Following the publication of the unaudited nine-month financial figures of 2025, I am delighted to welcome the Co-CEOs Dimitar Dimitrov and Wolfgang Kirsch, who will speak in a moment and guide us through the numbers and the presentation. After the presentation, we will move on to a Q&A session in which you will be allowed to place your question directly to the management. Let's jump straight into the numbers. Mr. Kirsch, the stage is yours.
Yes, good morning everyone and a warm welcome from our side as well, from Dimitar Dimitrov and myself. We are happy to present very good numbers for Q3, so very good outlook as well for 2026. Let's straight jump to the presentation. As usual, I will make the warm-up. I will give you some highlights as well, the high-level financials. Then Dimitar will talk about products today a little bit more, outlook for 2026, and then I will go through the detailed financials quarter by quarter as you are used to. Just as a reminder, as usual, what we are doing, we are in home automation and more and more we are ready to equip a whole house. We are not in one of the special segments. We are in safety security.
We are more and more and very strong in energy management and see a huge demand there. Automation and control and more fancy things will come in the course of the next 12 months. The highlights for nine months this year, we have sold a total, and that's always the number since we started with Shelly in 2018, where the first Shelly came to the market. We have sold now a total of 28.8 million devices. In the last 12 months, 11 million devices. We are in 2.5 million households. That's a rough estimation. What we know is that we have 2.5 million cloud users. We increased the number of cloud users by 800,000 in the last 12 months. We will come a little bit more to details about activations during Dimitar's part, and we have added around about 1.6 million households in the last 12 months.
We see that customers more and more moving to using our cloud and not third-party clouds, and that's as well a very good and positive trend. Some other highlights, revenue and EBIT in the nine-month period are both above target. We are growing in all regions above the market. We estimate the market growth around 10%-15%. Typically, we say 15%, but we hear some messages from some regions that it's more like 10% in this year. Not everything is super positive, but we are outperforming the market. In this case, it's just a question how much are we outperforming the market. As well, a very good development, and that's still an estimation. We will get final numbers beginning of the year, but we always say that our do-it-yourself share is 70% and our professional share is 30%.
This year we see a trend that Pro is growing faster than do-it-yourself. We estimate the number for this year will be around 65%- 35%, and that is exactly fitting to our strategy to be stronger in the professional market. Some of the products that we will launch will support that. We enlarge constantly our distribution channels everywhere in do-it-yourself and in Pro. We have started in 2024, in April 2024, our installer initiative to train installers, to onboard installers. We have installer portals now for our applications, and currently we have a bit more than 3,000 installers live. We onboarded in September a full Benelux team that gives us stronger access to a very strong smart home region. Cloud activations are growing overproportionally. That gives us more addresses of customers, more possibility to talk directly to our customers.
That's one of our key KPIs, and we see an increase as well in the Premium app users. To the high-level financials, we have ended the quarter with EUR 86.9 million, or the nine-month period, sorry, with EUR 86.9 million revenue, which was a growth rate of 33.8%. Once again, with this, we are growing more than twice as fast as the market. If we estimate the market growth at 15%, that's a bit more than two. If we estimate the market at 10% growth, it's even 3x the market growth. Very positive development. Our EBIT grew in the nine-month period more than the revenue, 42.7% EBIT growth to EUR 21.9 million. That gives an EBIT margin in the nine-month period that is a little bit above our midterm target of 25% with 25.2%.
Just as a reminder, after six months, we were at 22.6%, and we gave an outlook that we see the trend reversing because we had some negative effects from exchange rate, from prepayments that we did in the last year or in the first quarter with a different dollar-euro exchange rate. This is reversing now. We see some positive trends here, and we come to the quarter a little bit later. As well, on the cash side, we see that our free cash flow measures are showing positive results. We are increasing cash level. I come to the cash flow at the end of the presentation as usual, and there is still a lot of room to be better here, but we see that everything that we are doing, we take serious and it shows first effects. With this, we come to the products, Dimitar.
Thank you very much. Before we talk about the products, I think last time we presented you the comparison between the 2024 and 2025, how it's coming, because the sales is the one thing, but the second, which is most important, something which we're looking for our cloud. How many customers daily installed Shelly devices somewhere in the world? From what you see, the trend is there's a trend during the beginning of the year, there is much more installation, then middle of the year is going down, and now it's started jumping again. As you see, we keep the 46% growth of the daily installments. In numbers, this means something between only for the cloud connect devices, over 16,000 devices daily is installed somewhere in the world and connected to our cloud. The second one, yeah, this is the second one, which is also a comparison.
From what we can see, the number of the daily installation is growing from 6,900 devices to 10,000 devices, something which is important. This is only devices connected to our cloud. We know very well that at least 35%- 40% of the devices installed in the houses and they are not, which is never connected to our cloud. They connect to third-party systems. This is additional, which means additional 5,000 devices daily is for 2025 is not average daily is not visible there. Also the new households, this is the households which is connected to our cloud. There is 1/3 more which we do not see, but we know that they exist from our distributors, from our groups and channels. We know that there are many houses which we cannot count there.
Even that, as you can see, 31% of the households, more households on daily is connected to our cloud compared with a year ago. Also, this trend shows us something very important that 45% growth of the devices and 31% of the households mean that the customers which start to install Shelly devices, they continue adding more and more devices in their households, which is the this also shows the ability of devices, the trust of the customers, their satisfaction because they're looking how to install more and more devices in their households. Okay, something which is important, our application, we continue improving our application. Now it's not just application for the smart home, but also covering lots of many things. There is an alarm situation. There is alarms controlling and monitoring over your house, the security.
