Wow, good to see all of you here. Good afternoon, and welcome all of you online and on site to Detection Technology Capital Markets Day 2025. We truly appreciate your presence and commitment to learn about our journey and future. My name is Hannu Martola, I'm the President and CEO since 2007, and I'm really pleased to lead you in scanning into our business, technologies, and markets. Today is about transparency, sharing our strategy, and demonstrating how we create long-term value to our shareholders. We will start with a presentation by Nordea's Chief Economist, Tuuli Koivu, and she will be scanning Asia's role in the world economy.
I will outline just recently published DT 2030 strategy and its execution, and then further we'll scan through the medical markets, have an insight into the security and industrial markets, further focus on DT's technology and innovation through manufacturing footprint and supply chain, and financials at the end. I will come back on stage, we'll conclude, summarize, and then we will have a joint Q&A. Before we dive in, here's the small print. The full DT management team is present here, all eight of us, and I would like to introduce them to you. Please come to the stage. We are all excited to show you how our innovation and discipline execution positions us for growth through presentations and answering the questions.
I'd like to start with first, there's Chen Wu, President of APAC, Arve Lukander, President for EMEA and Americas, Jyrki Still, our Chief Technology Officer, Kai Utela, Vice President for Operations, Matti Nylander, Chief Financial Officer, Sari Holopainen, Vice President for People and Culture, and last but not least, Juha Talasmäki, Vice President for Business Development. Thank you. Our keynote speaker today is Nordea's Chief Economist, Tuuli Koivu, and she will share us insights of Asia's fundamental role to the future of the world economy. Welcome to the stage, Tuuli.
Thank you, Hannu, thank you, DT, for inviting me here. It's a great pleasure to give a short overview about Asia's, but actually China's outlook, how I see it, after having been following more than 20 years of this very interesting economy. Let's start with what we already know. China has been rising very rapidly to the top of the world economy. It's now one of the biggest economies, but on the other hand, since COVID, development has been quite sluggish. As we can notice from the left-hand side graph, actually the comparison between the U.S. and the Chinese economy has not been that simple as we thought 10 years ago, and China's GDP has not, especially in U.S. dollar terms, increased to the pace as we expected. On the other hand, we cannot get rid of China, definitely not. China is the world factory as we all know it.
It has been very successful in increasing its exports, but we also know, of course, that many supply chains, most of them in the world, related to high tech, related to goods supply, are somehow related to China, either at the raw material level or at the final stage. Certainly China's role in the world economy is really key. How do I see China's development? First in the short term and then in a bit longer perspective. Let's start from the short term. Chinese economy is extremely interesting. It always is, it has always been like that, but at the same time, it's extremely difficult to put that huge economy and country into one picture. I would say that at the moment, the sectoral differences are exceptionally large.
Even more than ever, it's kind of difficult to talk about China as one economy when we know that it's so much diversified, many sectors doing very differently at the moment. If we start from the weak point, that's anything basically related to consumers, households, and housing markets, of course. Everything related and tied together, as we all know. On the left-hand side graph, we see that China's consumer confidence never recovered from COVID shock, basically, and Shanghai lockdowns in the spring 2022. Severe hit to confidence at the grassroots level, how people feel about Beijing, how they feel about their country, and especially how they feel about their personal economy. It's much more difficult now to find a new job. Wage increases have clearly slowed down. Environment is much more challenging. They are not getting soon back to where it all started.
One of the biggest hits for the households, of course, stemming from the housing market. China built too many apartments. Nobody knows exactly how much too many, but still, there is still a lot of overcapacity. Vacancy rates are low, etc, etc. There's really a lot of overcapacity in the housing market. We expected the housing market to start stabilizing or at least show some signs of stabilization in 2025, but actually what happened during the summertime was that all indicators started to decline again. Price declines resumed. At the same time, housing starts hit new low records, et c . None of the people that I know in China is planning to buy an apartment, neither for his own or her own purpose, or even less so if it's about an investment.
This certainly creates a huge challenge for Chinese households and consumption going forward because we know that most of household wealth is invested into houses. Not just invested, but also their dreams were built on rising apartment prices and housing, basically an apartment with a good location was your pension fund. It was your fund for your kids' education, et c . Now those days are gone. The whole environment has changed. This is part of the reasons why Chinese households are saving a lot, high share of their income. They do not want to consume. They are much more cautious when it comes to their consumption. It is very difficult to see these trends turn around anytime soon.
At the same time, I would say that it's a huge mistake to stop there and think that, okay, GDP numbers are probably overstated, as for example, Financial Times is rightly saying today, because at the same time we see sectors that really are booming, new innovations, new technologies. I visited China last time in March, and I think this was really the biggest reason for people to be much more optimistic than they were in autumn 2023 when I visited many cities the previous time. China is investing really a lot when it comes to high tech. This is really like a growth boom. This is an innovation boom. Of course, from a European perspective, this creates a lot of competition in the world market, and China seems to be very successful, very competitive at the moment.
On the left-hand side, just as one of examples, if everything turning south, basically when it's about housing or consumption, high tech is not looking like that. High tech curves are something like this, production multiplied in a few years' time, et c . Also, exports are booming. China's competitiveness is now at a higher level than for many, many years due to weak currency, but also due to deflation that has kept wages down, kept all kinds of production costs down. I meet regularly now Nordic retail chain companies, which have actually concentrated their supply chains more and more to China during this year because they see prices declining and they see it again easy to buy from China. At the moment, the sectoral differences are really huge.
At the same time, we see problems in the housing market, problems when it comes to consumption, but then booming high tech, booming innovations, a lot of investments into these industries, and of course, really ambitious government and leaders taking China to the next level. When it comes to China's next level, let's figure out how it could look like in five years' time or so. It's impossible, of course, to forecast how China will develop, but I think it's useful to spend some time to think about China in kind of cycles. They do it themselves.
They are now writing and finalizing the new five-year plan, and I think it also gives us a kind of a nice framework to how to think about China, how they see their country changing, how they see their economy changing, and how they try to especially tackle these huge challenges that we all know do exist in Chinese society and in the Chinese economy. If I take two of the most kind of urgent or impactful, perhaps I should say impactful problems in the Chinese economy, I would say that those are the high level of debt and then again the demographic problem. When we look at the left-hand side graph, the red line is China. We are used to high level of debt both in China and here in the Western countries, of course, and we have become more and more tolerant about high levels of debt.
We discussed about the U.S. deficits, et c, but to be honest, of course, the upward trends have existed in almost all developed economies for many years. China, of course, is the exception. In China, if we look at the red line, the level of debt has increased at a very rapid pace. What has happened since the pandemic is not kind of stabilization as we have seen in many developed economies, quite vice versa, the debt problem has only increased. We all know that most of the debt in China is concentrated in the companies, corporate sector, in state-owned companies. It's partly hidden, but there's certainly no way around this problem. I don't expect any kind of debt crisis in China. They are not dependent on foreign currency debt. Most of the money, practically all of it, is domestic.
It doesn't have to go via crisis, but certainly it's not kind of logical to think that they could start booming the economy by just printing more money easily and distributing it to the households. The second challenge that they have is regarding their population. This is not a kind of urgent problem, just like in the housing markets. It's one of these gray rhinos that the president is talking about. They know that they do exist. They do anything they can to solve this, but it won't go away for many, many years to come. I heard yesterday rumors that the new statistics that have not, of course, been published yet for 2025 shows that the number of births has declined to close to 7 million. And this, of course, is a dramatic decline when we think about China's demographics.
It doesn't matter for next year's growth or next five years' growth how many births there are this year in China, but certainly this also is part of the problem. People do not trust. They don't invest into their future so much because they are more risk-averse than they used to. When it comes to China's labor force, it starts really declining in 2035. It has been declining already for 10 years or so. It will continue doing so, but it's not dramatic. By raising pension age, etc, China can overcome most of this problem. In 2035, things turn much more challenging than the declining labor force starts to be quite dramatic. How is China then aiming to answer to these two problems in their next five-year plan? This is my last slide, and I will concentrate a little bit on this new five-year plan.
The new five-year plan will be published only in March. It has to go through the National People's Congress. Now the party heads have been decided about it. It has given its recommendations to the stateside, and we basically have an idea of how China sees its next five years, how does it see the world, etc. There are many things that have changed. Even if it's really, I guarantee you, it's a kind of annoying to read lists of promises. We will do this and that, and they promise basically everything. I really recommend everybody to read it. It still gives an overview of how China sees the world. Especially if you still have energy after doing that, please read also the fourth plan so that you can make some comparison and see how the plans have changed.
I think the most important changes that I have recognized so far are partly related to how China sees the world around it and how China sees its own role inside the world. I think that will have a huge impact also on us here in Europe, but also on many companies operating in China. They, first of all, see the world as a more complex place, I would say, a bit more risky place than they did five years ago. They have noticed the world around them changing. Nobody basically being a driving force for free trade. And China is also giving up those kinds of ideas. Actually, what happens now, if these current versions continue to exist in the final format, then when they five years ago promised to lower the tariffs, now what they are aiming to do is to prepare more tools for export restrictions.
This is certainly something that we all need to pay attention to, of course. They will continue to open their economies and sectors, but that is mainly based on their own terms. China has been always doing that. They have wanted to pick up the winners. They have been very selective with sectors they open up, but I think it will become even kind of a more serious process this time. They just want to have the highest standards investments, and they will be really picky when it comes to foreign companies that are allowed to operate there. There won't be that many changes in industrial policy. They continue to invest a lot in high tech. This is, of course, partly a reply to the problem that they see in the labor force.
