Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to Siemens Energy AG's third quarter for fiscal 2025. Welcome to our conference call. All of the participants are in listener mode and this call will be recorded. After the presentation you will be able to ask questions. If you want to ask a question, please press asterisk and one on your phone. If you need help from an operator during the call, please press asterisk and zero on your phone. I'd now like to hand over to the moderator, Tim Proll-Gerwe.
Good morning and welcome to today's conference call for the third quarter at Siemens Energy. We published our financial figures at 7:00 A.M and we'd like to give you an overview of them. Right now we are in Berlin. In addition to Christian Bruch, we have the CFO Maria Ferraro. They are both here to answer your questions.
At the end of the presentation, Mr. Bruch will be speaking in German and Ms. Ferraro in her mother tongue, English. We have two webcasts, an original line and an English line where interpreters will be interpreting from German into English for questions. Journalists were able to register ahead of time with a separate telephone number. We sent you the link with the invitation to today's call and of course you can still register today. Now by dialing in the chat you can also ask your questions. We've seen that there are a number of investors who have already asked questions and the investor call will be after this call. This call is for journalists only, so to avoid any feedback, I'd like to ask that you put your phones on mute.
The presentations can be downloaded on our website after the call and you will also have additional slides with additional financial figures. Please remember that there is no text on the website. Both speakers will be speaking freely. Of course there is the recording. I'd like to remind you of our safe harbor statement and our forward-looking statements, which are on the second page of our quarterly presentation. Mr. Bruch, you might think it's finally a boring quarter, but then you replaced the counter guarantees and then the share price went up to over EUR 100. We're not all that boring after all. Over to you now.
Thank you very much, Tim. Good morning to all of you. Thank you for joining us today. As usual, what I'm going to do is give you an overview of our developments in the past quarter and then after that overview, Maria will go into the details of the figures. Basically, I can only repeat what I already said in the second quarter. Yes, it may be boring. Despite the geopolitical challenges, we continue to operate in what is an attractive market environment. The rising electricity demand and the need to replace aging infrastructure are indeed ensuring a sustained high demand for our solutions. I will come back to the situation in the U.S. and especially the current tariff agreement between the U.S. and the EU. I'll do that in a moment. I will also say a few words about our capacity expansions and our investments a little later.
The third quarter was the most successful quarter in Siemens Energy's five-year history in terms of order intake. Our customers placed orders for products and services worth EUR 16.6 billion, which exceeded the order intake for the same quarter of last year by almost 65%, adjusted for currency and portfolio effects. All segments contributed to this very good order intake. I want to highlight in particular Siemens Gamesa's two major offshore orders in the Polish Baltic Sea worth a total of over EUR 3 billion. I'd like to take this opportunity to thank more than 100,000 colleagues who work very hard every day to serve our customers. Our Order Backlog is now at a new high of EUR 136 billion, which is all the more remarkable if you bear in mind that we had to put up with negative currency effects of about EUR 4 billion due to the current strength of the euro.
This Order Backlog gives us planning certainty that's important for us, always important, because the order situation can fluctuate from quarter to quarter. Ultimately, it is about sustainable, it's about profitable growth. We're currently investing heavily in the same way, developing our workforce. As I said, in a moment, I'm going to give you an overview. On a comparable basis with the same quarter last year, we increased revenue by 13.5% to EUR 9.7 billion. In Q3, the profit margin before special items was 5.1%. The bottom line for the third quarter was a profit after taxes of EUR 697 million. We are on track to meet our revised forecast. We're currently aiming to reach the upper end of the target range. Now, our focus remains on profitable growth. We're focusing on three things. We need to create the conditions for growth. We want to continuously improve profitability and strengthen our portfolio.
We're making discernible progress in this regard, step by step. We resumed sales activities for the revised 4X turbine in September 2024. In wind, we now have also started sales activities for the revised 5X turbine. This turbine has undergone a fundamental technical overhaul, and we're now starting sales with an initially limited number of units. You can expect that it will take some time before the projects based on this turbine become visible in our order intake. That is the usual sequence of project development in the wind business. With that strong growth, the robustness of our supply chain is very important for us. This is especially true in this geopolitically volatile environment. In the past quarter, we signed a letter of intent with Japanese company TDK for the supply of rare earth magnets. These magnets are particularly important for those large offshore wind turbines.
