Good morning again, ladies and gentlemen, and, and thanks for joining us and taking the time. Welcome to the presentation of our first quarter results, showing very good start into the year. Together with Daniel, as, as always, we will try to give you a good overview on, let's say, the business and the, the financial performance as well as the outlook. And after this, we hopefully will receive a number of questions and also your comments to be answered. Looking at, at where we are, yeah, we have a strong start into the year and strong, I think, in a number of aspects. If you look back what has been accomplished, we have a significant, let's say, revenue increase there of 46% year-over-year, to, to last year's Q1.
At the same time, we are seeing, again, a significant improvement and lift in profitability adjusted EBITDA from 2.2%-12.2% first quarter last year or 13% approximately at the end of the year, up to more than 22% here in the first three months. And I'd say accordingly also a big jump on EBIT here from 8% to more than 18.8%. I think there we will look into, let's say, the reasons, the key elements. But at the same time, I think it's a strong start into the year also when you look ahead. If you look at the order book, incoming orders here of EUR 51.6 million is, let's say, the highest order intake we have recorded so far here in a three-month period here for the company.
This results, despite, let's say, those significant shipments and the revenue of more than EUR 40 million, in a substantial increase in backlog here by end of March. So with all of this, I think we have a very solid, a very good start into the year, which gives us, I think, the right basis to reach all our targets we have out there as guidance. We can confirm this. I think some of you might ask the question, yeah, why don't we now touch on our predictions, on our guidance immediately? I think here, Daniel and I can give you more insights. We are in the midst of a massive growth phase with significant investments and building up of cost structures here in various parts of the organization.
And also, naturally, we need to look at the capacity situation, and we'll be happy to elaborate on this. But this does not diminish, I think, the good start into the year, which I think is a seamless continuation of what we have seen or what we have witnessed here in 2023. We have to be, and we are grateful here to our customers, still appreciating what we do and seeing, let's say, a continuous ongoing demand here across the regions, but also across the different applications. And, again, I would like to draw your attention to the fact, and I think that's the key differentiating factor also in the sector.
We are showing significant growth here, but at the same time, we have, again, our planning in place, also an expansion of margin and improvement in profitability, which has been, let's say, our underlying plan here, and is being executed over the last years. Looking into, let's say, some of the highlights, well, we have put out a strategy saying we need to internationalize the business. We need to continue here with our investments into technology and technology leadership. And we also look at complementary M&A opportunities, and I think we see a mixture of all in those results. India, we went into operation here in the second half of last year. If we look now into the first quarter, a significant and strong contribution already out, let's say, of our Indian business here to first quarter results.
We have completed major deliveries here, especially in the public security business in India. If we look into the U.S., we are scaling up the team there. We are in full swing of hiring sales and service people. We will open up officially our sales and service and logistics hub there later in the quarter. Even though it might look like a relatively lower contribution now here in Q1, we have a solid and substantial order book also for the U.S. So we expect, let's say, overall performance also in North America according to plan, even though relatively it shows lower growth compared to Asia in the first three months. Well, then we come to our existing site in Cluj. We are in the process of building our largest manufacturing entity there on track.
We should be able to move into the new facility here by end of this quarter and go and ramp up here as of July. Just to put it in perspective, we are right now at a total capacity here on fuel cells of approximately 15,000 units. With having this then in full swing and full operation, we have at least a doubling of nominal capacity here with Cluj being online. Then the U.K., we have taken over the technology, the IP. In the meantime, also a significant portion of the team here of our long-term partner, Johnson Matthey. We have today, I think, 25 people on the payroll already now in the U.K., for the membrane development and production. We intend to start production end of this quarter and then ramp it up throughout the year.
Coming back to, let's say, the impact of this in terms of cost and in terms of, let's say, also buildup of capacity or removal of capacity limitations. Also, Daniel will give you his view and thoughts on this. But at the end, again, the latter project here is not just an improvement of stability on the supply chain. This is an important element. But long-term, we view this as an elementary and a key step of, again, improving competitiveness and also cost structure of our product means, profitability long-term. I guess we are integrating now material science know-how with our application expertise here.
And we are, I'd say, apart from ramping up or building this new facility in Swindon, what we have done is we have a manual production line already in parallel here built up in our facility in Brunnthal, not just as a backup, but especially also for the further development here on the technology side. Looking at the order book, I mentioned this already. I think, having, I'd say, highest shipments we ever were able to execute on in a three-month period with more than EUR 40 million revenue and still showing a positive Book-to-bill of 1.2 with EUR 51 million order intake, I think, is the right message also going forward and the right basis and gives us the visibility there.
Mentioning key highlights there, yeah, with our largest and longest-standing partner and customer on the power electronics side in the Netherlands, Thermo Fisher, we concluded another long-term contract here with EUR 27.8 million. We are already now in execution and delivering on this contract, also showing, let's say, there, and I'd say this is contributing also to the increase in revenue on absolute terms here for the Clean Power Management and the power electronics per se, even though the segment relatively is showing a lower contribution to Group revenues compared to Clean Energy. If we then look into some other, let's say, orders coming in here, we saw order intake in Asia here out of Singapore. We saw some of our European partners here putting in orders in the EUR single-digit million range.
