Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Transformers and Rectifiers (India) Limited Q4 and FY 2026 conference call hosted by Nuvama Wealth Management Limited. This conference call may contain forward-looking statements about the company, which are based on the beliefs, opinions, and expectations of the company as of the date of this call. These statements are not guarantees of future performance and involve risks and uncertainties that are difficult to predict. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Vikram Datwani from Nuvama Wealth Management Limited. Thank you, and over to you.
Thank you. Good evening, everyone. On behalf of Nuvama Institutional Equities, I welcome you all to the Q4 FY 2026 results conference call for Transformers and Rectifiers (India) Limited. We are joined today by Mr. Satyam Mamtora, Managing Director and CEO, and Mr. Mehul Shah, CFO. I would now like to hand over the call to the management for the opening remarks. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. I am Satyam Mamtora, Managing Director and CEO of Transformers and Rectifiers (India) Limited. Thank you for joining us today for our FY 2026 earnings call. We are pleased to connect with you as we close another year with a remarkable performance in terms of all key parameters, and happy to share our performance highlights both for Q4 and full year. As you are aware that our board of directors has approved the audited financial results for the quarter and year ended 31/3/2026, and the same has been uploaded on our websites of stock exchanges along with investors' presentation. The financial year 2025 and 2026 has further strengthened T&R's position as a leader in transformer industry as the company achieved robust operational and financial performance through operational efficiency, process excellence, effective financial management, strategic growth initiatives and technological developments, and strong corporate governance.
This has resulted into second successive year of giving record-breaking revenue and profitability numbers. We have achieved highest ever production in the company's history, manufacturing 33,763 MVA, up from 229,108 MVA in FY 2026. This has directly translated into record high revenue growth, supported by strong execution and a healthy diversified order book. This year we have been intentionally selective in taking new orders, as now the company has decided to take orders which are more lucrative in terms of profitability, payment terms, and flexibility in delivery times. We deliberately moderated fresh order intake during the year to align with extended delivery schedules and capacity planning. In spite of that, our total order inflow FY 2026 stood at INR 2,374 crores.
This robust inflow has resulted in an executed order book of INR 5,000+ crores as of March 31st, 2026, ensuring clear revenue visibility for the next 18 months. During the year, the company has received HVDC transformer repair order from PGCIL, which makes T&R the first Indian company to get an order of such nature. We are highly energized by this order as it will pave the way forward for T&R's entry into HVDC sector upon successful completion of this order. Such types of orders strengthen the company's position as industry leader and enhances customer trust. We are pleased to inform you that all our fully automated digital facility has got approval from PGCIL. Now we have initiated the process of getting our tank manufacturing facility approval from PGCIL also.
Apart from our capacity expansion in Changodar and Moraiya, we are also ramping up our testing facility to cope up with the higher number of transformers at those plants. As you are well aware that we have tested a record number of transformers during FY 2026, both in terms of MVA in total units, underscoring our internal capabilities of streamlined operations. The backward integration journey is well on course. Site readiness is progressing well and the plant and machinery orders for the long lead items have already been placed. This backward integration along with technological tie-up with our will enhance our in-house capabilities, reduce our dependency on external services, and improve our supply chain resilience. We have already started getting CRGO from our newly acquired CRGO processing unit. All in all, backward integration journey is well on track and to deliver its results in the very near future.
These steps will further increase our margin profile by 150-200 BPS. Looking ahead, as we transition into FY 2027, our focus remains firmly on strong order book execution through continued operational efficiency, leveraging our expanded capacity, further consolidating our resources and sustainably improving margins. Our long-term vision to become INR 1 billion revenue company within next few years remains intact. We are confident of achieving it through consistent execution, customer-centric innovation and robust financial discipline. Our strategies include strengthening backward integration, investing in automation and digital transformation, focusing on clean, sustainable energy solutions in line with India's power sector ambitions. With strong fundamentals, industry-leading capabilities and high-quality orders in the pipeline, we are well-positioned to navigate the opportunities and challenges of the coming year. On behalf of the entire leadership team, I extend my heartfelt gratitude to all our stakeholders, customers, employees, suppliers, board members, and investors.
Your continued trust and support remains the cornerstone of our journey. Together, we are building a future-ready organization that not only leads in the transformer industry, but also contributes meaningfully to India's evolving energy landscape, Viksit Bharat by 2047. Thank you once again for joining us today. I'll now hand over the mic to our CFO, Mr. Mehul, to take you through the financial performance of the company in greater detail. Thank you. Go ahead .