Also, it's a huge opportunity about the personalized scenes, remote control, energy management is something where we are very strong and everybody tells us that Shelly is the number one for the energy monitoring market, not only for do-it-yourself, but also becoming very strong here for the professional installation and with the solar manufacturers and with the BMS systems and business buildings. What are we looking for next year? You know, one of our next trends is the locks, the smart locks. We acquire, no, we don't acquire. We buy the assets for the Denmark or what is the Dutch, okay, the Dutch company a year ago and we start manufacturing the locks and improving the technology which we have. The result is significant. It's very good from what we've seen and the feedback from the market is very good.
We see the huge opportunity to grow this market and to be one of the strongest competitors and the strongest player on the smart lock market. The next year we will upgrade and use our new technology also and add more variants of the locks to cover more use cases for different customers. We believe that this will be one of our main directions for the new devices and the new trend which we add to the existing portfolio. The second one is the cameras. This is something very important for us. You know that many customers are asking about it. Also, our target is to create the camera which is fully, how to say, it is not just for the monitoring, but it is part of your home automation. The camera can act as a hub. The camera can control your environment.
The camera can listen to the environment for the end states of the switches, sensors, not only for the building sensors in the cameras, but the camera will be one part of the home, the same part of the home, everything integrated as we do. This will be a completely different user experience with the cameras, which compared with any other competitors. Also, not only this one, about the quality, about the security, we will provide the camera developed 100% by us. Our camera will be controlled from the European cloud. We will allow all customers, same as the other Shelly devices, completely to switch cameras to their own local solution or their own cloud and to keep security on the highest possible level in their own environment. This is the camera. The cameras are coming.
There will be an indoor camera, outdoor camera, the full AI camera, a different price range camera. Also, we're looking at the end of the year to have a door lock based on the camera and also the ring bell camera, ring bell with the built-in camera. This will be one of our strong directions for next year. The third one, something which is very important. Now we are a very well-known brand for home automation, but we've seen that protection. Every house has protection. Every house has the breakers, fuses, which is part. This is the commodity and this must be in every house. What we're looking for, this part, what we're seeing is a little bit outdated compared with technology.
We successfully just finished the certification of our first breakers, the connected breakers, the breakers which have the same powerful chipset as the other Shelly devices and which we were able to not only be switched on and off, but also monitor the environment. In case of the situation, the breakers could protect your home and notify you for what reason it is switched off, because of the overpower, because of the overconsumption, because of the overvoltage, and to notify what happens in your house. Also, like this, we're going one step further because each of the breakers can monitor the power consumption. You do not need to put the dedicated device, one of the models which we're working with the European manufacturer of the breakers because we don't manufacture the breakers as breakers itself, the protection part.
We're working with them for the electronic parts and connectivity, which we build into the breaker. With this product, we can achieve the protection, communication, connection, and everything which until now is not existing at such a level of integration. Shelly X, now we can see many products with the Shelly X. We've seen the huge growth this year. At least I think on the screen now is not all the products which we make with the powered by Shelly. There are many, many more which are on the market and it's coming many more which are on the market. I think even with the small delays to prepare the right platform for our partners, we've seen that the Shelly X is growing rapidly.
Next year, we can start presenting some numbers with Shelly X because we believe that that will start to be a bit important and significant for our revenue. Currently, there is a big satisfaction from the market, a huge demand for the Shelly X and the products which are using covered connectivity technology. This trend is continuing and this will be our main trend for the next years. We believe that also this will deliver the significant part of the revenue for the next years. Now financial from Working Issue. Yeah.
Yeah. Normally here I say now the boring financials come. I would say they are absolutely not boring. This is the chart that you have seen at the very beginning just as a reminder. Now if we go to revenue development quarter-over-quarter, we have now 31 quarters of consecutive growth. That is something that is a boring number for us. That is not boring for the market. That is not boring for our competitors because we know that not a lot of competitors, even in this growing market, are growing every quarter-over-quarter. You see as well that in this year, the growth rate quarter- by- quarter is accelerating. In the first quarter, we grew 28.9. In the second, 29.6, just a little bit more. In the third quarter, 42. In the fourth quarter, we expect a similar growth rate as we have seen in the last quarter.
With this, as I mentioned at the beginning, we are significantly above the market growth, especially if you see the last quarter, 42%, that's 3x the market in any case. If the market is somewhere between 10% and 15%, it might be even 4x the market. That comes, of course, from regional expansion. It comes as well from product expansion, new categories that we already launched. Even though we are a bit late with some of the products, we are outperforming the market everywhere. Now to the EBIT. In the first half of the year, our EBIT margin was 22.6%. In the total of the year, 25.2%. This, of course, comes from a push in Q3 where we had an EBIT margin that is 29.5%.
It is really a significant improvement and a significant number above the average that we are targeting for this year and for the next years. Please do not expect that now every quarter will be around 30%. Do not raise the bar. We are super happy with 25%. We know that we have to invest in marketing activities. We know that we have to invest in more organizations in the countries. We need more salespeople. We need more marketing people. Do not expect that this is something that now every quarter is 29%, but you see that we are very stable around the 25%. This is something that we are quite proud of to finish the quarter with close to 30% EBIT margin, something outstanding. With this number compared to last year, nine-month period, we were on twice as high EBIT in Q3.