Today, they're sourced almost exclusively from China. In this quarter, an important step was the replacement of the federal government's counter guarantees with an agreement with our commercial banks. I'm really proud that we were able to achieve this ahead of schedule. The German Bundestag Budget Committee has taken a decision on 30th of July . Now the basis has been laid for us to pay our shareholders a dividend for the current fiscal year if the AGM next year agrees. Maria in a moment will give you some more details, but I would like to take this opportunity to thank the German government for their support. In the current market environment, we are continuously developing our portfolio. These are first of all steps to increase capacity or secure supply chains. For example, we have acquired the remaining 50% of the former joint venture RWG.
RWG is a company that exclusively performs maintenance and repairs for smaller gas turbines from Siemens Energy. The company generates sales of just over EUR 200 million, and we expect this transaction to close at the end of the year. When it comes to partnerships, I'd like to once again highlight our cooperation with Rolls-Royce and small modular reactors. We do not expect the technology to be ready for the market until after 2030. However, we're already laying the foundations now to participate in future growth markets. Our partner Rolls-Royce has already been commissioned by Great British Nuclear to build three of those small modular reactors in the U.K. We would contribute the conventional part to that, so we're also well positioned here. The United States is the world's largest energy market. For this reason, I'd like to comment on developments there separately.
Of course, first of all there's the tariff situation, and I welcome that there's an agreement between the U.S. and the European Union, so that at least provides some planning certainty. The unilateral introduction of 15% tariffs is a significant step, and we would naturally have preferred to avoid that. In the third quarter, 35% of our orders came from the U.S., and for Gas Services this figure was even higher at about 50%. Still, you have to take a differentiated view here. On the one hand, we are manufacturing locally in the U.S., but on the other hand, we also have international supply chains in the sense that we're not just importing from the EU. Many details regarding the tariff situation still need to be clarified. We can at this moment only estimate the final impact on us.
By the third quarter of the year, we had incurred customs duties of around EUR 100 million. In the fourth quarter, we would expect an additional mid double-digit million euro amount. Given the current agreement between the EU and the U.S., that figure is slightly higher than originally assumed. These charges are primarily related to our rolled A service contracts where those charges cannot simply be passed on to customers. Given the good strong operating performance, we can compensate for the additional burden, but it is still a painful process for new and existing delivery projects. We're normally in a situation where we can pass on the tariff to customers. Despite the tariff situation, we currently see an extremely strong market in the United States for energy solutions.
Both in terms of the replacement of outdated infrastructure and the enormous demand for electricity for data centers in particular are now driving very high demand for our products in the U.S. Gas Services, for example, has secured gas turbine orders totaling 14 GW in the fiscal year to date. 60% of those are for data centers. Grid Technologies reserved an order in the third quarter for a high- voltage direct current transmission system for the low loss transport of large amounts of electricity, and has also received several orders for transformers, both of which are critical infrastructure products. In the onshore wind sector, we have once again received orders for repowering, which is the replacement of existing older units. Order intake in the U.S. amounted to around EUR 5.8 billion in the third quarter, in other words, tripling compared with the same quarter last year.
In the current market environment, it is important to me to point out that we maintain a broad global footprint in terms of order intake. We have once again succeeded in securing important orders in various regions this quarter. Europe is and remains a key market for us. Investment in grid infrastructure is a major driver here in Europe, benefiting our Grid Technologies business segment. We currently continue to be positive about the investment activity in this segment here in Europe. For example, National Grid and Scottish Power in the U.K. want us to be their preferred supplier for those two major HVDC projects. The Middle East, like Saudi Arabia and United Arab Emirates, also continue to be an important sales market for us.
In the Transformation of Industry segment, we received many orders from Northern Europe, from Asia and Australia, resulting in a 23% increase in order intake compared with the same quarter last year. To sum this up, let me say once again we had a strong quarter with a recorded order intake. We are working through our plan now, step by step, and we're making good progress. The tariffs are having an impact on our business, but we currently expect that this impact is manageable because at the end of the day our business is so broadly positioned that we can have spread those risks well. With that, you are now going to hear more detailed figures from Maria, please.
Thank you, Christian, and good morning everyone. A warm welcome also from my side. Thank you for joining us. Let's start with an overview of our financial performance for the third quarter at group level. As you see here, orders grew by 65% on a comparable basis. There is one thing that I would like to point out, which is that due to the strong euro, we've had some headwinds from currency translation and foreign exchange effects, which in essence means we have a bigger spread than usual between nominal and comparable growth. You'll see that here in terms of order growth that was spread across all business areas, also driven by Siemens Gamesa, as mentioned, where we booked two large offshore orders, each worth more than EUR 1.5 billion. Book to bill ratio remains strong at 1.7.
