Thank you. Good afternoon, everybody. Welcome, and thank you for joining our nine-month Q3 earnings call. With me in the room is Michael Bülter, our CFO, and Julia Haßelbach, who is responsible for coordinating our IR activities. This morning we have announced our nine-month and Q3 numbers. What you see is basically the second half year of 2023 slows down our remarkable track record in terms of growth. Top line on par to last year, for the year-to-date numbers and reduced growth for our results, though we are able to grow our results and also remain well in our brackets, well above 17% EBITDA ratio. As you know, this time of the year, we are very busy with the year-end activities, I might say.
But this year, I must say, we are always like always in these phases of, you know, market constraints, we are preparing also to become stronger and use the momentum of market contraction to prepare for an even stronger catch-up. Typically, we don't do Q3 calls, but we felt for a couple of reasons that this is important to do. Most importantly, Q3 fell behind our track record, and we want to show faith and transparency to this situation. It's very nice to present always good numbers, and I think we have done so for the last quarters. But when business gets a little rougher, we believe temporarily, yeah, it is good also to be transparent and to communicate. This is how we work with our business partners, and we also like to do that with our investment community.
Second reason is that we are well ahead in the planning for 2024, and we want to update you, especially in this current market environment. We have initially guided for a EUR 200 million target, organically, for next year. We want to update you on that, but especially also confirm that our profitability ambition remains on a EUR 200 million level. We'll come to that later. For a third reason, we want to update you on our midterm guidance, which has to do with the second point I just mentioned. We wanted to hold a Capital Market Day, and we found a lot of arguments to do it, but finally decided not to do it and move it to half year one.
So today, we still want to update you on this midterm guidance. Not able to go in too many details, but the main message is we remain ambitious with the top line double-digit growth line and raise EBITDA margin to 17%-21%, based on an even more stringent execution of our strategic and operational roadmap. So overall, we are convinced to see a short temporary market dip because that's what we see. But we believe that the business and the position we're in, our megatrends are healthy. The new topic, AI and artificial intelligence, will continue to offer great opportunities. We believe we are well prepared to tackle them in exciting markets with our technology portfolio and business model that delivers attractive margins.
The first two slides you know well, we have added artificial intelligence. I will come to that later in the presentation. As a strong driver, I think there's no doubt today that AI will revolutionize a lot of our businesses, and also gives us great opportunity. Now, I will explain how and how we see that later in my presentation. Second slide, really, showing where we are present. I think that I don't need to go through all of that. I'm sure you will come up with some questions on specific market developments, but I don't wanna get hold up on that right now. So as a summary, yeah, we deliver strong results on a strategic transformation that the company goes through.
Yes, we see a slowdown in revenue. Michael will talk about the numbers, but the growth, especially on the EBITDA line, despite the one-off effects which we have this year, is still positive. We don't normalize results or adjust results. We just wanted to show you here the underlying operational profitability of our business and also the growth of the underlying operational business, which is close to 13%, in terms of profitability, which, I think, in this circumstance, is quite remarkable. We deliver on gross margin.
I believe that last year we had you know we said that we are very healthy in this in that in this aspect, and I think this year we could show that we have a pricing power in the market and that we are able basically to really create value for our customers and get paid for it. Our operational cash flow generation is, I believe, also very well. We have looked at our working capital, and I know that some of you look at this very specifically. I think we have some good news on that side. Leading really to, I believe, a good trend in our earnings per share of EUR 1.77.
I think that we can also, in this market circumstances, show that our business model is really scalable. Our cost ratio of, twenty, almost 22%, below two, 22% , normalized just above 20%, I think is great. It shows that we are really having worked a lot in getting that done. And especially our sales per FTE, I think is a quite remarkable number. Today, I said, earlier that we are preparing for more. We are prepared for more. I think all the initiatives which we have announced, earlier this year on our roadmap are implemented, and so we really feel well prepared.
For the business to come back, for further growth and also further efficiency measures, which also leads to our raise of our midterm guidance, EBITDA bracket. Outlook for the year, unfortunately, we see Q4 not strong. That was something which wasn't that clear in the summer, but we confirm our adjusted outlook of minus, here it said four, but it's 3%-7% decline. And then, we still believe that the range of 15%-90% is achievable this year with the guidance we have given. Michael will talk about this in more detail. Again, our ambition level is double-digit growth. 2026 is a year which we feel is a good horizon.
