We are basically today to host Mitchell to talk about their quarterly update. Just want to ask how many minutes, if we could sort of pop our questions in the Q&A, and towards the end, I'll address and have the team answer the questions for you. And also note, this session is being recorded, so just an FYI. Andrew, just to sort of start this, just for the new investors on the call, it may be worthwhile giving an overview of the Mitchell story, a bit of background on yourself and obviously the depth of the board management, just to give a flavor. So Andrew, over to you. Thank you.
All right. Thanks very much, Allen, and welcome. Thanks for joining the investor briefing. And, yeah, certainly, as Allen said, encourage you to get your questions in and we'll look at them. So, for those that aren't familiar with the background of Mitchell or Mitchell, the brand, or Mitchell Services, I'll give a bit of a brief intro and then touch on the quarterly before I hand over to Nathan. So just the Mitchell Services brand, and for those that aren't aware, has got over 50 years ... And sold that in 2008 for a large amount of money. It was the largest privately owned drilling company in Australia up for sale and was sold to, ASX listed AJ Lucas.
After a five-year non-compete, we reverse merged back into the Australian market, a company called Drill Torque, that was listed. Changed the management team. And come 10 years, well, November this year will be 10 years of Mitchell Services post that reverse merge. But after the reverse merge, a couple of asset acquisitions at the bottom of the market, a couple of earnings accretive acquisitions, and in more recent times, a material organic growth strategy that's now complete. Sort of all those things aside, you look at the business today, where is it? What do we look like? The client book is 90%, you know, working on mine sites and, and then that sort of thing, or even we've only got about 1 or 2% of our revenue comes from greenfield exploration.
80% of our revenue is from global major Tier 1 miners, and probably, you know, 10-15% are Tier 2s and 3s . So it's a high quality contract book, working on the, on the best mine sites around the country, that are low on the cost curve and operate through the cycle. We work in the, in the hard rock sector, so, sort of got probably some of our revenue coming from, copper, gold, lead, and other, and 40% of our revenue coming from, from metallurgical coal. And we work on the surface, and we work in the, in the underground. As about 750 people. And that's a bit of a brief intro to, to the company.
Obviously, Nathan Mitchell with us today, and on the board, found a connection, and just under a 20% holder, will talk after I. So obviously from a company perspective, 10 years in November, and really, company's in the best shape it's ever been. I think we're very well positioned, and I'll touch on that as I go through some updates on the release. So I'm not going to read the quarterly, just touch on a few key points as I go through. Fair to say that it's been a strong start to the financial year, financial and operating cash perspective.
Even cash outflow that we have for shareholder returns in the first quarter, we remain in a very favorable net debt position, and certainly on track to achieve our target net debt by the 30th of June, 2024. Bearing in mind, there weren't any cash tax in the short term, given we took advantage of that instant asset write-off scheme with our organic growth strategy. When people read the quarterly, we have the little charts in there on the, on the rigs and operating shifts. Those two charts that you see in the recent quarterly is the corresponding quarter versus quarter, year on year, which does, does show a reduction. If you actually look at the operating rig count, over sort of the last six months or so, it is really flat. We've got about 98 rigs in the fleet.
We've got five that are old underground rigs that we used within an inch of their life and had a very good run with them. They're old and not gonna get rebuilt, so I would work on the assumption of 93 rigs in the fleet. From a utilization perspective, what we've told people as we've seen them previously, 90% utilization is a good number to work on as full utilization for a drilling business. So 90% of 93 rigs is approximately 83 rigs. In that quarterly, we did state that demand remains strong, and Nathan will talk to his views on the market when I finish. We expect operating rig count to increase as we move into the second quarter.
Obviously, inflation's easing, you know, a majority of contract pricing has been reset. We're certainly in good shape moving forward. You know, the heavy lifting and hard work has been done, and obviously you can see that the numbers are starting to come, and as are the shareholder returns. Towards the end of the quarterly, we talk about the prestigious safety award that the team won in recent times. Very proud of the team for that, and that was against all industries and all size organizations. So certainly for a company of our size, I think a very, very proud moment for us, and certainly talks to the quality of our safety culture, you know, and our performance as well in regards to safety.
