Webuild S.p.A. (BIT:WBD)
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Earnings Call: H2 2023

Mar 15, 2024

Operator

Good morning. This is the Chorus Call Conference Operator. Welcome, and thank you for joining the Webuild Full Year 2023 Financial Results Conference Call. Our call today is hosted by Pietro Salini, Chief Executive Officer, together with Massimo Ferrari, General Manager of Corporate and Finance. As a reminder, all participants are in listen-only mode. After the presentation, there will be an opportunity to ask questions. Should anyone need assistance during the conference call, they may signal an operator by pressing star and zero on their telephone. At this time, I would like to turn the conference over to Mr. Pietro Salini, Chief Executive Officer. Please go ahead, sir.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Good morning, everyone, and welcome to our conference call focused on Webuild full-year 2023 results. I am Pietro Salini, Chief Executive of the group, and with me is Massimo Ferrari, our General Manager. Today we celebrate another year of excellent results. Before we comment on our 2023 performance on slide 4, you will see a snapshot of our business in numbers representing the journey we made. The group enjoys in its track record 14,000 km of railways and metro lines, over 80,000 km of roads, highways, and bridges, as well as 313 dams and hydroplants on every continent of the world. Our dams and hydroelectric plants provide water and electricity to millions of people. The infrastructure we build supports the development of countries and regions, helping to improve lives of millions.

Turning to slide 5, in 2023, we further consolidate the development trajectory begun in 2012, posting record results. The 2023 results are the effect of the strategy we started some years ago, shared with all of our stakeholders. Notwithstanding the challenges that we have all faced these years, like COVID-19, inflation, we have stayed the course and met our goals time and again. We now have a group that has scaled, a sizable backlog of quality orders, sound financial discipline and risk management, and a more efficient organization. This makes us ready to keep building on the momentum and to size the opportunities presented by current market trends. So when it comes to momentum, allow me to talk about what we have achieved since 2012, when it all started for us as a listed company.

In a little more than 10 years, we have gone from a company of 11,000 people to a global champion with 87,000 people. With more than EUR 100 billion of new orders acquired since 2012, our consolidated backlog has reached in 2023 an all-time high of EUR 64 billion. This amount, which is among the largest in the industry, fully covers our current business plan and provides our group with visibility and certainty for the next industrial plan. In the last 10 years, our revenues increased more than 4 times, reaching EUR 10 billion in 2023. This is not all. We have de-risked our business, shifting our focus to low-risk countries. These countries now account for 90% of our revenues. We demonstrated our ability to generate cash from our activities, achieving an outstanding net cash position of EUR 1.4 billion in 2023.

This compares with a net debt position of EUR 300 million in 2012. We completed more than 270 strategic infrastructure projects worldwide, projects that changed the life of present and future generations. This includes the Panama Canal, the bridge over the Danube River in Romania, the San Giorgio Bridge in Genoa that has also become a model of efficiency and collaboration, the Cityringen in Denmark, and in Australia, the latest one is the Forestfield-Airport Link, the Al Bayt Stadium that hosted the World Cup Games in Qatar. In Ethiopia, there is Gibe III, the first dam on the Omo River that is supporting the country's development.

These results were made possible by a clear and consistent strategy we have pursued since 2012, a strategy supported by global megatrends that have given a strong boost to infrastructure investment, a winning strategy that consists in three pillars: focus on building high-complex and innovative infrastructure and becoming a reference partner for our clients worldwide. Consolidate our leadership position in core countries such as Europe and Italy, Australia, the United States, and the Middle East, continuing the policy of risk mitigation. Gain scale so we can invest in different strategic projects. Scale is fundamental in our industry. Scale has allowed us to invest in innovation, health, and safety. It has made us a trusted partner for our clients to solve the most complex challenges in building strategic infrastructure. Scale has allowed us to attract people with skills and expertise.

We have successfully managed challenges that come from the dramatic changes in the environment in few years, for instance, the worker shortage and the supply chain bottlenecks. Scale has allowed us to invest in processes to successfully reduce risks and improve margins. This includes a more selective bidding process, successful contract management, the cost-efficiency program, efficient working capital measures, and the reorganization of our subsidiaries. During the presentation, Massimo and I would like to tell you more on each of these initiatives. Turning to slide 7, I would like to illustrate some of the reasons for which we are a trusted partner for our clients in building strategic infrastructure. We invest in innovation. Today, we boast a strong organizational structure with more than 4,000 engineers worldwide. We deliver innovative solutions to high-complex engineering challenges that contribute to efficiency improvement and reduction of lead times.

At the same, we uphold the highest standards in sustainability, quality, and safety. This know-how makes us an international reference in the infrastructure sector. To give you an example, in 2023, we built Innovazione, a research hub in southern Italy, which designed and developed solutions to make products and processes more efficient. This will help reduce the technology gap that characterized the construction sector. We also inaugurated in Sicily a robotic factory to produce precast concrete for tunnels. It employs highly efficient technology to reduce the impact on the environment and increase productivity. The robots will be able to produce a precast concrete segment every four minutes, down from an average of 10 minutes. We also invest in health and safety, which are a top priority that we built, and our investment has made a difference.

In 2023, the average lost-time injury frequency rate for Europe's main industry players in 2022 stood at 6.5. At Webuild, it was 2 in 2023. Our strong performance is recognized by many third-party institutions. Wherever we operate, we bring our expertise and best-in-class procedures. In Australia, the Northwest Link was recognized as among the best projects from a technical innovative point of view in the safety field. According to ESG rating provider MSCI, we have a strong safety performance relative to our peers. Around EUR 500 million were allocated to health and safety in 2023 on our projects worldwide. Over 2 million of health and safety training hours were provided in the last four years, involving both direct workers and subcontractors. We launched several programs. For example, 12,000 people were involved in our Safety Builders programs.

