Macmahon Holdings Limited (ASX:MAH)
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Apr 28, 2026, 4:10 PM AEST
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Earnings Call: H1 2024

Feb 20, 2024

Operator

Thank you for standing by and welcome to the Macmahon Holdings Limited H1 2024 results conference call. All participants are in a listen-only mode. There will be a presentation followed by a question-and-answer session. If you wish to ask a question, you'll need to press the star key followed by the number one on your telephone keypad. I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Mick Finnegan, Managing Director and Chief Executive Officer. Please go ahead.

Mick Finnegan
Managing Director, CEO, Macmahon

Hi everyone and welcome to the Macmahon 2024 H1 results presentation. I'm Mick Finnegan, the Chief Executive Officer and Managing Director of Macmahon, and with me is our Chief Financial Officer, Ursula Lummis. Thanks for joining us today. As always, we appreciate your time and the opportunity to run through today's presentation, particularly during the busy ASX reporting season. I'll provide an overview of our result before handing over to Ursula to run through the financials in more detail. I'll conclude with some comments around our strategic outlook, after which we will be happy to take questions. Let's begin with the financial highlights on slide two. Macmahon has made an excellent start to the financial year with earnings up strongly across the board, margin improvement, and increased operating cash flow.

Reported revenue decreased by around 2% to AUD 966 million following the commencement of Batu Hijau phase 8 in April 2023, which saw the removal of Batu Hijau phase 7 cost recovery revenue that contributed about AUD 150 million in the H1 of 2023. Comparing on a like-for-like basis, revenue was actually up around 15%, which we believe is more reflective of the business performance. Our focus in the half was delivering both operational improvement for our clients and earnings growth for the business following the AUD 2.6 billion in contract wins secured in the last financial year, and I think the results reflect that. Underlying EBITDA was up 17.9% to AUD 176 million, and EBITA up 26.9% to AUD 68.1 million. Underlying NPATA was up over 33% to AUD 39.7 million, with statutory NPAT at AUD 36.5 million. You can find a reconciliation of these in the appendix of our results presentation.

EBITDA and EBITA margins were up to 18.2% and 7.1% respectively. These margin levels are more representative of the business now that Batu Hijau cost recovery revenue is excluded, but we still saw good improvement given the growth in underlying earnings was nearly double the rate of like-for-like revenue growth. Operating cash flow also saw strong growth, up 31% to AUD 138.2 million for the half. Cash conversion was 78.6%, impacted by some timings of receipts, VAT, and working capital movements, and we expect this to improve in the H2 consistent with previous years. Cash flow generation supported a strong balance sheet, and we've been able to increase our interim dividend by 50% to AUD 0.45 per share. You will notice that our return on average capital employed has reached and exceeded our long-term target of 15%.

Our response to that has been to increase our long-term target, and I'll talk more about that later. Finally, our order book remains strong at AUD 4.4 billion and is supported by a tender pipeline of AUD 11.6 billion comprised of predominantly capital-led opportunities, including AUD 2.2 billion of tenders submitted and projects at an early contractor involvement stage. Our secured revenue for FY 2024 is AUD 1.8 billion and has allowed us to increase our full-year guidance range slightly to expected revenue of AUD 1.8 billion-AUD 1.9 billion, while retaining our FY 2024 EBITA guidance of between AUD 130 million and AUD 140 million. And with a stronger H2 expected, it positions us at least at the upper end of guidance. Our guidance performance is shown on slide three.

I fully appreciate that our track record is only as good as our last result, but we have worked hard to deliver consistent and reliable performance in the business, and I'm pleased our half-year results have continued to demonstrate our consistency in delivering on what we say. This is notwithstanding some uncertain market conditions in recent years and continuing challenges around costs, skilled labor shortages, and volatility in commodity prices. I'd like to thank the entire Macmahon team for achieving this and continuing to strive to deliver on our targets. Again, we're on track for FY 2024, which is pleasing to report. Capital-led is a term we have increasingly used in conjunction with our growth plans, and slide four draws out progress we have made in reducing the capital intensity of the business.