Overall, abroad, again, an order book that is covering both segments that is covering, again, the different regions. If we look at the product side, at, and again, a big part of our competitiveness is based on a reliable, high-quality, maybe in some areas really superior product. We've just, or we are just in the midst of conducting a survey here with key customers and partners, and have hired an independent party to do so, or an independent party is doing this for us. What we see is that the key performance criteria by far in terms of the decision for doing business with us is, I'd say, product performance. And therefore, I think, yeah, being on top of this and making sure we are continuously innovating here, I think, is also in the best sense of the business.
Yeah, we have now with our H2Genset partnership here with two companies, TEST-FUCHS from Austria and also AG from Switzerland. We are now the first ones worldwide having a hydrogen generator that has also the capability to be fueled at a hydrogen gas station with CE marking, with TÜV. So we are able now to sell this product within, let's say, a period of not even two years. We got it from the idea to the existing product. And we have already the first orders here from Scandinavia and Luxembourg in for this product. Naturally, not contributing massively to the revenue right now, but that's, let's say, looking ahead into the pipeline. We had developed for the Canadian government, for some of their specific requirements in remote areas, what we call an EFOY ProShelter, which is a container-based, fuel cell-based energy solution out there, wherever there's no grid.
We have the first follow-on order here for those systems. Finally, civilian use, but also in terms of public security and defense application, we expect a significant potential out of this. In Hannover, we also presented our new platform now. We presented it the first time as the idea here in September last year. We are now out there with the pilot systems, expect first piloting with customers. It's called the EFOY Hydrogen Power Pack with 50-200 kilowatts power range. We want to see the product out in the market beginning of 2025. I touched upon the segments briefly. I think what we see is an exceptional growth here on Clean Energy with a significant contribution out of Asia. But again, we expect, on the regional side, a balancing out over the year.
But then also in terms of segmental revenue, this is, let's say, the overall, I think, corridor we are targeting. It means Clean Energy is a higher growth business. We expect it to account for 75% of the revenue midterm anyhow. And we show it already within this quarter. And we at the same time can see that this has naturally a significant impact also on the profitability. Let's look into, let's say, the end markets. Yeah. On the Clean Energy side with, let's say, a 73% growth here year-over-year in the first quarter. Again, we see the industrial market being continuously strong and contributing. We have a significant increase here on defense and public security business in there. Daniel will also look into the impact on the profitability here.
For our end consumer applications, we are seeing a continuously, I would say, not only challenging, but difficult environment because spending power is limited. And at the same time, yeah, we did not see too much room here for pricing compromises. No, instead, we increased, as you know, our prices last year here, according to, let's say, also the material cost developments here. And yeah, both of it has naturally an impact on overall sales. But we also have to, well, look at it in an overall perspective. This is, I'd say, around 3%-5% of the overall business. A market I think that is long-term still interesting as a testing area here for new products, but revenue impact we know and we accept is limited.
With this, I think, again, on the Clean Power Management side, it is showing a relatively lower contribution to the overall revenues, but at the same time, in absolute terms, consistently growing and growing on double-digit basis. Not to forget this. And with this, I hand over to Daniel to lead you through earnings and numbers related.
Good morning, everybody. Thank you for joining the call. Peter already said we had a fantastic start into the year, on level of growth, but also, in terms of earnings. You may have seen or you have seen the numbers. Let me quickly run you through the numbers, starting at the top, of the earning number, which is the gross profit. The gross profit increased to EUR 17.9 million, which is significantly up 75%, from the first quarter 2023, where we were looking at EUR 7.7 million.
Gross profit growth, if you've seen, has outpaced the revenue growth rate, which then translates also into an increased gross margin. Gross margin for the entire group in the first quarter, 44.7%. What are the key drivers behind it? First of all, it's a combination of much higher revenues, which lead then to relatively lower overhead per unit. We discussed it also in the previous calls if you've been there. Secondly, obviously also, on our effective and conservative pricing strategy in those segments. And then, and Peter touched it, also we had a very favorable product mix in the first quarter. I would even say an extraordinarily favorable product mix in the first quarter that resulted in that high margin. And last but not least, what we've seen, and we've seen that over the course of the last year, we're getting back to normalized cost of raw materials.
In addition, we didn't have any impairment on our inventory. Remember in the last year, certain quarters, we did have impairment on inventory on the components, which we purchased in 2022 at a relatively higher price, to secure delivery. And then we had to impair those components, which were still in inventory, to market prices, or as I would say, more normal prices. We've seen that the gross margin in both segments have improved significantly. Let me quickly start with the gross margin in the segment Clean Energy, which, as Peter mentioned, account for the larger portion of our revenue. The gross margin in that segment is at a solid 50%, compared to 43% in the previous year. We saw a huge jump in the gross margin, mostly different, as mentioned, by product mix.