On slide 8, you can see how we successfully managed the worker shortage and supply bottlenecks. In only 12 months in 2023, in a context of high demand, we hired more than 12,000 workers. We have now a total of 87,000 direct and indirect employees working with us across the globe. These people bring skills, expertise, and experience that makes us more competitive. We continue to invest in young people. More than 40% of our workforce is under 35 years old. We are committed to equip our people with the necessary skills and competencies to become the leaders we need. We give them the space to become ready for the future, and we are convinced our future CEOs are already among our talents.

The growth of our core workforce is thanks to several initiatives that we have undertaken, like recruitment and training programs with 1 million training hours only in 2023, scholarship, and collaboration with Italian international universities. For example, in Italy, we plan to hire 10,000 people within 2026. In order to meet the increased needs for resources in the market, we launched in November 2023 Cantiere Lavoro Italia, a training hub aimed at attracting people to the industry and ensuring that they are prepared to work on site. Thanks to our centralized supply chain management and procurement strategies, we have been very effective in dealing with supply chain bottlenecks, an issue that arose after the COVID-19 pandemic. We promoted innovation along the entire value chain, investing in automation and many digital tools.

To promote collaboration, engagement, and strengthen the relationship with the supply base, we have organized various events during the year. In addition, we are looking at extending our value chain to specialized companies that work in some specific sectors crucial to our business. I'm talking about procurement of steel structures, foundation, and MEPs, mechanical, electrical, and plumbing. For these types of activities, we expect a substantial growth in need coming from increased expansion in production. Those specialized companies could be both captive and work for different sectors. Turning to slide 9, I would like to give a brief overview of the initiatives we have undertaken to increase margins. Since several years, we have adopted a selective and disciplined bidding approach based on a deep analysis of the projects with the most advanced tools before deciding on submitting a bid. Competition is now more on technical aspects rather than price.

More than 90% of the new orders in the last two years have been acquired because of a better technical offer, not price. This leads to better marginality at project level. As described in our last calls, we are experiencing a paradigm shift in the sector. The main goal of our clients is now to deliver projects needed to face ongoing megatrends. In this collaborative environment, we have successfully managed our contract, introducing new contract formulas, which imply lower operational risk. Just to make you some examples, we are talking about the Incentivized Target Cost introduced in Australia, a model like a cost-plus with a benefit mechanism linked to specific time and cost targets. In Canada, we recently signed a new contract based on so-called Progressive Design and Build.

This is an innovative model that involves less execution of risk into the construction phases, being the budget defined on a first study phase in collaboration with the client. As many of you remember, the vast majority of our order backlog has price variation formulas to take into account inflation risks. The third level for marginality improvement is the cost-efficiency plan we launched a few years ago. Massimo will go more into details on this. Turning to slide 10, 2023 is the third year in a row that we have a record order intake totaling more than EUR 22 billion. This amount more than doubled our book-to-bill target for the year. In just one year and a few months, we have already secured about 80% of new orders that we were forecasting for the 2023-2025 business plan.

Out of the total, EUR 11.6 billion comes from Italy and EUR 10.8 billion outside of Italian countries like Australia, the United States, and Saudi Arabia. They are related to projects such as NEOM and the biggest urea plant in Australia being built for Perdaman Chemicals and Fertilizers. These extraordinary results do not include Messina Strait Bridge, for which we are waiting approval of the final project expected in the coming months. The work will then be able to start immediately after approval. The strong commercial momentum is continuing in 2024, with two strategic projects having been acquired, one in Saudi Arabia, also related to NEOM, one in Canada, and some others in the U.S. More is to come with more than EUR 13 billion of contracts for which we have already presented a bid and are awaiting answers.

As you can see in slide 11, this strong momentum comes to a total order backlog of EUR 64 billion, already exceeding the target we set for the end of the 2025 business plan. Our order backlog mainly comprises long-term contracts and is diversified across multiple geographic areas. This enables the group to remain stable throughout regional economic cycles. Out of the total, EUR 55 billion are related to construction projects, of which more than 85% is related to low-risk countries. Italy takes the biggest share of 48%, followed by Australia with 19%. The current order backlog covers 100% of revenues and EBITDA targets under the current business plan. It gives us high visibility for the next plan. True to our commitment to sustainable development, nearly all of our backlog is dedicated to achieving United Nations goals. Nearly 75% is related to sustainable mobility projects.

On slide 12, 2023 marked a year of significant progress for our ESG ambitions. In addition to the recent confirmation as a world leader in climate change action by CDP, former Carbon Disclosure Project, Webuild was upgraded to AA by MSCI ESG ratings in acknowledgment of our commitment to corporate governance and health and safety. We also maintain a top rating from other ESG rating agencies as ISS ESG with B- prime level and Moody's ESG ex Vigeo Eiris with advanced level. Our sustainability strategy is embodied in the ESG plan, which was defined in 2021. This three-year plan was completed in 2023. We successfully achieved our goals and consolidated our position in terms of sustainability. As already discussed, our performance in health and safety has been extraordinary, and we are among the best-in-class in the sector.

The injury rate recorded a reduction of 41% compared to the 2017 baseline, with a target of -40% in 2022. The emission intensity rate recorded a reduction of 67% compared to the 2017 baseline versus a target of -50%. It has been an incredible result if you consider the significant amount of projects we started in these years. The share of women included into the succession plan of key positions reached the target of 25%. Additional investments in innovative projects amounted to more than EUR 57 million, with a target of EUR 30 million by 2023. Let me remind you that in 2022, we also obtained the approval from Science Based Targets initiative for our CO2 emission reduction in absolute terms. We aim to reduce them by nearly 500,000 tons by 2030 versus the 2019 baseline. Let's move on to slide 13.

