To view documents relevant to today's meeting, including more detailed instructions on how to use the platform, select the Documents icon. A list of all available documents will appear. When selected, the documents will open within the Lumi platform. You will still be able to listen to the meeting while viewing the documents. Text questions can be submitted at any time, and the audio queue is now open. I will now hand over to Mr. Tony Ottaviano.
Thank you, Billy. Good morning, everyone. I appreciate you making the call between Easter and Anzac Day holiday. I'm proud to say today that we have got an excellent suite of results to disclose to the market. With me today, helping me present these results, are Jon Latto, our CFO, and Adam Smits, our Chief Operating Officer. Billy, without too much more time, can we go into the slide, please? The first slide is the disclaimer or the important information, followed by the summary slide. If we start with the summary slide, again, it starts with safety. You will see from the highlight side, we've had another strong quarter of safety. This safety is usually a precursor to good performance. Good safety almost always aligns with good performance. That underpins the plant improved performance.
We're seeing that through our confidence that, as we previously alluded to, we've been trialing a lot of the high-contamination, lower-grade material through the plant because the plant can take it, and it's performing very, very well. When we get to the section in the plant that Adam will present, you will see that for yourself. We've reinitiated the ore sorting, and we've done also some underground trials, which have given us very good results. We're continuing to successfully ramp up. As we mentioned in our half-year results, we called commercial production in the processing plant. We've commenced underground production on schedule. We're increasing our sales volumes, which is lowering our operating costs, which has resulted in a net positive operating cash flow.
That's two quarters in a row that we've been able to deliver net cash flow from operating activities, which has delivered a very strong and robust cash balance at the end of the quarter. Finally, from our inception, we've produced over 200,000 tons of spodumene at a 5.2% grade. Again, that's after eight months of operation. Billy, if we move to the next slide, we've got our ESG performance. Both our lost time injury frequency rate and our TRIFR have gone up slightly as a result of two things, in part mainly because we've seen a drop-off in the amount of total working hours as part of our construction demobilization. As operations normalize, we will see that come back into the zone we need it to be. The other point that I wanted to mention is the renewable power.
We've had over 80% penetration in the quarter. That is very encouraging because it keeps our cost of power down to a very attractive level. On the right-hand side, I want to draw your attention to this photo. This is a joint company called NPH, run by a very, very impressive young man in Troy. He is second from your left. I have personally visited this operation. NPH will do all our maintenance on all our light vehicles. It is one of the largest contracts awarded to Aboriginal Corporation in the Goldfields. Next slide, please, Billy. Just to highlight, I will draw your attention to a couple of key points. Firstly, concentrate production. We have increased that by a further 12% from the previous quarter. Again, a very good performance. The second thing I wanted to draw your attention to is the net cash from operating activities.
What makes this even more pleasing to the team is that this quarter, we did not have the benefit of capitalized commissioning costs, and we have incurred a full quarter of royalties. That is a particularly strong performance in comparison to our competitors. The second one I want to draw your attention to is lithium recovery. This is a very important—it is a noticeable increase, 10%. We have also mentioned in previous disclosures that during this quarter, we have had, during the underground trials, recoveries of over 70% and producing concentrate over 1,700 ton a day. It is very encouraging of what we can look forward to as part of the underground operations when we get going 100% underground. We see the underground as a point of competitive advantage.
The other point to note on this lithium recovery, it's done on an average mine grade or lithium grade to the plant of 1.3. The normal view is the higher the feed grade, the better recovery. The plant is performing where we can feed to it a lower-grade product but still get very strong recoveries. The next two points I want to draw your attention to is the cash on hand. There's AUD 173 million in the bank at the end of March. Even better, we've got 23,000 tons of concentrate at the port ready to put on a ship. Finally, operating costs. The points I want to draw out here is this operating cost is done on a 6% basis. Please, I ask the analysts to normalize the competitors' costs to a 6% standard and then compare us. On a US basis, it's AUD 512 a ton FOB.
On an Aussie dollar basis, it's 18% lower than the previous quarter. If we do it on a 5.2% basis to compare ourselves, it's AUD 708 a ton. Next slide, please. I'll now hand over the production side of the quarterly report to our Chief Operating Officer, Adam Smits.
