Uniper SE (ETR:UN0)
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Earnings Call: Q4 2021

Feb 23, 2022

Operator

Dear ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the conference call of Uniper regarding the business development 2021. At our customers' request, this conference will be recorded. As a reminder, all participants will be in a listen-only mode. After the presentation, there will be an opportunity to ask questions. If any participant has difficulty hearing the conference, please press star key followed by zero on your telephone for operator assistance. May I now hand you over to Georg Oppermann, Senior Vice President, External Communication and Sustainability, who will lead you through this conference. Please go ahead.

Georg Oppermann
Senior Vice President of External Communication and Sustainability, Uniper

Thank you, and good morning, ladies and gentlemen. I would like to welcome you to the Uniper annual press conference for the financial year 2021. Unfortunately, due to an illness, my colleague Fabienne Vielmann is unable to do the moderation of this call. Therefore, I'm happy to take over that part today. First, our CEO, Klaus-Dieter Maubach, will present the key developments of last year and the status of our strategy implementation. After that, our CFO, Tiina Tuomela, will give you an overview of the key business figures. As usual, you will have the opportunity to ask your questions after the two speeches. Myself and my colleagues from the press office will of course be available as usual to answer further questions after the call. Klaus-Dieter, may I ask you to start, please?

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Thank you. Good morning and welcome to today's press conference. Thanks for joining us. I'm pleased to be able to take a look at current developments at Uniper with you today. Last year was a challenge, but that's true for all of us. Our company handled these challenges very well as our results for the 2021 financial year clearly indicate. But let me start with some comments on the recent developments. I obviously cannot leave the events of the last days go unaddressed. Let me be open with you. The situation at the Russian-Ukrainian border leaves us at Uniper profoundly unsettled. Please note that I'm saying this as the CEO of a company where thousands of colleagues work hard every day to help earning a significant share of profits, either in Russia itself or longstanding ties with Russian partners that go back more than 50 years.

During that time, a lot has been achieved for all parties based on foresighted collaboration, mutual agreements, and trustful dialogues. My experience is if solutions based on those principles are not possible, this usually results in consequences with significant costs for all sides involved. Looking at Uniper now, while we are certainly hoping for a de-escalation, we need to be clear about the risk and the potential mitigation tools at our hands. Let me be clear and transparent about our exposure to Russia. Uniper's key exposure to the current situation can be categorized into four areas. The first one is kind of familiar already. A further escalation might lead to more volatile prices and therefore higher margining and liquidity needs for us. While we cannot predict how prices will develop going forward, it is good to see that the last days went by without turbulences.

The second one is Nord Stream 2. It probably did not come as a surprise that Nord Stream 2 got immediately into the focus of political counteractions. As you all know, Nord Stream 2 is completed and only waiting for the certification process to be completed. Yesterday, the German government has taken steps to put this certification process on hold until further notice. We are evaluating the impact of yesterday's decision on our claims towards Nord Stream 2, including potential impairment implications. The third section comprises potential sanctions against partners of Unipro, our Russian power generation affiliate, and Uniper, including financial institutions. As of today, we consider it unlikely that the business of Uniper or Unipro could be significantly affected in this regard, but I wanted to mention it here. The last category is related to possible interruptions of Russian gas supply in our portfolio.

Depending on the situation, Uniper could be required to source gas against high market prices to ensure security of supply to our customers. Let me put it clear, we cannot exclude none of these risks. The situation is unclear. When it comes to the likelihood of such interruptions, recent public statements provide some comfort. It is apparently understood that maintaining the supply into Europe is in the interest of all sides. As we have stated in the past, throughout our 50 years of partnership, Gazprom has always been a reliable partner who delivered as promised. On this positive note, I would like to conclude this topic for now. Let me assure you, Uniper is closely monitoring the situation and evaluating mitigation measures.