We have done this by diversifying and expanding our revenue to include more underground mining, mining support services, and civil infrastructure projects, which are typically less capital-intensive than surface mining and support free cash flow generation. This has continued to be a major focus during the period and has contributed to our positive results. Underground mining and civil infrastructure work is a priority and made up more than one-third of our revenue mix as at the end of the H1 FY 2024. This compares to only 10% back in FY 2018. During this time, we have also grown the surface division of scale, providing contract tenure and a stable foundation we can leverage to accelerate Capital-led growth. Importantly, two-thirds of our AUD 11.6 billion tender pipeline comprises underground plus mining support and civil infrastructure opportunities, indicating there is a lot further we can go in the Capital-led area.

To help achieve this, we continued to build our capabilities in underground, which included the Pit N Portal transaction, which I will talk more about shortly. I mentioned in my overview that we exceeded our long-term ROACE target of 15% in the H1 of FY 2024. We've increased this now to target 20% given we have now completed the high-CapEx growth phase for new projects and reflecting both the gains we have made around growing our lower capital-intensive work and the significant opportunities in our pipeline. Our long-term underlying EBITA target remains unchanged at 8%. Our EBITA margin was 7.1% over the half-year period, but we have seen margin improvement as the year progressed. In the final quarter of FY 2023, we reached 8.1%, so we are well-positioned for full-year FY 2024 if we can maintain this.

On slide five, I'd like to cover some of the more operational highlights from the half. In the surface space, Greenbushes is on track through mobilization and ramp-up, with steady state expected in April 2024. Record gold production was achieved at King of the Hills at a time of elevated gold prices, so this was really important. This was a really important achievement for our client. We focused on operational efficiency with continuous improvement initiatives implemented across the portfolio. We're actively looking at opportunities to lower the capital intensity of surface projects, and the strategic rental agreement with Emeco is a great example, which I will talk more about shortly. In underground, the focus has been on continued growth. We are targeting growth of over 50% the next two years to maintain the momentum of 44% CAGR we have achieved since FY 2018.

The acquisition of key Pit N Portal contracts will add circa AUD 100 million in underground revenue to our order book, but more importantly, the new workforce and underground assets will provide security to existing work and enhance the growth capacity of the business at the right time. In mining support services and civil infrastructure, we successfully completed the Fimiston Tailings Storage Facility project and are continuing to pursue a highly filtered tender pipeline with AUD 4 billion of civil opportunities, which is up from near zero in FY 2019. Managing risk and building capability are important considerations, and we have been pursuing teaming and strategic partnership arrangements in Australia and Indonesia to execute from the pipeline. Finally, at a corporate level, we continue to see a tight market for skilled labor in Australia, but encouragingly, the rate of cost inflation has shown signs of normalizing.

We continue to proactively manage these issues and successfully attracted talent to increase our workforce to nearly 9,000 people, excluding the 220 employees acquired from Pit N Portal. In addition, contract structures provided protection against rising input costs, including labor, with 35% alliance-style contracts, and we're always testing return and capital metrics on all projects and looking to improve those when opportunities present. I mentioned the Pit N Portal acquisition earlier, and now on slide six, I'd like to discuss the strategic rationale for the transaction. The slide provides a summary of the transaction details. These were also outlined in the ASX announcement, so I won't repeat them here, other than to say that the transaction was structured to be consistent with Macmahon's capital-led approach to investment, with no CAGR outlay, and to manage and minimize risk.

The key advantages centered around building scale and further capability in underground and providing flexibility for our Capital-led growth strategy. The transaction adds a significant skilled employee base in a tight Australian labor market. Around 220 Pit N Portal employees joined Macmahon's workforce. They are located across strategic locations in Perth, Kambalda, and Kalgoorlie, in addition to customer sites in Western Australia. The accompanying strategic rental agreement with Emeco facilitates growth flexibility, again on a Capital-led basis, while enhancing free cash flow generation capability. Finally, the contracts we acquired include Mincor Cassini and Durkin Projects, which Wyloo has recently indicated will be put in care and maintenance from 1 June 2024.

