Earnings Call: Q1 2021

Apr 26, 2021

Hello, and welcome to this call on the ICAD results as of March 30, 2021. My name is Rosie, and I'll be your coordinator for today's event. Please note this call is being recorded and for the duration, your lines will be on listen only. However, you will have the opportunity to ask questions. I will now hand you over to Olivier Vignon, CEO and Victor Aubrey, CFO, to begin today's conference. Thank you. Good morning, everyone. Olivier Vignoles speaking. So thanks for joining this call today. So I'm going to present our Q1 results with Victor Aubrey, our CFO, and the presentation will be followed by the Q and A session. So I hope you're all fine and safe. Personally, I'm just out of my COVID, so not a great experience, but I'm fine. So we have disclosed our revenues for Q1 2021 on Friday afternoon after our general meeting. So maybe before to start the presentation, let me remind you what is the sanitary situation in France as of today. So as you know, we have a 3rd lockdown in France that has started at the beginning of April and that is supposed to end the 3rd May, subject to further notice by the French government. So let's say like this, it's a smooth lockdown, quite comparable to the one that we had during last November. So the main topic, the main consequence for ICAD is that we don't have a shutdown for our construction site. So it's clearly a good news. On the other hand, with the lockdown, it's difficult for sure to organize visit for office premises. And our marketing suites for residential schemes are closed by request of the government. But the impact on residential is limited as we have a full digital marketing process for our residential scheme. As you know, in France, vaccination is now an ongoing concern, reaching its cruising speeds with more than 20% of the French population that have received the first vaccine injection. So probably good news by the end of the summer 2021. So just to summarize, it is clear that sanitary situation is not over and back to normal. But let's say that we are now used to it and that ICAD teams have learned how to manage such a situation. So let's go to Slide 4 now to start the presentation. So what are the key points for our Q1 figures in terms of revenues? So headline revenues at the end of March, they grew by plus 44% compared to 2020 amounting to €392,500,000 So for sure, Q1 2020 was a special period with the beginning of the pandemic at the end of February 2020. And 1 month of Q1 2020 was already impacted by the crisis. Therefore, I think it is also quite relevant to compare our 2021 figure with Q1 2019 and it represents also a significant increase of plus 30%. Our global figure of €392,500,000 is a blended figure. So if we go more into the detail for our investment portfolio, our revenues amount to €171,500,000 up by plus 1.5%. For the office property portfolio, I would like to highlight the good dynamic leasing activity. More than 65,000 square meters were signed or renewed during Q1. And the rental income is close to stable minus 0.6% compared to Q1 2020. And we had a very high level of rent collection during Q1 2021 above 97%. I would also highlight that as announced earlier in February for the preliminary agreements, we have also completed 2 asset disposal for a total of €328,000,000 So it's a significant amount, plus 6% above NAV at the end of 2020. And also I think interesting to highlight that it's in line with NAV at the end of 2019. And just to remind you also that rotation within our office portfolio is one of our top priorities for 2021. Regarding the Healthcare division, for sure the asset class is still more than resilient with revenue that are up by plus 4.7%. And we are still focused on the growth of the portfolio and the Pan European expansion. So in this prospect, the first acquisition that we have made in Spain, it's a good news. It's the 4th country for Icat Sante after France, Italy and Germany. So for ICAD Promotions, our development subsidiary, thanks to the very strong demand for residential in France, the figure of this quarter are really strong. Revenues amount to €217,400,000 up by plus 115% at the end of March compared to 2020. Maybe also a very interesting figure for new orders, up plus 126%. And just to remind you that Icahn Promotion, our development subsidy was the activity that was the most impacted by the COVID-nineteen crisis in 2020, because of the shutdown of our construction site for 2 months and a half. So as I said, in 2021, even with the CERN lockdown, our construction side are still functioning and therefore, we will be able to book 100% of our revenues. One word about tower liability side. We have kept on optimizing the company's funding structure and very favorable condition. So we have issued beginning of January a 10 year €600,000,000 bond with an annual coupon of 0 point 62%, which is a historical low cost for 10 years debt at TCAD. And we have used this fund mainly to optimize our liabilities, early redemption of the bond maturing in 2022 that was with a coupon of 1.87% and also the early redemption of a bond maturing in April 2021 with a coupon of 2.25%. Important also to highlight that our next significant debt maturity is now only 20 23. So clearly, we have absolutely no liquidity concern. So my view is that our Q1 figures reflect, I think, the resilience of our business model with 3 different activities. And we continue now more than ever fully mobilized to go through the crisis and to cope with the COVID-nineteen crisis. I will come back to guidance and dividend with the conclusion. So if you go to Slide 5, so you have the detail of the figures that I have commented with the split between officers, health care and development. So now, Victor, the floor is yours for more detail and comments on our activity. Thank you, Olivier. Good morning, everybody. So to echo Olivier's words, let me elaborate on the operational performance of our business lines. I'm now on Slide 6 and share with you the main KPIs of our Office Investment division. Let's talk first about leading activity. 