Yes. Good evening to everyone who are present over this investor con call to discuss quarter four, financial year 2026, financial performance of the company. Thank you, Satyam, sir, for your insight, for leadership remarks, and for setting the strategy context right for the current quarter. It gives me great pleasure to discuss with you all our quarter four financial year 2026 performance. A quarter that clearly reflects the strength of our execution capabilities, resilience of our business model, and the benefits of strategic initiatives that we have been implementing over the past several quarters. I am pleased to report that quarter four has been a strong quarter for the company, which is showing consistent improvement across all the key financial parameters. Revenue on the standalone basis from the operations stood at INR 752 crores as compared to INR 740 crores of quarter four 2025.
The growth was driven by the higher capacity utilization, timely execution of orders, improvement in supply chain management. The momentum seen during the last couple of quarters will give us confidence for the next quarters of consistent improved performance. EBITDA for the quarter came to INR 117 crores with a margin of 15.1%. The margin is slightly down due to additional increase in the employee cost on account of ESOPs. Profit after tax stood at INR 77 crores, reflecting not only the strong operating performance but also the disciplined financial management across the organization. Revenue on the standalone basis for the full financial year stands at INR 2,395 crores as compared to INR 1,950 crores for the full financial year.
EBITDA for the year come at around INR 370 crores with a margin of 15.1%. Profit after tax stood at around INR 225 crores with a margin of 9.2%. Further, on the consolidated basis, revenue for the quarter stood at INR 783 crores against INR 737 crores during quarter four FY 2025. EBITDA stood at INR 141 crores and PAT at INR 91 crores. On the basis of full financial year, consolidated number revenue is INR 2,509 crores, up from INR 2,019 crores. EBITDA stood at INR 444 crores and PAT is around INR 272 crores. Importantly, quarter four also marks a turning point in terms of consistent growth with margin sustainability.
We are very much confident of maintaining the improved margins due to our capacity expansion, backward integration plan and structural margin improvements. The backward integration facility and the developments are expected to further enhance the cost efficiency and reduce external dependency over the medium term. Looking forward, we enter the next financial year with strong visibility of our order books, new capacities coming on board, starting of our backward integration projects. Our order book remains robust, execution pipelines are healthy, and the plant utilization levels are expected to remain for the full financial year. Before I conclude, I would like to express my sincere appreciation to our team across operations, finance, supply chain, projects for their relentless focus and execution excellence. I would also like to thank our board and investors for their continuous trust and support as we work towards building a strong, more resilient and a future-ready organization.
With that, I conclude my remarks. Thank you once again for joining us today. We are now happy to take your questions. Thank you.
Thank you so much, sir. We will now begin with the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touch-tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we'll wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question comes from the line of Abhishek Vijay from Global Consilient Research. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi. Am I audible?
Yeah.
Yes.
Yes, you are.
Yeah. When I was seeing the results, I can see that the cost of materials consumed has increased a bit disproportionate to the revenue. I'm guessing that this is because of the copper price surge due to the Hormuz disruption. Could you throw some more light on what other raw materials is disrupted due to this Hormuz closure?
Abhishek, you see, mainly, copper is slightly disturbed. Other than that, not because of a Hormuz issue, but because of overbooking for all other ancillary parts like bushings and stuff, there is a slight disturbance. Plus, the porcelain is made in gas-fired kiln. Gas is also becoming slightly a problem. There are certain issues that we are facing because of Hormuz, but not very much.
Okay, sure. One more thing is that we are foraying into HVDC, and I wanted to understand the competitive landscape in HVDC from you. I've seen that a lot of players are already in the thing. What is the competitive advantage that we have?
There are only four major players in HVDC. Hitachi, Siemens, GE, and, I think, TBEA. TBEA is not able to compete with us in other tenders. Only three major competitors are there. Other than that, we are the only players who will be entering into HVDC.
I'm sorry, but I couldn't quite decipher what the competitive advantage was.
HVDC is a very highly technical product, and because of the limited number of players in this HVDC space, the margins are also better in HVDC.
Okay, sure. I was also reading Siemens' con call that only about one to two tenders are floated every year for HVDC. What are our odds on getting that contract compared to these four players that you just mentioned?
