BRBI BR Partners S.A. (BVMF:BRBI11)
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May 8, 2026, 5:06 PM GMT-3
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Earnings Call: Q3 2022

Nov 11, 2022

Danilo Catarucci
Managing Director and Head of Capital Markets, BR Partners

Good morning everyone, and thank you for waiting. Welcome to the conference call to present the results of the third quarter of 2022. We'd like to inform you that this conference call is being recorded and will be available on the company IR website, where you'll find the complete presentation. During the presentation, all participants must have their microphone turned off. Following the presentation, we will start the Q&A session. To ask questions, click on the Q&A icon at the bottom of your screen and type in your question. If you prefer to use the microphone to ask your questions, just let us know by message and we will send you a request to activate your microphone.

As a disclaimer, we emphasize that the information contained in this presentation and any statements made during this conference call relating to BR Partners business prospects, projections, and operating and financial goals are based on beliefs and expectations of the company's management as well as on information which are currently available. Forward-looking statements are not a guarantee of performance. They involve risks, uncertainties, and assumptions because they refer to future events and therefore depend on circumstances that may or may not occur. Investors should understand that general economic conditions, market conditions, and other operating factors may affect the company's future performance and lead to results that differ materially from those expressed in such forward-looking statements. Today, we have the following company's officers present here. Ricardo Lacerda, CEO. Marcelo Costa, CFO. Danilo Catarucci, Managing Director and Head of Capital Markets, and Vinicius Carmona, DRI.

I will give the floor to Vinicius now, who will begin his presentation.

Vinicius Carmona
IRO and Institutional, BR Partners

Good morning everyone, and thank you for attending our conference call to present the results of the first nine months of 2022. We highlight that due to the cyclical nature of our business, we constantly evaluate our performance, focus on the accumulated results, not only on the quarterly results. Despite a more challenging scenario with monetary tightening worldwide, political instability in Brazil, and distortions caused by a negative IPCA index in the quarter, we were able to show growth both in revenue and profit. Let's begin by presenting in slide two the highlights of the first nine months of the year. The total revenue reached BRL 290 million, a 15% growth over 2021.

Net profit reached BRL 113 million, an increase of 5% compared to 2021, resulting in a net margin of 39%. The annualized ROE reached 20%. It's important to note that our ROAE is 100% an accounting indicator. BR Partners is one of the only listed financial institutions in Brazil to present its results without any management adjustments. The Basel ratio remains stable at 24.8% in September 2022. The efficiency and remuneration ratios reached 35.5% and 22% respectively, showing once again the company's operating leverage. The private securities and bridge loans portfolio reached BRL 1.3 billion at the end of September 2022, representing an increase of 20% compared to June and 107% compared to September 2021.

On the next slide, we'll also take the opportunity to announce the continuity of the development of our capital markets area, which now uses capital strategically to expand and diversify its activities in the debt issuance market. We issued BRL 4.5 billion of debt in the first nine months of the year in 31 operations, seven of which were debentures issuance, a market that we began to access more competitively after the IPO. We also highlight that we approved the payment of interim dividends for the third quarter of 2022 in a meeting of the board of directors yesterday. BRL 0.18 per unit will be paid, totaling BRL 18.9 million in dividends. The date ex-dividend will be November 21, 2022, and the disbursement will occur on November 30, 2022.

Moving on, we will explain the results of our business units starting on slide four with investment banking. The investment banking area presented revenue of BRL 108 million in the first nine months. A decrease of 16.5% compared to the same period in 2021 due to a less heated business environment than the record year of 2021, mainly regarding M&A. The scenario experienced throughout 2022 and the increase in the cost of capital for companies and the shrinking of the stock market impacted the growth rate of some companies via acquisitions. In addition, the market throughout 2022 proved to be very volatile with significant events in the international scenario. And major uncertainties in Brazil's political landscape, which obviously impacted the activity level in the area, especially regarding M&A.

However, we still see the large company sector in Brazil with good asset quality and adequate liability management. Besides a panorama of different economic sectors in a constructive and productive environment generally. In IB, we have managed a solid and diversified pipeline with a strong deal flow and a healthy revenue level. In the year 2022, we announced 15 transactions. Most recently, we announced two M&A transactions advising GreenYellow, a clean energy generator, and V.tal, specialized in consulting to IT and telecom sector. We also advise on the corporate reorganization of the Camil Group. Along the year, we also advised on 12 other transactions, highlighting iconic deals such as Fleury's purchase of the Instituto Hermes Pardini and Tupy's purchase of MWM. Talking about diversification in the economic sectors in which we operate and the type of advisory services.

