Hello, and good afternoon, everyone. Welcome to CTS Eventim's H1 2024 Earnings Call. You have Holger Hohrein, Group CFO, and myself, Marco Haeckermann, on the line. And over the next 15-20 minutes, Holger will go through our H1 results, and then we will continue with a Q&A session, and without further ado, I hand over to Holger.
Thanks, Marco. Hello, everyone. Also, warm welcome from my end. Before we jump into the financials in detail, I'd like to provide you with a brief overview of the development of the first six months, and especially the second quarter. The environment for our industry looks good. We are seeing an ongoing strong momentum. We see high demand for live entertainment, for all kinds of events, music concerts, sports events, and the like. Therefore, we have seen a strong growth in also in the second quarter, which resulted in very strong numbers for the first six months in total. For the first six months, we have seen revenue up by 18% versus previous six months period, and Adjusted EBITDA up by 29%.
This strong performance is driven by all elements of our value chain, ticketing, live entertainment, and venue management as part of our live entertainment segment, so to say, a sub-segment. One major event in the second quarter has certainly been the signing and closing of our acquisition of See Tickets in our live entertainment business. And we have started consolidating these units beginning of June. And due to the strong performance of the existing business and the on-boarding of See Tickets, we raise our outlook for 2024 as a whole. We come to all this in a minute, but first, a brief look at some KPIs. Revenue and EBITDA, we have already talked about. The number of online tickets also increased significantly, now to 44 million for the first six months in total.
The growth outside of Germany has been even higher, 32% versus 29% in Germany. We come to this also in a minute. But last but not least, earnings per share came out at around 1.30, which is a substantial increase over the last year's first six months. Now first, a few words on the acquisition of See Tickets and its strategic rationale. In terms of size of the business, we in the last year, 2023, this perimeter had almost EUR 140 million in revenues, of which more than EUR 100 million came from the ticketing business and EUR 30 million from live entertainment. Here, the live entertainment this comprises festivals in the U.K. and in France.
On the left-hand side, you can also see the split of last year's ticketing revenues by country. More than 85% of come from countries where we didn't have a strong market position today, namely U.K., U.S., and the Benelux. Therefore, the acquisition is a perfect fit to our growth strategy and improves our market position in these mentioned countries significantly. In addition, we broaden our talent base and extend our product portfolio as we, Eventim and See Tickets, have partially complementary products and therefore also serve different groups of clients. Both will help us in future to further grow in our markets. After the closing of the transaction, we've immediately initiated and started a PMI project to explore our synergies on the customer and market side, as well as in the back end, of course.
As already mentioned, we have started consolidating See Tickets and the former Vivendi Live business, beginning of June. And for June, and therefore, already part of the second quarter, these businesses added EUR 25 million in, almost EUR 26 million in revenues and EUR 2.5 million in EBITDA already. So far, a brief look at the latest transaction. Now, a closer look at the first six months in total. Revenue already mentioned, revenue went up by 18% to now a little more than EUR 1.2 billion, driven by the growth in all parts of our value chain, ticketing, live entertainment, and venue management across all regions. It's worth mentioning that France Billet is still not included in our numbers, as the discussions with the EU competition authorities are still ongoing.
These revenues translate into disproportionately into higher, even higher EBITDA growth. The adjusted EBITDA came out at EUR 202 million. This is the highest amount in the first six-month period, but that's actually not surprising and not a news at all, so to say. The adjusted EBITDA margin on group level increased to 16.8%, and the EBIT ended at EUR 152 million. This is only a 30% up on previous year's number, but the reason behind this, that in last year's number, we still have items which have not been adjusted coming from Corona aid payments, which we then still received beginning of 2023. If you would deduct them, then we would end up with a similar growth rate compared to the adjusted EBITDA.
Looking now at the quarterly view, we can see an increase of 21% in the second quarter versus second quarter last year for the revenues, whereas ticketing revenues have increased 28% in the second quarter, and revenues in the live entertainment segment have increased by 20%. Compared to the first quarter, revenues have almost doubled, so the growth is accelerating. The adjusted EBITDA went up by 23% compared to second quarter last year, and this performance is mainly driven by the strong ticketing segment. The EBITDA in ticketing went up by 35% in the second quarter, and in the live segment, adjusted EBITDA went up by 5% in the second quarter compared to last year's quarter two. Let's now have a look at both segments in detail, and we start with the ticketing segment.