Yes, currently there are only about one to two tenders of HVDC, going further, the numbers of tenders that are going to be in pipeline should be around 10-12. Each tender should have about three units of HVDC. There is a good scope in HVDC in the coming future. By that time, we will also be successfully empaneled in HVDC transformers.
Okay. Yeah. Thank you very much.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of [Vaibhav Mishra] from Finvestor. Please go ahead.
Hello, sir. Good evening. Sir, my question is regarding this West Asia conflict. How can this affect or is it affecting us in any way like supply chain or from the delivery side? Are we affected in any way from this?
No. Basically, see, if you look at our export number, et cetera, there is very minimal exports that what we are currently doing. From the Western Asia region, there is a very minimal import that has been coming to India for us. There is no major impact as far as this conflict is concerned. The only issue that we are looking at is availability of gas for our fabrication units and stuff like that. We are mitigating those issues also.
All right, sir. Sir, regarding the guidance, actually in the last three quarters, I think this is the second quarter where we have missed our guidance. Like the revenue guidance was, I think, INR 2,600 crores in Q3 call it was told. Also order books, it was very confidently said that closing order book will be INR 8,000 crores, but it's still INR 5,000 crores. What is leading to this recently? I mean, has the issue of not meeting its guidance. What is happening for the last two, three quarters?
See, we are deliberately not taking orders currently because we want to, as we have previously told that we want to limit our exposure to not more than 18-24 months. We want to be very selective in which orders we take in terms of delivery and in terms of the price that we quote. We are being extremely selective of what orders to take, and we do not want to take any order which is beyond 24 months of delivery. That is where we stand at right now. As long as we are not free for next 24 months, we do not want to take any further orders.
Okay.
I think this was the stand in the.
Extremely selective. We want to be extremely selective in orders.
All right. Sir, I think the stand was in the last call itself and that we were selective and we were targeting.
We are maintaining our stand that we do not want to take any orders that are beyond 24 months.
All right, sir. Sir, our backward integration plans that we have for the next time in Q1, Q2, Q3, Q4, four quarters. Are they on track? I mean, is there any change in timelines of them?
No, that is all on track. We already started the site preparation. Plant machinery which is having a higher lead time has already been ordered, so
By, say, the start of next financial year, you will start to see the impact of this backward integration plan that we have.
All right. One last question, sir, regarding FY 2027. The revenue target that we have in mind for FY 2027 or the consolidated margins that we are targeting for?
I think as of now, we have not finalized what we will be looking at, but what we can say is around INR 3,250 crores is what we are looking at currently.
All right, sir. Okay. Thank you so much, sir. All the best for the future.
Thank you.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Bala Subramanian from Arihant Capital Markets. Please go ahead.
Good evening, sir. Thank you so much for the opportunity. Sir, I'm trying to understand the gross margin side. In FY 2026, we have a gross margin of 31%. Sorry, 31%-32% kind of range. We are trying to reach 35% by FY 2028 and 40% with deeper integration. I'm trying to understand how this gross margin improved in terms of RIP pushing internalization, CTC internalization, CRGO sourcing efficiency and pricing discipline. Which single item contributes the most weightage? If you could share some clarity on that.
Yeah. Basically, currently you are right, we are at 30%-31% margin. Due to this capacity expansion, that's what we are doing at our Changodar and Moraiya project, plus the effort that has been done to do the operational efficiencies, etc., this will give us some margins in terms of for next, say, 2-3 years. Plus the backward integration plan, which will start from the next financial year, which will also give us some, say, 200-300 basis points of additional margins. That's how we are looking at around, say, 35% margin.
I found-
Yes, sir. Also, I think already mentioned, we are on track for backward integrations. I'm trying to understand, I think we have a 60% increasing capacity of MVA and how this, I think the industry issues not remain resolved in terms of supply constraint. Whether we have alternative sourcing agreements or MOU already in place for the incremental CRGO pushing and the CTC volumes.
Yes, we already have agreements in place, sir.
Okay, sir. My last question, if you could help us understand on furnace transformers, renewables and green hydrogen. On that furnace transformer side, we have seen only market size INR 200- INR 300 crore despite having high technical barriers and low competitions. Why the addressable market is so small and whether we can expect substantial growth in those areas? Secondly, renewable side, the margins are, I think, at lower level. For renewable transformers and solar transformers, typically lower margins. Whether we can able to see margin improvement or volume improvement in those areas. Thirdly, green hydrogen.
