Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Ambuja Cements Limited Q1 FY 2027 earnings conference call hosted by Nomura. As a reminder, all participant lines will remain in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal the operator by pressing star then zero on your touch-tone telephone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I will now hand the conference over to Mr. Jashandeep Chadha from Nomura for opening remarks. Thank you. Over to you.
Thank you, everyone. Without much delay, I will transfer the call to Mr. Deepak Balwani, Head of Investor Relations. Mr. Deepak, over to you.
Thank you, Jashandeep. On behalf of Ambuja Cements, it is my pleasure to welcome all participants to our earnings call for quarter one FY 2027. Ambuja Cements is the ninth largest cement company globally, a key part of diversified Adani portfolio, the country's fastest-growing portfolio of sustainable businesses. Before we begin, I would like to remind everyone that today's discussion may contain certain forward-looking statements based on our current expectations and assumptions. These statements are subject to various risks and uncertainties and actual results may vary materially. At Ambuja, we remain committed to enhancing transparency, strengthening disclosures, and continuously elevating our capital market communication standards in line with the global best practices. We are pleased to have with us today Mr. Karan Adani, Director, Mr. Vinod Bahety, Chief Executive Officer, and Mr. Rohit Soni, Chief Financial Officer.
With that, I would now like to invite Mr. Vinod Bahety to share his perspective on the quarterly performance and the company's strategic outlook.
Thank you, Deepak. Thanks, Jashandeep. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us. We have started our financial year 2027 with a disciplined and sustainable performance, reflecting the continued execution of our strategy despite a challenging operating environment. The quarter was characterized by stable cement demand, supported by infrastructure, housing, and construction activity. While profitability across the industry remained under pressure from the higher imported fuel prices, elevated freight costs, and geopolitical developments in West Asia. Against this backdrop, Ambuja Cements delivered stronger profitability, improved operating efficiency, and continued strategic execution. Our strategy remains clear and consistent, creating sustainable value ahead of volume.
We used this as an opportunity to perform scheduled maintenance for almost 12% of our kilns, absorbing additional cost of INR 50 per metric ton this quarter while we built up clinker inventory of one month and core inventory of around three months, giving us a competitive edge in second quarter. We continue to execute against the four strategic priorities that will define the next phase of our growth. First, profitable growth. Our focus remains firmly on value creation. We continue to improve the quality of our revenue through a higher share of trade sales, increasing premiumization, discipline in pricing, market-specific commercial strategies. Trade sales share has actually improved from 74% to now 78% of our overall sales. Our premium strategy continued to gain traction, with premium products comprising 34% of our trade sales.
Cluster-wise, if I was to highlight, North continued with its leadership in terms of giving highest EBITDA in my books. We grew 2% of our trade volumes Y- on- Y in North, while we had a much sharper reduction in the lower margin non-trade volumes. Central cluster, it remained a stronger market for us with higher proportion of premium cement enabling higher EBITDA margins, and we improved our share of blended cement in this cluster. So far as West is concerned, it's well-balanced between trade and non-trade since the key markets of Mumbai, Gujarat are stronger on higher margins of non-trade volumes. We have grown positively both in terms of trade as well as non-trade in West. East is concerned, we have sustained on the trade volumes, and we maintain healthy EBITDA margins.
So far as South is concerned, we have consciously reduced our lower margin volumes while we continue to increase our channel network and focus on trade volumes as we move on the coming quarters. In all, we have a 2% negative Y-on-Y growth on the trade and a 21% negative growth on non-trade. The second on the track in terms of our four strategic priorities I would highlight is the structural cost leadership. Operational excellence continues to strengthen our competitive advantage. During the quarter, our clinker factor improved by 3%, from 67% to now 64%, while share of blended cement increased 85%. Improving both profitability and sustainability. Net operating cost reduced to INR 4,241 per metric ton, a reduction of INR 206 PMT from the previous quarter. Thus, it puts us firmly in terms of our guidance to achieve INR 4,250 per ton for this financial year.
Importantly, these gains were achieved despite the inflationary pressures. Productivity initiatives enabled us to maintain manpower costs at INR 222 PMT, while optimization of our manufacturing footprint reduced the primary lead distance by 20 km, lowering our logistics cost by another INR 10 per metric ton. Across the value chain, we continue to build structural advantages through raw material optimization, higher renewable energy utilization, better use of domestic fuel, enhanced capacity, enhanced captive coal integration, improved kiln efficiency, logistics optimization, and expanded rail infra. Our RE power capacity is now at 973 MW, up almost 500 MW over the past one year. WHRS capacity stands at 228 MW, and this has helped us to reduce our unit of power cost from INR 5.9 per kWh to almost INR 4.9. So by one rupee actually, it has come down with these improvements. This is in line with our earlier guidance.
Our cost transformation journey for this year remains firmly on track, as I mentioned earlier, supported by a series of structural efficiency initiatives. One of them, for example, reduction in the lead distance. We are expecting another 15 kM, which will deliver additional INR 30-INR 35 per ton of savings. Raw material logistics optimization through greater use of the BCFC rigs and the fly ash sorting initiatives is expected to contribute an additional INR 30 per ton. On the energy front, increased RE power consumption, backed by commissioning of additional 75 MW of the new green power capacity, along with the targeted reductions in the heat consumption, which on a conservative estimate, I consider 5 kkal from the existing levels per kg of clinker. And on the power consumption, which will come down by almost two to three units per ton of cement.
This is all expected to generate additional savings of, say, INR 50 on these initiatives and the other expenses. For example, there is a headroom of improving it by INR 10-INR 15. In all, these initiatives are expected to deliver savings of almost INR 130-INR 150 per ton, providing a strong visibility towards our cost leadership target and enhancing long-term competitiveness. It also mitigates any pressures on cost from the geopolitical tensions. I again re-emphasize all these initiatives are fundamentally reshaping our cost curve and reinforce our confidence in achieving total cost of 4,250 PMT by end of 2027. The third factor in our strategic approach is the disciplined capital allocation. Today, Ambuja has evolved into a 109 million tons of capacity integrated cement platform. Our priority is no longer simply adding the capacity, but it is converting scale into higher productivity, superior profitability and stronger returns on capital.
Our expansion program remains firmly on schedule. To highlight, trial runs have already commenced at Dahej, which is the expansion of 1.2 million tons of cement capacity. Salai Banwa in UP has already started with 2.4 million tons of capacity. Bathinda in Punjab, 1.2 million tons. And Jodhpur, which was, if you remember, we had acquired from Penna as an overall company. So this Jodhpur was under construction at that point. It has already also commissioned at 2 million tons of capacity. Kalamboli in Mumbai, basically 1 million tons of expansion. That is expected in Q2, and so is Warisaliganj in Bihar, 2.4 million tons expected in Q2. Maratha is a clinker line, which we are expecting it to commission next year.
These projects will increase our installed capacity to 119 million tons by end of this financial year. It will also help us to improve on our efficiency and overall costs. At the same time, our focus extends well beyond capacity creation. The debottlenecking, the asset reliability, the operational stabilization, and the productivity enhancement remains equally important to maximize the returns from every amount of capital invested. Fourth, in the pillar of the strategy which we are focusing is to build a future-ready enterprise. Technology and sustainability are increasingly becoming enduring competitive differentiators. Importantly, at Ambuja, sustainability is not merely an ESG commitment. It is a driver of innovation, efficiency, and long-term shareholder value creation. Let me now briefly summarize our financial performance. Revenue of INR 9,500 crore. Operating EBITDA of INR 1,589 crore. EBITDA margin, which has improved 331 basis points to now 16.7%. EBITDA per ton of INR 931.
Net cost reduced by 206 per metric ton sequentially, PAT of INR 660 crore and net worth of almost INR 72,000 crore. Looking ahead, friends, India's long-term demand fundamentals remains compelling. Infrastructure development, urbanization, industrialization, logistics investments and housing demand continues to support sustained growth in cement consumption. While near-term demand may remain influenced by monsoon and input cost volatility, our priorities remains unchanged. We remain well-positioned to outperform industry growth, expanding installed capacity to 119 million tons with the addition of 10.2 million tons, which I mentioned before. We also target approximately INR 250 per ton of additional costing, which I mentioned to INR 4,250 now by the end of further full-year of FY 2027, and continuing to improve returns through disciplined execution, premiumization, operational excellence, and digital transformation.
With industry scale leading structural cost leadership, disciplined capital allocation and technology-enabled execution and a stronger balance sheet, Ambuja Cements is uniquely positioned to create superior long-term value for all the stakeholders. I thank you again. I will now hand over the call to the moderator.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use their handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. We take the first question from the line of Navin Sahadeo from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good evening, sir. Am I audible? Hello?
Yes, Navin, you are.
Yeah. Good evening, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. Also, congratulations on the sequential improvement that we have seen in the profitability. I had two questions. One is on volumes. Now, volumes, you will appreciate that yours is the only company to have seen a, at least so far, in the listed entity space, Ambuja is the only company to have lost volumes. You explained trade, there is a decline and a much higher decline in the non-trade. This is in the quest to chase value over volume, which is now very apparent and also mentioned in the PPT.
