Good afternoon. This is the Chorus Call conference operator. Welcome, and thank you for joining the Interpump Group fourth quarter 2023 and preliminary 2024 financial results conference call. As a reminder, all participants are in listen-only mode. After the presentation, there will be an opportunity to ask questions. Should anyone need assistance during the conference call, they may signal an operator by pressing star and zero on their telephone. At this time, I would like to turn the conference over to Mrs. Elisabetta Cugnasca, Head of Investor Relations. Please go ahead, Madam.
Thank you. Good afternoon or good morning according to your time zone, and welcome to Interpump fourth quarter 2023 and 2023 preliminary financial results conference call. As usual, I have to bring your attention to the disclaimer slide inserted in the annex part of the presentation, I hope you were able to download from our website. Afterwards, it's my pleasure to leave the stage to Mr. Marasi, Group CEO.
Thanks, Ms. Cugnasca, and thanks to all of you for the attendance. Last November, I concluded the third quarter 2023 presentation underlying group expectations for 2023 and the upcoming 2024. For 2023, a nice single-digit organic sales growth rate, the best year ever in terms of EBITDA margin, and the material improvement of cash generation. For 2024, our full commitment to prepare ourselves at our best to face a complex year. Today, for 2023, I'm pleased to announce an organic growth of almost 7%, an outstanding result after the last 20% of 2021 and + 14% of 2022, an EBITDA margin of 24%, the best result in our group's history.
As you may imagine, this new Mount Everest makes us extremely proud because it reflects the hard work that has been done year after year to constantly improve ourselves from every point-of-view, from operations to strategic approach, from new product development to customer service. To your point, a free cash flow of almost EUR 150 million, the second-best result in our group's history after the record free cash flow of EUR 200 million recorded in 2020, the COVID year that was characterized by a double-digit sales decline and a consequent reduction in net working capital. Moving to 2024, I'm pleased to confirm our November thoughts, athletic performance in terms of organic sales evolution. Like in 2023, we will see different trends between the first and the second part of the year.
Contrary to 2023, we will see a weaker sales performance in the first half and then a gradual improvement in the remaining part of the year. I've commented many times in recent years that in such an uncertain and volatile environment, it makes limited sense to concentrate ourselves and our actions too much on a monthly or on quarterly results. It is the full-year results that matter and are meaningful, and therefore I invite you once again to consider 2024 in its entirety. The full commitment to protect 2023 EBITDA margin results in leveraging on the strengths, the flexibility, and the balancing that drove us to the 24% threshold, and finally, a further improvement in cash generation.
To understand 2024 group expectations, it's important to focus on the evolution of the last part of 2023 in terms of sales and, moreover, profitability because we are strongly convinced that some of the trends recorded in the fourth quarter should not be transposed or expected for 2024. In terms of sales, up by almost 8%, with an outstanding push of almost 7% coming from organic growth. Going back to account 2023 initial organic guidance, 5%, and the reason which pushed us to improve in May to a single digit, a stronger performance in the first quarter 2023, and not a more positive overview on the remaining part of the year, it is quite evident that we were expecting a decline for the second part of the year driven by both a market normalization trend and a demanding comparison base in the hydraulic business.
Please recall an organic growth of 14% for this division in the last quarter of 2022. Overall trends went according to our expectations, with a gradual softening of hydraulic business since summer, and the only exception related to 2023 year-end, and precisely December. Fourth quarter, and especially December, is a soft period, first due to the seasonality correlated to the Christmas break, and on top of this, it's normal for all industrial companies to check inventory level and decide how much to order before year-end. November 2022 was a great exception to this, I would say, historical and irrational behavior. There was an abnormal order level due to the still-present fears in terms of supply chain.
Exactly the opposite happened in 2023, in December in particular, during which we saw not only a physiological decrease in terms of order intake but an abnormal level of order postponements and cancellation.
To give you some color, hydraulic organic sales were slightly negative in October, down a single digit in November as we were expecting for both months, and almost double this drop in December. Waterjet Division confirmed the expected sales evolution driven organically by a strong push coming from complete solution products and the positive impact of acquisitions. The overall sales decrease of 2.5% in the fourth quarter was therefore the result of different trends, some more, some less expected, or better, expected but with a different magnitude. Group diversification, once again, helped balance different trends. For example, in the fourth quarter, in terms of sector application, agri, industrial vehicles and generic dealers, the two most important group market applications totaling more than 30% of our sales, grew respectively by around 10%, almost balancing agriculture, air moving machine, and lifting, together 25% of sales, which dropped between 15% and 30%.