Confirming our constant commitment, we will further invest in sustainability, setting ambitious targets with a new ESG plan for 2024-2025. The plan is based on the same three main pillars we guided ourselves successfully in the last years: green, safety, and inclusion innovation. With the new plan, we want to continue to contribute towards the low-emission economy, investing in clean technology, improving the environmental sustainability of our construction sites and infrastructure that we build. We want to continue to represent a sector benchmark in terms of health and safety, skill development, inclusion, and efficiency through investment in innovation and digitalization. We are targeting to further reduce our carbon intensity by 10% in 2025 from the level registered in 2022. Among the efficiency initiatives, we are going to implement there is our continuous investment in Green TBMs, machines capable of reducing energy and water consumption and increasing safety.

From the first simulation carried out, this well appears a 15% reduction in energy consumed per cubic meters of tunnel excavated compared to traditional TBMs. On health and safety, we aim a reduction of our injury rate by a further 6% to be reached in 2025. To achieve this goal, we continue to educate people, providing training plans and monitoring work areas, as also thanks to the use of technological tools. For example, one of our highly innovative devices is Infinity Neural, which applies artificial intelligence to monitor various safety risks associated with tunneling works. This solution recognizes non-compliant behaviors, communicates them with instant messaging to the supervisor, while at the same time sending acoustic signals to the workers involved and generating periodic reports. On gender inclusion and diversity, our goal is to improve the gender mix at our top-line management through inclusion-oriented processes and mentoring projects.

We further set targets in order to increase at least 20% the number of women managers by 2025. We are finally committed to reinforcing our leadership in the sector through innovation by investing no less than EUR 430 million in clean tech, high-potential, innovative projects. Before letting Massimo go into further details, let me give you a quick overview of our main 2023 result on slide 14. 2023 was a record-breaking year, both in terms of financials and operating results. We have largely exceeded the guidance for the year. With EUR 22 billion, we have consolidated an all-time high backlog of EUR 64 billion. Revenues grew by 22% to EUR 10 billion and EBITDA by more than 40% to EUR 819 million. We have drastically improved our credit standing, reducing gross leverage, and improving our cash conversion cycle. We registered an outstanding net cash position at EUR 1.4 billion, improving by EUR 1.2 billion versus 2022.

We ended the year with an adjusted net profit of more than EUR 200 million, for which we are proposing a dividend per ordinary shares of 0.071%, increasing by 25% in respect of the 2022 level. Since 2020, our dividend policy is becoming more and more attractive. We have dividend more than doubled, starting from a level of 0.03% per share. I will now leave the floor to Massimo to explain to you the details of it.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Thank you, Pietro, and good morning, everybody. Before I go through the results, let me remind you that as it is customary, we are presenting adjusted figures to represent the recurring performance of the business. You can find details of the adjustments we made in the appendix. Let's start from slide 16. Here, you can see how strong our operating results were in 2023.

As we said on previous occasions, Webuild proved to be anti-cyclical. We have beaten GDP growth in all the countries where we operate. The group closed the year with revenues and margins growing by more than 20% and more than 40% respectively. Revenues reached EUR 10 billion and EBITDA came up at EUR 819 million, largely beating guidance. EBIT reached EUR 475 million, with the margin reaching 4.8%. As described by Pietro, the good level of marginality is a result of a strong qualitative order book with better marginality at project level, contract management with new formulas for less operational risk, and the coverage on inflation we enjoy in most of our contracts. And finally, a cost efficiency plan, which we will go into more detail with. In the last 10 years, the whole sector has performed well, with an average growth rate of revenues of around 40% for European players.

In this context, we have had a strong growth, outperforming our peers, as Pietro was saying early, with revenues increasing more than 4 times since 2012. Going to slide 17, let's take a look at revenue distribution. Our activity is well balanced, with approximately 90% of revenues in low-risk countries. We worked a lot over the last years to improve the quality of where our revenues come from, shifting our focus towards markets that are low-risk. By low-risk, we mean developed economies with clear rules, political stability, and faster payment cycles such as Europe, Australia, the U.S., and the Middle East, in particular with Saudi. These are the countries where the group enjoys a leadership position. Italy represents the main market with 34% of revenues. It's a fact that Italy, in the last years, has changed a lot.

Many investments in infrastructure projects have been unlocked, with a clear approach shift from clients and government support with the approval of the new procurement code. After our acquisition of Clough, Australia has come to represent our second-biggest market, with 20% of revenues coming from the country. On slide 18, we have the P&L below EBIT line. We posted a net income of EUR 236 million, doubling the 2022 result. Financial income was EUR 119 million, in line with the previous year. Financial expenses were EUR 245 million, an increase of EUR 32 million versus 2022, and the rise in net financing cost is mostly due to the higher cost of debt as a result of the reference interest rate performance, which affects the group's variable-rate debt, and the reversal of financial income on delayed payment by Ethiopian clients following the settlement of contract amendments.

Taxes amounted to EUR 143 million, with a reduction in the rate from 43% to 36%. At the bottom of the slide, you can also see a bridge from reported net profit that amounted to EUR 124 million to the adjusted one. The adjustments refer to the accounting non-monetary items, such as EUR 43 million for the amortization of the positive bargain we registered relating to an Astaldi acquisition, netted by EUR 36 million bargain coming from Clough acquisition. This gain, as it was for an Astaldi acquisition, comes as a result of the purchase price allocation, calculated with the support of the leading independent advisors. EUR 106 million related to the final resolution in the proceedings for some damages related to the construction of the expanded Panama Canal's lock gate. On the next slide, we show our main balance sheet items.

At the end of the year, the financial discipline applied to our activities in the last years allowed us to drastically improve our credit standing. As we have said many times, cash generation is a key part of our business plan. We exceeded market expectations, consolidated an outstanding net cash position of EUR 1.4 billion. We continued our path of reducing gross leverage. We stand now at 3.2 times, which compares to an average of four times of a benchmark of European peers for 2022. With additional increase in profits, leverage should decrease further in the next years. In addition to strong operating results, working capital is one of our levers for cash generation. We successfully maintained it negative at EUR 2.1 billion, improving from the previous year. This comes thanks to a strong commercial activity, but also several measures to manage efficiently working capital and the cash-ins of slow-moving items.