Thanks, Tony. I think another strong quarter for the open pit with just under 2.5 million tons of ore mined or ore and waste mined through from the pit. Of that, sort of 550,000 was ore in a stripping ratio of just over 3. Grade control drilling was finished in the quarter. That's very, very important to finalize the wire frames and the ongoing extraction of the remaining part of the pit. The pit is on schedule to be finished in sort of January, February of next year. I'll talk more about that later in terms of the transition from open pit to underground. We have over 1 million tons of 1.3 million tons of ore now, ore and OSP material on the ROM pad. That's composed of about 800,000 tons of OSP and just over 400,000 of clean ore.
The picture at the bottom of the page, I think, sums it up. You can see the various fingers of ore on the ROM Pad. There is a large stockpile to the right of that picture as well of further ore. We will just go to the next slide.
I can just add a couple of points on this one.
Sorry.
That's okay. I think the analysts and the investors who have registered their interest on our site visit coming up in June will see firsthand how well organized this ROM Pad is. You can see it from the aerial photograph. The other point that I want to stress, again, we've gone to great lengths to explain this, is this strategic stockpile. 1.3 million tons and an investment of AUD 103 million. The operating cost, because there are a lot of accounting adjustments created through inventory and non-cash items, this is an investment where the capital and the cash has been sunk. We can draw from this stockpile going forward, which will then wash through our operating costs because that's how the accounting treatment works. It does not impact our cash balance. It's an investment that we've already sunk.
Thanks, Tony. In terms of underground, another strong quarter at 1,850 meters of development, 53,000 tons of clean ore and just over 100,000 tons of waste. That clean ore was development ore with stopping starting in April quarter. Jumbo productivity, again, another strong quarter at just over 300 meters of jumbo. We expect that to fall backwards a bit in the current quarter now that stopping has happened and there is a lot more interaction going on underground. Key infrastructure projects, the heart and soul of an underground mine, were progressed during the month, during the quarter, with the accessway raised bores completed, underground re-tech completed. Underground paste plant is ready to commission fully in May. Plus, we ran that plant. Probably 60% of the plant ran for the entire quarter, producing dry stack tiles material, which were used in our tile stamp upgrades.
That is really, really positive that that part of the plant is fully staffed, fully manned, and fully operational. Raised boring activities continue through the quarter for the ventilation. The first raised bore is expected to be finished in the first week of May. We expect the first fan to be installed in the June quarter.
The only other points I'd add to that great summary is this photo of the pegmatite drive. I mean, you can see from this picture, it's 100% ore. This isn't narrow vein gold mining. That entire drive is ore that we will capture as part of our stopping sequence. The other point we make is when people present slides such as this, they show the absolute result. But how does it track against our plan? This quarter, we're ahead of plan, 160 meters ahead of plan. The team on site are doing a very good job in managing the preparation and what we need to stay ahead of in order to deliver the production.
Next slide, please, Billy. In terms of the plant performance, I think you can summarize it best in terms of strong availability at 91% for the quarter and continued improvement in recovery. We have stepped up from 58% in the December quarter to 64% in the March quarter. That is with 600,000 tons or just under of ore being processed during the quarter. We had a record production month in March. Recovery in March averaged 68%, and we had days in March, probably three or four days, that averaged over 70%. That is including underground ore trials, OSP ore trials, and ore blends. I will talk a little bit more about that in preceding slides. In terms of where we are going to now, there are a number of key initiatives that are underway.
One of those is looking at regrinding a fraction of our tile stream and this measurable recovery associated with that. We expect to have that in and running in July. That has been progressed very, very hard in the quarter. There are comminution and classification upgrades that we are following through with, which includes the first of its type particle size distribution online. We will actually have cameras in pipes that are measuring the particle sizes. We have a complete new lining system coming for the SAG mill. That is a 26-week lead. That has already been designed and made. We have a proprietary control system going in the mill, all focused on controlling the grind, if you like, better. There are flotation circuit improvements that are underway, focused on coarse and fine recovery.
You can see there's a real focus on, yes, we're doing okay with recovery, but there's a push to get to that 70%. The really encouraging thing that Tony touched on a little bit earlier was that when we feed it that sort of 1.5 underground dirt, my God, we get some amazing recoveries. We got 70% plus without any optimization. There's a lot of room to move there when you combine it with the other initiatives that we're following up on.
The only other point that I would add to that summary is, now, these improvements that we've identified, these optimization initiatives, we've got a pathway to 70. These initiatives are to reinforce that pathway to 70, make it sustainable and strong, but also go beyond, well beyond 70.