This is driving our Order Backlog to another record high of EUR 136 billion, continuing to provide us transparency for the future and to provide a strong foundation not only for this year, but also for midterm targets. Looking at revenue here, we rose by 13.5% and reached EUR 9.7 billion. The growth in revenue was primarily driven by Grid Technologies, which grew by 26%, and Gas Services, which grew by 17%, again both on a comparable basis. Profit before special items increased quite significantly, almost 10 x year- over- year, to EUR 497 million. Here all segments increased sharply, of course, and for Siemens Gamesa it was as expected in the quarter. Profit increase was mainly due to increased volume and corresponding fixed cost absorption effects. We continue to execute through our high margin projects. This is driven by better pricing and a strong service contribution of 33% in the quarter.
Looking at special items this quarter, as expected, the demerger of Siemens Energy India Ltd. led to an effect of roughly positive EUR 0.5 billion and resulted in a profit of EUR 956 million for the quarter. Just as a refresher, on June 9th, Siemens Energy India Ltd. was successfully listed. As we've said before, our aim is to become the major shareholder in 2028. We will achieve this by swapping the 6% ownership of Siemens India Limited and purchasing the remainder from Siemens AG. The required cash out for this will fluctuate with the relative share price developments of both and is included in our business plan for 2028. This depends on the share price of Siemens Energy India Ltd. in 2028. Accordingly, our free cash flow this quarter was EUR 419 million, around EUR 300 million lower than in Q3 of the prior year.
Again, this is mainly due to a few things. One, we've had shifts to Q4, but also we have changes in our operating net working capital. This is driven mainly by reduction of trade payables as well as a lower increase in contract liabilities. This is mainly in Siemens Gamesa. Overall though, as expected for the quarter, now let's take a brief look at the performance of our business areas on the next page, and again, please refer to our website for the complete breakdown by business area. Looking at Gas Services, we had a very strong quarter once again, benefiting, as Christian mentioned, from a very strong gas market with EUR 6.3 billion in order intake. This is another record Order Backlog for Gas Services, which now stands at EUR 53 billion. Looking at revenue, this stood at EUR 3.1 billion. For Gas Services, this is just shy of a 17% increase.
On a comparable basis, Q3 profit before special items was EUR 406 million. This is nearly double year- over- year and has resulted in a margin of 13%. Overall, a very strong quarter for Gas Services. Now looking at Grid Technologies, also with a very strong Q3, orders at EUR 4.2 billion. For Grid Technologies, this is up 24% year- over- year and driven again, as Christian mentioned, by the strong broad-based demand across business products and solutions as well as across different regions. The Order Backlog for Grid Technologies stood at EUR 38 billion. Revenue grew by 26% on a comparable basis. This is substantial growth, and this was driven again by increase in both the products and solutions businesses within Grid Technologies. Profit before special items was at EUR 448 million, almost double compared to last year.
This resulted in a margin of 15.9%, and again, this improvement in profit was driven by strong underlying operational performance. Overall, a very strong quarter for our Grid Technologies business. Moving on to Transformation of Industry, Q3 orders at EUR 1.4 billion, this is a 23.4% increase driven by new unit orders therein with an increase of 35%. Revenue for Transformation of industry grew by 5.1% comparable, this driven by all business with our compression business being the biggest contributor. Q3 profit before special items was at EUR 157 million, again an increase of roughly 50% compared to prior year with a margin of 11.5%. Here profit was driven by sustained volume growth, particularly in service. For Siemens Gamesa, in Q3 we had an extremely strong order intake with all other KPIs as mentioned earlier, in line with expectations.
As you know, the business is still in restructuring or transformation mode, which means some variability quarter to quarter. For example, the first half of this fiscal year was trending positively versus prior year. However, in Q3, operational improvements were offset mainly by two effects. One, the tariff impact. Here the business was impacted with a mid double-digit euro amount and this is mainly due to catch-up effects on contracts and in some cases one-time in nature. Secondly, in Q3 we perform at Siemens Gamesa the regular annual update of the statistical models. This is utilized for the evaluation of the entire wind turbine fleet with respect to failure rates and cost assumptions. This caused also a high double-digit million euro amount, again well within our expectations. Also, maybe to note, our 4X and 5X provisions here remained basically stable.