Go on with your question.
Yes. On the green hydrogen side, I think we have not started any projects or any supply. I'm trying to understand whether when we can expect a demand for green hydrogen side, especially like any specific policy or project milestone or any tender awards or any state pipeline approvals are in place.
As far as transformers for renewable energies is concerned, see, with our backward integration and with our manufacturing, means 75,000 MVA manufacturing capacity, our purchasing power become significantly high. The margins improvement there are going to be very high. I completely understand that right now there is not much margin improvement there. With the backward integration and with purchasing power of 75,000 MVA, there should be a substantial decrease in our purchasing price. This is going to affect our margins effectively. Green hydrogen, the projects are still not coming up live. We are also working at a few prototype transformers which need to be short-circuit tested and done some testing. As soon as the projects come up live, we will start getting some feedback on the green hydrogen transformers.
Sir, on the furnace transformer side, sir.
Furnace transformer will see some improvement as the steel industry in India starts moving at a faster pace.
Okay, sir. Okay. Thank you.
Thank you. Moderator, can we limit to one question per person, please? Otherwise, everybody won't get a chance.
Sure.
Ladies and gentlemen, in order to ensure that the management will be able to address all the questions from the participants, we request you kindly limit your question to one question per participant. If you have a follow-up question, please rejoin the queue. Our next question comes from the line of Deepak Poddar from Sapphire Capital. Please go ahead.
Yeah. I'm audible, sir?
Yes, you are audible.
Yeah. Thank you very much for this opportunity, sir. I will ask two questions, very quick questions. Sir, our capacity got delayed, this Changodar plant. Now it's slated to start by second quarter, right?
Yeah. Extended monsoons was one of the biggest reasons in terms of delay in the usefulness of the plant.
Okay. Understood. When is the Moraiya plant expected to come on stream?
Moraiya plant, we are planning after this year's monsoon.
by 3Q FY 2027?
Yeah.
Okay. Ideally, then your first half growth will be quite muted, right? Because already-
No. See, Moraiya plant is working at about 75% plant utilization. We are working on maximizing that plant utilization before we start anything else.
Okay, understood. What's the CapEx-
I'm sorry to interrupt you, sir, but please rejoin the queue for more questions.
This is the follow-up, yeah.
You may rejoin. Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Ashish from Leo Capital. Please go ahead.
Yeah. I had a question regarding how the industry works. How fungible is installed MVA capacities across voltage classes? Can capacity allocated to, let's say, 220 kV be redeployed to higher kV or vice versa, or are they largely dedicated voltage specific lines?
See, basically the capacity, there are three things that would. From 400, we can go down to 220. From 220, we will not be able to go up to 400, if the plant is not designed for 400. Let's say testing facility, crane capacity, winding machines capacity, we have four or five items because of which from 220 going up to 400 is going to be a challenge, but coming down from 400 to 220 is easy. It's not vice versa, but from 400 to 220 it can be done. From 220 to 400, as long as plant is not designed for 400 kV, it will not happen.
Okay. To summarize, let's say someone has a distribution transformer capacity in MVA that can't be scaled to a EHV 220-
No.
400 capacity. What are the limitations exactly?
Crane capacity, let's say the height of the building, testing facilities. There are many factors. Winding machines capabilities. There are many factors that will affect it.
Okay. I got it. Thank you.
Okay.
I'll rejoin the queue for my next question.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Kaushal Sharma from Equinox Capital Venture. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Am I audible? Very good evening.
Yes, you are.
Yeah. Sir, my question is on the industry side. Like due to the extended monsoon, there was an approval delay in the overall industry transmission in the industry. Are we seeing any slowdown in the CapEx or is it temporary with like one or two quarter executions delayed?
No, there won't be any delay as far as CapEx plan is concerned.
Okay. We are not facing any delay in dispatching any orders for the current quarter book and all?
No.
Okay, sir. Thank you.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Vineet from Toro Wealth Managers. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Good afternoon.
Good afternoon.
Sir, my question is around the supply enhancement that has been going around in the entire power value chain. Most of our vendors as well in the transformer value chain are enhancing the capacities. I just wanted to know what's your view on if we can negotiate with our suppliers when they have increased capacity?
Sorry, Vineet, we didn't understand your question.
Sir, I'm asking in this phase where the capacities are being enhanced by most of our vendors.
Yeah.
What is our position in negotiating on prices with our suppliers?