In terms of geography, the resiliency of the American market, our most important one with approximately 25% of the consolidated sales, mitigated Europe weakness with an almost 4% growth, while in Asia, India boom mitigated Chinese decrease. In terms of EBITDA, after having reached 23.7% in 2021 and having confirmed it in 2022 despite inflationary trend and the diluting impact of the biggest acquisition in our history, in 2023, we reached a new Mount Everest, 24%. As you may imagine, this new threshold makes us extremely proud. It reflects, once again, the hard work that has been done year- after- year to constantly improve ourselves from every point- of- view. But to be, as usual, completely transparent with you, this result does not fully reflect group capabilities and best practices. As a matter of fact, until middle of November, we were targeting a better and higher number.
December sales evolution made us take some steps back. You are perfectly aware that operations flexibility is one of our strengths, but this time, we could not deploy our capability for a combined situation. The sales drop recorded in one single month was really too much compared to our forecast, and being December the last month of the year, we didn't have the time to adjust costs to the new level of sales. If the same situation had happened in October or even in November, we would have had the time and the chance to adapt ourselves and to put in place countermeasures.
This is the reason of the material profitability dilution recorded in the fourth quarter in the hydraulic division. Completely different situation in waterjetting. The dilution recorded was driven by sales mix, as in the first quarter, in the fourth quarter, complete solution products drove sales organic evolution.
This phenomenon was exacerbated by the acquisition impact, and in particular, by the acquisition and integration of Waikato. You probably remember that between the two acquisitions performed last spring, Waikato was the biggest in terms of sales with approximately EUR 45 million, and the most dilutive with approximately 14% in terms of EBITDA margin, that compares with the usual range of waterjeting between 28% and 29%. The natural dilutive impact was eaten by poor performance recorded by Waikato due to the worsening of milk market conditions all around the world and especially in Asia. In a few minutes, I will update you on activities we put immediately in place to help Waikato to overcome these market conditions and therefore mitigate near-future dilution factors.
Summarizing, in the fourth quarter, in terms of sales, different winds coming from different directions allowed the group to mitigate negative trend, while in terms of profitability, same wind coming from different directions created a sort of perfect storm, which jeopardized a perfect year. We all hope that after this long explanation, you will understand why we believe that some of the trends recorded in the fourth quarter should not be translated to 2024 and, moreover, why 2023 is, in any case, a year to be proud of. To conclude on 2023, let's underline the most important points on CapEx, acquisitions, and free cash flow. CapEx, with EUR 165 million spent in 2023, are the last important step of a three-year, EUR 450 million effort performed by the group to build the base of the growth path of the next decade.
This growth path was developed to achieve three fundamental targets, have best-in-class factories, increase production capacity, and improve production efficiency. But what do these words mean? Have best-in-class factories means building production facilities which are in line with best practice in terms of energy efficiency, material management, manufacturing process flow, and health and safety standards. For example, the best place where our colleagues can work at their best. This was the first and most important step of our plan because owning places where we work assures independence and flexibility to manage everything that is correlated to production with a real long-term industrial approach. A small but important example, one of the major difficulties to install photovoltaic panels on factories' roofs is not the weight or infrastructural limitation but how to split costs and benefits with owners of the real estates which do not belong to us.
These discussions could even take more time than the construction of the plant. This important initial effort, almost EUR 160 million, 1/3 of what we spent, is literally the foundation of next decade's group future, also because it's the fundamental requirement to get an increase of production capacity and efficiency. It has no sense to purchase better production lines or machine centers if spaces and flows around them are not consistent. From a production point-of-view, it's particularly important to stress the element of production efficiency too. To be able to follow market paths in terms of production is a guarantee for sales evolution, but to be able to deploy this capacity in an efficient way is a guarantee for sales profitability. Our initial CapEx plan required to be upgraded to factor White Drive acquisition, which by itself meant around EUR 40 million of additional efforts.