Again, overall a strong or as expected quarter for our businesses. Now moving on to our net cash position. With respect to net cash, here you see overall we have a strong cash position with EUR 8.5 billion in cash and cash equivalents. Our financial debt reduced slightly to EUR 3.7 billion, of which EUR 2.2 billion is long term, considering also pension provisions. Taking that into account, this brings us into an adjusted net cash position of EUR 4.4 billion at the end of June. For comparison, just a year ago we were at EUR 1.7 billion. With this, we continue to have a strong balance sheet commensurate with our investment grade profile, which is also reflected in our external ratings. A perfect segue to the next slide. During this quarter we also had several milestones, which is building a strong financial foundation.
For us, on June 5th we announced the replacement of the EUR 11 billion facility backed by the German Federal government and the EUR 1 billion facility backed by Siemens AG. Now we have a new EUR 9 billion syndicated facility, which fully supports our large-scale projects, business, and guarantee demands for the years to come. This achievement relieves us of a financial burden. As you recall, we did have a cost for the Bundbacht facility of approximately EUR 100 million plus in the fiscal year of 2026. On June 9th, Siemens Energy Ltd., as I mentioned in India, was also successfully listed on the Indian stock exchange. On May 26th, 2025, S&P revised their outlook for us to positive from stable and affirmed the BBB- rating. On June 17th, 2025, we received an investment grade rating of Baa2 with a positive outlook in its inaugural rating from Moody's.
Finally, last but not least, thanks to replacing our federal counter guarantees ahead of time, we have created the foundational conditions for enabling dividend distributions to our shareholders as the dividend restriction was lifted as mentioned earlier. Again, this was just the first step. Now, with respect to the dividend, we have to complete the fiscal year as planned so that we can, with approval of the Supervisory Board, recommend a dividend payment for the shareholders to vote on at our next Annual General Meeting in February 2026. Just a gentle reminder that our dividend policy is to distribute between 40% and 60% of net income attributable to shareholders. Now, moving on to our outlook, as you recall, we last upgraded guidance in our second quarter financial disclosure. Today, we are reaffirming that guidance and we are currently trending towards the upper end of ranges.
This includes the already mentioned direct impact from tariffs after mitigation measures of around EUR 100 million stemming from global impact of tariffs, also including China and specific raw material tariffs. Based on the recent EU-U.S. agreement of 15% tariffs effective from July, we now expect a further negative profit impact of up to a mid double-digit million euro amount in Q4. This brings the total estimated impact on Siemens Energy to approximately EUR 150 million as mentioned by Christian. Please note that this effect is already embedded in our guidance and in November we will give you an update of our midterm targets with the full year results and thereafter on our capital market day. That concludes my portion of the presentation and I hand back over to you, Christian. Thank you
Maria, thank you very much, Maria. As I said, I'm going to say something about our investments and expansions. We are growing, as you've seen in our numbers, significantly, and we're continuously investing in locations, we're hiring new employees. This year, our investments are almost EUR 2 billion globally. We're also investing in Germany. It's important to me to talk about this. Things are happening here, and we at Siemens Energy are also supportive of the major Germany initiative. I think it is important that we highlight those positive developments. We want to restore public confidence in the future. We want to send a signal, encourage people to tackle the things we need to improve here in Germany. It is true that many of our investments were already planned before the change of government.
The important message for me is that we are investing here in Germany as a company. We're creating new jobs. We're also confident that we can hold our own here as a location in global competition. We're willing to change to achieve this. Since 2022, Siemens Energy has been investing nearly EUR 1 billion at its German site. We are planning for more investment as well. Last year alone, we created 1,300 additional jobs in Germany. In the next fiscal year, we plan to hire another 1,500 new employees here in Germany. We train young people, we hire them. Like many other German companies, we are doing this very single-mindedly, both the small and medium-sized enterprises and the large corporations as well. I think therefore that it is right that the new federal government now has set itself the goal of seeking closer cooperation with businesses in Germany.
The government has a responsibility to create structures that those investments pay off, especially also in comparison to other countries, because businesses will only invest in Germany if they find reliable overall conditions, an intact infrastructure, competitive production costs, and well-trained personnel. If businesses like ours can support policymakers in any way to create these conditions, we're happy to do that because we all care about Germany as a business location. Now back to you, Tim. Thank you very much.
