Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to Q2 and H1 FY 2024 earnings conference call of JK Lakshmi Cement Limited, hosted by PhillipCapital (India) Pvt Ltd. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode, and there will be an opportunity to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Vaibhav Agarwal from PhillipCapital (India) Pvt Ltd. Thank you, and over to you.
Yeah. Thank you. Good evening, everyone. On behalf of PhillipCapital (India) Pvt Ltd, we welcome you to the Q2 and H1 FY 2024 call of JK Lakshmi Cement. I need to highlight that JK Lakshmi Cement is also the holding company of Udaipur Cement Works Limited, and therefore this call is also open for discussion about the performance of Udaipur Cement Works Limited. On the call we have with us Mr. Arun Kumar Shukla, President and Director, and Mr. Sudhir Bidkar, CFO of JK Lakshmi Cement. I would like to mention on behalf of JK Lakshmi Cement and its management that certain statements that we made or discussed on this call may be forward-looking statements related to future developments based on current expectations.
These statements are subject to number of risks, uncertainties and other important factors, which may cause actual developments and the results to differ materially from the statements made. JK Lakshmi Cement Limited and the management of the company assumes no obligation to publicly alter or update these forward-looking statements whether as a result of new information or future events or otherwise. I will now hand over the floor to the management of JK Lakshmi Cement for the opening remarks, especially for Q and A. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you, Mr. Vaibhav, and good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to this Q2 FY 2024 call for JK Lakshmi Cement. We had announced the results on Thursday, so you would have had sufficient time to go through in detail about the results. Nothing much to mention, and now we can throw the floor open for question and answers so that we can accommodate more questions.
Thank you very much, sir. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to only use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. We have our first question from the line of Shravan Shah from Dolat Capital. Please go ahead.
Thank you, sir, and congratulations on good set of numbers. The first question is on the volume front. If you look at the 1H, we have done a 9.4% volume growth on the consolidated, I am talking, and we were looking at 19% kind of a growth for this year. If I do the maths, then for the second half, we need to grow close to more than 27% kind of a growth. Just trying to get your sense of how are we looking at this number for the full year.
Thanks, Shravan. During last call also, I had mentioned that, yeah, 19% was the projection to start with, but last call we mentioned that somewhere we are going to be growing in a double-digit range, which is about 12%-13% kind of a thing. I will give a range of 12%-15% of volume growth for the year 2024.
Shravan?
Second, on the pricing and profitability front. We have seen a decent price increase in the east, prices particularly in September, and also channel checks suggest some rollback has happened. But for us in Chhattisgarh particularly where we have a sizable presence, there we haven't seen that much increase. Broadly, from the average of Q2 in north and particularly east, how are the prices currently versus a Q2 average? In terms of the profitability where we were looking at INR 1,000 kind of EBITDA for turnover 12-18 months. Is the deadline remains the same or can it be done even earlier also?
Shravan, I think the last question I would ask besides the first. Yes, I think 18- 24 months time period for INR 1,000 EBITDA, that remains intact. That is what I think we are working, and we will be inching towards that because a lot of actions which we had taken, now all those actions will get justified. This is part two of your question. Part one was about a price increase in eastern part of India and also perhaps north and western part of India. Prices have increased at different points in time, right? I think east, we will have some improvement in this quarter because the price increase happened somewhere around September, May, and then October. Benefit will come as far as east goes in this quarter. This is one.
Second, as far as north and west goes, prices are going to be a little strong because November is going to be a low month in terms of volume because of Diwali, but December onward, I think things should be all right. Demand also will improve, and so would the pricing. On an average, I see an increment of INR 50 to about INR 100. I give a range of increase over last quarter.
Sorry, sir. INR 50-I NR 100 increase on QoQ basis one can expect?
Yes.
Okay. Got it. Understood. Second, in terms of the expansion. Definitely clinker we have started at Udaipur. The grinding 2.5 million tonnes. Previously, we were looking at Q2 FY 2025. Are we planning to prepone this one?
Yes, we hope to do that. Towards March or April, we will be able to commission the 2.5 million tonnes grinding unit at Udaipur.
Okay. In terms of the next phase from currently post the Surat that we have announced 1.35 million tonnes. There also, if you help us in terms of two years we have mentioned, but will it be a one edge of FY 2026 where we are looking at to start and post the next expansion in terms of the reach of 30 million tonnes. We were looking at first the Durg plant and then the Udaipur. When we will be going to announce that expansion?
