Ladies, and gentlemen, welcome to the PNE AG Full Year 2025 Results Conference Call. I am Shari, the Chorus Call operator. I would like to remind you that all participants will be in listen-only mode, and the conference is being recorded. The presentation will be followed by a Q&A session. You can register for questions at any time by pressing star and one on your telephone. For operator assistance, please press star and zero. The conference must not be recorded for publication or broadcast. At this time, it's my pleasure to hand over to Mr. Heiko Wuttke, CEO. Please go ahead.
Good morning, everyone. Also from my side, thank you for joining us today in this conference call regarding the results of the fiscal year 2025. My name is Heiko Wuttke, CEO of PNE AG, and I'm accompanied by Harald Wilbert, CFO. Let me first give you an overview of the presentation and the course of today's webcast on slide three of the presentation. As usual, I will begin with a summary of 2025, followed by an update regarding the operating business. I will pass over to Harald for the financials. After that, I will give you a short update on our strategy and our transformation program and conclude the presentation with the outlook for 2026. We will then open the line for questions. As always, our slides can be found on our Investor Relations website.
Having said this, I would now like to draw your attention to slide five. Ladies, and gentlemen, we are pleased to share that we had a successful fiscal year 2025 with high development and sales activity. We've successfully sold projects with a total output of 428 MW in 2025. 12 wind farms with a total capacity of 287 MW, and one PV project with 140. 2025 was also characterized by a very good progress in our construction activities, especially in Germany and France, where we completed 10 projects with a total capacity of 215 MW. We received new permits for onshore wind and PV projects with a total capacity of 1.1 GW in 2025. This is a remarkable figure and a reflection of the steady flow of valuable projects progressing through our pipeline.
The expansion of our own IPP portfolio also continued, reaching 497 MW, as we added 68 MW in 2025. Power generation increased despite the very weak wind yields in the German onshore wind market, which according to the Anemos Wind and Yield Index 2025, was 12% below the long-term average. Also, our services business continued to grow with good margins. In addition, the first asset management contract for German BESS park, with a capacity of 100 MW, was signed at the end of 2025, marking a successful entry into this promising market. In financial terms, the year 2025 was successful as well. Our total output grew to EUR 376.4 million, which is another record level in PNE history.
Our normalized EBITDA, adjusted for one-off items, reached EUR 87 million and was therefore in line with our original guidance between EUR 70 million and EUR 110 million. From the 2026 financial year onwards, normalized EBITDA will serve as the key financial performance indicator for our forecasts, as it provides a better and more accurate picture of our operating performance. We will get back to that later. Finally, a dividend of EUR 0.04 per share was proposed. With this, let's move to project pipeline on slide seven. Our project pipeline was impacted by several effects in 2025. First of all, we have made some changes to the scope of our pipeline. The pipeline numbers now also include projects in the early exploration phase, called phase zero. The change was made to show the full scope of the projects we are working on.
To ensure comparability, the previous year's figures have, of course, been adjusted accordingly. Secondly, we have streamlined our project pipeline. This was necessary due to significantly changed market conditions, particularly in the international markets of Canada, Spain, and Romania. Streamlining the pipeline is an important part of our strategic focus on profitable markets and projects, which improves our risk profile further. Finally, we have completed the exit from Panama. As a result of those effects, the total project pipeline decreased to 23.8 MW compared to the previous year's 27.9 GW. Having said that, our pipeline continued to shift from lower value markets to higher value markets. This is reflected by the fact that while the overall pipeline decreased, the pipeline in our core markets, Germany and France and Poland, remained on a high level at 12 GW.
Having a look at the subdivisions, wind onshore decreased to 14.6 GW. PV decreased to 7.2 GWp, and wind offshore decreased to 2 GW. In offshore, the 0.5 GW in Latvia were value-adjusted, as well as of Q4 2025, and it is under review whether the 2 GW in Vietnam will also be adjusted in Q1 2026, after PNE was not considered as investor for the project. Moving on to slide eight. The streamlining of our project pipeline was also visible in the project pipeline for onshore wind 2025, with 14.6 GW, as I said, coming from 16 GW at the end of 2024. Our home market, Germany, which accounts for more than 40% of our project pipeline, remains strong with 6 GW. We sold the wind farm Sundern-Allendorf and Bebensee with 34 MW each to Encavis.
