Well, good morning, everyone. My name is Michael Fraser. I'm the Chairman of APA Group Limited, the responsible entity for APA Group that comprises APA Infrastructure Trust and APA Investment Trust. On behalf of the board, I'd like to welcome you all to this annual meeting of each of those trusts. Given it's now past 10:30 A.M. and a quorum is present, I declare open the 2022 annual meeting of APA security holders. In the spirit of reconciliation, I'd like to begin today by acknowledging the Gadigal people of the Eora Nation as the traditional custodians of the land where this meeting is taking place. We pay our respect to their elders, past and present, and extend that respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people today.
This meeting is being held as a hybrid, which means it's being held both virtually and in person. We have security holders joining us today in a wide variety of locations. I must say, it's great that after two years of just virtual meetings, to be able to also hold this meeting in person and to see you all here today. Before we move to the formal aspects of the meeting, I'd like to assure security holders that every effort has been made to provide you with the opportunity to fully participate in today's meeting by asking questions either from the floor, the webcast platform, or on the phone, and being able to vote on items of business.
On a procedural note, I now declare voting for all items of business open on the webcast platform and for those attending in person. Voting will remain open for the duration of the meeting. Security holders watching online will be able to ask questions during the meeting via the webcast platform by clicking on the Ask a Question box on your screen and typing your question. Questions can be submitted online at any time, and you don't need to wait for the relevant item of business to ask your question. In fact, we encourage you to start now, and I'll address them at the relevant time. Joining me today in Sydney is Kynwynn Strong, our APA's Acting Chief Financial Officer, and she'll read out the online questions from security holders.
We'll endeavor to answer as many of your questions as possible today while trying to ensure that we keep the meeting's duration to a reasonable period of time. I'd ask security holders to please ask no more than two questions and to keep your questions as short as possible. It may be necessary for us to group similar questions or summarize long questions. To ask a question via telephone, you'll need to press star one on your keypad, and you'll hear a tone to confirm that you're in the queue. You'll still be able to listen to the meeting while you're in the queue. When it's your turn to ask a question, the operator will introduce you to the meeting and unmute your line so you can be heard. If you wish to ask a subsequent question, please press star one again to rejoin the queue.
If you need assistance, please refer to the detailed instructions in the virtual meeting online guide that is available on the webcast platform and on APA's website. If you experience any difficulties, please call the meeting helpline, which appears at the top of your screen. The meeting helpline number is 1800 293 636. A copy of the webcast of today's meeting will be posted on APA's website as soon as possible after the meeting. With those housekeeping matters out of the way, let me make some introductions. Joining me in person in Sydney today are our board members, James Fazzino, who's the Chair of our Safety and Sustainability Committee, Debra Goodin, who's the Chair of the Audit and Finance Committee, Rhoda Phillippo, who's Chair of the Risk Management Committee, and Peter Wasow, Chair of the People and Remuneration Committee, Peter on the end there, and Shirley In't Veld.
I'd also like to acknowledge Steven Crane, who retired from the board just last month. Steven was a director for nearly 12 years and played a key role in helping APA be as successful as it has been over that time. I'd like to thank Steven for his service to the board. Let me also introduce you to some of APA's executive leadership team who are sitting on stage with me this morning. We have Adam Watson, our Acting Chief Executive Officer, and Amanda Cheney, our Group General Counsel and Company Secretary, who you just heard from. Also sitting in the front row, we have members of our executive leadership team, and we're also joined in person today by Jamie Gatt, our audit partner at Deloitte Touche Tohmatsu. The slide on the screen sets up the agenda for today's meeting.
The notice of meeting has been made available to all security holders, and I'll take it as read. Adam Watson and I will report on APA's performance for the 2022 financial year and our strategy and outlook for the current year. We'll then move to the items of business set out in the notice of meeting. We've also set aside time at the conclusion of the formal business to answer any other general questions that you may have. Now turning to my formal address. Against the backdrop of significant disruptions to Australia's energy markets over the last year, our FY 2022 financial performance has again demonstrated the strength and resilience of APA's business and our track record of delivering reliable and solid results. Compared to last year, revenue was up 4%.
Our underlying EBITDA was also up 4%, and our free cash flow was strong, being up 20%. These results meant we were able to declare full-year distributions of AUD 0.53 per security, in line with our guidance and up 4% on the prior year. This represented a continuation of our history of growth in distributions to security holders over the last 18 years, which says a lot about the robustness of our business. We can also reiterate our guidance of expected distributions of AUD 0.55 per security for the financial year 2023. Our balance sheet remains strong and ensures we're well-placed, well-positioned to pursue growth opportunities and ultimately create sustainable long-term value for you, our security holders.
With energy dominating the headlines over the past year, the need for an orderly and planned transition where the lights stay on and energy remains affordable has come into sharp focus. With that, the critical role of our business in the energy transition has never been more apparent. Australia's transition to net zero means there is a continuing need to invest in gas infrastructure. Over time, we believe a combination of natural gas, renewables, and other technologies will provide the most economical, secure, and rapid pathway to reaching this goal. Through AEMO's integrated system plan, we know that to meet the growing demand for electrification by 2050, the national electricity market is forecast to need to double the amount of electricity it delivers now. That is a massive task that we face as a nation.
These circumstances, among other things, influenced our announcement in August to call time on pursuing a U.S. acquisition. Our focus is now solely on the Australian market, which is where we believe we can create the most value for our investors and communities. Our organic growth pipeline currently exceeds AUD 1.4 billion, with many of these projects building momentum during the past year. We're committed to ensuring the investments we're making in gas infrastructure, renewables, hydrogen, and electricity transmission will all contribute to a reliable, affordable, and lower emissions future. Consistent with that strategy, we have agreed to acquire Basslink, the 370 km sub-sea electricity interconnector between Victoria and Tasmania, representing a significant opportunity to grow our electricity transmission business.
Our focus is to put Basslink on a sustainable footing and ensure that it plays a role in bringing new renewable generation onto the grid as Australia winds down its reliance on coal, as well as providing energy security to Tasmania. Over the past 12 months, we've consulted with our investors and other stakeholders to produce our climate transition plan, which updates APA's 2021 commitment of net zero emissions by 2050 with more tailored targets, goals, and commitments for the next three decades.
Most significantly, we have accelerated our net zero goal for power generation and electricity transmission from 2050- 2040, set a 2030 target of a 30% reduction in emissions for our gas infrastructure business, and set a 2030 goal of a 35% reduction in emissions intensity for our power generation portfolio, which we believe is an ambitious commitment given the Diamantina power station at Mount Isa, which is the largest we have, is already one of the most efficient gas generators in Australia. In addition, we've undertaken detailed work on our gas infrastructure to understand the capital required to support structural abatement of our emissions, and we've committed to structural abatement in preference to acquiring carbon credits where it's reasonable to do so.
We've also set a timeline for establishing a Scope 3 emissions goal, and these commitments and the pathway to get there are defined in our climate transition plan, which will be put to a non-binding advisory vote today. It's our intention as we move forward to report progress on the transition plan on an annual basis and to hold an advisory security holder vote on a three-yearly cycle. Before I finish, I want to recognize APA's previous CEO and Managing Director, Rob Wheals, for his contribution to the business over the last 14 years, including the last three years as CEO and Managing Director. As evidenced by our financial year 2022 financial result, Rob has left the business in good shape, and we wish him all the best for the future.
As security holders would be aware, we're now conducting a comprehensive search for a new CEO, but in the meantime, I'm confident that our acting CEO, Adam Watson, together with the other members of the executive leadership team, will continue to take the business from strength to strength. In closing, I wanna thank all of our employees, our contractors and partners who have supported us and worked so hard over the past year to make it another successful one for APA. I also wanna thank all our security holders for your ongoing support. I'll now invite Adam Watson to address the meeting. Adam.
Thank you, Michael, and good morning, everyone. I would also like to acknowledge the Gadigal people of the Eora Nation, the traditional custodians of the land on which I'm speaking today. I pay my respects to their elders, past, present, and emerging. Well, it's an absolute privilege to be leading APA as the acting CEO during what is a very exciting time for our organization and the energy industry more broadly. There are three key topics I'd like to discuss with you today, and firstly, I'll talk about our strong operational and financial performance we delivered in FY 2022. These results underscore the strength of our business to continue delivering benefits for our security holders and for our customers and for our communities.