Thank you very much. Christian Bruch and Maria Ferraro. You now have the possibility, journalists, to ask your questions. A technical remark: you can ask the questions in person if you've dialed in or by phone. You received the dial-in data with the invitation. If you want to ask a question, please press asterisk and one, o r you can ask your questions in the chat. To avoid feedback, you should switch off the webcast now. Unless, of course, you only speak English. Then, of course, you can listen to the translation into English. You can ask your questions either in English or in German, and the answer will be given in the same language. Asterisk one for a question. Now we'd like to ask you for the first question. We have a question from chat from Ed Ballard from The Wall Street Journal.
Mr. Bruch, you talked about the increased demand in the United States, and he wants to know if the demand for gas turbines is so great in the U.S. that it would go beyond the investments that you have already announced when you talked about the investments and the expansions there.
Right. Should I answer in English or German?
You can answer in German. It will be interpreted into English.
Okay, whatever's easier. Good, then I'll answer in German. That might be a possibility. It will depend on how stable this high demand is. As you might know, today we are manufacturing in the U.S. the blades, for example, and in Florida. We produce this for the global market, not just for the United States. As you know, we have structures in the United States, we have plants in the U.S., and we can also expand capacities.
We'll take a very careful look at that. As I said, that's what we're doing right now. It's a question: will this demand remain stable and at that high level, then would we invest in the United States? Right now we're investing about $500 million in plant expansions in the United States, and it has become a key market and we want to be successful.
Thank you very much. The next question, Christoph Steitz from Reuters. Good morning, Mr. Steitz.
I have three questions. Mr. Bruch, you talked about a mid double-digit figure for tariffs impacts. Is that the order of magnitude that you can expect every quarter? Will we have this amount every quarter? That's my first question. The second question, what about the discussions with customers in the United States? You talked in the past about stability and the expectations on the horizon.
Is this something that is reflected in your discussions with the customers and.
Order Backlog? You've been chasing records after record every single quarter for as long as I can remember. How high can Order Backlog become without losing its health? I know that this has been something that you've been paying a lot of attention to. Those are my questions for the time being.
Right. Good morning, Mr. Steitz. Thank you for your questions. First of all, what about the tariff impacts? Where does this come from? Primarily from longer, older service contracts. This is something the burden and the charges will mean. How long will these service contracts last? The contracts for new components or new gas turbines, new transformers, then we can pass on the tariff effects there. I assume that next year we will have similar orders of magnitude, but over the course of the years this will go down because from the service contracts, of course, we will successively come to an end and they'll be replaced by new ones. I'd like to mention one more thing. These tariff effects don't consider this only EU, U.S.A., t he effect the steel tariffs have an impact. Mexico, Canada, other countries also have an impact.
This is something that is moving all the time. I have to be a bit cautious here in mentioning any old figure. I think we have to take a very careful look at this because it's complex and changing. Discussions with customers and new plants, especially gas turbines and Grid Technologies, this is driven by the question can you deliver? This is something that we've done very successfully. We can present this very successfully. That's why we have very good order intake. Of course, we can also pass on the tariff effects. You shouldn't forget one thing. These effects also impact other suppliers just as they affect us. We're no different from the others. At the end of the day it means that the prices will go up. That's why we have to see how things developed when it comes to critical infrastructure.
Our discussions with customers have been driven more by the question as to delivery times and not so much by the tariffs.
Thank you, Christoph, for the question regarding Order Backlog. I like that chasing records, and I think it's really important. This is something that I stress quarte- over- quarter. It's not just about the growth of the Order Backlog, it's absolutely about the quality of that backlog. What we indicate quarter after quarter is not only are we growing in the backlog, but that the margin quality continues to expand and be better in the backlog. I think that's absolutely a function of what we call internally selectivity. Of course, we don't just book an order to book an order, we're selective in those orders. Also, because of the pricing power that we're able to have due to the market momentum. You're fully right. It's not just about increasing the Order Backlog. It's ensuring that the margin in that backlog continues to improve, and that's exactly what we're seeing.
Next question from [audio distorted] . Can we have a question, please?
Yes, hello. Good morning. I have a couple of questions on Gas Services. First of all, are the numbers always referring to Gas Services or all of your businesses that you've mentioned when you talk about the quarterly figures, and how full or how booked is your order book for Gas Services? How many years, in other words, and what is the markup you can charge in the gas business in the U.S.? Can you tell us what your overall assessment is of the situation of tariffs, not only generally in the U.S. but also globally? How much of that is affected by that situation? Do you also see picking up demand in other countries? Now the first question, are we posting a record also at Gas Services when it comes to orders? That was the first question.