As you probably remember, White was under disposal due to antitrust obligation correlated to the deal done for Eaton, and this limited CapEx in the years immediately before our acquisition, with a negative impact on White's capacity not only to follow market in 2021 and 2022 extraordinary evolution but to simply support customers with the level of service that is in line with the excellent quality of White product. To conclude with this topic, after what we did, let's comment what we will do. In 2024, CapEx will start to decrease, with only the last important project to be realized, the new headquarters of Interpump Hydraulics close to Bologna. After that, we will go back to our usual level of CapEx.
Acquisition, the amount we spent in 2023, approximately EUR 60 million, could generate the perception that in 2023, we were less active from this point-of-view, but in reality, total dimension of acquired companies close to EUR 80 million in terms of sales and, moreover, their strategic fit shows exactly the opposite because the importance of what we bought goes well beyond what we paid. Moltec was a fundamental step to mitigate the supply chain risk correlated to the most important raw material used by the group, cast iron, while I.Mec and Waikato were the long-awaited new phase of group development in the flow processing segment. Important steps in our never-ending journey to realize a growth path which should allow the group to grow and, in the meantime, to reduce industrial risk thanks to a better diversification by product geography and final market application.
Important steps, but in the meantime, not expensive. This is important to be underlined, and this reflects, from one side, our discipline and, from the other, changes occurring the last few years in our industry in terms of the acquisition landscape. Only a couple of years ago, roles and forces of counterparties involved in the competitive arena were quite different. In terms of competition, industrial buyers had to face private equity and financial sponsors which could leverage on extremely cheap money, while in terms of targets, the euphoria correlated to the extraordinary market situation pushed sellers' expectations to incredibly high levels. In the last two years, this situation changed dramatically. Structural increase of cost of debt and a higher market volatility coming from trends appeared in the last couple of years after decades of absence from inflationary trends.
In terms of cost of goods sold and, most recently, of labor to supply chain difficulties, made financial sponsors' approach more realistic in terms of valuation parameters. More recently, normalization trends and extraordinary demand peak made sellers more realistic too. Therefore, today, we are in a historical phase of role rebalancing among all actors of acquisition processes, and we strongly believe that industrial buyers like Interpump will have far more opportunities and better conditions compared to the past to consolidate also this very important and attractive market. To conclude my overview on acquisition, a new updating in terms of business evolution and integration process. Moltec and I.Mec deserve a few words. Integration activities are progressing well according to Interpump's usual approach, and the results in terms of production and, therefore, supply enhancement for Moltec and profitability improvement for I.Mec are already evident. Slightly different is the situation of Waikato.
New kind of activities and daily market difficulties having appeared since summer, especially for powder milk in Asia, forced to a deeper integration approach. We started from the basics. We launched a reorganization at headquarters level and, in the meantime, a production and logistics rationalization in the USA and in Europe, respectively. We went further on with the construction of a strong collaboration with INOXPA, which is the group company more involved in the dairy world. Today, Waikato's sales force can rely on the support of the global INOXPA commercial network. Despite these unexpected difficulties, we are confident that we will be able to support Waikato's progression as we did for all the companies which have joined our group. This is due to both our integration expertise and the fact that we both are a company known in this market for product quality and innovation path.
Moreover, after a few weeks of joint activities and effort, we welcomed a management team who fully embraced our managerial values and approach. Finally, and updating you on White Drive, the biggest and, above all, the most complicated acquisition in our group history. 2023 was the second and closing year of the integration process, a year dedicated to production enhancement and profitability improvement after 2022, during which our efforts were dedicated to both an alignment to group managerial approach and operations best practice sharing. In 2023, we finally completed the production reorganization and enhancement in the United States, and we implemented the factories' rationalization in Europe, moving all German activities in our Polish plant. Unfortunately, the conclusion of our integration effort materialized itself in the moment of normalization of the agriculture market, the most important application fields for White Drive products.