If you have less and less labor force, you need to have high productivity in order to grow by more than 4% per year, as it seems to be still their target until 2035. We can then discuss, of course, whether 4% is a realistic target, but anyway, the level of ambition is still extremely high. Regarding the growth model, which is also, of course, very important, everybody has been waiting for words, promises regarding more stimulus to households. Yes, the new five-year plan will pay even more attention to consumption than the previous plan. At the same time, it clearly kind of aims to establish a self-enforcing process in the household sector, which could then carry itself on and on in order to grow and be an engine for China's GDP growth.
Whether they will be successful, I think that will depend a lot on the labor market. They need to increase people's purchasing power, not by subsidies, but by increasing wages, increasing probably the share of wages in the economy. Now they promise also to increase the share of consumption in the economy. This is a huge challenge. China has not been successful in achieving this for many years. They have been talking about this. Now I would say that the words are stronger than they were last time, but it remains to be seen how much emphasis they will have on here. I think it's easier to say that the first two goals regarding foreign trade and investment policy, as well as the industrial policy, are kind of easier to fulfill than the last overhaul of the whole economy. What does this then imply for China's growth?
In the short term, I recommend not to believe the 5% growth numbers. They continue to publish those. Those are domestically important. It's very difficult to not keep your promises in China. Please, at the same time, notice also the huge sectoral differences. This makes and will make China a very complex environment for all of us. We need to really be careful when we think about our own operations there, our own opportunities, but perhaps also risks and challenges. One thing is clear, even in five years' time, and I think that is thinking about the world without China would be a huge mistake. Thank you.
Thank you, Tuuli. We have just published Detection Technology's 2030 Strategy. Together with my colleagues, we will get deeper into the world of X-ray, into the deepest exciting world of scanning for growth.
We are the most trusted partner imaging the unknown. We are the eyes for the X-ray equipment serving the OEMs, the big original equipment manufacturers. By the way, due to the laws of physics, X-ray is the only means for penetrating through and selectively penetrating into the objects of human scale. There is no substitute. This is the basis then for X-ray imaging. We work in the areas for medical, security, and industrial, all the markets with all the technologies now for X-ray imaging. We are a data company. A huge amount of data daily is created by our detectors. This data is a massive asset for our future. We are one-stop shopping for all kinds of detector needs.
We have CT detectors for medical and security, line scan detectors, flat panel detectors now, like this Jumbo over there, photon counting detectors up and coming, and more and more now software and services. The biggest customers we have actually have a need for various technologies. As what we're very proud of, GE Healthcare, who has selected us as the supplier of the year, I mean, they need detectors for computed tomography, but as well, they need flat panel detectors for surgical imaging or for oncology, for cancer. It is very important that we have now the full set of products to our big customers. In the big picture, we have estimated that with our products, 2 billion scans are done daily. So far, close to 10 million products have been shipped out, out of which 2 million, the most demanding computed tomography detectors.
More than 10 of the Fortune 500 companies are customers and more than 500 global brands. Looking a little bit back, the growth for the last strategy period from 2021 - 2025 was about 4%, but still clearly exceeding the 1% market growth that we have estimated. By the way, this 1% market growth, it's more probable that it would be actually the market growth, it would have been less than more. Due to the various issues, first we had the COVID, then from that we had the supply chain shortages. We have seen for even a longer period a generic China security market, the market decrease because of two things. One, the volume has been less because there's less need investment, plus the prices have been coming down. China medical reform a couple of years ago, that's now passed but still affects.
Then the huge price war that also Tuuli was explaining. It's really tough to compete, but I think that's good news. That's good news because we get better when we survive and learn. Then the latest, Trump was selected in January, we had these tariff issues and then also currency. As basis here, I'm using for 2025 actually the analyst consensus, but then we have corrected it with comparable currencies. Also looking at 2024, now looking after, we believe that there's also some stock building took place in the second half of 2024. The 2025 bar should be slightly higher from that point of view. Of course, then the 2024 slightly lower. Very critical for us actually is this Haobo acquisition that we performed in 2023. That has provided us doubling the addressable market.
We have now the vast EUR 1.5 billion flat panel market ahead of us, conquering the world as is part of our strategy. Another interesting area for future is moving downstream, still supporting our customers, but with more subsystem, more software integrated products. We have our learnings and we have adapted. Regarding risks, there are various risks, but by far number one now is geopolitics. The core challenge for a company like us, a small company in the global market, is how to navigate through these speeding up challenges and obstacles in the geopolitical turmoil. On the other hand, I mean, we serve in all the markets. I mean, we are in China, we are in Europe, in Finland, we are in India now. We have, by the way, the grand opening of India factory in December. Also, we have our foot in the U.S..
As a small agile company, we have much better and easier to navigate in these conditions. We are at a great position to capture on opportunities. We estimate now the X-ray digital imaging detector market to be EUR 3 billion in 2030. We thought, by the way, that this EUR 3 billion would have been already this year 2025, but due to these challenges and so on, I was explaining the market growth. This EUR 3 billion takes place in 2030. This is also verified from various sources. The big drivers for the market are the steadily growing aging population all over, except Africa, by the way. Various security concerns we see. Quality and efficiency needs. Also, this Jumbo will be used in the high-level NDT type of applications.
Environmental and sustainability issues are still with us, a severe topic that needs to be addressed that drives our business too, as an example of sorting of waste. Incoming more and more, Mother Earth is getting poor on minerals. There will be shortages of everything. That is a big driver for use of X-ray. All of these, by the way, are driven by the developing digitalization and AI. For AI, what you need, you need data. The markets are developed. If you look on the left side, we see there by application, actually about 75% are healthcare driven. That is healthcare plus veterinarian. Veterinarian is small, but it is very same products, but without government sort of regulatory approvals. Then about 25% is Detection Technology's bread and butter, line and CT scan, where we have been and are market leader.
By technology, on the right side ring, we see there the biggest is TFT plus CMOS, similar. That's about 60% market. This is now the vast opportunity for us to find new also pockets where we can help our customers and do good business. About one third of the markets by technology are line scan and CT, and very much for industrial and security. There is a small slice on photon counting, which is up and coming, and Jyrki Still, our CTO, will be a little bit telling us what's there about. By the way, there's interesting, there's still, as a sign of how slow this kind of technology is developing, there's still film-based X-ray as a very small, tiny 4%, which is used in the developed world. This is the full sort of focus that we are heading to.
As next, I want to explain our strategic target. We target to outgrow the market by driving customer success with smart data-generating X-ray detectors and outstanding usability. We estimate, after all that's taking place, the market to grow forward at about rate 3%. We have stated us a very tough target of tripling that in our growth. The growth target is 10%. The means to reach the target is developing easy-to-use detectors and services together with the core customers and clearly adding value then to their needs. This data from our superior hardware is then further conditioned through software. These are then the cornerstones, our detectors and business. The decisive factor is in our products and services, simplicity and usability. The key foundational thing is how we interact with our customers. This is our technological sweet spot.
We are not a huge company having possibility to spend hundreds of millions into fundamental research. But we are a company that spends enough into research and development, learning the technologies so that we can help our customers to adapt. Our biggest success case was actually when we were already in the medical CT and we saw the need for the security world, security companies to move into computed tomography. And we as a first mover then, we took the pole position and became the market leader there. So we help customers to adopt emerging technology or the mature technology with a twist. How we then position ourselves strategically. The three generic value disciplines are mentioned to be cost leadership, or technology leadership, or customer excellence. So we are positioning and will be positioning us as a company with superior customer excellence.
Our trusted position requires understanding the customer's needs and having the capability to serve them flexibly. I think very good proof of this customer success is the supplier award we have just received from GE Healthcare. DT was selected among thousands of suppliers, among, by the way, EUR 10 billion spent as the number one supplier for GE Healthcare. If looking back five years, I mean, in our customer surveys, our average score is 4.4. That is with a scale from 1 - 5. Net Promoter Score in the last survey was 70. For a B2B company, that is really top world class. I was, by the way, looking a little bit from AI, but Apple had 61, but this is according to AI. I checked both also ChatGPT and Copilot both. Seventy is some kind of number.
We are not pleased we can be better, but that's a good basis. The foundational elements in our strategy are improving our performance, improving the performance culture, and relentlessly developing the working with our customer. These are the two foundational layers there: elevate performance culture, being the most trusted partner, driving customer success through exceptional usability. We have four pillars. The first pillar is base. This base is relentlessly developing everything we are working with: our production services, our sales work, our speed to develop new products and better technology, productivity in our production supply chain. TFTs play a really important role in our strategy. This is the second and the most important growth part of our strategy. We are looking and we are moving into conquering the world with our TFT products. We have just, by the way, launched 60 new products for TFT.
Looking this year, I think by the end of October, we have 60% growth on TFTs. That is a good start. This is just in China, an industrial market in China. Added value. As a hardware company stemming from, by the way, CERN, the Nuclear Institute of CERN, Detection Technology was developed in the early 1990s by three Finnish scientists in CERN. We have really rooted deep into the physics, electronics, and hardware. Now we are jumping up more to having also software layers. We are today already 20 people developing our firmware and software. We move forward downstream, adding more intelligence, more services into our products by seamlessly integrating hardware with software. To be able to help customers for future, we need to develop our technology further. This is the new tech part.
We are now investing to photon counting, but also we are exploring various software areas. As an example, we are eyes of the equipment. We see what is the health of the equipment. It could be fairly easy and natural for us to develop, as an example, for preventative maintenance software products. As a system, how we are leading this, we are using this OKR-based, which is, I think it's developed by Google, quarterly setting targets, dynamic targets that we are changing, reviewing them, and we call this system OnePlus QR for us. Every quarter we are dynamically, depending on how the environment is moving, how we are achieving our things, we are moving forward. This with a system of stretched targets. After learnings, we still hold on to our market growth, our company target growth of 10%, which is about triple of the market growth.