So, you know, based on the results in the first quarter, and the fleet and, and all of those things, I certainly think we've got a world-class fleet available to us. We've got fantastic people. The strategic outlook for the business is extremely positive. The balance sheet is getting stronger all the time. We're on track to hit our net debt target that was put out there at AUD 15 million by 30 June next year, and that balance sheet strength is going to give us optionality in the future, whatever that may be. So from a strategic perspective, we have a couple of board strategy sessions every year.
Our next one's in November, and that's probably the first time that the board start turning their mind to where to from here for us as a, as a company, given the strong and positive position that we're going to be in, in the near future. From a coverage perspective, for those that aren't aware, we do have coverage from Q Value and from Morgan's.... So if you, if you're interested, in looking a little bit further at MSV, I would encourage you to, to have a read of, of those, those notes. So I'll hand over to Nathan, our chairman, and he can just talk a little about his views on the market, and some of the capital management, of the business. Thank you.
Yeah, thanks, Andrew. Look, first and foremost, I couldn't be happier and proud of the guys and what they've done. It's been another record for us on this last year and this last quarter. I think we've just gone from strength to strength. You know, we're now at 90-odd rigs in the fleet. I think that, and 10 years later, that's an amazing opportunity. When I sold back in 2008, we had 30 rigs, and now three times the size of that in only 10 years. I agree with Andrew, the company hasn't been—it's in its best position it's ever been in, and the numbers speak for themselves.
I think from a board's point of view, I think fundamentally, we're always looking at what is the right capital management for the shareholders going forward. And for us, I think, as I've said in previous presentations and years gone by, there's really sort of four prongs to what we can do at a board level, and that is, one, to, you know, reinvest, you know, our profits or our returns into the business for growth. And we did that, two years ago with that, you know, investing into the new smarter rigs, and that has really made a huge difference to our business. And, you know, at 3% or 4% interest rates, at the Instant Asset Write-off with the government, I think that was spot on.
And you're seeing that now in the results that we're seeing today. The second prong is obviously, you know, debt reduction. And again, we're on track for debt reduction, as Andrew has said. That's another prong that we're looking at. You know, we don't want to be holding lots of debt. We took on a lot of debt two years ago to make that decision on those rigs. We've now paid that debt off very quickly. And then that leaves us with the other two prongs of what we can do as a board. One is to either return cash to shareholders via dividends, and also do share buybacks. We're doing both. I think we're trying to get a blend of all four of those.
I think we've certainly done well in the first two. I think we've done well in the dividends. Obviously, we pay the dividend. I think overall, correct me if I'm wrong, Greg, but we've sort of paid AUD 8.7 million in shares and buyback for the last 12 months. So that's a fairly hefty return to shareholders, and we'll continue to try and to do that going forward. I think right now, you know, our view is we continue to do growth, but we're now at 8% interest rates, where we don't have instant asset write-off. Not to say that we won't continue to buy rigs, which we will.
We'll continue to grow the fleet as we buy and trade out of old rigs into new rigs. But what we're looking at now is the return of dividends to shareholders. So it's been a long 10 years, and... But also, at the same time, we're looking at the share buybacks. As I say, that's an avenue that we feel that there's an opportunity at the current share price. Now, the ability to be able to turn that on and turn that off, to subject to where the market goes, the market turns, we can turn it off, we can turn it on. We don't have franking credits.
Obviously, the benefit of buying those assets and instantly writing those off gave us the depreciation benefit, which means we don't have the franking credits at the moment. So in our view, there's obviously benefits in then doing the buyback. So again, it's really a balance. We've really tried to balance A, first and foremost, let's get the business really going well. Let's get ourselves market share. Let's get us to number one position in the industry, and then look at what do we do from there with regards to returns to shareholders. And I think we've got a good blend at the moment. We've nailed the timing where the market is, and now we're seeing you know those fruits come to flavor.
I couldn't be happier with what the team has done. On a go-forward position, as Andrew said, we're obviously looking at, you know, we'll have the strategy meeting next month, which we have every year or every twice a year, of where we're gonna go. The market still looks strong for us. Coking coal is up again, $318, you know, at $0.62-$0.63 to the Aussie dollar. Those guys are still making a lot of money, and that represents a large part of our business, 40%, as Andrew said, so that will continue. Thermal's at $142, I think. We don't do very much in thermal at all. Most of our business is all coking coal.