The 50% is also above the annual gross margin of that segment from last year, which was at 46%. The first driver is, I keep repeating myself, is really some project business that we delivered in the first year, project business based on our EFOY platform, that came with very attractive margin. The second driver is that the fuel cells for industrial application, and we've seen that also in the last years, are growing rapidly. The share is still from a perspective of segment revenues the largest revenue shares. They are higher power to some extent. They also have a higher level of integration, and that all results in higher margin products. If we look at the gross margin of the segment Clean Power Management, also sits there, we saw an increase in gross margin.
Gross margin went up to 28.1%, compared to 26.5% in the first quarter 2023. What have we seen? We've seen, you know, lower revenues in that segment, however, stronger margins. That's the same reason as in the segment Clean Power, Clean Energy. It's mostly product mix, in combination with the lower unit cost. And that especially applies for our power management product, being manufactured and sold in the Netherlands and Romania. Our midterm and long-term targets of the gross margin Clean Energy, we set north of 44%. We are there. We are consistently there. I guess at some point we have to increase that target. This is really where we, where we want to be and need to be. When it comes to the gross margin target in Clean Power Management, we're looking north of 32%. There we have a little way to go.
We're working hard on that to realize that gross margin targets. Let me go to the EBITDA and EBIT quickly, starting with the group reported EBITDA that amounted in Q1 to EUR 8.6 million, a margin of 21.6%, compared to EUR 3.5 million, a margin of 12.8%, in the previous quarter. Very strong margin expansion, as you have seen. The reported EBITDA, as always, was impacted by non-recurring expenses and non-recurring incomes. These are, as always, and I just mentioned them for completeness sakes, the provision that we make for the LTI equity-based programs, as well as translation expenses. Nothing has changed to the way that we account for it and adjust those numbers in this quarter compared to the previous quarters. In Q1, the impact, the net expense, for the LTI program was lower than in the previous quarter.
We are looking at a number of EUR 270,000, where we had a net income in 2023 of EUR 190,000. So a net expense in the first quarter 2024 versus a net income in the first quarter 2023. Transaction-related expenses amounted to EUR 86,000 compared to EUR 31,000 in the first quarter 2023. So if we then adjust our EBITDA for these numbers, we get to the group adjusted EBITDA, which ended up at EUR 9 million compared to EUR 3.3 million in the first quarter 2023. The EUR 9 million translate then in a very solid and very good 22.5% adjusted EBITDA margin, compared to 12.2% in the first quarter 2023. The margin in the first quarter 2024 is also well above what we've seen in the full-year 2023, where we were looking at 12.8%.
So quickly want to dig into and dive into the key drivers behind the adjusted EBITDA increase in addition to what I already mentioned with regards to the gross margin. So the first driver is really the fixed costs and the production overhead cost absorption resulting from the higher revenues that we had, especially in this segment, Clean Energy, in combination with the product mix and, as I mentioned before, stable input prices. So if we looked on the relative contribution of the gross margin to that adjusted EBITDA, we saw that the gross margin increased by 7.5 percentage points. And that would, you know, result in a relative contribution of EUR 3 million in adjusted EBITDA compared to the adjusted EBITDA of Q1 2023.
And then the second large driver that has a key impact is, you know, let's call it operational leverage, a term all of you have heard many times, are familiar with. We've seen that all functional costs increased absolutely. What I've already are also seeing is that those functional costs have grown at an under-proportionate rate with respect to sales. Driver of the functional costs, most of them is really personnel expenses, some other items on which I will touch in a minute. Adjusted sales and marketing expenses, which is still the largest portion of our functional costs, and they account for 40%, roughly, of the total functional costs, came up to 9.4% of revenues, compared to 12.6% in the first quarter. You've seen it's gone down notably by 3.2 percentage points, relatively to revenue.
and the relative EBITDA contribution would be EUR 1.3 million lower compared to Q1 2023. Adjusted R&D expenses also increased slightly in sales, resulting in 3.9% of revenues compared to 4.4% in revenues. The relative contribution to the increased adjusted EBITDA is EUR 179,000. Last but not least, the adjusted G&A expenses also increased slower in relation to revenue.
They increased marginally, though, and there were 0.4 percentage points lower in relation to sales than in Q1 2023, resulting in EUR 110,000 relative contribution, highlighting relatively lower G&A expenses. Other operational and impairment loss on financial assets, you've seen this line has been added. This is in the first quarter. We already had it in the full-year report. That is basically the IFRS 9 provision that we've made has been relatively higher by EUR 158,000. Depreciation, amortization, EUR 1.5 million versus EUR 1.2 million in 2023. So not a huge increase.
In terms of structure, not much has changed. A bit over a third of the depreciation is related to IFRS 16. So that is in the first quarter 2024, EUR 563,000, followed by depreciation for capitalized R&D, which accounted for EUR 486,000, pretty much on the level of the previous year. And then other tangible and intangible assets, the depreciation makes EUR 400,000. That brings us to the Adjusted EBIT. Adjusted EBIT was EUR 7.5 million, which translates in a margin of 18.8%. The factors for the increase in the EBIT is pretty much the same as in the EBITDA. Operating expenses, let me quickly touch on those. One comment, you may have realized that the Q1 2023 numbers that we now show in our report do not compare with the published Q1 2024 numbers for the operating expenses.