That you are right. It will be first half of FY 2026 which is a two-year timeline from now. That we are trying to see if we can do it in phases instead of entire 1.3 million tonnes coming in one shot. If we can do initially a bit half of that and then within six to eight months we do the complete 1.35 million tonnes. Yes, we will be at appropriate time announcing the brownfield expansion, which are in the pipeline, as you rightly mentioned, Durg and followed by Udaipur and then also followed by the greenfield at Nagaur in Kutch.
Okay. Last, a couple of data points for this quarter. So trade share, premium share, blending ratio, lead distance, load rate, mix, fuel mix, and clinker cost. Also the non-cement revenue.
[audio distortion]
Okay.
It's at 62%.
Sorry. I didn't get you.
62% of the-
Okay, 62%.
Yes.
Okay.
Lead distance is 387 km. We have brought it down further.
Okay.
Grade is working at 65%.
Sorry, 65% is what, sir?
Blended.
Blended, okay. 90% will be the road. That will remain the same.
Exactly.
Premium share will be, last time it was 27%.
Road, I think the rail depends, because most of the time if you reduce your lead load, you have to go by road than rail, right?
Okay.
That is what, as our lead goes down, I think dependence on rail will decrease. But once that 2.5 million tonnes comes, then I think
I was asking the premium share and the non-cement revenue for this quarter.
Premium is 23% of trade sales.
Okay.
Non-cement is INR 130 crores.
Mr. Shah, I request you to join back the queue for follow-up questions. Before we take the next question, I would like to remind participants to press star and one to ask a question. We will take the next question from the line of Rajkumar Das from Navodaya Enterprises. Please go ahead.
Yes, thank you for the opportunity, ma'am. Sir, my question is: in the last conference call, you have given information about the approval for your Durg railway siding and conveyor belt. Can you give its current status and timeline by when it will be completed?
On railway siding, we have already started our job. We got that approval, we have started our job, and that is going to get commissioned somewhere around quarter two, quarter three of next year. This is what the plan is. On conveyor belt, that approval process is still in progress. We are progressing well. Maybe when we talk next, I think we will have some update on that as well.
Okay. My next question is: what will you do about the expansion of Durg plant, and when can you announce the new expansion?
Still on the railway siding. Once we have done some concrete steps have been taken, then we will announce that. Presently, we are evaluating various options of, because the clinkerization while it will happen at the mother plant at Durg. The grinding units, we are trying to look for the various split location places. Once those are formed up, then we will announce. If things go as per plan, then hopefully by next in this financial year, we will certainly do that.
Thank you, sir. Sir, we are a very old shareholder of JK Lakshmi Cement, and so many times we ask so many questions on your email, but there is no one who reply us. Sir, this is my humble request, please reply our emails. If you want to reply on your BSE public domain, we do not mind. Sir, this is my last humble request to you.
We have a dedicated email for all the investors' queries. If you put in your request on that dedicated email, it will get answered immediately. I am not sure whom you are sending your request to. But there is a dedicated email, you can see that it is available on the website as well as on our annual report. I do not remember the email ID, but it is there, and if you do not upload your questions on that or send your email on that, certainly all questions, all the investors are getting responded to. But certainly, the only thing, we cannot give specific information to one particular shareholder. If there are any data points which you require, we will certainly share that with you, as we are doing with the other investors.
Okay, sir. Thank you, sir. Thank you. That is all from my side, sir.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, please press star and one on your phone. We will take our next question from the line of Mangesh Bhadang from Centrum Broking. Please go ahead.
Hello, sir. And congrats on good set of numbers as well as commissioning of Udaipur unit.
Thank you.
Sir, my question was, now we have reached 10 million tons of clinker capacity. But after the clinker and the grinding unit coming up, there is almost a gap of, say, five to six months. So I just wanted to understand that would we be selling clinker till then? And if it is so, then would it impact the profitability in the scheme?
Yes. So yes, you are right. There is intervening period, there is a gap between our clinkerization and grinding capacity. So whatever clinker we are going to produce in the intervening period, part of that we will be utilizing in some of our outsourced unit, one. And of course, I think our clinker sale will go up little bit because we will have availability of clinker. And since we are kind of through this phase of kind of stabilizing our KL2, so we want to kind of produce clinker whatever we can. So the plan is two prongs. One, outsource grinding stations which we have within our fold, and second, also selling little more clinker during this time.
Which are these outsourced grinding unit? Is it Amethi?
No. Amethi, I think, is part of this. We are taking from it. It will not go to Amethi, but we have one outsourced unit in Gujarat and one in north part of India, Punjab.