I wanted to just understand then, is it fair then that for full-year FY 2027, if this strategy maintains, we will have a very muted kind of a volume growth because we will be focusing more on maximizing value in the backdrop of the previous quarter's guidance that we were chasing around 80 million tons or so?
Thank you, Navin. Thank you very much. This question may be also echoing from some of the other analyst fraternity. Let me explain this in more detail. First, I want to assure you all, the whole focus on the trade volume, therefore this improvement in the percentage of trade volume from 74%-78% sequentially, as you rightly said, has actually given us a good bump in the EBITDA by almost INR 206 a metric ton. From here onwards, on back of our brand equity, Ambuja, ACC with the parent brand, Adani Cement, we are riding quite well in terms of the volume growth. As we speak in the month of July, I would not shy highlighting that we are already seeing a 8% improvement on the trade volumes.
Therefore it gives me a good level of confidence to continue with our estimation and guidance of 8% growth, which we are targeting for this financial year. Therefore more the way we focus on value terms, in terms of overall revenue, it will commensurate and keep us giving that elbow advantage compared to the competition. Doesn't mean that we are not focusing on the non-trade. We are, in my comment, we have highlighted that some of the markets of West and few of, say, North, which provide a great opportunity on the non-trade, which remains our key focus area.
What we are also doing is, many of the markets in Center and East, for example, they are also moving blended cement in the non-trade, which actually becomes an advantage and therefore has helped us to improve our overall, say, share of blended cement to 85%. The track is to, one is improve the blended share of sales to the non-trade institutional segment and keep focusing on trade with the brand equity and the excitement which we see now with the channel partners, the dealers, the contractors, the retailers, and the whole positive momentum which is now coming in. This definitely abodes very well for the coming quarters and which is reflected in July also. We are quite positive towards the volume growth for the year.
We'll gain, part of this question is, whatever market share loss we have had in Q1, we'll be able to recoup that in the balance nine months. Is that a safe understanding?
Navin, I would say that market share has to be looked upon not in overall basis. For example, I would say that we have sustained and rather only improved in terms of the market share on the trade segment. So far as you may say that we have reduced our market share on the non-trade, which is a very well-calculated, thought upon, basically action plan.
Understood.
On the trade side, we have sustained and improved only.
Understood. Sir, my second question then was on the green power and as you reported that out of the 1,122 MW, 973 MW has already commissioned, which is 87%. My question was that by FY 2028, the target is to take it to 111 MW, 112 MW, which is just 13% incremental, but the share of green power is then going from 34%-60%. Two parts of the question is, what major difference will the incremental 13% do to take the overall share to 60%? If company is selling some green power because not able to utilize at the plant, does it also mean that the benefits of this green power are largely captured, the only difference being they are in revenues right now and will come to cost later? Thank you.
Very good question again, Navin, I must appreciate. I think this is a very interesting point. What we have done is we have set up the capacity and just to put some more specific numbers, 45 crore units has been sold in first quarter out of all the operating assets. Question would be, are we basically inclined towards sale or inclined towards consumption? Actually, the inclination is towards the consumption, but there are always initial teething issues, the transmission infrastructure, some of the policy initiatives, so it takes time. This quarter, which is Q2, we are expecting to consume almost 50% of this, so almost 20 crore units out of these sold units. Number one. Your question is very interesting, that 34%. Actually, if I consider the sold unit, this 34 is actually reported on a consumption basis.
I would have actually shared on an overall revenue plus consumption, then my green power share is almost 48%. The journey is then from 48% to 60%, that is quite basically enabled through the capacity which you highlighted up from 1,122 MW, for example, also the WHRS capacity which are getting set up from some 230 odd MW as of now. We are absolutely well on our plan in terms of green power to achieve 60% by FY 2028.
Thank you. I'll come back in queue. Thank you.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Manish Somaiya from Cantor Fitzgerald & Company. Please go ahead.
Good evening, everyone. I have a couple of questions. First, it's on Sanghi, Penna, Orient. When do we expect normalized utilization and EBITDA per ton levels, and how much CapEx do you think you need to spend to achieve that?
Your question is, Manish, about Orient, Penna and Sanghi, right? If I understood it correctly. Orient, for example
Yes
Orient is quite well in terms of its capacity utilization as well as margin. Therefore, for example, from prospectively here onwards, I only see an improvement in Orient with minimum of investment. Because we have 87% utilization of capacity in Orient. So far as Penna is concerned, that remains an area in terms of improving the capacity utilization. One is the investment part. Investment is lesser, but I think what we have to do, investment is more on the channel network and increasing the whole focus in terms of the trade sales, which will be the key driving factor for improving our overall, say, penetration of utilization of capacity of Penna. Sanghi is quite moving well, and Sanghi, for example, we have seen an improvement in the capacity utilization, both clinker as well as cement.
Sanghi, for example, what we are doing is now an investment of closer to, say, INR 600 odd crore, which is planned in terms of the jetty expansion. That's more for the clinker, basically utilization, which will augment and support the plant grinding units on the coast. Otherwise, Sanghi has taken up the investment. We have, for example, we are already investing into a WHRS line in Sanghi, and what we have done is also plant shutdown of one of the kilns, which is in a normal course of the investment. Nothing special. I think Penna is what, for example, requires some of the AFR investments and WHRS investments. I would peg it, the investment is less than, let us say, INR 100 crore-INR 150 crore altogether.
The more important is the whole improvement in terms of the channel development for South to enable and facilitate a margin expansion of the Penna assets. As I said, Sanghi is now doing well, and you will see every prospective quarter a better utilization and improved margins coming from Sanghi.
That's super helpful. You mentioned in the press release that you expect sequential cost pressure in fiscal second quarter. When should we expect those costs to normalize?
I would say that this cost increase is basically more about the geopolitical escalations, if at all it happens. Normalization would all depend on how that deescalates. What we are doing is, because those are beyond your control, what is in your control is how you can further optimize the cost. I gave a narrative of almost INR 150 a ton in my initial remarks, whether it is logistics, whether it is green power, whether it is basically efficiency of the heat consumption or the power consumption, and also the clinker factor, very important. Because in the industry, for example, amongst the peers, I'd probably say that Adani Cement is the one which has actually reduced the clinker factor by 3%. Every 1% clinker factor has a good savings also.
I think we are expecting almost INR 130- INR 150 a ton, basically cushion available, which we are focusing to have any kind of. We are expecting, if at all this kind of, say, geopolitical situation continues, ballpark about INR 700, for example, potential rise in the cost. I mentioned to you, I'm holding an inventory of clinker of almost a month, and I'm holding a coal inventory of almost three months. I'm very well mitigated from that perspective. On top of it, the initiatives to bring down the cost by INR 100- INR 150, which will be a good mitigation to absorb any kind of surprises from any external factors.
That's also helpful. Just lastly, if I were to look at industry demand and pricing, can you just give us a flavor for what you're seeing across some of your key regions?
Yes, Manish. In terms of our key regions, I think we are seeing a good momentum coming in terms of, say, east. East is doing well. Is west, we are seeing now where we have grown positively also both on the trade and on the B2B side. For me, the key markets remains, Manish, north, west, center, and east. All of them, for example, we are seeing a good traction, and that's how with confidence I mentioned to Navin also in terms of our estimates of guidance on the volume growth. I think there is now a stronger excitement within the channel and in terms of a demand pool what also is coming for our premium cement and our overall brand equity pool. We are seeing a good momentum across this.
On south, I have to invest on the channel network, which we will do, which we are doing with lots of focus, and you will see a good improvement on that part as well. Meanwhile, we are also putting efforts in terms of doing some further improvisation on the product with some R&D and all on certain product segment, which, for example, down the line, we will let you know how things are shaping on that. Essentially, the idea is to improve the share of blended cement, which we are. As of now, we are at 85%, and we want to further improve down the line.
Okay. Super helpful, best of luck.
Thank you, Manish.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Indrajit Agarwal from CLSA. Please go ahead.
Hi. Thank you for the opportunity. Couple of questions. Despite improvement in trade sales, our ASP increase on a sequential basis has been one of the lowest in the industry. Is it more geographical mix, or what exactly is driving this?
Yes, Raju, thank you. In terms of the growth, I think we have achieved, say, 2% sequential growth. While Y-on-Y, there's a decline. If I have to put some factors, there are different ways how you calculate the NSP. I won't go into that accounting treatment, but one should consider that also because there are incoterms. For example, some companies actually net off from certain expenditures. We actually put certain expenditures which are netting of the NSP compared to some of the other industry players who may not do it. Number one. In terms of sometimes the X works, which is in the incoterms, the commercial terms, when it increases, it impacts your NSP also. One would look at those factors, therefore, for example, the NSP gets impacted.
From here onwards, I think what we are confident is the whole brand pool and the trade segment and the premium actually is going to differentiate our price movement also. I think price is all market forces, which is well appreciated, but I would still bring the focus back to cost, which is something which is absolutely in our control, and we want to deliver most efficiently there, which will be a determining factor in our delta improvement vis-à-vis the other player. You will see the journey of NSP also will improve in line with the industry.