Okay. Next slide. Thanks, Billy. In terms of that underground transition, the big focus of that underground transition, as Tony alluded to earlier in the presentation, is that stockpiling of that 1.3 million tons of ore. That supports the 15-month ramp-up of the underground. It's been a real focus of ours to establish that stockpile, set up that stockpile in a way that it can be reclaimed, and give the underground chance to ramp up to the run rate that we've got in our plans. Key activities in the March quarter, which I've touched on, was treatment of OSP. For the benefit of the AUD ience, OSP is basically diluted or contaminated ore that ranges between 5-30% contamination. That contamination is the host rock, which we call gabbro. That is rich in iron, calcium, and other bits and pieces that impact on recovery.
We really focused on trials of how we can process that OSP material and blends of that so that we maximize our recovery and maintain grades above the 5%. We also did some trials in March of straight underground ore. As I alluded, we got massive step-up in recovery with very little optimization. We jumped to 70% in the first day of those trials, which is very, very encouraging. There were a couple of issues picked up, which we have already got projects underway to rectify, mainly around steel. We also did a lot of work in terms of blends of the OSP with clean ore. We have recommenced sorting as a result of that, as Tony has alluded to.
Our future blend for the next 15 months will include a combination of underground ore as it comes out of the underground, sorted material, and blended straight OSP. We have a very clear strategy of what we are doing with that 1.3 million tons.
I want to re-emphasize. We alluded to in the previous quarter that we are testing various blending strategies through this plant. What we are finding is the plant is resilient. We can throw at the plant higher percentages of this gabbro than others are experiencing. It is a real competitive advantage. We are going to try and push that as much as we can. Therefore, this OSP material, which typically open pit mines, 30% of what they mine is categorized as OSP. We can blend this through our plants with a combination of some material which is ore-sorted, and the plant can take it, which is a huge benefit.
Yeah. Initial trialing is sort of indicating we can process this stuff at least twice what the plant was designed for. There is still scope to go on that.
Now, with this product and increasing the amount of gabbro in the blend, we're hoping that our trajectory for the recovery continues to increase. Depending on how this goes and how much the plant goes, that could taper a bit.
Okay. Next slide, please. In terms of sales, I think 93,000, five shipments at 5.2 shipped for the quarter, with the biggest shipment being 36,000 tons shipped in January on the basis of 96,000 tons produced at 5.1. There was also sales of tantalite at 221 dry metric tons at about 5% grade at Argus spot prices. The tantalite is probably one of our bigger other optimized areas in the plant. There is a big focus and a project just kicked off on how to improve tantalum recovery full stop.
Okay. Thank you, Adam. Now we'll hand over to Jon Latto, and he'll go through the operational and, well, mainly the financial metrics.
Okay. Thanks, Billy. If we could turn to the next page, please.
Okay. On the top of page 13, it shows a summary of some of the key metrics. As Tony has mentioned, the March quarter saw a 12% increase in production to 95,709 dry metric tons and a 15% increase in sales to 93,940 DMT. Grade shift was consistent quarter on quarter at 5.2%. There was a small increase in the average realized price we achieved on an SC6E basis from AUD 806 per ton sold in the December 2024 quarter to AUD 815 per ton sold in the March 2025 quarter. Looking at some key financial metrics now, we see that revenue for the quarter was AUD 104 million, which was a 17% increase from the AUD 89 million in revenue reported for the previous quarter. Our cash balance remained strong at AUD 173 million at the end of March.
Overall, our cash balance decreased AUD 20 million, or approximately 10% quarter on quarter, with the majority of that decrease being driven by expenditure on underground activities without the benefit yet of the material underground production, which will come in future periods. In terms of our cost metrics, we have unit operating costs in AUD terms. They reduced by 18% from AUD 1,000 per DMT of SC6E sold in the December 2024 quarter to AUD 816 per DMT sold in the March 2025 quarter. AISC reduced 8% in AUD terms from AUD 1,170 per DMT SC6E in the December 2024 quarter to AUD 1,081 per DMT SC6E in the March 2025 quarter. You will note that the 18% quarter on quarter decrease in unit operating costs was greater than the 8% quarter on quarter decrease in AISC. This differential relates to sustaining capital.
This occurred because we brought forward a TSF raise that was initially planned for FY 2026 into FY 2025. This was driven by some underground schedule changes, which changed the timing of paste fill requirements, which meant that some more material reported to tailings.
As a result of the November strategy review in the plan for stopping.