As already mentioned, revenues went up by 26% for the first six months and 28% for the second quarter, which indicates a strong momentum in ticketing. It's important to mention, See Tickets is only included for June in these numbers here. The Adjusted EBITDA went up by 29% for the first six months, so even stronger than revenues, and for the second quarter, as already mentioned, 35%, again, even stronger than revenues. The margin, EBITDA, Adjusted EBITDA margin increased to almost 44%, despite the OpEx inflation, and the strong performance reflects development or the positive development in our markets. Which brings me then to the key driver for or behind this positive development, which is the number of online tickets, which you can see here on this slide.
Looking at the number of online tickets, so the number of tickets sold by our own distribution channels, Eventim experience, so to say, we see 21 million online tickets in the second quarter, totaling to 44 million in the first six months. On the right-hand side, you can then see the number of online tickets split by region. While Germany is still a key market, other regions gain more and more traction, and the share of other regions is constantly increasing over time. It's worth mentioning that the tickets from See Tickets are not included in these numbers yet. They will be included then for the next reporting.
This development shows the increasing importance of international markets and more and more, and a more and more robust and diversified business mix. Now, looking at our live entertainment segment. For the first six months, revenue went up by 15% to 866 million EUR. Looking at the second quarter, we see an increase year-over-year of 20%. The second and third quarter are typically the strongest quarter here, and this is where all the major events or events in general take place. We've seen strong performance, especially in the European live entertainment portfolio, especially in Germany and Italy, and we have also seen a very strong performance in the sub-segment of venue management.
We start reporting numbers in the venue management in future, as this will be a area where we intend to grow in future even stronger. So in venue management, as you know, we operate a number of venues across Europe, like Lanxess Arena, and for the first six months, we have earned more than EUR 50 million revenues in this sub-segment already. The adjusted EBITDA increased by 27% in the first six months, and 5% for the second quarter compared to the second quarter last year. Here we can see an ongoing OpEx challenge on one hand. On the other hand, we see also an increased competition, especially in the U.S.
Nevertheless, the EBITDA margin improved to 5.3%, which is a decent level compared to former years, and also given the challenges in this environment. So all in all, a very strong performance for the first six months, and an even stronger second quarter. This raises the question, what our outlook for 2024 as a whole will be? Here comes our outlook. This is a slide with many, many upward-pointing arrows. I will guide you through the slides right now. Already in March, we were positive for 2024 as a whole, mostly guiding moderately higher revenues and EBITDA levels for both group and on segment levels.
Given the strong performance in our existing business, and the positive momentum we see in the industry, and as well also the consolidation of See Tickets, from June on, we increased our guidance for most of our KPIs on group and on ticketing level or segment. For the group, we increase, especially, guidance for the Adjusted EBITDA significantly from moderately higher to significantly higher. For the ticketing segment, we increase the outlook for revenues, Adjusted EBITDA, and also for the EBIT, from mostly moderately to or also significantly higher for the Adjusted EBITDA and moderately higher for the EBIT. In this context, just to guide you a little bit, is according to our internal metrics, so our internal scale means a growth higher than 15%, 15%, just as a rough guidance.
One last remark here. Why would the EBIT just be moderately higher than last year? Just as a reminder, last year was positively impacted by some one-off effects, mainly coming from the compensation for an abandoned car toll project, and also some COVID aid payments, which we received in the first part of 2023. So if we take out those effects, roughly EUR 50 million, we have to compensate this or set off this effect. Those EUR 50 million would have to be earned operationally. That's why optically this looks a little bit more cautious, but in effect we have to earn this operationally also.
I'd like to close my presentation by repeating the key takeaways. So again, the industry shows strong momentum. We see unchanged high demand for live entertainment in our markets. We have seen strong growth in the first six months, 80% revenue increase year-on-year, and even 29% revenue increase year-on-year in the adjusted EBITDA. The first six months were driven by all elements of our event value chain, ticketing, live entertainment, and venue management. We have completed the acquisition of See Tickets and former Vivendi's Live Entertainment Business, and have started consolidating this business in June. We are very positive for the remainder of this year, for 2024 as a whole, and look very positive into the future.
That's it, from my end for the moment, and now Marco and I look forward to your questions.
Thank you very much, Holger, and as this concludes the presentation part, we now move on to Q&A.