Shortly before the end of the year, we also sold wind farm portfolio, comprising six wind farms in various stages of development, with a total capacity of 91 MW to Qualitas Energy Deutschland GmbH. Six wind farms amounting to 107 MW were completed and put into operation, +3 wind farms for third parties with 97 MW. In addition, four wind farms with 63 MW were under construction in Germany, +5 wind farms with 93 MW for third parties. We received permits here for another 141 MW in 2025. With respect to France, we sold the first wind farms, Clermont-en-Argonne and Genouillé, with 14 MW and 11 MW, and received new permits of 25 MW.
Regarding other markets, we sold two wind farms with a total capacity of 103 MW in Panama, where respective milestone payments are possible, and completed our planned market exit there. Our project pipeline in South Africa remains stable at 2.3 GW, and we received new permits in Poland and in Turkey of 27 MW and 79 MW, respectively. Coming to slide nine, we see that also the PV was impacted by the value adjustment, and thus decreased to 7.2 GWp. Our development activity is continuing to show good progress from projects to the later project phases, resulting in 51% growth of phase III projects to 842 MWp, coming from 558 MWp in 2024.
Especially in our core market, France, we see a favorable increase of our PV project pipeline by 51% to 503.38 MWp. Our PV project pipeline in Italy also grew by 23% to 928 MWp. In addition, we received new permits in 2025 in our core markets, Germany and Poland, with 24 MWp and 181 MWp, as well as in South Africa and Italy, with 490 MWp and 50 MWp respectively. Finally, we sold one PV project with 140 MWp in Panama, where respective milestone payments are also possible as part of our market exit.
If you look at the expansion of our own power generation portfolio in 2025 on slide 10, you see that we made good progress here as well. We added 68 MW to the IPP portfolio, and with that increased the total megawatt in operation to 497 MW at the end of 2025. 480 MW are coming from wind onshore Germany, 11 MW coming from wind onshore France, and 6 MW coming from the wood-fired combined heat and power plant service. Despite the comparatively lower wind yields, we produced 822 GW of green energy in 2025, which is an increase of 10% and avoided 620 kilotons of CO2 emissions.
The hidden reserves accumulated in our portfolio decreased to EUR 153.59 million, compared to EUR 195.3 million by the end of 2024, which is partly because they are gradually recognized over the lifetime of the projects and partly because of project sales. More than 90% of our IPP projects are based on feed-in tariffs for 20 years, leading to an average weighted contracted tenor for the IPP portfolio of more than 15 years. This shows an interesting upside opportunity through short and medium-term PPAs that are more attractive than the EEG remuneration, and about 40% of our IPP portfolio already have PPA.
Let me also give you some information about our services business on slide 11, since it continues to perform well and delivers growing high-margin returns through long-running contracts. First of all, O&M management and technical inspections continue to grow. The assets under O&M management increased by 250 MW - 3.1 GW, and we had a good order intake in Germany and internationally with 75% external customers. As mentioned before, we had a successful market entrance in BESS, with the first contract closed for a German BESS park with a hundred MW at the end of 2025, and we conducted more than 1,000 technical inspections in wind farms.
We also had a strong performance in wind insights, with more than 500 wind assessments and expert opinions, and we concluded more than 300 lidar verifications. In addition, we had a good start of our PPA as a service business under the new brand, Wattmate. With more than 80 wind and PV PPA projects and a total output of approximately 1.1 GW, and a transaction volume of around 1,700 GWh. Also Bitbloom further grew the assets under monitoring to 5 GW. Perhaps even more important is the higher customer retention rate. Our largest customer prolonged his contract by three years, and furthermore, the second-largest customer just added 250 MW for performance monitoring. You see, the services segment is another exciting segment and integral part of our business.
With this, I would now like to hand over to Harald for the financials.
Thank you, Heiko. First of all, I also would like to welcome everyone here in this call. Looking at slide 13, you see that our total output increased by 10% to EUR 376.4 million, which is the highest level in the PNE history, as already mentioned before. This was driven by the successful project sales, the high development activities, as well as the results in power generation and our services business. Personnel expenses rose due to an increase in the average number of employees of 39. We've seen for many years an increase of the number of employees. For the near future, we do not see any further growth of our headcount. In the context of our transformation program, we want to, among other aspects, optimize costs, including overhead personnel and material costs through many measures.