Sure. On that note, given that you already have substantial coal and clinker inventory versus the commentary of some of the other players of, let's say, INR 80-INR 100 kind of cost increase sequentially in 2Q. Can we assume, at least on the variable cost basis, you are unlikely to have any cost increase in 2Q?
No, I would say that we will still have some impact. I have given you the mitigation of that. For example, on a net basis, we will be well in line with the June quarter estimate and slightly better only. On a full-year, we are anyway giving a guidance of INR 4,250 a ton. While I mentioned that there will be some element of surprise coming from these geopolitical tensions and all, and we are well mitigated with the overall, say, raw material and the other factors which I have highlighted.
Sure. What would be the CapEx number for FY 2027 and FY 2028?
CapEx is overall, say, closer to INR 6,500 crores and which is well spread between the growth and the efficiency CapEx. That slide we are working on.
Sure. I have more questions. I'll come back in the queue.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Rajesh Ravi from HDFC Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, sir. Good evening. Am I audible?
Yes, Rajesh, you are.
Hi, sir. Sir, first question, I think you have partly covered that on the volume growth for full-year, when you are maintaining 8% and first quarter we have seen a sharp decline. What gives the confidence that on a total basis we would be able to deliver 8%, which would mean more than 10% growth in the remaining nine months?
Rajesh, I think, the confidence is on the overall investment which we are now putting in terms of the focus on trade, the channel, the brand, the support coming now from the whole network, and that is what we wanted. Therefore, even for the B2B, we are focusing on the key market which are high margin B2B business, and it is therefore important that we are there in terms of the new capacity also. For example, which I mentioned to you, almost 10 million tons is coming, which will come in, say, different staggered manner, but those are also going to improve the volumes. The improvement also comes when I have a source of fly ash, which I have a long-term agreement, and it comes at a very competitive costing.
The infrastructure availability which we have created, the BCFC rake which we have invested, all of this basically helps us to bring and move the material in most efficient manner and get the volume share more so on the trade side.
Great. Sir, this trade non-trade mix 75% or what we have achieved 78%. Can we expect that in subsequent quarters it would be north of 75% trade sales-
Yes.
that will be the focus?
Absolutely, Rajesh, you hit the point. It is going to be upwards of 75%.
Okay. Sir, we hear in the channel that there is a lot of talks of merging ACC Ambuja brand into an Adani Cement brand. Could you throw some light on that and what is the thought process behind that effort?
Rajesh, no such plan for the brand merger. Whatever the plan is for the company merger which we have announced.
Okay, understood. On the RMC, could you share what is the EBITDA number for the RMC segment in Q1?
Okay. In terms of the RMC EBITDA for the quarter, we are at about, say, INR 35 odd crores. Yeah.
Okay.
This will. Yeah.
Okay. No, I'm asking because the last whole of four quarters of last year, this segment reported margins of close to 14%-15%. This quarter, this has fallen down sharply to 7%. Any change in strategy?
No specific reasons, this is still a smaller segment, I would say that I can spend time on that, maybe we will discuss more. There are specific in terms of the overall, say, the raw material pricing and certain, say, financial accounting, for example, in terms of the lease accounting and all. I think here and there, for example, we can spend more time on this separately.
Sure. No issues, sir. Lastly, of the total INR 6,500 crore earmarked for this year CapEx, how much we would have spent in Q1?
I would say that we are well in terms of almost closer to 25%, which is like it balancing out for me for the year actually. 25% is there around closer to INR 1,500 crore-INR 1,600 crore, which we have invested.
Great. That's all from my end. I'll come back in queue. Thank you.
Thank you, Rajesh.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Raashi from Citigroup. Please go ahead.
Thank you. I may have missed some of the initial points. Did you mention that trade volume decline was 2% and non-trade was 21%?
Yeah, Raashi, you're right. This is Y-on-Y.
Why, given that there is so much focus on trade, why do you still witness a decline? Could you give us a regional, like regionally what was the dynamic across or why
Yeah, sorry. Raashi, basically, Y-on-Y, for example, this quarter had the seasonal most impact of all the geopolitical tensions in terms of the diesel availability, in terms of the interim issues on the packing bag availability and so and so forth. This was even part. I think when you change your gears, there are certain disruptions which happen. I think now, I mentioned to you in July, we are already seeing a 8% Y-on-Y growth. I think, I would repeat from here that how things are moving. That the recalibration which we have done.
Okay. The 8% that you mentioned was only trade, right? Non-trade would still be negative.
Yeah. Again, the whole focus of our, the discussion will be, let us say on trade. Yes, absolutely you are right. Even going with the Y-on-Y of this quarter was visible with earlier year on some of the clusters I mentioned to you, like North, we have grown 2% on West and these are high EBITDA markets. West also we have grown, say, 2%. Selectively we have grown, selectively we have de-grown. Some of them is well-calculated because of the low EBITDA margins and all, which I have mentioned now, and we are focusing absolutely on value terms. 8% for trade remains a high degree of my overall sales. It will be, I told, upwards of 75%, then you can calculate and calibrate the overall volume growth.
Understood. Just on a regional basis, like your overall volume, either overall or on the trade basis, like regionally, did you basically witness a decline across in all regions on a year-on-year basis?
You are saying about the B2B, Raashi?
I'm talking about either total or the trade. I mean total actually, on the total volume which was down 7% year-on-year.
No, in fact, we have seen a good growth. As I mentioned, like for example, even in B2B, in the West side, we have grown both in trade and the non-trade. On the North, we have grown basically and North and East we have sustained. It is selective. I mentioned that South is where, for example, we have consciously the low margin we have. We have de-grown basically, which is the highest de-grown in that cluster. Center, for example, more we have de-grown because we have moved into the blended cement as an offering and which has actually helped us to actually improve our margins. We have been selective cluster by cluster.
Got it. What was capacity utilization for you overall?
Overall, say 65%. I think so, yeah, ballpark 65% on a totality basis.
Got it. Second question is on costs. I'm just trying to understand, in this quarter, you witnessed a INR 206 decline sequentially on your costs. Where exactly is this decline showing up? Because, when I read the various heads as per your presentation, then like power and fuel costs are actually moved up sequentially. I know that there's like a whole stock change impact. If I have to look specifically, where all have you got this INR 106 saving?
If you look at, in terms of, say, raw material, so we have got the savings in fly ash, in terms of efficient sourcing of the fly ash. In terms of the power, we have seen the RE power, which has benefited. The overall, say, price per unit of the power rate has come down. These are like two primary factors. Apart from that, my clinker factor, which has come down by 3%, that has been also a good improvement of my overall, say, cost reduction. This INR 206 improvement has come from combination of efficiency, the clinker factor. Logistics, marginally, I mentioned INR 10 per ton. RE power and fly ash has also given me a good advantage. Prospectively also, they will keep giving me advantage.
Okay.
So far as also what we are doing, Raashi, is the optimization of the fixed costs, for example. You will say that it is commendable that despite the capacity utilization being lower, but still we are able to optimize my fixed costs as well, a good speed of acceleration you will see on this front as well. Various factors, I can actually give a bridge on that, but I think suffice to say, this INR 206 has many good factors to sustain further and further improve from there.
Understood. You had given at the beginning-
This INR 206, by the way, is after absorbing the INR 110 ballpark, which we believe also has hit us from the West Asia escalation. This INR 206 plus INR 110, if I have to gross it up, actually, my saving is INR 316 actually, on the cost side. I have digested that INR 110, and after that, our cost has come down by INR 206 per ton.
Understood. Okay. You were giving some numbers on waste heat recovery, renewable energy. What was the total capacity now and what will it go to? I missed that earlier on.
Now it is 228 MW. This will go further to almost 376. Almost like another 100 MW, about, say, 140 MW, which will improve from here, basically. All my new kilns, whichever it comes to, it will have WHRS. It will further add up to, as I mentioned, Sanghi and Penna and all.
Okay. RE?
RE, Navin mentioned. We are, say, 1132 MW. 1122 MW basically for the RE. We are from the current 975 odd MW. Almost closer to 150 MW there.
Okay. Thank you.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Ashish Jain from Macquarie India. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Good evening. Sir, my first question is on capacity. While you have given a roadmap for fiscal 2027, there are two parts. One is, how do we see growth or capacity in, let's say, 2028, 2029? That is one. Secondly, out of this 119, which includes some of the old capacities, especially of ACC, is there something that we plan to permanently mothball? How should we think about that?
Ashish, hi. Thanks. I will answer your second question first. In terms of the one which you mentioned about the mothballing, answer is no. In fact, we are evaluating and we are working to see how they are optimized. Therefore, that's like a temporary suspension. So far as the capacity for 2028, 2029 is concerned, I would say that now I want to just give you this confidence that by end of this year we should be hitting 119. For 2028, 2029, work in progress. Generally, we expect every year, 8 million tons-10 million tons of capacity addition, and that's how we will plan it out.