Secondly, I'll talk to our strategy, and it's underpinned by AUD tens of billions which will be spent to deliver the Australian energy transition over the coming decades. Thirdly, I'll talk to our climate transition plan, which supports our commitment to delivering better environmental, social, and governance outcomes for our stakeholders. A great example of how our financial performance, our strategy, and our climate transition plan converge is yesterday's announcement confirming our agreement to acquire Basslink, the sub-sea electricity cable connecting Tasmania to the mainland. We've agreed to acquire a great business with great people, and we'll acquire a set of capabilities that will position us well to support Tasmania's renewable energy plans, as well as the connections necessary to support the development of new energy solutions, such as offshore wind farms, more broadly across Australia.
I'll talk more about that in a moment. Let's start with our FY 2022 results, and I want to first acknowledge that it's our fantastic people who deserve the credit for delivering such a solid result. Our operational performance was impressive, ensuring our customers were provided with their energy needs when they needed it. We continue to make good progress with improving our safety and well-being of our people, as reflected in our total recordable injury frequency rate, where there was a significant improvement achieved during the year. There's always more we can do, and we continue to remain focused on continually making improvements. Our FY 2022 financial performance highlights APA's solid foundations that continue to take the business from strength to strength, and they include our strong balance sheet, our inflation-linked revenues, our strong cash flow conversion, and our diverse customer base.
We remain focused on delivering value for our investors, our customers, and our communities. We know distributions are an important way to create value for our investors, and we're always looking at ways to ensure that we get the balance right between delivering growth from a distribution perspective but also retaining an appropriate level of cash flow to internally fund our organic growth pipeline. We do this through the strong balance sheet and our focus on capital management. Our financial performance year to date in this financial year, that is FY 2023, is progressing well and remains on track to deliver our FY 2023 distribution guidance of AUD 0.55 per security. We're pleased, as Michael said, that both FY 2022 and FY 2023 will deliver almost two decades of year-on-year distribution growth for you, our security holders. Now to our strategy.
As Michael also outlined, this is an exciting time for APA as we continue to grow and invest in support of Australia's energy transition. Key to an effective energy system, and importantly a successful energy transition, is ensuring they deliver four key outcomes, and that is energy that is safe, energy that is reliable, energy that's affordable, and energy that's low emissions. I'm excited about the role that APA can play to deliver this for all of Australians given our experience and our exposure to renewables, electricity transmission, gas and gas firming, and future fuels. Our strategy for growth and value creation is underpinned by the fact that Australia's entire energy system is undergoing enormous change. Right now, coal represents about 60% of our East Coast electricity market, and we all know the retirement of Australia's coal-fired power generators is accelerating.
This will command significant investment in renewable power generation. As the owner, operator, and developer of renewable power generation, this is a space that APA knows well, and we will continue to focus on. An example is the development of our Mica Creek solar farm in Mount Isa in Queensland. It will be Australia's largest solar farm outside the National and Western Australian electricity markets. I visited the project just last week, and it's truly impressive. All of the new renewable power generators need to be connected via electricity transmission. This is another area where we have experience and will continue to play a leading role. Again, our acquisition of Basslink will further enhance our electricity transmission capability and expose us, hopefully, to some new energy markets. We'll be the owner and operator of Australia's major sub-sea electricity transmission line.
This acquisition will give us further skills and experience to help Tasmania achieve its growth ambition to be a major renewable energy producer. We can also potentially help Australia achieve its ambition of being a major producer of energy from offshore wind farms. We now have, as an Australian-owned business at APA, the expertise to connect these wind farms to the grid. We're looking forward to working with the state of Tasmania to put Basslink on a sustainable footing and safeguard its critical role in connecting Tasmania to the national electricity market. The investment opportunities in renewable power, generation, and electricity transmission are clearly attractive. At the same time, we know gas is essential to fast-track renewables and deliver the most secure, the most reliable, the most affordable, and the most low-emissions pathway to the decarbonization of Australia's energy system.
As we see record levels of supply coming from wind and solar, the firming role of gas-fired power generation will be important, increasingly important to ensure grid stability. When the sun doesn't shine, or the wind doesn't blow, or where renewable power simply isn't intense enough to support major industrial users, gas will be required to step in. This is a scenario that we've seen play out in Australia recently, and we're seeing it play out right now in other parts of the world, such as Europe. The role of gas is to secure our energy system, and it's critical. The 2022 electricity crisis in the national electricity market has been challenging for many of our customers, and we're doing all we can to support them with a safe and reliable supply of energy solutions.
That includes delivery of key projects like the expansion of East Coast Grid, which we initiated ahead of market requirements to help avoid the then forecast gas supply shortfalls of winter 2023. As a nation, it will be crucial that governments, communities, and the private sector work together. This way, we can develop solutions and pathways to ensure the energy transition is delivered in a structured and coordinated way. The energy market needs sensible policy, and it needs the right incentives and support in place. We need to be sensible about our energy sources to ensure the energy system again is safe, reliable, and affordable, as well as low emissions. At APA, we're working hard to find ways to play our part in the developing of the infrastructure required to support the energy transition for the future.
Our Pathfinder program, which is looking a long way into the future, is working in partnership with customers, with universities, governments, and key industry participants. It's looking at the necessary transportation and storage infrastructure to support future fuels such as hydrogen and biogas. Some of this infrastructure will be new, and some of it will be from the conversion of APA's existing assets. While the viability of these future fuels is still a long way away, we recognize the importance of doing the hard work now to ensure we can support Australia in the future. We also remain focused on delivering our existing AUD 1.4 billion organic development pipeline that is supporting our energy needs of today.
Right now, this includes projects like the Western Outer Ring Main in Victoria, the pipeline connection to the Hunter Power Project right here in New South Wales, the Northern Goldfields Interconnect Project in Western Australia, and the Mica Creek Solar Farm in Queensland. Now to our climate transition plan. A team of representatives across all of the functions and operations of APA have worked very hard over the past 12 months to bring this plan to life. We've sought to align our targets and our goals to the objectives of the Paris Agreement, and we've taken a considered approach to assessing the tangible opportunities for emissions reduction, prioritizing structural abatement where we can. As Michael said, these opportunities are based on proven technologies. We believe our targets and goals are achievable, and we will continue to push ourselves to make further improvements in the future.
Our plan is just one part of our sustainability roadmap that we've successfully progressed during FY 22. We've also invested in initiatives consistent with our roadmap to further improve outcomes for our communities, our First Nations stakeholders, our customers, and you, our security holders. At a community level, we commenced implementation of our new community and social performance strategy to further improve the way we support our host communities. Additionally, we're working to establish a responsible procurement strategy, which will involve developing APA's approach to sustainable, ethical, and socially responsible procurement. We've already signed up to Supply Nation and Social Traders to drive our supplier diversity and better incorporate First Nations businesses into our supply chains. As an Australian business, we are proud of the important role we play in our economy and our communities. We're proud of the work we do with governments.
We're proud of the partnerships we have formed with local communities, and we're proud of the jobs we create in regional areas. Just this year, we expect to create about 575 jobs to deliver our Northern Goldfields Interconnect project pipeline and around 160 jobs for the Mica Creek Solar Farm when they're at the peak of construction. In summary, APA is making good progress, and this is all achieved through the hard work of our 2,100 employees. To the APA team, I say thank you. You've once again displayed resilience, adaptability, and flexibility during the COVID challenges of FY 2022 and 2022 more broadly. We will continue to invest in our people, our systems, and our processes to ensure we have the necessary capabilities to support our next generation of growth.
I also wanna take the opportunity to thank our executive team for their hard work, support, and leadership, and I'm confident that the team will continue to deliver value for you, our security holders, whilst improving the lives of our communities. Thank you to our board and to you, our security holders, for your ongoing support of APA. We're a strong business with strong foundations and a great future, and we're proud to be at the forefront of responsibly transitioning Australia's energy system. I'll now hand you back to the chairman. Thanks, Michael.
Thanks very much, Adam, and well said. I'd like to turn now to the formal business of the meeting. Security holders and proxies attending the meeting online can vote through the online platform by clicking on the Get a Voting Card box at the bottom of the webcast. For those attending in person, when you arrived here today and registered your attendance, you were given a card that's either yellow, blue, or red, and you must be holding a yellow card if you wish to vote at this meeting. Please mark your yellow card on each of the four resolutions to indicate whether you are voting for or against the resolution or are abstaining. If you hold securities jointly with another person, only the person holding the yellow card may vote. The returning officers for the polls are representatives of APA's registry, Link Market Services.
They'll collect your yellow cards and count the votes at the end of the meeting. Only those holding yellow or blue cards are entitled to ask questions at this meeting. Visitors holding red cards are welcome, but are not entitled to ask questions. If anyone has not yet registered or has not been given a colored card, please identify yourself immediately to a representative of our registry, Link Market Services, who are up the back, so that we can register you and issue you with the appropriate card. Now, there are four items of ordinary business today. Security holders will be able to ask questions specific to each resolution to be put to the meeting, before voting on the resolution.