We will keep you updated going forward. However, while the situation is certainly getting our highest attention, we need also to keep our daily business and the strategy execution on track. Let's move over to this part of today's presentation, starting with an overview of the key highlights in 2021. First of all, on balance, 2021 was a successful but turbulent year in which we took many important steps forward. We met our earnings forecast. S&P Global Ratings confirmation of our BBB flat credit rating in January 2022 reaffirms that we operate as a structurally sound business in markets with uncommonly erratic price fluctuations. We delivered Adjusted EBIT of approximately EUR 1.2 billion in the financial year 2021. That's nearly a 19% increase from our solid prior year earnings.

The main earnings driver was an outstanding performance by Global Commodities segment. Adjusted Net Income rose by 17% to just over EUR 900 million. Tina will provide you with the details in a moment. 2021 was a year with two phases. The first was that we were successful operationally and posted very good earnings. The second was that volatile and above all, sharply higher prices on commodity markets posed considerable challenges for us. We have obtained the necessary financial flexibility to secure our deliveries for the possibility that extreme power and gas prices recur. Overall, the financing measures we took around the end of 2021 expanded our liquidity framework to EUR 12 billion. Even if those liquidity risks are only temporary in nature, we need to properly and carefully manage those risks going forward, especially in the current geopolitical situation.

This involves not only our internal business steering, but also our dividend policy. Most of you will already know from the ad hoc we released this Monday that Uniper's management will propose to reduce the dividend from prior years of EUR 501 million to EUR 26 million for the fiscal year 2021. This proposal has been aligned with majority shareholder Fortum and will be brought forward to the AGM on May 18. Ultimately, the purpose of the dividend cut is to increase the resilience of Uniper's investment capability in a highly volatile environment. The developments on energy markets in recent months have underscored the importance of gas and supply security. Being one of Europe's largest gas traders and gas storage operators gives Uniper a key role to play in such complex situations. The numbers tell me we played this role well last year.

Let's take the LNG business as an example. In 2021, we traded a total of 356 LNG tanker cargos, 131 more than in the prior year. Compared with our LNG activities five years ago, that's very swift progress. In 2016, the year of Uniper's stock market listing, we traded a total of 16 cargos. In short, we have achieved enormous and sustained volume growth in this business. To illustrate, the 356 cargos we traded amounts to about 330 terawatt hours. That's equal to one-third of Germany's gas consumption in 2021. We're not just able to operate successfully in a demanding global market, we have also been able to grow significantly and profitably in an extremely short time. The numbers demonstrate that Uniper ranks among Europe's biggest LNG traders.

We now want to use our many years of experience to help ramp up the hydrogen economy. It will be built largely on the same markets and along the same transport pathways. In addition, we marketed about 83 terawatt hours of gas storage capacity. If full, this capacity is equal to 12.5% of Germany's winter gas demand and would fully cover the country's gas consumption on more than 20 winter days. Of course, we are already planning for the future. Our cavern storage facilities, we are Germany's biggest operator, are particularly suited for storing and retrieving hydrogen. Whenever we think about gas, we include hydrogen. Otherwise, it's unclear how gas can serve as a bridge. The bridge extends from fossil gas to clean hydrogen and other zero carbon gases. This long-term aspect plays a decisive role in all our projects.

There's currently a lot of discussion about how the tight situation on the gas market, high prices combined with comparatively empty storage facilities, can be improved. My personal view is that we can ensure a secure gas supply with market-based instruments. These instruments already exist. They just have to be used. There are various possibilities or ways to do this. For example, operators could be obliged to use storage facilities and to engage in secondary storage marketing as early as the summer months. Long-term options, tenders at storage connection points are another possibility. In the future, they could be tendered for several years and on a larger scale at the latest at the beginning of the injection period. Combining the tendering at storage facilities described above with additional tenders at import points would make the model even more robust.

The basis of these additions at the import points could be, for example, minimum flows from pipeline supply or from LNG deliveries. In other words, there are a number of good mechanisms for absorbing or at least cushioning future bottlenecks and which would take effect in the short term. We shouldn't wait until next winter to talk about this. The time is now. Whether it's LNG, pipeline gas, or the production and import of hydrogen and other green gases, our company is prepared to do its part. Our company has no influence on political and geopolitical issues, so I will focus primarily on what Uniper can influence, our own transformation. We have made important, indeed game-changing decisions. The coal exit of Uniper's power generation business in Europe is decided. From 2035 onward, the power we generate in Europe will be climate neutral.