Right. No, sir, I'm not looking for numbers as of now. We will be adding something or the other, organic, I mean, in 2028, 2029 also, or given our shift to profitability.
That's true.
Yeah.
Organic only. Whatever we are discussing now is purely organic, and yeah. Anything more, Ashish?
Yeah. Sir, second, I wanted to understand the cost impact a bit better. The incremental number that we are talking about. From the breakup which you kind of alluded to, looks like the large part of the incremental savings is coming from RE. Is that the right interpretation?
Well, I think you have all the engines on fire on the cost. One is the efficiency, second is the raw material, third is the, of course, RE power also, and the fixed cost optimization. Yeah, I think all of them, for example, we have a good focus on them and there's a good visibility also because we have invested, right? When I say raw material, we have invested into the BCFC infrastructure and the fly ash, for example, when it comes to recently, like 10 days back, there was this policy from railways which actually further improvises the logistics cost when you move by BCFC. We have made those investments.
Right.
Therefore, the incremental savings are coming from those investment, whether it is RE power, whether it is in railway, so on and so forth. More importantly is the efficiencies also, which are now coming on our plants.
Okay. Great. Thank you so much.
Further to like, if you want some specific, I can share the numbers also, for example. In terms of, let us say, the efficiency factor, it is almost like INR 30 - INR 50. When it comes to the input material and logistics, it becomes almost, say, INR 50 a ton. The clinker factor itself brings another INR 50 a ton. The fixed cost, for example, optimization, will help me another INR 80 a ton. This journey, for example, from the INR 4,447 which we had reported in Q4 of FY 2026 to coming to INR 4,250 or INR 4,241 for the first quarter of 2027, I think these are broad heads in terms of specific numbers also.
Yeah.
As I said, this is after digesting the INR 110 West Asia war escalations.
Right. Yeah. Thank you so much, sir.
Thank you.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Ritesh Shah from Investec. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. Couple of questions. First one, sir, how should we look at the ICD, which has actually come through, via ACC and Orient? How should one read into that? That's the first question.
Ritesh, we are in the advanced stages of now merger. These ICDs are well within the approved limits of the shareholder and carries a coupon of 8%. Now, practically, it's like a one platform, and I think that's what the whole idea was to merge together all of this. I would say that these are all within the compliances.
Sir, I appreciate it's under compliance. It's all legit. Any specific reason of not raising debt at Ambuja level? If I have to put it the other way around, if I look at the debt maturity profile for Ambuja, we have almost like INR 22,000 crore-INR 23,000 crore, which matures in FY 2027. Should one link both the variables or how should we read into it?
The operating company, Ambuja, has no debt and so far as if you are alluding to the parent company debt, I would not be the right person to answer on that. Coming to the Ambuja level, as I mentioned, zero debt and I think we are managing our cash flow from the operating cash flows and we have a good plan to sustain on that.
Okay. Sir, would it be possible for you to reflect upon the SLAs that we have done for a few plants, how the experience has been? I understand we are also looking to expand it to logistics as well. Is this for a particular market or is it on a pan-India basis? If you can give some numbers around CapEx, OpEx, cost benefits that we already derived or what we expect out of SLAs.
Ritesh, we have begun on this. It's little early to come to you on it. I think let us mature on this. Things are quite positive and I must say that the overall vision of our chairman and supported by Karan , I think things are moving well in the direction on this.
Sure. Sir, I'll just squeeze in one more. With respect to power and fuel, sir, our stated goal for 2030 with respect to TSR is 23%. We are somewhere at 5.7%. How do we plan to achieve this roadmap? That's one. The second question, I think we have four coal blocks right now. One of it is operational. How should we look at the potential cost savings from both PSR as well as the coal blocks?
PSR, basically it is the overall utilization of the AFR, for example. That's what you are highlighting, right?
Yes, sir.
AFR, for example, I agree with you that we are on a lower side at 7%, and that is one of our key focus area, to improve this component of KPI, and you will see a good progress in coming quarters. We have highlighted to you before that our target is to achieve 25% of the AFR down the line, and right now we are little behind on that schedule, but every passing quarter you will see an improvement.
Right. Sir, is there a roadmap to go till the stated number? Because the number is quite steep?
Yes
The incremental cost savings can be huge over here.
Immediately right now, for example, in this fiscal year, we are targeting to hit almost 12%-15%. See, when it comes to AFR, it's all a combination of how much is the cost of the fuel, how much you want to save on the AFR versus the overall CCOL and blah, blah. As a rule, basically we want to maximize this, and this improves to 10%-15% in this fiscal year.
Sir, on coal blocks?
The coal cost. What it is? The coal cost.
Sir, coal blocks. I think one of the coal blocks are operational. What is the status of the other ones?
There are three coal blocks which we are focusing. The first one will be operationalized in 2 years-2.5 years time. Just to circle back on the AFR, I think needful investments have already been made, therefore, the confidence to hit 15% is high. Coal block, the first one gets operationalized in about 30 months from now.
Okay. Sir, would you like to give some numbers on tonnage savings?
I think it's too early. The investments all have a good payback, therefore, you can basically understand these are five to six years payback.
Sure. Thank you. I'll join back with you. Thanks.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Amit Murarka from Axis Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi. Good evening. Thanks for the opportunity. Would you be able to share the regional volume mix in the quarter?
In terms of the overall volume mix, that is like for overall, I am saying this for the trade and non-trade, ballpark I am going to highlight to you. Let us say, the North is almost closer to 25% for me. West is a tad higher to 30-odd%. East is also like 25-odd%. This becomes almost 80%. Then 10% is the Center and 10% is the South. Ballpark will be breakup.
Sure. Would the share of South be lower in Q1, given what you just mentioned earlier in the opening remarks?
Yes. You mean to say Q1 or Q2?
Q1. You mentioned that in South basically you have de-grown in both trade, non-trade.
Yes. Absolutely. Therefore, compared to last quarter and also last year, South my percentage is low at this time.
Got it. Seems like that is one of the reasons as well for better cost performance, right? Because we know that South is a higher clinker factor market as well as a higher cost market in that sense to service, particularly in a quarter where fuel costs are high.
That is true. That is the whole focus. Absolutely right.
Got it. Secondly, on green power. Sorry, the sales you mentioned, right? 44 crore, 45 crore units sales of power. What is the EBITDA number of that?
The sales revenue, I can say. For example, ballpark around INR 140 odd crores is the sale number for the quarter.
Right. Most of this will be EBITDA, fair to say, because these are all your own units, right?
Yes. These are all because these are all business by investments made. Absolutely right. Very much part and parcel of the business.
What I mean to say, the OpEx will not be too high for this INR 140 crore, right?
Hardly 5%. Otherwise, this is all adding to the bottom line.
Got it. Lastly, when I look at the mix of trade, non-trade, last year Q2 it was actually pretty high. It seemed that 32%, 33% was non-trade actually, and trade was a bit low at 67%. When you say that the trade is growing 7% or so in July, the non-trade is continuing to be a big decline because that would imply that the overall volumes would still be low in Q2 given that last year.
I think we are strategically handling non-trade also. It's not going to be that big decline, for example. Overall, we will be able to manage our volumes in line with the guidance which we have given.
Sure. Just lastly, if I may ask, while you mentioned the cement cost number, which is obviously different from the overall cost pattern when we calculate it. Similarly, for cement realization as well, could you provide a number just to get a like-to-like comparison? Because EBITDA is blended, right? When you report EBITDA per ton in the PPT. Similarly, if you want to just calculate what was the cement EBITDA per ton, could you give a clean realization for cement as well?
Cement EBITDA per ton for the gray cement is INR 911 per ton. Yeah. That's the number I have.
Sure.
See, I have told basically RMX and gray cement. Gray cement is INR 911.
That is the overall EBITDA, right? Which includes EBITDA for RMX.
Right. Basically.
Okay, sure. Maybe connect on this a bit later. Yeah.
Okay.
Thank you.
Sure.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Pinakin from HSBC. Please go ahead.
I have two questions. My first question is that the filing mentions that some manufacturing operations have been shut down. Can you just highlight what are the manufacturing operations, what capacity has been shut down? My second question is that there seems to be some ICDs from ACC Orient to the parent. Any particular reason for the ICDs, given that the company already has access at a group level at that cash entity at the Ambuja Group level? Thank you.
In terms of the temporary closure of the plants, basically this is temporary because we are anyways working on optimizing it. The capacities are closer to around 3.5 odd million tons of annual capacity. Number one. What was your second question?
The ICDs from the subsidiaries to the parent.
The ICDs?
From-
Sorry, can you repeat?
Yeah. See, the ICDs from, I think, ACC and Orient Cement to the parent-
Yes
What is the particular requirement for it at this point of time at the Ambuja level?