Everybody will ask you, "How do you, how do you know what's happening next year, and how do you know what's happening the year after?" But I think for us, it's important to have a clear vision where we want to head, and we believe that this is something which is well prepared for. Again, also in the profitability rates of our bandwidth for the EBITDA. We have added also a dividend payout policy, if you say ratio, which we will also talk about later. You know me, and I always like to talk about market. I repeat here the slides from the half year earnings call.
On the left side, basically, VDMA, European business climate numbers, and machine vision indices. I think what we see is that the assessment on the upper left side, the assessment of order book levels is decreasing, unfortunately, quite substantially after the summer. We don't really see, you know, any improvement here. On the production expectation for the months ahead, we see in this report that there is a, you know, a slight upward trend. Though this is, I would say, yeah, not strong enough to really believe that we see really that this sluggish situation is going to end in the next weeks or even months.
That means that, on the lower left side, that we see that the shortage of material that is really, let's say, over. We also believe that the stocking effects that our customers are getting to an end, so that really the main driver for the market situation is a demand shortage. We believe to see some early indicators in early movers in the industry, like the semiconductors industry and others. So we believe that there is some positive signs, but not strong enough to be really optimistic in a very short-term view. On the right side, you see that the machine vision market itself, also, despite the fact that it has been very positive over the last, let's say, years, is currently also affected by that, especially the component side.
You heard me earlier talking about this, that, yeah, then on the component side, I think the main problem here is really the demand. There is quite some demand still on systems, but with the overstocking, that has not yet released the component suppliers from that sluggishness in the market. Talking about execution, in inside, you know, you can talk along about market, but I think you have... And that's what we do concentrate on, on our abilities and our, yeah, power to basically get things done. The green records here, rockets, should say that they, our initiatives have been listed and, yeah, are well, I believe, on the way. We have launched our SI MORE program for our service campaign.
We have built further portfolio and project opportunities, especially in very attractive markets, as you know, our non-industrial field, the battery business. You heard me speaking about that earlier. We have really organized us in a harmonized way, what we call internally now, One Initiatives. And our announcement to integrate further Infaimon under the brand and also under the processes of Stemmer is just another proof point for that. We've launched our digital offerings on our website and also expanded our offering in terms of own development and own offering throughout the year. So we feel that we have not lost time this year.
Actually, it was a year which we could really get our things done, and that really gives us good feeling that we are prepared well for the future. We are reshaping our image more and more. So we believe Stemmer Imaging is more. That's why we also call our campaign MORE. And we like to formulate that in the expression of a systems house, which Stemmer Imaging is the leading international systems house for machine vision technology. So what basically the message is that our services, starting from engineering services, operational services, own IP, and special solution applications around our distribution business of components, become really an inherent part of our proposition.
So that we are not adding services to our business, but that really the high-level engineering expertise in machine vision technology as a system house really is something which, yeah, is a holistic picture and not just an add-on to a distribution business. MORE program basically is for sure based on our strong, let's say, distribution DNA. We have organized ourselves to really excel in this and also drive efficiency in this area, while still taking the business to the next layer in digitalizing services. We have introduced the MORE program, and this is, I believe, having good feedback from the market on the engineering, on the operational services.
Won't go through all of that, but just give you here an indication of the elements of that, basically, and then leading also to our thermal imaging own IP. On our responsibility side, which is an inherent part also of our business culture. I can confirm, and you see this on the right lower side, that we have just been awarded again with the Silver Award of the EcoVadis for the year 2023. Just missed the gold standard here, but for us, it's important to stay also on top of these things and to basically, for the second time now, have a consistent progress in also our sustainability activity.
So overall, we are end-to-end organized, and that is really a very strong statement, I believe, to really capture the growth opportunities which are in the market, applications, and with our customers, new customers, and existing customers. With an extensive offering on the component service and solution sides, with a differentiated sales model and digitalized interaction, really are based on our One Manufacturing, One Tech initiatives, which are, I would say, you know, getting completed this year with operational excellence, and for sure, in our industry, very important, the modern IT backbone. Just to confirm that here, that is basically how we look now from also from a customer perspective, that especially international customers, multinational customers, basically see us as one company.