For those security holders who are here in person and wish to ask a question or make a comment on a particular resolution, I'll invite you at the appropriate time to come up and ask your question at the standing microphone in front of me down here. For those security holders who are unable to come to the microphone, please raise your card and we'll have an attendant come to you. Once I've taken some questions from the floor, I'll then also move to take questions from the webcast platform. I was going to say from the telephone, but I understand that no one has registered, so we won't be having any calls into the meeting today on the phone.
As I said earlier, I'd encourage those who wish to ask a question via the webcast platform to please do so now, so they can be queued into the system to be asked at the appropriate time. I ask you to nominate clearly which resolution your question relates to, if it relates to a specific resolution, so that it can be addressed. Alternatively, if the question relates to general business, please indicate this. All resolutions will be put to a poll. The first item of business today is the adoption of the remuneration report for the year ended 30th of June 2022. The remuneration report is included in the directors' section of the annual report and details remuneration received by directors and APA's key management personnel for the year ended 30th of June 2022.
As you are aware, the APA board has adopted a corporate governance framework which is designed to be as consistent as practicable with the best practice procedures of publicly listed companies. Now under that framework, security holders can vote on the adoption of the remuneration report. The resolution 1 is an ordinary resolution and will be passed if more than 50% of the votes cast by security holders entitled to vote are in favor of the resolution. While the vote is advisory and doesn't bind the directors in accordance with our corporate governance framework, if at least 25% of the votes cast are against the adoption of the remuneration report at the annual meeting in two consecutive years, then the two strikes mechanism will be triggered as per the Corporations Act. I'll start by taking questions from the floor.
If anyone here in the room would like to ask a question or make a comment on resolution 1, please make your way to the microphone here at the front of the room. Okay, sorry, there's a gentleman here. Thank you.
Chairman, I would like to introduce Kevin Troy, shareholder.
Thank you.
Good morning, Mr. Chairman. You said a lot of nice things about the Basslink connection between Victoria and Tasmania. I assume the technical problems it had a few years back are thoroughly overcome. The question I want to ask, though, has to do with whether you'll be tendering for the construction of the new Marinus Link between Victoria and Tasmania, and what sort of timescale you think that will be on.
Yeah. Kevin, could I say at the moment we're just dealing with the resolution in relation to the remuneration report.
Oh, sorry.
I'm very, very happy to come back and address that question, if somebody can-
Mm.
Write it down for me. When we get to general business.
Yeah.
I'll make that the first cab off the rank if you wanna jump up then.
I'm working from habit.
Good on you. Thank you. Thanks very much. There don't appear to be any questions in the room. Kynwynn, are there any questions or comments on this item of business from the platform?
Yes, Chairman. The first question is from Stephen Mayne. Because it is a trust, APA doesn't have to put its remuneration report to the vote. Thanks for voluntarily doing this since 2017, although it was regrettable you didn't do it for the first 12 years of the regime, which was introduced in 2005. Is there anything stopping the board from dumping the remuneration report vote in future years, and will you commit to continue the current practice into the future?
Well, I think the answer to that probably, and I'm looking across at our general counsel, is probably technically there's nothing that would prevent us from dumping that, as Steven has put it, in the future. All I can say, Steven, is that at this point in time, we have absolutely no intention of doing that. I would expect that security holders would let us know, in no uncertain terms, what they thought about it if that was something that we sought to do. They, for instance, do get to vote on who sits on the board. It's a good way of showing your displeasure with that.
Chairman, there are no further questions at this point.
Thank you, Kynwynn. The details of the total valid proxies for this agenda item are displayed on the screen. Yes, they are. I'd like to remind you that voting is open. You can use the webcast platform to cast your vote.
Excuse me, Chairman. Another question has just come through on resolution one from Steven Main. Has there been a material proxy protest vote against any of today's resolutions, including the remuneration report? Origin Energy is also holding its AGM today and has disclosed the proxy position to the ASX with the formal addresses ahead of the AGM commencing since 2008. Why doesn't APA do this, and will you at least disclose the proxies on the screen before the debate commences?
Look, the short answer is you've seen the vote. It's there for you. The proxy votes are up on the screen. So that's there. No, the intention is not to disclose what the proxy votes ahead are ahead of a discussion about the resolution, because I think that just takes away from the discussion that people might wanna have, if they see that something's already been carried, et cetera, via the proxy. So the intent is that we will not do that as a matter of, I think, of good practice. No more?
There are no further questions at this point.
Great. Thank you. The second item of business today is approval of the climate transition plan. The climate transition plan was published on APA's website and released to the ASX on the twenty-fourth of August 2022. Resolution 2 is an ordinary resolution and will be passed if more than 50% of the votes cast by security holders entitled to vote are in favor of the resolution. While the vote is advisory and doesn't bind the directors or APA, the directors will consider the outcome of the vote and comments made by security holders on the climate transition plan. If anyone here in the room would like to ask a question or make a comment on Resolution 2, please make your way to the microphone here at the front of the room.
Chairman, introducing Antoinette, shareholder.
Welcome back, Antoinette.
Hello. How are you?
Very well, thank you.
I basically just want to say thank you for doing the climate plan because even if I get a few cents less of dividends, I am all for that. I do recognize, of course, that some of what you say is very much cosmetic, but I think APA is genuinely in the forefront of actually doing things that they also realize is inevitable to do. I think it's a good idea to have companies that are really doing the right thing even if they do it unwillingly because it is in the interest of just about everybody. Just otherwise, I just want to thank you because I'm quite a happy shareholder, and I'm a bit shocked that it's been 18 years since I've been a shareholder. I was not aware of that.
Yeah.
Thank you to the board, and I'm very interested in what you are going to do about climate change. Thank you very much.
Well, I'll take that as a comment rather than a question.
Good question. Thank you.
Thanks very much, Antoinette.
Chairman, introducing Margo as a proxy holder.
Margo.
Hi. Hi there. I just wanted to ask you about the climate transition plan.
Yes.
Repeatedly states that there's potential for existing gas infrastructure to lower, to transport lower emissions fuels, including hydrogen, and that APA is actively pursuing this through the Pathfinder program.
Yes.
Is it possible for APA's existing gas pipeline infrastructure to transport 100% hydrogen? If not, and if replacement or significant upgrades are required, wouldn't widespread electrification be a far cheaper decarbonization option than replacing gas with hydrogen?
Well, in answer to your question, that's part of the work that we've been doing at the moment is understanding whether any of our pipelines can carry 100% hydrogen. We've been doing test results which are, I'll say, encouraging so far with respect to the Parmelia pipeline in Western Australia, and that has been a primary focus for us. That's kind of on track, but we've still got work to do with respect to it. I think in reality, the answer is that that will vary from pipeline to pipeline around the country. They were built at different times to different specifications.
I think one of the other things that I would say as well about pipelines is that it will also obviously depend on, you know, where you end up with your distribution networks, and whether they can carry 100% hydrogen, and that will ultimately determine, you know, where hydrogen may or may not flow around the country. The other issue, of course, is being able to produce it economically, and there's a lot of enthusiasm for hydrogen. There's a lot of money that's going into it. It's got a long way to go in terms of it being economic. The other question you raised about hydrogen versus electricity, I think there was a commentary this morning about that.
I think the reality is when you look at what the future energy demands are for the Australian economy, and this is the same all around the world, we're basically going to need every tool that we've got in our kit bag to be able to deliver reliable and affordable energy. If hydrogen can get down the cost curve, as those who are very enthusiastic about it seem to think it will, then it'll be one of those things that are available to us in our kit bag. As I say, it's got a fair way to go to get down the cost curve.
Chairman, reintroducing Kevin as shareholder.
Kevin, back again.
Hopefully on the right issue this time. I notice you've got the estimate of the price involved to 2030 as between AUD 150 million and AUD 170 million. Now, I guess that some of that is gonna be spent on regulated assets and so will go into the regulated asset base and produce income that, by that route. But that amount that's spent on the unregulated assets, any increase in income will have to come from you charging your users more. I'm just wondering to what extent you'll be able to gain income from the unregulated assets.
Well, that's a very informed question that you've got there, Kevin. Well put. So the most of the money is primarily targeted at this point at non-regulated assets and looking at electrification of compressors and other things. It really is an open question as to you know, customers' desire to pay. They will all no doubt, 'cause most of our customers are obviously the large players in the energy industry, either as retailers or as large users of energy. They'll all be looking to develop their own plans, and anything that we can do will obviously you know help them in the longer term. They are typically the unregulated or the contracted assets.