We have put in place hundreds of initiatives to optimize working capital, aiming to accelerate work-performed billing, also by eliminating any inefficiencies and slow-moving collection. We substantially reduced the exposure balance sheet risk, settling a large number of outstanding claims in 2023, with a net reduction of EUR 400 million. A further boost on cash flow comes from non-core asset disposals. In 2023, we successfully sold the concession related to Milan Metro Line 4 for about EUR 140 million. The divestment agreement signed in the final stage of the work demonstrates the group's extraordinary ability to deliver highly complex infrastructure. Moving to slide 20, there is progress being made on cost efficiency. We presented the plan in our 2023-2025 business plan. At corporate, at project level, we targeted EUR 180 million of accumulated savings for the business plan period. Up to now, we have implemented initiatives for EUR 90 million.

An important part of the savings comes from the reorganization of staff and optimization of external spend, including, for instance, consultancy and several third-party services. Optimizations are also linked to our continuous effort in back-office automation, with the use of the latest technology to automate low-value, time-consuming activities. We have achieved successful results in domestic and international projects, and now we are also optimizing activities at our subsidiaries, extracting synergies, for example, from Clough. On slide 21, we want to give you an update on the reorganization process of our subsidiaries. We aim to improve their efficiency and profitability, sizing most market opportunities, and identifying potential divestment options. In Australia, we are working as a single company, Clough together with Webuild. We have completed the integration of the two companies, aligning the organizational model and the processes.

Thanks to our combined skills, we are placed among the top five players in the country. The same approach has been followed in the U.S. Webuild is well positioned to address market needs thanks to the local subsidiary Lane. Currently, Webuild is working on reshaping Lane by the recent new strategy. A new strategy focused on core projects and market is being applied. Discipline is the key word for this turnaround plan, which aims to bring back Lane to positive margin already for 2024. Regarding the concessions we have in our portfolio, we are looking at potential divestment, as was the case for the Metro Line 4. In Milan, we have in our portfolio other concessions for potential sale, with a residual book value of about EUR 300 million. We are looking for potential partnerships with infrastructure funds for new greenfield projects.

It's important to point out that the strategic management of our subsidiaries' portfolio represents a value-added activity. It allows us to develop specific know-how in different sectors and core markets, combining the benefit of business diversification with the competitive advantage of a local presence. For this reason, we are proceeding with a structural reorganization of Seli Overseas, Cossi, NBI, CSC, and Fisia. This process is based on the alignment and organization governance and processes with our best practice while integrating specific tools. On slide 22, we show the main numbers of our corporate debt and the liquidity profile. The next relevant maturity date relates to the bond maturing in October 2024, which has been already partially addressed with the liability management operation completed in September 2023. We successfully refinanced the EUR 450 million maturing in 2024 and 2025, placing new notes for an equal amount maturing in 2024.

In September 2023, Standard & Poor's upgraded us. It reflected the strong improvement of credit metrics in 2022 and the expected progress in 2023-2024 as a result of our consistent derisking strategies. S&P also appreciated our strong expertise in executing and delivering complex construction projects, improved operational processes, and qualified management team, which translated into better risk management and a better working capital trend. We closed 2023 with a comfortable liquidity position of almost EUR 4 billion, including more than EUR 900 million of un-drawn RCF lines. Nearly 90% of our corporate debt is at fixed rate. This relates to the bond debt. The cost of the corporate debt is about 5%. I will now leave the floor to Pietro for a view on the outlook and some closing remarks.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Thank you, Massimo. Moving to slide 24, where we can see our guidance for 2024.

We are giving the following guidance: a book-to-bill of more than 1, revenues higher than EUR 11 billion with a growth of 10%, reaching 2025 targets a year ahead of schedule, EBITDA higher than EUR 900 million, approaching 2025 targets. Finally, we aim to maintain a positive, solid net cash position higher than EUR 400 million. In addition to a lower level of advance payments versus 2023, the target for net cash position reflects an estimated CapEx of around EUR 500 million-EUR 700 million linked to growth. However, there is room for efficiency. For example, the refurbishment of some TBMs, the management of timing for new machinery acquisition or the disposal could lead to a lower level of net CapEx.

We remain committed to our gross debt reduction target of EUR 250 million within 2025 and to distributing a stable dividend to our shareholders for a cumulated amount of EUR 160 million-EUR 170 million in 2023-2025. To achieve these targets is all in our hands, 100% covered by the orders already acquired in our backlog. Let me remind you that these targets do not include the bridge over the Strait of Messina. That project is an upside to the plan, and every day the start of the work comes nearer and nearer. On slides 25 and 26, we look at what else is in store for the future beyond our plan. We have in front of us a very promising market with trillions of investment in infrastructure powered by global megatrends of the century. Climate change, energy transition, water scarcity, and urbanization are the key catalysts.

We can leverage on a solid leadership position demonstrated by years of successes. Thanks to our ability to move people in every region of the world, our technical know-how, and our capacity to invest in innovative solutions, we are in pole position to address these market needs. In Australia, as Massimo told you, we have created a high-value asset, following Clough acquisition completed in 2023, which is among the top five players. Backlog doubled versus 2021 to EUR 11 billion in 2023 with cost-plus type of contracts. As of last year, EUR 2 billion of our revenues are generated in Australia, and we expect this number to increase to over EUR 3.5 billion in 2025 with mid-high single-digit margins. We are operating in the country as a company with no debt and no claims. The synergies that Clough and Webuild will bring to the engineering and construction industry in Australia are unparalleled.