Thank you very much. Ladies and gentlemen, if you would like to ask a question, please press nine and the star key on your telephone keypad. In case you wish to cancel your question, press nine and the star key again. Please press nine and the star key now to state your question. And the first question comes from Cornelis Kik, from Hauck Aufhäuser. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thank you for taking my question. I would have two, if I may. So I saw that sponsoring revenues increased by 77% year-over-year. Could you maybe elaborate on the growth drivers behind that? And is that a trend that we can expect to see in the future as well? And then maybe if you could help us, again, with the bridge between normalized EBITDA to adjusted EBITDA. I saw that you changed that metric now. Maybe if you could shed some light on that, that would be helpful. Thank you.
Okay. Thank you. Thank you for the question. Of course, I mean, we put particular focus as well on ancillary revenues, and as we were coming out of COVID, this whole industry is of course now operating at a different level. And this helped us, of course, as well on our festival formats, and so forth, to increase the part of sponsorship revenues, which is a mirror image, of course, of how well we see the development from the customer sides, attending big events, which is the main platform for our sponsorship business. And I think it's fair to say that we are only at the beginning there, and that with the continued quarters and years, we will make this as well, a more sustainable income and earnings stream as part of our live entertainment business.
On the second question, maybe can I ask my colleague to jump to page 18 of the presentation? Yes. We've anticipated that this question might arise, as we have prepared a slide for this. Just as a reminder, this is, I think we made it transparent in our full year report, 2023 full year financial statement, where we explained the transition from normalized EBITDA, which we have reported on in the past, and adjusted EBITDA, which we use from this year on, beginning of this year on. The reason behind is that the definition of normalization effects was rather narrow. Only, in the sense, some effects coming from, you know, M&A activities, but rather narrow definition.
And last year we had the strange situation that we had not- that we have normalized some small effects coming from those activities, while not taking into account the larger effects, like, you know, compensation from the car toll project, roughly EUR 14 million a year, and also some corona aid payments. And also in the previous year, in 2022, we had quite substantial corona aid payments, which were not normalized, which is a little bit strange, because you guys are interested in the, you know, look at the operations, or the operational performance behind on this company, and would be interested, I guess, in you know, on the in a metric which expresses the operational strength of the company. And therefore, those effects-...
Would have been or should be excluded in a way, yeah? And that's why we have changed the metrics beginning of this year. And we now have a, in general, a broad set of potential effects which we, or non-recurring effects, which we will eliminate or add if necessary. And an effect is seen as significant if it exceeds 1% of the EBITDA. So everything below would not be touched, but if it exceeds 1% of the EBITDA, then we will adjust for this on non-recurring effects. And for 2023, this means we would eliminate the compensation for the car toll project, and we would eliminate some received payments, COVID-19 payments, which we then received at the beginning of last year.
This would mean for last year, the Adjusted EBITDA, so the restated EBITDA, so to say, would be EUR 450.45. Yeah.
All right. That was very helpful. Thank you. Thank you.
The next question comes from Andreas Riemann of Oddo BHF. Please go ahead.
Yes, good afternoon, Andreas here. Thanks for doing this call. First topic, See Tickets. So thanks for additional details. My question would be, what might be the contribution to revenue and EBITDA in the years 2025 or 2026, once potential synergies are included? So the first topic. Second one, the U.S. business. So how does the debate around Live Nation and Ticketmaster that we see right now affect your business in the U.S.? Do you already observe any tailwind? This would be my second question. Thanks.
Yeah. Maybe I start with the first one, and Marco then answers the second question. I mean, we have provided you with some numbers for 2023. We have provided you with some numbers for June. We do not expect those numbers to decline, but rather to rise. But for the moment, we will not disclose any numbers for the next year. But, I mean, you can do some estimates yourself, I would guess. But for the moment, we have just started the PMI project, look into the business a little bit more, in detail. But we of course expect some synergies and quite substantial synergies, but we will not disclose any number, at least not today.
For the second part of the question, how does the current DOJ investigation affect our business? So for now, I mean, through See Tickets, we have gained access to the U.S. from a ticketing perspective, but of course, on a scale that is largely unaffected by the ongoing DOJ investigation. As a player in the industry, of course, we pay very close attention to what is going on over there. But again, I mean, it's very difficult to comment on a potential outcome there. I know that the banking scene is discussing various scenarios there. But, I mean, it's always difficult to put a bet on the outcome of an ongoing litigation, particularly when it is so prominently positioned, as this case is in the U.S. Some expect, of course, a breakup to cause ticket prices to decline.