Our EBITDA decreased to EUR 55.3 million compared to EUR 69.0 million in the previous year, especially due to the following one-time effects. First of all, the aforementioned impairments of the project pipeline of EUR 28.1 million, which are included in work in progress and in other operating expenses. Second, the deconsolidation of Panama amounting to EUR -3.6 million. The normalized EBITDA, adjusted for the one-off items, reached EUR 87.0 million. The decrease in the financial result of EUR -6.8 million was mainly driven by higher interest expenses resulting from a higher average volume of project financing. The increase of expenses for taxes in 2025 compared to 2024 is mainly attributable to deferred taxes of EUR 20.3 million compared to only EUR 5.8 million in the previous year.
By the way, you may recall that some of last year's figures were slightly different. In 2025, the PNE Group identified that the subsequent measurement of certain financial liabilities arising from low interest loans, especially here the KfW loans, in prior fiscal years had not been applied in full compliance with the requirements of IFRS 9. Correcting this error has had an impact of -EUR 9 million in 2023 and +EUR 9 million in 2024 on the consolidated net income. The total effect on consolidated net income and equity amounted to only -EUR 0.1 million in 2024. It is worth noting that this IFRS adjustment to the valuation is not related to operating results and has no impact on liquidity.
Looking at the segments on slide 14, I would like to mention that previous year's figures were adjusted due to changes in the segment reporting. The consolidation now includes all group consolidation as well as general overhead costs that could not be reliably allocated to operational segments. Consolidation was therefore renamed to corporate functions and consolidation. Having said that, we see growth in all operating segments. Total output of the segment project development increased to EUR 314.7 million compared to EUR 252.7 million in the previous year due to high construction and development activities. Total output of the segment power generation increased to EUR 104.2 million compared to EUR 92.0 million in the previous year, despite the lower wind years mentioned before.
Total services increased to EUR 38.0 million compared to EUR 35.4 million in the previous year, driven by a strong order book. EBITDA-wise, the segment Power Generation, the highest contribution in 2025 with EUR 73.1 million, despite the weaker wind years. EBITDA from the segment Project Development increased to EUR 40.8 million, and the Services segment contributed EUR 7.9 million. Balance sheet. On the asset side, we see on slide 14 that most is allocated to property, plant, and equipment, as well as inventories, what we see as investment in stable values in recurring cash flows. Inventories decreased as a result of the project sales and impairments. Our cash position fell to EUR 78.1 million due to the investments in project development and our IPP portfolio, but is still on a good level.
Equity decreased to EUR 154.1 million, reflecting the negative net income. The equity ratio was 13.0%. However, we continue to aim for an equity ratio of 20% or more in the midterm and already expect a clear improvement in 2026. Adjusted for hidden reserves, the equity ratio was at comfortable 23.4%. In the second quarter of 2025, we increased our existing bond by a EUR 10 million tap. Liabilities to banks decreased, resulting in a clearly reduced net debt of EUR 731.3 million. In addition, it is worth mentioning that the majority of the bank liabilities are non-recourse project financing. With that, I would like to hand back to Heiko for the brief update on our strategy and our transformation program, as well as for the outlook.
Thank you, Harald. Ladies, and gentlemen, this leads me to the strategy and transformation program on slide 17. The market environment in the renewable energy sector is changing rapidly at present. Interest rates have risen sharply and auction prices have fallen significantly. In addition, the cost of machines and materials have increased. Moreover, the political framework conditions are partly unclear. In our core market, Germany, for example, auctions for wind energy onshore are significantly oversubscribed. As a consequence, it has become more difficult for projects to secure an award and the remuneration for successful bids have decreased. Nevertheless, PNE has been awarded the contract in every tender it has entered, which speaks to its in-depth knowledge of the market. In a new Renewable Energy Sources Act, EEG regime, the awarded bid prices may again develop in the opposite direction.
At the same time, in Germany, as well as in other parts of Europe, grid access and the associated pace of expansion of renewable energies are increasingly being discussed. We have recognized these challenges and are addressing them and are responding strategically, for example, through value engineering of the entire pipeline, system requirements oriented project development, and co-location projects. Last year, we informed you about our transformation program and the numerous measures associated with it. These measures continuously help us focus strategically on our core business and reduce costs to form the base for sustainable and balanced growth. The working title is Focus and Deliver, meaning building on what we are good at while evolving to strive in the new environment. What are we focusing on? We have our strategic focus on the markets and technologies with the highest earnings potential.