Considering the last 12 months, the area announced 23 transactions distributed in a diversified pipeline, as you can see in the upper graph on the right, highlighting the oil and gas, retail, and energy sectors. With regard to the types of investment banking's advisory services that we provide, we can see in the lower right chart an important diversification of our activities with a natural presence in M&A. It's important to note that since the end of last year, we have expanded our special situations and restructuring services, a pillar that has been gaining more space within advisory IB, where we have a wide presence ranging from debt renegotiation, planning of a new capital structure for companies, sale of non-strategic assets, corporate reorganizations, and even acting in court-ordered restructuring plans. Now we will present the capital markets highlights on slide five .

In capital markets, we continue to mature our thesis focused on financial disintermediation. With capital being used strategically as a firm guaranteeing some operations and a team of excellence, we continue to strengthen our presence in new debt markets, mainly debentures, infra debentures, and CRAs. What we have experienced throughout the year 2022 is a well-heated debt market despite the antagonism of high interest rates. In this sense, some factors explain the good performance of the capital market in Brazil. First, our market is becoming more sophisticated, with new companies seeking alternative sources of funding with longer terms and more competitive rates compared to direct bank financing. On the other hand, with a more consolidated local investor market. In addition, the fact that the market is closed to funding via the stock market has opened space to DCM to absorb part of the company's demand for funds.

We also experienced an active moment in infrastructure projects, especially in the energy sector. Finally, the investor appetite for fixed income products increased with the Selic rate reaching 13.75%. In other words, this scenario culminated in good opportunities to issue debt in the first nine months. In relation to revenue, the area reached BRL 69.6 million, an increase of 8.4% compared to the same period last year. In the quarter, we had the impact on the profitability of the securities we carry in IPCA+ due to the deflation that was presented during the quarter, but also a very positive dynamic of structuring and distribution fees. Jumping to the bottom left chart, we can observe the development and diversification of our platform. We can show a greater diversification in the mix of debt issues since the IPO in June 2021.

The volume of issuance reached BRL 4.5 billion in the period, an increase of 56% over 2021. 31 debt issuances and nine were CRI, five were FIIs, seven debenture issues, two CRAs, and other eight issuers of fixed income products such as sale-leasebacks and built-to-suits. In the bottom right chart, we present the sector distribution of clients according to debt issues made in the last 12 months, highlighting the dispersion of the sector and new products with new issuers. Finally, we are prepared to continue to capture good opportunities in the market, focused on structuring debt for good clients and aiming at the continuous development of the Brazilian capital market. Now I give the floor to our CFO, Marcelo Costa, who will continue the presentation.

Marcelo Costa
CFO, BR Partners

On the next slide, we'll show the results of treasury shares, sales and structuring, investments and other revenues. In the first nine months of 2022, the area continued consolidating the expansion of its activities with the capital raised with the IPO. The total revenue reached BRL 42.6 million, an increase of 11% compared to the same period of last year. The accumulated growth reflects the greater competitiveness of the area with the capital increase, which made it possible to increase the credit limits and access new customers. Counting on the upgrades we had from some rating agencies to the AA-, which enabled us to access bigger clients, big clients.

In terms of activity in this quarter, the environment continues to be good, but we must consider that we experienced a deflationary environment in July, August, and September, which affected the volume of IPCA debt issues and therefore the demand for swap and hedging instruments. We consider these market variations as normal in the area activities, and we already see a normalization of activities in this fourth quarter. In investments, we presented revenues of BRL 3.6 million in the period, representing a growth of 72% in relation to 2021. This growth in revenues reflects the growth of our AUM with the beginning of the management of FIP PATS at the end of 2021.

In the remuneration of capital, we observed the growth of 272% in revenue, reflecting the capital invested in CDI due to the increase in the Selic rates and the capital increase in June 2021 from our IPO. Next, we will present more details about our capital and funding. Slide seven, we show the growth of private securities and bridge loans portfolio, which reached BRL 1.3 billion at the end of September 2022. A growth of 20% in relation to June and 107% compared to September last year. This increase is explained by the growth of private securities portfolio in line with our strategy of using capital in an intelligent way and in a more active way in the debt issues we structure and co-invest with our investors.