That's a significant number and we are really happy to be able to present that. Coming to the regions, the DACH region is still around 50% of our business. It was in H1, it was a little bit below the 50%. It is moving around the 50% with a stable growth of 38%. Everything that we are doing there is paying back, looks like. We are constantly growing and not reaching a level where we could say, "Oh, this now will be tough to continue growing." That is the core of our business. The rest of Europe is growing in the nine-month, 15%. It was a bit more in the first half of the year. We see a couple of effects where we had very good business in six months and then now retailers are selling out.
We expect that this will level out in Q4. The rest of the world is still something that we are not really focusing on. That is, we see that as opportunistic, but we see with doubling the revenue in the first nine months a significant growth. We have a very positive development in Asia. Our office in Shenzhen is delivering products not only to other Asian countries, but as well has a positive result in the Chinese market itself where our products are really appreciated. Normally we avoid talking about the United States a little bit, but the United States had in Q3 the best quarter ever. We see a very positive outlook. We expect that this continues in Q4. We think that we can report some very good news about the United States for the full year.
That is a proof that as well here we are taking that seriously and we have some very good leads as well that could push us in the next year to a completely different level there. The cash flow, this was always one of the weak spots. In the first nine months of this year, operations generated roughly EUR 7 million more cash. As I said at the very beginning, that is something that we really focus on, that we look at. On the other hand, we do not want to lose opportunities and potentials in selling. We still operate with quite a high level of stock, as well a high level of chipsets because we want to take benefits from the chip prices and as well from some shortages that might occur.
We are really safe for the next month to be able to deliver, whereas some others might suffer. In the next one or two years, we will continue focusing on that and we will increase the level of cash flow from operations or decrease our working capital significantly. The negative effects here are EUR 2.6 million investment in R&D developments. The other big part is dividend payment of around EUR 2.4 million. The rest is leveling out a little bit up, a little bit down. Cash level of EUR 15.7 million end of September is on a very good level. On top of this, if we need, if we would need more financing, which we do not see currently, we have as well a bank line secured with Bulgarian Bank.
That is EUR 22 million or EUR 23 million that we can take if we need it, but currently it's no need to take a big amount of that. We use this opportunistically. If we do not want to exchange lever into euro, that will be different after the euro start in Bulgaria next year. Some details here. I will not go through all the numbers, just something that I will now say for the last time because in the next call, this will be over. We have a change in accounting policies, how to account bonuses of customers. If we would not have this change and continue everything as is before, so if you want a like-for-like comparison, revenues would be EUR 1.8 million higher. That would mean a revenue growth of 36.6% instead of the 33% that we show.
We always have some movements between gross margin and marketing expense, especially. That is something that we cannot avoid. That depends on the contracts that we have with some big customers, how we are forced to book that. In general, that has no effect on the bottom line. Everything is under control here. We think that this trend will continue for the rest of the year. The Premium app users grew compared to nine months last year, grew by almost 100%, so close to double, 95% +. The revenues are a little bit below that trend with 76% +. That mainly comes from different booking because if someone buys a 12-month premium account for EUR 35, we have to book this in a deferred way. That means month over month for the coming month. We did not do that in the same period last year.
That's why we have some effects. We still expect around EUR 1 million revenue unchanged for 2025 from the Premium app and EUR 2.5 million for next year. I just repeat what we continuously say. This is something that is on top for us. That is, of course, in the future can be a significant part of our business. We do a lot for that, but we do this really carefully. We do not want to overpush. We do not want to frustrate our customers. Dimitar mentioned that we have more and more customers that are super happy with our application. That is the first step into recurring revenues at a later stage. We see that trend continuing. The guidance is unchanged. We still guide between EUR 145 million and EUR 155 million for this year and EUR 200 million next year.
The 25% EBIT margin stays as well stable, maybe with a little bit of a chance for this year and for next year to be above that. We will see. In general, I would say we are very comfortable with the current estimation of the analysts that see us somewhere in the middle of the guidance for this year, a little bit below maybe. For next year, they see us above our own guidance. We feel comfortable with what all these guys are analyzing. That is why as well we say we have no need to change the guidance. Currently, maybe next year we can talk about that. That leads to the summary. In nine months, 2025 revenue and EBIT are above our targets. We perform in all regions above the market.
Repeat the market somewhere between 10% and 15%, maybe a bit below the 15% in this year. We have an outstanding EBIT in Q3. We have a very positive EBIT development in general with 25.2%. We have a solid improvement in free cash flow. That all shows that our measures that we started a year ago pay back. The regional expansion continues. As well here, we are a little bit late. We have onboarded now the Dutch team during the year. We have onboarded the Polish team. We have a team in Nordics, but we wanted to have a full team in the U.K. already. We are a bit late with that, but that is all opportunities for Q4 or for the next year. We have as well a small delay in some product developments. We are compensating that and sell more of other products.
That's a big chance for next year because the products definitely will come. We have a higher daily cloud activation that is above the revenue. If the revenue is 33% growth and the cloud activation 45%, that shows that there is no jam in the traffic jam or selling jam in the channels. More and more customers use our cloud. That is as well a very positive trend. Number of Premium app subscribers is increasing. We confirm the guidance. I repeat that we are very comfortable with the analysts' expectations. We continue to work on reducing our working capital. On the other hand, we do not want to risk not to make revenue. We continue planning with a comfortable level of chipsets so that we are not running in any risk here.
New product categories that Dimitar talked about will support the growth in 2026 and give some upside potential. Smart circuit breakers that will be available in the market in Q1 next year for us is not only a new product category. It's a very big entrance door into the Pro market. That's one of our key markets for the future that is already increasing from 30% to 35% share. With these smart circuit breakers, not from one day to another, but over time, we expect that this will have the doors wide open into the distribution for the electricians and in other channels. Anyhow, we see that more and more electricians in more and more regions talk very positively about us.