We streamline our pipeline, rationalize our footprint, and closely monitor opportunity markets. We will consolidate the IPP expansion in 2026 before continue the build-up in the midterm. We want to deliver best-in-class project development and focus on system compatibility through storage solutions. We will also strengthen our internal efficiency and organizational performance via value engineering, as well as process optimization and digitalization of corporate functions and operations, and strengthen our economic performance, profitability, and liquidity by optimizing our overhead efficiency and reducing costs, personnel and OpEx of some EUR 20 million-EUR 30 million. We expect a regulatory framework that rewards grid-friendly behavior. That is why we are expanding our offerings to include integrated systems, systemic solutions. Our actions should therefore contribute more than ever to grid and system stability.
With all this, we are creating a lean, flexible and agile PNE that focuses on its core competencies to be able to deal with fast-moving markets. We are setting up our business for sustainable and balanced growth. With that in mind, let me move on to the outlook for 2026 on slide 19. Based on the current plan for the 2026 financial year, we expect the group EBITDA normalized for special items, or just normalized EBITDA, of between EUR 110 million and EUR 140 million. Normalized EBITDA is adjusted for one-off non-operating items that are not attributable to the PNE's ordinary operating business activities. For 2026, these one-off effects are expected to amount to approximately EUR 20 million.
Regarding our operating business, we of course aim to sell a significant number of projects and finance in the financial year 2026, for example, in Germany and Poland. The expansion of our IPP portfolio will be consolidated this year before we further build it up in midterm. According to our stronger focus on selected core markets, exits for Turkey and Canada are targeted for 2026. As mentioned before, we focus on projects and solutions with high system and grid compatibility. Coming to an end of my presentation, I would like to emphasize again, we are committed to future-proof, sustainable growth and value creation. With this, I would like to conclude our presentation and open the call for questions.
We will now begin the question- and- answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchtone telephone. You will hear a tone to confirm that you have entered the queue. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use only handsets while asking a question. Anyone who has a question may press star and one at this time. The first question comes from the line of Karsten von Blumenthal, First Berlin Equity Research. Please go ahead.
Good morning, Heiko. Good morning, Harald. A couple of questions from my side. In your corporate news, you said that you are looking for a more balanced mix between projects and IPP expansion. Could you elaborate on that? What is your target regarding your own plant portfolio? What does it mean to have a more balanced mix? Is that a 50/50 share? How can we make this clearer?
Yeah. Thank you, Karsten, for your question. Well, actually, I think as mentioned throughout last year, we are acting in a flexible manner in order to see that we, at the end of the day, will receive and have a result which has the highest profitability of our business. That's why we don't give out a certain number of what we want to add at the end of the day of IPP or sales. What can be made clear, I think, for 2026 is that we concentrate in general on the sales of projects while not in this year increasing IPP projects, given the circumstances to prepare for more challenging market environments.
All right. That is a very clear answer. There will be no increase in your IPP portfolio this year according to your current plans. Understood. Okay. Yesterday or the day before, the German government in the new climate protection program said that they wanna add 12 GW extra for the tenders, which should be built until 2030. Could you elaborate on what this means for the onshore wind market? Have you any insight when the first bid will start? In which tender? Is this the August tender, the November tender? Perhaps you could elaborate on that point.
Yes. Happy to do so. Actually, yes. First of all, I think it's good news that the government decided to increase the auction volume until 2030. I think it's a reaction to what we see in the market with the increasing number of projects being permitted. As far as we understand, these additional 12 GW are meant to fall into the period from 2027 until 2030, so will not be a part of this year's auction. But this is not very clear yet because the ministry, neither the economics, the BNetzA, or the environment ministry, has made their specific number. What our sources say is that it very likely is not increasing this year's auction volume.
However, there's another initiative, surprisingly coming from Bavaria. Additional 2 GW-5 GW for this year, and this is still under consideration. I think it makes its way into the Bundesrat, first of all, to be considered, and then it further on goes into the parliament. We will see what will be the outcome. For us, this definitely is a positive signal to the renewables industry, especially onshore wind industry.
Thanks for clarifying on the 12 GW. My next question is, if I look into the leaked EEG suggestion and into the grid package, German Netzpaket, my feeling is, will it really help to have more GW if on the other hand, the conditions to build onshore wind farms deteriorate because of this redispatch 10 years and many other hurdles that are erected at the moment? How do you see this EEG leak and the grid package for your company?