We are investing many resources there to seize a market value of more than EUR 400 billion. Opportunity will be driven by investment in traditional segments, mainly road and rail, in the short term, but a higher boost in the medium term will come from the energy sector. For example, the Powering Australia Plan forces more than AUD 40 billion in the investment in climate and energy transition with the aim to make the country a leader in clean energy production. Thanks to Clough expertise, we can address new business segments where demand is growing on a global scale. We are referring to green ammonia plants and transmission lines. Finally, another sector to explore further is defense, where the government has committed to a major upgrade of its facilities.

If we value the Australian franchise, which, of course, these numbers are not reflected in our balance sheet, and we use the multipliers that are used in the market, we can have an asset that the value of which exceeds EUR 2 billion. In Italy, we are committed to deliver turning to slides 26. Sorry. Let's have a look at the other core markets. In Italy, we are committed to deliver in time the projects financed by the PNRR, but many other initiatives are on the horizon. In the coming years, there will be projects not only for the completion of railways, such as the Salerno-Reggio Calabria, but also investment in metro lines, ports, stadiums, hospitals, and hydroelectric plants. There is as well the Messina Bridge, which we are committed to build.

The Railway of Italy alone has announced a plan of EUR 100 billion of investment in the next five years. Europe is also notably increasing public investment aimed to accelerate the climate and energy transition. The EU planned to invest EUR 208 billion by 2027 with the REPowerEU program to increase energy security, clean energy investment, and energy savings measures. Additional EUR 600 billion are committed to be spent to fight climate change. In the Middle East, the market is expected to almost reach EUR 800 billion in the coming years. Here, we have a historical presence with local branches. In particular, Saudi Arabia is attracting many investors to an ambitious investment program, the Saudi Vision 2030, aimed at diversifying the country's economy in order to reduce its dependence on oil. The programs include megaprojects such as NEOM and Diriyah, in which Webuild has recently acquired major orders.

Further opportunities will come from the two future events, the World Exposition and the FIFA World Cup, to be held in 2030 and 2034, respectively. In North America, we are working on a new hub with an integrated approach towards the American and Canadian markets, which are totaling more than EUR 5 trillion of new orders. On U.S. markets, we will be driven by several government initiatives, including plans like the Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act, and the Inflation Reduction Act. We are among the world leaders in tunneling sectors. We bore tens of kilometers of tunnels per year, and we have started a project for the refurbishment of TBM components, for which the first TBM will be inaugurated in June this year. For example, we are boring the longest tunnel in Italy for the Milan-Genoa high-speed, approximately 27 kilometers in mountainous terrain with different rock layers where high-speed trains will pass.

To excavate these tunnels, five highly specialized TBMs were used specifically for this project. TBMs are extraordinary, highly technological machines. Each TBM is between 75-115 m long, with a head up to 20 m in diameter, which can accommodate over 20 specialized workers inside who pile up the machines. In mechanized excavation through TBMs, a single machine does everything. It not only bores, but also installs the prefabricated segments. In some contexts, special machines are needed to avoid the risk of building and surface roads collapse. For example, in the Metro 4 of Milano, we worked with machines that dug 20 km of tunnels in the city center. Another area of business which high-growth potential comes from the water market, estimated at approximately EUR 400 billion worldwide.

Our subsidiary, Fisia, has a long history and great track record in the construction of the water treatment and desalination plants all over the world. In the past decades, Fisia has contributed to the development of Persian Gulf countries, realizing some of the biggest desalination plants in the region. We want to bring that expertise to new markets such as Italy. Today, desalinated water production in our domestic country represents only 4% of the total consumption, compared to 56% in Spain. To address this gap, the Italian government has declared a strategic interest in contracting water scarcity and enhancing water infrastructure, potentially attracting the interest of international investors. Finally, in slide 27, we give you some takeaways from this call. Thanks to a clear and consistent strategy, we have delivered solid results in the past years, crowned with the record-breaking results in 2023.

We are set to reach 2025 targets early thanks to our robust order backlog that fully covers 2023-2025 plans and proves ample visibility for the next plan. We are active in booming markets driven by global megatrends, which we are seizing thanks to local presence and structural organization we have built in the past years. I thank you for your attention. We are now ready for the Q&A section. So as not to slow things down too much, we encourage you to focus on the group's strategy and other broad initiatives that underline its current and future financial performance. For any questions you may have of a more detailed nature on one figure than another represented in the tables or some technical details mentioned during the presentation, the investor relations team will be available and willing to answer them after the call. Thank you to all of you.

Operator

Excuse me. This is the conference call operator. We will now begin the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touch-tone telephone. To remove your question from the question queue, please press star and two. We kindly ask you to use headsets when asking questions. We will pause momentarily as the callers join the queue. The first question is from Emanuele Gallazzi of Equita.

Emanuele Gallazzi
Equity Analyst, Equita

Yes. Good morning, everybody. Thank you for the presentation. I have two questions. The first one is on your operating target for 2024. If I look at the low end, so EUR 11 billion of revenues and EUR 900 million of EBITDA, it implies a margin that is flat year-on-year. So it seems to me that there is room to do materially better from this perspective, but I just would like to understand a little bit more on your view on this. And the second one is on the U.S. business because you mentioned that for 2024, you already expect a positive EBIT margin. So I would like to understand a little bit better about the ongoing restructuring process of this business and if you expect an acceleration of orders from the U.S. market in 2024. Thank you.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Okay. Thank you, Emanuele. So regarding the margins, you are right. We expect the same percentage marginality. Of course, we still keep the approach under-promise and over-deliver. So we have many actions in place in order to improve the marginality, but we believe it's an ambitious target to achieve EUR 900 million, also because you know very well it's very important, the conversion rate on cash regarding the EBITDA. The second question regards Lane. We expect to achieve the break-even in 2024 and then to start to have a positive marginality. But more than that, we are putting inside Lane also the Canadian market, and we would like to exploit also the large infrastructure business that we can push if we achieve discipline and we achieve positive margins in Lane that we expect for 2025.