I had a podcast with an energy platform podcast, and this guy titled the podcast, "Shelly, the Darling of the Electricians," which shows that we are no longer seen as a brand that is just for do-it-yourself and for geeks. It is a brand that everyone can use in professional installations and in big buildings, office buildings. That is as well something that we are very proud of. That is something that gives a lot of positive push for the future. That is all. We are now ready for questions, answers, and whatever you want to know additionally.
Yes, thank you very much. We will now move on to the Q&A session for a dynamic conversation. Dear participants, we kindly ask you to ask questions via the audio line. To do so, click on the raise your hand button.
If you have dialed in by phone, please use the key combination star nine followed by star six. However, if you do not have the possibility to speak freely, please place your question in our chat box. As you can see, we got a QR code, and you guys can scan this and get the presentation from this event right away on your devices. We move to the Q&A session. Bastien Bracht, you should be able to speak now and place your question.
Thank you. Very good with us, guys. Let me have two or three questions on that. First, on the EBIT margin, which was really outstanding and much higher than you usually guide for with your 25% in Q3. Of course, we discussed the US dollar weakening and the positive impact on that.
Were there any one-offs positive, or what was the reason for this high EBIT margin in Q3? My second one is on the outlook in 2026. Do you expect to open another country office in other regions where you operate right now, or will you slow down the pace from this year where you opened three new offices? Also on the product roadmap, especially on the locks and cameras, should we expect a meaningful impact financially already in H1, or is this more back-end loaded for the year 2026? Thank you.
Yeah, Bastien, as usual, a lot of questions. I have to be careful that in my age, I do not forget all the questions before answering them. The first question, there was no positive one-off. This was coming from, some part of this is coming from the dollar-euro exchange rate.
Some part of this is coming from some supply chain optimizations. We started shipping the first products not with air freight, but with train. We see that this gives significant economies on the logistics side. We have as well some very fruitful discussions with chip manufacturers and with the factory about reducing the cost of the goods. All this has an effect. If you see as well, we have some cost advantages because we optimized our costs a little bit or did not spend everything that we planned to. There is no one-off. There is no one-time effect. On the other hand, that's why I wanted to manage a little bit the expectations for the future. Our plan is 25% and not 30%. If the 30s% happen, that's fine, but it's nothing that we plan.
We want to invest the money in growth and not invest the money in a better EBIT margin. For the next quarter or for the current quarter, we know that, you know, this is the Black Friday quarter, so we have to be aggressive in pricing. We will as well invest a lot in marketing activities in a lot of countries to be visible, not only on our website and on Google, but as well on a lot of events and in a lot of promotions in all the countries. That is why I try to manage expectations a little bit. We think that we have a positive trend on that. No one-time effect. The second question, now I forgot already. Second question was?
On the outlook 2026 on regional expansion and the second one was on the?
That will continue.
I mentioned during the presentation that we are a little bit late. We have onboarded Netherlands with four people. We have onboarded Poland with five people. In the pipeline, we have Spain and the U.K. with a little delay, but we have identified the leadership teams for both countries. We will start soon, latest in Q1 next year. This time we are 100% sure because we have identified the people. We are looking for someone for France because we had a change there. We had to unfortunately take someone out of our team. We are more or less everywhere in Europe. In Italy, we have two people now. We are in process hiring one or two more. In Nordics as well, we will expand the team because it is not a country, it is a region.
Currently we have four people working there. We need two or three more to be really present physically as well in Sweden and Norway and Finland a bit more and to localize things more. We see that the localization, especially in professional business, pays back. We see as well that in Nordics, we have a very high success in the professional channel. If you ask me about the Pro and do-it-yourself mix in Nordics, I would say we are more on 60/40, or maybe 55/45, so 45% share of professionals already. That is really, really a very strong achievement. That gives a lot of hope for the future. Yes, we will continue and we will soon have in all big countries or regions like Netherlands is taking care for Benelux. Spain will take care for Iberia, so Spain and Portugal.
We will have people everywhere on the ground in all our regions.
Yeah, how about a third question? Let's answer for when we expect the revenue from the new products, especially cameras, locks, okay, and the breakers. For me, this is separated. What we could expect for the cameras, we expect to showing some results in the first half of next year. This is because the camera is the pure retail product as the other ones. We can start, we will continue selling them through the existing channels. Also, the production cycle is not so sophisticated. It is the usual one as we do. There is no third parties, additional third parties, which we need to expect something for them. For cameras, we're expecting the results to happen H1. Probably something, but very limited in Q1 and much more significant in Q2 next year.
Very similar with the locks. For the locks, we're expecting to show the results in the first half of the year. For the breakers, it'll be opposite. Maybe second half of the year. There are maybe two reasons. The first one, we just finished certification and production time is quite long for the breakers because lots of the much more components, third parties, especially for the breakers, as is it, no communication controlling part. We expect the first manufacture, the first batch of the breakers to be available, to be in the March, the Q1. This is only the first batch, not the main, not the main quantity. Even 100,000-200,000 is not serious quantity. After that, we'll start selling them. Maybe the peak will be second half of the year. Then we can present something.
The second, yeah, the second reason for this one is the breakers coming through the different channels. There is a much more professional installation. Maybe some of the retail customers can buy them, can try them, but it's mainly oriented to professional installation. Usually, professional channels are a bit lazy. They react slower to the new products. Even with the huge interest and demands as we see now, we know that this is not coming one to the next day. This will take time. For this one, we expect for the breakers to have really results in the second half of the year. Okay.