They can also track or get access to, let's say, the complete access of portfolio and capabilities of our company. That is really also the reason why we like to integrate now Infaimon to gain speed in addressing international markets and customers, being a harmonized company. We feel that this really adds value also to the Stemmer brand, and not have a diluted, let's say, a two-brand strategy, but really have a really stronger imaging Stemmer imaging brand recognition, and therefore, also speed and execution. Just to show our progress here on the website with our digitalization and the customer interaction, where we not only integrate the marketing automation, which is especially important for new customer attraction.
But also, how to deliver through the website with a modernized product catalog and really building an e-commerce platform, which for sure prepares us for the future, to drive conversion rates, to drive more satisfied customers, and at the end, hopefully, more customers. And with that, I hand over to to Michael.
Yeah. Thank you, Arne. Coming to our, the overview of our numbers for the first nine months of the year. And I have to say, it's, yeah, it has been nine months of mixed messages. We have achieved EUR 130 million in revenues, which is on par with the first nine months of 2022. But when you dig into this a bit deeper, you have a, first of all, mixed regional development. So in Germany, we are quite stable, so still 34% of our revenues are recorded in Germany, 66% in the regions, which is stable compared to the last year.
But when you go into this deeper, we see a strong development in Iberia and the U.K., where we have growth rates that are double-digit. And on the other hand, we show a weaker development, especially Switzerland and in France, where yeah, we also have significantly lower revenues than last year. Same accounts for the customer types. We see OEMs still above the line of last year. End users, which are quite stable compared to last year, and when we come to machine builders, these are reducing revenues compared to the last year. And when we look at our markets in machine vision, Artificial Vision, whereas the markets overall are also quite stable.
We have in artificial vision significant revenue increases in transport and medical, where we show over 30% revenue increase. Whereas on the other hand, food and agriculture has decreasing revenues. For machine vision, we have the strongest revenue growth in print and packaging and metrology, and this fits to the decline in revenues for machine builders. Factory automation was weakening in the first nine months, 2023. Strong gross margin above 39%, 39.2% for the first nine months. And we also expect this to be the case for the full year.
I will dig into this, into stock valuation topics in a moment, but here we see very strong development and also see this for the next couple of months. As Anna said before, our organization is very scalable. We are currently running at a cost ratio of 21.6%. This is above full year 2022, but as said, we had normalization effects for the integration of Infaimon. So the operational cost ratio currently is at 20.5%, and we also expect the cost ratio to be in this range for the full year. As I said, we show pretty stable distribution between our distribution solution segment.
We also see good gross margins for both segments, for the first nine months and also for both of those segments, increases in gross margin compared to the first nine months of last year. I also already touched on the regional development. As said, U.K. and Iberia are strong, Switzerland, Netherlands, and France with decreasing revenues. So how does this trickle down for the Q3? Yeah, what we have seen, order intake was weak, with EUR 30 million, compared to a strong Q3 2022, with EUR 38 million. We have seen that it simply takes longer for our customers to destock their high inventory levels, and of course, we also all see recessional effects.
But as Anna said, we expect or we see, for example, for the semiconductor space, that there are first positive signs, in terms of destocking. Our revenues down by close to 15%, 14.8%. Nevertheless, we record a strong gross margin of 38.4% compared to 73.3% in the last year. This is mainly because of our mix in U.S. dollar, euro conversion rate, a bit below the first two quarters of this year. Also, we had slight devaluation effects of inventory. I will touch on the reduction of our inventory, of EUR 3.2 million since the beginning, in a moment.
But what we see is that despite devaluation over the full year of roughly EUR 500,000, we show very strong gross margins, which shows that we are able to keep our prices, keep our pricing, and also shows the success of our value-added services. When we come to our operational personnel costs, these have been decreased to EUR 5.3 million, compared to EUR 5.6 million, which is 6% down compared to last year, and only because of our one-time effects of EUR 1.2 million are above last year and amount of EUR 6.5 million. Operational expenses significantly below 2022 by EUR 1 million.
But I have to say that this is also positively influenced by FX effects, as well as our stringent receivables management, where we were able to book out devaluations of receivables. So we have a positive effect of EUR 500,000, around EUR 500,000, in terms of cost measures and the other half for FX and receivables management. EBITDA at EUR 5.7 million. When we look to the operational EBITDA, we are at EUR 6.9 million, so we achieve a return on sales, EBITDA margin of 19.9%. For the first nine months, pretty much the same picture. Orders below the strong first nine months, 2022. Revenue on par, strong gross margin at 39.2%.