It's worth noting that 100% of this portfolio is composed of debt securities that we originate, structure, and distribute from companies to which we perform a complete due diligence by our credit and risk areas. We highlight that 95% of our portfolio is rated between AA and B, with no delinquent credit according to the criteria of BACEN's resolution. Also, in the first graph, we present the bank's leverage, which reached 2x in September 2022, a considerable growth over the periods, but it still leaves plenty of room for the implementation of our strategy of asset growth over the next quarters.

Regarding the Basel ratio, we ended September 2022 with a ratio of 24.8%, a stable level in relation to the previous quarter and really adequate that would allow us to continue to implement our strategy to expand our portfolio of private securities and bridge loans and our derivative operations. We point out that 100% of the company's Basel ratio is level one. In slide eight, we show the evolution of the company's equity, which reached BRL 771 million in September 2022, while the equity of the bank stood at BRL 672 million. We point out that all dividend payments are made from cash generated by made outside the bank, and that the bank's results have been recapitalized, which can be observed by the 8% growth in the year-on-year comparison.

At the bottom of the slide, we present the evolution of the company's funding. We reached funding of approximately BRL 1.3 billion at the end of September 2022. A 94% increase growth, compared to the same period of 2021. I would like to highlight that we keep growing our funding in order to be ready to increase our portfolios and keeping comfortable levels of liquidity. The average funding term with third parties reached 257 calendar days. In slide nine, we show the evolution of revenues generated directly in the clients' businesses, which considers investment banking revenues, capital markets fees, treasure sales and structuring revenues, and the management fees for our FIPs. In the gray area, we show the revenues from the capital invested in CDI and the private bonds that we carry in our balance sheet.

We can see that the revenue with clients remained stable in the period, reaching BRL 210 million. However, when we open up these revenues, we have a better insight of how the IPO was a fundamental pillar to strengthen the investment banking activity by strengthening revenues from clients in capital market fees. Since having the ability to grant firm collaterals allowed us to be more competitive in structuring the ventures and CRAs, and also to develop the treasury sales and structuring platform by increasing credit limits with our clients and greater regulatory capital. In the next slides, we will talk about our performance indicators.

In slide number 10, in the graph on the left, we show the evolution of service revenues, which reached 50% of the total revenue, a natural dilution in relation to 2021 due to the greater contribution of capital revenues from the IPO. In the graph on the right, our efficiency and compensation ratios reached 35.5% and 22% respectively, remaining at healthy levels and showing that our operation leverage even with a considerable increase in staff compared to last year and with an increase in clerk expenses due to our growth. On slide 11, we present the evolution of profit, which advanced 5% in the period. The net margin remained at 39%, which is a healthy level.

As for profitability, our ROAE reached 20% in line with the business plan that we had before the IPO, even with a much more challenging business environment. The reduction of the ROE reflects the capital increase that took place in 2021. In summary, we kept a strong pace of revenue generation in the period combined with a positive, a good profitability, and remained positive with the current marketing dynamics. We keep generating value for our investors. We are now at your disposal to answer the Q&A session. Thank you.

Danilo Catarucci
Managing Director and Head of Capital Markets, BR Partners

Now we will start the Q&A session. In order to ask questions, please click on the Q&A icon at the bottom of your screen and type your question. When you are announced, a prompt to activate your microphone will appear on the screen, then you must activate your microphone to ask questions.

We kindly ask you to formulate all the questions at once. Let's go to our first question from Pedro Leduc, a sell-side analyst at Itaú BBA. We will open your audio for you to ask your question, Pedro. Please go ahead.

Pedro Leduc
Sell-Side Analyst, Itaú BBA

I was muted. Good afternoon, almost. Can you hear me? Thank you. I'm gonna ask you a few questions. The first one is, like, for the capital markets in Brazil, we had a bad impact from deflation and inflation that impacted on your securities. I'd like to talk about the impact from this for the next quarters, or if you will increase your hedge levels. Looking at that from a structural way, is it possible to mix the liabilities of the bank to compensate the cost of the hedge? That's my first question.

Ricardo Lacerda
CEO, BR Partners

Thank you, Pedro, for your first question. It's important to say that in our portfolio in which we showed for of 1.3 billion, we have an exposure to IPCA of 20% of our portfolio approximately. It's not a big exposure, but we had, of course, three months suffering all those political questions and issues and the deflation in Brazil that was very intense. We had 0.7% of deflation in some months. We see that yesterday we saw the IPCA of October that was a little high. We think it's normalized now, and we now see the revenue of the fourth quarter in line with the previous quarters.