See, Vineet, honestly, there is still hand-to-mouth in terms of most of the items that transformer manufacturing is concerned. We can only negotiate in terms of delivery time for each product that we need. That is one of the basic negotiations that can happen currently.
The demand is so strong that only we can negotiate on the delivery timelines, but on pricing side, more or less the same.
Yes.
Got it, sir. Thank you.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Yash Gupta from Asit Koticha Family Office. Please go ahead.
Sir, my first question is on the capacity. Could you please help us understanding the trajectory of our upcoming capacity addition? Is it reasonable to expect that around 50% of the utilization will come by H2 FY 2027? How should we think about capacity expansion plan over the next 2-3 years and how cash flow will be placed from it?
See, basically from Changodar facility will be up and running from this quarter two. After that, we will take up this Moraiya plant expansion. After these two plants, the capacity would be, say, from 40,000, it will go up to 75,000.
How our utilization will be for the second half of FY 2027 and 2028 upcoming capacity?
Yeah, upcoming capacity, Changodar will start from the H2, but initially it would be low since it is a new plant, et cetera. From the next financial year it would be running at around 75%-80% capacity.
I think by end of quarter three we should be almost at 80% capacity in Changodar plant.
Do you think it will impact our EBITDA margin in the first half and maybe Q3?
No.
No.
Because, see, our orders are already in the pipeline and we are working on that, so that won't be any impact. It will in fact, definitely the quarter three numbers will be on a higher side because of these new capacities. Say first half, the numbers will not be affected by this.
Yash, like we said before, we are very selective in what orders we want to take right now. We are not taking any orders that are beyond 24 months. Being selective on the type of orders that we are taking, there is not going to be any effect on the EBITDA of the company.
Sir, higher in Q3 means in the terms of higher margin or in the amount you are talking about?
Both. Not margin, but in terms of revenue.
Revenue.
Margin will be this only 16.5%-17%.
Yeah. Margins will remain at 16.5%-17%.
Okay, sure. Thank you, sir.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Yash Rathi from Mangal Keshav Services. Please go ahead.
Good afternoon and congratulations on good set of numbers. We are going backward integration on the CTC plant itself. Just wanted to understand, would that also require additional PGCIL approval if we are using that for the captive purposes into our 465 kV and moving forward when we get HVDC approval as well? We will be using our CTC for the captive purposes, so how the PGCIL approval would look like?
PGCIL approval will definitely be needed. The plant that we are putting up for CTC and the plant that we will be putting up for Pressboard, both these plants are world-class plants. We have already taken into account what all PGCIL requires for approval of the plant. Since it is our own captive consumption, the approval becomes very easy from PGCIL.
Can we just get some timeline on the same?
Timeline on what? Getting approval from PGCIL?
Yes.
I think within the month of starting the production capacity, we should get the approval. See, as it is, PGCIL and we are also facing some issues regarding the deliveries of CTC conductor. It is of utmost importance to PGCIL also to make sure that they have one more vendor in India which delivers CTC production.
Okay. Just one more thing on the CTC plant itself.
Yes.
It won't cater to our whole production for the transformers. How much you would still look to outsource or it would be enough for our annual transformer manufacturing capability?
The current plan is to cater to 100% need of T&R. Going forward with certain more expansion, we will be also looking at selling in the market. Third party selling also we will be doing.
Okay, understood. Thank you so much.
We will basically be also CTC suppliers to other transformer manufacturers.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Our next question comes from the line of [Shubham Ramsna] from Think S ite Advisory. Please go ahead.
Sir, am I audible?
Yes, sure.
Yeah.
Sir, any update on the World Bank issue?
Mehul Shah will give you a reply.
Yeah. As per the timelines, et cetera, we have filed the reply to the World Bank, and we are awaiting any response also. Recently also we have filed that before taking any decision, et cetera, we should be given an opportunity to be heard in person. We are awaiting the feedback from the World Bank on this.
Okay. Can we expect a reply?
I think it should be closed in 45 days. That's what our belief is.
Okay. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Abhijeet Singh from Systematix. Please go ahead.
Yes, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. My question is on HVDC. What is the scope of our offering in the HVDC scope overall? For example, the OEM typically has about 45%-60% of the overall project cost. You mentioned that you will be able to supply 3-4 units in a substation for HVDC. What is the scope in percentage of the overall project cost for HVDC for us?
We didn't understand your question. Please, can you come back again?