No. As part of the whole MSA commitments, because Ambuja has the higher share of the capacity and therefore Ambuja is supplying the material. This time you have seen that almost 1.6 million-2 million tons of cement has been supplied. How much? 3 million? 3 million has been supplied to ACC by Ambuja. I think this is part of the whole MSA arrangement, Pinakin, wherein the investments which have been made by Ambuja, the benefits are also being received in terms of volume by ACC, Orient, and everyone within the cement pack, and that's how the MSAs are ensuring the proper payouts also to the respective companies.
Got it. Thank you.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Prateek Kumar from Jefferies. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good evening, sir. I have three questions. Firstly, can you discuss the quarter timeline of this 3 million tons Jodhpur clinker and 4 million tons Maratha clinker?
Maratha, we are expecting to commission next year. That is what, for example, we have planned. So far as Jodhpur is concerned, we already have seen trials started. In Q2, which is in this current quarter, it will start stabilizing and supplying to my grinding units.
Next year, do you mean Maratha is next financial year, FY 2028?
Yeah. Absolutely. First quarter of next year.
Okay. The other question is on your cost again. You have done this quarter INR 4,2 40 kind of cost, a full-year INR 4,2 50 expectation. Basically incremental cost impact of inflation will be absorbed by incremental savings, your full-year cost remains same what you reported in Q1. Is that correct?
Absolutely. Well summarized by you, Prateek.
Okay. Last question. Because your PPT first time mention of fly ash sale and power sale, can we get the cumulative revenue and cost of fly ash and power sales in 1Q and 4Q to get an exact calculation of cost per ton?
Prateek, I mentioned to you that these two components basically, which are closer to INR 45 crore of unit which we have sold in RE power and fly ash, I don't have right now with me, but I can circle back to you in terms of what tons of fly ash being sold.
No, I'm looking for revenue and cost for these two line items cumulatively. I don't require separately.
On this point, let me just circle back once I have the details on this call or maybe separately.
Sure. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. Participants, in the interest of time and fairness to others, we request you to restrict to two questions per participant. We take the next question from the line of Pulkit Patni from Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead.
Sir, thank you for taking my question. I don't know if this has already been asked, but my first question is, the plants that have been suspended, any time duration for which they have been put under suspension?
Around, say, six months, basically.
Okay, we should not expect any volume throughput coming from those plants for the next six months, or it's in total six months?
Total six months, basically.
Total six months. My second question is more bookkeeping. The depreciation number is much lower in the quarter. Any specific reason, and what's the run rate that we should keep for the next few quarters?
Yeah, I will request Rohit, my CFO, to answer on this.
Sir, if I can add to here, the depreciation run rate would stay at the similar level. In the last quarter, due to the true-up entries which were taken on account of the merger of Sanghi and Penna, the depreciation was higher Q-on-Q. Otherwise, it's going to be at the similar levels at this point.
Okay. Thank you for that.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Rahul Gupta from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi. Thank you for taking my questions. Two questions. First, with data keeping, you mentioned that power revenues were around INR 140 crores in the first quarter. Can you give us the comparable number for fourth quarter?
For the fourth quarter, the question was about the power revenue? In terms of the million units, I can highlight that in the fourth quarter, which is March 2026, over here, almost 70 or close is the number for power.
This was 45 crore units this quarter, right?
No. For fourth quarter, the units would be lesser. In terms of the overall sale, this was around 24 crore units for the fourth quarter.
Versus 45 in this quarter?
Versus 45 in this quarter.
Got it. My second question is a bit towards understanding your strategy in South. You said that you cut off some of the volumes in the region. Can you please help us understand what kind of volumes were being cut off and how much of that would be from Penna and Orient? Thank you.
We actually curtailed the low and negative EBITDA volumes, and this is almost closer to 1 million, for example, which we actually reduced.
Is it fair to say that some of these volumes not come back?
Sorry?
Is it fair to say that some of these volumes, of this 1 million tonne, would stay the way they are, or is there any strategy to improve?
No, I think the strategy is to improve on the cost so that they become viable and sustainable and the margins expand on them. That's the way which we are working right now.
Can you please help us understand what you are doing to help improve their profitability to the current level?
Precisely, in terms of the overall, say, improving on the cost for those specific plants which are serving those markets. Right from the green power to alternate fuel to WHRS to basically bringing the fly ash at the most optimum cost, the overall raw material mix, the fuel mix. These are precisely the treatment and the efficiency factors for those. The overall blend of cement, which has to improve and for the clinker factor to come down. These are all basic, important treatment which has to go to those plants.
The reason I'm asking this question is I'm just trying to understand the 1 million tonne volume that has been lost, how soon can we expect this to come back?
No, rather, see, I'm not so concerned about the 1 million which has been lost. I'm more concerned on how I move that 1 million into trade segment, number one. Anyways, the work in progress is there, and out of 1 million, we will be able to capture a good volume. More importantly is how can I move into the trade segment.
Yeah, how soon can we-
We have an opportunity because our market share, for example, will give us the opportunity to move into the trade segment. That happens. I say that I have to invest on the channel. I will have to build up that, in specially, say, markets like South. For example, it will take one or two quarters more, the ramp-up, otherwise on the other clusters, the other four clusters which I mentioned is moving very well. The brand pull, the brand equity, the channel is excited. I think that is helping us, and South is also now starting to pick up in terms of my trade sales.
Got it. Thank you so much.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Rajesh Ravi from HDFC Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, sir. I was just comparing your NSP with UltraTech's reported NSP for like-to-like comparison. I see barring Q1, the preceding eight quarters from Ambuja delivered better NSPs compared to UltraTech. This quarter, almost INR 50 higher on an average versus this quarter, we are down INR 100 versus UltraTech's reported NSP. Given that we have almost similar market mix, why should there be such a sharp fall in our number versus UltraTech when the focus was more on trade sales and pre-cementization versus UltraTech, which is aggressive both in trade as well as in non-trade.
I think I mentioned to you, Rajesh, that we have seen a disruption in the June quarter coming from multiple factors which are beyond control. Therefore, for example, this was one quarter which has seen this aberration. The idea is to also basically how to get this whole channel growth and all, and you spend investment on that. I'm not sure accounting-wise which company does what. We actually, in our NSP, we treat that accounting-wise also, and reduce the NSP from all those costs. For example, this time we are investing into channels.
Understood. Sir, just to clarify on that, power revenues which you have sold, the green power. You sold around INR 140 odd crore realized in Q1 and around INR 70 crore in Q4, which you netted off in your power cost. Incrementally, your plan is that you will be consuming those captive green power within your cement companies, and hence, if I have to look at that cost per ton, that could be on a sustainable basis. That is a benefit which will directly accrue, right?
Absolutely, Rajesh. In fact, that's what I mentioned that from INR 40 crore-
Correct
I'm expecting 50% of that will be consumed this quarter. Every quarter with our capacities moving up, this will be consuming it. Yes.
Okay. All these solar power plants which-
The benefit will be more basically because my savings on cost is better than my realization by selling in the market.
Correct. Agree, sir. Incrementally, are your solar power plants, how much more they can ramp up? I want to understand this opportunity of selling INR 140 crore in Q1. Even when you ramp it up for your captive consumption, would you still be left with surplus over next three to four quarters, whereby you can sell and realize some incremental gain resulting in lower cost for the cement business?
I think, first priority will be for the own consumption, and there will be some left out basically capacity, which will be sold efficiently. We will keep balancing on it.
Understood.
Let us say that, at any stage, not more than 10% will be used for selling and rest we will be actually consuming for our own requirement.
Understood, sir. Lastly, this fly ash sale was an opportunistic sale where you had surplus and you sold it off in the market? What should we understand of that?
Sorry, Rajesh. If you can circulate that.
The fly ash sale, which you said that you have realized some fly ash sales in Q1. Was it some inventory liquidation, surplus inventory liquidation which you did?
No.
Or this is-
No, Rajesh. We have now entered into a long-term agreement, basically for the fly ash. Wherever, for example, we are consuming it, and we are actually consuming almost 30%, and wherever we have an opportunity to sell, we are also selling in the market.
Understood
selling or dumping into the dikes and all, we are actually selling it.
Understood. You're gaining some, fair to understand that you'll be making some profit out of that sale versus your own long-term purchase price?
Absolutely. Effectively it actually brings down my overall effective cost of fly ash.
Great. That's nice to hear. Thank you. That's all from my end.
Thank you. Participants, a reminder, we request you to restrict to two questions per participant and rejoin the question queue. We take the next question from the line of Siddharth Malhotra from Kotak Securities. Please go ahead.
Thanks for the opportunity. Sir, just wanted to check, given that you've temporarily suspended manufacturing at these facilities. Sir, can we gain some color as to which facilities are they? Are they the acquired facilities? Are those old ACC facilities? Which facilities are we exactly talking about?
Siddharth, your voice was very feeble, but what I hear is that the mothballing facilities, you're asking a question is about that, basically?
Yes. Which facilities are those?
These are like the very old facilities of ACC, some of them, and one facility also of an acquired company.
Okay.
Just, Siddharth, as I mentioned to you that these are actually a temporary closing because we are looking to see improvement in terms of the overall treatment, what we do on cost and efficiency. Before that, I mentioned that about say 6 months time horizon, which I'm expecting. Yeah, so this will actually help us to optimize it. It doesn't mean that we are losing on the market because we have alternate supplying plants which we are catering to.