That is ambitious, but we are not limiting ourselves from, for example, M&A. The primary avenue is organic growth. Profitability target is 15% minimum EBITDA. Out of the net proceedings, 30%-60%, we then plan to return to our investors. How do we then achieve this? How do we achieve the 10% growth? Today, as I said, this is analyst consensus 101, 101 million for 2025 as a base number, corrected with the comparable currencies. Looking forward to 10% mathematically, we should be in 2030, EUR 170 million in revenue. Looking around, we believe that and have set as a target, out of the TFTs, we will get EUR 20 million more. Medical and Industrial, CT and Line Scan, another EUR 20 million. Security, CT and Line Scan, EUR 15 million. Now, due to the geopolitics and global issues, also cargo is quite exciting.
Arve Lukander will tell more about that. We've set a cargo target into 10, coming down to EUR 65 million. Looking then at this from a regional point of view, APAC 33. By the way, APAC is expected to grow double in GDP compared to the Western world. EMEA 20 and Americas 12, totaling to EUR 65 million. And our CFO, Matti Nylander, will then be explaining a bit more detailed here. To conclude, key takeaways from the presentation. We aim to outgrow the market. We drive the TFT growth across regions and applications. We have an extremely good start in the most demanding and toughest market in China. We achieve added value through integration and software. We spend and invest into new technology of photon counting for our future. That's trust in action. Chen Wu and Arve Lukander will then introduce more deeper our actions in the markets and applications.
I'm very pleased to hand over to Chen Wu, DT's President for APAC.
"No niin", w hich means "deliver". Another expression that you guys are perhaps more familiar with is "ni hao." Actually, "ni hao" would mean "deliver" when you are one-to-one communication. On an occasion like this, "da jia hao" would be the correct expression. Yes, Chinese language is difficult. Therefore, I decided to use English for today's presentation. First, to introduce myself, my name is Chen Wu. I'm the President of DT's APAC BU. I joined DT in the end of 1999 after I graduated from Tsinghua University, which is a top technology university in China. I lived and worked in Finland for 11 years. I studied in the University of Oulu and got a doctorate degree in microelectronics.
In my long career in DT, I came to this position in the beginning of this year. Before that, I had been leading DT's medical BU since 2007. So that's briefly about myself. Today, I'm going to cover two topics. First, I'm going to talk about the global medical market. Then the next, particularly about the China market. And thanks to DT, sets a very good stage for the big picture of China. Then we can take a look at how we, DT, through a small micro lens, how we see the China market. Let's start. So then I will come to my first topic about the global medical market. In this part, I will explain a bit how the market is, what's the dynamics there, what's the driver for the growth, and then DT's market position, our target in 2030, and how we will achieve the target.
By management estimation, we estimate the total global X-ray imaging medical market to be EUR 1.8 billion. By application, it can be divided into these four segments: medical CT, about EUR 400 million, 27%; dental and surgical, about EUR 250 million each, 15%- 17%; then the rest is radiography. Worth of note is that by technology, if we would segment the market, it can be segmented into two. In medical CT, that by itself is a CT detector. Then the rest are pretty much the flat panel detectors. Looking to the growth, we estimate to 2030, the CAGR is 2%. The growth in the medical market is mostly driven by these three elements. One is the aging population, which is the global issue, generates the new demand for the X-ray imaging. The increasing demand in the emerging economies. Thirdly, there is a shift on the technology.
As Hannu also mentioned, that actually part of the medical imaging is still using film or other analog devices. This will be digitalized, which means that they need X-ray detectors. We see the photon counting era is coming, which will create new applications in medical. That will also generate new demand for the detectors. We also see that the AI technology is more and more widely used in medical imaging as well. That will also widen the use of the imaging devices. DT has a well-established market position in medical CT. We have about 20% of the global market share by volume. That means one out of every five CTs manufactured in the world are equipped with DT's devices. The medical CT accounts for 85% of our medical revenue. That's the picture of a product, a typical product.
Flat panel, which, as I explained, is taking the majority, 73% of the market. We have contributed only 15% of our medical revenue. By playing with the mathematics, you understand that we just scratched the surface of the flat panel market, which also suggests that there will be a big potential for DT to grow our business. Worth to mention here is that we have a full technology portfolio on flat panels, meaning that the CMOS flat panels, the amorphous silicon flat panels, and the IGZO flat panels. We have already done some pilot testing with some customers, including some large medical OEMs. We get very good feedback and remarks on the performance. We are confident that we are ready to capture this market. Globally, right now, DT has more than 60 active customers in medical, including four out of the five largest medical OEMs.
Why Detection Technology is selected as a vendor to this medical equipment manufacturer? The fundamentals are the image quality or the performance. Number two is the quality. Why this is important? The better performance means that the doctors can have a better image with less dose. Both are very important for clinic diagnostics. Reliability, naturally, that's very, very important for the patient because nobody wants to have a surgery and then have a breakdown in the equipment. That's not going to happen. Those were the fundamental features of our products, which are built on our hardcore technology, which our CTO will explain. Beside that is the service. As I explained, we have the full technology portfolio, basically all the medical X-ray detectors. We have the technology in-house. It's a one-stop shop.
Throughout these 30 years of practice, we have built a deep technology know-how. Why that matters is that when the customer has an issue, we know what they are talking about. We know why that is important to the customer. We can link the requirement to the fundamental detector physics. Therefore, we can offer the value. We can solve the problem the way that the customer would like to see. We usually have a long-term R&D partnership with the customers, which means that we are not only developing today's generation of the products. We are also sharing our R&D roadmap with the customer. Some of the customers, they would do the same with us so that we can have an aligned mutual future.
We have a global presence, which is important to some of the customers who have the global operation, and they can get the local service from us. Another feature worth mentioning is that medical is a slow-moving industry, basically because of its highly regulated industry, which actually creates a barrier for the newcomers so that it protects the players already in the market. A customer case. Usually, we are not allowed to share our customer's name. This time, thanks to our dear customer, they allowed us to make this announcement. In the recent GE Healthcare Supplier Day, Detection Technology was awarded to be the Supplier of the Year of GE Healthcare in 2025. This is quite an honor. We have to realize that GE Healthcare has thousands of suppliers, more than EUR 10 billion annual spending, and Detection Technology was selected to be the one. It's a great honor.
Also to look back into the history with GE Healthcare, I think this is also quite a typical way how we collaborate and grow our business with the medical customer. The collaboration with GE Healthcare dated back about 20 years ago. We started with one project, a small component. We succeeded. Then we were granted more business, and we succeeded again. We are granted more. Until today, we are considered to be the strategic supplier partner to GE Healthcare. I listed a few issues or the achievements we did with GE. First of all, we had outstanding technology and the product performance that very few companies in the world can match. Thanks to our operation team, great job in our quality. In 2024, the customer claim rate is 7 PPM for the highest volume product. PPM means parts per million.
I heard from a guy that this year, 2025, the number is going to be even better. We still have one month to go. Let's hope that nothing happens. Naturally, the competitive price, on-time delivery, short lead time, those were the things that we have to do and excel. Looking to the future, in this DT strategy tier 2030, the target for medical business is to grow EUR 20 million on top of where we are today. If we look at this in two segments, on medical CT, the expectation by percentage is not so aggressive. What we are going to do here is to do better at what we are already good at. Meaning that we need to be even more innovative in cost cutting and improve our operational excellence.
We do see that the photon counting CT era is coming, and DT has already invested heavily in this field, and we will continue to do so. We will be exploring also the more value-adding into the CT products, for instance, radar electronics, software, and even subsystems, and so on. Flat panels lie the bigger hope for the plan for the growth. Basically, what we need to do in the flat panel is to repeat our success in CT. These two technology or products, they actually had a good overlap of the customer base, meaning that many of our existing big CT OEMs, they are also a big user of the flat panels. We need to leverage our existing customer base. Especially, we see the opportunity outside of China.
Inside of China, there's already fierce competition for TFT, but outside of China, with the cost base we can achieve with our manufacturing and the technology that we develop in China, we think that we can be more competitive outside in the Western countries. We have the manufacturing facility inside of China and in EU that we can leverage. Also, on flat panel, we will also explore to provide added value, more added value with our software features. Talking about the target of EUR 20 million, maybe worth mentioning that medical CT, we have 20% of the global market share, as I said. If we could reach 2% of the global market share for flat panel, then we would already reach this target. Okay, that was the part I prepared for the medical market. I will come to China market.
This China market, I will be talking not only about medical, but also security and the industrial market. The reason why we raise this topic, make this a special section for China, is that we understand that maybe to some of the investors, the China market or Detection Technology's exposure in China market is a concern. In our opinion, it's not. In our opinion, it's an opportunity. Hopefully, I will explain well in the following slides. To put it short, China is the largest and toughest market now and beyond. Talking about the largest, if we look at the upper right pie chart, APAC accounts for 2/3 of Detection Technology's revenue. We can tell that revenue from China is the dominating majority of the APAC part.
Talking about the toughest, I believe you guys all heard that there's a fierce price competition in many other industries like solar cell, EV car, and so on. Someone called it a cut-throat price competition, which unfortunately is true. It is also a similar case in our industry, maybe to a bit less extent. Besides the price competition, another thing that makes China a tough market is that the customers in China, they have exceptionally high expectations on the service level from the vendors. We are talking about a clock speed, how fast you can respond. That is what China market in our eyes, what it is. DT's performance in the past few years, if we look at the lower right hand, DT has been, or the China market has been the growth driver for DT for a number of years.
In the past few years, the growth has not been there. In our opinion, that is not because we are losing market share. We believe that our performance is in line with the overall market. First, China had the COVID from 2020 to 2023, which brought the security income to be less than half. Even today, the market is still far from recovered. We had mid-2023, we had the anti-corruption in healthcare. Generally, the China economy has been staggering in the past few years. We think that since we are playing in all this field, the overall market is staggering. We see signs of recovery that we see that the medical market started to pick up already this year. Everybody who has been traveling in China must notice that the security equipment in airports are quite outdated.