Emanuele Gallazzi
Equity Analyst, Equita

Thank you.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

If I may add something, we are, of course, thinking of expanding our franchise in the U.S. The size that we actually represent, which is, let's say, a little bit shy of EUR 1 billion of turnover, it is not sufficient to tap on what is our main strength, which is, let's say, the larger project and the more sophisticated project. I think that the Webuild will invest, of course, into people. We will bring some of our best managers to take care of the U.S. facility and also to look at different-sized projects in which our expertise is, let's say, outstanding. This is the fact that we target in our strategic plan to have a company in the U.S. that in the U.S. market plus the Canadian market may envisage in the next coming years a size of around EUR 5 billion-EUR 6 billion of turnover.

Emanuele Gallazzi
Equity Analyst, Equita

Thank you very much.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Thank you, Emanuele.

Operator

The next question is from Matteo Bonazzoni of Kepler Cheuvreux.

Matteo Bonizzoni
Head of Italian Equity Research, Kepler Cheuvreux

Yes. Thank you very much. Good morning. I have three questions. The first one relates to these, I would say, extraordinary results which you achieved on the net cash of EUR 1.4 billion, up from like EUR 200 million last year. Looking at the bridge in your balance sheet, particularly, there is a big increase of the contract liabilities clearly related to your EUR 22 billion intake. Can you a little bit provide a little bit more color on I think it's Italy or maybe also Australia. Can you a little bit elaborate exactly where this strong increase of the contract liabilities came from? And also, in relation to the target for the net cash for 2024, which seems to go down by around EUR 1 billion, but I think you could do better.

Also, in this case, can you indicate what kind of swing in your net working capital should we expect in order to be able to understand better the bridge for this year? The second question relates to the delta between the net worth, your equity, and the net profit. So the consolidated net profit was more than EUR 100 million, but the net worth, the net equity, was down at group level by around EUR 200 million. Looking at that is mostly driven by the minorities, which are down significantly, the equity minorities. I mean, can you also, in this case, a little bit please reconcile the delta between the consolidated net profit and the evolution of the net equity? The last one is on CapEx. I have looked in detail at the presentation and also press release. I don't think you have disclosed CapEx.

If yes, pardon, but I don't think you said 2023 what it was. You said that in 2024 it's going to be EUR 500 million, EUR 600 million if I have correctly. Just to have an idea of the evolution of the CapEx 2024 versus 2023. Thanks.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Thank you very much. So starting from the contract liabilities, the color that you asked, most of them come from Italy, but of course, also from the settlement we made in some other contracts, the reduction of claims. These are the sources in general, but in terms of advance payment, most of them came from Italy, but there are some other advance payments that came at the beginning of 2024 and will come in 2024 from Italy and, of course, for instance, from the Middle East, as you can imagine, from the large projects we won and also from the other projects that we will be happy to announce in the coming days, also in the coming days, from other low-risk countries. Regarding the working capital, we put in the assumption that bring us to the target of net financial position higher than EUR 400 million.

The highest CapEx that we should be EUR 700 million, but we have many levers in order to improve the release of cash coming from the CapEx because what happened in 2023 is that the action put in place in 2022 and 2023, thanks to the scale, generated much larger benefits than expected also by us. Also, when we closed the nine-month results, we didn't expect the target that we achieved, and these are the benefits that Pietro mentioned at the beginning coming from the size because all the action put in place improved significantly the capability to manage the working capital from the corporate level from the center. Regarding the net equity, we have the in Italian, Riserva Oscillazione Cambi, the net effect from the exchange rate that is not a monetary.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Accounting matters.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Accounting. It's just an accounting matters, and then the change of the perimeter of consolidation. Regarding the CapEx, I already answered to your question. We expect a range between EUR 500 million and EUR 700 million. Why the range? Because we have the financial effects that probably started already in 2023. We have some cash out in 2024, and it depends from the start of the production in each job site.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Well, but Massimo, if I can add something, it's, of course, let's say, related to the magnitude of our order intake. If you see the order intake in the last couple of years, we are talking about EUR 40 billion. So, of course, we need to perform this contract. It's not only a matter of collecting advance payment and just sit on the cash. This would be, let's say, not very efficient and will not bring to the company any EBITDA. So I would say that we had to make this investment. Of course, the investments are related to cash disbursement in the year you make, but they are also creating cash for the future. So, let's say, this company does not want to close its activities in 2024. Think about the future. Think about the fact of what we should do in the future.

So we had to invest money for purchasing the equipment to perform the plan. This money will come back, of course, EBITDA and cash into the future. The guidance we gave on EUR 400 and more than EUR 400, let's say, I think that is, let's say, a clear indication of the fact that the company will remain absolutely cash positive, but at the same time, already takes into consideration all those factors. So the, let's say, the extraordinary condition that brought advance payment in 2023 will not be repeated in 2024. We take into consideration this fact. We take into consideration the expenditure we have already envisaged. We can better some of those, as Massimo was saying, with some savings, some refurbishment, for instance, of the refurbishment plan into the machinery will, of course, better and lower the CapEx that is expected so that we can make better than that.

Let's say all those considerations brought us to be conservative into the assumption of the cash at the end of 2024.

Thank you, Matteo.

Operator

The next question is from Alessandro Tortora of Mediobanca.

Alessandro Tortora
Industrial Equity Analyst, Mediobanca

Yes, hi. Good morning to everybody. I have one, two, three, four questions, okay? Very, very brief. The first question is on Australia, but also on the Clough business. Massimo, can you give us an idea of the contribution of Clough in 2023 in terms of contribution in terms of sales and EBIT from Clough? That's the first question. I don't know if you want to go one by one.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Okay. We can answer to the question. Regarding the.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Not only Clough. I would say don't talk only about Clough, but talk about the Australian franchise, which for us is a single business. As we told, the Australian franchise now collects all our activities in Australia. I would say that this thing we have had orders intake from around EUR 6.2 billion in 2023. We have a backlog in execution of EUR 11 billion in 2023, doubling our backlog size since 2021. There is.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

In terms of revenues, EUR 450 million, okay?