It's an open discussion that we'll have with our customers as to what future pricing might look like and what might be included out of what costs we may incur. We haven't yet had that discussion.
Thank you.
Chairman introducing Ray as shareholder.
Ray?
Yeah.
Yep. Okay. Thank you.
Thank you, Chairman, for taking my question in regards to the other shareholder and her question about blending. There is currently a company in Wisconsin, in America, that is doing tests on this right this moment. Looks like globally it's blending of hydrogen and natural gas is happening.
Yes, in South Australia, they've been doing some tests over there as well, blending it into the network in South Aus-
Let's hope it goes well. From listening to your speeches this morning, are you planning on offsetting your carbon emissions from gas transmission by using renewable energy from Basslink? Is that gonna offset?
Yeah, no, not really. I mean, Basslink is a transmission link, so, you know, we're not buying generators with that. Think about it pretty much in the same way as a gas pipeline or where you've got a producer, in this case, generators in Tasmania will export to Victoria. Likewise, if they're short of power in Tasmania, it will export there. No, it doesn't work that way.
Oh.
So-
Okay.
Yep.
I think you answered the question.
Great.
Okay.
Thank you.
Chairman, introducing Hugh as shareholder.
Welcome, Hugh.
Morning. Thank you. UniSuper has long been APA's largest shareholder-
Mm-hmm
has been significantly reducing its stake in this company lately. This sell down has coincided with increasing commentary and commitments from UniSuper on climate change, including a commitment that the fund's actions will be consistent with the ultimate goals of the Paris Agreement, in particular, targeting net zero emissions at a whole-of-fund and portfolio level by 2050. My question is this: How can APA shareholders view the sell down by our biggest shareholder as anything but the ultimate rejection of the company's inadequate climate plan, irrespective of the outcome on this resolution?
Well, yeah, I mean, I think when you see where the proxies are and you understand that UniSuper hold circa 12%, 13%, so they're still far and away our largest shareholder, I think it's pretty clear to see, you know, which way that they have voted. I think they may disagree with you with respect to that. What I would say is that the approach that UniSuper has taken, and there are many people who call for institutions out there to simply sell down your stock in companies like APA or oil and gas companies, then there are people who I think take a far more proactive and educated approach and, like UniSuper, who think that they're much better to be inside the tent and proactively engage with us on our plan.
I have to say, we've had, you know, very active engagement with UniSuper with respect to our plan. They certainly think that we've got more work to do with respect to it, but I think, net-net, they're supportive of where we've got to so far. No doubt they wanna see us do better as we move forward.
Indeed. I'm sure they do. In response to your remarks about active engagement, I take your point in principle, but we're here now today in a climate crisis, 30, 50, 150 years, depending on which date you pick from the earliest warnings, and emissions are still rising. It's a bit difficult to accept that has any credibility at all. I guess the other remark I'd make in connection with that is that the position that UniSuper might be adopting presently is not necessarily supported by their stakeholders, and I'm sure you're aware of the pressure in that respect.
Yeah.
That may change in the future.
Sure. Look, what I would say, and, you know, I think I've said it already, you look at any of the modeling out there is a critical role for natural gas to play, not only in Australia, but right around the world in getting to net zero by 2050. I have said it before at previous AGMs. I think if people are genuinely interested in reducing emissions rather than just being ideologically opposed to natural gas, then, you know, we would have enough gas to make sure that we can get to net zero a lot quicker than we otherwise would.
Okay.
At the end of the day, if we don't keep energy reliable and we don't keep it affordable, then the community will respond to that. If we end up with blackouts, we're already seeing prices going through the roof in, on the electricity side of things, then my concern is that that mandate, that community support for getting to net zero will be lost. I come back to, we firmly believe, and you look at whether it's the IEA's modeling, you look at the AEMO modeling, which are all, you know, what are the pathways to net zero by 2050. Yes, there is a reduction in their forecast in the use of natural gas, but it plays an absolutely fundamental role to getting there.
I think sophisticated shareholders and the debate generally is, you know, around the planet, quite frankly, is starting to recognize how important natural gas is.
I think most people would accept that gas today and in the short term has a role to play. Your climate plan is predicated on continued near-term investment in new gas supplies being-
Yes
Essential out towards 2040.
Yes.
Your stranded asset risk analysis for your Moomba to Sydney and southwest Queensland pipelines are considered resilient to climate risk. In practice, this may require new basin development-
Yes
out until 2040.
Yep, yep.
On page 25 of the plan, it says you're aligned with the objectives of the Paris Agreement.
Correct.
Now, that's clearly not aligned with the objectives of the Paris Agreement.
Well.
The IEA and the UN have clearly said that there can be no new fossil fuel developments, really from now in developing countries.
Yeah.
In order to align with the Paris Agreement.
I would say well, we don't necessarily agree with everything that they have said.
No.
As I say, just to go back to you talk about today versus the future. I'll just repeat what I said. If you go and look at the International Energy Agency's, you know, transitions to net zero, there is still a very substantive role for natural gas come 2050. Go and look at the AEMO pathway to net zero by 2050, and their scenario analysis, and again, there is a very significant role for natural gas out to 2050. At the end of the day, look, from our perspective, we absolutely believe that's where we need to go, and we absolutely intend to be part of the solution, not part of the problem. Being part of the solution means making sure that people have got reliable and affordable energy in the transition.
You can't, and it comes back to, and I'm sure you would advocate just shut the coal-fired power stations. Well, I'm sorry, but whilst that might, you know, that's an ideal scenario. At the end of the day, the lights go out and we lose the mandate. On the other hand, if you. Which is again what AEMO's modeling shows is, I forget the exact number, but say another 10,000 megawatts or so of gas-fired generation, which is required to back the system up. You need that to be built.
The question to me isn't so much how quickly can you take coal out of the system, it's how quickly can you replace it with low emissions energy, be it wind farms, solar farms, or gas to firm it all up.
Okay. Given the nature of your business, I guess that's not unexpected. It's very clear that renewable electricity is by far the most reliable and by far the most affordable electricity going into the future.
But, um-
Your plan's predicated on new gas development is clearly not aligned with the Paris Agreement objectives that you claim to be aligned with.
Okay.
Okay.
Thank you.
Thank you.
We'll take that as a comment.
Chairman, introducing Arthur as shareholder.
Michael Fraser.
Yes.
I think I remember you from some time ago, probably years ago, you were CEO AGL. Is that right?
That's correct. Yes.
Good. Good. My question comes back here, you say you are looking for another CEO for APA. Can you not perform both cases because you have experience already? I believe it too. I'm not sure. APA was part AGL. Is that correct?
That's correct.
Well, why you need another CEO? You got all the experience to do that. Okay.
Well-
That's my point of view.
Well, I'll take that as a vote of support. Thank you for that.
Yeah.
No, that's. I'm at a point in my life where that's not something that I'm contemplating. So, thank you.
Okay. Just a question.
Thank you. No, thank you.
The other thing, I don't believe in climate change.
Mm-hmm.
I don't believe it at all. I've been follow that for years. I got information from by internet about a Nobel Prize in Norwegian. Was over 50 years in science, in weather and things like that. It says CO2 doesn't make any difference in the change in the climate. It's actually, it says we are really going down the CO2 and the weather is going down. As we can see now, we have more rains. I live in Queensland. We have more rain now than ever before. We the weather is being cooler there even we are going now in spring. Years ago, it used to be very hot. Government make a propaganda and follow west brainwash everybody of climate change. I don't believe in that at all. It's like coronavirus.
Coronavirus or nothing, I am 80 years of age. I didn't have the vaccine, even though they send letter at my house to have a vaccine, make me stay at home because I'll be fine if I'll do that. I didn't. Now it's all abolished. In America actually, they have a court case against the Pfizer, a company produces coronavirus. It prove it's all false. It's all con, that thing. They did everyone. We follow everything because in America they do that, we accept whatever they say here. The same thing happens with the climate.
I think, Arthur, this meeting is about APA business, not about.
Yeah, no, but the climate.
Not about, no the-
The climate we are talking about now. Approve the climate transition. I don't agree on that. I don't believe we shouldn't because wouldn't improve anything. Actually, you try mess it up with environmental event, you're gonna pay very hard with that. Actually, they don't say how many things been doing for the environment. We recycle almost everything. Now we have solar in all the house. They have electric cars, but they don't talk about. It's just talk, we have to eliminate everything. We should come back to candle lights. I don't agree on that because there's too much hysteria on that. That's my point of view.