But you've got gold now at $1,975, I think. Again, Aussie dollar 0.63. So I think that'll go to $2,000, so with what's happening in the U.S. and overseas, in the U.S. and the Middle East. So we're in a pretty strong position, I think, going forward. We've spent our money on the gear, and I think the market looks reasonably good for our business. Going forward from a drilling's point of view, the majors are still drilling a lot of holes. They're they want safety as number one paramount, and they're getting it, they're getting that from us. So that's really us in a snapshot.
We'll have our AGM tomorrow on the business, and we'll run through a whole bunch of notes on the company. But overall, I think we couldn't be happier. I think there's a whole bunch of questions. Andrew?
Thanks, Alan.
Sorry, Allen, we just-
I think you're on mute.
On this side? Sorry. Again, thank you, Nathan, and thank you, Andrew. So we'll kick off from the top. So again, I think we've touched on the rigs, but I'll reiterate the question. So, what is the plan with the current idle rigs?
Look, I think there's all idle rigs, and people ask that question to say, "Well, you know, why don't you sell the idle rigs and, you know, return that capital back in the form of dividends or share buybacks?" The issue is, we are a very diverse drilling business. As I say, we're underground, we're on the surface, both in minerals and coal. So we've got large diameter, we've got directional drilling. So we've got a diverse fleet. And the fleet changes, so we don't have. We're not a hire company that has all Toyota Corollas. You know, we have a whole different set of rigs. And so this, you know, this next six months, gold is up.
There might be a lot more exploration, and maybe there's not as much work for the large diameter rigs, and vice versa. You know, coal mines slow down, there's an issue, they turn us off, and so we slow down. So we've always tried to keep a mix of rigs that we're ready to go to a client when they need us. And it's always an issue. You've got to have gear sitting on the sideline. It's a 12-month lead time for drilling rigs. And if so, a client, a good client comes to us and says, "Look, we need you to ramp up," we can't just turn around and say, "Look, you know, we'll get back to you in 12 months' time." So yes, we'll have got idle rigs. But the only...
If they're idle rigs that we don't think are necessary, then we'll sell them, which is what we've done over the last 12 months, and we've returned that capital in the form of dividends. Sorry, in the form of share buybacks. So yeah, we're actively looking at rigs that we think are idle and no good, versus idle and are useful to us going forward.
Yeah. I'll just add to that, as I said, there's, you know, 93 rigs in the fleet. At 90% utilization is about 83. We've got 75 running. That gives us about 8 in hand. You know, and those older rigs that we've really run down will be scrapped or sold for limited value, you know? So really, there's a handful of rigs left. And the, you know, the demand for the surface rigs, as Nathan touched on, is very strong. And those rigs that we've got available to us are predominantly underground rigs. So I certainly think, you know, 75 running, heading into the second quarter, demand's strong, and we've said in the quarterly that the count's expected to increase. It's in good shape.
Yep.
Good. Thanks, guys. Same question from Jason. Wouldn't it be more beneficial to utilize the buyback to decide to maximize the amount of shares purchased, instead of purchasing high volumes initially, then heavily, slowly the buyback as occurred? I guess he's referring to the speed of the buyback.
Yeah, I suppose, great. Limitations are what we can do.
Yeah, look, I'm happy to, happy to touch on that. I think the first one, in terms of the broader capital management policy, is the thought process is that profits will be returned to shareholders in the form of a dividend, sort of up to 75% of profits. And then, to the extent that there are any asset sales of idle rigs, the thought process being, I suppose, as you reduce, in theory, your earnings capacity, the appropriate form of capital return there would be through the buyback. So just touching on a couple of those issues around the timing. Yes, it was heavier in the early days. That was largely a function of the asset sales that did occur.
That circa AUD 4 million in buybacks came at an average price of AUD 0.37. Our view, and I dare say the board's view as well, is this AUD 0.37 represents outstanding value. And so happy on the basis that it was asset sales, on the basis of the AUD 0.37, happy to purchase to the extent that we did. Now it's probably a case of a little bit slower, on the basis of needing to get to 31 December, finalizing what, you know, the extent of funds available for further distribution. And obviously, the fact that the asset sales are on pause. So, I hope that talks to the sort of split.
The other aspect worth noting is a standard on-market share buyback, where there are under the rules limitations in terms of, you know, how many shares and at what price. And that has, in more recent times, reduced from where it was. But I hope that answers the question.
Thank you, great. Question from Sharp: What indications are you getting from clients on how they will be operating over the high period in December, January?