We don't expect this to impact our expected revenue from Pit N Portal in the H2, and the workforce can be readily deployed on other Macmahon projects, helping us meet our ongoing people requirements and retaining our capacity to execute on our extensive pipeline. Slide seven is a recap of our key projects: their tenure, cost curve profile, and related commodity exposure. Some key callouts include our newest project is the Greenbushes Lithium Project, a tier 1 global asset supplying 40% of the world's lithium. As I mentioned earlier, the ramp-up has progressed well. The Dawson contract expires in June, and we are currently reviewing extension options with the client that are amenable to both parties. You will recognize slide eight as another regular feature in our presentations, which outlines the portfolio diversity in the business.

This is an increasingly important attribute given the significant price volatility we have seen in some commodities over the last twelve months, such as lithium and nickel. While we have a large exposure to gold, approximately 75% gold and copper gold on a revenue basis, we do have diversity among commodity exposure and also by client. It is worth noting that our exposure in Indonesia has dropped off to 6.5% following the commencement of Batu Hijau phase 8, which saw the elimination of cost recovery revenue. We would like to leverage our competitive advantage to increase this through some capital-led contract wins in this region. Moving on to slide nine on people and culture, I'll begin with the safety and well-being of our people, the management of which is critical for our business.

TRIFR increased slightly from 3.94- 4.36, and while severity tended to trend down, this is always a priority focus for us. To assist in setting our expectations for safety and quality throughout the business, we have developed the Winning at Macmahon supervisor training to educate in role-specific processes, systems, and legal obligations, and we also introduced the Electronic Passbook to strengthen our leaders' knowledge of the HSEQ systems and processes. On the workforce front, we continued our efforts on both development and acquisition, including the 220 people from Pit N Portal. Development included ongoing investment in our Grow Your Own program, and this delivered 286 new recruits. We also have 421 trainee participants, 26 mining graduates, and 109 apprentices. We were again successful in attracting talent in the challenging market to increase our workforce to more than 9,200 people.

Overall, female representation in the Australian-based workforce increased to 19% across all occupations, and First Nations people represent 4.7% of the Australian workforce. Slide 10 outlines some of our sustainability-related activities and metrics, and I've already covered some of these points in my discussion on people and workforce, so I'll let you go through the points on this slide in your own time. I will, however, take the time to reiterate the importance of a sustainable business to Macmahon. At Macmahon, we are committed to embedding sustainability within our business, strategy, operations, and culture so we can continue to grow responsibly and in a way that delivers positive outcomes to our team members, customers, investors, and the communities in which we operate. I'll now hand over to Ursula, who will take us through the half-year financials.

Ursula Lummis
CFO, Macmahon

Thanks, Mick. Good morning, everyone, and thank you again for joining us today. Before I go through the profit and loss, slide 12 provides some additional context on our half-yearly financial performance over the last three or so years. The key takeaway is the growth and the consistency the business has been able to deliver in this period, particularly in underlying earnings. Underlying EBITDA and EBITA continued this track record in the H1 of 2024. We have also adjusted for the impact of the zero-margin cost recoveries included in revenue under Batu Hijau phase 7, which was approximately AUD 150 million in the H1 of 2023. You can see from the shaded columns in the revenue chart that adjusted revenue has largely been on a positive trend, with a tapering off slightly in the last year due to the commencements of Batu Hijau phase 8 and the removal of these pass-through costs.

Excluding the pass-through revenue, on a like-for-like basis, revenue growth in the H1 of 2024 was over 15% compared to FY 2023 and over 25% on the preceding half in 2022. We have also adjusted the EBITA margin chart on the bottom right to separate margin performance based on a like-for-like revenue. The clear columns show the margin performance on revenue excluding zero-margin cost recoveries, and you can see the difference is significant. This also highlights that the H1 of 2024 included revenue growth from the AUD 2.6 billion in contract wins secured in the last financial year, which have taken time to reach steady state and provide scope for margin improvements, which we expect to see towards the end of the year. Slide 13 provides a summary of our profit and loss statement.

Mick already called out the key revenue and earnings changes, so I just want to cover off on a few of the other relevant details. Net finance costs were 6.2% in the H1 of 2024 compared to 5.2% in the H1 of 2023, reflecting interest rate increases and the refinancing costs of our financing facilities. Interest rates appear to have stabilized, so we don't expect to see significant rate-related increases going forward. The effective tax rate is 29.2%, following AUD 15 million of tax expense incurred in the H1. The reported statutory impact was AUD 36.5 million compared to underlying impact of AUD 39.7 million, which excludes one-off adjustments principally relating to share-based payments, acquisition and corporate development costs, and software as a service costs. Finally, the strong half-year performance supported an increase in the half-year dividend to AUD 0.45 per share unfranked, equating to a payout of 23.8%.