Okay.
Okay?
Well, thank you for.
It's good.
Thank you for your opinion. Just for the record, you know, the board's position is that the science of climate change, as assessed by the IPCC, is unequivocal. That's our view. Do we have any other questions from the floor? No. Kynwynn, are there any questions or comments from the platform on this item of business that we haven't Already aired?
Yes, Chairman, there's a few questions. The first one is from Gregory John Decker. What is the APA Group's climate transition plan?
Well, look, as we outlined in both my formal presentation and Adam, we published the plan back with the results in August. Really what it is, it's a plan that sets out a series of commitments by APA of the role that we're going to play in Australia's transition to net zero by 2050. They are commitments that we believe are consistent with the objectives of the Paris Agreement. Given the discussion that we've already had on this and the fact that I've gone through some of the detail, I won't go into any more detail about it. That's the essence of what it is.
It sets out a series of commitments that we've made to targets, goals, objectives, between now and 2050.
The next question is from Kerry Osmond. The climate transition plan is nothing more than a transfer of the company's wealth and ability to control funds directly from the good of the company and shareholders to outside forces. When does the board intend to stop pandering to those questionable, illegitimate, and false influences which will enable the company to grow, expand, and work to the betterment of the country?
Well, again, I respectfully disagree with the premise of the question. The board's position, as I just stated, is that we believe the science of climate change, as assessed by the IPCC, is unequivocal. We've committed, as I've said, to net zero by 2050. Very importantly, I think the point that I was trying to make to the gentleman before is, we also absolutely believe that natural gas and natural gas infrastructure has a critical role to play in that transition to net zero. We fundamentally believe that the steps that we're taking, that we've outlined in our climate transition plan, are absolutely in the best interest of security holders. As I said before, our intention is to be part of the solution, not part of the problem as we transition.
The next question is from David Bryce. Are there any ESG investors on APA's share register that are requiring APA to improve APA's carbon footprint on the environment and become carbon neutral faster than is reasonable?
Well, I think the real answer to that is that many institutions would regard themselves as being ESG conscious. As I've talked about before, we've had active engagement, not only with UniSuper, who are our largest shareholder, but we've also had significant engagement with many of our security holders, including the Australian Shareholders' Association, representing retail shareholders. The climate plan really is the result of proactive engagement that we've undertaken as a company as we've progressed the development of the plan. We've engaged with shareholders right along that journey.
Chairman, the next question is from Steven Main. When disclosing the outcome of voting on all resolutions today, but particularly this climate transition plan, could you please advise the ASX how many shareholders voted for and against each item, similar to what happens with a scheme of arrangement? This will provide a better gauge of retail shareholder sentiment on all resolutions, and was a disclosure initiative adopted by the likes of Metcash, Altium, and Dexus after their 2021 AGMs.
Look, the short answer is no, Steven. I think you've gone to the heart of it. That's an issue that you would see with a scheme of arrangement where you need to know not only by the number of votes, but by the number of shareholders. In this case, under the Corporations Act, you disclose the number of votes, and that's what we will do.
Chairman, the next question is from Steven Main. What prompted the board's decision to put the climate transition plan up for a vote? Will you commit to doing this every year into the future, like what occurs with the non-binding remuneration report vote, which is also a voluntary initiative?
The short answer is, at this point, we're committing to putting it up. As I said in my formal address, we intend to put it up for a security holder vote every three years. At the end of the day, and if people, you know, read the plan, these are longer-term targets that you're setting. We certainly will be reporting progress back to security holders on an annual basis. We don't intend to put it up until three years' time, and then on a three-yearly cycle, so that we actually have time to get some real traction on what, you know, on a number of significant projects. That's where we are with respect to that.
Sorry, the other part of the question, Kynwynn, was,
The non-binding
Oh.
Remuneration report with similar voluntary initiative.
What prompted us? The question Steven asked was what prompted us to put up? Look, I just come back fundamentally to, you know, the thing I said, we intend to be part of the solution, not part of the problem. We don't wanna be a laggard. We clearly recognize that the space that we're in the energy industry, we clearly have a significant role to play in the transition, and we wanna be on the front foot, all the time. It's, as simple as that. We could have sat back and waited to see, and it is early days for, many companies in terms of putting these resolutions up. We wanna be on the front foot.
There are no further questions on the platform.
Thank you. All right. The details of the total valid proxies for this agenda item are displayed on the screen, and I'd like to remind you that voting is open. You can use the webcast platform to cast your vote. Right. The next two items of business up on the screen relate to nominations for the two board positions, for the two positions on the board of the responsible entity, APA Group Limited, that become available on the retirement of James Fazzino and Rhoda Phillippo. For convenience, I'll refer to the responsible entity, APA Group Limited, as the company. Let me briefly explain the process that leads to the nominations. Under the company's constitution, at each annual meeting of the company, one-third of the directors and those who've held office for three years since election must retire from office. They are, however, eligible for re-election.
On this basis, two directors are required to retire by rotation as directors this year, namely James Fazzino and Rhoda Phillippo. Both are eligible for re-election. The company's constituent documents require that APA security holders approve the candidates for nomination as a director. Let's now consider their nominations one at a time. The third item of business is approval of the board-endorsed nomination of James Fazzino for re-election as a director of APA Group Limited. James was appointed a director in February 2019. He's been determined by the board to be an independent director, and I'll now hand over to James to address the meeting.
Thank you, Chairman. It's a privilege to stand before security holders seeking re-election to the APA board. We're currently in what is arguably the largest transformation ever in the Australian energy system. I believe that APA will play a key role in ensuring that the transformation is successful with respect to emissions, reliability, and cost. The specific expertise that I bring to the board during this time includes, firstly, an understanding of customer needs through my roles outside APA in working with energy-intensive manufacturers, and in my previous role as CEO of Incitec, which was and remains one of Australia's largest energy consumers. Second, a deep understanding of federal government policy and thinking on transition. Finally, hands-on experience in successfully executing world-scale projects, including hydrogen production and the hydrogen economy. I also chaired a safety and sustainability committee of the board.
My relevant experience here is, firstly, an unwavering belief that you can work without incident and that all incidents are preventable. Second, hands-on experience in safely running high hazard, high potential consequence facilities, importantly, most of those in remote locations. Third, expertise in diversity and inclusion, including psychological safety. Finally, experience in sustainably operating facilities in a way that protects the environment, generates jobs in local communities, and creates shareholder value. Thank you.
Thank you, James. Are there any questions on this item of business?
Chairman, introducing Sue from the Australian Shareholders' Association.
Welcome, Sue.
Thank you, Michael. How are you? Mr. Chairman, could we ask Mr. Fazzino please to advise us, could he tell us how he's brought his skills and experience to bear on matters the board has dealt with since joining the board, how he's assisted the board in dealing with some critical issues, and could he give some examples, please?
Yeah. Look, thank you for your question. Well, firstly, if I start with safety, obviously, I have a deep experience in that by virtue of the fact that I used to run an explosives company. If you look at the safety performance at a company and really a step change in that performance, I believe I've been part of that. Of course, management's driven it, but from a board level, yes. Secondly, as we go into energy transition, I've got a deep understanding of what makes transition possible and how do you create wealth for broader Australia. The conclusion is gas plays a key role in that. There were some questions around hydrogen. What isn't well appreciated is hydrogen is a feedstock into industrial chemicals that can't be replaced by electricity.
You're actually sitting on hydrogen at the moment in the form of acrylonitrile, if I correctly predict what the material is of those suits. Firstly, gas plays a key role today 'cause it creates the basics of life, and hydrogen will replace that. Secondly, in terms of high heat, high pressure environments, you can't replace gas with anything other than hydrogen. So that's important. That experience in energy-intensive customers is obviously valuable in terms of not only the strategy of today, but also the strategy of tomorrow. Finally, I sit on the audit committee, and I've got experience as a former CFO and I'm able to actively play a role in that committee because of that experience.
Thank you, James. I can assure security holders that James is an outstanding and very diligent director. Right. Kynwynn, are there any questions or comments on this item of business from the platform?
Yes, we have a question from Stephen Mayne.
Okay.
APA has a market capitalization of AUD 11.3 billion and is the largest listed company which remains a trust rather than a regular company. Does James Fazzino agree it is time to just pay the extra tax and regularize our corporate structure to replicate what every other ASX 50 company does?
Well, look, just let me take that, James. Nice to hear from you again, Steven. You're obviously listening in. Steven and I have had this discussion on and off over the years. Look, the board's position is there is a substantial cost to security holders and a substantial detriment to security holders in terms of the tax consequences of us converting from a trust to a traditional company structure. The short answer is that the board's unanimous position is that it's not in security holders' interest to do so.