Correct. The key factor driving the reduction in unit operating cost metric and the AISC metric for the March 2025 quarter was the 15% increase in ton sold in the March quarter, where ton sold increased from 81,341 DMT in the December 2024 quarter to 93,940 DMT in the March 2025 quarter. In addition, our gross mining costs were 7% lower in the December quarter as we had 8% less material moved from the open pit, driven by a scheduled reduction in our open pit mining fleet as part of the new mining plan that we announced to the market back in November 2024. We have noted in the presentation and the ASX announcement released today that we expect to trend towards the upper end of our cost guidance.
At an AISC of AUD 1,081 per DMT SC6E sold for the March quarter, we're actually under our guidance range at the moment, which is between AUD 1,170 per ton of SC6E and AUD 1,290 per ton of SC6E sold. There are a couple of factors that will push us higher in Q4. These include the introduction of ore sorting in April 2025, which Tony has spoken to. Also, in Q4, we will draw down on our stockpiles as we ramp up our underground activities. We expect to see a charge to our AISC rather than a credit to our AISC and our unit operating costs that we've seen to date. Lastly, we also have an underspend in our forecast sustaining capital projects for the year to date. We have forecast a catch-up of that underspend in Q4.
We also have a capitalized deferred waste charge for Q4 as the strip ratio in the open pit increases for the quarter as we mine down to our next ore zone. Billy, if I could turn the question.
We've just finished, sorry, the business optimization initiatives. As we alluded to the market back in November, we'd identified about AUD 100 million. We're on track to deliver them. We're AUD 60 million already realized. That's the first point. The second point I'd like to add just to further reinforce on the guidance. Now, we've introduced ore sorting. The plant is performing that well. I can't reassure the market more about its performance. Therefore, we want to throw in some of that OSP material while we can. That has an accounting impact where we've got to, while we draw from the stockpile, there's a charge on the operating costs. That's why we've given the market that guidance.
Thanks, Tony. Billy, if you could move across to the next page, please, on our briefly talk about the Cashflow Waterfall in front of you. The Cashflow Waterfall shows in chart form the same information that is in the Appendix 5B Cashflow Statement that we have released today. It is a pretty straightforward waterfall. I will not talk to all of the components, but I will make the following comments. Firstly, we generated positive cash flow from operating activities, as Tony has mentioned, of AUD 14 million for the quarter. I would just like to put that in a bit of context. We previously announced that we had declared commercial production from the Kathleen Valley Processing Plant with effect from the 1st of January 2025.
As a result, this means that this is the Q1 since we commenced production where we have not capitalized any of our operating costs associated with ramping up the processing plant. All operating costs are now reporting to cash flow from operating activities. In addition, this is the Q1 in which we have paid royalties. This cash flow is also shown as part of our operating costs for the quarter. To put the royalty outflow in context, we made our first sale in September 2024. Funds from that sale were received in October 2024, along with further sales receipts received in the December quarter. It is the receipt of revenue that crystallizes the royalty obligation. Royalties linked to the December quarter are paid in January 2025.
For this current quarter, we also include circa AUD 6 million of cash outflow associated with royalty payments as part of our payments for operating activities. Taking all of this into account, we reported a positive cash flow from operating activities for the quarter of AUD 14 million, a strong result. The only other component of the waterfall I will touch on is the cash flow through investing activities, which showed an outflow of AUD 27 million for the quarter. The majority of this related to development expenditure associated with the underground. The waterfall chart shows that we closed the quarter with a strong cash balance of AUD 173 million. A couple of comments to add here. We also had a shipment that took place on March 31, 2025 worth approximately AUD 12 million, for which we received the funds in April.
We also had concentrate on hand of approximately 23,000 tons at the end of the quarter. We also have AUD 25 million on deposit with Export Finance Australia associated with a guarantee required under our power purchase agreement with Zenith. This has been cash backed for quite some time. We continue to work with the various parties concerned to have those funds returned to us and replaced with alternative security. This AUD 25 million does not form part of the AUD 173 million closing cash on hand that we have reported for 31 March 2025. Having said that, I'll turn back to Tony.
Thank you, Jon. Comprehensive as ever. Now, if we move to the next slide, Billy, let's talk about the market. Okay. I want to spend a little bit of time on this. I think you've seen from the various other lithium producers that have delivered their quarterly results, we're all in agreement, and the various forecasters have seen this as well, that the demand signals are strong. They will continue to be strong. There are sectors of the battery market that are outperforming. Stationary batteries is one of those. If we look at recent results from BYD and CATL, profit margins are strong for the end users of our product.