This was in line with the increased policy payout range of 20%-35% of underlying earnings per share, previously announced at our FY 2023 results release in August, and it is also a 50% increase compared to the H1 of FY 2023. Cash flow net debt waterfall on slide 14 provides an overview of the major cash movements during the year impacting our net debt position at the 31st of December. In summary, net debt increased from June 2023 primarily due to the increased working capital relating to the timing of receipts from customers, delay in receiving the Indonesian VAT, and the Greenbushes project ramp-up. Underlying EBITDA of AUD 176 million was the major driver of cash generation, with net working capital movements of AUD 37.7 million resulting in underlying operating cash flows of AUD 138.2 million for the half.

Consistent with prior years, this is expected to be higher in our H2. The 78.6% EBITDA cash conversion was impacted by timing of certain receivables, the VAT, and increases in working capital for the project ramp-ups, including Greenbushes. Again, we expect significant uplift in second-half cash conversion as has occurred in the previous years. Total CapEx was AUD 128.5 million, comprising sustaining CapEx of AUD 80.1 million, growth CapEx of AUD 31.4 million primarily relating to the Greenbushes lithium project, and AUD 17 million related to tires. The FY 2024 CapEx forecast remains unchanged at AUD 203 million. This excludes tires.

Overall, while it was a relatively neutral H1 of free cash flow generation, with the timing seasonal impacts I've noted and CapEx more weighted to the H1, we expect a step up in the free cash flow to return in the H2, together with a lowering of the net debt and gearing, in line with our expectations as set in the beginning of the year. Slide 15 shows our five-year cash generation and return on average capital employed track record by half. The core strategic objective has been to improve cash returns and the return on average capital employed. You can see from the chart that the business has historically been a consistent generator of cash with a relatively high earnings cash conversion.

Cash generation in the H1 of 2024 was AUD 138.2 million, with cash conversion below full-year levels, but this is not uncommon at the half-year due to the cash receipts and working capital timing differences. We expect cash conversion for the full year to be higher, with no change to the expected free cash flow for the full year, as previously noted. The chart on the right shows the return on average capital employed has steadily improved to be back above our long-term target of 15%, following a couple of years of higher capital investment dragging returns down. We expect this return to continue increasing as the capital intensity of the business reduces and positive earnings and margin growth continues. Accordingly, as Mick noted earlier, we have now increased our long-term return on average capital employed target to 20%.

Slide 16 provides a summary of the balance sheet, highlighting continued improvements and balance sheet strength. Net debt as of the 31st of December was AUD 212 million, up slightly in the six-month period, but is expected to be below the 30 June 2023 levels by June 2024. Borrowings comprise predominantly bank financing facilities and equipment leases. Net debt EBITDA of 0.63 x and gearing of 25.1% is below our internal guide rail of 1 times and 30%, respectively. Current gearing level reflects the ramp-up of Greenbushes operations, including CapEx in the H1 that is now largely complete. Lastly, cash on hand was AUD 200 million, and together with the available banking facilities, totals AUD 264 million. Thank you for your attention. I will now hand you back over to Mick before we open for questions.

Mick Finnegan
Managing Director, CEO, Macmahon

Thanks, Ursula. Now, I know I go through the strategy slides in all of our results presentations, and people may be keen for me to skip straight to the outlook. But our strategy guides our direction. Delivery of our strategy drives our performance, and our strategic objectives frame our outlook. I'll get to the outlook shortly, but please bear with me while I briefly recap on our strategy on slide 18. Our strategic themes are to improve margins and execution of the underlying business, invest in future relevance and competitive advantage through investment in our people, processes, and systems, undertake focused expansion in current markets, including underground and Indonesia, diversify through new business growth with a focus on accelerating growth in the civil infrastructure area, and assess corporate value drivers to ensure we have the balance sheet required to execute our strategy.