2 figures reflecting the dynamic asset management job done during the 1st part of the year. First, a total achievement of 65,000 square meters signed or renewed since January 1. Thanks to continued proactive crisis management with our tenants, at the end of March, more than 85% of the 2021 break options were estimate to have been prevented or covered by the signing of new leases. In addition, the collection rate nearing 96%, reflecting also as we put forward a lot in 2020 the solidity of our tenants' business. I want also to underline the resilient rental income despite the health crisis and the shrinking rental market aligned with our expectation, around €94,000,000 93,500,000 to be precise, down minus 0.6 percent on a reported basis. It remains solid, especially under the current circumstances. We have a like for like 2% decrease due to a slightly positive indexation and some expected departure. It's fair to assume that it should keep declining this year. On one hand, we are confident on our capability to hold our existing tenants. And on the other hand, it may be more challenging to attract new tenants in 2021. Another evidence of what I'm saying regarding the solidity of our tenants profile is another financial KPI key for us, credit default rate that stand now below 1%. Talking about occupancy rate for this division, it's quite stable at 90.4 percent, minus 1.4 points on a like for like basis. This indicator illustrates also the resilience of our office investment portfolio. Let me highlight that no significant tenant departure has been notified in Q1. 2nd topic I would like to highlight, development pipeline and investments, a very active quarter also with 2 major deliveries representing more than 80,000 square meters. Firstly, ICAD handed over Technip Energy's new headquarters, Origine, nearly 51,000 square meters of office space in Nanterre, a very attractive and dynamic location. This important investment nearly €450,000,000 illustrate our office investments expertise in developing major office projects. With its hybrid timber concrete structure, the origin project is also at the apex of HICAD's low carbon expertise and hence at achieving the highest levels of French and international environmental certification fully in line with our low carbon strategy. At this stage, 80% of the new space is leased and Icat's team, of course, are fully committed to secure total floor area. The 2nd main delivery from this quarter, the new Lattecoeur headquarter, a 13,000 square meters building in Toulouse that is fully rented. Including those 2 completion projects to be completed by the end of 2021 at 63 trailers. Last topic I want to share with you regarding the HF division, asset rotation that has actively resumed. Olivier has previously referred to the disposal we made. We had announced during our annual results the primary agreement as part of the 2021 disposal plan and the resumption of opportunistic disposal of core and core plus asset in the office portfolio. And we are happy today to confirm those 2 transactions, totaling more than EUR320,000,000. 1st, sale of the Roire building in Dejivre, Valder Marne on April 18, 2021 to an institutional investor from the insurance sector. Built in 2010, this building has a floor area of around 20,000 square meter and is fully led with the French bank LCM. The second one sale of the millionaire 1 building in Paris on April 21, 2020, 2021 to a real estate investment fund manager by Brookfield Asset Management, a world leader in real estate asset management. Built in 2,007, this 29,000 square building located in the Millionaire Business Park in the 19 District of Paris is fully led to 2 1st rate tenants from the financial sector. These sales were completed at the plus 6% premium to 2020 NLE, meaning by that plus 6% regarding the global asset value in 2020. There are the 1st milestone of €500,000,000 to €600,000,000 objective of the disposal plan for 2021, a volume in line with the average we have done during the last 3 years. Beside in terms of acquisition, we just signed a value add opportunistic operation in Monterrey, right next to La Descentes in an area we know very well. This asset offer high potential for value creation through its future redevelopment. All in all, we can say that our office investment division remains very agile to meet the challenges of the current market environment. Going forward on Page 7 is a focus on the Healthcare division. As we said earlier, this year and the year before, the impact of the COVID-nineteen crisis has been very limited on this non cyclical asset class