My personal view is that these people who think that this could happen should further investigate and understand how this industry works in the U.S., yeah. And you all know my point. I mean, complaining about high ticket prices starts at the point of time when we all stopped buying CDs and went to streaming, yeah? So it's the main source of income for artists, particularly in the biggest market worldwide, which is the U.S., and there are huge economic interests behind this industry. And, yeah, we continue to stand on the sidelines to see whether any opportunities arise for us, and then we are willing to act on those. But for now, yeah, we remain on the sidelines.
Okay. Thanks, Marco . Thanks, Holger .
The next question comes from Craig Abbott, from Kepler Cheuvreux. Please go ahead.
Yes, good afternoon. Thank you also. And if you don't mind, I'll ask three. First of all, just to be 100% sure on your guidance outlook. So you said you expect at least 15% EBITDA growth, and that's compared to this comparative base, which you very kindly showed us with these charts a moment ago, of the 445, correct? I mean, that's the first part of that question. Second part is, last time you gave us kind of a range. Are you willing to give us kind of a range of what you're thinking about at this stage? That would be my first question, then I have two more. Thank you.
Yes, for the first question, it's a clear yes. I'm not sure if we got the second question, what more, if you would be willing to provide more range?
Yeah, last time you kind of said 5%-15%. Now you're saying more than 15%. I'm just wondering, you know, if you could give us a ballpark figure, just, you know, what maybe you're looking at on the upper end.
It's at least 15%, as you pointed out, yes, and the upper range, if I mean, if it was more 30%, then we would maybe you have used a different terminology. So I know that's maybe a very, very poor range, but so we
Okay.
Maybe 15%, 25%, 30%, but maybe this is a closer range, but the upper end is not 100%. Maybe this helps.
Mm, okay, I kind of understand. Yeah. All right, thank you. Yeah, secondly, I was just in the Live Entertainment, you know, we saw the margins down. We know about the cost pressures in the industry with artist fees, you know, structurally having increased in addition to the other cost pressures and less flexibility on pricing. I just wondered, but then you also mentioned increasing U.S. competitive pressures. In the past, you've kind of said you expect this division to be able to generate 6%-8% EBITDA margin. Do you still feel comfortable with that range on a full-year basis? That's the second question. I have one more, please.
Yes. In general, yes. As it looks, I mean, yes, we have some pressure, and, yes, we see this impact on the OpEx. Of course, it's challenging. You see price inflations everywhere, and this hits us, especially in the live entertainment segment, of course. But now we have 35.3 EBITDA margin, and a strong quarter, Q3 is still to come. So we remain positive to reach this range. Maybe it will not be the upper end, but we will reach this target.
Okay, so you feel like with your pricing power is still reasonable enough that you can stay in that range on a full year basis?
Yeah, but in the live segment, not sure if the pricing power there is, plays this important role there.
Okay, got it. And my second question was kind of on ticketing in general. If we assume, you know, stable underlying ticketing fee on average per ticket, it kind of looks like you didn't really see much growth in the average face value. I get that, you know, due to geographical mix and things like the Peru, Chile acquisitions last year. If you can maybe talk us through that and as well, talk about your pipeline. Also, kind of, like, what you're thinking in terms of pipeline heading into 2025. Thank you. Thank you.
Thank you, Craig. I'll take that one. So first of all, of course, with transactions like See Tickets and so forth, yeah, we have pretty much broadened the scope further of our portfolio, and as Holger indicated, an increasing share from international ticketing activities, yeah, makes it, of course, a bit more complex to look at these KPIs, which have been very helpful five or six years ago when we were talking about transition from offline to online ticketing, yeah? In general, we could say, and as Holger said, we're very confident with regards to what we see in the broader industry, the trends, yeah, that of course the industry continues to operate on a level that is significantly higher than everything which we have experienced before COVID, yeah?
That the underlying EBITs, I mean, you've seen how, which direction the ticket prices have gone, yeah? If we look at it on a single cluster, then you see on these categories as well, that, of course, the revenues per ticket follow the same direction. But given that we scope out, yeah, with ongoing international expansions, where the average ticket prices are a little bit less, what comes up in all our models is more the mix effect, yeah, rather than any pressure on pricing or definitely not any different pattern in the ways of how we charge for our services.