It is worth noting that as part of this, we regularly review all our projects to ensure they are continuing to meet internal hurdle rates, including margins, return on average capital employed, and free cash flow generation. Where required, we will recycle capital from high-to-low capital-intensive projects. I hope you can see these themes have been evident in our H1 of FY 2024, with our focus on margin improvement, investment in people, enhanced underground mining capability, increasing business mix, and improvement in capital management and returns. This is the basis for us increasing our return on average capital employed target from 15%-20%, which we see as sustainable moving forward for the business mix we are developing. Before I talk about the outlook for the H2 of FY 2024, I want to walk you through our order book and tender pipeline on slide 19.

Our current order book remains robust and stands at AUD 4.4 billion. The order book runoff chart on the left shows a high volume of secured work in FY 2024 and FY 2025 at AUD 1.8 billion and AUD 1.3 billion, respectively. This excludes any short-term churn work, which is usually between AUD 100 million-AUD 150 million per annum, putting us in a very strong position for the years ahead. The tender pipeline has grown to AUD 11.6 billion and comprises highly filtered, strategically aligned, and credible project opportunities aligned to our capital light strategy. It reflects strong market activity in the underground and civil spaces. Along with continuing strong levels of activity across the broader mining sector, the growing tender pipeline supports a positive, longer-term outlook for the business in our targeted areas. Macmahon's capital allocation policy is outlined on slide 20.

It reflects our view on the importance of balancing dividend payments to our shareholders and retaining financial flexibility to enable the continued execution of our strategy. Our priorities remain to maintain a resilient balance sheet and ensure appropriate liquidity and gearing, retain flexibility to fund organic growth and accretive acquisitions, and provide increased cash return to shareholders. We've been executing on all three fronts, with balance sheet leverage and gearing being kept well within our long-term ceilings of 1x and 30%, targeting lower capital-intensive growth in underground, and a consistent track record of sustainable dividend payments to shareholders. We increased our payout ratio in FY 2023 in line with our focus on capital light growth and improving business performance.

You can also see in the graphs at the bottom of the slide that Macmahon continues to deliver significant growth in revenue and earnings over the past five years, while our price-to-earnings ratio has more than halved over the same period. Given we are past the CapEx-heavy growth cycle, which pushed our gearing and leverage to the FY 2022 peak, I believe this divergence will now correct. That brings me to our priorities and outlook for the H2 of FY 2024. It shouldn't surprise you that our priorities are largely the same as outlined here on slide 21, all with a view to generating capital light revenue, earnings, and cash flow growth. Consistent with the past, we expect our H2 FY 2024 free cash flow generation to be much stronger than the H1, which will see us deliver increased cashback earnings in FY 2024 pre-dividend payments.

We have a positive outlook with our AUD 4.4 billion order book showing a high level of secured earnings in FY 2024, underpinning the bottom of our revenue guidance range. We have a very robust AUD 11.6 billion tender pipeline that continues to support our positive demand outlook for the business and also our objectives to grow in lower capital-intensive segments. Levels of activity in the mining sector remain strong, and we have diversity in our order book, our client base, and our capabilities. Interest rates and cost inflation appear to have stabilized in Australia, and the tight labour market is showing signs of easing. Skilled labour is still difficult and expensive to source, and we will continue to invest internally and consider opportune acquisitions where we can.

With that backdrop, our guidance for FY 2024 is for revenue in the range of AUD 1.8 billion-AUD 1.9 billion, up slightly from the previous range of AUD 1.7 billion-AUD 1.8 billion, and underlying EBITDA of AUD 130 million-AUD 140 million, with a stronger H2 expected, which should be at least towards the top end of the guidance range. Again, this is supported by our strong order book with around AUD 1.8 billion of work already secured for FY 2024, excluding short-term churn work. With that, I'd like to now hand back to the operator to open for questions.

Operator

Thank you. If you wish to ask a question, please press star one on your telephone and wait for your name to be announced. If you wish to cancel your request, please press star two. If you're on a speakerphone, please pick up the handset to ask your question. Your first question comes from James Lennon from Petra Capital. Please go ahead.