In relation to the hedge issue, we have a small percent, but what we have been doing is that to start capturing IPCA via some stimulated subsidized products like LCIs, LCAs, and we have been lowering our exposure. This exposure is only on some operations that we had, especially CRI operations that may have some prepayment during the life of. Sometimes to have a hedge with derivatives is not always the best solution. All those operations that we have been doing recently, especially in the debentures operations, we have been doing the hedge at start. It's a thing. It's an issue that impacted, of course, but much more because of the intensity of the deflation, other than the size of our exposure.

Just to complement this issue, we didn't have any relevant impact in terms of revenue or IPCA or disconnection of portfolio as we could see in other institutions that published their results. When we comment on the negative IPCA, it's a little of that and the impact of the number of issuances that this IPCA negative. Some operations that we saw like a high volatility and the pricing of some operations, so we decided to opt out. So it's a market question and risk assessment due to those three months of negative IPCAs. But it's not nothing that we have to correct in our balance sheet or something like that.

Pedro Leduc
Sell-Side Analyst, Itaú BBA

Thank you, Lacerda and Marcelo .

Ricardo Lacerda
CEO, BR Partners

Talking about volatile markets and thinking about your activity in the capital markets and M&A. We have a credit cycle that's worse, and it has nothing to do with your activity. There are some signs of worsening of the credit offer into retail, like civil construction is a little hard. It's a little more challenging. Thinking about your activity for, like, issuance of fixed income products or your appetite to keep growing your portfolio, like, your credit portfolio. The scenario probably is making you think a little more over this area. Next is M&A that due to this difficult market, you can see some opportunities. Maybe this balance might be favorable to you, but I'd like to hear your opinion.

As a background, we are effectively in a very challenging scenario due to everything that we have been talking now, like a monetary tightening in Brazil, the impact of that coming from the international scenario, like the political landscape, negative IPCA. The scenario is, like, very challenging, but we don't see in our portfolio any deterioration of credit. We are comfortable. It's something that we see all the time. Our client portfolio, our big clients and which are, like, big companies and, we can see an increase in financial expenses and a slight deterioration of hedge. In this long-term interest rate scenario, we can see an impact, of course. In terms of opportunities, I think we can see each market individually, like the M&A market shows many opportunities.

We have a robust pipeline regardless of this acceleration of the third quarter. Since then, the accumulated year. It shows this decrease of the activity. When we see the composition of our revenues in the third quarter, it was one of the most diversified and favorable that we had. Up to now, the pipeline is still robust, reflecting the diversification of the sector, of the players that generate many businesses in our segment. Talking about that, I'll give the floor to Danilo. We had a heated market due to substitution of resources that the companies were expecting to get from the equity market, and it didn't happen. You could see a migration. That's the reason you see the market well-heated, even with the interest rates.

Obviously, we must have a good tax scenario that points out to a lower interest rate, maybe a one-digit interest rate for this market not to lose speed for the next months. We’re very alert, seeking for opportunities. Just to complement, among the capital market products, we could with the IPO funding to increase the mix of our revenues. This year and probably next year, the debentures market or the open funds non-listed market is really good, and we have been growing there. If you see our volume of issuances of these products grew significantly and on the non-listed products, not necessarily due to this high volatility that Ricardo mentioned.

I think that next year, that market will keep heated maybe because it's one of the unique funding sources for funding operations or replacement of investment equity or everything going that way. We believe that in those products, the market will keep heated. On the listed products, some sectors might be heated, mainly CRA that has been capturing funding, and the segment does not depend necessarily on the domestic activity. They are products in which we have interest to keep growing.

Pedro Leduc
Sell-Side Analyst, Itaú BBA

Thank you. I'll ask my last question if I may. Ricardo Lacerda talking about tax policies. You've made your comments. Public banks and to stimulate growth and expansion of balanced credit and BNDES.

Ricardo Lacerda
CEO, BR Partners

You might be thinking about that for a long time.