We've also significantly accelerated the pace of our coal exit technologically. Datteln 4 and Maasvlakte 3 will be our only coal plants operating in Europe after year-end 2024. That's less than three years away. A recent example of this acceleration is shutting down a power station which will stop commercial operation in May 2023. That's over a year and a half earlier than our original plan. Alongside our coal exit, we are systematically aligning other businesses with a climate neutral future. By 2035, we aim to reduce our indirect Scope 3 emissions by 35% relative to 2021. Uniper as well as the entire Fortum Group will be climate neutral by 2050. This kind of transformation, especially at this speed, involves difficult decisions that reflect the resoluteness of our actions. The decision to restructure our engineering business was one such necessary consequence.

Negotiations are currently underway to find acceptable solutions for everyone involved. We're providing social packages that promote smoother changes to those employees who need to reorient themselves professionally. I and the entire management board are very aware that successful transformation has a price. Nevertheless, we have a corporate and social responsibility to take a strategic look into the future. Ladies and gentlemen, it ought to be clear to everyone that this isn't just about exiting coal and reducing carbon emissions. We intend to invest more than EUR 500 million in green growth businesses in 2022. This money will go primarily toward renewable green gases and green thermal generation. That we are not a renewables front runner is no secret, but we are slowly gathering speed, and just before the new year, announced our first joint wind project with Fortum.

The decision to build the Pjelax and Kristiinankaupunki wind farms in Finland, which will have a combined capacity of 380 MW, represents the first important step toward achieving our minimum target of 1.5-2 GW of renewables capacity by 2025. Beginning in early 2024, the 56 turbines of these two wind farms will generate about 1.1 TWh of electricity annually. Construction began in early January and will be completed in about two years. We are off to a good start, and we want to steadily increase the pace. You'll see that there is more to come. We now come to the ideal partners of renewables, green and low carbon gases. Uniper has all the capabilities to make a significant contribution to the ramp up of a hydrogen economy in Germany and Europe.

All our current gas activities are experienced in trading, structuring, marketing, transport and storage. All of it is applicable to green and low carbon gases. Germany in particular needs these capabilities because it wants and needs to secure its energy policy agenda with the help of low carbon gases. It’s undisputed, for example, that Germany will have to import around 70%-80% of the green hydrogen it will need. The Federal Ministry for Economic Affairs and Climate Action has taken an important step in this direction by approving EUR 900 million for the H2Global Foundation. The federal government has already announced its intention to increase these funds further. The purpose is to propel the ramp-up of a green hydrogen market by means of double auction.

As the market environment slowly takes form, we are moving forward with our hydrogen business just before the new year. You will see that December was a busy month. We signed a term sheet with Novatek for the long-term delivery of up to 1.2 million metric tons of low carbon ammonia. Our partnership with HYPORT Duqm in Oman to import green ammonia to Europe is moving forward as well. We are also involving projects in key industrial clusters around Europe like Rotterdam, the Netherlands, Humber in Britain, Luleå in Sweden, and Wilhelmshaven in Germany. We want to establish Wilhelmshaven as a green hydrogen hub that can meet about 15% of Germany's hydrogen needs by 2030. We are working with strong partners in Wilhelmshaven as well. This includes developing more than 1 GW of electrolyzers capacity on the grounds of our power station in Wilhelmshaven by 2030.

We are exploring obtaining the renewable electricity needed for electrolyzers from offshore and wind farms by Ørsted of Denmark. We're also planning an important terminal for green and blue ammonia. The terminal would have a cracker that transforms the ammonia back into hydrogen. Just the day before yesterday, we concluded a cooperative agreement with Salzgitter AG. The goal is for Uniper to supply competitively priced green hydrogen to Salzgitter's SALCOS project to produce climate neutral steel. Ladies and gentlemen, there is no shortage of projects and plans that help reduce carbon emissions, and eventually that could enable Europe to achieve its climate targets. Ambitious climate targets are one thing. The realities of the energy system are another. It's good that Europe is phasing out coal, and the phase out of nuclear power enjoys broad public support, at least in Germany.