Yes, sir. Out of the total project cost for an HVDC-
Yeah.
What is our scope? Let's say we are supplying HVDC transformer, right? 3-4 units per project.
Yeah.
What is that as a % of overall CapEx of the project?
That should be around 40% of overall CapEx of the project.
Right, sir.
Because HVDC transformer is going to be the largest equipment and the most expensive equipment in the project. Around 40% should be our cost.
Right, sir. Sir, when do we expect the approval from PGCIL for this particular product?
Once we've successfully repaired this transformer and given back to PGCIL, after six months of working in a satisfactory condition, PGCIL will start the process of approving us as one of the HVDC manufacturers in the country.
Right, sir. Sir, just one last thing.
I'm sorry, but please rejoin the queue for more question.
Sure.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Prathmesh Salunkhe from PL Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Thank you so much for the opportunity. Sir, my question is again on the HVDC space. I just wanted to understand now that we plan to supply only the equipment, the HVDC transformers in the projects, and it may take some time for the approvals to come in. At the same time, I recall in the last few calls, management had mentioned that we are not really doing LCC or VSC. We are trying to come up with our own technology. For next two, three years, all the projects that are in the pipeline have already been established whether as an LCC or VSC project. How will T&R be able to compete for these projects against the established MNC?
What is LCC project?
Sir, technology of the HVDC, LCC and VSC.
We are coming up with our own process of HVDC.
Yeah. Sir, my question was the same. Since there are 2-3 projects in the pipeline, right? For next 2-3 years.
Yeah.
All those two or three projects have already been decided whether they are coming with LCC technology or VSC technology. If the projects are coming in LCC and VSC and we are not supplying either of these technologies, how will T&R be able to participate in these tenders? We will have to wait for a project for next four, five years, before we can participate. Is that the right understanding?
No, that is not right. There are other projects that are coming up with EPC contractors also where we will be participating.
Okay. These projects with the EPC contractors, these projects will not primarily come from a player like PGCIL. Is that right?
Yeah.
All right. Thank you. Thank you so much.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of [Raj Sarraf] from Finvestors. Please go ahead.
Sir, am I audible to you?
Yes.
Thank you very much for giving the opportunity. Sir, I'm tracking and I'm invested in the company since last two and a half years. I appreciate the journey that is going through. Sir, from last one year, what I'm seeing that there is a delay in some projects. If I compare the investor presentation of FY 2025 and now FY 2026 on the chairman's comment, what I can see that all CapEx have been delayed by at least one year and all the backward and all the integrations are also delayed with the same timeline and even the guidance has been delayed. When I watch interview, which is given by your Director of Finance, Mr. Chanchal Rajora, what he guides on television and what we come to know in the conference call, there is a very significant difference in these two outcomes. I want your take on that.
What are you exactly referring to, if I may ask? Are you talking about the order input?
Sir, there are numerous things, sir, like order inflow. What you are mentioning, that we are very concerned about the margins and the quality of the order we are getting.
Yes.
Despite questioning on the same line to Director of Finance, he very confidently, in TV interviews, putting the number of 8,000 and close to 7,500 order book closure by FY 2026, the first thing. The second thing, the projects or CapExes we have right now at which we're doing, the timing of the project, which is right now delayed by at least one year, all the projects, whether it be Changodar or Moraiya . The third thing is on the margin front.
Okay, what we are expecting as investors from last one year that all the projects which are right now being done will increase the margin, whereas what we are going through, even in the last, which is Q4, the recent completed Q4, in spite of we are having a greater number on the top line, the margin is still consistent, which we would have liked that it could have come the best margin of the year. All these things, sir.
As long as the outlook on the margin, we have always maintained that the margins will remain at 15%-16%. We have never changed that. In terms of the order book, yes, we have miscalculated the orders that were supposed to be coming to us. Like we say, we are very careful in selecting which orders we really want to execute, because right now the market is such where we can be slightly choosy about what orders to take. As far as the new projects are concerned, there was a delay because of extended monsoon, which has delayed the project by one quarter.
Okay, sir. Sir, on the guidance side also, sir, initially when
I will once again reiterate that orders input will be very selective, and we will make sure that we do not take orders that are beyond 24 months.
Sir, I was asking you the guidance in the top line, sir, not on the order books, sir, which you have clarified now.
Top line, Mehul Shah will answer. Yeah.