Yeah. So, obviously, people would be aware we've gone from, you know, El Niño to El Niño, which is supposedly meant to be drier. So that can only be a benefit for us, hopefully, given, given what's happened in previous years with weather, but you can never control the weather. But, yeah, certainly our clients are busy. There'll be a very short break, at a majority of sites, and most are of their intention to keep going. So, as I mentioned earlier, you know, well in excess of 90% of our revenue is from operating mine sites. And again, it's not greenfield exploration, so those mine sites, as Nathan said, are making good cash with commodity prices where they are. Their budgets are strong. The demand for drilling services is strong. They've got work to do.
It's a short break, and they're going to get on with it. So there is always traditional seasonality around that time. You know, we do stop for Christmas, New Year in many instances, but it's looking good.
All right. Thanks. Thanks, Andrew. A few questions from Jason. With a target of net debt of AUD 15 million by June 2024, and a current debt of roughly AUD 18 million, is it the intention to make acquisitions, shareholder returns, or CapEx on rigs?
Well, I think I just wanna- it's really just gonna be a blend of all three. There's always opportunities. You know, people are approaching us all the time for, you know, to look at investing or buying their companies. And we'll always look, you know, not to say that we'll do anything. I think we've been quite prudent on the companies that we bought, and the investments we've made. So we're, you know, we certainly have a look, but at this stage, nothing on the horizon that would warrant that we do anything. And the rest, we would just blend what we think is the right decisions for the shareholders.
I think whether it's share buybacks, dividends, or net, net debt, and I think it's, again, it's just a blend of all three. Not to focus on one or the other.
Understand. Thanks. Thanks, Nathan. Jason, I'll reach out to you firstly on broker research, and then we can go from there. Question from Daniel Seidi. Perhaps a question for Nathan on capital returns. The company has had a good start, FY 2024, and the board has some decisions to make at the half year result. How are you thinking about weighing up dividends versus buyback in FY 2024? And is the FY 2023 dividend a reasonable reference point for what we should be thinking about for the interim and final, FY 2024?
Good question. I think that—look, we're always hoping to do better next year. You know, it's always not sure where the world's gonna go, but I think, ideally, we'd do better next year. But again, you know, weather, all the other things that we—that are outside our control, but we're on target to hopefully, you know, replicate what we've done and better it again next year. So. And that's just been the same year in, year out, every year. And so I think, you know, we'll look at. You know, we obviously have paid the dividend now, and there's potential for, you know, further in the future, whether it's another interim dividend, or a special dividend, or just share buybacks. Let's see where it goes.
We're not, you know, we haven't made any decisions on that, and we'll take that to the meeting the board next week, next month.
Got it. And is there a franking level?
No.
No. No. We used the balance of our franking credits in the previous full year dividends or final dividends. And as sort of touched on previously, that we've obviously got those tax losses now as a result of the government incentive program giving out material organic growth program, which means we're in a tax loss position, so no, no franking credits in the short term.
Thank you. A question from Alex. What's the biggest challenge for the business in 2024?
Look, I always say it's a, it's a people business, it's a service business, you know, and it, and it's all about our teams and, and the people that do the hard work in the field for our clients. And, the biggest challenge is just people. You know, it's just, it's safety, and it's, it's managing a team of over 750 people working 24 hours a day, seven days a week around Australia, surface and underground. You know, the drilling business never stops. So certainly I think that's our biggest, biggest challenge, this year. You know, commodity prices are good, demand is strong, we've got a great fleet. You know, they're all the things that, we can control and have done a good job on, but just day-to-day, the people, for sure.
Thank you. Next question: Pricing and terms are clearly improving, but shifts down from the last six months. Can we expect shifts to get back to the first quarter calendar year levels?
Look, I probably won't comment on where the actual shift count is gonna get to, other than to say, we've said in the quarterly that the rig count is gonna increase moving into Q2. So I think, you know, you can certainly do your own math on average operating rig count, number of shifts, and make some assumptions on how many you think may be operating in Q2, and onwards. So yes, we expect it to increase, but, you know, I won't sit here and actually give the number of shifts.
Okay. Thank you. Next question. Alex, how do you handle maintenance CapEx? Is that done in your own workshops? Do you have your own, and do you outsource some work?