Okay, sir. Sir, we've highlighted that we have around INR 24 crores of termination-related exceptional items and no impairments for this quarter. Can you give us some color as to what sort of further impairments are we looking at maybe two quarters down the line?
No, this is not to do with impairment. This is like a normal VRS scheme which has been implemented in one of our plants in South India. This is more about bringing more efficiency in the operations. Nothing to do with the impairment.
Right now we don't really expect any impairments to happen on this account, right?
No.
Got it, sir. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Jyoti Gupta from Ashika Group. Please go ahead.
Good evening, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. Just wanted to know, every year we have increased our market share by 2%. Now, of course, a demand decline in your volumes. What kind of market share gain do we expect given if you're growing at 8% in FY 2027 and then FY 2028? Second is, we have seen cost measures. The Adani has acquired ACC Ambuja in 2022. I would like to see when are we going to really see the actual cost measures feeding into the EBITDA per ton to let's say 1,200 and then 1,500 of that big number that we've always heard of. When do we see the trajectory, Ambuja actually on that trajectory of gaining that kind of numbers?
Okay. Jyoti, thank you. I think both are important questions. First is on the cost journey. I still remember when we acquired, that was way back in September 2022, and the journey from there, for example, cost was almost INR 4,700-INR 4,800 a ton. Rather actually, INR 5,000. My team tells me INR 5,000. We have now come to say INR 4,244 a ton and with a high element of confidence, we are giving guidance for INR 4,250 a ton for the FY 2027, number one. The way we have worked upon is the next year also, we want to bring another INR 250 reduction in the cost, so that by end of FY 2028, we reach up to INR 4,000 or below in terms of cost per metric ton.
Now, that's an INR 1,000, for example, reduction from INR 5,000 to the journey which we are right now navigating. Your second question is about the EBITDA. I would rather restrict myself to cost. EBITDA is a multiple factor of basically price and cost, and that is something which is beyond your control. The cost journey is what, for example, my request to all of you, and therefore we are giving our guidance on that. So far as the market share is concerned, Jyoti, I think, I can only highlight what is my growth. Market share is again dynamic that depending on how others are growing. I can highlight that we will be growing. When I'm adding almost 10 million to capacity, say, every year.
From a capacity additions perspective, we are growing almost, say, 8%-10%, that is what, for example, we would be targeting to grow in terms of our growth plan on the trade side, especially.
Okay. Thank you, sir.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Bharat C. Shah from BCS Capital Ideas Private Limited. Please go ahead.
Yeah. The first question in retrospect, if we think about all the acquisitions that we made, whether Penna, Sanghi, et cetera. Now that we have a better chance of assessing what we have done and what we have got, do we think we have acquired more of an asset or more of a liability in that?
Bharat, thank you for this alerting question. We have actually bought assets only, and these assets will actually start giving the results.
Yeah.
I think, let's be assured these are assets.
Okay. I had a second and last question. It's not about numbers or any micro data, but about people and the talent pool. What exactly is being done to tone up the organizational talent pool in general and senior management in particular? Cement is a traditional business. It's not a business of some grand strategy, but of terrific detailed execution. Therefore, people with eye for detail, fire in the belly, treating every element of the cost, every element which will optimize advantage in the marketplace, which will gain that incremental volume and implement the strategy at the ground level in a very efficient, deterministic way and using technology in an apt way. What exactly we have done so far to tone up the talent pool and more steps which are on the way to make that happen?
Bharat, so nice. I think you are the first one to actually put this perspective. I really appreciate this because these are the two Ts which you mentioned, the talent and technology. In the group also in cement business, these are highly focused upon as of now. You will see benefits of this. We are building up a young team, a very enthusiast and energetic team who are raring to and willing to take up the larger responsibilities, who have been groomed with substantial L&D programs. The group has a very methodical structure on this, basically. As you rightly said, in cement, we always say, "You take care of the pennies, the pounds will take care of themselves." I think that is the beauty of cement in terms of the operating leverage. We have our eyes on that.
Are we on the tracking term? Are we satisfied as to what we have done so far? Are there major initiatives in place going ahead?
Bharat, there is always a scope of improvement and more so, like in the last investors call also we highlighted there are few delays which have happened in terms of our certain efficiency CapEx and all, in terms of giving the outcomes. I think better late than never. A good thing is now in June we have already given the savings of INR 206 a ton. Every, for example, passing quarter, I will keep improving and there is going to be still a scope of improvement. I think that's a learning curve and opportunity for us in my business.
Sure. We'll take you on that.
Thank you, Bharat.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Kunal Shah from DAM Capital Advisors. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, sir. You mentioned upon a point in terms of the realization and the excise sort of impacting it. That sort of should be reflected in lower freight as well, right? Sir, our lead distance has gone down from 269 km to 249 km on a YoY basis, but yet the freight per ton is stable. If you could just help here with some insights.
Kunal, there was this disruption of the diesel shortages, and more so like in some of the plants in western side and all, which hampered the distribution and therefore escalation of costs. We have also seen some disruptions which have happened in east. Therefore, that is one factor which has resulted in. Then there was the green sales which have come, the AGP, for example, in Himachal. There are some of these factors which are beyond control, which have kept the logistics costs higher. I think I mentioned that is one area for us to. With the tech platform on logistics, there's a good opportunity for us, which we are working on. We will come with more details on this. Point very well taken. This is an area which we want to improve.
Understood. Secondly, sir, just to understand our strategy. From here on, what would be the desired utilization levels or a range on the expanded base of 119 million tons for us to start the next leg of CapEx? When do we actually think about the next leg now? Just a follow-up to that, are there any regions in our current footprint wherein the utilizations would be tight and we might need to initiate CapEx there despite relatively lower utilization at company level?
Kunal. Absolutely good, thank you. I think our targeted utilization now that our focus on value and all. In that background, I'm saying around 70%-75%. This is all value-focused capacity utilization. Point number one. Point number two, in terms of the expansion requirement, we have done that in north. I've expanded Bathinda. I've also expanded the Marwar Mundwa, and we also have now Penna Jodhpur. I have almost like one plus 2.4, 3.4, plus another two. Almost 5.5 million tons of additional cement capacity, which has come in north. That was, as I mentioned, one of the most profitable markets that we have. Likewise, in west also, we are in fairly advanced stages to expand our Kalamboli, that BCCL Kalamboli, which is an important asset that we have.
We are putting up additional, this will give me additional 1 million tons of capacity, for example. We are also expanding a few other locations like Bihar, for example. I mentioned east and center also are doing very well. Salai Banwa and Warisaliganj. Salai Banwa is already, the trials are through, and Warisaliganj will come in second quarter, most likely in September. Wherever this need is there, we already have proactively worked on that, and the capacities are therefore going to help me to sustain the volumes which I mentioned. There was this previous question that how are we confident, and this is where the confidence comes, because now I already have almost 10 million tons of capacity, which will be coming in the market on the commercial production sense.
Understood. Just one last, if I could squeeze in. There's this clinker line at Maratha, the earlier timelines were 2Q, 3Q of this year, which moved to FY 2027, now we are talking of FY 2028. Any reasons there why the delay? Are there any structural issues? If you could just tell there.
No structural issues. In fact, no structural per se issue because I have a good level of overall balancing of my utilization of the facilities because Maratha would have served the Maharashtra market and I have clinker coming from Sanghi also, which is, for example, now going very well. In fact, in Sanghi, I'm utilizing almost 60%-65% clinker capacity utilization, which will actually go up to a larger capacity utilization. I think we are trying to now balance it well. We don't want to rush and then unnecessarily have a capacity while we already have capacity which can be augmented well with the marine infrastructure which we have in Sanghi. Per se, things are absolutely under control. Last call, we have highlighted one payment issue which we had faced with one of this contractor partner. I think that is also now under control.
You will see now closing of many of these projects which are in the hands.
Understood. This is very helpful, sir. All the very best.
Thank you, Kunal .
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Bhavin Chheda from ENAM Holdings. Please go ahead.
Good evening, sir. Congratulations on overall improving on the cost and the efficiency on the quarter-on-quarter basis, and we are on the right path towards that. Couple of questions, sir. Basically on this fly ash and power sales which are shown in the presentation. This fly ash sales which has happened, has this been reduced from the raw material cost itself? Has the raw material cost per ton looks to be lower both on quarter-on-quarter and YoY basis? I'm saying on the absolute numbers of raw material cost. Hello?
Sorry, can you please put your question again? Some voice has been feeble. Sorry. Can you repeat?
My question was, you have fly ash sales in the quarter since you have long-term contract and you sold as shown in the presentation. The absolute number of sales of fly ash which has happened, has that been reduced from the raw material cost itself in the absolute numbers of INR 15 crores-INR 86 crores in the consolidated basis?
There are two factors, Bhavin. One is the actual consumption basis. Basically, fly ash costing has come down, and further on top of it, the overall sale also gives me advantage further. This is like on both the sides, we have seen the improvement. The same is the case so far as the power is concerned.