That really results from the discussion we had with our new auditors at the end of last year and the conclusion that the income of the reversal of the LTI provision, which we've shown in the other operating income, should or need to be presented in the functional cost. So you will see that this income no longer in the other operating income, but directly in the functional cost, which changed a little bit the functional cost. No impact on gross margin, no impact on EBITDA, no impact on EBIT. It's all happening within the functional cost. So total or adjusted cost of sales and marketing, we saw an 8.7% increase compared to the previous year's numbers that results in EUR 3.8 million. What is the key driver behind the increase is really mostly personnel expenses. We've seen the headcount increasing to 108 from 103.
Then also what we've seen is an increase in sales provision as well as some consulting and service provider expenses. R&D expenses, let me break it down in the R&D costs that we spent, which is higher than the R&D expense you'll see in the P&L. So what we spent on R&D in the first quarter was EUR 2.5 million compared to EUR 2.1 million in the first quarter 2023. That's about 18% up. How is that number being calculated or composed? Well, it's first the R&D expenses that you'll see in the P&L adjusted for the non-recurring items, which was EUR 1.6 million. Then we had the R&D that we capitalized in the first quarter. That was EUR 754,000, 2.2% up from last year. So basically on the same level. And then last but not least, we received subsidies of EUR 193,000, 12% up from last year's numbers.
So if you add up those three numbers, you get to the amount that we really spent on R&D, which was EUR 2.5 million. It's a bit higher than what we've seen in the first quarter 2023. Key driver really here was material that is used in R&D, as well as consulting and advisory services purchased in R&D. That is legal advisory on patents, that also refers to some software advisory. So it all goes in that direction. The total R&D spent in relation to revenues is 6.3%, compared to 7.8% in the first quarter 2023. So that's about 1.5 percentage points lower than what we've seen in 2023. We are looking at a long-term spend for R&D of 6%-7%. So we're pretty much in the corridor that we are and obviously with increasing revenue, also our R&D expense will increase.
G&A expenses, adjusted G&A expenses were EUR 4.4 million, compared to EUR 3.1 million in the first quarter 2023. Large increase, huge increase, 42.3%. Again, it's mostly personnel, but also what hit us in the first quarter is higher advisory cost, advisory cost, in context with the audit, in context with a tax advisory. It has to do. I mentioned also in the previous quarters on transfer pricing, tax optimization, and tax establishment with our foreign subsidiaries. We are working on this project and these projects, you know, will continue to be with us for the next quarters. That corresponds to 11.1% of revenues compared to 11.4% from last year. So it went down a little bit. In the medium-term range, we are looking at the adjusted G&A expenses to account for anything between 11.5%-12.5% of revenues.
Balance sheet, really briefly, just, let me touch on the CapEx that we had in the first half year. So total gross CapEx, excluding rights of use and IFRS 16 accounting impact was EUR 2.1 million. So slightly down or EUR 600,000 down from Q1 2023. But remember in Q1 2023, we had, we purchased the MEA assets from Johnson Matthey. That was really driving the high CapEx in Q1 2023. CapEx split between intangible assets and PP&E. About 37% is in intangible assets versus 63% in PP&E, excluding right of use. Intangible assets, as always, mostly CapEx R&D, PP&E, mostly measuring and equipment across various categories and all subsidiaries, amounting to EUR 2.2 million, has to do also with the build-out. Peter mentioned it, ramping up Romania, ramping up the U.K., but also, you know, we did some investment in the U.S.
Cash and cash equivalents are a very important number for us, to be stable to finance our growth, and to invest. Cash freely available was EUR 66.2 million, compared to EUR 56 million in the first quarter, sorry, at the end of 2023. So, you know, we made a decent portion of cash in the first quarter. We will, you will see, in the next quarters, that we will be spending cash, mainly again on the build-out of our subsidiaries, mainly in ramping up MEAs, mainly in ramping up Hansa's Romania to production.
Financial debt went down a little bit, EUR 3.4 million, all short-term, still the working capital lines that we have in Canada and the Netherlands. That leaves us with a very healthy and solid net cash position of EUR 63 million, compared to EUR 56 million. Equity, you've seen it increased, mainly because of the positive net income. Cash flow, let me quickly touch on that one. Cash flow before changing net working capital, EUR 9 million, much higher from what we've seen in the first quarter 2023.
Obviously, it has to do with financial performance as well as with our increase in the revenues. Inventory always a topic. We're looking at inventory, you know, optimization for a business. So you've seen that the inventories have decreased by EUR 1.1 million. So we're really getting back to normal levels. We will see, we will still see inventory increasing as we move along with sales. We're really at a low level of inventories right now. At the same time, you've seen that our accounts receivables increased by almost EUR 6 million. This is really where cash is going. We mentioned it on various calls previously. We will see that also increase going forward with sales.