After constant and steady improvements quarter- after- quarter between 2021 and the first half of 2023, last summer, market conditions changed temporarily, stopped this path. Please note that I deliberately used the adjective temporary. After two years of hard and deep work, White Drive is part of Interpump Group not only from a legal point- of- view but, moreover, from operational flexibility and best practice point-of-view. And in 2024, we will leverage on this efficiency implemented in 2023 from production ramp-up to reorganization benefits. Moving to free cash flow, after more than EUR 200 million dedicated to development activities, the previously mentioned EUR 165 million and almost EUR 60 million of CapEx and acquisition, respectively, probably it would be natural not to associate 2023 to a great year in terms of cash generation.
On the contrary, 2023 will be remembered as the year of 24% EBITDA margin, a record level, and the second most important year for Interpump in terms of free cash flow generation. After 2020, a historical record of a bit more than EUR 200 million, in 2023, we generate close to EUR 150 million. We took in summer 2022 a cash commitment improvement, and quarter after quarter, we deliver it. We underlined with you many times the reason of 2021 and 2022 cash generation declines, the organic growth boom, more than 17% in these two years on average, which consequently drove to both a material increase of trade receivable and the group's rational decision to push production through a massive support from inventory in a period of supply chain issues and scarcity.
Without mentioning White Drive consolidation in 2021, astonishing 2021 and 2022 results in terms of double-digit organic growth and profitability achievement required compromise in terms of supply chain risk mitigation and cash flow generation. Starting from summer 2023, these compromises were not necessary anymore. Today, in February 2024, we are extremely satisfied to show a record in both EBITDA margin and cash flow generation. 2021- 2023 cash evolution underlined two additional important features of Interpump's business model, EBITDA excellence and resilience apart, trade working capital and CapEx, proactive management, and flexibility. And this, going back to the previously mentioned EUR 220 million dedicated to development activities without tampering growth opportunities.
Therefore, after 2021-2023 CapEx close to 7% on net sales and the trade working capital having peaked to close to 40% last year, we can proudly confirm once again with strong evidence that CapEx and trade working capital in the next few years will return to the usual group level, around 4% in terms of CapEx on sales ratio and around 35%-36% in terms of trade working capital on sales ratio. Before the usual updating on most recent market trends and more color on 2024 expectations, please allow me to hand over to Miss Cugnasca for the ESG updating.
Thanks, Mr. Marasi. I will be extremely concise since a few weeks ago, we announced the completion of all 2023 ESG plan action and the duly ongoing delivery of multi-annual action.
In fact, between last November updating and December end, following action has been implemented, launch of the circular economy pilot project, Action E4, conclusion of the pilot project to prepare and implement a vendor rating model that uplifts environmental and social criteria, Action S5, communication the achievement of ESG plan objective, Action G6. We already start to work on 2024 action, product eco-design, injury rate improvement, and supply chain evaluation model extension. In the meantime, we will work to execute at best one of the most important 2023 actions, the decarbonization strategy, and to assure delivery on the most important 2025 action, the increase of no-compulsory training. Important steps for the two targets are the signature of a corporate power purchase agreement and of a global training program, respectively.
Obviously, we will go on with the mapping of scope one, two, and three, which, I remind you, is an important point to be addressed. Summing up my ESG updating, Interpump is delivering good from all points of view. Our mantra of concreteness and excellence pushed us a 360-degree on everything that we were doing, and we are very proud to announce that this commitment was recognized just yesterday evening. In fact, Interpump was awarded as best performer in the year in the seventh edition of Best Performance Award 2023-2024 of SDA Bocconi School of Management. Financial solidity and the focus on both innovation and sustainability are award-based.
Thanks again, Miss Cugnasca. Going back to business, what are we seeing now that support our 2024 expectations? In terms of backlog, we are seeing a consistent increase of water jetting order intake, mount- after- mount.
We are seeing a normalization trend of hydraulics ongoing, and moreover, we are seeing a backlog that today is three times 2019 level. In terms of customer behavior, December postponement and cancellation trends are over. In January, we came back to a normal physiological trend. In terms of industrial landscape, a more prudent approach from private equity and financial sponsors, a more realistic expectation from sellers, should drive to a better environment for M&A. In terms of Interpump, a totally committed group with everybody focused on three essential targets, protect profitability, exploit cash generation, pursue growth opportunities. 2023 was a year to be proud of in terms of EBITDA and even more in terms of free cash flow. You can be confident that we will do our best to make 2024 another year to be proud of and to match in 2025 our medium-long-term expectations.