Both the sales which has happened has been accounted in the top line. My question was that basically.
That is part of the other operating income.
Other operating income. Okay. Sir, you guided that the plants which are mothballed will be restart in, say, 3 months- 4 months time. This assumption is dependent on, because obviously for your 7%-8% volume growth, you're obviously looking at 12%-13% volume growth for the remaining part of the year. When the second half demand would be much stronger, is that when you want to restart those plants? Because you still have enough capacity in the remaining plants to service the market. How the restart of the plants would be dependent upon?
Bhavin, thank you. I think let me first again, request and put you all, mothballing may not be the right word. What we are doing or we have done is a temporary basically closing of this so that we do a thorough plan of optimization and then look forward to restart. Your question is what are those initiatives to optimize the cost, correct?
Correct.
I think right from the overall, say, efficiency factors to the investments required in terms of the overall, say, costs, whether it is WHRS or AFR, whether it requires any kind of debottlenecking, what is the railway infrastructure requirement, what is the availability of fly ash, what kind of, say, coal can we consume, can we actually put some technical efficiency in terms of heat factors. I think cement is that way well understood by all of you. These are very important factors which we will be going through it. Of course, we have the alternate plants. We don't want to lose any asset if we are able to turn it around, and that is the whole endeavor and efforts to see how best we can turn them around.
Great, sir. Best of luck. Thank you.
Thank you, Bhavin.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Navin Sahadeo from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Thank you. Thank you for the follow-up opportunity. Sir, my question was about the other expenses. I was just looking at your annual report. Last two years, I see some of these expenses have seen a sharp jump year-on-year, particularly your stores and spares cost or even the advertising and sales promotion cost or repairs and maintenance cost also for that matter. How should one look at these major cost items, which largely form part of other expenses in FY 2027?
Navin, when you have acquired assets, I mean, like in which we have actually acquired four companies, obviously there has been this other expenses would, depending on the intensity of requirement of the investments on these core stores and spares to the likes of Penna, Sanghi and other assets, for example. Therefore like apple-to-apple, we'll look at it. But now we are stabilizing well and, therefore, for example, prospectively and therefore this one cement platform which is anyways like this financial year, we are hoping that we will be able to close it. It now, for example, with all the organic growth, it brings a level of, say, stability and no per se any surprises which otherwise would get when you acquire the assets and all.
Understood. Sir, just a clarification again. On the green power cost, you said we sold about 45 crore units in this particular quarter. If I do a simple arithmetic as per your power and fuel cost, certain reported, I broadly understand the cost of these units sold was roughly INR 3.3 a unit. Correct me if I'm wrong.
You're right.
Yeah. Broadly, I just want to understand at what price they are currently sold, because in next quarter, I just wanted to understand that when they actually starts getting consumed, then it will displace or offset what cost of power so as to broadly understand the delta gains that will accrue incrementally at the EBITDA level. That will be my question. Thank you.
Very good point, Navin. My blend of power, if I look at the overall grid power, that comes almost at INR 7- INR 8 a unit. That is the first opportunity for us to basically replace with this green power, and hence you know the math, for example. I think I mentioned in my previous question also, I mentioned that it is always beneficial for me to consume the power first, and only for any reason surplus, we will want to sell it. Otherwise, the opportunity is far better to consume on account of cost element.
Very helpful. Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Girija Ray from Nirmal Bang Securities. Please go ahead.
Thank you. All of my questions have been answered and all the best.
Thank you, Girija.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Kamlesh from Lotus Asset Managers. Please go ahead.
Thanks for the opportunity, sir. If I just calibrate or look at your, let's say, write-downs, which we took for the impairment. If I see in particularly in ACC, Chaibasa, Bargarh, then Wadi and even say Lakheri, roughly around 6.5 million tons of capacity, which I presume had been on the suspension for a temporary purpose. Even, let's say, if we take one plant in acquired entity, that also had been suspended. What is the learning going forward if we take a look at any inorganic opportunity which comes into play? This is a mammoth capacity which has been suspended. Just wanted to have a thought on that, sir.
I think, Kamlesh, when you acquired ACC and Ambuja, obviously, the whole world knew that ACC has these old assets, and at some stage, there will be a situation of improving and upgrading them. We have been highlighting about this during the investor call also. I think learnings are enormous whenever you operate business, and the learnings in terms of the organic and inorganic, both expansions are immense. As I said, every prospective quarters, despite level of improvement, we will keep further upgrading and improving. That is one part. Second is about the overall, say, what you said about the asset, any impact on the asset per se. Because I mentioned to you that they're all temporary suspension. We are working on that. Unless and until we decide to permanently close, which we have not yet, we are still evaluating.
That point of time, for example, any treatment on the books, we will do that.
Sir, the way, let's say, even if we in the past, we have seen some companies having preference over value over volume, and that has played in their, let's say, margins getting improved or the realization getting improved. Our case, if we see the NSP, it has improved hardly 1% quarter-on-quarter, and despite the fact that we have cut down so much of volumes. Honestly, that has not realized in form of high realizations. On the cost front, like I say, no doubt, we have sold the renewable power. That also doesn't give a proper picture on how the cost has come down.
Kamlesh, in absolute terms, also, the cost has come down, and on top of it, the sale has further complemented. If you look at, and you can do a very quick math also, whatever the numbers you have highlighted. In both absolute terms and on top of it, the sale, which is complementing. Second, your first question is about the NSP precisely, for example, when the NSP of those particular clusters were not supporting and the costs were not supporting that we decided to suspend those plants temporarily, and then basically put the whole focus on the cost because NSP is beyond your control and my control. That is what we are doing as a treatment to see the revival of those plants in a most optimized manner.
Lastly, sir, on post Q3, we had done the call and on the maintenance cost, we had highlighted that now the maintenance cost would be portioned over the four quarters. In your opening remarks, you have said that your maintenance cost is higher by INR 50 in this particular quarter. Since we are now going for that accounting equalized manner, how come our maintenance cost is higher by INR 50 in this particular quarter?
No, good point, Kamlesh. I think we are still engaging with our auditors on this point because from the accounting standard perspective, they are deliberating on this point that how we basically equalize over the four quarters. Until that time happens, we have continued with the reporting on the actual basis on the O&M cost. That's also my follow-up with the auditors also. Otherwise, in the industry, people have been following on the actual basis. We only thought we'll actually amortize over four quarters subject to the accounting standard, which they will let us know.
Great, sir. Thanks a lot and best of luck.
Thank you. All the best.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Shravan Shah from Dolat Capital. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Thank you, sir. I thought I will not be getting an opportunity to ask the questions. Just a couple of things, sir. First, sir, in WHRS, when we are saying 228 MW will increase to 376 MW in FY 2028 from now, which is at 148 MW. Would you help in terms of how much clinker capacity are we adding, so where this significant WHRS will come up?
It's a combination of both the existing kiln lines and the new kiln lines, basically. In terms of the clinker, new capacities coming up, say Assam, we have announced, and then Mundra, for example. Then Maratha is expanding, and so is the Penna, Jodhpur, which has come up now. Then Bhatapara, we have already expanded, for example. On top of it, some of the acquired assets of Sanghi and Penna, for example, they will also be having these investments on the WHRS. Overall, basically, this will complement and improve the capacity of WHRS.
Okay. Sir, correct me if I'm wrong. We said that from FY 2028 onwards, we will be adding 8 million ton-10 million ton capacity every year. This year definitely we'll reach to 119, and then one can look at 8 million ton-10 million ton every year capacity addition.
That is true, Shravan. On the cement capacity, absolutely you're right. That's the plan which we are working on.
Okay. Similarly for FY 2028, the similar INR 6,000 crore-INR 7,000 crore kind of a CapEx, one can factor in?
Yes. On a run rate, yes.
Yeah. Sir, still many people have asked on the costing front because everybody wants to understand the cost reduction, the INR 4,241 number of cement cost. Still not able to figure it out, particularly because of maybe the fly ash, even for RE if we take. If you can break it up, this, the entire cost of, let's say, the reported INR 7,911 crore consolidated cost for this quarter. If I go by this number, INR 4,241, multiply into the units or the volume that we sold, 70 million, which comes INR 7,238. The RMC cost is obviously INR 33 crore is the paid, the cost is there. Still a gap is there, and similarly for the Q4. If you can help us in terms of reconcile how the cost per ton comes.
Shravan, maybe I will repeat basically. Our cost, which was reported at almost INR 4,500, say in March, and where we have now come down to say almost INR 40-INR 41. Some of the components of this cost I have highlighted. The overall, say, clinker factor, which has improved by 3%, which gives me savings of almost INR 15 a ton. The fixed cost optimization
Sir, that we got. What I was trying to understand in terms of if I have to break it down, this entire reported cost of INR 7,911 crore into cement, into RMC, into RE power and into fly ash. If that is available, would be helpful to understand how for Q4 and for Q1. It would be more easy or convenient to understand how the cost reduction has happened.