They still use 2D systems, and it needs to be upgraded to CT. It's only a matter of time when this will happen. In the industry, we also see that China will remain to be the big manufacturing house for the world. There is a demand for the productivity and also the application of the AI technology in the industry that turns a lot of previously offline done inspection to be inline, which generates also new needs for the X-ray imaging. In the mid to long term, we fully agree with DT's conclusion that China is a market we cannot give up. DT has played well and built a strong position in China that in medical CT, we estimate that we are 30% of the market share. In aviation security, which is a high-end security, we are about 50%, perhaps even more.
That is because of the long history we had in China that we came to China in 1994 already. We are one of the early first detector vendors. Many of our customers, they built their first-generation systems with DT detector. DT's name is well recognized. The customers, they are willing to pay a premium for DT quality. We have built up already a very strong team, including R&D, sales, service, manufacturing, and so on. It is a self-sustained team. I would say the strong team we had in China is the core reason why DT succeeded and will be successful in China. One proof is that after we acquired Haobo in 2023, DT, as Hannu mentioned, we achieved more than 50% growth in this year. The TFT market is actually a highly competitive market. We are able to do that.
Another customer case, DT is supplying to several leading EV battery makers already, including the very leading one. In this very leading battery maker, we were appointed by the end customer, because usually there's one layer between us who is a system integrator. We are appointed by the end customer to be the detector vendor. This is all achieved through hard work with our strong competence in China. The battery makers have a very high expectation of the customer service level. Sometimes they call you at 2:00 A.M. and expect you to respond immediately to their request. It's very tough. Usually, the battery manufacturing line environment is pretty tough with the heavy battery moving around, so there's a huge amount of electrical and magnetic disturbance.
To make the product work with the production line, it usually takes time to fit in. Naturally, the high imaging performance and the cost are two basic reasons. Looking to the future, I think we will continue to do what we are already good at. That is our brand and leverage a customer relationship to succeed in China. One more point is that we need to be more Chinese in China. Compared to many Western companies, we are already very, very much more Chinese compared to many others. That is still not enough. That means mainly the clock speed. We have to adapt ourselves to the China clock speed. Other things that we can leverage are also the supply chain in China. Key takeaways from me. On medical, our target is to outgrow the market in the legacy market.
How to do that is to do better at what we are already good at. We put high hopes on TFT, and we will leverage our existing customer base to achieve our goal. We will invest into photon counting, which is the future of the X-ray imaging. In China, we have all the reasons to believe that we will continue to be successful there. Okay, thank you. That is my part. I will now hand over to Arve for the security and the industrial market.
See you, Chen. Hello, everyone. My name is Arve Lukander, and I am the President for the EMEA and Americas Business Unit. I have been working for DT now for four years. Before this, I have been working within the security and the medical fields, also including our customers at DT.
In this part, I will scan through the security and industrial markets, starting with the security markets. We estimate that the market size for the detectors in the security market is approximately EUR 300 million. This market is divided to approximately the same size segments: aviation security, which means carry-on and whole baggage and air cargo scanning at airports; urban security, which then means hotels, train stations, subway stations, etc.; and cargo inspection, which is at the borders, border control of containers, trains, vehicles. We believe that this market will be growing around 3% until 2030, driven by aviation growth in passenger numbers. In Europe this year, the passenger numbers grew with 5%. Also in India, at this moment, there are tens of airports under construction at this moment. Urban threats are on the rise all over the world.
Also now, at this moment, in the geopolitical situation, nations are investing more and more in border control. We at Detection Technology have approximately 17% global market share of the security detectors. Our sales split from security CT comes 55%. In security, CT means that the passengers can leave their bags or their laptops and liquids in their bags instead of taking them out. That improves the people flow at airport. 40% of our business comes from line scan detectors and then 5% of cargo detectors. In addition to these detectors, we sell data combiner boards and more and more software and services. Security is all about trust. We are trusted in this business because, first of all, we know what we are doing. We have been conducting demanding projects with our customers that are top in the market.
We have also been leveraging the knowledge that we have gained from the medical market, which is much more demanding than the security markets. Our product quality is excellent. Only 0.005% field failures. Customer support is top-notch, proven by the NPS number of 70. We are in a neutral geopolitical position. We have some 100 customers in the security business, and 8 out of 10 of the largest manufacturers in this business trust us. Three out of the four security CT manufacturers and 8 out of 10 top line scan manufacturers. One out of five major cargo scan manufacturers. Let's now dig a little bit deeper into the carry-on baggage CT markets, which are the most important for us. In Europe, there are some 700 systems deployed until now, which means that in the deployment rate, we are approximately at 30%.
In the U.S., they are a little bit further than us with 1,300 systems installed, and they are around 50%. Also in some developed countries like Japan, Korea, Singapore, etc., they are at 30% deployment rates. For example, China, the deployment rate is still very, very low. In countries like India or other underdeveloped countries, the market is totally untapped. We believe that we are now 15%-20% started this business, and it will bring us business to a decade to come, which is growing. Going towards 2030, the security market or business will bring us some EUR 25 million more revenues. Most of it, EUR 15 million will come from aviation, especially from CT, where we have a very strong position and then also a good pipeline at this moment.
We can add value to our customers with software, shortening their development times and also saving money for them. In line scan, that's still ongoing business, and we have a strong position there traditionally, and we will be further boosting this now with this new AVA Air product. In cargo inspection, we have just launched this beautiful product called X-Cargo, which is good in the sense that trains can drive with that speed of 70 km per hour, and we can scan those trains while they are moving. This business has actually started now for us with this new product surprisingly well. We believe that EUR 10 million growth is possible from this product alone. In urban security, we have launched just the AVA One product, which is very cost-efficient for us. We also have other low-cost products in the pipeline.
This will bring us more volumes, but the growth is a little bit hindered by the price erosion. Let's move to the industrial markets. The market is EUR 300 million, as well as the security. We divide this to the five different application areas. Non-destructive testing means scanning and quality inspection of metal parts, engines, etc. Now also the defense business is in growth, and this is non-destructive testing. Sorting and mining is, for example, about scanning metal parts in a waste flow. Battery inspection, I will dive deeper into that soon. Food inspection is all about food safety, finding foreign objects like plastics, glass, metals in the food processes. Oil, gas, and electronics is mostly about gas pipe inspection and then electronics quality control.
These markets are in a growth of 5% approximately, driven then by the electric vehicle batteries and energy storage systems growth. Recycling is on the rise as well, and defense is increasing. Globally, we have in industrial markets some 6% market share. In the line scan business, we have a very established 30% market share. The flat panel business is five times bigger than the line scan market. We see a tremendous opportunity for us to introduce our flat panels like the Jumbo there, which are unique to the market. We also have the people and contacts in this market ready. This business will bring us a growth of EUR 20 million towards EUR 30 million. In the industrial business, also trust is important. Now, especially with the flat panel portfolio, we have the broadest off-the-shelf product portfolio.
We have been working decades in this market, so we know the applications very well and the customer needs. Product quality, customer support, excellent. We are able to be very aggressive in pricing there where we have to. Currently, we have some 200 customers. As Chen mentioned, one of the two largest battery manufacturers in the world, three out of six largest line scan NDT companies, and three out of four largest sorting companies. Here is the deep dive into the battery inspection business. We believe that this market will grow with 20% driven by the electric vehicles and energy storage systems. At each production line of battery cells, there are several inspection points with X-rays. That means that typically in a production line, there are more than 10 detectors.
These detectors are running 24/7, meaning that the products wear within one or two years, which means recurring growing business for us. As mentioned, the industrial business is bringing us some EUR 20 million more revenue towards 2030, most from the battery inspection and then entering the new markets with TFTs, especially outside Asia, where we are just about beginning. In conclusion, we believe that the security and industrial business will bring us some EUR 45 million additional revenues towards 2030, coming from CT security sales, EUR 15 million, industrial TFTs, EUR 20 million, and then X-Cargo, EUR 10 million. Thank you all. Now it is time to give the floor to Jyrki Still, our CTO.
Thank you. Thank you, Arve, and thank you, Chen, for introducing our businesses. I will be scanning you guys through our technologies and inventions. First of all, my name is Jyrki Still.
I'm the Chief Technology Officer of Detection Technology. I have been with DT for over 20 years, starting from the startup days and up to today. I was 10 years in China setting up our operations and also working very closely with customers and our suppliers. That has happened to be the same time when Chen was in Finland. We actually don't get along that well. We had to swap continents. Truly, what really drives me at work at DT is the purposeful work that we do. We help save lives with X-ray imaging. That is in the heart, and that gives the purpose for us in R&D and engineering. Today, I will be introducing the technologies and inventions. Don't worry, I don't get to the deep end. I will just explain some basic things about the technology.
Detection Technology, we have been trusted in the radiation detector field for more than 30 years. We are the leader in the line scan and CT X-ray detectors serving global medical, security, and industrial customers. Today, we have more than 20% market share in medical security CT. Our detectors have been FDA, so that's the regulatory medical body in the U.S., for over two decades. We are all over the world's hospitals with reliable detectors. All our core technologies are nowadays in-house. The whole pie that Hannu was showing from line scan, CT, TFT panels, CMOS, photon counting, those are all now in-house. We're very proud of that. You may think that why is it so important that we have this in-house from sensor design, readout designs, electronic system integration? Why is it so important?
That gives us full control over performance, quality, and the cost. With 11% of DT's revenue reinvested into R&D, we are continuously developing new technologies and new products to the market just to make sure that we stay at the forefront of X-ray imaging. Our business benefits from high barriers to entry and long life cycles. Just giving examples, typically X-ray equipment life cycle is anywhere from 7-10 years. Actually, DT is still manufacturing products that were developed 20 years ago. There is a very long life cycle. Once you get in, you can manufacture for a long term. There are regulatory barriers. As I mentioned, the FDA, typically like in the aviation segment, airports, also the hospitals, those are highly regulated markets.