We see that the gross margin is strong for distribution as well as solution. In distribution, we have a plus of between 1% and 2%, and same accounts for the solution segment. Personnel expenses reduced by 1.8%, for the normalized personnel cost and only Q1 one-time effect, they are above the previous year. Operational expenses decreased by EUR 0.4 million, and we see further decrease over the residual months of the rest of the year. As EBITDA, EUR 21.1 million, so we are at an EBITDA margin of 18.7%, well above last year's EBITDA margin of 18% or 18.2% for the full year.
Coming to our cash flow statement, we report a very strong cash flow from operating activities, EUR 15.8 million, which is, of course, mainly due to the strong net income and as well as our change in working capital, which is mainly influenced by the decrease in inventory of EUR 3.2 million. Yeah, for the rest of the cash flow statement, nothing special here compared to the first nine months of 2022. Besides our investments in the digitalization of our business model and dividend payment of EUR 19.5 million, so that we have a cash flow for the first nine months of close to -EUR 8 million compared to +EUR 0.5 million in the last.
Looking at our balance sheet, what's important here is the decrease, the significant decrease in our working capital ratio, which is amounting to 16.9%. Last year, we were amounting to 19.2%. And this is basically driven by the significant decrease in inventory by EUR 3.2 million, as well as the decrease in receivables by close to EUR 2 million. Net debt close to EUR 32 million minus EUR 1.9 million. So we have a net cash position of EUR 32 million. Equity ratio is strong, above last year at close to EUR 72 million, and we only have a residual portion of our bank loan for the acquisition of Infaimon back from 2019, which is amounting to EUR 2 million.
Since this is all in the current portion now, this will be repaid by the end of Q3 next year. Take an outlook for 2023, for the rest of this year and next year, we still see that in the current market environment, we have a slow order intake and also expect this for Q4, which causes top line contraction for the second half year this year. And we expect, as Arne said before, revenue decline of -3% to -7%. So we will see consolidated revenues of EUR 144 million-EUR 151 million by the end of the year.
We are still comfortable with the lower end of our EBITDA range of EUR 26 million-EUR 32 million, including the planned and announced one-offs in Q3 of EUR 1.2 million. Yeah, I was talking about mixed pictures before. We also see a mixed picture for 2024. We expect top line growth in, or top line in, in the first half year, 2024, to be quite similar to the second half year, 2023, with an above average catch-up effect in the second half year, 2024. This is our planning assumption, of course. There can be unforeseen circumstances, but nevertheless, this is where we are currently standing.
So we expect an upper single-digit growth of revenues for the next year, and we see ourselves comfortable at the upper end of our guided range of 15%-19%. Yeah, we are kind of holding word. We will not achieve the EUR 200 million of revenue next year and had to update or have to update our midterm guidance. But nevertheless, we target to be in the range of the current midterm guidance when it comes to the EBITDA. Now, with this, I hand over to Arne.
Thank you, Michael. Yeah, talking about midterm guidance. When we started 2019 to introduce the term Artificial Vision, I think nobody would have expected that, you know, with ChatGPT and all of that, we see a dramatic increase of concretization, I would say, that AI is really an additional and maybe the strongest driver also for our business. And I wanna talk a little bit about that and how we see that also influencing our way going forward. Basically, when you boil it down, machine vision provides the capability to capture and process visual data, and AI, at the end of the day, enhances the interpretation and understanding of this data.
So our focus on new markets, I think is really, yeah, I must say, gladly, confirmed by the fact that basically, machine vision and AI, if you put them together, enable more sophisticated applications and intelligent decision-making based on visual information, and that really drives a lot of new applications. We see this in logistics. Michael has said that, yeah, we see a first half year next year, not so strong, not only because of the market, but we also know some larger projects, and we were talking about major projects which we won in, for example, the logistics market, are really ramping up only in the second half of next year.
We're fully busy with this with that now, but we can really see that AI, machine vision, and our positioning in this field has really, I mean, we see that really picking up, and a lot of other applications coming the way. We believe the impact of that is really that the landscape of component suppliers will be more competitive, with new players coming into play from the artificial intelligence side, NVIDIA just being one. We feel that we are well prepared for that, because we have started very early to position us in this market and also find our way not to be basically stuck in, let's say, old concepts, but really attacking the new concepts, especially around connected, autonomous, digitization, electrification, circularity, and gamification applications.