I think the detail which you require, maybe then offline we can connect, or I don't have it right now in terms of breaking between cement, RMC and all in totality. Definitely we will circle back offline.
Okay. Thank you. Thank you, and all the best, sir.
Thank you.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Satyadeep Jain from Ambit Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi. Thank you. Karan, just first want to understand on the trade, non-trade. Historically, when we saw Ambuja before the acquisition, it was mainly trade-focused organization. It seemed like in the last two, three years, there was a thought of moving more volumes to non-trade. Now going back to trade? Looking at 65% utilization on the outside, logically, it would seem like an 85%, 90% utilization, you can still make a decision between trade and non-trade. Why leave extra volumes on the table when you can maximize EBITDA and return? Why at 65% utilization do you want to give up the non-trade?
Let me give some flavors. I think originally, yes, Ambuja ACC was heavy on trade, and non-trade was a small part of it. I think as we look at last year as well as our performance in the last, I would say, last year.
Especially on the acquired assets, what we have seen is the performance had dipped because we have increased our non-trade volumes over there, and most of the volume was happening at a negative EBITDA or a marginal EBITDA. That was actually dragging the overall performance of the company down. Even when we look at today the performance, we feel that having a sustainable performance matters more than anything, and the variable cost of producing the cement at a lower EBITDA or at a marginal EBITDA, generally doesn't make sense because at the end of the day, our fixed cost is smaller compared to your variable cost. That's where we feel that even with a lower capacity utilization, you're not leaving value on the table. Yes, you might be leaving the volume, but you're not leaving value on the table. That's where we are focused on.
The idea is, as you become more cost competitive, automatically those volumes will come back onto the table. Because at the end of the day, we are looking at EBITDA and not looking at permanent loss of volume over here.
Just to clarify, these volumes are largely for the acquired assets. Ambuja and ACC did not shift to a meaningful degree of non-trade and now moving back to trade. This is largely at the acquisition level. Is that a fair statement?
Yes, that's right.
Secondly, on the cost, just trying to understand the rationale, and sorry if I missed it, of selling RE power outside and fly ash it seems is some CPPs, because anyway, you have a long-term agreement with Adani Power. The rationale for selling it outside through power purchase and not using it internally, can you clarify?
Yeah. Let me clarify where both on the RE as well as on the fly ash. The ultimate goal is to consume everything in-house. It is a transition phase because as a lot of our systems come online, for example, in RE, a few of our plants we need to connect to the central grid. They don't have the connectivity to the central grid, which programs are under execution. Even on the fly ash, as our DCFC projects come online with the capacity coming in, we do believe that all of this will be consumed internally. There will be a 10% or 15% volume both on the fly ash as well as on the renewable, where there will be a mismatch between in-house consumption and production, which we will look at optimizing from a sales perspective. The ultimate objective is to consume 100% in-house.
This is a sort of a transition phase where we will move in the next three quarters to 100% consumption.
This is 1 GW in Khavda, where you're saying the ISTS connectivity is not there. How -
Yeah. Khavda is connected. Some of our cement plants are not connected. That is where the-
Okay
programs are going on. The connectivity to the power plant is not an issue.
Just to also add to that, 700 MW is Khavda, 300 MW is Rajasthan. This 1 GW is in this breakup.
Okay. Right now you're selling on the exchange. Is that a fair statement? This one is 700 MW and 300 MW.
Not everything. A large part of it is consumed in-house, and the balance is sold.
Okay. Thank you so much.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Rajesh Toshniwal from Varnmala Office. Please go ahead.
Thank you for the opportunity. Just had a small concern. The asset of Orient Cement has delivered quite impressive results after acquisition by our company. The valuation at the time of acquisition of this asset and the valuation being offered at the time of merger, do you think, sir, that this is too low in comparison to the acquisition price of around INR 8,000 crore? If at all it has come down to INR 3,000 crore, INR 4,000 crore as per the merger valuation, how do we reflect this loss on acquisition in the books of Ambuja?
Rajesh, I think you are looking at the standalone numbers of Orient and then giving this remark. I think, always there's an element of MSA between Orient and Ambuja. Therefore, when I look at in totality, Orient assets are delivering us decent margins and justifies the valuation. When you look it on a standalone, therefore you will find that given the MSA treatment. My request is, we will have to factor those MSA treatments and then look at it.
I see. I was just trying to come to some explanation for the wide divergence between the acquisition price.
The implied price derived by the merger ratio. I just thought that maybe some color can be thrown by the management just to reconcile that difference. That was all.
Okay. I think on that part, it is all about the valuations by the independent valuers, and followed with the guidelines of pricing of study guidelines and all. I think during the approvals also, those were discussed in detail. My request is, if you can refer to those discussions, so that would be sufficient. On this call, maybe on the operations part, I can address.
Fine, sir. Thanks for clarifying whatever could be done. Thank you.
Yes.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Rajesh Ravi from HDFC Securities. Please go ahead.
I think most of the questions have already got answered. Just one on the clinker capacity addition. This financial year, we are not commissioning any clinker unit, and the Maratha would get commissioned next year, and the Mundra project would also be operational mostly in FY 2028. Is this understanding correct?
Rajesh, my Penna assets in Jodhpur.
Right
the 3 million tonne of clinker has already started trial production.
Right.
Yeah, this is one development. I think, just to also highlight, we are well balanced on all my requirements of cement with the clinker available.
Right, sir. For commercial depreciation and all purpose, the Penna clinker unit in Jodhpur, that was commissioned in March quarter, or that will be considered to be operational or commissioned in FY 2027?
It will be considered in September quarter, because trials have started.
Oh, okay. Understood. Okay. This Mundra project is also expected to be on stream for next year?
Mundra is expected about 18 months-24 months from here.
Oh, okay
2029 basically.
Okay. Not in FY 2028. Understood. Next year we only have the Maratha project which would get commissioned on the clinker side.
We have that and already we have commissioned our Bhatapara line, for example. We have Penna-
Right. Correct.
over here.
Yes.
We have adequate clinker because market- to- market, we will be able to move on our cement.
Understood. Yes. That's all from my end. Thank you, sir.
Thank you. We take the next question from the line of Abishek from Axis Capital. Please go ahead.
Yes. This is Amit here from Axis. Just to clarify, the INR 206 QoQ per ton reduction in cement cost that you highlighted, in that calculation, is this power sale being netted off over that 45 crore units?
Yes, it is netted off. It is very much part and parcel of my overall, say, OpEx only. This is netted off.
Got it. Even the fly ash sale is netted off in that calculation?
Yeah. Absolutely.
Sure. By when are you expecting these cement plants to get connected to the power grid in order to receive the green power?
In about, say, two to three quarters in a phase-wise manner progressively. Yes.
Sure. Got it. Just lastly, when you say that there are some plants which are shut and you'll be kind of upgrading or making these plants more efficient before you bring them online. Again, just to clarify, these are mostly plants in South India, or these are plants also in other regions of the country?
No, these are like mix and match, basically, Amit. There are few plants which are there in central, eastern side basically, and one of them in, say, north and one of them in south. We are evaluating them.
Sure. Okay. Got it. Thank you. That's it.
Thank you, Amit.
Thank you.
Thank you.
We take the next question from the line of Eshaan from Aakash Emprise. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, sir. My question is regarding on the gross margin. How much gross margins can the company expect in the next few quarters this financial year around?
I think, margins, again, in the prior call, I've highlighted that right now we will give you guidance on the cost, which is like INR 4,250 . Margin is a factor of combination of NSP and cost. That leg of NSP, for example, I would say that it is still market forces driven. I think we will sustain on our margins, but we'll improve on our cost.
Okay. Got it. In terms of volume growth guidance of 8%, this will be just for trade scheme and not for non-trade, right?
The focus right now remains very much on trade. We'll separately come on non-trade also. Yes, the 75+% bucket will be on the trade side, which we are seeing a good, healthy growth now.
Okay. Got it. Understood. That's it from my side.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we take the last question from the line of Rahul Gupta from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.
Hi. Thank you for taking my question again. Just want to understand what would be the fly ash sales during the quarter. My math suggests that it was more like INR 50 crore in the fourth quarter. Can you give us comparable numbers in the first quarter as well?
The first quarter sale is about INR 25 crore-INR 30 crore. Let me just confirm it. Can you just give me a minute? I have the details with me. Just a second. Rahul, it is INR 15 crore for the first quarter, and you're right, around INR 50 crore for the second quarter.
Thank you. Is it fair to say that just like power sales, almost entirely it flows through the profitability, right?
Yes. Net of the expenditure around that.
Okay. Thank you so much. Wish you all the best.
Thank you.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, with that, we conclude the question-and-answer session. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Deepak Balwani, Head of Investor Relations for closing comments.
Thank you everyone for your time and engagement today. We appreciate your continued interest in Ambuja. If there are any follow-up questions, please do not hesitate to reach out to me directly. We look forward to stay connected. Thank you.
Thank you. On behalf of Ambuja Cements and Nomura, that concludes this conference call. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your line.