Thank you to everybody. We are now ready to take your question. One request, please. In order to avoid problems with the line, we kindly ask you to make one question in a row and, therefore, to allow us to answer your question step by step. Thank you.
This is the Chorus Call conference operator. We will now begin the question- and- answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touch-tone telephone. To remove yourself from the question queue, please press star and two. Please pick up the receiver when asking questions. Anyone who has a question may press star and one at this time. We will pause for a moment as callers are joining the queue. The first question is from Matteo Bonizzoni with Kepler Cheuvreux. Please go ahead.
Thank you and good evening. I have two simple questions, which are, by the way, related to the usual topics which we ask in this presentation, in the Q&A. One is on the organic growth. My question is the following one, compared to the -6% decline in hydraulics, which we have seen in Q4, which you clearly said was due to a particularly weak and probably abnormally weak December, for the first half, so my questions are for the first half because I don't know what kind of visibility you have for the second half. I think quite low, so I only ask for the first half. Do you expect similar organic decline or better or, in any case, different?
And similarly to that, for water jetting, which kept a positive trend with a 3.7%, and I think here December was not particularly affected by this phenomenon which you described before, but correct me if I'm wrong. For the first half, you expect pretty similar or it might be better because you have said that you are continuing to observe, if I am correct, a strength of the order intake. So maybe it's even justified to assume better than this 3.7%. The second, the last question.
No, wait, actually one question.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Absolutely, yeah.
Okay. Thank you, Matteo. In terms of organic growth, I believe that we can expect in the first part of 2024 a similar trend of what we have seen in the fourth quarter 2023 that you have just described, then a weaker hydraulics and a stronger and more resilient water jetting.
The second part of the year that will be better, in particular for hydraulics. This is due, once again, also from the comparison base that is far tougher in the first part of the year and from our customers' behavior that realized in the second part of last year that they have exaggerated their purchasing plans and their backlog management and inventory management. And I believe that it is almost natural to expect a weaker hydraulics business in the first quarter and a stronger and more resilient water jetting. But once again, it's the year that matters.
Thank you. Last and quick question is on the margin protection, which is your target for the year. The consensus is, by the way, pretty much in line with that. Maybe it's a little bit down, but I would say, if I'm correct, 10, 20 basis points, but not more than that.
Also, in this case, for the two divisions, can you a little bit elaborate more? Because we are speaking really about a few basis points. But in hydraulic, given that you will have top-line pressure, are you, in any case, targeting a full protection of the margin while in water jetting, also including the action which you are implementing, particularly at Waikato, should we maybe expect, on the contrary, a slight expansion of the margin? Thanks.
Matteo, this is a difficult question. We do not have a crystal ball. It is difficult to make such a precise description of the margins that we expect by division or by company by quarter. We have commented margin protection for the full- year because we consider many different trends between the quarters, the application fields, and the companies. We expect a recovery of Waikato, but that is, of course, a minor company.
We expect a strong contribution from the water jetting resiliency and strength from Amelman in particular. As you know very well, water jetting is characterized by a profitability that is way better than the one of hydraulics. On the contrary, we expect a more challenging hydraulics market in terms of profitability as well because of the normalization trend that we are experiencing now. When we were commenting our expectation or our guidance for the margin for the year, we were considering all these factors together without entering too much in this granularity.
Thank you.
The next question is from Domenico Ghilotti with Equita. Please go ahead.
Good afternoon. Hello. Can you hear me?
Yes, perfectly.
Okay. Now, maybe just to follow- up on the elements and the granularity that can support the profitability, just not by quarter but more on a qualitative basis. So how do you see the, or have you seen also in 2023 the inflationary pressure, in particular, on labor cost? And how have you seen and do you see the trend on raw materials, on the cost of goods sold? So do you see any particular element that you want to flag?
Yes, this is a good point. We saw different trends for different cost factors. As we have already commented, for sure, in November but also in other occasions, we are seeing an increase in terms of labor cost. It is a sort of late catch-up of the inflationary trends of 2021 and 2022 in many areas in the world. And we are seeing, on the opposite, a reduction in the cost or in the prices of many raw materials, aluminum, stainless steel, cast iron in a more reduced way.