Now I think it was the second highest order intake per quarter, but still it was a special situation currently that we're seeing here in the market. Why? Because there are many customers that are buying more than one gas turbine, so multiples. It's not only about data centers, you mentioned that, but about 60% of our demand is the usual business. That would be coal to gas, oil to gas, that sort of conversion or normal electricity growth. About 40% is new applications, so either data centers, but also applications like, you know, what do you use the power ships, so power ships, so floating power stations that can be used for emergency or crisis situations or take LNG electrification, that sort of thing. This is now also what we're seeing and they're gaining importance, the share of data centers. The U.S.
is dominating when it comes to demand for data centers. 40% of our gas turbines are related to the data center business. Globally, that figure stands at about 25%. Of course, we are talking here about those large scale data centers, so hundreds, multiples of hundreds of megawatts. You would find that in regions of the world where electricity prices are low or, you know, planable. You would expect the United States with the hyperscalers. What we also now see is the Middle East. This happens a bit later with a lag. I think this is the next big wave. Europe is a bit reticent about that. I think that was the question. When will you be fully booked as it were with your orders? Delivery times are growing.
Now we are booked until 2027, but 2028 already has good Order Backlog, and if I remember correctly, 21 GW of reservations is what we currently have. Yeah, we have customers who are interested, and at the same time in the coming year and also in 2027 we are going to see our capacitors enlargements there. We're trying to balance our operations that well. What this means is we're in a good situation. Our Flanning horizon is very stable.
Next question will be in English. Plechinger from Energi Watch. Christian, you need to answer in English, but please Maz, fire your question.
Yeah, good morning. I didn't get the last part, Tim, but you're welcome to answer in Danish as well. I have a few questions about Siemens Gamesa. One is regarding tariffs. You mentioned mid double-digit euro effects. Why is that, and which projects is it? I saw the Virginia senator talk about that they would have to pay around EUR 300 million in tariffs. Is it projects like those which have something in the contract that make you pay tariffs? That's one question. The other is regarding the onshore successor of the 5X platform rather than a relay launch. Why is this a successor, and how much is this indeed a new platform? Also, when do you expect sales to pick up? Thank you.
Yeah, [foreign language]. I probably do it in English. It's probably better for the rest. First of all, the tariffs, it's a mixed vector. Keep in mind we have service onshore and also offshore execution at the moment in the U.S., and there's obviously also tariffs on steel, which is an element. It's not just European Union and the U.S. It's a mixed bag of these different things. Service is mainly local.
Right.
I mean, that is something where there's the least impact between offshore and obviously some pieces of the onshore businesses where we import. That is what is driving the impact. On the successor, that's a super question. You know, it will not be in the market under 5X. It will have a different name. It will be called 7.0, right. It shows you it's somewhere between a progression of the old platform and really some revised elements. However, let's say obviously we base it on things which have worked and which we know, and we also obviously keep a prototype running while we start gradually to introduce a product. It is definitely not just 5X with fixes. It's really a renewed product, however, obviously based mainly on the same frameworks.
I think the team did a great job to really redesign it, and it gives me a comfort that this can be a successful platform in the market.
Thank you very much. Next question comes from [Marcus Frey] from FAZ. Good morning, [Mr. Frey].
Good morning. I hope you can all hear me.
Yeah, we hear you well.
Now I'd like to talk about your dividends because you said, you talked about the early possibility to pay dividends in [Anne]. Now, Ms. Ferraro earlier said 40%- 60% of net earnings are to be distributed. Is that also true for this year because you had a EUR 3 billion net profit, but with Siemens Energy India Ltd. you have special effect. It would be EUR 1.5 billion. What will be your reference for the dividend payment? I also have a question on the weak dollar now. EUR 4 billion of negative FX, we heard, if I understand that correctly. How much is really the weak dollar weighing on your business and what that really means?
Yes, I will absolutely go first. Thank you for the questions. Yes, let me clarify the dividends. The 40 %- 60% is based on net income and the technical term is, you know, attributable to shareholders. Yes, that would be the range that we use also for this year and that would be the proposal that we would be put forward with that range for a dividend payment. What I wanted to stress is it's for fiscal year 2025, and of course would only be paid after, in February 2026 onwards, after the AGM approval. That is the basis. You're correct there with respect to the EUR 4 billion of FX. Let me clarify. That was relating to a translation effect in our Order Backlog. In other words, our Order Backlog stands at EUR 136 billion. Actually, if it wasn't for that translation effect, we would be closer to the EUR 140 billion.