Okay. And what would be the capacity, sir? Just wanted to understand how much incremental volumes it can generate from.
See, I think what we see that we are going to produce clinker to the capacity of about 50% or 60%. Because this is the stabilization phase, right?
Right.
Out that 50%, if you take half of that or maybe about 40% we will be grinding it, because Rajpura, Punjab, I think we have a good capacity. This is up to us how much we can really consume out there. There is no limit as such in terms of grinding. That capacity is available there. In Gujarat also, I mentioned you, yes, I think we can increase, not to a great extent, but little more there as well. Third option also, I think our Surat unit. I feel that we can further improve our utilization out there. We will use there as well. Combination of these three is going to consume about 40%- 50% of clinker, which we will be producing during this interim period.
Okay. Thank you, sir. Secondly, we mentioned that we are currently operating at almost 100% clinker utilization. The clinker capacity that has come in, basically the matching grinding capacity is going to come later. That 75% cement utilization and 100% clinker utilization, would it remain the same for at least this and next quarter till the new capacity comes up? Only increase probably could be higher clinker. Overall cement volume should remain the same that we did in this quarter?
There is some turbulence. There is some earthquake in Delhi.
Earthquake in Delhi.
Okay.
Yes, hold on for a moment. Just hold on for a minute.
Okay.
Yeah, it has stabilized. Yeah. Sorry, can you repeat your question? We were in a hope everywhere is okay and if it is not very severe anyway.
Yeah.
Yeah, go ahead, please.
Sir, my question was that we did 75% cement utilization and 100% clinker utilization in this quarter. This would remain the same, right? Because we will not be able to use the new clinker from Udaipur to cover. Is there any arrangement through which we can utilize some of the clinker inside and still be able to produce more cement? That is what I wanted to understand.
If you look at our capacity utilization of cement grinding was 73% last quarter. That is what I mentioned you, that we do have scope within our system to consume clinker. If something is still left over, then we will go to outside.
Okay, sir. Okay, fine. That is it. Okay, I will come back in the queue.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, please press star and one on your phone. We will take our next question from the line of Sanjay Nandi from VT Capital. Please go ahead.
Hello.
Mr. Nandi, can you please speak a bit louder? Please use your headset phone.
Yeah. Am I audible?
Yes.
Yeah. Sir, can you please throw some light on your petcoke consumption, like what kind of inventories we are holding as on date or what is the thing as on date?
You have asked about inventories, right?
Yeah, inventories or whether we have added something in this particular quarter or we are holding something from last quarter, like what is the exact inventory placing as on date?
Inventories, especially petcoke, we have about three months consumption available with us.
Okay.
In this quarter, the kcal was about 2.04 kcal overall, and we expect it to be about 1.98 kcal next quarter.
Okay. Which means we can expect some price drop from the power and fuel cost front due to petcoke.
Right. About 5% in terms of the cost of the fuel. You are right.
Got it. So that is it. Thank you so much, sir. I will come back in the queue, sir.
Thank you. Participants may please press star and one to ask a question. We have a question from the line of Ritesh Shah from Investec. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi. Thanks for the opportunity. Couple of questions. Sir, first I wanted to understand our accounting policy. A couple of quarters back, you had indicated that whatever transaction with UCWL, we do recognize it in expenses as well as on the revenue line. I think in the subsequent quarters, you had indicated that we will only treat it as one line, somewhere as a conversion cost. Sir, can you please highlight what the status is like over here? I just wanted to understand that. That is the first question.
Yeah. That is basically earlier what we were doing when Udaipur was to get its clinker converted into cement from the grinding units of JK Lakshmi. Earlier, what was being shown as clinker sale initially, and then they purchased back the cement. In the process to the extent of the clinker, it was getting double accounting. Now they are not showing any clinker sale for any conversion from clinker to cement, and whatever cost we are charging, they are loading that as part of the cement cost. So there is no duplicacy as far as the clinker. That has been done with effect from 1st April 2022. That was done. That is what we had done. Now there is no duplicacy.
But we are also sourcing some cement from UCWL, for which we are not supplying any cement, any clinker. Then obviously that is shown as cement purchased from that. So the better way of seeing and analyzing the result, as we have always been mentioning on the call, is to see on a console basis, which we are giving in our press release, both cement, the numbers, et cetera. So that will give you a fair idea of what the overall picture looks like in terms of a better pattern on a console basis.