We see, and maybe that's also an indication that Michael mentioned earlier, that the especially, machine builder, integrator, landscape has, decreased this year quite a bit. We see this really as a trend, and you heard us talking earlier on our focus on OEMs and end users, that this new technology ecosystems are much more deeply integrated and not so much, retrofitted through integrators. So we really believe that, that is a great opportunity for us to continuously show growth. So I believe we are at a point and, that the industry has to be rethought or that we, rethink the industry, and this, transformation, will be enabled. We are in the middle of this. I think we are well prepared with our offerings.
So we see no more new modular technology topologies, decentralized, miniaturized, connected, autonomous, and intelligent components. Really, basically on standards, not only from a machine vision, but also from communication. So we see a lot more wireless, Wi-Fi, cloud applications. You heard us talking about this, also over the last two, three years. And then new open source image libraries, with complete new AI vision software algorithms. So our focus not to invest in heavily, let's say, a complete software portfolio, but basically finding the way how to enable AI, I think pays out now. And that's what we see. We see that our offering today includes already mobile devices.
For sure, we will see also more mobile devices taking over some, let's say, machine vision applications, and you will see that in our portfolio. We believe that the image acquisition part remains a very strong footprint in this industry, and because that's not taken over by AI applications. So I believe our sweet spot in our software offering remains very strong in the market and factory and non-industrial automation with our offerings, and then especially the embedded technology proposition. When you bring it down, I think, this week has been perfect, really, in terms of taking that picture. We see that the paradigms of this industry are changing. We feel that machine vision is a fundamental part of the AI infrastructure.
As we provide vision data to AI, we are basically in the lower end of this, let's say, tech stack, you know, when you, when you look at what, what this, in or this ecosystem is all about, and we feel really we're well positioned. Why? Because we provide basically the enabling technology, AI enabling components, for AI and the subsystems. We support our customers with our proposition, in this journey, to save and de-risk development efforts, for energy and space efficient solutions. Energy becomes a complete, new topic in this field, and especially you talked, our embedded board is basically one of the key elements, is really to drive not only space efficient, but also energy solutions. And that, basically, this on a, on an optimized and reliable buying experience.
If you look at that, the truth is also the money is made in the infrastructure. I think we do not see overall data or even AI, let's say, algorithms and offerings in the market really being profitable. So Stemmer Imaging is a, let's say, reliable profitability business model also in this new world. At the end of the day, basically, we want to confirm that, yeah, also in this upcoming, let's say, industry opportunities, we're well positioned to with a business model and business proposition, which is proven, it's attractive, and will continue to deliver growth and returns through our strategic transformation. We provide the eyes for AI. I believe that's a very strong and suitable statement going forward. How do we look at that?
Basically, we heard about the baseline and the initial guidance for 2024. We believe that our transformation to be well prepared is well underway. Yes, I must say this systematic execution is very important. Four elements, really very strong. The offering, of course, as for the industrial and non-industrial markets, what we call Artificial Vision markets, basis, but then really the four elements with our value-added proposition, standardized, differentiated, cost-efficient value propositions for our customers, fitting really the needs of tomorrow. The further technology and region expansion, I believe that also is clear that our portfolio today looks completely different, and work on continues to change going forward.
The structure reduced transaction costs, for sure, the digitalization and automation of our own processes, but also the interaction with our customers play a big role. We have today a, what we call a, a service company within our structure, which we, want to transfer to a professional service hub organization. There's a lot of, let's say, conceptual thoughts about that, which will happen over the next period to be implemented, and for sure, needs more insight on your side. But basically, the main idea is to provide, at the end of the day, you know, more operational excellence and superior customer service. And then selected M&A activities. We're very close this year to conclude on a, on an acquisition. We carry also costs on that in our balance sheet, or in P&L, sorry.
But we didn't reach to an agreement because of price, let's say, differences. But we are very active in this field, and we believe that the time is right now to also execute that. So on our mid-term guidance, again, we see double-digit top-line growth. If you draw it back to 2022 or 2021, we believe that 2022 might not be a good basis here to compare it, but basically, we provide still the top-line growth of double-digit in the range above 10%-11%. So I believe that we remain firm on our growth top-line ambition.