Yeah, just to add something to the breakers because it fits to the first question, the second question.
We are now starting hiring dedicated people in the countries where we already have teams that are concentrating only on smart breakers and on the Pro channel. That, of course, I mean, we still have some time because if the products arrive in March, we will have the preparation in Q1 to have serious talks with the channels. The first feedbacks are very positive. We will as well invest in people because we know that this is a completely different business than retail business. One more to the locks. We have updated the lock and when the year is over, we will have sold round about 10,000 pieces of the existing one with some small updates. The lock that will arrive now in December is a new one with, or it's the same form factor, but will close and open in two seconds.
That's absolute state of the art. Not this long movement of the lock anymore. The other thing is that we found out that production time and preparation time, because it's metal parts, that takes much longer than we thought at the beginning coming from our plastic world and easier products. We do not want to make mistakes and compromises. That's why this takes a little bit longer. Next year, we think that we can make a huge jump in revenue with the locks. Similar to the cameras.
Yeah. Okay, thank you. One add-on question on the EBIT margin. If you say no positive one-offs and more like supply chain improvements, this sounds like a structural better EBIT margin.
If you want to, not want to go down, but might aim for 25% again, would you invest this rather in additional marketing or in better pricing or in additional product development? What is your thinking behind that?
I think, let me answer this one. I think it's a mix of everything which we can do. If you see more EBIT, then mean that maybe we can do something else. Let's say it could be a different approach. The new product definitely is coming, but maybe we can speed up the regional expansion, not to waiting a bit because anyhow, as a public company, we need to balance between the profit, between the investments and everything just to keep the promises and to show the good results and much more predictable results and stability.
It could be a little bit on marketing, but marketing also related, for example, to in some countries where we're not present to invest more and to be much more recognizable as a brand. We could expand the teams. Also, we can go start working on the verticals, which we're talking every day and every month with the Wolfgang when we can go to the verticals, for example, just with the shading manufacturers or we talk only for the water pump manufacturers because there is a huge business itself, but we need to concentrate too. This needs the people, this needs materials, this needs everything. This is something which we're working for this one in this direction when we've seen that there is an opportunity to make it further, not to postpone it, for example, for the second half of the year. Yeah, and this is the main reason.
Nothing to add.
Yeah.
Okay, thank you very much.
Thank you for your question. We got some other participants raising their hand, but in the chat box, we got some questions as well. I will read one out for you. What are your thoughts regarding Black Friday or Cyber Monday now, which is a huge event, especially at Amazon? Are you expecting lower Black Friday results this year due to the situation with Amazon? There are some other questions relating to the current situation with Amazon. Will you release numbers for Black Friday sales like in the past years?
Yeah, that's a habit already. We will release Black Friday results. We will see after Black Friday how Black Friday was. So far, we were able to compensate whatever we did not sell to Amazon, as our numbers prove. We are well prepared for Black Friday.
We will not change our Amazon policy if this is one of the follow-up questions. We see that what we are doing there is very well received from other channels. We are able to compensate. For us, it is more important to be stronger in other retail channels and pro channels than to get the last million of revenue done with a desperate movement that we would make. We will not do that. What is the effect on Amazon, sorry, on Black Friday in total? I can tell you after Black Friday. We are well prepared and we expect good numbers. Will this be a huge boost? We will see. On the other hand, we are as well compensating with being stronger in the Pro market.
That's a more constant and a straight development and not having these peaks as the Black Friday sales and the retail sales. We will see. We are still positive with Q4. That's what I said. Otherwise, we would have to change our guidance. We will not do desperate things to make the last euro revenue that we could do.
I also don't know, this is important. Our products are still available with Amazon. They are there through our partner network. They are working with Amazon. The difference is that we are not actively selling as a vendor to Amazon, but there are other ways. I think at the moment, maybe we've seen some such of the balancing, then Amazon is fine with that. We're fine with that. The products are there.
The only which is the big difference is not crazy prices for our products in Amazon, which is important for us. This is our target from the very beginning to have a much more flat pricing and offers around the market. There do not be somebody which has dropped the price significantly because this causes a huge additional impact and complaints for our other distributors. Do not work with Amazon, does not think that you can buy the products from Amazon. This means that we work on a different procedure, which for us is much more healthy for the future development of the Shelly products and wines.
Thank you very much. We therefore move on to one of the participants raising their hand. Alexandre Despret, you should be able to speak now.
Yes, thank you. Alexandre Despret from Badel Europe.
I have a question regarding also the Amazon situation. We know that you usually have a kind of dependency on two major distributors. In the past two years, you managed to broaden your distribution channels. My question is simple. Have you managed to reduce the dependency on Allnet as well? Or has this Amazon situation created a further dependency on Allnet?
Allnet is our biggest distributor and is our main distributor for the biggest region. That is why the revenues with Allnet are growing. I would not call this dependency because we have a balanced way of working together. That is not something like if Allnet tomorrow makes something completely crazy, we would have a problem. We are working in a very close partnership. I would say that we are equally depending on each other. That is a bit different with Amazon.
On the other hand, we are working on balancing that out. We have a very strong Italian distributor. I'm just coming back from a trip to London where we talked to our main distributor for the U.K., still on a low level with very high expectations for the future. Everyone is positive about what can happen in the U.K., still this year and in the next year. In the Nordics, we are widely distributed without being depending on someone. I would say in general, we are reducing the dependency significantly and not only to Amazon. Balancing this more out over more countries and more distributors, and that's quite a positive trend.