We now need to phase something in, and what we need to phase in are new clean technologies that are also flexible and reliable. This is the key challenge of this decade. Natural gas is a transitional technology that plays a key role in stabilizing the energy system. Natural gas can also enable rapid, significant emission reductions whenever it replaces carbon-intensive energy sources. I therefore welcome the fact that the German government coalition agreement foresees precisely this. This is the foundation and a prerequisite for Germany to decarbonize its economy as quickly as possible. This transformation will certainly take a number of years. A joint study by Boston Consulting Group and the Federation of German Industries estimates that Germany will need 60 new gas-fired power plants with a total capacity of 40 GW of 2030.

Today is February 23, 2022, and construction has not yet begun on a single one of these much needed gas plants. If you consider the time it takes to approve and build such a plant, meeting this target is going to be challenging. This makes it all the more important for Germany to establish an investment framework as quickly as possible, so that in view of the lead times necessary for planning, approval, and construction, the target remains achievable by 2030 and beyond. Under the right conditions, Uniper would be prepared to invest into 2 GW of gas-fired capacity, provided this investment is compatible with our decarbonization targets for 2030 and 2035. Ultimately, this is a matter for policymakers. In the meantime, we are gradually decarbonizing by moving forward with projects relating to green thermal generation.

The first example is Irsching 6, a 300 MW gas-fired power plant that will serve as reserve capacity for the transmission system operator in Southeast Germany starting this fall. The second is Scholven 3, a 130 MW gas-fired plant that will provide power and heat to an industrial customer. Both these projects combine supply security with decarbonization. We'll also pipe waste heat from a BP refinery into our district heating network in the northern Ruhr region. This will enable us to displace 60,000 metric tons of CO2 a year. In addition, we are partnering Dutch energy company, Eneco, to make the district heating network in The Hague more sustainable. We are developing a plan to make the energy this network supplies net zero carbon by 2035. Ladies and gentlemen, I'm certain that the energy transition will succeed, even though Germany has set the hurdles very high.

This means that we'll just have to jump higher than other countries. First, Germany therefore needs to swiftly plan and build new clean hydrogen-ready gas-fired power plants. The German government intends to present proposals for the investment framework in the fall of 2022. Speed will be essential here. Second, and simultaneously, Germany needs to steadily expand its renewables capacity and build and incentivize a market for hydrogen and green gas. Uniper is already developing these types of projects and seizing opportunities. We are propelling our own transition by means of renewables, green gases, and innovations. Fortunately, as CEO, I can say that I have the right colleagues on the board for this, and that Uniper has the right expertise and the right mindset. These will again be our most valuable assets in the year ahead. Thanks for listening. Over to you, Tina.

Tiina Tuomela
CFO, Uniper

Thank you, Klaus-Dieter. This morning, a warm welcome from me as well to our annual results press conference. Thanks for joining us. I'm pleased to be able to present to you full year results for the 2021 financial year that are in line with the expectations of our forecast for 2021 updated at the end of October. I'll start as usual with Adjusted EBIT. We recorded Adjusted EBIT of EUR 1,187 million, which is almost 19% above the prior year figure of EUR 998 million. The increase is mainly attributable to the strong earnings delivered by our Global Commodities segment. Before we turn to that, let's take a look at the most important developments at the European Generation segment.

This segment posted Adjusted EBIT of EUR 473 million in 2021, which is significantly below the prior year figure of EUR 492 million. This is attributable especially to the non-recurrence of positive income from the optimization of fossil fuel power plants and the temporary unavailability of Maasvlakte 3 hard coal-fired power station in the Netherlands. Earnings were also adversely affected relatively to the prior year by an increase in provision for asset retirement obligation at our nuclear power business in Sweden. A positive factor was that Zwentendorf and Isar 2 and five power plants, which entered commercial operation in the course of 2020, contributed to earnings for the full year in 2021.

