My name is Natalie, and I'll be your coordinator for today's conference call. Please note that this call is being recorded, and for the duration of the call, your lines will be on listen only. However, you will have the opportunity to ask a question at the end of the call. This can be done by pressing star one on your telephone keypad to register your question. If you require any assistance at any point, please press star zero and you will be connected to an operator. I will now hand over the call to Hugues Chomel, Deputy CEO and CFO, to begin today's conference call. Thank you.
Thank you, Natalie. Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. I am Hugues Chomel, Deputy CEO and Group CFO of the Vicat Group. With me is Mr. Stéphane Bisseuil, Investor Relations Director. Thank you for attending this Q&A session that follows last night's update of the Vicat Group's 2022 outlook. Before moving to questions, I would like to summarize a few elements. Two main factors have emerged in the recent weeks to support the review of our outlook for the full year of 2022. The brutal and very significant increase in electricity prices in France and Switzerland coupled with already strong selling price increases. We've announced additional and very significant price increases in France and Switzerland to compensate the effect of this acceleration in inflation. The ramp-up of our Ragland plant has been more gradual than expected due to the necessary technical adjustment.
Utilization rate at Ragland has improved, and the group should progressively benefit from the full capacity to respond to the dynamism of the market and from the energy efficiency of this new facility. Even if the updated expected level of EBITDA is lower than the initial expectation, it is still expected to be strong and above the 2020 level. In this environment, the group is taking the necessary measures to adapt. In mature economies, energy inflation has prompted a radical change from the traditional pattern of annual price increases in favor of a more dynamic sequence of adaptation to rises in energy costs, with hikes introduced every time it is required. The second point is an enhanced focus on debt reduction, with significant decrease in CapEx plan through 2023 and 2024.
In the meantime, the group is seeing tangible result in the acceleration of its ecological transition with a faster ramp-up of the use of secondary fuels, a decrease in the clinker rate, and it maintains its objective of reducing cost per ton of cement produced, thereby improving overall climate performance. After this brief comments, I would like to move on to questions. Natalie, you can open for questions.
Thank you. As a reminder, if you would like to ask a question or make a contribution onto this call, please press star one on your telephone keypad. To withdraw your question, please press star two. Your first question comes from the line of Yassine Touahri from On Field Investment Research. Your line is open. Please go ahead.
Yes, good morning, gentlemen. A couple of questions. First, could you quantify the negative impact of the Ragland ramp-up? I think you quantified a number of EUR 25 million in the first half. It would be very helpful if you can give us an order of magnitude for the impact in the second half. A second question on this energy, on the electricity bill in Europe. I thought that you had long-term contract in France, so I'd like to. Could you explain a little bit how the purchasing of electricity works for you in France and Switzerland? How much was effectively hedged for the second part of 2022?
Is it like, maybe like 30% or half of your electricity bill was not hedged and you're paying the spot price? You know, any information that you can give us on your exposure to spot electricity prices in Europe would be very helpful.
Okay, thank you. Thank you for your questions, Yassine. Good morning. In terms of quantification, I mean, you have seen the revision of our outlook between growth and above 2020. That gives you a magnitude of a global impact. I would say more than half of this negative variance comes from electricity and the most of other part is coming from U.S. That would be. I'm sorry, but it's as precise as I can get at this point. On energy mechanism. As you know, the situation is quite different in France and Switzerland. In Switzerland, we have no regulated prices, I would say.
We start with theoretically only market prices and we build hedges with over time, so on a rolling prices basis. Doing so, we were still exposed to about probably less than a third to spot in the second half. Seeing the impact of brutal increase, it has skyrocketed. In France, as you know, energy intensive electricity do benefit from the ARENH part, so it is roughly two-thirds, one-third. We have one-third, which is theoretically open to market and on which we either buy spot or buy forward, depending on the situation.
When you look at your energy, your electricity bill for 2023, have you started to hedge? Are you going to pay the spot price in Switzerland and France?
As you noted, we have not yet disclosed elements in 2023 to the market. We will be able to do that later on. As a general comment, we have not changed our aging policies, and we will communicate later on these trends.
Maybe a last question. When I look at those price increases of more than 20 EUR in France and 30 CHF in Switzerland, do they fully reflect the latest spot price for electricity? Does it mean that once they're implemented, you will be able to fully cover cost inflation? The other question is, are those price increases described to your client as electricity surcharge? Does it mean that if in 2023 electricity prices come back down, will you have to cut back those prices?
These price hikes are meant to cover all expected electricity prices for the end of the year. As a spot basis on the end of the year, they would cover the additional cost. So far, they came with a delay, so that's why we see an impact on our EBITDA this year. They are presented as general price increases. Of course, at some point, if energy was to decrease substantially, I would believe that market price will adjust with time as they did on the way up.
Thank you very much.
Thank you. We'll now take our next question from Michael. Line is open. Please go ahead.
Can you hear me?
Yep, very well.
Yeah. Hi, good morning. I'm sorry, I got disconnected on the previous question. So I'm gonna ask it again. Will the two price increases that you've implemented affect the energy cost inflation at the current spot prices in Switzerland and France? I'm sorry, I understand it was asked previously, but I got disconnected when you were giving the answer. My second question is on the maintenance CapEx. You have communicated that you will focus on deleveraging starting next year and take the CapEx down to basically maintenance CapEx. What kind of, you know, if you could quantify that a bit, you know, in 2020 and 2019. I mean, these were just under EUR 200 million.
Does it mean that, you know, CapEx will go back down to EUR 200 million starting next year? Thank you.