How do you see the scenario and of course, to diversify products and scenarios, it mitigates the risks, but how can you see opportunities in this situation? From the macroscopic standpoint, of course, it's worrisome because when we see the credit policies in the Workers' Party government, they were harmful. We are worried about that. It's a general concern of the financial sector. Of course, today, the financial sector is completely different from what it were before. We have much more players and sectors and companies, investors. I think it's difficult to go back to the second term of Lula and the first term of Dilma, but it worries us. We have to be aware.

When I look at BR Partners specifically, the profile of the companies that received public credit back then, talked about names and sectors, they are not our clients here, mainly in the debt sector. Our clients are companies that are growing and emerging, growing super fast. They would not have access to that credit. They are not the national champions that received that kind of credit, public credit back then. We are comfortable that our client's portfolio will not be affected by that, but mainly because now we have a bigger market, much more dynamic with many more players. That's what we need to do to diversify this risk profile. We don't have any kind of concentration in a specific client or especially in the debt issuance market. Our portfolio is very, very diversified.

Even if we go back to this kind of policy that did not work in the past, let's hope that we don't make the same mistakes that we made in the past. Let's make new mistakes because it's inevitable. I think we are protected due to the range of clients and activities that we have in our portfolio now. The market awaits that from 2023 on, we have a bigger presence of the states in the economy, but the main states in this country have more liberal agendas. We could maybe see opportunities in infrastructure compensating the privatization scenario, an area which we were very active before. We can see like big infrastructure projects in the state level. This is another issue that people ask us. What about the privatization agenda?

We expect that in a federal level, it's gonna disappear maybe. In the government of São Paulo, Minas, Rio, Paraná, and Rio Grande do Sul, we have state governors that are pro-privatization, and they have a very intense set of assets to put in the market. I think we will keep this activity.

Danilo Catarucci
Managing Director and Head of Capital Markets, BR Partners

Thank you for your answers, Vinicius, Marcelo, everyone, Danilo Catarucci. Next question is by Thiago Paura, sell-side analyst from BTG Pactual. We will open your microphone for you to ask your question live. Thiago, please proceed.

Thiago Paura
Sell-Side Analyst, BTG Pactual

Hello, everyone. Good morning. Can you hear me? Yes, perfectly. Good morning, everyone. Thank you. Thank you for your results. Thanks for the opportunity of asking questions. Gonna ask the first question and then in sequence we'll ask another one.

First one is that we observed that you guys have been very strong in this capital markets area, and you have big clients with big exposures and some clients non-listed due to this M&A vertical. Thinking about the IB platform, does it make sense for you to enter the ECM capital? It's a segment that has synergy with our portfolio of clients. In the area of M&A and CM, the players are the same. It's just a product with a different bias, but we provide advisory services. We have some transactions in which we have been providing advisory services for IPOs and pre-IPO advisories. We look at this segment for the future, of course. Of course, the big players, they have brokers and an equity business that is very big.

We need to be realistic in which like what would be the approach for us to enter this market, but it has a lot of synergy with our business.

Ricardo Lacerda
CEO, BR Partners

For now, we have been providing services of financial advisory.

Thiago Paura
Sell-Side Analyst, BTG Pactual

Thank you, Ricardo. It was clear. The second, just for me to get updates at the vertical of wealth management. You said that you would enter the wealth market. Is there any evolution in this sense? Another one very quick. Was it driven due to the Selic higher, or there was any punctual adjustment or any? Thank you. Perfect. We're still developing our wealth platform. Our digital platform is operating with different modules that are active, and we have been integrating them inside the firm.

Ricardo Lacerda
CEO, BR Partners

Now we are internally adjusting to start this wealth part in a very organic way due to the discussions we had here in acquisitions or due to value or results of the business that we saw. It didn't happen, but we may announce something very soon. A team to conduct that and enter 2023 entering this market. We kept the strategy, and we hope that from the beginning of the next year on, we can enter this segment. Talking about capital and orders, yeah, it's about Selic, and it's how we show that. This capital issue, everybody asks us, like in the bank, of course, you have different nuances for the capital. You have funding regulatory capital you use for specific transactions. From a discipline standpoint, the financial discipline standpoint, we separate the cost of Selic capital.

In the areas that demand capital, they have to pay this minimum remuneration that we would have by capturing that in from the market and show results beyond that. When we see it, the TVM results or sales and trading, they're all above the cost of Selic. We like to separate that as a capital gain. It's not that we have a capital that is stuck invested in Selic. It's just the way we account that. A big part of this capital is allocated in our TVMs or in our positions of sales and trading. Just to summarize that, this growth is due to two things. The base of our capital last year, it was a smaller base because half of the year was pre-IPO. The growth of the benchmark, that's the CDI, as we said.