Right. Sir, thanks for the explanation. So just as a follow-up, I was looking at the related party transaction, what we have put out.
Right.
When I look at that number, the number is around INR 264 crore. That is the purchase of cement/others
Right
from UCWL. So even if I look at JK Lakshmi on a console basis, this number is nearly 35% of the total raw mat, including inventory change.
Right.
How should one interpret this? Because 35% looks a pretty steep number, given the intercompany with UCWL.
This you are talking of which figure and for which period you are talking of?
Sir, I am referring to the first half numbers, the related party transaction, what you published. We just looked at the numbers on the purchase that JK Lakshmi had from UCWL. This is only purchase for cement and others.
Right.
This does not include, I think, fuel. This number is INR 264 crore versus the total raw mat plus inventory change on a first half basis of INR 763 crore.
Right.
So of the percentage of total, even on a console basis, this number looks very high at 35%.
35% of what? 35% you have to see on a total turnover basis, not on a cement or a raw material basis.
Sir-
You have to see link turnover, not to the cost of the material consumed. Link it to the turnover, you will get the answer.
Sir, why would that be so? Because you are purchasing something from UCWL, which is a subsidiary.
Right.
Right. You are saying that this is all cement, there is no clinker over here?
No, there is no clinker, obviously. There is no clinker.
INR 264 crores of cement.
But you see that it gets eliminated. If you see on that console basis, it will get eliminated.
Sir, the net, if I look at it on a net basis also, there is a difference of INR 150 crores because sale of cement and clinker, what is written is INR 114 crores. The purchase of cement is INR 264 crores. The difference is INR 150 crores.
Can you repeat that, please?
Sir, if you look at on a first half basis, the purchase from UCWL for cement/others is INR 264 crores. The sale amount is around INR 113 crores.
Sir, can you tell me
Sir, purchase of cement/others is INR 264 crores.
Purchase of [audio distortion] .
Paid is INR 113.7 crores. The difference is still INR 150 crores, INR 150.9 crores.
I am not able to see where are you reading it from.
Sir, I am referring it to the related party transactions. Probably, I will drop you an email, sir.
You see the P&L, please. The purchase of cement. I will read out purchase of stock in trade for JK Lakshmi. What figure you have? INR 404 crores?
Yes, sir.
UCWL standalone is INR 113 crores.
Sir, I am looking it on a first half basis.
Yeah, first half. I am also talking of first half only, please.
Right. So on a consolidated basis, the raw material consumed is INR 227 crores. Purchase of trade
INR 276 crores, please.
It is INR 227.5 crores, sir, raw material consumed.
I don't know where are you reading it. It is published as INR 276 crores.
Okay. What I'll do is, probably I'll drop you an email. We have the numbers from the presentation.
If you have my number, you can speak to me also, maybe tomorrow or after this call.
Perfect, sir. That would be helpful.
Thank you so much.
Thank you.
I do not know the number which you are talking or where are you referring it from. No worries. You talk to me after the call.
Sure, sir.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, please press star and one on your phone. We have our next question from the line of Prateek Kumar from Jefferies. Please go ahead.
Yeah, good evening, sir. My first question is on your profitability improvement. In the past, you have talked about several measures which will drive improvement in your profitability and EBITDA by around INR 10 or higher over 18- 24 months, as you highlighted earlier today also. This quarter, we did see that around INR 140 kind of improvement in profitability. What particular element would have driven this on a Q on Q basis?
It's a combination of things. So, of course, I think our volume this year were better than last year's same quarter, one. Second, improvement in realization, which is combination of pure price increase, what we call it, and then the top-line levers like I told you about trade sales, geo mix, and premium products. So these are the contributors. Of course, I think on manufacturing and logistics also, we have done quite a bit. So we have reduced our lead. In the last quarter, it was 387 km, which is about 13 km lower than before. And apart from lead, I think there has been some actions at manufacturing end. Okay. So I think on AFR improvement little bit, though I think we do not have still full-fledged capability at our plant, which we are working on.
So there also, I think we have increased AFR and hence reduction in fuel cost. And of course, I think softening of fuel costs also has helped a bit. So combination of things, something which is external which we got benefited and some actions internally on top line and cost base, which we are working on.
Right. But trade mix has largely remained trade mix and blended cement mix has largely remained similar, right? Q on Q, that particular aspect would not have contributed.
No, trade sales has gone up 68% from 58%, 62% to 58%, right? A good increase. What is not visible on the figure is, which I think anyway we work internally, is geo mix, like selling material in the low trade zone area where our realization is better.