If you look at the views of the world, Wood Mackenzie versus CATL, and we got this from their recent prospectus where they have listed on the Hong Kong Exchange, their view as a battery producer is far, far stronger than the forecasters. They are seeing an 83% increase on EV demand over the next five years. They are seeing an even stronger increase in stationary batteries. What is happening here? Why are we not seeing a corresponding increase in the price of raw materials? The fundamental reason, as we see it here in Liontown, is the length of the battery value chain. There is inventory scattered throughout the value chain. It is that inventory that buffers. If you have a demand increase, a demand signal, it will take time to work through the inventory that is contained in the battery value chain.
You have inventory at the car manufacturers. You have inventory in the battery producers. You have inventory at the PECAM and so on at the refineries. Until that works through, we won't see an impact to the price directly. The positive angle is the demand signal is strong. Now, on supply, I can tell you that at the current prices, the incentive signal is non-existent. It will disincentivize, and it has disincentivized, exploration, brownfields expansions, and new projects. We know, having done this ourselves, it will take years for new Greenfields capacity to come on, even if they started today. At some point, this will correct and correct strongly because you cannot suppress the raw material supply as it's currently being done for as long as they anticipate without a material impact. We're seeing that.
We know a number of players right across the battery value chain, the refiners, the PECAM producers, they are not making money. We are encouraged about the short to medium term in terms of demand signals. We see a turnaround coming because at these prices, we will not see new supply. That brings our presentation to an end. Thank you, everyone. We will now open up to Q&A.
Thank you, Tony. If you have not yet submitted your text questions or joined the live audio queue, please do so now. I will introduce each caller by name and ask you to go ahead. You will then hear a beep indicating your microphone is live. Our first question is from John Fisher, Jarden Group Australia. John, please go ahead after the beep.
Good morning, guys. Thanks very much for taking my questions. Firstly, congratulations on the continued impressive ramp-up. I think technically the performance of the operation is very commendable and obviously bearing out the results. So well done. Well done to the team in that regard. Obviously, lithium prices at the moment aren't doing you guys much by way of favor. I guess my first question is around, obviously, the guidance. You've indicated that at the top end of the cost range for the fiscal year or for the June half, which worked out at current exchange around AUD 825 US per ton, SC6 equivalent. Obviously, fast markets are now printing with a seven handle. Your all-in sustaining cost is obviously impacted a little bit by stockpile movements and accounting treatments. It also doesn't fully factor in the underground or the freight element. Very long-winded question.
What sort of additional elements are you looking to manage that cost and, I guess, ensure that you can maintain operating free cash flow?
Thanks, Fish. I'll take that and let the team chime in. There's a couple of points to unpick your question. Firstly, I want to sort of head off the issue of underground costs. Our guidance already factors in three months of underground production. That's the first thing. There's some amount of underground production costs built into that. The second point that I'd like to make is currently we're incurring the costs of open pit and the costs of underground together. Once this year finishes, this calendar year finishes, the operating costs associated with the open pit will disappear. I'm not sure the market has taken that into account, that we'll be just solely underground mining after the end of this calendar year.
Now, in terms of where we are in our cost structures, we believe now that we're building an operating database and operating know-how, we will continue to look for efficiencies and productivity improvements. We have a number of initiatives underway or will be underway in the new financial year in order to deliver those operational benefits. We did a first pass in November when we released our strategic review. This is an ongoing exercise. We believe we have more room to move. One, for example, is reagents. Reagents form 20%-25% of our processing costs. We have a number of alternatives that we're currently testing to reduce those costs. There is better purchasing we will go through because a lot of our contracts were signed at the peak of the market.
There is an opportunity now to renegotiate a lot of the consumables and input costs. They are just two examples, Fish, of further operational improvements and efficiency we can derive. Okay?
Okay. Can I just add something to that just around the all-in cost then? I mean, I know we're still pending guidance for fiscal 2026. I respect that's a work in progress. Are you able to give us some steer or an update as to what you think the capital number looks like through fiscal 2026 to establish a steady-state underground operation?
The main cost of an underground operation is the upfront development. We are sinking that CapEx now, right, so that once we get into operations, we have the headings and the drives open. A lot of that investment, Fish, is already happening. Whilst next year we have already alluded to the market, it is a transition year and the operating costs will trend higher. We believe on the CapEx for our development, it will be sustained. Potentially in the future, it has come off as we get into that higher margin zone in the ore body, which is thicker and therefore the development is already being done.
Our next question comes from Kate McCutcheon from Citibank. Kate, please go ahead.