Global Commodities Adjusted EBIT of EUR 756 million surpassed its prior year earnings of EUR 496 million by a wide margin. The increase is attributable in part to higher earnings from our international portfolio, which benefited from unusual weather conditions in North America and from business activities in Asia. In addition, our gas business followed up its good results in 2020 by having a positive impact in 2021 financial year as well. It benefited from exceptionally volatile and rising prices. Our Russian Power Generation segment recorded earnings of EUR 230 million, which was at the prior year level. The recommissioning of the unit three at Berezovskaya Power Station in May 2021, and the associated income from the capacity mechanisms, along with higher prices and the sales volume on the electricity market, had positive effects on earnings.

These positive developments were partially offset by the expiration of the long-term capacity payments for the total of four generating units at Shaturskaya GRES and Yaivinskaya GRES at the year-end 2020 and at Surgutskaya GRES-2 during the 2021 financial year, as well as negative FX effects. Adjusted net income essentially tracks Adjusted EBIT. Our full year adjusted net income of EUR 906 million significantly surpasses the prior year figure of EUR 774 million. Uniper recorded a net loss of EUR 4,106 million at the end of the 2021 financial year. The main reason for this is the discrepancy in IFRS accounting treatment of the marking to market of the hedging transaction and hedge position.

Derivatives are recorded at the fair value on the balance sheet date, whereas the increase in the value of the hedge asset is initially limited to the acquisition or production cost. Any increase in the value beyond this may only be recorded when the hedges are unbound. This means that we record income from hedges as soon as we settle our contracts. This valuation discrepancy is factored out, Adjusted EBIT and Adjusted Net Income in order to better reflect Uniper's operating performance. The net loss we recorded is a snapshot at the end of 2021, which may already look very different today. The main reason for these developments was the rapid rise in electricity and above all, gas prices towards the end of the last year. Uniper sells power and gas also on forward markets as well.

This enables our customers to lock in a fixed contractual price. For Uniper, this ultimately means that rising commodity prices have a negative impact on unadjusted IFRS earnings, while falling prices have a positive effect on IFRS earnings, all due to the aforementioned valuation mismatch. In addition, collateral payments are usually agreed on forward transactions. This collateral reflects the difference between the current market price and the contractual price. Normally, this collateral amounts to a few percent of the contractual price. At one point, towards the end of last year, it amounted to nine times this difference. The increase in collateral payments is not only reflected in an Adjusted Net Income, but also requires us to have significantly more liquidity.

At the end of last year, we obtained the necessary additional flexibility in the form of a credit and guarantee facility agreement with Fortum on early 2022, a revolving credit facility with KfW Bank, in addition to the existing revolving credit facility with Uniper's core banks. To state it very clearly, Uniper has a solid operating and financial foundation. Uniper's goal is a stable investment-grade rating of triple B. In late January, S&P Global Ratings reaffirmed Uniper's triple B credit rating and stable outlook. Economic Net Debt declined significantly from EUR 3,050 million at the year-end 2020 to EUR 324 million. The main reason is the increase in our operating cash flow due to the measures to optimize liquidity.

A reduction in provisions for pensions and other obligation resulting from the increase in actuarial discount rates relative to year-end 2020 led to a further decline in Economic Net Debt. Full-year cash effective investments totaled EUR 720 million, which is EUR 23 million below the prior year level. About EUR 329 million went towards growth investments and EUR 392 million towards maintenance investments. Our growth investments were lower than in the prior year, whereas our maintenance investments were higher. I turn now to our forecast. We anticipate Adjusted EBIT of EUR 1 billion-EUR 1.3 billion, and Adjusted Net Income to be between EUR 0.8 billion and EUR 0.3 billion for the 2022 financial year. In Uniper's foundation, we always place great emphasis on presenting our business transparently.

Last year, we published our first Tax Transparency Report. The 2021 report will be disclosed in March. This year, we are taking an additional step. Our TCFD report, TCFD stands for Task Force on Climate-related Financial Disclosure, represents the opportunities and risks that climate change has for Uniper. The report is for the first time part of the Non-Financial Report included in our Annual Report. In addition, Uniper is reporting its EU Taxonomy-eligible economic activities for the first time. Now we are happy to take your questions.