Other short-term receivables, that these are mostly prepayments and prepayment or taxes, increased slightly to EUR 18,000. And then you also seen that the accounts payable have increased significantly by EUR 3.8 million as we purchase also more material. Yeah. So after tax payments and after the changes in working capital, that results in a cash flow from operating activities of a solid positive EUR 9.6 million. Last year, we were still at negative EUR 3 million, mostly driven by the change in working capital. Cash flow from investment activities, EUR 1.8 million euros, and cash flow from financing activities, negative EUR 6.97 million. With that, I would give it back to Peter.
Well, thanks, Daniel. Maybe complementing here, I think doing all this and driving this growth plan here naturally can only be done as a team effort and, well, an increasing number of heads and pairs of hands and shoulders helping us to, let's say, pull this through. We're looking at more than 400 permanent employees here, as of end of March. Yeah, we're still out there looking for, let's say, the next 50-80, looking at our open position. So this is a continuous focus here on the operational side. Apart from systems being upgraded here, we have this program in place to work on our digital transformation. And we have, let's say, kicked off our group-wide SAP S/4HANA program.
Not sure whether it's, it's seen as a positive or a negative if SAP mentions us in their, in their profit, in their Q1 call as one of the key projects. But yeah, I think it, it shows there's visibility there here for SMEs, with, with this, large, software partner there, but also there. Again, this results in resources being bound to this, but it's preconditioned for the further growth. And, and this leads me to the conclusion here on the forecast mentioned before. One could see this, let's say, us confirming now with this excellent start now, into the year with the numbers of Q1, by just confirming our guidance. I think with, with, with, let's say, all, all, objectivity, one has to see that the guidance still is a 20%-30% growth. We still have, let's say, the relevant bandwidth improvements here on profitability in there.
We see Q1 as an excellent foundation here to really deliver on what we have promised so far. But at the same time, we also know we are building up a higher cost structure. We are also facing, and I've mentioned this is specifically here with the takeover of the core production of membrane electrode assemblies with the core element for our fuel cells. We have planned capacity limitations starting in the later part of Q1, now going through Q2, and we are planning to catch up now in Q3. Doing all of this and doing the ramp-up, I think there's always a residual risk in there of delays resulting then in increasing cost, but then also in prolonged capacity limitations.
And therefore, I think bear with us here, give us a couple of weeks more to build out more or to create more visibility, maybe even, let's say, until summertime. And then I think the moment we have this clear, nothing is between us and then touching onto the existing guidance. But what can you expect from us then? If you look at the EUR 40 million revenue here in Q1, you look at maybe 20% of it being really a project-based impact here. So netting this out and then looking at the removal of capacity limitation of EFOY, then we are back, let's say, solidly above a EUR 30 million level here. And even if we keep some of the capacity limitations here for the entire Q2, we are at a revenue level that is comparing to our best quarters here in the previous year.
This is what we show as a worst case. I think that's where our presentation ends. Happy to receive your question. Thank you very much.
Thank you.
We will now begin the question- and- answer session. Anyone who wish to ask a question may press star and one on the telephone. You will hear a tone to confirm that you've entered the queue. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Anyone who has a question may press star and one at this time. The first question is from Karsten von Blumenthal with First Berlin Equity Research. Please go ahead.
Good morning, Peter. Good morning, Daniel. Congratulations to this extraordinary result, especially on the EBITDA level. This is really exceptional. My first question is regarding your, Peter, your 15,000 unit fuel cell capacity. I didn't understand. Does that refer only to Brunnthal?
Good morning, Karsten. Thank you very much. Well, if you look at it right now, you can look at, let's say, the 15,000 in a split where we have already an initial production line now in Cluj running in the existing facility where you take out, let's say, a number between 2,000 and 3,000 already being contributed here from Cluj. But then at the same time, you can add, let's say, all our tactical products with another 1,500-2,000 units here in Brunnthal and another, let's say, approximately 2,000 here for repair and refurbish. So, the one or the other way, if you take 15,000 for Brunnthal, this is included. If we just say new EFOYs, then it's, let's say, the 15,000 would be Cluj and Brunnthal.
If you then take the full amount, then we are somewhere at 18,000. By putting Cluj now into place, and not to forget also additional assembly capacity in India, we are looking at a rough doubling here, one shift production, a rough doubling of the capacity here going into 2025.
Doubling means then in figures?
30,000.
And everything else would then mean double shift.
Okay. Yeah. So could you imagine when you start double shift?
Right now? I think for this year, well, honestly, today, we are doing, let's say, I mentioned also our manual MEA production line here where we are at the moment doing two shifts. So even out of this, we are getting the same capacity we got from our long-term partner here out of the U.K. So that makes us self-sufficient. But all the other plannings here for this year is one shift planning. And also with the 30,000 units going into next year, I think we are still looking at a one shift plan.
Well, how long does it take to ramp this up?
You can think about a quarter or maximum four months.