But altogether, we do not expect any if we consider all the cost of goods sold or all the different elements that contribute. We do not expect a price effect either negative or positive for 2024. We expect stable prices and stable volumes.
Okay. Clear. And maybe a follow-up on the working capital side. So you are mentioning that you have already been able to decline to reduce the working capital and sales ratio at the end of 2023. So should we expect also further improvement in 2024 given the fact that you are planning for flat-tish organic? So it's merely coming from the operational improvements.
Yes. After the peak that we reached in 2022 in order to mitigate the supply chain risk, the inflation that we were seeing, and the scarcity in raw material, we reached the unprecedented level of 40% in terms of net working capital on sales.
In 2023, we have already reduced this ratio by approximately 150 basis points, and we expect between 2024 and 2025 to be back to the pre-COVID level that was 35%-36% on sales. And we are progressing on this target.
Okay. My last question. Well, looking at your 2025 commitments, you are well on track on leverage and also on the profitability side. It's quite I'm not saying far away, but it's much more challenging, the top-line guidance. So do you think that you can really get to that number? And I presume that this will involve some not say large but sizable M&A also in due course.
Yeah. Staying on numbers, we confirm 2025 targets because we expect a better organic growth in 2025 and because we still have in front of us two full- years for M&A.
And then considering the better environment for acquisition that I've just described and considering the very strong balance sheet that we have now and we will have even stronger going forward quarter after quarter, we believe that we will have the possibility to reach our targets, of course, with an important contribution from M&A.
Okay. The very last question is just a clarification because if I understood properly regarding the short-term outlook, you are saying that the exit so the entry speed into 2024 is much more, say, similar to the average of the quarter of Q4 and not really to the final so to the end, so the December month in which you had really some extraordinary negative elements, and so you were at significant double-digit decline in hydraulic. Correct?
Yeah. The entry speed is low but is, in particular, far lower than last year's entry speed. But the reality is that it was the fourth quarter 2022 and, in particular, December 2022 that was an exception. Considering the unprecedented level of demand that we were facing last year, we had several of our companies that didn't stop even for Christmas break last year. Of course, this year we are living in a different world, and we slowed down our manufacturing activities. I would say that we have entered in a low but in a more normal speed in 2024. You have also to consider that in 2023, the entry speed was so high that we closed the first quarter last year with +19% in terms of organic growth.
Sure.
The next question is from Alessandro Tortora with Mediobanca. Please go ahead.
Yes. Good afternoon to everybody. I have two questions, if I may. So the first one is related to what basically you mentioned on the free cash flow potential you see for the current year. So if we basically consider the, let's say, trend and declining trend in working capital on sales but also much more normalized, let's say, around 4% of sales for CapEx, is it correct to say that basically 2024 will be your new record year for free cash flow considering also the target in terms of margin protection you mentioned before? That's the first question. Thanks.
Alessandro, you did the math then. We never shared a precise target in terms of free cash flow generation, but if we put together all the elements in terms of expected EBITDA and a normalized CapEx and a reduced trade working capital on sales ratio, you did the math.
Then it's correct to expect a very good year in terms of Free Cash Flow generation.
Okay. Okay. And Fabio, just if I may, is it something as a trend in terms of free cash flow, let's say, pretty regular over the year or we need to expect, I don't know, maybe a better performance start considering also a trend in sales? Just to understand if it's, let's say, pretty regular over the next quarters.
Sorry, sorry. Can you please repeat your question because we hear a very metallic voice?
Yeah, but it's my voice, okay? Unfortunately. But yes, Elisabetta, it is related just to the performance if this free cash flow generation, let's say, on a quarterly basis is pretty regular, okay, or we need to think about any seasonality in this performance?
No, our business is very well balanced, and then we do not have particular seasonality in terms of business and in terms of free cash flow generation. If I recollect correctly, the second part of the year is better than the first, but generally speaking, this year, I would say that we will be more regular. That's important.
Okay. Okay. Thanks. Thanks, Fabio. The second question is on Waikato and White Drive. So if I understood well, Waikato now is under, let's say, deep restructuring for now. Considering what you said but also a starting point in terms of profitability, the 14%, is there any reasonable target we can remind for Waikato also considering the wide gap versus, let's say, the profitability of the division?