Hi. Hi. Morning, Tony and team. Just the processing physicals, just to explain how they've been restated. Previously, December quarter was 620,000 tons milled. Now that's 555, so you've lost 10% of tons. What is driving that big reconciliation difference there? Has that been resolved?
Yes. A couple of points there. Yes, it has been resolved. What we typically do in the normal course of events is routine reconciliations and the mass balances across the plant from ship to ROM Pad. In the course of that full reconciliation, once we called commercial production the 1st of January as part of our half-year results, we did the flyovers and the surveys and checked and balances. We found that there were some bits of the instrumentation in the plant, waytometers and conveyors, that were giving us an overcall on production. We have corrected for that. There is no impact on sold tons. They are what they are. We have reported it. On the mill feed, given the waytometer discrepancies and on the concentrate conveyor into the shed, there were some anomalies on the waytometers. We have corrected for that.
Okay. Got it. Fixed now. Just thinking about the cash position into the end of the financial year, you've noticed that the stockpiles cost AUD 103 million to build per se. There is an adjustment to cash when that is fed. Can you give us some color around how much of the stockpiles you expect to feed over the next three, six, nine months or what that profile looks like to help us correctly model that P&L versus cash adjustment?
Yeah. Sure, Kate. We do expect to see a pretty significant drawdown in stockpiles across the June quarter, circa 500,000 tons, something like that. Broadly speaking, we expect to see that stabilize, or sorry, that will take you to FY2025. There is a smaller drawdown as we move into FY2026. When I say smaller, it is circa 100,000 tons or something like that. That is for the first half of FY2026. We do continue to draw down the stockpile across FY2026, but we still retain a.
A decent buffer.
A decent stockpile balance at 30 June 2026.
We will give all that as part of our guidance.
Yeah.
Thank you. Our next question comes from Adam Baker from Macquarie. Adam, please go ahead.
Morning, Tony, John, and Adam. Just on the Capitol Inn corner, it's gone very well for you guys. Good to hear that it's going till February next year. Just wondering how many tons are left to be extracted from the pit, please, or tons.
Trying to remember. I'm going to have to get back to you on that, Adam.
Yeah, no problem. I can reach out after the call. Just maybe on sustaining CapEx, the two half FY2025 guidance between AUD 55 million-AUD 63 million. Just wondering how much there was in the 3Q. You have the AUD 6 million royalties, but just sustaining CapEx as a line item itself, does around AUD 19 million sound about right?
For the third quarter, the March 25 quarter?
Yes.
No, it's lower than that, Adam. I.
A bit of catch-up in the 40.
Yeah. John's alluded to it. Yeah, we do. There is definitely. We've had sort of an understand on our CapEx. We have forecast a catch-up, but let's see how much of that eventually.
Okay then. Thank you.
Our next question comes from Hayden Bairstow from Argonaut. Hayden, please go ahead.
Yeah, morning, guys. Tony, it's a question on the underground. I mean, the reserve grade's lower than what you sort of talked about in this development grade that you've delivered already, and you just started stoping. I mean, can you give us any guidance on the early sort of grade profile of the underground as you go through this ramp-up phase? Or can you focus on higher grade areas?
Initial grades, I think 1.4-1.6 in that range. Some of the upper zone.
How long can you sustain that for?
That's pretty much all of, I think, FY26, the underground ore is similar. Yep.
Yeah. Okay. And then just on the discussion around sort of the CapEx catch-up, I mean, what are we spending on in the fourth quarter that you haven't that you sort of pushed out that's material? Or as you sort of alluded to, is it likely that CapEx guidance, if anything, you'll fall short of it? There'll be a bit more in 2026.
There's basically two components there, Hayden. There's the sustaining CapEx in the plant, which we've traditionally seen and understand to date. We've brought some of that forward. The other piece is, as we mentioned, we are moving out of the ore zone. Our strip ratio increases. We have some capitalized deferred waste as well for Q4.
Thank you. Our next question comes from Glyn Lawcock from Barrenjoey. Glyn, please go ahead.
Morning, Tony and team. Just firstly, could you make any comments around how the blast went in your first stope? I mean, there's obviously been lots of concerns around how it may go, whether it'll fracture. You obviously talked to us about having the thin layer around the outside, which will give you some benefits. Just how has that actually physically gone?