It did have an effect, but that's temporary in nature. It's something that we do every period. That's why it's called a cumulative translation effect. Of course, that then would vary as with the changes in the FX. What I do want to say is with respect to profit. Again, it's important to note that we are hedged. This is something that we do very methodically, especially for our projects. With respect to profit, we are heavily hedged to ensure that we don't have that variability on a month by month or quarter- by- quarter basis.
The question about the respective dividend import to Siemens Energy, not in Europe, right?
Of course, yes, if that was what was asked. Yes, absolutely. It would be the Siemens Energy net income effect. I think what they were referring to is the special effect of EUR 473 million that is deemed a special effect. It would be excluding that or could be excluding that profit because it's a non-cash effect, to be technical. Yeah, thanks.
He also asked the question about why you had the, you have the dividend ban that you've to not release just the dividend that no longer a ban on the dividend.
That's a nice question. Let me try and give you the answer. The ban on paying out a dividend was really a major problem for our investors. In the next calendar year or the next fiscal year, the ban on the bonus will also be lifted. For this calendar year, sorry, for this fiscal year, I should put it, that is still the way it is.
The next question is [Christophe Ruemeier] from dpa. Good morning, Mr. [Ruemeier].
Good morning. I would like to know, this is a question of the strong position and high new orders. You have a very important and strong position on the market. How much does this influence the prices?
Can you ask for better prices considering the high demand, how much does that amount to? Another request, could you really tell us what about the EUR 1 billion or up to EUR 1 billion organically in operations in terms of profit, how much of this close to EUR 500 million can be added considered for India? I assume that in this current fiscal year you will be above last year's, especially driven by special items, or is that being far too speculative?
Let me say something on the prices and Maria can talk about the net income. Let me put it this way. Generically speaking, in all areas, the orders that we take in are accretive to the backlog margin. In other words, profitability in the backlog is increased. Everything that we see in the prices is higher than the average. This is based on the price increases during the quarter.
We have been able to say that what we see now in gas turbines, we continue to have a situation where price increases can be achieved, but not to the same extent as was the case in previous years or in previous quarters. The price curve is flattening out. The similar situation in Grid Technologies, this as in gas, depends on the delivery dates. We also have to say if you have a short term delivery, then you can enforce high price increases. If it's an order that will not go through until 2028 or 2029, then that's not the case. You have to see it that way. I think the most important message here is that everything that we take on board can increase the profitability of the backlog. In other words, the average profitability is improved as a result.
Let me take the dividend question. Let me clarify again. You're fully right. Our guidance says around EUR 1 billion in net income for this fiscal year for Siemens Energy. We excluded in that guidance a special effect coming from the demerger of Siemens Energy India Ltd. We now know this quarter that effect is approximately EUR 500 million We still maintain the EUR 1 billion, and we don't include that in our guidance.
Right.
Of course, the net income including that impact is exactly right. It's about the EUR 1.5 billion all in. Just two topics there with respect to what would we consider with respect to the dividend. Our dividend policy does indicate that we can exclude non-cash items. To be very clear, the Siemens Energy India Ltd. translation effect is a positive effect, but it's non-cash in nature. It's really a technical accounting treatment effect and hence why we exclude it from our guidance accordingly. Again, our policy does indicate that we can exclude non-cash items. What I would ask is that we finish the fiscal year, determine how our net income fares, and then we go from there. Hopefully that clarifies that.
Thank you, [Ann], very much. If you want to ask a question, asterisk one, we have two more questions in the chat. Mr. Bruch, a question from Ed Ballard from Wall Street Journal. Let me read it out to you in English and maybe you can answer in English. Administration indicated to Siemens Energy that additional manufacturing capacity for gas turbines would be desirable given the strength of demand growth.
First of all, it's ourselves, not the Trump administration seeing the good market. As I said, we have an interest to expand our production capacity in the U.S. and for the transformers, switch gears. We're doing it at the moment for the blades factory in Florida. We are doing this at the moment. We are exploring further opportunities. What we are trying to balance out is also the understanding of what does the investment cost. You see the inflation in the construction market. Obviously, building a factory gets more and more expensive, and we obviously try to understand what is really the long-term trajectory of the market going forward. In the U.S., we are in close contact also with the administration. Keep in mind, in a lot of cases the state is even more relevant than the federal government.