There are no further questions.
Thank you. The details of the total valid proxies for this agenda item are displayed on screen. Voting is open. You can use the webcast platform to cast your vote. The fourth item of business is approval of the board-endorsed nomination of Rhoda Phillippo for re-election as a director of APA Group Limited. Rhoda Phillippo was appointed a director in June 2020. She's been determined by the board to be an independent director, and I'll now hand over to Rhoda Phillippo to address the meeting.
Thank you, Michael. Good morning. As Michael said, I joined the board in 2020. I've served on both the People and Remuneration and Health, Safety, Environment, and Heritage committees during this time. From this month, I'll take on the role of Chair of the newly formed Risk Management committee and serve on the Audit and Finance and People and Remuneration committees. I'm pleased to offer myself for election today, and thank you for your consideration. I'd be honored to continue to serve with our excellent chairman, Michael Fraser, and my fellow directors in support of the APA leadership team. Holding Australian, Kiwi, and U.K. passports, I've lived in Australia for the last nine years. My executive career of some 35 years was in the telecommunications, energy, I.T., and infrastructure sectors, the last 22 in New Zealand and Australia.
I have a master's in telecommunications business and engineering from the University of London, and worked in commercial engineering, operations, and customer service leadership roles, culminating in managing the Southeast of England for British Telecom post-privatization. Eventually, I moved with British Telecom to New Zealand in 1999. My TransTasman energy sector experience includes managing the transition of the downstream New Zealand Shell business into private ownership, Z Energy, and as managing director, leading the strategy to sell Lumo Energy, the then fourth-largest energy retailer in Australia to Snowy Hydro.
My global board experience spans the last decade, and in addition to my role on this board, I'm currently a non-executive director on the board of Pacific Hydro, an Australian renewable energy retailer, and I chair Kinetic IT, an Australian privately owned IT and cyber provider to government agencies and major corporates in Victoria, WA, New South Wales, Canberra, and the Northern Territory. My prior board career includes chairing a global transport payments provider, non-executive director of a major Australian telco, deputy chair of a New Zealand bank, and several technology businesses. In all of these roles, I've been a member of or chaired the risk management committee. I'm passionate about energy and the technology sectors, and believe I've gained some deep insights into both the challenges and the opportunities in the local and international market gained through my executive and board experiences.
APA has a tremendous portfolio of people, capability, and assets, and is well-placed, as you've heard today, to play a significant role in the energy transition in Australia. Outside of work, I'm a proud mom and a grandma with family who live all over the world, including a son who's currently serving with the UN in Ukraine. I'm a keen runner and triathlete. I've done 33 marathons, three Ironman events, and next week I'm gonna have my second attempt at the world's largest Noosa Triathlon. I can confirm that I've got sufficient time to dedicate to the role, and that I'm a graduate member of the AICD in both Australia and New Zealand. If reelected, I really look forward to working with this great team and adding value and insights as we navigate the exciting strategic choices that are present in our industry over the coming decades.
Thank you all.
Thanks very much, Rhoda. No guesses as to where the accent comes from. Do we have any questions on this item of business? It's Sue. I've gotta
It's the same question. Do you want me to read it out?
Please.
Mr. Chairman, would Ms. Phillippo be able to tell us how she's brought her skills and experience to bear on matters that have been dealt with by the board, and how she's assisted in dealing with some critical issues, and could you give us some examples, please?
Yes, thank you for the question. I mentioned that my background has seen me with significant experience in IT and technology, and particularly in the area of cybersecurity. Over the last couple of years, APA, as you heard from Adam, has been investing in transforming some of our systems and processes. I've played a special role for the board in helping management think through those projects and approaches and brought some lessons from my past to bear on those. I'm a passionate advocate for what every company needs to do to protect both its customers and its people in the world that we live in now, where cyber threats are very real. They'd be a couple of examples.
With my new role on the risk management committee, but before that, have brought my expertise in renewable generation to some of the projects where we've considered renewable assets, both organically and inorganically, and I'm really looking forward to use that in the future, chairing the risk management committee.
Thanks very much, Rhoda. Look, I think, you know, shareholders, security holders, sorry, should feel hearing Rhoda speak and James speak. You should feel very confident about the quality of the people that we've got on the board and looking after your money. Kynwynn, are there any other questions from the platform?
Yes, Chairman, there's another question from Steven Main.
Yes.
It's quite a long one, so I'll break it into two parts. Does the trust structure have an impact on the appointment and removal of directors? For instance, is it easy for external parties to challenge for a board seat, and what is required for shareholders to propose a removal resolution?
I'll turn to Amanda. This is right in her valley roots, so.
Thank you for the question and your interest in the director re-election process. Certainly, our governance framework has a deed poll, and that sets out the procedure and rules around the right of unit holders to nominate for positions on the board when they become available at times of re-election. To answer your direct question with regard to the Corporations Act, of course, there is a 5% or a 100-member requirement to put forward a resolution. Thank you.
The second part of the question is this. Also, does Rhoda Phillippo support APA voluntarily moving to annual elections of directors, a governance initiative which both BHP and Treasury Wine Estates have voluntarily embraced in 2022? What does the chair think of such a reform in order to be more accountable to unit holders?
Look, it's obviously not common practice at all here in Australia and we don't intend to move in that direction at this point in time. It's a simple answer. Do we have any other questions, Kynwynn Strong?
Yes. The next question is from Stephen Mayne. There was a 20% protest vote against the last two resolutions. Surely this should be explained, and has Rhoda Phillippo also suffered a 20% protest vote? Which proxy advisors are recommending against the board, and is this UniSuper flexing its muscles?
The short answer is all of the proxy advisors have recommended that shareholders vote in favor of all resolutions. Any votes against, Stephen is focusing on the 20% against. I'd like to focus on the 80%, who are in favor of the resolutions. Stephen, in short, all the proxy advisors, and we engage with all of them who are active in this market, were all in favor, recommended people vote in favor of all resolutions.
There are no further questions on the platform, Chairman.
Okay. Thank you. The details of the total valid proxies for this agenda item are displayed on the screen, and voting is open. You can use the webcast platform to cast your vote. A summary setting out the details of the total valid proxies for all agenda items is displayed on the screen for your reference. Voting will close shortly, so please complete your yellow voting cards now if you've not done so already. A reminder to security holders participating online to please vote now as well. If you're finished, the representatives of Link Market Services will collect your yellow voting cards, and they'll do that now. Okay. Okay, I think that's it. We've collected all the voting cards. Polls will automatically close five minutes after the conclusion of the meeting. That completes the formal business of the meeting.
The poll results will be released to the market by an ASX announcement and will also be available on APA's website as soon as possible. Now let me turn to matters of general business. We've already covered a number of questions that we received in advance of the meeting from our security holders in the earlier addresses. I'll now open the meeting to questions in relation to the APA business, including any questions which relate to the annual report for the 2022 financial year. That report is available to view on the webcast platform in the Download section at the bottom of the screen.
I mentioned earlier that our auditor is here today to answer any questions on the auditor's report or the conduct of the audit through me as chairman of this meeting. Now I will actually start. I said, Kevin, we'd make you first cab off the rank, and so your question, there were two parts to it. One was around have the problems with Basslink, the undersea cable that we've acquired, have they been fixed and will we tender for Marinus Link, I think was the other part of your question. Look, the long and short of it is that primarily, yes, the problems with Basslink have been fixed, but there is still, you know, a program of work that we will undertake to ensure its continued safe and reliable operation.
It has been operating reliably for some time as a result of things that have been done and limits that have been put in place. Will we tender for Marinus Link? Look, what that's referring to is that I guess it's overnight the Federal Government and the Victorian Government and in fact the Tasmanian Government have put out an announcement about building another link across Bass Strait linking Tasmania into Victoria. We actually think that makes a whole lot of sense and kind of vindicates our view about the important role that Basslink has to play. Obviously, that announcement has just come out.
I think it, you know, if I think about it rationally, there are clearly going to be operational synergies between Basslink and Marinus Link. It would be way too early to see whether there's a role for us to play or not. We're certainly interested in that announcement, and we'll be engaging with all levels of government on it, no doubt. All right. Do we have any other questions from the floor?
Chairman introducing Rowan as shareholder.
Great. Thank you. Welcome, Rowan.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Look, I just admittedly read the annual report in a very cursory fashion, but noticed on page 22 very interesting references to the projects producing green hydrogen.
Mm-hmm.