Okay, thank you. Just the second part of that question on the pipeline heading, and also, like, you know, beyond Q4 and heading into 2025.
No, I mean, we cannot give any details, of course, as for many reasons, it's not disclosed yet which artist will go on sale when. But let me sum it up again. We are very confident with regards to the second half and beyond that, yeah. It's a good place to be in live entertainment, particularly for a company like CTS Eventim.
Okay. Thank you.
And the next question goes to Christoph Blieffert from BNP Paribas Exane. Please go ahead.
Good afternoon, and thank you for taking my questions. Let's start with ticketing, please. Can you please help me to better understand the 38 million EUR year-on-year increase in ticketing revenues? What is related to scope, higher ticketing sales, potentially change in offline tickets or potential mix effects? Thank you.
Just looking for the number. Which number are you referring to? The...
The year-on-year increase in ticketing revenues, Q2, Q2 over Q2.
Well, this is yeah, I mean, it's just the volume effect, and it's an increase in volume in ticket sales. As Marco pointed out, there's no structural effect in the fee structure. So it's just
Mm.
-driven by the higher volume of tickets we sold, we've sold, across various markets, or actually across all markets.
Can you, can you give any indication of the first-time consolidation of the two assets you have acquired in South America, so Punto Ticket and Teleticket?
Yeah. Okay, good question. As you know, we have acquired. I think in mid-November, we have acquired Chile and Peru, two entities, the respective market leaders in their countries. The effect, actually, we do not report on country level, but in general, we could say the effect is a low two-digit number in terms of revenues. Should be maybe a little bit more than 10 million +, so maybe 10 million, 12 million, or so this way.
So it's not too big, or at least, put it the other way around, the growth in the existing business with our See Tickets is not driven by those acquisitions. Yeah, so they play a minor role here.
I would like to ask a follow-up question on ticketing. Is there any effect from other operating income positively affecting EBITDA and ticketing in the quarter? Or is there any positive impact from the consolidation of See Tickets beyond some earnings generated in June?
No, no, no significant effect. No, not at all.
Okay. Then another question on See Tickets, please. Can you give us a guidance for PPA for the remainder of the year?
PPA for the remainder of the year regarding See Tickets? Yeah. I mean, we have made transparent the preliminary PPA in the report. You could have a look, and if there's any remaining questions, maybe we take this offline and discuss this.
Okay. And then, as the last question, and this is related to potential expansion in U.S. ticketing. I mean, looking on the U.S. ticketing market, I got the impression that it's much more sophisticated, both on primary and secondary ticketing. And the question is: Is your IT infrastructure sufficient to cover the needs of the U.S. market, or do you have to make major investments to get a competitive IT infrastructure?
Yeah, I'll take this one. I think the best way to look at it from this point is that if our infrastructure would be in doubt, yeah, I cannot imagine that we would have won the LA28 tender for ticketing, and I mean, if you've seen the closing ceremony of the Paris Olympics, yeah, and how the Americans got crazy for bringing this event home, you can be sure that this will be the most sophisticated ticketing challenge the industry has ever seen, and we are the ticketing partner for that.
That's clear. Thanks a lot.
The next question comes from Ed Vyvyan, from Redburn Atlantic. Please go ahead.
Hi, guys. Thanks for taking my questions. I've got three, if that's all right. Firstly, on See Tickets, I was hoping you could maybe give us some guidance about how to model ticketing volumes in for the remainder of the year. Consensus is only modeling around, I think consensus has 93 million tickets in, which seems very, very low for the full year, if See did 43 million or something in 2019. So maybe a little bit of color on that. And then secondly, with France Billet, I was wondering if you could help us get a sense of how dilutive the acquisition will be to your margins in FY 2025, given it carries a much lower fee per ticket.
And then lastly, I wonder if you could just help us with some of the phasing between Q3 and Q4. It looks like there's gonna be some pretty tough comps in Q3, with Taylor Swift and Coldplay being lapped, but that will be partially offset by See Tickets. And then Q4 has to look a bit stronger to get to consensus. So if you could just help us with the building blocks, that'd be great. Thanks.