Yes. Good morning, Michael. Thank you for your questions. Just to reiterate my previous comment on prices. Those increases are meant to compensate the acceleration in inflation. On a spot basis, by the end of the year, they would match the expected cost increase. As they come with a delay, they will still leave an impact on EBITDA this year. With no further increase of cost, they would offset them by the end of the year.
On the full run rate basis in 2023, does that mean that, you know, we will.
They will recompensate the cost increase.
Okay. Have they been accepted by your clients?
As you have noticed, those are announced for future dates, so.
Yeah.
They are being announced.
Okay.
Discussed. So far, we see a good understanding from the market.
Okay. Thank you.
On CapEx, I would like to clarify a little bit the statement we made last night. We will focus on maintenance CapEx. Maintenance CapEx are usually between EUR 120 million and EUR 140 million per year. We will maintain or we will continue committed projects. As you know, we have quite a substantial portfolio of committed projects. For example, we are building a new kiln line in Senegal that will continue through 2023. It will be a magnitude of EUR 100 million next year. We will continue more carbon reduction projects. We're prioritizing the ones with the best return on investment.
The decrease will be only gradual in 2023, given the, I would say, backlog of committed project, and the decrease will be more substantial in 2024.
I see. Thank you. Just a question on the cash flow related to the CapEx. You know, the dividend was increased this year for the first time in many years. In the history of Vicat, it has never been cut. Obviously now you are focusing on deleveraging. Could this mean that, you know, the dividend could potentially be cut? Yeah, if you can make a few comments on that.
Well, obviously this is a proposal of a board and a decision of a shareholder, so I will not be able to give clear comments on that. As you rightly pointed out, if we look back, the group has never cut dividend through the cycles, even in the post-2008 crisis, where the impact on profitability was more severe.
Okay, thank you.
Thank you. Once again, ladies and gentlemen, if you would like to ask a question, please press star one on your telephone keypad. Thank you. We'll now take our next question from Jen of High Cliff Investor. Your line is open. Please go ahead.
Hi. Good morning, Hugues. Good morning, Stéphane. Thanks very much for taking my question. Just a more general high-level question. You know, you talk about deleveraging and maybe prioritizing that. Could you just talk a little bit about why there is a greater urgency to deleverage at this stage? That's the first one. The second one is on the exposure that you have to interest rates more generally. Could you remind us what is your exposure to rising interest rates? How fast do rising interest rates translate into your PNL interest costs? Thank you very much.
Thank you, Jen. Thank you for your questions. On the second one, as you may have seen in our documentation, we have our debt is 50% fixed rate and 50% variable. The variable part is capped with relatively low levels of cap. The effect in the coming year and a half will be very limited. It's only with the renewal of the caps that we'll gradually see some increase above the current cap levels. This is the point. Sorry, I missed your first point then.
Yeah. Thank you. Just on the deleveraging, it seems that there's.
Oh yes.
A bit more, yeah.
Yeah, yeah. The, I mean, it has always been a focus of the group to maintain a relatively low level of CapEx of debt. At the current level, we believe that with volatility in inflation, we see less visibility on cash flow generation. We believe it is adequate to take a more prudent approach in reducing the cash outflow of CapEx. Of course, as soon as we have more visibility on cash flow generation, we have a lot of value accretive projects that we could roll out as the time goes.
Yeah. Thank you very much.
Thank you. Once again, ladies and gentlemen, if you would like to ask a question, please press star one on your telephone keypad. We'll now take our next question from Laurent of Zebec. Your line is open. Please go ahead.
Yes, good morning. Thank you for taking my question. The absolute number on CapEx, I had EUR 450 million in 2022, and if I understood what you were saying, for 2024, I should expect EUR 250 million, so two hundred million less between 2022 and 2024. That's my first question.
Good morning, Laurent. Thanks for your questions. As you well noted, we did not quantify it in our press release. We maintain our guidance of EUR 400 million for the current year, 2022. Too, we expect, given the backlog of committed project, some reduction next year, but not to a very large extent, and then a much more significant reduction in 2023.
The magnitude I'm mentioning, which is EUR 200 million, makes sense or am I missing something of reduction of CapEx?
No. I mean, it will be substantial, EUR 200 million maybe, if you noted that the maintenance CapEx that we don't compromise on is already in the magnitude of EUR 130 million. If we are maintaining some effort on decarbonization and some productivity CapEx, that brings us probably in excess of EUR 200 million.
I think I'm more or less correct. On next year, obviously, we're uncertain about the volume. If I understood what you're talking about, the 2022 guidance has come down effectively by EUR 50 million compared with what you were guiding before, which was slightly above previous market, and now you're slightly above 2020. I go from 625 to 575, which is a delta of EUR 50 million.
The price increase you just mentioned gives me, if I calculate correctly, roughly speaking, EUR 85 million more to compensate for the electricity price, which you mentioned in Switzerland and in France.
When I look at 2023, and I will have also the project, as you mentioned in some countries, which will come through, hopefully the CapEx generate a bit there. Am I right to think that you should generate more than EUR 600 million in 2023, or I miss something?
It is too early, Laurent, to comment on 2023 profitability levels. We'll do that with annual disclosure.
Okay.
Thank you. Once again, ladies and gentlemen, if you would like to ask a question, please press star one on your telephone keypad. Thank you.
Okay.
I don't see any questions further. Yeah, I'm handing it back over to you. Go ahead.
Thank you. Thank you, Natalie. Thank you for being on the line this morning. We'll gather again for the Q3 business update in a little less than a month's time. We'll give you more color on latest market events. We'll confirm that the group is still generating a solid level of EBITDA in a market environment that has been characterized by unprecedented inflation. Have a good day.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for joining today's call. You may now disconnect.