It is a mixture. So obviously the rigs will come in, you know, after a certain amount of time and get maintenance CapEx paid on. We talk about maintenance CapEx, that would be, you know, outside of a yearly service, sort of, you know, 3-5 years would be a typical time that a rig comes in. Underground rigs are typically done in-house, and a majority of surface rigs would typically be done externally. We've got facilities in Bendigo that do underground minerals work, a facility in Newcastle that does underground, a facility in Dysart that does surface rig work. And then obviously there's other service providers we use as well. So typically those rigs would come in, we spend approximately 30% of their new value-
That'll get capitalized, and we go again. But obviously, you know, we've bought quite a few rigs in recent times, and as part of that organic growth strategy. So it's certainly a fleet that's in very good condition. You know, and as we've sort of demonstrated with last year's capital spending and Q1 so far, you know, we've been pretty disciplined on the CapEx, but doing what we should do to keep the fleet in great condition, you know, for our clients.
All right. Thank you. Another one from Alex. Are there any CapEx light businesses in mining services by M&A that are available? Or what areas of the mining service sector do you see as being complementary to your drilling business?
I don't think there's too many businesses that are capital light in mining, unfortunately. There's consulting businesses, for sure, and those sort of businesses. And they usually, you know, work directly for the customer. And in today's companies like us, where the geological services companies or, you know, mine engineering companies. We did look along that path, but I think that's probably not for us. We did look down the path of capital-heavy businesses in the mining sectors, similar to where probably Capital Drilling went. But again, I think around that, the mining services side of it, there's a definite bridge or a wall to cross. And, you know, once it gets sort of over 8%, GP or return, then the miner does it himself.
Anything under that, the contractor does it. But those returns aren't good enough for us and our shareholders, so I don't think that's something that we would be too interested in getting into.
All right. Thank you. Next question from Daniel. Can you speak to the recent, the recent BHP asset sales? Does the sale of the mines to Whitehaven Coal present any potential opportunity for Mitchells in FY before?
Oh, always. I think, you know, when a tier two, we can call them that, comes into the market, they're obviously buying it for a reason, to try and expand it. I think there's... It's good to see that, you know, obviously BHP's made it aware that they're not spending any more money in coal. These guys are obviously gonna spend money. So I think that's only a good thing, to keep, you know, the Queensland economy going and keep those mines expanding. So yeah, we see it as an opportunity and a positive.
Yeah. Thank you. The next one from Neil. What is standard depreciation schedule for rigs? How does this match up with maintenance costs? That is cash flow benefit or deficit.
I might take that one, if that's okay. So I suppose to carry on from what Andrew said, in terms of that maintenance CapEx program, really dependent on what type of rig it is. In the underground space, typically after that 3-year period, the rig will come in for essentially a capital overhaul. That's probably more like five years in the surface space. From a cash flow perspective, certainly a lot less expensive than the purchase of the rig itself. So you're probably looking at, you know, sort of 30%, or thereabouts, of what the rig would cost new, would typically be spent on that, you know, capital overhaul.
The reality is, if you continue to be diligent in terms of that, in terms of that program, the rig itself can last, you know, 10, 15 years, in some instances. In terms of the maintenance costs from a, from a P&L perspective, I suppose that's, you know, generally as outlined in the P&L per the annual report. But that sort of trends anywhere between sort of 6% and 7% of revenue, there or thereabouts.
Thank you. No more questions on the chat, but, maybe one from me. Is there any plans to go offshore? I guess, as an opportunity or considered, any thoughts there?
Certainly with the Tier 1 companies. You know, it's pretty competitive out there around the globe, North and South America, you know, Africa, Middle East. There's places everywhere. And we have looked at overseas in North America. But, you know, and so we would go with the right customer and the right client and the right contract for sure, if it's one of the Tier 1s. I don't think we're interested in going overseas for Tier 3s and trying to compete on a price. That's not our business. You know, we're a quality business, and we bring a quality service and safety standards that the Tier 1s want. And we would go with them because it gives us confidence around getting paid. It gives us confidence that those jobs- ... In Western Australia or in North America.
Doesn't work for us. But Tier 1, they're usually looking for a big project or they've got a big project, and they want the services of a company like ours. And they trust what we do, and they like what we do on their current contracts. And if all that works, then for sure, we would work with them where they are.
And I guess for the Tier 1 guys, being an existing client, do you guys sort of become the sort of preferred driller? Like, do you get sort of a preference, I guess, on new work?