Particularly, I noted one project in Central Queensland, and this just raised a rather superficial question in my mind, as to what would happen if this project gets going in Central Queensland, and we find ourselves in another protracted drought period where water is very scarce. Now, given that in my understanding, we're dealing with green hydrogen production by electrolysis of water, is the question of sufficient water availability for the intended magnitude of the hydrogen production being considered, especially against competitive demands for water in an arid outback area? This brings further questions to my mind as to whether the possibility of having recourse to seawater or bore water is contemplated as the sources of said water.
If saline waters of high salinity are contemplated as the feedstock for such operation, I would anticipate there might be some risk of chlorine production as a by-product. I have two further questions. I would expect first, the major by-product would be potentially pure oxygen. It might need to be purified. Is commercial exploitation of the recovery of that pure oxygen contemplated to increase the profitability of the operation? And also the question of if any chlorine is produced as a contaminant for the oxygen by-product, is this question of perhaps separation of the chlorine being contemplated? I'm just wondering, I know this could be a bit complicated, and I don't want to take up time now with my nitty-gritty.
Does APA have any paper publication on this? I'm an old-fashioned character. I'm internet incompetent, so please don't refer me to the internet.
Okay. I won't, Rowan. Look, the long and short of it is, what I will do is hook you up with the appropriate APA executive after the meeting, which is Darren Rogers. Second one along there, putting his hand up, too, with a nice tie on. Nice to see you with a tie on, Darren. I'll hook you up with Darren to do that. They're very good questions that you're asking, and they are obviously all things that are being considered as part of the, you know, feasibility analysis.
Oh, good.
of it. I'll get you after the meeting, if that's okay, Rowan, to engage with Darren on the detail.
Good. Look, I certainly appreciate that, invitation, but I would like to say I would like to try and briefly have a word with our company secretary after the meeting as well, and I'm just hoping the two invitations don't clash. Would that be-
Well, they won't run off.
I'm hoping that will be reasonable and possible.
It will be.
Thank you.
Thank you, Rowan. I've got Antoinette back.
I just revert back to how you make appointments. All companies constantly refer to these searches for managing directors, et cetera, et cetera.
Yes.
Do you include current employees for applying for similar appointments? Because I think APA has done very well out of, regarding the expertise of its employees and, people who have worked in related fields.
The short answer, Antoinette, is yes. We have Sue back from the Australian Shareholders' Association. Now I've done the full introduction.
Thank you. Very good for advertising. Mr. Chairman, firstly, we would like to thank the company for the time that the chair, the acting CEO, and other senior executives made available to us to work through all of the questions that we had. A question on strategy. For a number of years, you've had an acquisition as part of your strategy, and it's a key part of the STI structure. You've also got quite a large group of options that you're considering under organic growth. Is another acquisition, now that you've done Basslink, still part of the strategy, given the amount of work that the company has in front of it, or are you considering pulling back from that?
Well, normally, you know, you wouldn't comment on that, but what I can say to you is that we're not actively pursuing, at this point in time, any other acquisitions. That doesn't rule out the fact that there may be something that we would look to in the future. As I think both Adam and I talked about, we've got a AUD 1.4 billion organic growth pipeline ahead of us at the moment. It's no secret we're participating in the New South Wales government is running a process at the moment to look to build a renewable energy zone, as they've called it. We've been shortlisted on that, and we're participating in that. Basslink, as you said, that's. We've been after that for quite some time.
Julian Peck, who leaves us shortly, down in the front row here, has put it mildly, worked his butt off to get that done, and I'll publicly say well done, Julian, on that. Nothing at the moment, and our primary focus at this point intends to be on organic growth, but I won't rule anything out in the future.
Thank you.
Thank you. Okay, I think we have a question up the back there.
Chairman, I'd like to introduce Robert, a shareholder.
Okay.
Just a couple of points. The first point is, we get our annual tax statements in September. Why with modern computer technology are we still waiting something like two or three months after the end of the financial year to get that information, to get our tax returns completed?
Yep.
That only delays things like refunds, you know. I'd like to know why do we need a new computer system or, you know.
I think-
What's the problem?
Yep. I'll answer that if you like. The short answer to it is that because of the nature of us as a trust, you've got different components that go into the distribution. From a final kind of completeness standpoint to say, "This is exactly what it is," we have to wait until we finalize our annual accounts that they get signed off and the components of the distribution actually get signed off. Unfortunately, that doesn't occur till around the third week of August, typically. Apologies, and it is a very familiar question that we get at the annual general meeting.
What we did a number of years ago, and many security holders, like yourself who want to lodge their returns earlier, we have an annual tax estimator, which sits on the website. You can go into that. That will give you know, an estimate of the breakdown, and that is acceptable to the tax office to the best of my knowledge and belief. We've had no issues with that. If you wanna get your return in early, use the tax estimator and you can complete your return using that information.
All right.
That's the reason we have to wait until we have our accounts finally signed off.
Well, my second part of it is, you know, what I can't understand in this country, we don't have to rely on Vladimir Putin and his gas and oil reserves, right, in this country. We've got plenty of that in this country. What I can't understand is why are we so swayed by a lot of scaremongering by the government that prices are gonna go up, you know, this year 25%, next year 35%, when we have abundant coal, abundant water, abundant sunshine, abundant gas, right? A lot of investment, not only by this company, but by Andrew Forrest and also your previous company, AGL. Why are the prices going up? Is it because of government incompetence or is it because we're so over-regulated in the whole sphere that no one knows what's happening?
I'd like to know what the view of this company is in its attempts to stabilize prices and guarantee supply. Because the reason why we have electricity in this country is not because of we need to keep the lights on, but we need to keep industry sustainable in this country and competitive in the world market, and we need it for the education of our children, so they can turn the lights on at night and do their homework.
Yeah. If I started, I'll probably be taking two hours to explain all the nuances of it. Let me just go to look at a couple of points that you've raised. If we look at the gas market, first of all, why are prices going up in the gas market? There are three LNG projects that have been built up in Gladstone in Queensland. That was built against the backdrop of there not being gas that was reserved for the domestic market. The consequence is with you mentioned Russia and Putin, et cetera.
We don't need them.
That has obviously led to a significant increase in LNG prices around the globe. If the LNG producers can get gas and feed it into those projects, they can export it at very high prices. That's fundamentally that extra demand relative to supply that's available in the system is why gas prices have gone up. I would argue a simple answer to that is more supply.
Well, you know.
As one answer. That's one part of it. The other part is, you know, electricity prices are going up for a whole myriad of reasons, including there were breakdowns in coal-fired generators running into winter. Obviously, people are, you know, perhaps not spending as much on maintenance as they necessarily should. There's a whole myriad of reasons that have gone on in relation to that for prices to go up. As far as your part of your question about what are APA doing about it, we've been absolutely on the front foot about it. We've looked at the supply-demand balance for gas on the East Coast. We typically would only go into projects, historically, we've only gone to projects if we've got a long-term contract to underpin it.
We looked at the supply-demand balance for gas on the East Coast and said there's absolutely a need to be able to move more gas from Queensland down to Victoria because Bass Strait is being depleted, which is something I've personally been talking about for many, many years. We have a project underway right now to build extra capacity into the system to be able to move gas from north to south. We're proactively doing that, and that's what we can do because as I say, more supply is kind of fundamental to where you go on price and security of supply. Anyway, that'll do, but I could go for.
Okay. Well, my third question is, from your experience, when should we see prices actually coming down and this country being more competitive in energy pricing?
Well, first of all, with respect to the electricity market, as has been reported over the last couple of weeks, there is something like, and I don't have exactly the right number, but there's circa a 35% increase already baked into retail electricity prices next year. Just by the way the system worked, and I won't try and explain how the system works for that, but that's already baked in. You're probably looking at least another, you know, couple of years of higher prices at a retail level, before you potentially see some moderation in the prices.
Okay. Thank you.
Kynwynn Strong, are there any other questions from the platform?
Yes, Chairman. Two security holders, Joyce Barbara Samways and Equus SA, have asked a question to the effect: Why do we have to wait till September fourteenth for our June 30th dividend and tax statement to be released? First week in September next year would be appreciated.
Well, like I think I've just answered that question. Do we have another question, Kynwynn Strong?
Yes. The next question is from Steven Main. Did any of the five main proxy advisors, ACSI, Ownership Matters, Glass Lewis, ISS, and ASA, recommend a vote against any of today's board resolutions? And if so, what concerns did they raise?
As I've said before, and again, the short answer to that is no.