James Lennon
Senior Industrials Analyst, Petra Capital

Hi, Mick and Ursula. Well done on the results. Just a quick question on your depreciation and CapEx. So is it fair to assume going forward, I mean, you mentioned there you've passed the peak. Where do you see CapEx as a proportion of depreciation getting to? Is it likely that CapEx will sort of come below depreciation or around about the same? Where do you sort of see it going in the next three to four years?

Mick Finnegan
Managing Director, CEO, Macmahon

Yeah. Look, thanks for the question, James. Over the longer term, we'd expect CapEx to just be slightly above depreciation, but we would see depreciation be in a smaller proportion of overall revenue and obviously earnings as we pivot towards the lower capital-intensive earnings that we're looking at, and you can see in our pipeline. But yeah, we'd see the absolute number probably staying the same as earnings increase and are attracted from other areas that don't require as much capital.

James Lennon
Senior Industrials Analyst, Petra Capital

Great. Thank you.

Operator

Thank you. Once again, if you wish to ask a question, please press star 1 on your telephone. Your next question comes from Alexander Baer from Cove SMSF. Please go ahead.

Alexander Baer
Analyst, Cove SMSF

Yeah. Hi, Mick. Well done on the result. Just a quick question on the tender pipeline. I think it's on slide 19. You point out you've got AUD 2.2 billion of tenders submitted and at ECI stage. Can you just give us a bit of color on capital intensity of the tenders? I think casting my mind back to Talison's, I think it was AUD 1.1 billion off the top of my head and something like AUD 128 million in capital or capex. So can you just give us a bit of guidance around the tender pipeline? How intensive is that in terms of CapEx? Thanks.

Mick Finnegan
Managing Director, CEO, Macmahon

Yeah, for sure. Thanks, Alexander. Look, of the AUD 11.6, as you can see, 2/3 is underground and civil mining support services, and that's very intentional. You'll see the mining support services civil infrastructure is AUD 4.2 of the AUD 11.6, and you'll see in one of the earliest slides that's grown from zero years ago. We did that very deliberately so we could grow a long-term foundation in surface so that we had the ability to be selective in the new work we bring on.

So as a result of that, and obviously, it's the reason we have confidence lifting the return on average capital employed target now from 15%- 20%, and we expect to do it even further in the future. That's off the back of the fact that almost all of the tenders submitted at the moment are low CapEx tenders, and I would say below 20%-25% of CapEx for every annual revenue dollar. So you're dead right with Greenbushes. That was about AUD 1.1 billion at the time, and AUD 128 million was the top end of the CapEx. And we did say at the time we're looking for different ways to do that. And we've been moderately successful in doing that, but this would be much lower capital intensity than Greenbushes. And in some cases, over half of those jobs are effectively only working capital, no capital outlay for fleet.

The other thing that contributes to that are things like the Emeco rental agreement that we've agreed with Emeco as part of the Pit N Portal deal. By getting competitive rates there, it does make us competitive in the civil infrastructure area and means we don't have to labor off our balance sheet. The only time we'd do that in the civil area is if we had idle assets, which at the moment we have very little.

Alexander Baer
Analyst, Cove SMSF

Okay. Thanks. Just one other question. Just on the dividend, I think it's unfranked from memory, but I noted you've started paying tax and you'll likely continue to pay tax. Just in terms of the franking, can you give us some guidance on what level of franking we should expect going forward?

Ursula Lummis
CFO, Macmahon

Hi, Alex. Just to highlight, so for the H1, we've utilized all the tax losses. We have not started paying tax yet, so we will, by 30 June, be in a tax-paying position. The franking will only accrue to Macmahon the minute we pay their tax, which is December 25. Albeit though, the ATO can come back and request us stop making provisional payments, but at this point, we're still not generating franking credits.

Alexander Baer
Analyst, Cove SMSF

Okay. All right. Thanks, guys. Great result. Thank you.

Mick Finnegan
Managing Director, CEO, Macmahon

Thanks, Alex.

Operator

Thank you. Once again, if you wish to ask a question, please press star one on your telephone. We'll now pause a moment to allow for any final questions. Thank you. Your next question, it comes from Tony Greco, private investor. Please go ahead.

Tony Greco
Analyst, Private Investor

Oh, good day, Mick. Tony here. Yeah. Congratulations again on the good result, similar with the other guys. Just wondering, with your shareholding in Calidus, don't know if I pronounced that right, comfortable holding it for the moment? Does it sort of help you work more as a partnership with them if additional work comes on or comes from their mines? What are your thoughts of that?