Okay.
There are set of actions on logistics cost, on direct dispatches, on warehouse costing, on trade sales. All these actions put together, I think that has really helped us. Maybe I think we have not fully realized all these actions as yet because some of the actions are still work in progress. You will see that gradual improvement, and that is why I took that time of 18- 24 months.
Okay. Prime FPC, we have done I think good improvement this quarter, but prime FPC, the next two quarters should look better than this quarter, right? Based on spot pricing and cost trend, et cetera.
Yeah, demand is going to be better and some of the actions which is work in progress, that will also get fortified. My belief also is that it is going to be better than last quarter.
Okay. What is your net debt position as of now? What will be peak net debt which you are looking at on consolidated basis with the expansion project which we are undertaking?
Today, as far as JK Lakshmi on a standalone, we are having a gross debt of about INR 680 crores and net of cash is about INR 140 crores. On a consolidated basis, it is INR 1,975 crores as of September on a gross debt basis and about INR 1,175 crores on a net debt basis. Going forward, seeing various projects which we are doing, we feel our gross debt in JK Lakshmi would reach out to about INR 880 crores from INR 650 crores presently in the coming six months, and that is FY 2024 and to about INR 1,000 crores by March 2025 on a standalone basis. Net of cash will be around the same level, INR 140 crores, INR 150 crores, and around the same level as of March 2025 also. There will not be any major increase in the net debt on a standalone basis from the present level of September to March 2024 or March 2025.
Yes, on a consolidated basis, certainly the number would be larger because of the fresh loans which we are taking for UCWL expansion. There we'll see from the present gross debt of INR 1,975 crores will peak out to about INR 2,400 crores by March 2024 to INR 2,600 crores by FY25. A net debt position on a consolidated basis from the present INR 1,170 crores to about INR 1,600 crores and then INR 1,800 crores by FY 2024 and 2025.
Okay. FY 2024, 2025 on consolidated basis, how much CapEx is there impacting in this on a year by year basis?
We are talking of a CapEx. As far as JK Lakshmi is concerned, in the current year, we are talking close to about INR 500 crores and INR 700 crores for UCWL. Next year, JK Lakshmi, another INR 500 crores and INR 100 crores remaining for UCWL. We are talking of INR 1,200 crores on a consolidated basis, the CapEx in the current year, INR 500 crores for JK Lakshmi and INR 700 crores for UCWL, including their expansion. Next year, again, INR 500 crores for JK Lakshmi and INR 100 crores odd remaining for UCWL, INR 600 crores. So INR 1,200 crores in the current year, including whatever has been spent in the current six months and INR 600 crores in the next financial year.
Any new projects which we take up may reflect in FY 2025 number if any new expansion.
In addition to that, if we announce as and when. These numbers which are shared with you talks of only the announced projects like Surat grinding unit, conveyor belt, railway siding. But once we announce the expansion at Durg, that will be in addition to that.
Right. Conveyor belt has been very sticky in terms of clearances for years. Has that been now sort of sorted, like at Durg?
Broadly, yes, because there were two parts to that approval which were required. The bigger one approval, which was more time-consuming, was the railway siding. That has come and hopefully in this quarter, the conveyor belt green signal would also come for that. Thereafter, we are talking of about eight, nine months for conveyor belt and about a year for the railway siding.
One last question on Gujarat market. While the Ambuja acquisition has not completed, is there any expected increase in material from Sanghi Industries in your core markets in Gujarat post that acquisition completing?
Sanghi per se, I think I have not seen that any quantum has increased. Little bit increase, yes, of course. The kind of demand which is there in the market is not at all disturbing any dynamics. Not much increase, little bit increase. I think I would say they have gone back to the normal level, which they were doing. Nothing beyond. Once they are coming full-fledged, let's say to 6.1 million tons, then I think that we need to see. But as of today, I think business is as usual.
Sure. Thank you, sir. These are my questions. All the best.
Thank you.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, please press star and one now. We have our next question from the line of Rajesh Ravi from HDFC Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, sir. Good evening. I'm calling. You have some good set of numbers. First on this non-cement revenue is INR 130 crore. How much was the RMC? On this INR 130 crore, what was the EBITDA margin, please?
This is basically the margins are low here in the Value-Added business. In this quarter it was 3%. Out of the INR 130 crore which we told you, INR 60 crore was this RMC, INR 50 crore AAC and INR 20 crore was POP.
Sir, on company level, all this trade, non-trade and blended, you share those numbers. They are all on a consolidated basis or standalone?