There is like only one or two small adjustments among the areas, but it's not so relevant connected to the rentability of CDI. Thiago, we had an opening in this quarter in which we show the revenue generated by our business clients. It's very obvious that this capital is important to stimulate the platform of capital markets and treasury solutions that has compensated this less heat in investment banking. We had a massive growth in revenue from 2021 to 2022. This capital that we have been using to develop the internal platforms has been essential, critical as a pillar to compensate this weak environment for IB. Thank you. It was loud and clear. Thank you very much.

Danilo Catarucci
Managing Director and Head of Capital Markets, BR Partners

Our next question was made by Hanna Mangel, Sell-side Analyst, XP Investimentos.

Ricardo Lacerda
CEO, BR Partners

We will open your microphone for you to ask your question. Hanna, please proceed. I think Hanna presented some technical issues, so we might read her question, please. Of course. The question is, in a year full of uncertainties and this macro environment very challenging, BR Partners could keep some resilience in its results. Looking forward to the next year. At which moment we can expect a resume of this capital markets in general, M&A, sales and structuring? I think that obviously we suffered in the market in general a process of like lowering of speed since the middle of last year when we opened our capital. It has reflected a little on our activities in both investment banking and also in the debt area.

We still see a very favorable landscape and an active with a good pipeline of business in every area, very robust. I think that this tightening, the monetary tightening that we could see worldwide and especially in Brazil caused this problem in the market here. In Brazil, we have this cycle of monetary tightening complete. According to some data that we saw from the American market, we could see that this cycle might be getting to an end. This scenario leaves us optimistic. We might have a growth cycle in this activity. Besides this macro aspect, I think the most important thing is the diversification that we have in terms of clients portfolio, sectors, companies.

I think Brazil is a country that presents a weak macro growth traditionally due to the distortions, the market size, judicial insecurities and the tax inefficiency. On the other hand, we have a private sector very diversified that actually generate businesses for our company in most different areas, in investment banking, in capital markets, and in the treasury area for clients too. We see that this moment is still uncertain, but I think we can start this recovery moment for this cycle so that we can have in 2023 some signs of recovery, especially if we can point out to a decrease in the long-term interest that is the drive of all those businesses. Next question was made by Pedro Leduc, Sell-side Analyst from Itaú BBA. We will open your audio for you to ask your question, Pedro. Please go ahead.

Pedro Leduc
Sell-Side Analyst, Itaú BBA

Thank you for the follow-up. First, regarding your business of restructuring, did you have any relevant contribution? How do you see this pipeline? The second question is, in an occasional scenario of, like tax levied on dividends, maybe thinking that BR Partners have many partners. So will you increase the payout or earlier or later to keep this compensation? What do you think about it?

Ricardo Lacerda
CEO, BR Partners

Regarding the restructuring businesses, we haven't had the results as a relevant revenue source, but we have a nice contribution and a relevant contribution in terms of pipeline. In this segment, we have a different participation in this area because the big banks, they do not compete in the segment. They're creditors for the companies.

We compete with some niche competitors that don't have the same size as we have in investment banking. We had many appointments, many assignments, some iconic highlights like Legacy. We have been evaluating that carefully, what are the sectors and companies that might have trouble, and where we would work. We have a relevant team and a relevant pipeline. As a source of revenue, it's up to come in the future. Regarding dividends, there are many variables, and we don't have a tax reform that would put some tax over dividends. It would not happen in 2023 because it would have to be approved in 2022. There's nothing, no bill in the Congress.

Regarding the project that was discussed in Congress last year that was not approved. We had some benefits in our environment here because there was a project to tax dividends, but a reduction of the income tax for some companies. When we saw the combined effect, for us, it was slightly positive. It's not something that worries us. Of course, if it goes back to Congress, we have some provisions to pay a little more dividends in the bank and in the holdings. If it happens, if legislation changes, we would consider paying a bigger dividend to let our investor and our shareholder have some benefit. On the brightest scenario, it would come in 2024, because today we don't have that being discussed in the Congress.

Pedro Leduc
Sell-Side Analyst, Itaú BBA

Thank you, Lacerda. You're very transparent and clear. I wish you success.

Ricardo Lacerda
CEO, BR Partners

Thank you.