Okay. Thank you.
Thank you for your question. We move on to one question out of the chat box.
You make reference to an average market growth of 10%-15%. What companies are you comparing with and what is the estimate composed of?
Yeah, so basically, first, we take market data that is available from Statista and from there is a Nordics company called Berg Insight. They publish some numbers. And then you read newspapers and everyone is talking about these 10%-15%. Now, the other question that is a bit detached from that, what are our competitors? That's the question that comes every now and then. Of course, we have our famous competitor in Nordics, in Sweden, Plejd. Everyone is talking about Plejd as well because Plejd is as well public listed, whereas other companies are not public listed.
In Germany, one of our main competitors in most of the areas where we are in would be Homematic, a company that is already 25 years, 30 years in the business. They are making more revenues than we do. Then we have in heating control, we have Tado. Tado is not public. Homematic is not public. So complicated to get some numbers. Whatever we hear from the market, that leads to this number of 10%-15% and more on the 10% and 15% in this year, as it was already end of last year, a little bit below the 15%. In general, everyone sees as well, Statista sees the market in average growth for the next years on 15%. That is why we have this number.
There are a lot of players in the market that are smaller, that are not really on our market screen where it is complicated to get data, but we know that a lot of them are not doing well. We think as well that a lot of them will not exist in the next two to three years because there will be a consolidation going on. We plan to lead that consolidation without talking about acquisitions, but some companies simply will not be on the market anymore because they make significant losses and there is no change of that. One day, investors will say they pull out the money.
Thank you very much. There is another participant raising his hand. Ben, you should be able to speak now and place your question.
Yes, hello. Good morning. Wolfgang Specht, from Berenberg.
Once again, one for you, Wolfgang. On the competition side, do you see moves from the mass market producers in China regarding their pricing, or is this, let's say, pretty stable? The second question would be for Dimitar and the impressive product pipeline. Do you still believe that your development team is large and strong enough, or is there a need to ramp that up to also have, let's say, new developments for the years beyond 2026?
First question, and I look as well to Dimitar, we do not see aggressive movements from Chinese competitors. We see that the typical players are in the market like SwitchBot and SONOFF and Tado and, sorry, Tado, TP-Link. There is no big movement from their side.
We see other players coming to the market like IKEA just announced that they will be strong in bulbs, which is not one of our core competencies. Currently, we do not have bulbs. Very simple products. We do not see a big threat coming from there. What we see is that, and of course, we talk to some of these competitors that obviously no one is really happy with the profit. Somehow we have found the formula with excellent products, with a very good reputation at low prices, competitive prices and excellent quality that a lot of other companies have problems to follow. That is one of our big differentiators. We do not see a threat coming from this angle currently.
We do not see much lower prices coming from China, beside the fact that we saw the gap to Chinese competitors shrinking in the last years because they increased the prices and we did not. There is no big trouble coming from this area. Now about R&D.
Yeah, about me. Okay, in general, developers is never enough. That is in general. If there is a thousand here, believe me, I can find a job for every one of them and we can speed up like crazy in development in different areas, verticals, helping other people. This is the first one. Organization must be ready for such a rapidly growth. The next one, the AI is here and even the AI is still not capable to do nothing alone.
This is the good right hand for our existing developers to speed up a little bit the process, coding, helping them to solve some issues. Yeah, we'll continue hiring new developers from the hardware side, from the software side, but nothing significant. I think for the next year is additional 40 people-50 people. If there is some huge opportunity, which we need to follow, then we can look for more people. I think this is something like a stable growth as we do this year, especially from the development side.
Thanks a lot.
Yeah.
Thank you. There is one question in our chat. How is your outlook for the U.S. market for 2026? Will you be focusing more on expanding in the U.S. market and how important would be Amazon in that case?
I thought I have answered this during the presentation because I said we might have some very positive news beginning of the year when we talk about the full year 2025. The U.S. market is growing overproportionally or we are growing overproportionally in the United States or in North and South America. That is quite positive. We have a couple of very interesting talks and negotiations going on with some key retailers that could really be an accelerator. Even without that, we see a very positive trend. It is a bit too early now to talk individually about the United States. Let us do that next year and see how this year finishes. It looks much more or much better than it looked a couple of months or a year ago.
There is also a couple of new products which are coming, especially for the U.S., which are the different price segments and different categories, mainly plug-and-play categories because for the U.S., we do not have so many plug-and-play products here on the affordable pricing. Now we target in this segment, but it's too early to know. There is some kind of experiments and we have a plan, but really it's hard to stay behind some concrete numbers.
It's a bit too early. We see light at the end of the famous tunnel. We hope that this is not the train that is coming in our direction. That is really the end of the tunnel. On the other hand, there was a question about Amazon. We are on Amazon Marketplace, so we control the pricing on Amazon 100%.
In this year especially, we see a much faster growth on our own website compared to the growth that we have on Amazon. We see as well a very nice development on still a very small level in the B2B segment in the U.S. market. As I already said, we are in discussion with a US distributor that is very strong in a couple of U.S. retail chains. We have sent them samples. They have discussed this with their customers. That looks very positive now, but still not signed. That is why I do not want to create too much imagination here and fantasies about what will go on in the U.S. next year. We try to manage a little bit of expectations as well on this side.
Thank you. Regarding the product roadmap, you previously mentioned there were some delays.
Could you share the current status and what customers and investors should expect in terms of upcoming product launches and future rollouts?