Well, I think one has to distinguish between those. On the revision of the EEG, actually, we don't see this, and we don't expect that this is a major issue for us. We know, of course, expecting is two-sided CFD, how to handle this from other markets. It's of course open. It's a one-time step out of the EEG and going into a PPA and coming back, if this is possible. I think the major changes are more expected to impact mainly small PV, where, yeah, we are not active in. EEG renewal is not really where we see issues. You mentioned the grid package. Yes, this is much more critical.
The so-called redispatch formula says that if the projects are in the areas with grid constraints, you might not be reimbursed. That, of course, could affect certain regions and then projects in that region where you will not be able to be financed and then will be realized. Regarding our projects, because we looked into this already, our projects when we compare it on a map where our projects are and where grid congestion is, we are not that much affected. This also shows that we have already in the past looked into, let's say, low or constrained grid connection constraints and moved our project development activities towards that direction.
One, of course, is that we are following up a key mitigation measure of that is co-location too, that we might not be affected that much. It's a topic we very closely monitor, as you can imagine.
Thanks for giving me this and us this insight. That is very helpful. Not easy from outside to know which projects, how many projects will be affected by this. My next question is regarding your offshore wind business. You very unfortunately were not successful in Vietnam. You now said that in the Latvia project, you have written it down. Given that it is very difficult for medium-sized companies to act in this business for very large companies, usually the offshore wind business, do you think about leaving this segment altogether?
Yeah, thanks. Offshore, I think first of all, it's not just necessarily a question of size, depending on the market. I think we have done a very good job when entering Vietnam and doing the development work. It was always our focus to, at the end of the day, partner up with another company. Unfortunately, the EOI process was not successful for us there. We're still considering if and how we can be involved in the further development of the projects, but not as an owner or the owner of the rights there.
In general, we are now evaluating how we deal with that situation since we have quite some offshore knowledge in the company, which we might use on the consulting side on one hand. The other is, of course, that we in this moment in time where we said we want to focus on core markets and on profitable markets, we are not looking to go and look for new offshore markets. That's the current situation. We will, if we change that, we will inform them accordingly.
All right. Very helpful. Thank you for that. In your presentation, you mentioned that you want to reduce costs and OpEx and personnel by EUR 20 million-EUR 30 million. This is quite a high figure. When do you want to have reached this? And what does this mean for your overall cost basis? And will that fall in coming years? Will it be stable, given that you might try to grow somewhat? Could you reflect on that?
Well, I think PNE has in the past grown quite significantly for good reasons but in different market environments. Looking forward, I think we have to see what that means if, at the end of the day, there are more challenges ahead. While doing this, you can do geographically, of course, what we do, which has a cost impact as well, that we decrease so exiting markets. The EUR 20 million-EUR 30 million is a significant figure, which we think is necessary on one hand, which will not happen in a year, but in a bunch of years, looking into the next three years, actually.
It will mean that the cost base on the OpEx or other OpEx parts and the personnel expenses will decrease to bring us. I think in one area I mentioned that we will become a leaner company, and this means in terms of new processes, digitization, and then focusing on certain areas. This makes us leaner, and then of course we don't need and will have the let's say the same level of costs and employees as we had to have before. I think it's a consequential way that we do, and I would like to emphasize we do this quite ahead of the times that we look at.
That is, it's not the pressure yet, but we think we have to react in time, much earlier, before, in order not to be challenged later on.
Yeah, that is also my impression that you are before the curve and not behind. That is highly appreciated. In your presentation, in your guidance, you say that you now switch to a normalized EBITDA and that you have EUR 20 million in one-offs to come to the EBITDA, which is then shown. These EUR 20 million in one-offs, could you elaborate on that? What is in there?
Hi Karsten, Harald here. I take over this question, especially for the deconsolidation of our exit markets. That's one thing, and we have this transformation program with cost cuts, for example, for headcount. This could be part of this too. Yeah, these are the two main factors for the adjustment of the EBITDA.
Yeah. That fits. Thanks for that. One last question from my side regarding your PV business. I mean, you have reduced your pipeline by revaluing it. Can we expect any PV project being built and commissioned this year?
Yeah. Thanks for touching that area. It depends on the markets you look at. We are seeing quite some challenges in the standalone PV market in Germany. There we are really focusing on the co-location, where we will not see the effect this year. We are, however, solely concentrating on PV in Italy. There we have been awarded last year in the new tenders that have been published and are now on the brink to realize those projects. That's not very clear if they will, at the end of the day, be commissioned this year. Very likely next year. We will start with the implementation this year.