Our EBITDA bandwidth, I think we have good reasoning to move that up, not only because of the current, let's say, performance, but really, we believe that our position is increasingly stronger in the market, seeing where we are today and what we have implemented so far. For sure, a continuous focus on operational cash flow generation. I think this is inherent to our business model and will continue to be in our focus. And then on the dividend payout policy, which we changed last year based on the, let's say, changed market circumstances, we're aiming to pay out 70% of our net earnings. This is not a fixed number, but above 70%, I think, is a good indication going forward.
Yeah, and with that, basically, we believe that we had important messages to convey, and happy to take your questions at this point of time.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, at this time, we'll begin the question -and -answer session for those joined by telephone. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star, followed by one on their touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star followed by two. If you're using speaker equipment today, please lift the handset before making your selections. Anyone who has a question may press star, followed by one at this time. Our first question comes from Robert-Jan van der Horst with Warburg Research. Please go ahead.
Hi, thanks for taking my question. So I have actually questions on the updated midterm targets, not so much on the margin, since you're kind of already there. But regarding the top line, we've talked about and you've just mentioned some attractive and also larger M&A targets. So are these already part of the guidance, or is this still a mainly organic target? And also, kind of in relation to that, the high targeted dividend payout ratio.
So I mean, I'm well aware that you've been very strong on cash generation recently, but considering kind of the hopefully also in the for private companies declining transaction prices or more attractive multiples, how does it fit together that there is a lot of opportunity on the one hand, but on the other hand, you're kind of paying out cash that you could very well use to maybe acquire attractive target?
Yeah, thank you. On the first question, we have factored in about EUR 30 million in this top line ambition for 2026. We are also looking at larger acquisition targets, but you know, as you know, being more conservative, we feel comfortable with that, with that number. Clearly focused on, again, regional expansion, especially North America, technology and getting market access. On the second question, dividend payout, I understand. I think we might need an asterisk here, in the sense that, you know, obviously, if we have good reason not to pay that out, and that is in the interest of also our shareholders, then obviously we will explain that.
But, at the end of the day, we feel that, also this year, and you saw that, that we basically regained the dividend payout this year, pretty much, almost throughout the year. And, that, also our debt leverage is basically zero. So, basically, we see enough headroom to tackle that. Again, this depends then on the concrete situation. We're also not shy of going in case we have a specific situation, an acquisition target into the market and say, you know, what are alternatives in that sense? For sure, the share buyback was not- is not an option.
I think we stayed firm on that for this time, and so basically say, you know, if we need more money for a more accelerated acquisition pipeline realization, then either debt or capital raise would be an option for us.
Okay, perfect. Those are helpful. Thanks.
Our next question comes from Lasse Stüben with Berenberg. Please go ahead.
Hi, good afternoon. I think with the Q2 call, your communication on sort of end market demand was that your customers were giving you indications that, you know, they would start ordering again in Q4. Like, I suppose obviously that's changed now. So I'm just wondering, how are those conversations developing now, and what gives you, you know, comfort, you know, potentially headed into next year and also H2 2024, that that recovery will take place? Thank you.
Yeah, again, I think coming out early this, today on the 2024, let's say, outlook, is basically what, what we see right now. Again, I think, we have done a very in-depth analysis of, of market situation, just before the summer. Again, this has turned out not to, to be valid. I think everybody of you knows how the last six months looked like, and I think that we are not, I think, mistaken in, in taking a good view, also making our statement, but being careful of, of saying, you know, that, that, we will then, basically not, deliver, especially on the results side. So I think that we have been cautious on the results side.
Therefore, I think we have not, yeah, or we're not mistaken in any, let's say, strategic decision to jeopardize our result targets. At the moment, again, Michael mentioned it, we see some early signs on the semiconductor side. We know that, you know, that's the early kind of start in the value chain of our business. We talk to customers who still are confident, especially on the OEM and end user side, contracts which we are winning.
You know, when I cannot share that number today, but I heard today the amount of business which only this one logistic customer, which I said will probably be the largest one next year, what amount of business they will do over the next two years. This is a very promising number, and they will start in or the rollout will happen in the second half of next year. So we see that a lot of our customers out there, at this point of time, starting for more substantial rollout in the second half of next year.
And so that's why we think that there is a realistic and the most likely scenario, if you might call it, at this point of time, that we see a stronger, and we call it above market average, catch-up effect in the second half, than the first half year. I also want to recall that in our industry, this has happened over the last three major crises, Corona, Euro crisis, and financial crisis, that we saw a very late dip in cameras from a market perspective, and I think we confirmed that this year, this time as well. But we saw a very steep increase just after.