Maybe we start with the second part, France Billet. I think there's no structural difference in the France Billet business. It's slightly lower, but it's not significant. So I would not adjust the model too much, I would say. So it's actually comparable. Maybe, yeah. Maybe with regards to See Tickets-
Yeah.
as we said in the presentation, we have acquired a very complementary business-
Yeah
... to our existing portfolio, yeah? And given that we were able to close the deal very fast and that we've integrated it in our numbers for June, yeah, brings us now to the point where we really have to think about how to allocate these tickets more into our B2B business or into our B2C/retail business, yeah? As of course, they have a very good reputation for very customizable B2B solutions, yeah. While on the other side, they have their own retail channel, yeah, but it was not, of course, comparable to our existing channels like Eventim, yeah.
In markets like Benelux, the U.S., and the U.K., See Tickets has become a very strong brand for solving ticketing challenges, if you will, for festivals like Tomorrowland, Glastonbury, and so forth, which is a segment that CTS was serving as well in the past, but I think it's fair to say that See has developed quite good solutions there. We're in the process of how to basically model this forward, particularly with regards to ticket volume, because the ticket volumes which we have acquired are not just retail tickets as by our old definition. We worked that out, and as we said already in March, we're continuously working on providing you guys with more KPIs.
But it would be misleading now to take the forty-four million and consider them to be straight-up retail tickets as we've defined them in the past, yeah?
Is there a rough percentage you would be able to share at this point?
No, it's, let us discuss that when we all meet again, or latest by our next set of numbers, we can provide more color on that. Sure. And with regards to the phasing for the second half, as I said, I mean, last year everyone's looking at Taylor Swift and Coldplay, but we shouldn't forget that there has been a plethora of other events which we sold? And, on the other hand, I mean, this year, for what is already in the public domain, we started to sell Ed Sheeran tickets. And, I mean, it's hard to make a bet on timing, as always, on individual quarters?
So there is, of course, still something in the pipeline for the remainder of the year, and it's of course, out of our control now to say basically, what is, what is basically going on sale at which point in time, because this is ultimately the call the promoter has to make, yeah? Whether they decide to still go on sale in Q3 or whether they roll it over into Q4. So, it's very hard to comment on this because, it could be wrong next week when a promoter decided just to go on sale at a later stage.
Sure. Thank you.
But net, net, I mean, even if the basis in Q3 might be a little bit tougher, yeah, on the other hand, Q4 looks then the other way around.
Great. Thanks very much.
And we have a follow-up question. It comes from Cornelis Kik. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thank you for taking my question again. It's regarding ticketing, and maybe you can help us better understand the other service charges, because they're up quite significantly year over year. Is that related to a shift to mobile, or how can I understand the growth driver here? And then also, could you help us unpack, also in ticketing, the portion that's classified under other, because that accounts for over 13% of sales, and that would be helpful to understand what's in there, please.
Please give me a chance to which numbers you are referring to on,
Uh-
What numbers in my mind?
In the six-month report-
Yes
... we have a breakdown of the revenue, and then ticketing is split into ticketing fees, et cetera, and would like to know a bit more about the growth drivers behind other service charges?
Yeah. 50/50, providing you the page number, it could be... Okay.
Nine.
Yes. The ticket fees, commission. Yeah, I'm afraid I can't provide the answer right now. Maybe we take this offline and-
Yeah
but in general, if you look at the size of the numbers, and give it as a, you know-
We've highlighted the important things in our presentation.
It's not material, although if you look at the size of the number, but of course, I mean, yeah, it has increased by EUR 3 million and has increased by another EUR 12 million a year.
We have to check with the accountants-
Yeah
whether they're booked in different accounts. But in the end, I'm sure that's not the case, but please bear with us. We can take this offline and provide some. I'm not sure if this, if you did the analysis in terms of, you know, volume, if this is not simply would not simply explain already the difference. I think it's in line with the volume increase. We follow up with this.
Thank you.
There's no structure change, if this is the question, yeah.
All right.
Okay, ladies and gentlemen, we didn't receive any further questions, so let me hand back over to Marco Haeckermann for some closing remarks.
Awesome. Thank you very much for your time and your questions. Then this concludes our H1 Earnings Call. Yeah, thank you for preparing and giving us the questions, and yeah, we look forward to our next call, and until then, we continue to sell tickets and host live events. Wish you all a great end of the summer. Bye.