We have to go through, our customers have to, OEMs have to go through regulatory approvals. That regulatory approval takes one year or more. We have a diversified portfolio. We have all these technologies in-house and a very diversified portfolio. I will actually show you that they are all in a different technology adoption curve in the next pages. One significant topic I wanted to highlight here is that we have a global R&D footprint. What does that mean? We have R&D engineers in China. As Chen was greatly showing, the agility and Chinese execution speed, it's great to be in China. At the same time, we have R&D in Finland and France as well. This is really mitigating geopolitical risks and while supporting customers and sustainable growth.
This chart here shows the typical technology adoption curve all the way from the early research and invention to the decline or to the end of life. Again, we have a full technology portfolio. Actually, we are covering all these key segments of the life cycle. From photon counting, being in the early adoption, all the way to line scan CT and amorphous silicon TFT, which are getting to the mature part of the life cycle. We strategically actually avoid being in the very forefront, like in the early research or early invention. That is meant for bigger companies, but also maybe for startup companies. To give you an example, you see the photon counting there, which is now in the early adoption. It took Siemens Healthineers 20 years from the research to an FDA-approved machine in the hospital.
They released their first machine in 2021, and now it's in the hospitals. It's a very long path if you start from the early research and start investing there. Instead, at DT, we focus on adapting and scaling proven technologies efficiently and turning them into reliable, manufacturable detector solutions. This disciplined approach keeps us agile, helps us capture value as markets grow, and supports long-term profitability. Next, I'll take you guys step by step through these technologies. The first is the CT and line scan. Today, around 90% of DT's revenue comes from CT and line scan. It's at the core of our business. These technologies are getting into the mature phase of the adoption curve, and the market's becoming more and more commoditized. That means that our competitive edge comes from operational excellence and cost leadership.
How do we do this? What's our technical edge? Instead of building a product at a time, one product designed at a time, we actually build modular platforms. Another thing is that we have these local development teams, especially in China, where the clock speed is much faster than anywhere in the world. At the same time, what's happening in this segment is that we are integrating AI and advanced algorithms to further reduce the cost and enhance differentiation. A good example is Arve was showing already these AVA line scan detectors. First of all, it's not a single product. It is a portfolio of many, many products. It's actually four different product families, four different product families, and they are designed for different applications, whereas in industrial and security. This particular AVA is also enabled by algorithms and AI.
What that does is that we spend 40% less material, and we get 50% cost reduction on that kind of line detector cards. This is exactly how we keep our core business strong and competitive, even as we prepare for the next great technologies that I will show you next. Moving on to this amorphous silicon TFT, which is about EUR 1.5 billion global market, a huge market. It is already in the mature phase, but actually it's new to DT. To accelerate our entry, we acquired Shanghai Haobo Imaging Technology in mid-2023. That's how we got into the TFT panels and markets, giving us a local R&D capability with fast development cycles.
Our main focus currently is on industrial applications, as was explained, created by Arve and Chen as well, like such as in battery inspection or electronics inspection, and then some special use cases, and then while we gradually work on to medical imaging market. We have already released over 60 panels under the scalable platform, again, not a single product, offering both standard and custom TFT panels at the competitive cost. Here is one of our latest releases. This panel here is the world's biggest and fastest X-ray detector in the whole world, first of a kind in the world. We are very, very proud of this design. This panel is used for several applications. Basically, the idea is that you can scan at single scan, like a more than 1 meter industrial object, whatever that object may be.
This is used primarily in automotive, aerospace, and defense industries. Next one is IGZO- TFT. IGZO- TFT is in the growth phase of the adoption curve. Compared to the TFT that I just showed you, this offers faster signal transport and lower noise and a better image quality. This is ideal then compared to TFT. It's ideal for more demanding applications in battery and electronics inspection. Or as in one more example from medical, it's surgical C-arms, which is now being replaced. There are image intensifiers being used in the C-arms, and they are being replaced by the IGZO flat panel detectors. Here our platform approach again supports both custom and standard solutions. This allows us the flexibility in panel sizes and also pixel configurations. Production ramp-up is underway on this IGZO.
We have already released nine of the more than 60 TFT panels with the IGZO technology. We have several more in the R&D pipeline. This technology, as Chen was saying, has been qualified by the leading battery manufacturer already. It is showing that, confirming its performance and also reliability in high volume use. IGZO is a good example of how we take, convert existing technologies into scalable revenue-generating platforms, fast, efficiently, and close to customers. The next one is CMOS. CMOS is driving the next wave of growth. What is CMOS? CMOS basically, in a nutshell, provides the highest resolution, so smallest pixel size of TFT and IGZO panels. Also the high speed with very, very low noise. IGZO panels can be used for high-value dynamic imaging applications.
Compared to the TFT panels or IGZO panels, the difference is that CMOS is made on silicon, so basically silicon wafers and silicon foundries. These TFT panels, IGZO panels, they are manufactured on very big glass plates on display factories. CMOS is the highest resolution, best imaging quality, but it comes at the highest cost. There's a cost trade-off, which is then a speed and cost trade-off as far as which panel actually to select for certain application. This makes CMOS perfectly suited for most advanced medical and industrial imaging, also in battery inspection and precision electronics, surgery, and mammography. At DT, we are still at the early phase of developing our CMOS product portfolio, but customer interest is high, and we see a strong potential coming out of the CMOS business.
We intend to be a meaningful part of our business in the years to come. About the value-adding integration, we go beyond detector components to deliver more complete imaging subsystems with systems and software. Today, most of DT's business comes from the detector modules, and data acquisition ports as highlighted here with the pink color. We are now expanding our offering to subsystems by developing scalable data combined ports and slip ring interfaces for CT, along with integrated software. This is all part of the modular platform, again, not a single product. We utilize also algorithms and software to enhance the image quality and lower the dose in X-ray imaging, and also enable very high-quality 3D imaging with X-rays. As Hannu was stating, more than 2 billion inspections are done with our detectors every day.
That means there's a vast amount of data available. That is what we are then starting to explore and generate, think about how do we utilize that vast amount of data for DT business. This is an enabler here, what I'm showing you, that we have a full data chain, for example, in CT imaging. This is enabling us to use more data-driven solutions. What's happening in the market is actually that if you take like big medical OEMs, CT OEMs, they are spending their time and resources into photon counting. That actually leaves space in the current technology for DT to address with a more value-added offering rather than just the detector cards. Another thing that's happening is that take an example of India. India doesn't have CT engineers.
They need actually more value-added subsystem type providers who are reliable and have been in the market for a longer time. They are trusted. Indian customers are looking for more integration and suppliers who can provide it. Those are the opportunities with the value-added. About the photon counting, this has been mentioned several times today. This is the highest end and next major leap in X-ray imaging. This is delivering the highest resolution and a lowest dose. Most importantly, it provides superior material discrimination. This material discrimination opens up lots of new imaging possibilities. Radiologists just love it. They really, when they see PCCT images, they love it. It is so crisp, so precise, and with the small details very well shown. After more than 20 years of R&D, Siemens has now validated photon counting, and it has demonstrated its clinical value.
It is not just a hype. This is actually paving the way for wider adoption across the industry. Photon counting is still low in the early adoption, so it has high barriers to entry, from crystal growth to ASIC to readout design, assembly, testing, calibrations, and algorithms. It is not a ready solution for anybody. This is exactly where DT's strength lies. We are adopters and integrators. Somebody else did the research work, and now we are adapting and integrating. We turn this kind of validated research concepts into scalable, manufacturable detector solutions. As the market is transitioning from research to adoption, we are ideally positioned to enable that shift with DT's photon counting offerings step by step. Okay, to wrap up, the key takeaways from my presentation are first, proven leadership with market position.
With over 30 years of innovation and more than 20% market share in CT detectors, we are the trusted partner to the world's leading X-ray imaging OEMs. This long-term reliability forms the foundation of our business. Second, scalable platform. Not a single product, but scalable platform. For example, more than 60 flat panels are offered as standard custom at a competitive cost. Our R&D footprint in China, France, and Finland keeps us close to the customers, but also helps to mitigate the geopolitical risks. This is a real, real competitive edge. Third, we are well equipped for photon counting. Thanks to Siemens, the technology has now been validated in the clinical use in the hospitals. The market is preparing for adoption. This is exactly the sweet spot for DT.
As we move forward, we are exploring software and data-driven solutions to further enhance our offering and create new value for our customers. As we look toward 2030, our direction is clear: trusted, scalable, and ready for next generation X-ray imaging. With that, I'll hand over to Kai Utela, Vice President of Operations.
Okay, thank you, Jyrki. Nice to meet you all. My name is Kai Utela, and I'm head of operations and quality. Okay, as Jyrki mentioned, Jyrki went a little deep, and now we go different, deep, and hopefully not too deep, but I'm trying to explain what we have, where we have, and how we execute, how we do these products. A little bit of my background. I have been in DT now 15 years, and as well as Jyrki, 10 years in China.
If I would describe myself, I'm a lean practitioner, what you will probably see in this presentation as well. Let's serve. Here I try to explain a little bit what it means when we say that we have asset-light operations. This product is Security CT, typical product. What we do, you can see the green part is the printed circuit board, and that we subcontract. We are not doing that ourselves. We do not have EMS, this kind of assembly lines. Instead, we are buying that, and then we are buying other parts, what you can see here, a little like separate each other. The gray part is photodiodes. That is a core part of our product. That we buy from wafer level as a foundry.