portfolio. Let me remind that healthcare operators are strongly supported by government measures since the beginning of the crisis and that those measures have been extended until June 2021. The figures consume very favorable indicators and continued expansion. Let me talk about our gross rental income first. For GRI, this quarter amounted to €78,000,000 up plus 4.7 percent on a reported basis, fueled by acquisition carried out in 2020 in France, but also in Italy and Germany. On a line for line basis, revenue are up 0.4%. In terms of geographical breakdown, France, gross rental income at €72,300,000 plus 2.3%. International gross rental income increased to €5,700,000 Occupancy rate is still at 100% as well as rent collection with no impact at all of the crisis. Furthermore, we benefit also from solid portfolio of tenants that are long term committed, warm at 7.3 years. It is stable compared to December 2020. On average, it stood at 6.6 years as far as assets located in France are concerned 16 years abroad. The investment market momentum remains strong in this division too, and we continue to be active in our view. Growing in France and abroad is one of our objectives this year by maintaining a steady number of projects, sales and leaseback or off plan acquisition as well as diversifying our partnerships. In France, our investment in Q1 amounted to almost €44,000,000 Let me illustrate with the 18.6 percent operation for the acquisition of Les Denteliers facility located in Valencien, operator Elzan. And in addition, we also invest nearly €20,000,000 in the French development pipeline. In Europe, ICA did our 1st acquisition in Spain with a preliminary agreement with Amavarug Group to acquire 2 nursing homes in Spain for 22,000,000 euros including duties. This is a milestone in the Healthcare Property Investment Division's international expansion strategy and brings amount invested outside France in the end of 2018 to nearly €750,000,000 All these metrics confirm ICAT's health care attractiveness to continue and rigorous growth of the business line and are good news for the future this year and beyond. Now I'm talking about our 3rd business line. I'm on Slide 8, property development or development subsidiary for external clients. As Olivier said previously, the business recovery is here as we expected. As largely put forward in 2020, the revenues and operational sales indicators were heavily impacted by the crisis and the set of construction fees during 2 months and half. As highlighted on this slide, variation compared to Q1 2020 are quite dynamic, but compared to 2019 also. This performance is not only a question of catch up. Q1 2021 economic revenue grows by 128% year to year to nearly €250,000,000 but also plus EUR 56,000,000 growth versus 2019. Several positive impacts can explain the strong upturn this quarter. Construction projects progressed faster than in previous year over the same period, but also sales of projects nearing completion, which typically have strong positive impact as revenue is recognized using the bulk method, percentage of completion method, were also substantial. Thus, revenue from the Residential segment rose by 136 percent at EUR 207,000,000 in Q1 2021 versus EUR 87,000,000 in Q1 2020. Concerning the Office segment, revenue growth by 92% this Q1 at EUR 41,000,000. If we look at order on Q1, the indicators are also well oriented, plus 126% in term of new orders, plus 96% in value terms. I want to mention the strong progression of the notary sales, too. As you can see, the jump by 92% versus Q1 2020 and plus 5% versus Q1 2019. This growth partially explains the rise of the residential segment I just mentioned, in addition with a sharp year on year increase in construction starts, plus 38%. Now looking at leading indicators that remain well oriented, confirming growth potential. A backlog of €1,400,000,000 down slightly compared to December 2020, resulting from accelerating revenue recognition in Q1 2021. On a 12 rolling month basis, the trial showed solid performance with the backlog up by nearly 10%, driven by the residential segment plus 16%. An additional potential of revenues of €2,200,000,000 deriving from a residential portfolio that we do control through option of preliminary agreements. It comprised 10,00902 units, and these potential revenues, excluding taxes, represent an increase of plus 4% compared to December 2020. In total, ECAD promotion potential revenues stand at €6,800,000,000 in the 5 coming years. On top of that, we noticed last year that the market profile of investor had evolved during the year with institutional ones back to the residential market. The appetite is confirmed on the Q1 again with institutional investor representing more than 50% of the orders. Regarding this matter, let me mention as an example, the Atleti Village project in Saint Trois that is totaling 3 14 units, business premises, retail units, residential with services and a student residence. Last but not least, Icard is also very ambitious in term of low carbon construction and aims at being best in class regarding that topic. Through the creation in early 2021 of its subsidiary, Urbain des Bois, specializing in low carbon construction and home personalization, ICA is taking stepping up its involvement in timber construction, one of the driver of its low carbon