Mick Finnegan
Managing Director, CEO, Macmahon

Yeah. We did a very intensive day before we took that move, and we're obviously comfortable with Dave Reeves and his team there. It does allow us to work more in a partnering way, Tony, and there is future work there. But obviously, longer term, we don't intend to be equity holders in our clients. But at the moment, it helps. We do respect and enjoy working with Dave and his team. We see that project and that company growing with what they're doing. And at the right time, we'll convert that back to cash.

Tony Greco
Analyst, Private Investor

Okay. Thanks for that.

Operator

Thank you. Your next question comes from Paul Brower, Private Investor. Please go ahead.

Paul Brower
Analyst, Private Investor

Oh, good morning, Mick. The question with regard to franking credits has been answered. Now that we've passed the high CapEx growth, when do you see that the payout ratio will be increased to 50%?

Mick Finnegan
Managing Director, CEO, Macmahon

Yeah. You're spot on. We did mention at the end of last financial year that we'd move to the 20-35. I think, as Ursula said, we expect net debt gearing to reduce this full year as we did at the start of the year. We'll probably have a couple of years at this level, and then we do intend to put the company towards that 50/50 payout ratio position in the future. All we want to do is I think once we exceed the 20% return on average capital employed cashback target, it would coincide with those sorts of numbers.

Paul Brower
Analyst, Private Investor

Okay. Thanks very much, Mick.

Mick Finnegan
Managing Director, CEO, Macmahon

No worries, Paul.

Operator

Thank you. Your next question comes from Simone Grogan from The West Australian. Please go ahead. Pardon me, Simone. Your line is now live.

Simone Grogan
Business Reporter, The West Australian

Sorry. It was on mute. Hi, guys. I just wondered if I could get a bit more color on the Cassini contract that you guys picked up from Pit N Portal and how you'll expect they'll reflect on the business. And just as well, if you could talk about any impact for you guys on the slowdown at Greenbushes as well. Thanks.

Mick Finnegan
Managing Director, CEO, Macmahon

Yeah. So in terms of Cassini and Durkin and Simone, we had a pretty good line of sight or a level of expectation what would happen there. And obviously, we took that into account in the acquisition, and Emeco and Ian were very forthright in how we structured that. So we understood that. For us, the priority in that transaction really was to get additional immediate order book, a number of really skilled people in a market that's really hard to attract, those sorts of skilled people, and obviously, the rental arrangement. So we're pleased with what we've done there. And obviously, in the future, depending on what happens, we've got a position there if and when that comes back. In terms of Greenbushes, we haven't seen our production profile change at all, really, in a material way.

We work very closely with the Talison guys, the Talison team, sorry. Got to be correct there. At this stage, there's been very minimal change in the production outlook. Obviously, a lot of what we're doing there in the pits is pre-strip for future order delivery. So at this stage, we haven't seen a shift. If anything, the movements have meant that there's a number of skilled people out there in the market, and I think we all know that that's been rare for a long period of time. So it's one of the things I like about our industry. We stay very close, and if people are keen to work, we make sure that they're gainfully employed by working together. So that's what we're all intending to do, and there's various ways to do that. But at this stage, that's the impact. Lithium is about 11% of our order book. Nickel, very little. So the overall impact to our financial results is minimal.

Simone Grogan
Business Reporter, The West Australian

Great. Thanks for that.

Mick Finnegan
Managing Director, CEO, Macmahon

No worries.

Operator

Thank you. There are no further questions at this time. I'll now hand back to Mr. Finnegan for closing remarks.

Mick Finnegan
Managing Director, CEO, Macmahon

Yeah. Thanks, Darcy. Look, we really appreciate everyone's time. I know it's a busy period. We've got our virtual roadshow starting tomorrow for three days, and then beyond that, we're in Sydney, Melbourne, around where people would need us, really. So please call out, reach out. If there's any questions, we're more than happy to answer them, and we'd look forward to meeting everyone in person as and when the opportunity presents. Really appreciate your time.

Operator

Thank you. That does conclude our conference for today. Thank you for participating. You may now disconnect.

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