That's a very good question, Glyn. Both Adam and myself spent the weekend, last weekend, on site so that we could go and have a look at the first stope and the blast. We were very, very happy. It was clean breaks, exactly how we predicted it. The team's got some more fine-tuning and optimization. The fragmentation, I'll let Adam speak on it, but it was almost like, yeah, I think we're calling it sugar. Sugar. Really, really, really good fragmentation. Very clean breaks. They're looking at revising some of the way they drill underground in terms of the overdrill. They're looking at how much of a skin they leave. Certainly, recovery from the stope was excellent. There's a lot of learnings from that stope. That initial stope was about 12,000 tons.
To put it in perspective, it's a fairly small one from what we're going to see going forwards. Yeah, very, very encouraging. The other point that we would make is, again, this is the differentiation between narrow-vein mining of gold versus what we're doing. That one stope, that 12,000 tons, that's two days of production just from one stope. That's a baby stope. We've got stopes coming up in the next financial year where they're close to 80,000 tons. This is an opportunity for this mine to really get economies of scale. We'll be doing a little piece on this as part of our next presentation coming out of the Macquarie conference and going into diggers.
Okay. Thanks, Tony. If I could just follow up. If I just look at the cash flow statement for the quarter, AUD 94 million roughly spent excluding the money on CapEx. There is obviously a little bit of sustaining in that. If I take the 94 million and divide by your SC6 volume, I actually get closer to AUD 1,200 a ton, not the AUD 1,100. Is that because you are capitalizing some costs that are not coming through? On a true cash basis, is it actually higher than what you are reporting?
Glyn, perhaps I'll give you a call after this. That's a tricky question to answer on the fly. I can certainly assure you that our AISC is calculated correctly. If there are some differences to cash flow, obviously, you've got the differences between cash and accrual.
Drawdowns of stocks or building stockpiles impacts it.
Yeah. There is an inventory component. I would not use your skid maths as indicative, Glyn.
Thank you. Our next question comes from Levi Spry from UBS. Levi, please go ahead.
Yeah. Good day, team. Thanks for your time. I guess if as we think about heading into FY26 guidance, can you just talk through some of the things you're thinking about? Recoveries are obviously trending well, but it's at a 5.2%. Is that the starting point?
Yeah. I think where we've got to, Levi, is as you recall, we've been looking at what is the optimal concentrate grade that we'll probably target on an ongoing basis. And 5.2-5.3 is the range in line with our competitors. Now, in terms of other things.
Okay. Thank you.
In terms of other things we're foreshadowing in FY26, we continue to look at ways of ensuring that the ramp-up of the underground occurs more efficiently and effectively. That is an ongoing improvement. The plant, I've already touched on a few parts of the plant that we're looking at improving. There are better reagents, more cost-effective reagents. All those will be factored in as part of the FY26. Again, I sort of stress that it is a transition year.
Yep. Okay. Thank you. I think some of the previous questions are sort of dancing around the cash flow waterfall. We are trying to work out what that might look like this quarter and then obviously next year. Can you just talk to me about what is the cash flow from investing activities waterfall there? Underground development, sustaining project, what that could look like this quarter. I guess the lease stuff, we are assuming that repeats. What about the other items like interest and stuff?
Perhaps if I just take a step back, Levi. I mean, I suppose what your question really is about our cash balance, I'm assuming. We've taken a pretty prudent view in relation to the current pricing environment and our internal models. We've allowed for a spot to continue for quite some time. Our models show that even with those assumptions incorporated, we still will get to 30 June. We'll still have a healthy cash balance and beyond as we progress into FY2026. Obviously, if the current pricing continues for years, then us, as with every other lithium producer, will have to revisit it. As we sit here today, we have allowed for current spot pricing to continue for an extended period of time, and we remain comfortable. Yeah.
The other point that I'd say in terms of what is the next quarter in terms of sustaining capital. That AUD 27 million cash burn that we had in that category, John's already alluded to that there's potentially some sustaining capital that we've brought forward, and there's some catch-up to be done. There may be a little bit extra there, but nothing material.
Thank you. Our next question comes from Milan Tomic from JP Morgan. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, team. Thanks for the call. Just had a question on the interest payments. I saw that there are only AUD 1.2 million for the quarter. Your debt's about AUD 800 million. Applies a very low interest rate. Are you just able to provide a bit more clarity on what those interest payments are going to be moving forward? Is there a catch-up payment that we should account for in a future date, or?
Yeah, sure. Thanks for the question. I mean, at the moment, all of our interest payments are capitalized. So we do not have any cash outflow associated with interest payments, either under our debt with Ford or our debt with LG. In terms of cash interest payments going forwards, basically, the commencement of interest payments under the Ford debt facility will commence when the off-take commences. So that is, I think.
September.