What is an interest, and I myself have been in Washington lately, is are we able really to ensure the supremacy in artificial intelligence by supplying the electricity and absolutely, we are interested to contribute where we can and ensure that the U.S. is successful on their journey. In that regard, we continue to look into this and also discuss with the states and with the federal government in terms of how do they look on it, particularly since the data center infrastructure is obviously linked also to certain federal decisions in terms of what comes when. We are in contact. I really want to underline that it's really market driven for us from the customers, and we will continue to look onto further investments in the U.S., but we are all on it already.
Next question from the chat is from Joachim Heer of Börsen-Zeitung. Mr. Bruch, you said before that tariffs are mostly affecting existing long term service contracts. Now I don't know if Maria or Christian wants to take that. What are the effects of U.S. import tariffs in the coming years once those long term service contracts expire?
First of all, tariffs affect everything, okay? The question is how much of it can we pass on to our customers or not? In that context, I do believe that tariffs will lead to a change in pricing structure. You're going to see higher prices also because our competitors are exactly in the same situation here. The question is will you do more localization or not will very much hinge on how much you can plan the situation and how long term that situation.
No one is going to build a factory for the market in the next three or four years, right? Investments into a manufacturing facility are massive. Therefore you need to have a feeling how a market develops over the next 10 years. That's really what matters. In that context, it's true that we're very much preoccupied with the tariff situation. I'd like to call on everyone, stay calm, look at the market, try to understand the underlying trends. That will be what matters most.
Thank you very much. Clara Thier from WirtschaftsWoche as a follow up question. Ms Thier, go ahead.
Thank you very much. Follow up question on Gas Services. I've seen that your target was that by 2030 your gas emissions or Gas Services emissions are to be reduced by one third. Is your climate target still up to date?
And if it is up to date, how you want to achieve that. You have the same time are growing your orders and you grow your capacities in Gas Services, how do you stick to your target?
Scope 3 referred to the entire company. Let me say that at the top and it depends on how much customers switch to other fuels, right? I mean that's what it was about. If you're operating a gas turbine, you can fire it with hydrogen. This is why it's not that we have control of on our own. Obviously we're looking at the situation as we speak and of course it will be influenced by growth going forward. Again, let us also point out it doesn't depend on how we are developing, but how the customer market is developing.
If or when society is ready to invest into alternative fuels, countries will have to spend money on that. This is something that is discussed across the board. It is the truth of the matter that in any electricity system you need dispatchable power. Dispatchable power means you can control flexibly the meat and you can use a gas turbine. Whether it takes natural gas or hydrogen is your decision. We cannot resolve that on our own. In that sense, I cannot give you a final answer. We're trying to understand the market drivers as we see them out there. What is important for me is that at the end of the day everything is a Scope 1 emission. Everything that we do, Scope 3 refers to the investments carried out by others, not by us.
Therefore, we will stick with our roadmap to reduce our Scope 1 and Scope 2 emissions and to achieve net zero emissions by 2030 that we're striving for. That's my corridor, right? That's what I can influence. Looking at what the market does is hard for us to influence.
Maz Plechinger from Energi Watch. Maz, please.
Yeah, thanks for giving me another opportunity, and thank you for adding more details on the new onshore turbine. Could I get you to elaborate a bit more on its market potential, more specifically in the German market? How much of a difference do you assume that this turbine can make in the German market before the current boom begins to fade? Thanks.
Yeah.
Once again an excellent question. I will probably be better able to tell you six months from now when I've seen really the sales teams having developed or starting to develop projects with the customers. What I hear from the, let's say, early discussions and pre-discussions which we had with customers across Germany, also across northern Europe, also in areas you could consider like Australia, is a very positive reception in terms of high interest of customers in this turbine. Whether they order the turbine at the end is something where I really would like to see the proof points first from the market. I really have to say I cannot tell you at this point in time, but I think the product itself is well positioned and now we have to see if customers are taking it up in the current environment.
Obviously, yes, we would love to happen to the German market as well. As you know, project development in the German market takes particularly long because of the process on how it is. I would not expect that Germany is a first market. What we see by taking in orders.
Good.
All the questions have been answered. We've learned that Mr. Bruch speaks Danish as well. We can conclude today's press call. Thank you for joining us and for your interest. If you have any follow-up questions, my press team and myself will be happy to hear from you by phone. The conference call for analysts with Christian Bruch and Maria Ferraro will begin at 10:30 A.M. You can dial in if you like, but you can't ask questions. That's only for analysts. You can find the link on our website. The next date is our annual press conference. The year has gone by quickly. It will be on the 14th of November in Berlin. We'll send you out a Save the Date in the near future. Thank you all very much. That concludes today's conference call, and have a lovely day. Thank you very much.