Quarter or four months. Okay. Very good. Thanks for that. Next question. When I look into your segment reporting, I mean, it's amazing how strong the Clean Energy business grew. But having a look at the Clean Power Management, and Daniel, you mentioned it, sales were a bit lower compared to the prior year quarter. Could you elaborate on that? What is different? Why didn't it increase?
Yeah. I also need to specify what I stated before. I said, well, the power electronics part is still, let's say, on a double-digit growth, which in the segment is right. And also, let's say, if we look at the order book, I mentioned Thermo Fisher, the orders are in for the remaining part of the year for a double-digit growth there. But what we saw as the comparison to first quarter last year, especially in our energy business in Canada, we had some significant projects here on the clean power side, which I think is more quarter-on-quarter comparison. And we are expecting to level this out throughout the year based also on the backlog, including Canada. So also demand in the energy sector for both segments, which are covered there, oil and gas with the commodity price where it is very consistent.
All right. Understood. So it's the strong Q1 2023 that makes the difference. Further question from my side. You mentioned your capacity constraints in the MEA production. Do you also still get from your supplier, from Johnson Matthey, MEAs, or how do you manage that? What is this?
No, this transition has already taken place. We did it last year, shipment here end of last year. And we are, let's say, working right now based on the stocks we had built up to make sure we have enough safety stock here. And in addition, as said, we ramped up an initial line here in Germany. And within this quarter, well, it's really within the next two to three weeks that we really ramp up production now in the U.K.
But we had planned a capacity, a maximum capacity here, let's say, or a limitation from, let's say, March into July timeframe. And this is where we look at. And whatever we can do faster and better will result in a removal of this limitation earlier. The plan really is within Q3 to do, let's say, the catch-up here and then also address naturally some of the shipment backlog that we will see until then.
All right. But then I perfectly understand why Q1 is so exceptional. You will run into some capacity constraints. You have stocks, but and you have your manual production, but still you have to start ramping up in a few weeks in the U.K. That takes time. And step by step, then you will have enough MEA. And you have to rely on your own production. So that explains it very well. I know I understood it. Thanks for that, Peter. I think that have been my questions. Thanks a lot, Daniel and Peter for answering them.
Thank you.
Thanks, Karsten.
The next question is from Malte Schaumann with Warburg Research. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good morning. Maybe following on the last topic, capacity constraints. So what maybe more on a qualitative level, what would be your demand levels for the next two quarters or so without capacity restrictions? And then what revenue levels we can actually expect in light of the potential limitations you have?
Well, morning, Malte. Peter here again. I think as said, if you do the math here with our Q1 results, if you take out approximately 20% there, then I think that's the lower limit here. This is really what we, what we plan for. And then I'd say where, where, where could we go based on demand? Yeah, 10%, even 15% higher. This is really the corridor. And the plan is really to catch up here, most of it in the second half of Q3 and into Q4. And again, as said, there are naturally always risks there with ramping up such as site, with doing all of this. I think we have been diligently preparing it. We are in good shape.
We have, I would say, 100% of the Johnson Matthey team on board. A good thing to have knowledgeable people, very experienced on the practical side, but also on the manufacturing side, but also on the R&D side. And still, it can take longer. And therefore, we need this couple of weeks and maybe until summer to really have visibility. And then we look at the overall planning and the overall guidance again.
All right. Okay. And in terms of profitability impact, I mean, you pointed out that Q1 margin was positively impacted by a very favorable product mix, but nevertheless, incorporating the headwind from the ramp-up in the U.K., what is then your gross margin expectation for Q2 and Q3? I mean, your full-year target is kind of in the high 30s. Should we look towards mid-30s for the next one or two quarters before it then goes up again once you're fully ramped?
This is Daniel. I think, yeah, you're looking at what you said at the gross margin level, this is pretty much what you're looking at. Look at what we had last year, right? So this is what we consider our sustainable gross margin, always depending a little bit on product mix. But again, we do not expect any, you know, significant negative surprises, neither on the gross margin nor the other margins.
Okay. So even second quarter margin should be, yeah, kind of quite satisfying despite the slight headwind you see from the U.K.?
It should be quite satisfying for us. Also the second quarter margin, again, it depends, you know. It depends a little bit on the revenue level of each quarter. That may be shifting from one to the other quarter, as also Peter mentioned, you know, may do some catch-up eventually in the year. So if we look at the, you know, on the quarterly margin, which, you know, depends on product mix, depends on absolute revenue, you know, we'll, of course, see it going back to more normal levels. But for the rest of the year, we are very confident.
Yeah. Okay. And in terms of the split, what was the contribution of in India from Indian customers in the first quarter?
Well, also if you look at this, yeah, we are looking here at, let's say, high single-digit million shipments. We are looking at, if you look at Asia, 27%, and then you look at, let's say, a good 20% deriving from India, as a ballpark, which is a tremendous start. And naturally it's, let's say, helping us to make this investment already in the first year a really profitable undertaking.