Danilo Catarucci
Managing Director and Head of Capital Markets, BR Partners

Next question by Thiago Paura, Sell-side Analyst of BTG. We will open your audio for you to ask your question. Thiago, please proceed.

Thiago Paura
Sell-Side Analyst, BTG Pactual

Well, guys, thank you again. I will just ask another question to do a follow-up in your financial indicators and to talk about the revenue of clients. We understand that it's a seasonal business, but thinking about the full year, is there any benchmark, any percentage which you see as optimal as a breakdown of capital and services revenue or indices or of ROE, this 20% ROE, is it feasible to be recurring?

Ricardo Lacerda
CEO, BR Partners

Just for me to get the spirit of your KPIs. This ROE over 20% is a motto to us. It's something that we seek due to like revenue mix and cost efficiency.

We try to keep this profitability. Since the funding that we had in the IPO and the scenario as a whole, we're really happy to keep this level of ROE. Just to remind you that our ROE, it's the book value, it's accountable. We don't have any kind of management adjustment. This is not only a benchmark, it's our motto. We believe that yes, it's possible even in this challenging scenario, counting on a higher volatility due to the government change. We believe we can keep that since we have robust pipelines in different areas in fronts, and we have room to expand our portfolio. Regarding other rates like efficiency and remuneration, we had significant impacts because we had like a slightly smaller revenue in the third quarter.

Especially in the efficiency rate and remuneration, I believe it's adequate, below 25% as we have been doing historically. In the first nine months, we stayed at 22%. The way we see the provision method is that along throughout the months, we will save some provisions according to the nominal value we expect the remuneration throughout the year. In the last quarter, we adjust according to market conditions and the results of the company. We do not expect any significant difference regarding this topic. We are properly provisioned for this scenario and our talent retention that we see today.

Thiago Paura
Sell-Side Analyst, BTG Pactual

Thank you. Just a last question, just about revenues of services and capital, looking at the accumulated results. If you compare the nine months of 2021 and 2022, it changed a little. Is this the optimal picture or not yet? You can change something?

Ricardo Lacerda
CEO, BR Partners

We have 60% of revenue by clients and 40% by capital revenue. Even with a challenging scenario, we have to remember that our third quarter of 2021, it was our strongest quarter in revenue. When you compare, we had a slight disadvantage due to this moment, but we believe that the scenario may be reversed in the fourth quarter. We can't have this big expectation for like big changes or a new capital revenue component relevant. Capital made the big difference to us. It's evident when you look at the results. When you see the development of capital markets and sales and trading, it's very clear. Obviously, we have been conservative.

We are expanding our portfolio in a deterioration scenario of the corporate credit as a whole, so we have to be careful, and we are very aware. In the sales and trading area, we clearly dismissed some opportunities in the quarter because we saw some risks of execution due to volatility in the IPCA negative. We have been managing everything, trying to seek growth. This, we have leverage room regarding the capital we have, but we are doing that in a careful way. We don't want to bite more than we can chew, let's say. Everybody wants to grow. Of course, we want that too, but we tend to be cautious. Regarding the mix of revenue from capital and services, it's connected to the cycle, the economic cycle we are now.

In a monetary tightening scenario, of course, the capital revenues stand out. In another scenario, considering that the assumptions of the market are correct, and like from 2023 second semester on, the economic cycle will heat again, so M&A and investment banking will grow. Services revenues will grow. This mix is connected to the market conditions.

Thiago Paura
Sell-Side Analyst, BTG Pactual

Very clear, Vinicius. Thank you. Thank you, Ricardo. I say goodbye to you. Have a good weekend, and congratulations on your results again. Thank you.

Danilo Catarucci
Managing Director and Head of Capital Markets, BR Partners

The Q&A session is closed now, and we'd like to return the floor to the companies for their closing remarks.

Vinicius Carmona
IRO and Institutional, BR Partners

Just to conclude, summarizing. First, I'd like to thank you for attending our conference. It's always a big opportunity to explain to you our results and the status of the businesses of the company.

We have concluded these nine months in a very challenging scenario, but we could keep growth in revenue and profitability and our ROE at 20%. That is a very important target to us. I thank you all, and see you next time.

Danilo Catarucci
Managing Director and Head of Capital Markets, BR Partners

The conference call on BR Partners third quarter 2022 is now closed. The investor relations area is available to answer any other questions you might have. Thank you very much to the participants, and have a

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