Sir, the top line which was guided in the commencement of FY 2026 was INR 3,500 crore, which was reduced mid-year after very subdued Q2. That was again told to INR 2,500 crore-INR 4,600 crore. Even on the 3rd and 4th March, when Director of Finance came on television , and he repeated the guidance that we are very sure that we will be closing above INR 4,500 crore. This INR 100 crore guidance is okay, but the confidence which has been shown initially in the year and right now the tone of the management in this Q4 conference call is not matching.
Yeah, that's true that initially we have targeted that number, but that has been later on realized, and we have categorically come up and revised that guidance during the quarter two conference call.
Okay. My point is that, sir, we are doing very phenomenally well. Let us be conservative if we have to use it and then deliver more rather than being more.
We have realized this, and that is why this year we have given an outlook of INR 3,250 crores, not beyond that.
Yes, I share this, and thank you very much, sir.
Thank you.
I'm concerned about the company because I'm invested from last two and a half years. Thank you very much.
Sure, Raj.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Karan Gupta from ACMIIL. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi. Yeah, audible?
Yes.
Yeah. My question is more on the margin side. Concerning the competitive bidding in the industry, what will be the margin on a better level consolidated basis over 2-3 years? One thing is the competitive bidding in the industry, and the second thing is that you are doing backward integration, and you're saying 2%-3% kind of leverage in the margin you can get. My point is, in the next 2-3 years, what will be the margin side? It will be compensated by the backward integration you are doing, or it will improve further from the mark of 16%, 17%.
Yeah, see, as we are saying that margins will remain in the range of, say, 15%-17% as currently. Through this backward integration coming up, you may see some increase in that number, about 200-300 basis points.
Mm-hmm. Okay. What about the cash flow side, the working capital compared to FY 2025 to 2026, receivables and part, inventory part doubled, I think. What we are doing for this working capital side now, we are getting mitigated with them.
Yes, see, compared to our financial year 2025 numbers, it's definitely the receivable number and inventory numbers are high. But on the receivable side, I think due to this.
Last-minute March numbers, we have missed certain collections. In the first year, in that 15-16 days time, we almost collected around INR 200-odd crore. There are some delays as far as the utilities are concerned because their budget, etc., has been delayed by March. They have released the payments in the new financial year.
Okay. Basically payment is got delayed.
Yeah.
Thank you.
Okay.
Our next question comes from the line of Deekshant from DB Wealth. Please go ahead.
Sir, you mentioned that we are looking at alternative sources for our gas, which will help us continue our production. What is it that we are doing to mitigate this risk right now so that our production can ramp up?
We had invested a few years back in some laser cutting technology. We have also invested in plasma cutting technology. All that is coming online and if the gas crisis has helped us improve our efficiency on those cutting CNC machines.
Instead of using gas as a power source, we will be using electricity as a power source.
Yes. That is correct.
Sir, is there any other way that we can make sure that we don't hit into any problems for expanding our capacity? Because now that we are going to a new phase of expansion, this seems to be a risk that seems to be very likely.
What is the risk we are talking about? The gas risk, are you talking about?
I mean, anything that is going to make our production capacity go down or our capability to deliver go down. Gas is one of it, right?
No, no. There is no issue as such for the utilization of the capacities.
Okay, sir.
We don't see any risk in the utilization of the capacities, Deekshant.
Okay, sir. Thank you so much.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Aditya Vora from Sohum AMC. Please go ahead.
Hello. Hi. Good evening, sir. I had a question on margins. You alluded to the fact that I think 15%, 16% is a good number to look at currently. Structurally, I just wanted to understand that most of our peers, in spite of being in low kV class, are doing superior margins to us, and also that they are not backward integrated. What is the reason for our margins to be at 15%, 16%, where majority of the peers are 18%, 19%, and even 20% to some extent. That was the understanding which I wanted. Also, at a time when the transformer industry is at an explosive growth, shouldn't we be getting better margins and faster growth?
Yes. See, this backward integration margin is yet to come into the picture. This, we are talking these margins, say, of 15%-17% is without any margin improvement in terms of backward integration.
No, I understand what you're trying to say, but the peers also don't have backward integration, that is one. Secondly, what I'm trying to highlight is that peers are in a relatively lower margin, lower kV class, while you are predominantly into 220 kV and above. You know 220kV and 400kV is what you are targeting. While if I look at majority of our peers, we are getting to 220 kV or 400 kV. In fact, if you look at, say, Atlanta, it recently got into 400 kV and others are getting there.