So, we are working right now on, again, the further pipeline, together with our partner. I think we know naturally it is not, let's say, next quarter that you get the next defense orders in. There is always a cycle to it. But looking at the pipeline, I think there is, let's say, I'd say the expectations in terms of order intake over the next two, three quarters are at significant levels. But right now, the focus was really to make sure we ramp it up. We are able to do the assembly. We are doing the quality testing. We ship this out. So it was really the first full operational quarter.
Yeah. All right. So do you expect major shipments during this year to take place, or that was something, get the next large order intake and then ship early next year?
Yeah. We are talking about India still.
Yep. Right.
Yeah. Yeah. That's right. Well, there is continuous, let's say, smaller shipments now expected. But seeing the cycle of this business, we are, let's say, looking at an order intake, let's say, within this year's timeline or within the Indian fiscal year. And then subsequently, larger shipments would be in our next fiscal year.
Yeah. Okay. Okay. Good. Then on the order intake, I mean, that included the large order for power supplies in the Clean Power Management business. So the book-to-bill in the Clean Energy business was then below one. Do you expect that to turn around in Q2 already? I mean, I know, I mean, it could be quite lumpy from quarter to quarter, so that does not need to tell something. So what is your expectation regarding order intake for the Clean Energy business on the growth path going forward?
I think the good thing there, this is not at all lumpy. And you're naturally right by, let's say, splitting this up and looking at it on a segmental basis. The project or the business structure, fortunately, is different there and based on a broader customer base. We have some of those, let's say, yearly commitments in from partners here from, as mentioned, Singapore, Netherlands. We are, let's say, looking at now significant projects in the U.K., looking at a significant diversification of the customer base in the U.S. And I just came back from Singapore. I think also from there, we are seeing a massive rebound after a long COVID-impacted, let's say, slowdown of the market.
Seeing all of this, I would not promise now that everything is in until 30th of June, but we will make sure we have the majority in within this quarter to also look at, let's say, again, the balance then at end of Q2, but something might shift into summertime. But again, geographically diversified and then also end markets again diversified. So we also looked at, let's say, Southeast Asia as a business as such. We had, let's say, our Japanese partners in a week ago also there. They, they expect a continuous growth here in Japan. And we are seeing, let's say, first projects here not only from Oneberry coming in, but also out of the wind industry in some of those markets. We are looking at Vietnam. We are looking at Taiwan. So really diversified.
Therefore, naturally this lumpy, fortunately, this big, long-term contract here with Thermo Fisher, let's say, had a significant impact on the structure of the backlog. But diversification is on its way and I think is a matter of timing now. And you can be sure we are, we are pushing on this end as much as our customers let us.
Okay. Sounds good. Last question is regarding then the your Japanese business. So what's the current status here? I mean, is that finally picking up?
Yes. As said, I think we are, we are really happy with the funnel in Japan. We are happy, let's say, with the wind industry in Southeast Asia. And we are looking at, let's say, also alternative partnerships and looking at, let's say, also the expansion of our collaboration with, for example, Oneberry in Singapore across different markets and also in Indonesia with our partner there, which is come back from the largest defense show in Malaysia called DSA. We had, let's say, all our Asian partners, including also our Indian partners there. And as always, this business takes some time, but also their geopolitical impact is seen and we expect spending going up. So I think we will see a more diversified picture also in Asia. And we cannot afford to simply rely on one single party. I think that's the path forward.
Yeah. Okay. Good. Thanks.
Thank you.
The next question is from Thomas Junghanns with Berenberg. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good morning, gentlemen. I have two questions. Maybe we can go one by one. So my first question is also related to the capacity constraints. Are these capacity constraints exclusively caused by a limited access to the membranes? And is there no possibility to source this membrane from other third parties?
Good morning, Thomas. Yeah. We can, we can, let's say, we're clearly limited to this single source. We have, I'd say, taken over and transitioned the technology and, and insourced it, by, let's say, in a very conscious effort to, to really control this part of the supply chain. And what we are doing is diversifying now the supply of the materials. Means if you look at the MEA, that's called the membrane electrode assembly.
And then you get the different, let's say, ingredients, call it ingredients, not a technical term here, but the metals or, let's say, the other materials, we are diversifying the supply base there. So we insource a larger part of the value chain. There's no intention to, let's say, expand the supplier base on MEAs, but on the metals. And that's happening as we speak, including also German, very reliable sources here.
Okay. That makes sense for me. And my second question is also a little bit related to the capacity constraints. You have mentioned that you expect in your worst case scenario in Q2, a revenue of roughly EUR 32 million, so 20% below Q1. This would be higher than the quarters we have seen in 2023. Do you expect that this is also be valid for Adjusted EBITDA, that it will be in Q2 higher than what we have seen in each quarter in 2023?
Hi, Thomas. First of all, a very good question. Let me give you a very long answer to this very short question, even though I totally understand you want to have a point on very short answer. But my answer isn't it pretty much plays in what we have communicated previously. So, first of all, you know, we confirm our guidance. I think that really gives you a strong sign of where we think we're going to head for. Secondly, also, you know, referring to what Karsten asked earlier, EBITDA on a quarterly level depends on various factors, depends on revenues.