Operator

Coming from Clough.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Coming from Clough.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Yeah, but in 2023, we're EUR 2 billion, huh?

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

To the Australia.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

2 billion in Australia. Coming from Australia in 2023 is EUR 2 billion total. So don't make the difference because it's no difference. Then we will have a growth, which is significant. As we commented during the presentation, we are going to target the EUR 3.5 billion, not Australian dollars, in 2025 with an expected growth of EBIT significant that goes from the EUR 113 of this year to around EUR 270 in 2025. That's why I was talking about an asset which has, let's say, a hidden value that is not expressed in the balance sheet.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

It is not expressed.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Of a significant amount.

Alessandro Tortora
Industrial Equity Analyst, Mediobanca

Okay. Okay. Thanks for the answer. Then the second question is on the contract management side that we discussed before. Can you help us understand the impact of contract resets like, as we know, we had, let's say, last year? I understand the IFRS sales recognized over the project life, but these resets are basically in line with your budget margin, better, lower. So just to understand the impact of this contract reset, I would say at EBIT level. And are there any other major contract resets this year we should be aware of? Thanks.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

If I understand clearly, we made a statement on that and we also announced that previously the Snowy contract, that was an issue. Let's say many of you have asked details about the risk that was inherent to that contract in the past for price escalation and other things that were related to that contract in the past has been completely changed in a new contract that is a target incentivized target cost-plus basis. So there is no risk inherent to the contract, and that's it. I mean, that is very simple.

Alessandro Tortora
Industrial Equity Analyst, Mediobanca

Okay. So yes. The third question is in Italy, considering apparently the national recovery plan deadline in mid-2026, but also the EUR 3.4 billion sales achieved last year in Italy. Will 2024, but also 2025, be basically the years of, let's say, full speed in terms of sales contribution from Italy?

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Yes, of course. We are performing the plan. I think that we are, let's say, a very major player into the PNRR for the infrastructure in Italy. This means also that we obtain from our shareholder CDP this renewal of our agreement, which makes a very good effect on the, let's say, stabilization of the shareholders into the next coming three years for their view on the, let's say, importance for Italy of our activity into this plan. We are, let's say, performing most of the new investment of the railway sector in high-velocity train in Italy from the south, especially in the south, and we are doing a lot.

We're doing most of the Sicilian high-velocity: Palermo, Messina, Catania, and the one contract which has been launched from the Salerno-Reggio Calabria and the Bari-Napoli, which is another important line of high-velocity connecting Italy with a new speed in the south and the north. So I think that we are performing. In the north, we are doing all those projects that are related to the PNRR, the breakwater in Genoa, the node of Genoa, the high-velocity train from Genoa to Milano, the new Padova, Mestre, the Trento, and I think that we are a major player, let's say, not only in the world, but also in Italy, of course, and this is our role. We are now performing full speed in all those contracts. There are no issues related to the deadline of 2026 at the moment.

So, of course, it's not only depending on us because it's something that we still have to perform respecting the rules, the authorization, whatever else that comes from the public sector. But so far, we are performing at the speed which is needed to complete those works into the right time.

Alessandro Tortora
Industrial Equity Analyst, Mediobanca

Okay. Okay. Thanks. And the numbers.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

The numbers inside the 2024 guidance include the production from the Italian works.

Alessandro Tortora
Industrial Equity Analyst, Mediobanca

Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. The question was just related to the fact that in theory, we should have, let's say, a higher production level, okay, in Italy, even though 2023 was already a very strong year with EUR 3.4 billion sales in Italy, okay? Thanks for the detailed answer. The last question, Massimo Ferrari, I didn't catch the CapEx level you spent basically on 2023, but can you also, on top of this, help me to understand the level of, let's say, net financial charges, okay, should we assume for 2024 excluding, let's say, non-recurring items you mentioned, also Ethiopia last year? Thanks.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Okay.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Just let us read a little bit the numbers because they're written very small.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Around.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Also with the glasses. I need the help. So in a range between EUR 210-EUR 220. Yes. Hopefully, less than that, as you know, that the interest rate during these years should go down in a way. So we keep it very conservative figures.

Alessandro Tortora
Industrial Equity Analyst, Mediobanca

Okay. Okay. Thanks.

Operator

The next question is from Enrico Coco of Intermonte.

Enrico Coco
Equity Research Analyst, Intermonte

Yes. Good morning. Thanks for taking my questions. So the first is on if you could say the level of advance payments you included in the budget of this year. Understand if this reflects the sort of worst case on orders and advance payments and having an understanding of the kind of buffer you have to close the year with a net financial position much better than the EUR 400 million guidance. Then, if I may, a second question, still on debt. I saw that the gross debt last year was stable, and you confirmed the guidance of reducing the gross debt by EUR 250 million between 2023 and 2025. So now, basically, this EUR 250 million must be generated in this year or next year.

The question is, given the size of the company which is growing, the EBITDA is, let's say, approaching EUR 1 billion, do you think that gross debt will more or less remain pretty high at this kind of EUR 2 billion level, so two times the EBITDA, or you think you have the idea, the target of significantly reducing the gross debt when this will be possible? Of course, if you could also indicate if this EUR 250 million deleverage in gross debt you expect by 2025 is a reasonable indication or you have upside also on this. Then, if I may, the last one, you said that you could divest from concessions with a book value of EUR 300 million. The question is, shall we expect something to be sold this year of significant size? Thank you.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Let's start from the advance payment, let's say, net effect on the guidance. We consider it zero as a contribution of new advance payment because, of course, we have to reimburse other advance payment that has been disbursed in the past and cashed in in the past. So contribution that is envisaged in our budget is now zero for 2024. I think this is clear. The second question was?