That's September in the September 25 quarter. In terms of interest payments across FY26, they're relatively modest. We sort of expect sort of in terms of cash interest payments, AUD 4 million a quarter, something of that range. [crosstalk] That 1 million, isn't that an inflow? That's interest from. The million dollars? Yeah. It'd be an inflow. It's a net inflow, isn't it? Yeah. On our accounts. Yeah. Interest on our cash balance. Yeah.
Thanks very much. I'll leave it there.
No worries.
Our next question comes from Anthony Barich from Platts. Anthony, please go ahead.
Yeah. Just regarding Anthony Albanese, talking about the critical mineral strategic reserve, just wondering whether you think lithium should be included in that because they have not announced details about it yet. And whether you think it is a general good idea, whether it could promote investment as AMEC has. What are your thoughts?
Yeah. Thanks for the question. Look, you can appreciate we've been focused on our quarterly and presenting it. They've got announced today. We are not across the detail and exactly what the Prime Minister has presented and disclosed to the Australian people. Give us a little bit of time to review that, and then we'll have a position.
That's okay. Just regarding your operations, the things that are impacting your operations, I think Dale from PLS the other day talked about tariff-related uncertainty could affect the financing and development of new lithium projects. Just wondering whether you suspect that may be the case as well. If so, give us some flesh on that.
Look, put tariffs to one side. The price itself, and given that you guys reported, that's a big enough disincentive for future projects. I think we need to worry about that first rather than everything else.
Thank you. Our next question is a text question from Brad Johnson, a private shareholder.
What is your take on the demand side for lithium over the next 12 months?
Hi, Brad. Thanks for being a shareholder. Appreciate your support. Look, as far as we're concerned, and we've already alluded to that in my market slide, we're very, very strong on demand for the next 12 months and for the next decade, actually. It's not just our perspective. We've got an in-house view, but what we see in the market, the biggest battery producer in the world showing a very strong forecast for battery demand in the next 5-10 years. Even if CATL's view was halved, it's still a tremendous growth path. As I've said, it will take time for it to ultimately flow through a very long supply chain to get to the raw materials, given how much inventory it contains at each part of the supply chain.
You need to wash that through first before you see an impact on the price of raw materials.
Thank you. Our next question is a text question from Anthony Barrage from Platts. The CEO of PLS said tariff-related uncertainties may create headwinds for funding and development for the new lithium supplies. Do you agree with this?
I think, Billy, we've heard from Mr. Platts already, so I think I've answered that question.
Next question is an AUD io question from Jon Bishop. John, please go ahead.
Thanks for taking my follow-up. Just a couple of questions probably embedded. You were quoted in the press recently in Western Australia about accessing the WA State Government lithium support package. Are you able to comment as to where that's at?
Yes.
Apologies. We are having some technical difficulties. Tony, can you hear me?
Yes, we can, Billy, but I didn't hear Bish's second question.
No worries at all. John, could you please go ahead and repeat your question?
Okay. Can you hear me?
Yep. Loud and clear, Bish. That signal at Rhodo is not.
I wish. It's not a great day either over here. Not a good day for Rhodo. Look, you were quoted in the press recently being flagged as potentially accessing the WA State Government critical minerals or lithium support package. Are you able to comment on where that process is at, please?
Yes, I am. We've had a really positive engagement with the government on this, and we're working towards concluding those discussions, and we'll make an announcement on that in due course.
Okay. Can I just have a quick follow-up to that? Just regarding your Ford payments, which start next fiscal year, are you also having discussions with Ford around potentially deferring the principal repayments?
Look, I'm probably not at liberty to announce very confidential discussions, but we're in constant dialogue with all our customers around a whole range of things. Ford is not unique, but we are talking to all our customers about the current situation.
Thank you. That is the last question we have time for today. I will pass back to Tony for some closing remarks.
Thank you, Billy. Thank you to the people that have dialed in to the great questions. For those that will follow up, we will do that. Leanne Cot will follow up and provide you those responses. Again, in summary, I think we are doing our very best to ramp up the plant and get it to a stable situation. We have done that. We are now moving our focus to the underground. We want to make the underground a winner. We do believe the underground will give us a competitive advantage longer term, especially around ore hygiene and fragmentation. The grades that we are seeing in the underground, as Adam has already pointed to, work very well through the plant.
I want to move all this OSP material, all this low-grade, high-contamination material, throw it through the plant because it can take it, and then move ourselves into 100% underground material and let this plant fly. Thank you for everyone for listening, and we'll sign off from here.
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