As you rightly said, Peter gave you an idea of where we're going to head up. But then it also depends on how and we ramp up our subsidiaries. Thirdly, it depends on product mix. Fourthly, it also depends on how we ramp up our entire business over the year. You know, we are expanding on various levels. That means, you know, we're not taking on people, you know, in a, in a linear line. It is also here and there a little bit lumpy.
So these are all impacts that has an impact on the quarterly EBITDA margin. We are very positive on that, on that margin. Obviously, if we weren't, you know, we would not confirm our guidance. So I think that is a very long answer to your question. But there's no reason, like I said, we don't see any, you know, right negative signs whatsoever at the horizon.
Thanks, Daniel. One follow-up question I still have. In Q3 and in Q4, do you expect after the removal of the capacity constraints to get back on a similar level, like in Q1?
Well, if you look at, let's say, the midpoint of the guidance, I think that's the logical consequence here. And I think that the real moving part here is how fast can we, let's say, remove the capacity constraints? Can we really catch up fully in Q3? Right now, we are seeing, let's say, this really towards the end of Q3. And as said, if we, let's say, see this moving into Q4, yeah, then we have naturally a stronger impact also on revenue in Q4.
Whatever, I think the fact is we have the orders in. Means the order book is strong enough that we can, let's say, we are at this point also proportionally reducing shipments to different customers to make sure we can satisfy the needs. So which is kind of a luxury problem, but you do not want to perpetuate this and prolong it because it doesn't make anybody happy. But yeah, you can see that demand is higher than the available quantity. But yeah, we target is really to be through this until the end of Q3. If it takes a couple of weeks longer, we will see, let's say, simply a shift of revenue into Q4.
Perfect. Thanks for answering my questions.
Thank you.
The next question is from Usama Tariq with ABN AMRO ODDO BHF. Please go ahead.
Hi. Good morning, team. Congratulations on the strong results. I had one small question with regards to North America. So, year-on-year sales were down. And you also indicate that they're expecting fixed costs to rise with expansion of the service and sales subsidiary in our U.S. How does that fit in going forward? Could you provide some color with regards to North America in the coming quarters? Thank you.
Thank you very much. This is Peter again. Yeah. I think what you see there is naturally, again, as we had it on the Clean Power side in oil and gas, a very strong Q1 here, especially in the U.S. with our prime customer there, in Q1 last year. We look at the order book, and if we look also at the project pipeline, we expect this really to level out throughout the year. We are not looking at a similar growth here in the U.S., especially, let's say, with the, with, with this largest account because we made this jump up last year. But still, looking at their pipeline, they are predicting larger demand and, and, and we have, let's say, still a significant order book there.
So we expect overall growth. But this is also deriving from the diversified customer base. We are seeing now initial orders coming in here from a broader customer base. So overall, yeah, not the same level of, of, of, let's say, significant, a jump there or growth, but consistent expansion of sales, higher market penetration. Well, and then in Canada, I think looking at where we are right now, as said, we have less of a dependency on the energy space than we had historically. Also, there, I think, energy, oil, and gas commodity prices and outlook are solid. So we expect here a continuous development as also in the previous year. And this means also solid double-digit here overall.
And when it comes to the costs and the expenses, you know that we're growing in North America and in Canada, obviously in the U.S., much faster. We established our subsidiary there. We're ramping up the business. So yes, I know expenses will increase in the U.S. business. We don't expect huge jumps, right? As always, as we do it with every geographical expansion, we do it very cautious or very much step by step. But it's, it's really in line what we've, you know, said and communicated before, as we ramp up the subsidiaries, obviously also the operating expenses increase.
Thank you, Daniel. Thank you, Peter. Just one follow-up question, a small one, if I may. Anything on M&A front?
Yeah. I think that fits into this topic as well as into, let's say, a more generic view on the sector. Starting with the latter one, we see, let's say, with our profile here growing and being profitable, there are, let's say, not so many others in the, in the sector, doing this. And we expect some consolidation opportunities really materializing, and we are seriously looking at it. Expect, I think, nothing here, I'd say, until tomorrow, but we are continuously looking at this. And it's an opportunistic thing. Yeah. Maybe we see some acceleration there.
And the other part is U.S., very clear, as also communicated before, we are looking at a long list of potential targets for acquisitions, for acquisition. We are following here the example of our approach here into the Canadian market, acquiring, or looking to acquire a system integrator well-versed in, let's say, power products to our verticals, to our customer base. And then converting this into an energy solution provider based on our fuel cells. The long list is there. Don't expect anything to happen in first half of this year, but yeah, we want to have a clear view and a short list within Q3.
Thank you, Peter. Thank you, Daniel. That will be it.
Thank you very much.
Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question. I would now like to turn the conference back over to Dr. Peter Podesser, CEO, for any closing remarks.
Well, again, we are running out of time. I think we are hitting our timelines here. Very good to have you all. Thanks for the interest and, let's say, the trust in us. As always, if we have bilateral topics open, reach out to us, Susan, Daniel, myself. And also very glad to see some of you tomorrow in our AGM. Thank you very much. Goodbye.