We do not have own foundries, but we buy as a wafer level, and then we dice them, and then we buy individually. As you can see, this product, 500 pieces, we die on them automatic machines individually to the printed circuit board. On top of that, there are going to be scintillators. Those we also do not produce from material, this kind of like a plain material ourselves, but we buy plates, and then we do this kind of, we call pixelation, and then we assemble those to the photodiode. Those we put together, and then we load software firmware, we test that, and that is a ready product. Why we do those in-house? There is a very special process including this. There is a high advanced, this kind of die bonding technology, and this very high assembly accuracy and flatness precision, which is unique.
It is also this design and how we do these processes are in-house developed. We talked about today many times of quality. Quality, of course, is not done in manufacturing. It is done together with all of us, especially of course when we together with customer define the product, and then Jyrki's team is designing the product and actually defining 80% of the quality. We then try to do that 20%. I tried to a little bit explain how we do that as well. Here is the picture of our factory. Probably it does not look like the asset light. This is a pacing factory, and there is one line behind these engineers, and we have those three lines in this factory. Each line has about 30-40 equipment, but any of those equipment is not like millions of euros.
They are hundreds of thousands maximum. This team here is our competent engineering. We have more than 40 engineers relating to the production development, and those also are involved already in the product development phase. These guys, they are mostly guys here, I think, even if we do not see, but they are very proud of, you can see very smiling. The reason is why. This picture has been taken a few days after these guys together with some other of our teams, we did the layout change. This behind line, there is 36 equipment, and we decided that we need to make the new layout. Every one of those equipment was relocated and not only a few meters totally. It was one line, and we made two U-shaped lines. Like this kind of lean principles.
We tried to get a better flow of production, less conflicts, and then of course less working process and many other targets. We did everything ourselves, two days, three days, and then we needed two guys from outside to calibration, and that's it. We do all assembly, electric assembly, everything ourselves. That's now proof that we call it we have relocatable lines. We are very flexible. Few days basically, if we have a clean room ready, we can move the lines. I mentioned lean, and this is something I want to a little bit explain more deeply because this is one which is very close to my heart, as Jyrki mentioned the other stuff. This is the first little bit to lean what it means. It's a Toyota production system basically.
I have been privileged also in my history to work even directly as a Toyota electronics supplier to Toyota. Now we are doing also in China, we do cooperation with Toyota Tianjin so that we are implementing these Toyota systems. What is typical for Toyota and lean is that they reduce waste. Waste in any format, waste of overproduction, waste of scrap, waste of space, waste of time. The other thing is they do continuous improvement. That is something very unique. What is typical then as those lean practitioner companies, they are high quality, low cost companies. They are industry leaders. Together with lean and the Six Sigma. Six Sigma is then when we have processes like us. How to improve processes, how to reduce variation. Together of those two, it's a competitive advantage.
How then us, because we are not Toyota and we do not copy anything. We take those best practices and then we do our own DT lean. We are Lean Six Sigma AI. AI of course is the quite new thing, but we are combining and using that already in our data handling in production. What is unique in our lean is that we are putting this kind of principles in place. We have one principle which is also here: quality first, safety first, on time second. Why is it so strange? Safety first as well. You as investors are very happy if I say that safety is so important for us because we do not want to ruin our factories by one accident, for example. There it comes to another principle that we have.
We have a principle that in our Chinese factories, there is no unmanned minute anywhere. When we started in 2015, there was not one minute, not even during COVID time by the way. During COVID time, people were, in a week, closing the doors. There was no unmanned time. Even now today, every minute there is a person. That is one safety thing. The other thing I want to highlight is Toyota and what we have really understood through this period together with Toyota. In 2015, we started this cooperation. It is about how to make improvements, and also how to do changes, because all the change is improvement. That is Kaizen. You may have heard the word Kaizen. It is nothing very fancy, but it is improvement. Each improvement is done so that it is proven to be better than it was before. We started in 2015.
We did a couple of hundreds of Kaizens per year. Then we noticed that actually volume is very important because it tells the speed. Faster and faster, the better we are. In 2020 we reached 1,000 Kaizens per year. 2025 was 1,500, and now this year will be more than 1,700 Kaizens. It is about six Kaizens per person per year. Is it a lot? It is not. Toyota is now level 15-50 even. Yes, we are going that direction. Why the number is important? You can see other number in this slide is PPM 50. The more we do Kaizens, the more we do improvements, and we all the time know that we can be better, our quality and all these KPIs go right direction.
PPMs go down, and then our yield, this quality inside, goes up, and our cost goes down. As Jen mentioned, this is our GE Healthcare, our dear customers, which actually location quite close to our factory in Beijing. This year is less than seven. I can release it zero. We have none failures this year. So far, one month to go. The other thing which is also very close to lean, and this is the sustainability, because reducing waste, sure, it's sustainability. We reduce the time, we reduce the space, everything. We reduce CO2. Those are our KPIs to sustainability. This year we apply these EcoVadis, and we just last week get the score, 63 out of 100. Oh, it's not very good. 97% of companies which are applying EcoVadis get lower than that in the first time. 65 is advanced.
We have still a way to go, more Kaizens. Then a little bit those factories and where we are. Beijing, 2015 we went to the new factory. We have been there early 2000. That is a 4,000 square meter. It is just our main factory at the moment. There is ISO 7 clean room. It is not, let's say, foundry level clean room. It is just this kind of enough for us, about 10,000 old particle numbers. It is a good clean room for us. Then we expanded China 2019 to have opened other factory in greater Shanghai area. There we went because we wanted to have, of course, safety. Also, we have a risk mitigation. We have two factories. The other reason is there are suppliers and customers also in the greater Shanghai area. A lot of resources available. There we have still expanding possibilities.
Now expand those panels. They need a lot of space. Even the lead times is very fast. All of Finland, we have had production as long as the company has existed, but now 2024 we moved to the new facility where we have now 1,000 square meter as a production, but the facility is actually now when we built it or renovated, it had done so that the whole 2,000 square meter can be taken into the production very fast. The office even have the ESD floor. They do not know it yet, but that is the ESD floor. We can just throw them out and take the production use. India, I will have one slide. I will tell that later on. Here a little bit then this global supply chain and what are the risks and how we mitigate there.
We have global sourcing, meaning that we have a lead sourcing in Finland, but then both factories in China, we have global local sourcing managers, procurement teams, and also supplier quality engineering. We are very close to our suppliers there and managing those and faster as we have been hearing today. The other thing, we have this dual supplier strategy. We have chosen key materials components. We have always actively two suppliers. Even so that when we have chosen, we have one supplier in Europe and one supplier in Asia. Those decisions we have made, of course, we are scanning the customer needs and of course cost, quality, other key things as well. Okay, here shortly about India. It was so new case. We started early this year.
We started this factory project, which means that we built a clean room and small office there. End of June, then we were ready to make made in India products. Now we can do made in India for local customers. Depending on the products, we can do panels, cards, and so on. There is of course customer service near the customer. It is only 400 square meter, which is small, but because we put our processes, we put our lean system, it is very easy then to scale up. Okay, a little bit the future. Yes, we are following closely, of course, the global trends. Tuuli is visiting our factories actually also very often. I have met Tuuli in our factory there. We are following what happens in China, what happens in the world.
How then how fast we can and need to change. Of course, we're listening to our customers and what they are thinking, but we can provide in the future definitely made in China, made in EU, made in India. Who knows then if change, we can also very fast relocate this end assembly and testing. Quality, we are not there where we want to be. Less than 10 is the good target for 2030, and we must be faster. We have seen that faster is also we need to faster for improvement. We know from 6-7 per person, we think that 12 Kaizens per year is a good target for 2030. Resilient global supply chain. At the end, I would like to a little bit borrow one lean guru's wording here because this Mr. James Womack actually works in Qi Healthcare at the moment.
Very, very famous lean guy. I met also him a few months back. He is saying this way that lean is all the time making more and more with less and less and going all the time like doing exactly what customer wants. No other adding value, only those that customer is ready to pay. I would say that we do less, we do more in the future. That is why how we get the trust. Thank you. I will give now to our CFO.
Thank you, Kai. My name is Matti Nylander. I am CFO for Detection Technology now for the past one and a half years. Prior to that, I spent more than six years as a CFO for a Finnish technology startup.
Before that, more than 15 years in various finance and IT roles in the mobile phones industry in different companies. In today's presentation, I'll be covering the financials broadly from two aspects. One being the historical and the background information regarding the DT business, and then elaborating a bit further on the financial targets for the upcoming strategy period. Starting with some historical view. If you look at the DT revenue for the past years, from 2017 - 2019 was kind of characterized by strong drive in the APAC security, China in particular. It was a result of us having great product available at the great time meeting the market demand, resulting in high revenues as well as high profitability. Then came COVID pandemic, which caused quite a bit of changes also related to DT.
Security market since traveling more or less ceased for a while and dropped dramatically. It went into half. In China, actually the security market went even below that. At the same goal, medical market on the other hand got the boost for the CT business particularly. That was kind of a reset for the market from Detection Technology perspective. Since COVID, security market has been growing fairly steadily. Last year being very good already, but it still was not on the level it used to be. Despite the growth, it has not recovered fully yet. If you think of this year, then as referred earlier already, there was some customer inventory buildup in the 2024 figures, which partly shows then in the 2025 in security.
2025 also has been impacted by the regulatory challenges in the EU area with the so-called 100 milliliter regulation changes, which has caused slowdown in the implementation of the aviation CT. Medical, as mentioned, grew quite nicely after the COVID or during the COVID and after it, and then got a bit stabilized until then there was a healthcare reform introduced in China, which again then caused slowdown in the investments in China for the medical and impacted 2024 medical sales clearly. That has now for 2025 shown signs of recovery. Towards the end of the year, the situation has been already improved. Our third application area, the industrial, we have been reporting separately from 2019 onwards, and it has been growing steadily. It is now close to double what it was in 2019. We have the Haobo acquisition in mid-2023, which currently contributes mostly for the industrial sales.