No, I can tell when we talk about the delays, the first one, let's say we're thinking that the breakers will be there end of this year. Because certification is quite longer, the first time we work with them, it takes a little bit more time. Certifications happens not in September, happens now beginning of November. Production will start now, but the first breakers will be available on the market for the next quarter. I think for the cameras, it's a very, very similar situation. We start with the idea that maybe for Christmas, we could have some very limited numbers of the cameras, which will not be important for the revenue at all.
Because even if you sell the 10 or 20,000 cameras on the pricing, this will not be a significant part of the revenue. Also, we move them for the beginning of next year because the development, because the other things are coming. This is usual. Nobody can expect because we do the new things, which before that does not exist. We are targeting something to start on time, but there are sometimes delays. The good thing is delay is not everywhere because as we promised, for example, and as we are targeting the strip, the Power Strip is there and selling very well, like crazy. We were very happy with this one. The other products, the other products which we are talking about, they are on time on the market.
For these new trends, for example, there is a month delay or month and a half delay for development, for certification. This is from where it's coming. Believe me, it's usual. Sometimes I think even without disclosure, there are products which delay for six months, from what I remember a year ago, just because we are fighting with the physics and real issues how to make it work properly and good. There is no single product or single one which is dependent too. There are many. I can remind you that Wolfgang said before, if everything happens as we are showing and as we are planning, then next year will be.
Revenue. We will not say any number.
Yeah, I cannot say any number, but it will be completely different.
Because we know that all the time there's a different issue, channel issue, selling or some supply chain issue or even with development delays. Something else happens, then this is the reason to showing not what we expect based on the 100% success. Yeah.
Thanks. You talked about the Nordic expansion earlier on. There's one question about the process and the progress, especially the improvements following the partnership with Ahlsell. Can you give some flavor on the competitive landscape? Are there any regions or products that experience higher competition? Also, can you elaborate on competition with Plejd?
Yeah, so Plejd is a very strong brand, very well positioned in the Swedish market especially, but has some trouble to get foot on the ground in the rest of Europe, a little bit as well in Norway.
In the rest of Europe, they have trouble to land. In Sweden itself, they are very strong and dominant in the lighting business. They now have as well some downlights or some LED spots. I would not say that they are a full competitor because they do not offer the full range that we have. That is a company we look at. We say, wow, they are doing a good job. They have good products. Our products can do much more. They have a very strong position in the pro channel. This is something that with the wholesalers, Ahlsell, Rexel, and others in all Nordic countries, but especially in Sweden, where these wholesalers really help us. They are very open, much more open than in other regions of Europe because they are looking desperately for an alternative to dominant players like Plejd.
We are one of these alternatives, and that is why they help us. They are pushing together with us installer trainings, presence in the stores. This all is something we know, that the professional market is not reacting from one day to another. Dimitar just said earlier, a bit lazy, so slow moving. That is something that will pay back for us in the next year, in 2027, 2028. We do not want to stop business in the near future, so we need some positive developments. In general, Nordics for us, especially in Q2 and Q3 this year, is a region that is growing significantly overproportionally. That is one of the regions that really help us to develop in the way as we do.
I think about the competitors because this is the main question. Everywhere there are competitors.
For the small company, big companies, everywhere there are competitors. This is something which is more important. At the moment, we do not see in our radar the competitor which is coming close to the numbers which will make, forget about the device and profit, but 2,000 daily new households connected to our cloud. We know that 1,000 more is connected to third-party clouds using our devices. This is, in total, 3,000 new households in Europe. There are no players. I mean, compare with the biggest names, Legrand or ABB, or everybody working in that direction, they are far away from these numbers. There is no other way, no other players which can cover this one. Maybe some of them make 1,000-2,000 installations from their devices. We talk here about 15,000 devices daily, 3,000 devices, 3,000 new households daily.
Believe me, at the moment, we cannot see on the radar a company which can make 1/3 of what we are doing in Europe. Maybe all of them together do something, but even the strongest competitors in different countries are limited and they cannot really go close to what we are doing.
Thank you very much. We have participants raising their hand. Vesselin Kirilov, you should be able to speak now and place your question.
Hello. Thank you for the great result. I have a few questions. One to Mr. Wolfgang. Can you give us your prediction about China? How do you expect China to grow for Shelly? Just roughly, not numbers. What is your feeling about China?
Very positive. Very positive. We have a very good team there. Without big efforts needed from here, the team is performing very well.
They understand the local market and our products are very well appreciated as a high-quality product. The Chinese that buy our product, and it's still on a small level. I mean, you have seen the total rest of the world region is still small, but they consider our products as a very strong European quality brand. This is something that gives a positive outlook for the future. I see China and the Asian region very positive with a very good team on the ground there and with very good results.
Thank you very much. Mr. Mit, two questions for you. First one, AI and Shelly, can you be enough careful of this future because everyone is talking about AI, heating, and expectations, etc., etc.? Can you give us a little bit of your thoughts about the AI and Shelly?
Yeah, I can tell.
First, many things which everybody shows is far away from the AI. Usually, this is machine learning or machine. This is why they present AI because nobody is talking anymore for machine learning, but 99% is something like that. What we are working on, especially for the customers, we have some tries. Some of our better customers already have access. Others will be coming soon where we can make for the customers some complicated things easier. As an example, if you need a scene not to go into to choose the devices and touch on your displays many times, you can just talk. You can just say, "Okay, when I come in the room, I want to wipe to switch it on.