strategy. The objective is to realize €100,000,000 revenues end of 2025. To conclude on that activity and on the back of a demand that remains structurally high, we are ready to address the challenges and are in line with our 2025 ambition roadmap. Thank you very much, Victor. So let's go now to Slide 9 to conclude this presentation on our Q1 2021 revenues. So as we did say in February, we are very clear priorities for 2021 and we stick to that. Just let me recall them. The first one is with respect to the office portfolio. So it's to focus on portfolio rotation and value creation deriving from the development pipeline. We have completed 2 schemes during the Q1 2021, Origine and La Texe Coeur, as Yves Croix said. Both of them were 100% fully let. We will have another one in June 2021 in Nanterre, fully let the group amount. And the last one will be SREFESK, 20,000 square meters of offices that will be completed Q4 2021. Still not pre lap, but ongoing discussion. On Health Care, we are focused on further growth and international expansion, and we are working on the preparation of liquidity even as we again, as we did say. For development subsidiary, you could have seen the I think the interesting figures for Q1 and it's clearly our priorities for development our development subsidiaries to increase revenues, but also to achieve higher margin. Our CSR priorities is clearly the acceleration of our low carbon strategy. It's called low carbon by Icard and we have presented the detail of that in February. And our 5th priority is the operational implementation of our purpose in our different activities. I think it's also an important topic for the team. So the Q1 is that was good. I think in our view it's quite solid and confirm, I think, the resilience of our business model, which is a mixed business model with 3 different activities. In addition, clearly, the beginning of the year has been very active for Icard, especially in terms of new leasing for offices. You have seen the figures. As I said, the completion of 2 schemes, the asset disposal for more than EUR320,000,000 for the growth in Italy and Germany, 1st acquisition in Spain for health care and clearly a development business, which is quite well oriented. On top, we have been able to continue to optimize our balance sheet in terms of financial condition. So it is clear that even if the sanitary crisis is not over, it is clear that probably 2021 is still utilizes a challenging year. We are very confident that we will achieve the target and objective that we have announced for 20 21. And therefore, with regard to our guidance, we do confirm the guidance and that the 2021 group net cash flow per share is expected to grow by around 3%, excluding the impact of 2021 disposal. And also, I think it was important to give a clear view on the evolution of the dividend. And the 2021 dividend for ICAD is expected also to increase by plus 3%, which represents a payout ratio close to 83% and the distribution of part of the capital gains deriving from disposal. So that's the end of the presentation of our Q1 revenue. And now, Victor and I are ready to answer your questions. Thank you. Our first question comes from the line of Florent Laroche Joubert from ODDO BHF. Please go ahead. So hi Olivier. Hi, Victor. Thank you very much for this presentation. So I would have two questions, if I may. So first question, so you have been able to tell us that you have secured 5% of in addition of break options. So that means that there are still 15% of brake option to be secured. So could you please give us maybe more color on your confidence to secure them during the year or during the next month? So that would be my first question. And my second question will be on Health Square. So you have told at your annual results that you were in discussion for the potential acquisition of €1,000,000,000 of assets. So we have been able to see that you have done €70,000,000 of investment in Q1. So could you please maybe give us an update on the transaction the amount of transactions that you are looking? Thank you. Okay. So for your 2 questions, maybe start with the second. We are at Selectaive rolling volume of investment under review close to €1,000,000,000 And you know what is the volume of our acquisition plan. It was €2,500,000,000 between 2019 2022. We have already closed 60% of that at the end of 2020. So I think we have a sufficient pipeline to reach our growth ambition. Nevertheless, market is quite competitive and we try to really to stick to our investment criteria in a world for healthcare assets where you have a lot of new competitors coming to the market. But we are clearly and I will say that even the pipeline is growing because due to the increase of valuation, I think that more and more operating companies are thinking some of them are thinking to stick their real estate asset on their balance sheet, but most of them are thinking to outsource their real estate portfolio due to the fact that market conditions are quite favorable for vendor. So we are confident with the fact that we will be able to deliver the acquisition plan, that we will be able to continue the Pan European expansion that could be maybe to open a new country in 20 21. So for your first question about the break option for office building, I will make some several comments. The