Yes. In terms of Waikato, we never share a precise target, but it's easy to say that we consider that our first goal should be to move Waikato EBITDA margin to 20%. That is our excellence target. It is clear that Waikato was already at a lower level, and the market conditions are very tough as per our previous comment. I wouldn't say that we are strongly restructuring the company. We are adapting the business model of the company. We are exploiting synergies within INOXPA in particular, and we are adjusting some peculiarity of Waikato in order to be prepared to a more normal market in a more normal market condition to have far more interesting profitability and far more interesting EBITDA margin.
It is too early to say that Waikato will reach a profitability in line with INOXPA or with the division, but I believe that 20% is reasonable with a mid-term perspective.
Okay. Okay. Thanks. The third question is on Walvoil. Okay. You mentioned before about the current outlook for agriculture, and this is an important asset market for Walvoil. Can you help us, let's say, to understand what's going on there? Okay. You completed, let's say, the restructuring of the U.S. operations, but would you need, let's say, a restart, let's say, or a better performance from agriculture in order to, let's say, at least see an improvement or at least a convergence of the profitability of Walvoil, let's say, towards the average of the group or, sorry, of the division, of the hydraulics division?
Yeah. Waidelive is, as we have already commented, the business that is the most exposed to the agriculture end market that, as you know very well, is one of the weakest in this moment. We have just seen the outlook from CNH or John Deere or other players in this industry. This market was already suffering a lot in the second part of last year, and it is expected to suffer in the first part of 2024. I wouldn't say that we need a stronger agriculture market in order to have profitability aligned with one of the groups. We need to consolidate because in 2023, we completed an important restructuring plan both in Germany I mean, in Europe, in which we closed the German plants, and we integrated everything in our plant in Wrocław, Poland, and in the United States.
Then, as you can imagine easily, the inefficiency, the restructuring cost, the consultancy cost were in the EUR millions. Then combining this restructuring or extraordinary cost with a weaker first-market situation is, of course, tough. But, of course, a stronger agriculture market will be more than welcome, but I believe that the profitability of White Drive has the possibility to be aligned with one of the hydraulics business even only with a normal agriculture market and not with a strong industrial market.
Okay. Okay. And the last question, Fabio, is on the sales mix effect you mentioned in the water jetting. Is this something related to, let's say, some specific application? Is it related to, I don't know, much more Hammelmann instead of NLB? So just to understand, let's say, some color on this factor, please.
I would say that it is too much granular. It depends.
Sorry.
We are restricted too much the time horizon that the different sales mix in every single month or in every single quarter can make the EBITDA different quarter-on-quarter or month-on-month, but I do not have any kind of particular or significant trend to comment. In one quarter or in the other, we may have a stronger contribution from larger equipment in comparison with maintenance business and so on. It depends. But I don't have particular trends to comment.
Okay. Okay. Thanks.
Gracias, Alessandro.
That's it.
The next question is a follow-up from Domenico Ghilotti with Equita. Please go ahead.
It's actually a follow-up on this topic. So from your answer, I understand that looking at 2024, there is no structural reason to expect water jetting to be having a structurally different mix. So it's more a matter of some quarter compared to the other, but we should not see a structural trend in which systems are growing quarter after quarter.
This is correct.
Okay. Thanks.
The next question is a follow-up from Matteo Bonizzoni with Kepler Cheuvreux. Please go ahead.
Yes. Thank you. A quick clarification on the 2024 indications. When you see when you see that, say, that you see a stable 2024, it's organic or it's current perimeter? I ask you because there is half year, some months more of Waikato and a little bit of that perimeter. So just to understand, is it organic? Because if it is organic, it seems to me a little bit aggressive, let's say, but maybe not. If it is at current perimeter, less so, let's say. Thanks.
It is organic, and we will see if it will be aggressive, realistic, prudent. We will see, but it is organic. Thank you, Matteo.
The next question is from Bruno Permutti with Intesa Sanpaolo. Please go ahead.
Good afternoon. A question on the capital allocation. So in terms of return on capital on possible acquisitions, where you see the more rewarding opportunities. And so if you have an idea in terms of segments or in terms of geographies, where you believe that you could have the major benefits from acquisition for the rest of the group?