Standalone JK Lakshmi.
Oh, okay. Is it possible to share these numbers on consolidated basis because as you say, we should consider this company more on a consolidated basis?
Yeah, we will share that.
We will share that. It will be the same level. Broadly, it should not be a material difference.
Okay.
±1%-2%.
Okay. And this quarter , we have seen this trade share now improve from 55% in Q1, which remained around similar level for FY 2023 to now 62%. Is there some conscious effort to inch up trade share or is it just that the non-trade volumes have been lower and that is why the trade share is north of 60%?
No, Ravi, I think this is a design one, not something which has happened by default.
Okay.
Yeah.
Again, on your green power, how much was your consumption sales at 30% in Q1 and in Q2, and what is the outlook?
We had talked of that we have now started sourcing the 40 MW of green power or the solar power for our Durg plant. By virtue of it will be on a renewable basis, jumping up for Durg to 80% from the present 36%, as far as Durg is concerned. On all the plants of JK Lakshmi taken together, then we are talking of close to about 35% by way of renewable in this quarter.
Okay. This will inch up when the Durg sourcing increases. AFR, sir?
October obviously this will go up.
Yes. AFR share was how much in volumetric terms?
What, sorry?
AFR, alternative fuel.
AFR, I will give you in terms of TSR, thermal substitution rate.
We have taken up that project for increasing the TSR. That will increase our TSR from 4% to 12% and ultimately to 20% in phases.
Okay. This year, what is the target from 4% you spoke previously?
So, we do not have any capability as such, and more so because we always compare the other fuel cost versus AFR. We will be around 6% around at Durg. We will be around close to overall 6% in Sirohi as well. Because Sirohi right now is doing less than 4%. First phase of AFR maybe will start during last quarter of this financial year. By end of this year, I think we will reach there about 6% there as well.
Okay. Sir, last question. First half you have talked 10% volume growth or second half you have surplus clinker now that your clinker plant is operational in October. What is the volume number? My understanding would be that you are already in shortage of clinker. Given the surplus clinker, would you be able to ramp up the Udaipur second line much faster, maybe reaching 70%-80% utilization in Q4?
Yes. The effort is that only, Ravi. We will have wherever capacity utilization has to go up, that will go up, and we will try to expedite that in upcoming earning seasons as well. Right.
Okay.
Yeah. That is what the effort is. Let's see how fast we can team is there on the line.
Okay, great. Great, sir. That's all from my end. I'll come back in queue. Thank you.
Thanks, Ravi. Thank you so much.
We have our next question from the line of Uttam Kumar Srimal from Axis Securities. Please go ahead.
Yes, sir. Thanks for the opportunity and congratulations on the good set of numbers. Sir, what has been our fuel mix this quarter? Petcoke and imported coal.
In this quarter, we had a total fuel mix of about 46%, 38% was coal, and balance was the other.
Okay. And sir, what is the current status of oil-to-fuel plant in Alwar and AAC block in Aligarh that we are setting up?
Yeah. Aligarh we have already commissioned, and we have almost near capacity of about, let's say, 75% of utilization. We are already doing about 11,000 cu m a month. More or less, we have stabilized our Aligarh plant. As far as Alwar oil-to-fuel plant goes, it will take some time because now this job is not happening because of the ban. NCR entire construction activities has been banned, right? This is going to be little bit delayed on account of this. But our target is to do these trials by end of Quarter three.
Okay. And sir, any target that you have set for your VAP business, Value-Added Product business? Because earlier, I think it was around INR 500 crores, and I think this year we will cross that INR 500 crores income, our Value-Added Product. So any new target you have visualized for your Value-Added Product business?
Value-Added Product, I think our ambition is to take it to INR 1,000 crore level by the end of 2027, 2028. This is what the plan is. So right now we are at INR 500 crore level. So another maybe three years, we'll go to INR 1,000 crores.
Okay, sir. That's all from my side, and all the best to you.
Thank you, Uttam Srimal. Thank you.
Thank you. We have our next question from the line of Raghav Maheshwari from AMSEC. Please go ahead.
I just wanted to know the new proposed grinding unit at Surat, what is the clinker source? Is it from the import from the Middle East, or we have the surplus clinker available at the Dabok or the Sirohi location?
We will have, I think, combination of them. Of course, I think Sirohi also, we are contemplating if we can really increase further efficiency with least CapEx involvement, little bit more clinker from Sirohi or Jaykaypuram. That is one. Second, of course, I think we will take some clinker out of Udaipur. Third is going to be import, if at all we require.