Enrico Coco
Equity Research Analyst, Intermonte

Gross debt reduction.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Net debt reduction. We confirm also in the presentation that we will reduce as a guidance, we reduce the net debt by the gross debt, sorry, from around from EUR 200 million-EUR 250 million. This comes, of course, from the cash generation that we imagine to have. Remember that all of our debt is represented by bond. So let's say the quick reduction of it means purchasing back or reducing our debt, outstanding debt by the reduction of this bond. It's not just a matter of dealing with banks with the excess cash treasury that we may have. This is also explained the fact that at the end of the year, we had such high figures of cash in hand, and the gross debt remains the same. Of course, in different situations, it could have been, let's say, simpler to offset the gross debt with the excess cash.

In this situation, for the structure of the debt, this is a different factor. The same things apply to the excess cash, which is temporary. Sometimes it's temporarily available, and then you need to think about the sustainable gross debt that is in the future. That's why we gave that figures of a reduction on the total of EUR 200-250 million. What you should think is that the debt that comes from the past is comparing itself in size to what is now at different sides of the EBITDA generation and in the sides of the revenues, the sides of the company, which makes the leverage changing dimension by 25% this year, and we continue to reduce these sides into the future. So when you say, let's say, the figures of EUR 2.6 billion, of course, it compares to EUR 1 million of EBITDA is one thing.

It compares to EUR 1 billion of EBITDA, is a different figure. So I think that the growth of the company is there. The debt is more or less always the same. We managed to keep it, let's say, in the past even with the growth because normally, debt goes with the expansion of working capital, the investment in CapEx, whatever you do. And if you see one of the things which is important is that the growth I anticipated at the beginning of the call in the 10 years has happened from the EUR 2 billion to the EUR 10 billion, giving to the shareholders, including the capital increase, we did EUR 900 million back in terms of dividend and what has been paid, including all the requests we made as capital increase.

I think that this company has grown with its own resources, distributing dividends so far, not requesting money from the markets.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

So let me add. We have one of the lowest levels of gross debt in the top 10 peers around the world. What is important is the cost of the debt. So we are waiting for the easing of monetary policy in order to spend less in terms of interest charge, having EUR 2.5 billion of gross debt on EUR 10 billion of revenues, and EUR 1 billion of EBITDA is very good leverage if you pay, for instance, 2% on the gross debt. So we are looking at on debt, we can manage it very easily. We successfully managed it in the past. So we are committed to improve the cash generation for the equity investors the most that we can. There are other questions that we missed.

Operator

What was the last question?

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

We didn't put any concession disposal in the target. It could be on top of the target that we disclosed.

Operator

The next question is from Matteo Salcedo of ODDO BHF.

Matteo Salcedo
High Yield Credit Analyst, ODDO BHF

Yes. Thanks for taking my question. Maybe just to come back on the margins. You said, of course, you have flat margins, let's say, kind of conservative for 2024, but then if you look at your target at 2025, you have as well, let's say, still an important headroom to get to the 9% that it will imply your 2025 target. Is there something you're expecting in 2025 to maybe kick that margin up, or what should we expect, or maybe it's just your remaining conservative in 2024? Then in terms of net debt refinancing, what will be the timing for the 2025 bond?

Now that you have a lot of cash, will it as well be considered you will be considering to refinance it as well with some cash in hand, or how should we think about it in order for you to get to your 2025 target of gross debt reduction? Finally, if you could tell us about the maturity of the RCF, I believe you extended it to 2025. I just wanted to know if you have any other extension options or yeah, mostly on the maturity on the RCF. Thanks.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Well, on the debt refinancing, all the time we are talking now, this is March 2024. We are talking about the first bond in October 2024, sorry. So we have all the time to manage it and to, let's say, look at the conditions that are foreseeable in the future. So we will take the best opportunity of making it in the best possible way. We have, of course, managing we have also RCF that we can use in order to delay.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

We have the option.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

If it's needed to delay this date when it's needed. So for this.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

For the marginality target of.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

For the marginality, as we explained, the size, the reduction of general expenses, the reorganization of those, let's say, branches, the different market in which we operate, the size into the different areas like Australia, like other countries like Saudis, will bring a boost into the future that is what we gave as a long-term EBITDA margin. You have to appreciate also that this EBITDA margin is by far exceeding all our peers' EBITDA margin significantly in terms of numbers. So, let's say, we cannot expect to. We are not changing the, let's say, the market with which we operate. We always do infrastructure. So we cannot think of a free double-digit EBITDA margin because this is not related to our market. We extract more value through value engineering. This is something we said during the presentation. When we make our bid, we do not win bid on only price.

So this competition is not related to price. It's related to innovative solutions to value engineering that bring, of course, added value to our clients but also to us. So this is why our EBITDA margin, it is by far the highest of the market.

Matteo Salcedo
High Yield Credit Analyst, ODDO BHF

Yeah, yeah. I agree with you. I'm just trying to understand why would you guide for a flat EBITDA margin in 2024 and then to jump almost to 9% in 2025? But yeah, I believe you have a lot of upside given what you said. Thanks.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Thank you.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Remember, Massimo told you that it's better to overdeliver than to overstay.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Overpromise.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, I will hand it back to Mr. Salini and Mr. Ferrari for any closing remarks.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

No, no final remarks. I think that thank you, all of you, for attending this.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

We are available.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

We are available, and our team in investor relations is ready to satisfy all other questions that may be.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Also to arrange some meetings with all of us.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Thank you very much.

Massimo Ferrari
General Manager of Corporate and Finance, Webuild

Thank you. Have a good day. Bye-bye.

Pietro Salini
CEO, Webuild

Bye-bye.

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