Okay. I don't have any crystal ball, unfortunately. Otherwise, I would make another job. But I believe that it's easy to comment that we are not a private equity or we are not a financial institution. We are an industrial group.
Thank God, we don't have any kind of limit in terms of capital allocation or any kind of imposed threshold in terms of return on capital employed. We always look and think about any potential acquisition, thinking about the industrial meaning of this acquisition. Of course, as you know very well, we have always been very prudent, I would say, or rational in the price that we paid or in the offer that we made, but we never made or we never allocated capital or we never approved budget on M&A because M&A is something that you cannot predict. It's something that happens in general. Of course, we have a very open approach. We have an opportunistic approach.
Considering the very strong balance that we have at the end of 2023 and the very strong free cash flow generation that we expect in 2024 and in 2025, the problem is not to consider or to decide where to allocate the money. The problem is to find the right candidate, interesting industrial target, and so on.
Okay. And if I may, a second question related to the supply chain. So in particular, if you can elaborate a little bit on Moltec, so if there is what are your programs there? And if you are experiencing or expect to experience some increase in transport costs, so related to freight costs. So also, if you are doing something eventually to manage in a different way the supply chain, considering what is happening around the world.
Yeah. We are very happy if we think about the Moltec acquisition because we secured the most important raw material for the group, in particular, for Walvoil, for the valve division that is cast iron. We are very happy about the development of Moltec, the integration of the team that we have found with the foundry. We are progressing in developing new patterns and new models for Walvoil, for Walvoil, and for other group companies in order to leverage the manufacturing capacity that we are expanding and installing in Moltec to support group companies with a combination of a very good control of the supply chain and a better cost because the cast iron from India costs significantly less than the cast iron from Europe, even considering the transportation cost.
In terms of transportation cost, if you were referring to the Red Sea crisis or what we are seeing, it is clear that this is having a short-term impact on transport cost. But it's important to mention that the cost of transporting a container from Asia went down approximately 80% during 2023. And then this increase is something that is having an impact, but it's not so strong or it's not as strong as in the first part of 2022.
Thank you.
The next question is from Gabriel Colominas with Gesiuris AM. Please go ahead.
Hello. Can you hear me?
Yes. Perfectly. Perfect.
Yeah. Just a couple of questions here. First question is on debt cost, on interest rates rising and affecting the company looking forward.
Good to know.
So I want to understand the perspective on the financing part, which is the current cost of debt currently of the company. That's my first question.
Okay. Considering the level of the Euribor today, the average cost of debt is around 4%.
Okay. Okay. And second question, you said that this year, it's a very good year in terms of cash generation, which is, of course, in terms of free cash flow. But the way I look at Interpump in terms of cash generation is I take the cash generation previous to working capital effects, which I think could be very circumstantial depending on the year. And I just eliminate the or I subtract the interest paid, the realized exchange differences, and the taxes paid.
If we look at these concepts and we subtract that from the current cash generation of the companies previous to CapEx and previous to working capital effects, I think this year is not a great year in terms of cash generation. Last year, you had cash generation to a bit about 80% from 2020- 2022. This year, this ratio, it's the lowest in many years, being around 70%. I don't know if you have an explanation about that.
No. I believe that you can consider free cash flow generation in many different ways. It's your job. Our job is to consider the balance management, the level of debt to EBITDA, and the absolute terms in terms of free cash flow generation. Of course, we consider EBITDA. We consider CapEx.
We consider working capital because also CapEx and working capital are important managerial tools that have to be considered in very good years or in more normal years. We have commented many times that in 2021 and in 2022, our free cash flow generation in absolute term, in absolute number, in euros, was limited by the very important investment that we had to put in place in terms of CapEx and working capital. You may include, exclude. I don't know which is your answer, please. But for us, it's very important to consider the absolute number in terms of EUR million. And this year will be very good thanks to the very good EBITDA, a more normal CapEx, and a more normal working capital.
I'm referring more on operative level of cash generation, which this year has been lower in respect of last year's.
Too difficult for me to comment.
Okay. I will send a mail.
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Okay. Thank you very much to everybody for the attendance. We wish you a very happy St. Valentine's Day. We will speak in May. Thank you. Bye.
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