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Operator.

Operator

Yes. Ladies and gentlemen, if you have a question for our speakers, please dial zero and one on your telephone keypad now to enter the queue. Once your name has been announced, you can ask a question. If you find your question is answered before it is your turn to speak, you can dial zero and two to cancel your question. If you're using speaker equipment today, please lift the handset before making your selection. One moment please for the first question. The first question is from Christoph Steitz, Reuters. Your line is now open.

Christoph Steitz
Chief Company News Correspondent, Germany, Reuters

Good morning from Frankfurt. Can you hear me loud and clear?

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Yes, we do.

Christoph Steitz
Chief Company News Correspondent, Germany, Reuters

Perfect. Mr. Maubach, I have a question on the Nord Stream 2 funding. Your co-financing partner, OMV, said yesterday that, you know, the consortium had started to pay back the loans in the second half of last year. Can you confirm that the consortium has also started to repay the funds to you? If that's the case, can you tell us by how much has been paid back? The second question would be on your operations in Russia. I mean, you laid out, you know, your conviction that, you know, there will be limited impact on your business there. What can you share in terms of contingency plans? How have you prepared staff at Unipro for, you know, an eventual escalation of the conflict?

Maybe that's something you could comment on. Thank you very much.

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Let me start with your second question. I mean, Unipro is a Russian-based business, okay? Their kind of performance is excellent, was in 2021, and we expect this also for 2022. There is no emergency plan or something in place. This is something they are doing business as usual, and I don't expect any kind of immediate impact that the conflict on the Russian-Ukrainian border would have on our Unipro businesses, okay? The power units that we are running are not close to that border. They shouldn't have any impact, and I don't see why they should be interrupted in terms of fuel supply.

We are running gas-fired power stations and a lignite-fired coal-fired power station, so I don't see why this should be interrupted. In an operational sense, I don't expect this to have any impact on our businesses and operations in Russia. Whether sanctions would be imposed on Uniper and or Unipro or whatever could have an impact on our business relationship between Uniper and Unipro, that is impossible to assess today because we do not know about anything that could have an impact on that. Today, I can say I don't expect anything to happen in this regard.

Clearly, I mean, this is obviously a very dynamic situation that can develop over time, and hence, I would also kind of refrain from speculating how this could develop going forward. Again, back to your question, operationally, today, I don't see any issue with our operations in Russia. On the Nord Stream thing, I don't know what OMV said on Nord Stream 2, so I cannot comment on that. What I can say is that we are kind of treated in the same way, and I do not know what they were referring to when they said they received payments back. Whether this was related to a payback of the loan itself, I would be surprised.

whether there are other payments that they are claiming to have received, then I would simply say we are treated in the same way. OMV is in the same situation as we are with regard to the fact that both companies and three more companies are financial investors to Nord Stream 2.

Christoph Steitz
Chief Company News Correspondent, Germany, Reuters

Okay. Thank you.

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Any other questions, please?

Operator

Yes. The next question is from the German channel. One moment, please.

The next question comes from Antje Höning. Your line is open.

Antje Höning
Journalist, Rheinische Post

Good morning, Mr. Maubach.

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Hello.

Antje Höning
Journalist, Rheinische Post

I wanted to ask something about number two. Could you also say whether the sanction of the federal government is something you understand and accept? The second question is, if Nord Stream 2 is finally started. Will you then actually take action with regards to the shareholders, Germany against the EU or against that strong?

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

I have to admit, at least I had some difficulty to understand both questions. Maybe you can repeat that. That would be very helpful. Thank you for that.

Antje Höning
Journalist, Rheinische Post

My first question is, do you understand that Germany has declared that? Do you really accept that personally? The second question is, if now that it starts working, will you actually take actions against the German shareholders?

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Sorry.

Antje Höning
Journalist, Rheinische Post

To take action against the Nord Stream or the Gazprom.

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Sorry. I think, operator, we have a technical problem. That seems to be the translation channel. Could you please connect us with Frau Höning? Are you hearing me?