We see for France an increasing pipeline and expect this in the next years then to come. There's no realized projects, but there's still PV activities going on in those markets. Plus, in markets like Poland and in South Africa. While in South Africa, our business model, as you may know, is slightly different, where we mainly sell project rights and at an earlier stage, but those include PV projects as well.
Perfect. Thank you very much for taking my questions.
You're welcome.
The next question comes from the line of Holger Steffen, SMC Research. Please go ahead.
Good morning, everyone. Only a few additional questions from my side. Maybe let us start with your impairments last year, which were forced by the market conditions. What would be a scenario that would necessitate further write-downs, and in which countries do the greatest write-down risks currently remain?
Yeah. Thanks, Steffen. As we last year really thoroughly looked into the portfolio, we came to the conclusion and with the market conditions accompanying to that we have to impair projects. However, that means that we don't see currently any further impairments of the projects since it was not a small number of projects. However, you never know what will happen, of course, in terms of market changes. As we are downsizing our market footprint and concentrate on the markets where we think the conditions are still stable or promising, we don't expect further impairments.
Okay. We won't see any impairments for offshore projects, or that's a different topic?
I think that you kind of look at that because we mentioned we are considering what's happening in Vietnam. That's the truth. However, the offshore business, if stepping out, will not have an effect of any impairments to our results. Maybe I can add, we haven't capitalized any inventories or assets in offshore, so there's nothing to impair.
Okay. That's great. Okay. Let us move on to the balance sheet. The improvement in the equity ratio has not yet been achieved due to the impairments. Are you relying on the 2026 results here to improve or are supplementary measures such as a capital increase also being considered?
Regarding the equity ratio, we expect a rise in this year. This is based off the sale of a lot of projects and our EBITDA normalized or EBITDA forecast what is between EUR 90 million and EUR 120 million. That's the main reason why we see here a better equity ratio for 2026.
You, we won't see capital increase?
will be an agenda item this year too, at the AGM, but the last five, six years, you know this was not possible to do this, but you never know.
Mm.
Yeah, that's open item.
Okay. That would be a possibility if you get the acceptance of the AGM.
Okay.
My final question. Sorry.
Yeah. We would be, of course, happy to do so. This is why we are a listed company.
Okay. My final question is about the bond that matures in 2027. When will the refinancing of the bond be addressed?
We already started here the process for the replacement. There are three windows we see before the summer break, after the summer break, or then winter. The process is started and takes a while and we have to see. It's activated.
Okay. That's fine. Okay. Thank you very much for taking my questions.
You're welcome.
The next question comes from the line of Guido Hoymann, Metzler. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good morning, gentlemen. One question, please. You know, given the headwinds from the falling tariffs and the high interest rates, you know, all these headwinds, actually, negotiations with wind turbine suppliers are probably also part of your daily business. The question is, do you feel that they, you know, these turbine suppliers, that they are listening to you, and are they willing to make concessions? The same question regarding the landlords. I guess that you're also renegotiating leases. Do you experience concessions here?
Yeah. Thanks, Guido, for that question. Well, of course, in this market environment, we look for all the cost items and especially in wind projects, the turbines have the most impact. Since it was in the past, let's say, quite a good seller's market for them, I think the situation changes now. Yes, we are in negotiations for the projects to come. And we see willingness there to move. I think it's important that we as PNE have in the past proven, and this more now since more than 30 years, to be a very reliable customer who at the end of the day delivers projects. The OEMs concentrate on those developers who are able to deliver, and we are amongst those.
Therefore, I'm pretty confident that this will have an impact. Coming to the land leases, yeah, that's a bit more difficult I would say. However, we are approaching the landlords in Germany on that because at the end of the day, we are all in the same boat. We have to deliver the best economic projects in order to be successful in the auctions. Therefore, let's say we have to all work together and maybe not in all but in many projects we will see movement there. That's at least our hope, and we have started these activities to change on a moderate level the land lease fees as well.
Okay. All right. Thank you.
You're welcome.
As a reminder, for questions, please press star and one. There are no more questions at this time. I would now like to turn the conference back over to Heiko Wuttke for the final remarks.
Okay. Thank you. Well, if there are no further questions, we would like to thank you all for your participation in today's webcast. We look forward to welcome you next time, maybe at our next webcast, on the publication of our quarterly statement Q1 2026, which is scheduled for the 13th of May, 2026. Have a great day.