Yeah.
Ideally, our margin structurally should be much higher than them. I'm assuming even their backward integration, even aside from Atlanta, their backward integration is the same as us. I don't know why our margins are at the only 15% structurally.
Yes, sir. That's the reason why we have stopped. We are very selective in terms of taking orders, et cetera, going forward. As you must have seen, these orders we must be executing, which we have taken, say, 12 months, 15 months back. That is the major reasons why we have decided that, yes, we will not take any orders which is coming our way, and we will be very selective in terms of margins, et cetera, as well as the delivery schedules, et cetera, matching with our production lines. That is the reason why we would be selective and our margins will improve.
Okay, sure. Just one thing on your guidance going forward. Would you like to give any guidance for FY 2027 in terms of growth percentage, if not the absolute number?
Yeah, it could be roughly around, say, 35%-40% growth in terms of revenue.
Okay. Order book, any sense on that, considering you're curtailing incremental order inflows to focus on the quality of orders?
I think if we do INR 3,250 crore, we will be, let's say, I don't know. Rather than putting these numbers, we would like to restrict ourselves to, we will take the order, say, up to 24 months.
Okay. 35%-40% is the revenue growth what you're talking for FY 2027?
Yes.
Sure, sir. Thank you, sir.
Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Sagar Gandhi from Invesco Mutual Fund. Please go ahead.
Yeah, sir, my question is on the inquiry under negotiation PowerPoint presentation, that is INR 23,000 crore that you mentioned. Now you highlighted you are looking at orders only under 24 months. Of this INR 23,000 crore, how much is for 24 months?
After quarter one, there should be around 18,000 MVA order inquiry that will be in 24 months.
Thank you, sir. Sir, you confirm that the receivables that have gone up by around INR 410 crore, of INR 200 crore, of this INR 410 crore have come in the first 15 days of April.
Yeah.
That has happened, right?
Yeah.
Yeah. Thank you. Thank you so much, sir. That is it from my side.
Moderator, we would like to take last few questions, please.
Sure. Next question comes from the line of Neville S. Shaft, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Good evening, sir. Thanks for taking my question. My question would be on the order book mix. Recently we've seen a good amount of orders coming from the government utilities. Could you tell us that out of the outstanding order book of INR 5,000 crore, how much percentage consists of these utility players and how much is the private portion?
Let's say around 55% will be utilities, 20% will be EPC contractors and remaining all private customers.
Okay. Got it. Another third now with backward integration facilities in place, which will be coming into effect from the first half of FY 2027 and dated by FY 2028. That would lead to shorter lead times and also give us some cost advantages. Would we be approaching more private players who still prefer Chinese suppliers for transformers or we'll stick to this mix?
No, we would be approaching many private customers. Provided we are getting deliveries and quality of the order inflow is going to be the key area of focus in the next year.
Okay, sir. Got it. Thank you very much.
Thank you. We'll be taking the last question from [Shashi Ranjan] from Anandan Capital. Please go ahead.
Good evening, team. Thank you for the opportunity. I heard that we have order book of around, say, INR 5,000 crore approx.
Yeah.
In the previous discussion we also learned that we were not able to pass on the rising cost because the orders that was there was older one.
Yeah.
We're putting it from the point the increase started. How many such order books that we have, which are not giving us more margin other than INR 5,000 crore order book?
I think everything that has been there, we have already executed. Now since last six months, we have been very critically analyzing every order that we want to take, and we are very selective in taking orders. None of the orders that are in this INR 5,500 crores have any issues in terms of our margins or cost.
Last one, sir, if you may allow, what is the current capacity that we are running at and how far we intend to pull this capacity utilization in next two quarters?
We are currently running at around 75% capacity. This year we should go at around 95% capacity.
Thank you so much, sir. Thank you for the opportunity.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, due to time constraint, that was the last question. Any pending question will be sent to the Transformers and Rectifiers (India) Limited investor relations team, and they will get back to you. With that, I'll hand the conference over to the management for the closing remarks. Thank you, and over to you, team.
Thank you once again for joining us today. I extend my heartfelt gratitude to all our stakeholders, customers, employees, and board members and investors and all of you who have attended this investors call. Thank you very much, everybody.
Thank you so much, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, on behalf of Nuvama Wealth Management Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us and you may now disconnect your lines.