Antje Höning
Journalist, Rheinische Post

I can perfectly hear you.

Operator

I just need a moment. We have the translations connected to each other, so I have to dial in a link line. One moment, please.

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Yes, please wait.

Antje Höning
Journalist, Rheinische Post

This is a moment because the translators are connected to each other. Just a second.

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Yeah. Please apologize for the problems. Hold on, please. Maybe we need some seconds to sort that out, but we will soon continue. Sorry for that. Oh, do we have another question? Operator, please.

Antje Höning
Journalist, Rheinische Post

Haben wir vielleicht noch andere Fragen?

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Operator, can you please, let us know if, the call can continue or if we should stop.

Operator

[Non-English content]

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Okay, if that doesn't work, can we maybe change to the next question?

Antje Höning
Journalist, Rheinische Post

[Non-English content]

Operator

[Non-English content]

Antje Höning
Journalist, Rheinische Post

[Non-English content]

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

[ Non-English content]

[Non-English content]

Tiina Tuomela
CFO, Uniper

[Non-English content]

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Oh.

Tiina Tuomela
CFO, Uniper

[Non-English content]

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

[Non-English content]

Antje Höning
Journalist, Rheinische Post

[Non-English content]

Tiina Tuomela
CFO, Uniper

[Non-English content]

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

[Non-English content]

Operator

Yes, the next question is then from Christian Krisement. Your line is now open.

Christian Krisement
Analyst, Societe Generale

Hello, good morning. Thank you for taking my questions. Two questions if I may. Actually, I'm still trying to understand the implications from the sanctions in Russia and how this is going to unfold in the near future. You just confirmed your guidance, your financial guidance on Monday. Looking into the future, could the whole Russia situation endanger your guidance for this year? That's the first question. The second question is about the Nordic hedging numbers. If you could shed a little light on that. I'm a bit puzzled by the development for 2023. In comparing the numbers Q3 2021 and the full year hedging, the hedging ratio increased, but the prices fell. Shouldn't at some point the higher prices in Nordic region be reflected in those numbers? Thank you.

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

On your second question, Tiina will come back to you in a second. Let me try to answer your first question. I understand that you were asking about our guidance that we have released on Monday and to what extent sanctions or other things that might happen around Russian, Ukrainian conflict might have an impact. Well, I don't know. I don't know, because we don't know how this entire situation will develop. We don't know how commodity prices will develop going forward, and hence we don't know what kind of impact that will have.

What I can say is that we are rather on the cautious and on the conservative side also with our guidance that we have released on Monday, because it's really unclear how a number of factors will have an impact on 2022, in particular. I cannot rule out that also the developments in Russia, Ukraine will have an impact on prices and price levels on our activities. That certainly also includes Nord Stream 2 or our gas business that is, as you know, also depending on Russian gas imports. Maybe on Nordic hedging?

Tiina Tuomela
CFO, Uniper

Very good. Thank you. Our hedged prices for 2022, 2023 are on a lower level than in previous years, as mentioned. I would mention maybe two main reasons. First of all, our hedging includes the EPADs, the area price hedges. Whereas the overall system and other area prices have increased, the Price Area 2, I think, was relatively low compared to other prices. It is the kind of structural where our production is and what are the weights of the different areas. The other reason relates to the proxy hedging. Usually we build our hedging during 2-3 years, 3 years beforehand.

Now we have some hedges done a couple years ago when we were under Corona pandemic and the price is very low. Liquidity, particularly in the price area 2, very low. We used proxy hedges. Now obviously those proxy hedges have had at least a temporary negative impact. As said, you know, of course, the hedging ratios for 2022, 2024, 60% and 20%. Obviously a possibility to improve also the hedged prices in the future.

Christian Krisement
Analyst, Societe Generale

Great. Thank you.

Operator

We have another question from the German channel. Just one moment please. I will switch the channels. Next question comes from Annette Becker.

Annette Becker
Researcher, ZEW - Leibniz Centre for European Economic Research

Good morning. I'm just trying to be lucky as well. You were talking about the fact that this credit with Nord Stream 2 might actually lead to reduction. What would be required?