2025 still has one bit of a peculiarity compared to the other years, and that goes to the exchange rates. In the past, the exchange rates have been more stable, but now with the recent fluctuations, fairly fast and fairly high have impacted also the DT's reported numbers. I'll come back to that in a moment. If you look at DT financials on a bit more granular level on a quarterly level, you see certain seasonality within the years. It is commonly so that first quarter is the lowest sales quarter, and the fourth quarter is then clearly the highest. Second and third quarter are typically in between, and the pattern seems to repeat quite typically the same.
If you look at individual quarters, and particularly if you look at individual quarters for individual application areas, you will start to see quite a bit more fluctuations already because of the sheer numbers. Numbers are smaller and so on. If you think of individual deliveries for certain systems, those can be worth hundreds of thousands of EUR. Timing of individual deliveries, particularly if you talk about industrial customers, can mean fluctuation between the quarters. A system delivered late in the previous quarter or early in the next quarter easily kind of gives fluctuation to the numbers. Also, as we are providing our products towards the next year in the supply chain, i.e., the manufacturers, they may at any given time be either building up or clearing their inventory, which again may cause temporary fluctuations in the numbers.
On the other hand, if you look at the 12-month rolling average figure, it is actually a lot more stable as you would expect. Judging performance for one given quarter, you should probably look a bit longer term and not draw too strong conclusions on any individual quarter. Coming back to the exchange rates briefly. We are a global business. As you've heard, like 2/3 or 60-70%, depending on the year, of the revenue comes from APAC. We have Americas business as well. As anticipated, of course, most of the revenue or practically all that revenue is other currencies than euros, namely in Chinese yuan or U.S. dollars. Also, some part of the EMEA revenue is in U.S. dollars.
This then means that if euro appreciates against the mentioned currencies, it will have fairly direct impact to our EUR reported revenues, even if the business as such wouldn't really change. For example, if euro appreciates around 3%, it will be more than 2% impact on our top line without the business itself changing practically in any way. At the same goal, our costs are also largely in other currencies than euros, mainly in Chinese yuan as well as U.S. dollars. Materials and services predominantly are purchased in the mentioned currencies. Also, personnel and other costs, more than half of those are in Chinese yuan and U.S. dollars. This leads into a situation that our profitability is not impacted in a similar manner as the top line. Fluctuation will impact top line. It will have much less or a limited impact to the profitability.
Shortly about the profitability of the main drivers for the margins. In the short term, it comes from the application mix. If you think of our application areas, medical tends to have fewer customers. They are larger customers. They are quite demanding. They are the ones with whom the new technologies are typically built with. With the high volumes, with large customer size, cost to serve the customers, the administrative things and other things are kind of lower, but with the pricing power and the volumes or the negotiation power of the customers, medical products tend to have lower gross margins. Meanwhile, it is compensated on a long run with the better efficiencies otherwise. Industrial is kind of the other extreme where the customers are typically a lot smaller. They are more laborious to serve, more kind of individual customer needs again some care and attention.
Meanwhile, the margins, the gross margins for those products are clearly above the average for DT. Security is a bit of a mix. Security has big customers. It has also a bunch of small customers. Margins in security are above average. The operational efficiency obviously varies then depending on the customer. Further, country mix has certain bearings. There are, like mentioned in China, very fierce competition in certain areas. Obviously, if the revenue comes from those sales, then the margin is being impacted. All in all, in short term, the higher proportion of the sale coming from security and industrial will mean higher relative profitability. However, for the longer perspective, the medical has certain benefits kind of balancing the situation.
Looking a bit from the balance sheet perspective, we have very strong net cash position that provides us clearly some resilience about the turbulences. We can sustain a good amount of headwind without being in troubles. Also, that gives us ability to seize opportunities should those appear. We also have had a continuous cash flow from the operations, which enables us to invest for growth. Cash flow slightly fluctuates with the changes in the networking capital. Since we need to hold inventories to provide delivery capability or ensure the delivery capability, that causes some challenges or causes fluctuation in the cash flow. For instance, this year, we will need to increase the inventory in order to ensure our delivery capabilities. As Kai mentioned, we have an asset-light business model, which facilitates the scaling of the business.
We do not need to invest tens of millions or hundreds of millions for the facilities or the production processes in CapEx terms, but it is rather in individual millions. Also, as you can see from there, there is the Haobo acquisition. We have the ability to execute M&A cases if those are seen viable. Also, that provides us the ability to pay continuous dividends. Detection Technology has been paying for the past five years quite consistently around 60% of the earnings as dividends. As you heard, the financial target remains to be 30-60% dividend also going forward. From a return on investment perspective, if we compare to the peer group of certain selected competitors and related companies, those have been less than 10% ROI in 2023-2024, and we have been performing quite nicely compared to those.
Coming back to the growth and to the financials for the strategy period. As Hannu mentioned, we aim to grow three times the market growth, so it's an ambitious but yet achievable target. As you heard from Chen and Arve, the growth comes from the following applications. First, TFT panel business overall. That's the biggest market for us. That's also the market that we have been for the shortest period involved and where we have very low market share. There is a lot of room to grow both in APAC as well as particularly in the Western markets. Medical, industrial, CT, and line scan businesses are our stronghold. We have a good share. We will grow with the market. There are certain specific areas like the battery inspection and other things which help us grow faster.
We also will introduce more value-added solutions in terms of hardware and software as well as then aim to tap into the adoption curve of the photon counting. That is where we should hit the sweet spot of DT in terms of the technology cycle Jyrki was talking about. For security, CT and line scan, as Arve mentioned, there is still a lot of room to grow in the aviation CT, for instance. There are plenty of airports which still will eventually move into CT, both in the Western world as well as particularly in China and India and later on in the developing countries. Finally, there is cargo business in security, which has had quite a good start now and a promising get-go for the sales. This is also a market that is clearly growing and we have a high-performance product available.
Region-wise, APAC is our biggest region and will continue to be. Growth, though, is even stronger than in EMEA and particularly in Americas. About the everyday improvement, first, of course, the top line growth drives also the profitability improvement. This comes from our asset-light business model, so we do not need to invest heavily in order to scale up our businesses. Also, our gross margins for the products are on a good level, so that helps to improve here. We will provide more value-added and integrated software and hardware solutions, which will help us to increase the prices, maintain the prices, keep the customer commitments, and so on. Further, there are new opportunities, as mentioned, photon counting, growing with that, hitting the adoption curve of the photon counting and also expanding our offering in the software business.
Finally, we will continue to improve our efficiency in line with the strategic actions. That goes for the lean things, goes for all the operations, it goes to the performance culture both in business as well as in the operations, and then promoting the modularity and platforms for our products. We will need to invest, particularly in the middle two, so the integrated solutions and photon counting and software things in the near term. Hitting 15% EBITDA in the next year is going to be a challenge. To summarize my part, since the market reset after the COVID, we have been growing faster than the market, although not quite up to the level as we would have hoped for. Our cash position is strong and our cash flow is continuous, which provides us resilience, enables us to invest in growth as well as continue to pay dividends.
For the future growth, there are plenty of growth areas identified and we have actions in place to drive the profitability through the growth as well as through the strategic actions. With that, I'd like to welcome Hannu back to the stage to summarize.
Thank you, Matti. And thank you, all of you, for your time and engagement today. I'm going through, as a summary, our DT 2030 strategy. Our goal was to give you today a clear view of strategy, the growth drivers, and long-term value creation. As a recap, first of all, I think the strategy is very simple. It plays on two foundational bricks. First is the performance culture. And what does that mean?
That means that each of us, as DTNs, we are continuously giving feedback, we are setting tough targets, and we are trying to reach those, reaching those and learning also by the mistakes and then moving forward. We need to be working close with the customers. Looking at the customer success through our products, exceptional usability, and the service we are giving them. The base is very important. The base is our balanced, diversified portfolio, the cost-efficient solutions with smart features driving growth in security, industrial, medical, the quality, agility, efficiency, asset-light business model, and the geographic. We are local. We are made in China. We are made in Finland. We are made in India. As a basis for base, we have a strong presence in China, the toughest and highest competitive market. That is a foundational base to step out and conquer the other markets.
I think the base is also very important because each DT employee has a special role in here. Everybody can here help us to succeed. Number one, growth comes from TFT. Already more than 60 products, wide portfolio. We are expanding with our tough cost competitiveness and our quality to Western markets. Giving solutions for advanced industrial and medical applications. The strong demand already has started in battery inspection. By the way, battery is going to be important. EV is also in the U.S., also in Europe. We add value with our software also to the TFTs. The added value part means going downstream, helping our customers, taking, by the way, certain things they are doing right now, taking that and doing that for them. Integrating the hardware with the new software we are creating.
The future part is the new tech, going also beyond 2030, developing the photon counting and also exploring the software. Why invest in Detection Technology? I would like to take one example here of our culture. I think we have great diversity. On the other hand, we have very serious, disciplined technology and R&D engineers. We also have people who are challenging that and who are then willing and wanting to take risks. I remember during the idea and life of this Jumbo so far, I have heard twice you can do that. The first is that we got an idea that, hey, we should try to do something new, something different, something that nobody has done before. We made a mockup. We made a mockup of that into an industrial NDT exhibition. I think it was in the U.S.
That was the first you can do that because we did not have it. We did not even have an idea how to do it. By the way, physically, it is pretty challenging to distribute the voltage through this long sort of path of the detector to read all the pixels. You can do that. We went with a mockup to exhibition and we were surprised that there was a lot of interest. There was so much interest that even the competitors got interested and saw why there is so much interest at our booth. We thought, hey, this is something we should try and do. We started to develop it and also then we were selling it. Actually, this product has been sold before it existed to an Italian luxury vehicle manufacturer.