first one is that the remaining part is a large part of that is linked to 2 office building in Lyon fully led to Framatome. And we knew before the beginning of the crisis that they will leave the 2 buildings in Lyon. So and even when we did acquire those two assets, it was with the AMF transaction in 2017. They had Framatome already launched the building of a new headquarter in Lyon. So those two buildings will be vacated and we have already we know exactly what we will do with those 2 projects to redevelopment best location in Lyon very close to a La Pardieu Station. So it means that the remaining 20% of break option of 2,000, we have a little more to secure, but not that much because the last part of that is linked to the 2 building in Lyon. I will make more general comment on the office letting market transaction. The first one is I'm sure you have seen the figures released by real estate brokers. So clearly, to move to the new headquarter is not the top priority of most of the corporate in 2021. If you look at the figures for the price letting office market, it's minus 30% compared to Q1 2020. So that's the general picture. It's still very difficult to organize visit of office premises. So that has explained the fact that we have a slight decrease of the occupancy rate. So our feeling, our view is that it's better compared to the 2nd part of 2020 market condition. We have seen more than in terms of large transactions, we have seen more large transaction in Q1, certain compared to 10 in Q1 2020. So it's a bit better, but I think we will have to wait the 2nd part of 2021 before to go back to, let's say, a normal market situation. It's clearly linked to the sanitary situation. As you probably know, corporate are still requested by the French government to do as much as possible work from home. So it's getting out a normal situation. So we do we are let's say it's like this, we are quite confident and positive. We have, I think, an interesting discussion on new scheme also, which is something new in terms of relating to the 3 years in advance, but it's clearly not a normal situation. So I think maybe to wait again 6 months before to have a normal market leasing activity, it's what we do have in mind for the time being. Okay. Thank you very much. The next question comes from the line of Veronique Mertens from Kempen. Please go ahead. Good morning all. Thank you for the presentation. Maybe just as a checkup point. So the vacancy rate, as you said, okay, it might be hard to attract new tenants. Can we expect the vacancy rate to not improve over the year and even get a little bit worse as the 2 assets in Lyon will be transferred to the development pipeline? And also, I was curious what you're seeing in terms of reversion rates for the portfolio. And lastly, do you have can you elaborate a bit on the long term dividend strategy? Is the 83% payout ratio something that you want to stick to in the coming years as well? Okay. Regarding the occupancy rate, as I commented just before, we had a slight decrease. It's minus 1.6 points, as I said. It's mainly due to a completion we have done last year at the end of the year, which is not already fully rent. And of course, the teams, the asset management teams are very concentrated on the objective to pursue the occupancy rate of these buildings, which is in Marseille, Lyon, which is Lyon. And so that is the main reason of the evolution of the occupancy rate regarding the 1st part of the quarter of the year. Of course, there is another impact, which is the completion of Origin, which is already pre let at a level which is already let at a level of 79%. And of course, it is the 2nd main reason of the slight decrease of the occupancy rate. And as I said one more time, teams are very focused on the or ability to complete the occupancy of this building as soon as possible. Regarding your second question, which is about the option we offer this year with the scrip dividend for the 2020 dividend, of course, so far the board decides to propose to give you a global view of the trend of the evolution of the 2021 dividend. And it's perhaps a little bit too early to precise if they want to continue to renew this scrip option. But what we can say so far today is that in your point of view, in the current context, it's a good option to contribute for the shareholders, to contribute to reinforce the global balance sheet of the company. It should represent this year if there is a 100% subscription to this option and additional equity of around €120,000,000 So clearly, it's a good thing in term of balance sheet management. But as I said, so far, it's a little bit too early to proceed if this option will be a reconduct in 2020 for the 2021 dividend. Okay. And maybe lastly, on the reversion rates that you currently expect or see for the office portfolio? Slightly we expect a slightly negative evolution regarding the reversion rate. It's difficult to say. But what we can observe regarding the 1st part of the year is around minus 2%. Okay. Thank you very much. I don't know if we have additional questions. Okay. Thank you. So our next question comes from the line of Celine Win from Barclays. Please go ahead. Hi, everyone. I just have two questions. The first one would be on the office acquisition that you've done in Monterre. Can you comment on the rationale