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Operator, können wir bitte die deutsche Version haben? Das hilft uns jetzt nichts. Können Sie uns bitte direkt mit Frau Becker?

Annette Becker
Researcher, ZEW - Leibniz Centre for European Economic Research

Have precautionary measures already been taken in 2021?

Operator

One moment please.

Annette Becker
Researcher, ZEW - Leibniz Centre for European Economic Research

This topic as you gave it, does that relate to the prices? Because earlier this year-

Operator

[Non-English content]

Annette Becker
Researcher, ZEW - Leibniz Centre for European Economic Research

[Non-English content]

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Okay, [Non-English content]

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Annette Becker
Researcher, ZEW - Leibniz Centre for European Economic Research

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Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

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Operator

We have another question if you want to take the time for that question.

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

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Operator

Okay, sure. We are now in the English Channel again and we have a next question from Semiconductor Energy Intelligence. Your line is now open.

Speaker 9

Hi, good morning. Apologies if I repeat a question that was asked in German. But I wanted to ask: Is Uniper or would Uniper consider any legal action against the German government or the European Commission if Nord Stream 2 is blocked indefinitely or if it's not allowed to continue operating? That's one question. My second question is: How do you see the German supply picture if Nord Stream 2 is indefinitely not allowed to operate? My third and last question is: You mentioned that under the right conditions Uniper would be interested in investing 2 GW in gas capacity. Could you be a bit more specific what those right conditions would be? Thank you.

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Okay. Let me start with your last question on new build on gas-fired power stations. I think we try to be clear in public, but also in our conversations with German government on that we think from our end that it would be not sufficient to just rely on wholesale prices as an incentive enough to us to make a decision on additional new build of gas-fired power stations. That is something that no one should please expect. Reason for that is not only that we are in a volatile price environment, but also because we have ongoing discussions about how long you could then operate a natural gas-fired power station going forward and how long you would have the permission to do so.

Hence, we would need any kind of framework that would provide for an attractive incentive in order to make decisions from our end. If I may add, I take away from discussions in the sector and with peers that there is not a single competitor to us having a different view and saying, "Well, that's sufficient. We will just rely on wholesale prices and make a decision on additional gas-fired units in Germany." So that's number one. Or that was your third question. Then you were indeed, you don't have to apologize, but indeed, you were referring to that question of whether we consider any legal action based on what's happening around Nord Stream 2.

Just wanted to point out that we are not equity investors into Nord Stream 2. I would believe that if anyone would consider legal actions against German government or the EU Commission, it would be Nord Stream 2, the legal entity, Nord Stream 2 by themselves, and not us being basically a financial investor. I don't have any reason to believe that they are considering such kind of action, but that is certainly a question that the responsible managers on the Nord Stream 2 AG have to look into and understand whether they would like to take such kind of step.

Your second question was around how would that situation look like if Nord Stream 2 would not be COD'd and if that was not made available for supplying gas to Europe. Well, I think what's fair to say is that the gas supply situation would then strongly depend on pipelines through Poland, through the Ukraine, and the availability of additional transport capacity, and the willingness of Russian gas suppliers to use that transport capacities into the European market. We have seen in recent years that in terms of capacity, those transmission lines are sufficient, but it's obviously not only a technical question for the gas supply situation in Europe and in Germany.

Operator

Hopefully your questions are answered. I assume they are. At the moment, we have no further questions, so I would like to hand back to Mr. Maubach for some closing remarks.

Klaus-Dieter Maubach
CEO, Uniper

Well, thank you for joining us. Apologies that this was a little tricky, in particular if we had tried to use our German channel. I think we have to kind of again consider how we deal with that going forward. Thanks for joining us, and thanks for your questions. I understand there are a number of questions that you have, and we have only limited answers, but that's obviously a very dynamic situation, which we are right now. I would dare to predict that this will stay to be a very dynamic situation going forward around prices and also around what's happening on the Russian-Ukrainian border and what kind of impact it will have on our businesses. So, let's stay in touch. Thanks for joining. Thank you.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for your attendance. This conference has been concluded. You may disconnect.

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