Sir, what is the cost difference on the lender at a plant? What is the cost difference between import and the transferring from either Dabok or the Sirohi?
That depends. I think if you talk to me maybe six, nine months back, then import was cheaper. But now, since fuel costs and other things have softened a bit, then I think the cost clinker is little better. But I think import has always been comparable. Import is not as high. If you really want to run your plant and you do not have clinker, then that also offers a very good option.
Okay. And sir, last question from my side for the Gujarat market, particularly. Gujarat market is primarily after the Sanghi operational, when it will go for the Adani management. What we are hearing, Adani will introduce ACC as a new brand. So how will you see the Gujarat market and particularly South Gujarat market, which is one of the strongest market of the JK Lakshmi? Because this is my understanding, most of the material evacuation from the Sanghi is practically possible for only the South Gujarat and the Mumbai market because of the sea route availability. So it will impact pricing pressure on this market. How will you see, particularly?
My reasonable assumption is that this will not impact as such. Maybe a little bit. But I don't think because, see, a market is big. Some of the market which you name some competitor, they are supplying to other market also, which is as lucrative as Gujarat is. So I don't think that price dynamics is going to change drastically. That will happen to the extent it normally happens because of the cyclicity and demand supply there. But not per se that additional volume is going to really disturb the market prices.
Got it, sir. And sir, just wanted to check one thing. Why the plant for the UCWL for the cement grinding is delayed so much compared to the clinker? Because we have already commissioned the clinker in the current quarter, and we are proposed to the commissioning for the cement is approximately after the three quarters. Why this gap? Because there isn't any environmental clearance issue or something else?
I think this is what our project plan was. If you recall all those calls, we have been telling that around October, our clinkerization will come, and during last quarter of this financial year, grinding will come. If you remember, I think we also had in the intervening period, COVID issues, global supply chain issues. This was the project plan itself like this. That we will install that clinkerization first, and then we will go to cement. As such, there is no delay. This is going as per the book.
Yeah. There is a lag from the start only, from the project planning, I guess.
Yeah. At that point in time, based on that global situation and supply chain issue, we planned that way. And that was prudent at that point in time.
So meanwhile, clinker produced by the UCWL will produce internally, or we will go for the clinker cell from the UCWL plant?
I told, I think, some of the gentlemen, they asked this question. The order is like this. First we will consume whatever clinker we will have to our internal grinding stations, which we have. One. Second, we will go to some of the outsourced unit where we have some surplus grinding capability. Third is going to be clinker sale. But of course, I think clinker sale is going to be little higher during this intervening period.
Got it, sir. Sir, thank you for your detailed explanation. Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Thank you. We have our next question. Line of Aman Agrawal from Equirus Securities. Please go ahead.
Good morning, madam, and thank you for the opportunity.
Sir, can you please use your handset mode, Mr. Agrawal?
Is this audible now?
It is very low.
Hello.
Yeah.
Is this audible now?
Yes. Please go ahead.
Sir, two questions from my side. First was with respect to demand in the eastern region. A couple of peers have highlighted some subdued demand growth, mainly in the eastern region. What is the kind of situation that you are facing? And going ahead, what is the kind of growth that you see for that market?
Whatever information I have got, the demand during last quarter in the East was the highest, in terms of percentage growth YoY. Followed by other markets like North, West and South. My information and my intelligence feels little different than what you are saying. Even going forward also, I see that East is going to grow in double digit. Because with East, we need to understand, this is predominantly IHB-driven market. I think this market is going to grow in double digit going forward also. 8%-10% growth I see going forward as well.
Understood, sir. Second question was with respect to our expansion plans. We already tried for acquiring a much more sizable capacity in the western region, and recently we have announced 1.3 MTPA expansion in another west region. Going ahead, can we expect more of such expansion to be announced in the western region itself for JK Lakshmi?
That call we will take depending on the demand supply, but as of now, we do not have anything in the offering.
Sure, sir. Got it. Thank you.
Thank you. A final reminder to participants to press star and one to ask a question. We have a question from the line of Navin Sahadeo from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good evening, sir.
Sahadeo.
Yes. Am I audible?
Yes. Please go ahead.