and how much you've paid for it? And the second one would be on Ical Promotions. How do the margin profit the profit margin compare to 2020 2019? I appreciate you do not disclose the margin in Q1, but just a brief comment whether it is getting worse or better. Thank you. On the front, the rationale for the acquisition of the value add building, our view is to recycle the capital on the office portfolio. So it's disposal in order to finance new development or new acquisition. This specific building is located on a location that we really do like, and we really do like it because we do think it's probably one of the best location of the Greater Paris area. It's a location that we know perfectly well where we do have a lot of assets very close to the origin project. And the building is for the time being fully led to the public tenant that will leave the property probably in 3 years from now. Acquisition has, I think, quite appealing cash on cash cap rate with close to 6. And the building that has to be refurbished to be restructured when the tenant will leave. So it's clearly a value add opportunity. That is clearly our job to create value. So for the 1st 3 years, we will have the cash flow coming from the fact that the building is to be let. And for that, we do think we should be able to manage a redevelopment project that should deliver a double digit higher ARPU. So that rationale is clearly a rotation within the artist portfolio. Sorry, did you say a yield of 6%? Sorry? Did you say a yield of Around, around, around. Around 6%. And did you get a discount on it or not? A discount of what? A discount of what? On asking price. Well, I think I have. With that asset. No, no, no. We are still under the preliminary agreement, so we can't comment too much. But I think it's clearly, I think an interesting acquisition on the location that we do know perfectly well. We know exactly what are the potential tenants, the rental values and so on. We have really good cooperation with the city of Montpellier. So no clue about the fact that we should be able to get the building permit and so on. So it's a limited transaction around €60,000,000 But it's clearly, I think, quite interesting. And maybe we will do some more transactions of that kind during the year if there are interesting opportunities. On margin, I think we can't compare 2021 margin is 2020 due to the fact that due to the pop meter margin in 2020, they were close to 0 with cash flow in 2020 for ICAP promotion that represented €2,500,000 or more than an unusual year for ICAT promotion. So our view is that we should be able to do close to the same level of 2019 on an average midterm trend, which is to increase that. So I think the market is there clearly. So it's in terms of demand. So in order to be able to achieve the margin, you look at the margin at 2 different levels. You have the level of scheme by scheme and gross margin should be around 18%. And after that, you have the overall margin at the level of ICAT promotion. And here the question is the volume. As we said, we do think the volume is quite well oriented. And I'm sure you have in mind that the only concern that we have at the level of the market is that the overall volume of building permit that we should be able to get due to the fact that let's say like this local authorities are maybe a little bit more reluctant to grant building permits. So the challenge for Icard promotion is not now, I think we are back right on track at the level of each scheme, it's more a question of volume. You probably have in mind that in 2020, the market building permit for the entire market, it was minus 21% compared to 2019. And there is a debate on the French market and with local authorities on the volume of building permit for the time being. And as we said, forward KPIs are well oriented, but we are looking at how the situation is evolving. Maybe you have seen some comments from our colleague of Copenhagen Bureau that have released their figures 2 weeks ago. They were very concerned about that. We are probably a little bit less concerned due to the fact that the activity of ICAD Promotions is mainly concentrated on large scale that are initiated and monitored by local authorities and therefore they can't stop them or they can't renegotiate them. But it's clearly a point for the residential market. Again, it's not a question of demand. Demand both from private clients or institutional clients is really strong. So the question is more the supply and the supply comes from building permits. So but it's not a question for us for 2021 or 2022. It's more a question is a trend will follow the will remain the same. It's more a question for 2023 to 2024. But again, as Victor said, we are confident with the fact that we will be able to deliver the roadmap that we have presented at the end of 2018. Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Christopher Fremantle from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead. Hi, good morning. I had just two questions, please. First on Healthcare. I'm sorry, another question about the liquidity event. How has your view on timing and structure developed since you last talked about this? And if it hasn't changed, when are we likely to learn more about the timing and structure of that liquidity event? And then the second question is on just a follow-up on Celine's question on development. You've compared to 2019, which is helpful. Is it fair to assume a similar increase in percentage terms in the quarters to come in 2021 as you have reported in the Q1? Or is there anything special about the Q1 that would make the comparison with 2019 different for the rest of the year? Victor, do you want to answer the two questions? Yes. We can begin with the first one regarding the liquidity. And for instance, so far, the answer is exactly the same as of what we said in February. We are working hard on it. And to interpret more precisely to your question regarding when we will be able to give you more detail, I think mid of the year could be a more favorable conditions to give you more detail regarding this liquidity event. But of course, one more time, as we said, it's clearly a job we are working hard on since the beginning of the year and I hope so we will be able to give you more detail in dual with our half year results presentation. On the second question regarding following up on development, I think that as I said just before, as I highlight, there is an impact of catch up regarding the figures we have shown in 2021 Q1. And after saying that, we can expect not such vigorous figure for the next quarter. But in the meantime, we are very confident to say that there will be a slight increase regarding the 2019 figures. That's what I can give you what I can say to you this morning. And for sure, unless I add, as a principle, we will make for especially for H1 result, we'll make the full comparison for sure with 2020, but also with 2019 because we do think that for but it is also for investment. I think it's more relevant compared to 2019 I guess, again, 2020 was a very special and specific year. So a slight increase versus 2019 for the remaining quarters, Have I understood that correctly relative to 2019? Yes. You could take that into account, yes. Okay. Thank you. Our final question for today comes from the line of Pierre Clouard from Kepler. Please go ahead. Yes. Good morning. I hope you are both well. It should be you Olivier. So I have three questions in my side. Just the first one to come back on the property development. So 50% of your reservation have been realized with institutional investors. Is there a specific buyer there? Can we imagine that the CEC EBITDA has been very active in the quarter or not? So this is my first one. The second one is just coming back on the building in Monterrey. Can you remind us the total acquisition price? Sorry if I missed that. And the last one on disposals. So you realized both €300,000,000 of disposals. So can we imagine more disposals in 2021 or not? Are you thinking about any potential new disposals by the end of the year? Okay. I will answer your 3 questions. On the first one, it was true that in 2020, CVC EBITDA was a very significant buyer and client for ICAD Promotions as it was true for most of the developer in France. It's not exactly the same situation in 2021, much more diversified client base. CDC EBITDA has announced that they will try to do the same figures compared to 2020. And they have acquired last year on the French market 60,000 apartments. I don't think they will be able such a volume this year. But for us, it's clearly we want to diversify our client base and you have more and more institutional clients. And it is also fair to say that the demand from private client is still very strong. The level of mortgages in France, again, record level, lower level, so strong appetite from private client. And is it possible to have a breakdown on the each room that bought reservation? Yes. I don't have it in mind, but we will revert to you this morning. On the second question, so we are under a preliminary agreement. So we can't give full detail, but I have mentioned the figure which is close to €260,000,000 I believe we have acquired in Norte. And in terms of disposal, as Victor said and as we said during our investor presentation in November, after a very significant volume in 2019 more than €1,100,000,000 no disposal in 2020. And what we do have in mind is to have a disposal volume close to let's say like this normal level on a midterm trend, which is between €500,000,000 to €600,000,000 So it means that we should be able to announce other disposal in 2020. Again, the rationale for that is to recycle the capital and to raise capital again to be reinvested in freezing the office development pipeline because we still have a significant office development pipeline, the growth of e Cat Sante And as you know, also the fact that we want to decrease our LTV ratio by the end of 2023. So we will use the proceeds of the disposal to address the 3 topics I have mentioned. Okay. Thank you, Olivier. Jerre Emmanuel, you have on Page 6, the breakdown of housing orders by type of consumer, if you want to have an update. Page 6 of the press release. Yes, yes. You have the Yes, but I want to have more details in terms of institutional investors. Just want to know what are the main buyers? You always want more details. I know, I know. We will revert to you. Thank you very much all of you for attending this call. And again, if you have any further more detailed questions, do not hesitate to contact Anne Sophie or Victoire. We will be right to you as quickly as possible. Thank you very much.