And so that we believe that this temporary effect is something which will not be, you know, very long in that term, because camera imaging drops into this market or is detected by these market situations very late, and is basically able to also capture getting out of it very early growth path. Again, nobody knows exactly. That's the scenario, and I think that's also how we formulated that. That is our planning assumption. And for sure, when we give our guidance for the full year with our annual report, this will be updated. Hopefully, we have even better news because we are not getting excited about, you know, single-digit growth pipeline next year.
But that's what it is, and we are facing that situation. I think in a professional, but also very ambitious way going forward, keeping also our results very much in close, let's say, eyesight.
Great. Thanks very much.
Our next question comes from Tim Wunderlich with HAIB. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thanks so much for taking my question. It's once again on M&A. It's the question is if we could still expect an M&A deal to close this year, so in the course of Q4, or alternatively, in Q1 2024. So what I'm really getting at this, what does your M&A pipeline look like? You talked about one bigger target. You were in discussions, this didn't work out. I mean, how far along are you with some other potential targets? Thank you.
Yeah, thanks, Tim. Again, M&A is always, I think, the most difficult art. First of all, I would like to say that we always said that, the Champions League for us is organic growth. That's where we believe really the main value creation has to come from. We know that our industry, the buy and build, with the positioning and transformation of our positioning, has changed a little bit.
We're more careful of not diluting our proposition or our value proposition. But I want to respond to your question is that, yeah, there is a likelihood that it can be in Q1. I don't see any really chance for this year, still. But I would say first half year, we should see some, at least that's the pipeline right now, we should see positive signs. And again, with all the risks M&A deals have, but we are well ahead in having not only identified, but in detailed discussions with targets pretty much in two segments, regional expansion and also technology expansion. So both areas seem to be head-to-head. Let's see who wins, let's say, the first one.
Okay, thank you. The EUR 30 million revenue that you said is M&A-based revenue, that you said is included in the midterm guidance. I mean, is that one target or two targets or three targets? What, how should we think about this?
Yeah, as Arne said earlier, we are looking at smaller and bigger targets, but I generally would say expect this to be yeah, 1 to a maximum of 3 targets, not more.
Okay, thank you. And then my last question, I mean, you had one-off expenses in Q3, which related to the integration of an M&A target. What about further efficiency and restructuring measures? Could we expect additional one-off expenses in the coming months? I mean, you hinted that you are still looking into—you're still looking at some measures. Maybe a bit more color on potential further one-off expenses would be appreciated. Thank you.
Yeah, so currently, we don't see further one-off expenses over the next couple of months. What we see is that we will, yeah, put a large effort in the digitalization and automation of processes. So when it comes to really efficiency measures and leveraging our EBITDA margin, this will come mainly through, yeah, digitalization, automation, and really efficiency of the organization.
Okay, got it. Thank you so much.
On my side, just this, Arne, you know, I think over the last years, we have shown how we do that. Basically, we have refocused our organization on new things. So we have hired people also carrying that know-how and expertise. And this year's one-off effect have to do with the strong situation in Infaimon to basically complete the manufacturing and associated elements. So going forward, we don't see that structural kind of further innovation one-off, but basically you know an underproportional growth of personnel cost or operational cost to the top line growth. So I think that that's really where the efficiency is.
Understood. Thank you so much.
Ladies and gentlemen, if you would like to ask a question, please press star followed by one on your telephone. Looks like we have no further questions at this time, so I hand back to Mr. Arne Dehn for closing comments. Please, go ahead.
Yeah, thanks, everybody, for joining in. I hope that this was helpful for you to see where Stemmer Imaging at this point of time is. I hope that we could convey that we're not only busy with the operational, you know, things going on in, in-- at this point of time, especially of the year, but that we are well advanced in, in our planning going forward. I think we adjusted well to the situation currently, but also what are the opportunities and how to tackle them. We realize that the Capital Market Day is something which we have promised, and we will not fall short to also deliver that. Hopefully, you appreciate also that, that delay.
Again, we'll be present at investor conferences shortly, and then expect basically more follow-up on that starting the year. And with that, I thank you for your audience and attention and wish you a good day further on. Thank you very much.