The next question is from Stephen Mayne, and it's quite a long one. Given the interesting discussions along a range of topics today, could the chair undertake to make an archived copy of the webcast, plus a full transcript of proceedings available on your company's website? You did the webcast last year, but not the transcript. Politicians and judges aren't told to watch videos of parliament and court proceedings. They get a transcript of everything that is said. The likes of Nine, AGL, ASX, ANZ, CIMIC, Domino's, IDP Education, and Lendlease all produced their first AGM transcripts in 2021. Will you follow suit in order to be more transparent?
I think we're being very transparent, Stephen, and as I said, we will make a copy. The webcast will be available for people to review. I'd also say we look after our security holders' money and I don't want anything, so anyway, we don't need to spend that money on having a transcript. People can listen.
The next question is from Steven Main. UniSuper, Vanguard, and State Street are our three largest shareholders with a collective 24.7% of the company. Have they ever raised concerns about the governance weakness in our trust structure? How much would it cost each year in extra tax if we regularized our structure and ditched the trusts to become a normal company?
Look, I've addressed the second part of your question already, Stephen. Look, the short answer is, to my knowledge, none of those shareholders have raised a concern about it. In fact, the only person that I can remember now raising a concern about it in recent memory, is you, Stephen.
The next question is from David Timothy Bryce. With the drive to societal decarbonization and financial institutions in Australia reluctant to lend to energy companies to fund new developments, does APA also find difficulty with Australian financial institutions to borrow money from like many of the coal companies? Does the ESG crowd take the same view of APA as they do with energy companies that mine commodities like thermal coal?
Again, look, our experience is that we have had no issue at all, to date with respect to raising money. APA has an excellent reputation in debt markets in Australia, Europe, Asia, the US. I also think that there is a growing recognition, as I've talked about today, of the critical role that gas has to play in the transition, and so we're perhaps viewed a little differently from others. You know, to evidence what I'm saying, we have refinanced AUD 3.2 billion worth of our debt facilities over the last two years.
The next question is from Steven Main. Under former chair Len Bleasel's long leadership, APA had significant personnel crossover with its original sponsoring company, AGL. Our Chair, Michael Fraser, is a former AGL CEO, which is now only capitalized at AUD 4.52 billion, whereas we are now worth AUD 11.3 billion. How deep are the current ties with AGL, both in terms of personnel who have come across and in commercial arrangement? That's the first part.
Yeah, I was just gonna say, I did ask at the start of the meeting that if shareholders could limit themselves to two questions. Kynwynn Strong, I might just answer this part of the question, and then I think that's enough for Stephen Mayne. We might see if there are any other questions that people had. Look, I'm not gonna go into detail, but the long and the short of it is that it's now 22 years since APA was separated out of AGL. I was probably one of the younger people around at the time in AGL that's still in the industry that came across.
Look, the reality is that there is a handful of people that have worked at both AGL and APA, but literally out of our 2,000-plus employees, it would be a handful of people.
The next question is from Walter and Audrey Francis Martins. I was happy to receive a good dividend from APA in spite of the economy facing many challenges, including COVID-19. My question is, how do you do it? APA also faces another challenge of an additional holiday for our Queen's funeral on Monday the nineteenth of September. Will it be just another challenge?
Well, how do we do it? Look, I mean, we just talked about APA, AGL 22 years ago. When APA was spun out of AGL, one of the premises of it was that it would be a vehicle that would provide reliable, low risk returns to security holders. Kind of 22 years on, and after the last 18 years of consistent growth in distributions, I think it's fair to say that that original premise was absolutely correct. Today, we have around 90% of our revenues are CPI linked. We've got our interest rate cost largely hedged out until 2025.
Hopefully, as you've seen with the distribution guidance for next year, we've still got more growth ahead of us. I think over the years, the APA, us, we've never always got it right, but by and large, we've got it right. I think if we continue to invest wisely and manage prudently, we'll continue to do well in the future.
The next question is from McMahon Family Investments. Can you please explain the sudden departure of our CEO, the reasons and financial impact of changes in our strategy, et cetera, e.g. US expansion, articulate our current strategy, provide SWOT analysis on our SBUs, provide an outlook and comment on our forecast EBIT, EPS, DPS?
Well, there's a lot in that. I'll see if I can pick up a few bits of it. Look, with respect to Rob Wheals' departure, the last few years have been difficult for many businesses and many CEOs, particularly with a business that is as geographically diverse as APA's business is. Really against that backdrop, and also the board having made a decision not to pursue the U.S. strategy and acquisition in the U.S., Rob decided it was the right time for him and the right time for APA for him to step down after 14 years with the organization. As I said before, he's left the business in very good shape, and we wish him well for the future.
With respect to the US, look, there have been some costs associated with that, but it's all been, they haven't been significant, is the long and short of it in the context of a company the size of APA. With respect to our strategy, that remains really the same as it was, excluding the fact that we don't intend to pursue an acquisition in the U.S. We intend to focus here on the Australian market, whereas, you know, we've talked about today and you see it in the papers every day and on the news every day, there is so much to be done in the energy sector in Australia. We think this is where we're best placed to focus and deliver value for shareholders.
With respect, I think the last part of it was questions around outlooks for EPS, et cetera, et cetera. Look, the only guidance that we do give out is the distribution guidance, which we've reiterated today, and that is AUD 0.55 per security for the financial year that we're now in, FY 2023.
Chairman, the next question is from Kevin Troy. When will the company cease acting like a Ponzi scheme and restrict dividends to be paid out of the net tax paid profits and use depreciation cash to repay borrowings?
It's a funny one. We can't keep everyone happy, is what I will start by saying, because we have a number of shareholders and analysts who say we should pay out higher distributions rather than lower distributions. I think really, from a policy point of view, our policy is to pay out 60%-70% of free cash flow as a distribution. The really important thing, though, is that our distributions are paid out of cash flow net of whatever capital expenditure we have to in order to maintain our assets. I think the point of that question is getting at the fact that from an accounting perspective, we pay our distributions out of both profits and capital. Dare I say, it is only accounting.
The important thing is that we pay our distributions out of cash flow, as I said, after allowing for the capital we need to maintain our assets. I think the last part of the question was around lowering our debt levels. Look, our debt metrics are very strong. I talked about how we'd refinance AUD 3.2 billion over the last couple of years. In the last year, our credit metrics just really what you need to look at, they've actually improved and strengthened, even with the distributions that we've paid.
Chairman, we have similar questions from Peter and Maureen Pierce and Tommy Kwok-chi Chan . When are we going to receive a dividend? When can we expect to receive a regular dividend?
Well, I think, all I can say is after 18 years of continuous growth, I think we've delivered on that. Do we have any other questions?
The next question is from Helen Haysom. Why, in 2022, do you only have one woman on the board? Diversity strengthens performance. Why are directors' remunerations not limited to 10 times the base salary of the lowest paid employee or contractor? These funds could be used to reinvest in the business or to provide much better dividends for investors, as well as to contribute to a fairer Australia. No one deserves AUD 900,000 per annum.
I just looked left and right to make sure that my fellow colleagues on the board hadn't exited on me. We do have three female directors, 50/50, at the moment in terms of the makeup of the board. I'll take that as a question on remuneration, generally. There's been a lot, actually, said about how competitive it is out there at the moment. We go through an annual review process. We do benchmark where how we're placed versus organizations that we compete with for talent. We don't seek to overpay people, but we do seek to get good people with the skills that we need into the business, and we need to be competitive in the market to do that, and that's what we seek to do.
Chairman, the next question is from Richard Hughes. Why are directors' fees increasing when shareholders have waited years and years and years for a dividend?
Well, okay. The answer is obvious to the second part of that. Shareholders haven't waited for years and years. With respect to directors' fees, there was generally a modest 2.5% increase back on the first of January. We had our two of our committees together back then, so there was an increase for the chair of what was the Audit and Risk Committee above that. Chairman's fees went up 0.5%, which was the superannuation piece. I'll just add the chairman's fees haven't gone up in five years, I think it is. I think we're doing okay with respect to getting the balance right for distributions.
Chairman, there are no further questions on the platform.
All right. Well, that was a fairly lengthy question and answer session, so thank you for those questions. That completes the business of the meeting. Now, before I close, please note the voting will remain open until the conclusion of the five-minute voting window for webcast online participants. All polls will then automatically close. For those of you here in the room, please hand your voting card to a Link Market Services team member so that it can be counted, if you haven't already done so. Thank you to all of you for your attendance today, and we appreciate your interest in APA. I thank you for your patience and support with today's hybrid meeting process. I wish you all good health until we meet again.
For those of you in the room, please join us for refreshments in the foyer and meet up with a couple of execs who've got appointments. Thank you, everyone. Cheers.