When I leave, I want one minute later, so it wipes to be switched off. This will happen automatically because the AI will help to recognize what the customers want to and make a sense for the customer. This is something which we are doing now. The second thing, some of the devices we build in the AI, for example, the new sensor, the new presence sensors, which are counting the people, there is some kind of there, maybe much closer to the machine warning is that which also counts the people and makes a procedure. This is the dog, this is the cat, or this is somebody else. Especially for the cameras, I think this is the best what happens here because for the cameras, we now try and test AI, and it's working for us, and it's working very well for the customer.
No matter for the object recognition or face recognition, number Plejd recognition, some different situation detection, for example, a fire or something from the camera, the AI has the best approach. Yeah, we're working on. In every team, from the backend, frontend, there are specialized people which are working, investigating, and thinking how we can use it. Yeah.
Thank you very much. A couple more questions for you, Mitko. Mr. Wolfgang is a world-class player. Mr. Vilanek also, he's a world-class. You're a world-class genius. Don't you think it's a time we need to add an investment banker like from JP Morgan, Barclays, or BlackRock to the board?
No, not for this question.
Okay, you cannot answer.
No, we have no idea.
Second one. Just think for that.
Why we need them? What to do with them?
Okay. I don't know. I'm just curious.
Okay, same from our side. Okay.
Okay. And the second thing, I checked with my lawyers. You are able to print on the box of every Shelly device a QR code which can lead to the Tetra. That's not advertising. Most of the countries allow you to do it. This also, you can think as an idea because you do not ask the people to buy your shares. You just inform them that you are there.
Okay.
Thank you very much for the results and good luck, guys.
Thank you very much.
Thanks.
Thank you.
Thank you. There is one more participant raising their hand. Angel Rabarczynski, you should be able to speak now. I hope I pronounced this name slightly well. There are no raised hands anymore. Yes, Georgi Reykov, you should be able to speak now.
Hello, do you hear me?
Yes.
Yep. I don't hear you for some reason. Sorry about that. If you hear me, I would like to know about the Bulgarian factory. Is it on track to start production? I believe that during the AGM in the summer, it was mentioned something around March 2026.
Yeah. Okay. To confirm, yes, this is the pipeline. It's exactly like that. We must make it work to end of March. Everything is going well. I think the building is already prepared. There's some installation which we need around the machines is still under preparation and installment there. The main machines are coming and will be delivered at the end of January, middle of February. Then we'll finish the project in March. This is ongoing and this is, yeah, at the moment, everything is on track there.
I think we must because the European program which is financing this project is also the end of March is the deadline.
Hopefully, Mr. Reykov could hear your answer. We move on to the last questions in our chat box. Are there any capacity constraints or bottlenecks based on the current situation and expected strong growth going forward? Any significant investments expected in the coming one to two years? Thank you very much.
These were three questions. The answer is no, no, no. No capacity constraints. We are constantly talking with our main factories. We have more than one at partner factories. We are able to increase the capacity significantly in the next year if we want. We need a couple of months' time to do that. Our partner is very flexible there. This does not need any investments from our side.
On the other hand, we see that with the growing quantities, we have a lot of advantages because we can now have production lines per product. For the plug, one production line that is producing the same product the whole year. For our electro meters, the same. That will give us some cost advantages and support our strong bottom line growth, so EBIT growth or EBIT development. Once again, I want to manage expectations. The board is now talking about 35% or so. We do not see any problems there. That is all under control and very positive. Okay. Something to add?
No. No. All good.
Okay. There is a question concerning the partnerships and the build-up on teams abroad. Can you tell us more about the work of the new team in Poland?
Are you managing to start working with the identified partners, or are there any difficulties?
There are always difficulties. What we see is as soon as we have the teams on the ground, they know much better what the market requires. They know the right wholesalers, the right retailers. In Poland, because this was a specific question, we see that we have now contracts with much more distributors than before. We are as well operating local trainings and local languages that support our growth in the professional channel. We see in Q3, we already saw a very good development there. In Q4, we expect accelerating that still on a low level. We will see significant results in 2026 and 2027. That is the same for every country.
When we started to put the team in Nordics on the ground, it took a year or one and a half to get benefits. Now we see that it is really taking off. We expect the same in every country where we put people. We have existing business, so we are not starting from zero. The next level then will be to, let me say, to professionalize that, to go to the right distributors, to the right wholesalers, to identify the right influencers, to go to the local communities, the local tech magazines. Where do we have to be? You can always do that much better if you speak the local language, know the right people in the country. That is what is happening basically everywhere. In Poland, we see the first steps in this direction. A local team is always a small team at the beginning.
We add people if we see that we need to add people. It usually consists of a technical support person, a marketing person, and one or two salespeople. We see what is next and what is needed.
Great. We got two questions from Mr. Wolański.
Yeah, but let's just be to ask questions which we answer for because we can stay the whole day and answer the questions. Just somehow our presentation. I think if there are additional questions, they can ask our investor relation department.
We will do so.
Okay. Thank you very much.
Okay. Thank you. Great. With that said, I will copy them and send it directly to the investor relations department. Ladies and gentlemen, thanks for your interest in Shelly SE. With that and concerning the time, we come to the end of today's earnings call.
Should further questions arise at a later time, please feel free to contact investor relations. Thank you to you both for the presentation and answering the questions so far. I wish you all a lovely remaining week. I guess I hand over to Mr. Dimitrov for some final remarks. Is that right?
Okay. Thank you very much for everybody for participating. Yeah, we do our best for the company and to deliver the results. Thank you for your trust. Yeah, as every time, we promise to continue like that. Okay. Thank you.