We would hope so, but, you know, obviously everything comes down to price with those guys and, you know, safety is, is paramount. But if they've got a good customer or a contractor in their country... You know, usually they'll stick with those guys, but if they don't, and they say to us, "Look, you know, you did an amazing job here. Can you help us in this country?" Then, you know, if the answer is right and the, and the profits are there, then we look at it.
Understand. Good. Thank you. Question from Steve. There's been some sizable consolidation in the industry, DDH1 recently. Do you think the industry will continue to consolidate? And, where does Mitchell sit in this regard?
I'm not going to answer it firstly. I mean, you look at Mitchell Services, as Nathan said, we're number one in our respective markets in Australia, both in metalliferous, hard rock slash, metallurgical coal. You know, we took out Drill Torque, Tom Browne Drilling , Nitro Drilling, Radco and Deepcore. So that's the consolidation just in the east of the country. And then obviously with Perenti, DDH1, Swick, Ranger and Strike. So right there, you know, there's a handful of about 10 companies where you've seen that consolidation in the west and consolidation in the east. And I certainly think that that's really, you know, bodes well for the market moving forward. It, as Nathan said, you've got a handful of larger, more sophisticated companies now that are operating in that Tier 1 space.
It's hard to be a drilling company. It's capital intensive. There's a lot of red tape, green tape, the safety regulations, so it's harder for new entrants to come in. But certainly, those drilling companies that operate the Tier 1 majors at the top end, where they do value safety and pay for that, there has been consolidation. As to continue to consolidate, you know, I don't know. I mean, Nathan, I don't know if you've got any comments?
No, not really on that. You know, I think, again, we get approached all the time, but I think, you know, the capital growth that we did a couple of years ago proved to us that we are better to grow ourselves than to buy other companies. We certainly did it, as Andrew just said, in the early days. We bought up a lot, and we got a, you know, a very large rig fleet. But we've also turned our direction towards, you know, state-of-the-art equipment, new rigs, you know, and that's... I've just come back from the field after last week, looking at our gear up in Northern Territory and certainly talking to the guys there, that's, it's easy, new easy to operate. It's attracting younger generations into it. It's attracting women into it.
So, you know, if we're going to do capital growth, it would probably be towards more internal organic growth. But again, we've sort of not done that, but we've got a strategy where we want to go with that growth. So buying other people's older gear is probably not where we want to be at this moment, unless there's something they have that we need, you know, whether that gets us into a new market, like one of the previous questions around. So that give us, you know, a new arm to our business into something that we have, we're not in, then sure, we could always look.
Thank you. Perfect. Is there any more questions from anyone?
Maybe one more last one, if there is one.
Oh, here we go. One from Danny. Is there a frustration on the share price internally when you are delivering the sales you want? And is there anything else you can do about this, or is it, it'll take care of itself over time?
It is frustrating, but I mean, you know, there's not much more that we can do. If you look at the arrows, they're all pointing vertical up. I don't think we could. I'm sure there's improvements. There's always things we could do. You know, we have made some mistakes along the way, but not many, which has been a credit to the guys and the team, the board. In this industry, there's usually always hurdles, and there's always setbacks. But overall, I think we've done exactly what we said we were going to do. It's been a great 10 years, and we're in the best position we've ever been in. The share price is what it is.
It's, I think it looks, it represents, you know, very good value to shareholders. It's one of the reasons why we're doing buybacks. So, you know, I'm, we're hoping that the, the price will reflect, but I think it's a broader issue. It's not really our company as such. I think it's just mining services in general. I think it's the global economy, where things are at the moment. People are probably gun-shy on where to from here. All we can do is continue to run a very good business and employ the best people we possibly can, and deliver it to our clients, you know, and therefore, hopefully deliver to our, for our shareholders.
No, agree there. Agree with Nathan, you're doing the right things, buyback and dividends. So, yeah, it's just about, yeah, getting yourself and Andrew out there and, yeah, letting the market know you guys are back on your growth radar.
Yep. Very good.
Yeah. Thank you. So, any... Is there a question?
There's no more.
Oh, there's no more. Okay, we'll wrap it up there, guys. Again, as Andrew said, if you like some research, feel free to sort of reach out to myself at Bridge Street, or I'll have the details, and we can have another chat. But yeah, definitely worth reading Q Value Research and Morgans to get a better understanding of the company and what they're trying to do. Again, thank you, Nathan, Andrew, great for your time today.
Thanks.
Thanks, Allen. Thanks, everyone.
Thank you, guys.
Thank you.
Thank you. See you.