Great. Good evening, sir, and thank you for the opportunity. Sir, two questions. One is, what is the rationale to choose the new 1.35 million tonnes grinding unit in Surat? Is it better demand? Because I am saying that if your existing unit at Kalol is much closer to Ahmedabad, which is a buzzing center as such, and also it will have a lesser lead if at all clinker has to come from Sirohi or even Udaipur for that matter. My question was just trying to understand what is the rationale. Is it higher demand? Is that market more profitable for you? Is there an outlook that you see is much better? Because we have Kalol as an option. We could have also had Jhajjar as an option for the grinding unit or some new grinding unit location in NCR. Just trying to understand why Surat. Thank you.
There are a couple of reasons, Navin, why did we choose Surat. One, of course, I think the demand projection, the way demand is going up. Surat was already touching to its capacity. We thought of putting a load there because we have almost exhausted our capacity at Surat, one. Second, if you know the geography of Gujarat, South Gujarat is a better price market than north and other part of it, though I think your lead is little bit more. I think price-wise, this is quite stable and prices are also better. The third and important consideration is that this also gives us an opportunity to enter into that Mumbai market. Right? Because the way Mumbai market also is going, I think Surat is going to be a good source of supply in the neighboring area or bordering area of South Gujarat. Right?
These were the three considerations, right, why did we choose Surat.
Does this unit also have incentive benefits? Surat will have incentive, grinding units related incentives, any sales, I mean, GST refund or something?
Yeah, we are trying to see. We have already applied. We have not got the confirmation, but we are trying to see if we can get some incentive there for this additional grinding unit. Hopefully, we should be able to get that.
Okay. Concluding on this question per se, Surat is a better realization market for us net of freight from clinker from anywhere, but Surat is a better, at least as of now, we see it as a better realization or profitable market for us.
Yeah.
Understood. Sir, second question then was, you mentioned about the railway sidings that are coming, I think next year, as you said, Q3 or Q4 and the conveyor belt. These will lead to what kind of savings do you anticipate? Thank you.
Of course, I think we will be able to reach out to some of the high price market, one. Because right now we do not have access to some of the high price market of west. Second, I think is going to be incoming raw material also is going to be cheaper. Third is we also transfer clinker to our grinding station of Cuttack and Amethi. That is also going to help us in reducing cost. These are the immediate benefit which I see we can get out of this railway siding.
Helpful. Great, sir. Congratulations on good set of numbers. I think sequential improvements are really something that we all are very happy to see. Thank you so much for the opportunity and all the best.
Thanks, Navin. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Mr. Shrikant from BoB Capital Markets Limited. Please go ahead.
Yes, hello. Thank you, sir, for the opportunity. I have two questions actually. Number one, if you can share the differential for premium product and normal gray cement in terms of pricing and EBITDA.
The normal and premium, the difference at EBITDA level is about somewhere depending upon the market, on an average about INR 250.
Okay. On the pricing, sir?
Sorry?
On the pricing front, what is the differential in terms of EBITDA, H2 2023?
Sir, in different market, different gap, right from INR 20 to INR 25, INR 27 for bag base.
Okay, got that. Sir, my second question is, in our last conference call we had spelt out on our peak net debt to EBITDA, which is around 3x. Does the guidance remain the same right now?
Sorry, can you repeat your question?
Sir, in our last con call we had spelt out the debt to EBITDA ratio of around 3x. Does the guidance for that 3x still remains the same?
Yeah, guidance is a long-term guidance. When we do projects and future expansion or acquisition, we try to keep that within that norm. The norm and that guidance doesn't change on a quarterly basis. That remains the same.
Okay. That's true. That helps, sir. Thanks a lot.
Thank you.
Thank you. Due to time constraints, we have the last question from the line of Mr. Parth Bhavsar from Investec. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, sir. Sir, thank you for the opportunity. Sir, wanted to know what was the clinker production and cement sales at UCWL for the quarter.
UCWL clinker production in this quarter was 3.84 lakh tonnes. What was the other question?
What is the cement sales?
Cement sales total was 4.68 lakh tonnes, and clinker sale of 0.92 lakh tonnes, total sale of UCWL 5.59 lakh tonnes.
5 point?
59.
Okay, sir. Those are my questions. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. I would now like to hand over the conference to Mr. Vaibhav Agarwal for closing comments. Please go ahead, sir.
Yeah, thank you. On behalf of PhillipCapital (India) Pvt Ltd, I'd like to thank the management of JK Lakshmi Cement for the call and many thanks to partners for joining the call. Thank you very much, sir. Yes, sir, we may now conclude the call. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Agarwal, on behalf of the partner.
Thank you.
Thank you.
On behalf of PhillipCapital (India) Pvt Ltd, that concludes the conference call. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.