Twice you can do that, but yes, there were people driving it and doing it, and I'm sure that we will have good success at the end. Why invest in Detection Technology? You've heard, I mean, the global trends are driving our growth. We are the trusted leader in CT and line scan. We have the big over 30-year history with the roots to the Institute of CERN, Nuclear Institute of CERN. We are fighting and winning in the toughest markets in the world, and by the way, there's a lot of Western companies who have not seen it yet, and that's coming. We are now positioning ourselves as a growth leader in the EUR 3 billion digital X-ray imaging detector market with high entry barriers. There's plenty of room to grow for us. There's plenty of nice pockets where the competition is not so red hot.
We are also expanding to new segments. We are targeting double-digit growth and profitability with a very strong financial position. The first headwind is not going to pull us down. We have an asset-light business model enabling profitable growth. It is easy to scale up from that point of view. We also are sufficiently investing into the future for new technology, including software and data-driven next-generation solutions. The manufacturing footprint is there. The agile and reliable global footprint supports our risk mitigation. I would like to thank you, and we would then finalize this with a Q&A. I would like to ask the management team to the stage for Q&A. We are here to answer your questions, and we also already have some online questions. I mean, if we start first with these people here on site.
Hi, Waltteri Rossi from Danske Bank. First of all, thanks for the presentation. A really good one. I'll start with the sales growth. If you look at the last three years, your growth has been below the 10% target, mostly due to the market, I guess. What gives you the confidence that the market will improve next year, or will the recovery take more time?
Yeah, if I start this, and then maybe Chen and Arve can continue, but I think the basis is if we first take the security. I mean, we see that this 100 milliliter, for example, issue in Europe is now behind. We already see forecasts and orders from our customers, so that starts to then flow through, and that's why we are quite confident on the first quarter. That's one thing.
Another thing is that, I mean, if we take the security in China, that has already, as a market, come quite the way down from it was, which means that it probably will not continue going further down. We should be somewhat reaching bottom there. Then we have the medical on like the China, I mean, after the healthcare reform and so on, that's passed. There already are bids, and we see some orders coming in. It's a bit bumpy, by the way. The medical business will be more bumpy than it was before because of the nature of it. Overall, I think the industrial market with the TFTs, you heard, we have a precise number, I think it's 57.
Chen was saying, as a humble guy, over 50, and I was talking 60, but precise number is we have 57% growth from cumulative this year so far on that. That helps. I think together, if we looked at, I mean, due to these structural things, there are certain things have been going down, especially the security in China. Even though we have been growing there and so on, and we have been compensating, we have not been able to compensate and grow beyond so much that we would have been able to reach the 10%. There are currencies and these kind of things also affecting. Anything more that I did not mention or so on, or Chen or Arve?
I could add that we have clear signs that our share of wallet of some of the biggest companies in the security business will increase a lot.
From my side, I think naturally we cannot, we do not have a crystal ball. I mean, we cannot predict what is going to happen, but we do have an understanding of the current market situation and the customer cases. I mean, that is our best estimation now.
The fourth quarter will still be fairly challenging. We go down as we have guided, but then first quarter is we start to then step up.
All right, thanks for the answer. The second one relates to the fact that the market, you see that the market has not been growing that much. I think it was 1% over the last few years. Yet you have been growing a bit faster. You also now estimate that the market will grow a bit lower at a lower pace compared to your previous estimates. What kind of makes you think that your competitive advantage has therefore even improved over the last few years?
I think we have exceeded the market growth so far. I mean, we have not been in this TFT business before. I mean, our sales was really, really small last year. This year we are already some nice single-digit million of EUR there as sales. That gives us also an extra boost for future.
Actually, about the TFT sales, that seems to be the most important growth lever. Where are we with that today? When should we expect TFT sales in medical and industrial segments?
Sh ould Chen and Juha maybe answer on that? We have already sales, like I said, single-digit sales, but I mean,
yeah, I mean, we already have good sales already in industrial. The 60% year-over-year growth that Hannu mentioned mainly comes from industrial and particularly from battery. We do see that the battery as an industry is growing very fast. As I also explained, we have already a good position. We have a good customer base. I mean, we are just at the starting phase of strong growth. Medical is a bit slow-moving. We have good leads. I said that we have good customers and we are offering, but with those big OEMs, they are talking about years when they adopt a new vendor into. That's true, and we have to wait for our opportunity.
Oh, thank you. I actually meant to say security instead of the industrial. What about security and TFT potential?
Maybe Arve can answer on here.
Yeah, in security, the TFTs are not playing a significant role. There are some niches there, but those are pretty small and we do not expect to have very big growth from that area. From some pockets, yes.
Thank you. Last one about the software sales. What is being done there today and what are your software and service sales? How do they look today?
It is integrated. Jyrki, you want to describe a little bit on our subsystems with software?
Yeah, basically as I was showing in my presentation, we are building enablers right now by adding more value and building subsystems first. That is the enabler for our upcoming software business. Currently we do not have a sellable software which we are actually selling out to our customers. We are working number one on the subsystem so that we have the enabler. Now we are exploring the software opportunities. So far, no software sales.
Thank you.
Hi, it's Matti Riikonen, DNB Carnegie. Couple of questions. You have talked about the software as an enabler, as Jyrki said, for a long time. Still, we kind of failed to see how that leads to revenue or actually margin increase. Which year do you think that we should be penciling that kind of numbers into our estimates coming from software or hardware software packages?
Actually, the software is in many of our products already in. It's in these kind of TFT panels. It's also in what we call as X-Scan for industrial scanning. The question here is that we will be increasing the share of software in our overall offerings.
Is it already meaningful in your numbers? Because if you look at your profitability for the past couple of years, of course there's been unusual times, but we kind of failed to see what value add the software actually brings. That raises the question, when should we start to expect that you would gradually start to climb in your margin numbers because of software and maybe the volumes as well?
If I answer that, it is gradually increasing our growth and it's inside. I mean, it's integrated. What's the value of hardware or what's the value of software when a customer buys the package and you need to have both? Do you, I mean, recognize the hardware as cost or you understand? It's actually a sort of subsystem.
All right. Moving on to the price competition, particularly in China, that has been particularly severe at the moment. You would always like to see from bad things that they come to an end. It seems that as long as there are players in China, there will also be the very fierce price competition. Is there a risk that your growth targets would be diluted significantly because of prices just coming down more than they used to? The players in China are not disappearing, at least in the short term.
Yes, they will not be disappearing. There is some, I mean, planned in some price erosion and so on. Chen, you want to describe a little bit more on that or?
We have our own estimation of the market price erosion level. When we make the plan forecast, we take that into account. That explains why the CAGR I presented for medical is 2%. The volume increase is actually much more than that. I think that for DT as a company, we are not afraid of price competition. Reason being that first of all, in this industry, we still have the volume. Combined with medical, security, and so on, we still have the volume compared to our competition in the selected market. Therefore, actually, there are a lot of things we can do to leverage from our volume to reduce the cost. I mean, there are things we can do better than in the past. Plus, DT has a reputation, as I said, a brand name that the customers are willing to pay a premium.
That sort of that if we all the players have to bend on their knees, I mean, DT would be the last one because we still have a little bit of headroom there.
Okay. You have earlier talked about 5%-7% as the normal price erosion annually. Do you have a new estimate for that, at least for the next one year, two years? I mean, clearly it has been more, but what's your internal estimate for prices coming down?
It's probably, I mean, it's very specific to products and competition and cases, but probably this 5%-7% is a good ballpark number. What would you, Matti, think?
Yeah, like Hannu said, it kind of varies quite a bit. It varies by the product and the customer segment as well as it varies by the market. In the low-end businesses, in certain cases in China, it is very fierce competition, whereas in some other cases with the regulated systems and others, it might be much less.
If I add to that, I think we try to be very selective also. I mean, sometimes there might be some case that we just want to take because we want to prevent the competition from getting in there. I call it the marketing cost and so on. It might be very, very tiny. Of course, we can't have too many of such cases. The basic public infrastructure, critical infrastructure, security market in China is very, very highly competed. I mean, like bus stations, subways, these kind of things. We are not there as much as we w ere before.
All right. Final question. When do you expect that you would start to get more material photon counting revenue from your products?
That's a good one. We've had some small revenue already, I mean, but it will stay as fairly small. Jyrki, you want to elaborate a bit on that on our roadmap?
Yeah, so I think truthfully, like major revenue from PCCT, especially so that goes beyond 2030. Market peaking at that probably 2035. Actually, Siemens has a plan to replace current technology with photon counting by year 2040.
It is one of the components in your 2030 plan. At which stage of the 2030 plan do you start to make kind of a couple of million revenue at least in the photon counting?
This pillar is for future. This is also beyond 2030. This is also that, I mean, we are talking, we are in the industry where the clock speed is very small. I mean, our customers' architectures are typically seven to ten years. We need to be also lucrative from the point of view future to our customers. I see our technology developed as synonym for marketing. We need to be interesting also, interesting and competent player for the future.
All right. Fair enough. Thank you.
Hi, Juha Kinnunen from Inderes. I was just wondering about the growth. You had a nice slide about it. It had the business areas and it had the geographical areas. Most of the growth was put on APAC. Most of that is China, I suppose. At the same time, my understanding is that the revenue share of China has been declining over the past years and you have been growing in the Western markets. I'm just wondering, are you expecting significant growth in China or is this other parts of Asia or is it just because you are going to the manufacturing is still anyway in China and the end market might be somewhere else?
I think if you look at our numbers, we have the China security has been coming down, but the medical China has been coming up. In a way, there's been sort of a swap. In addition, this year we also have the TFT now in industrial in China. Regarding the growth, APAC is EUR 33 million out of the EUR 65 million. APAC is twice, I mean, like 2/3 of the world's population.
The GDP growth is twice what it is in the Western world. We are looking forward for growth in China, but also in other, for us, the markets important are Malaysia, Japan, South Korea especially, a little bit Thailand, Vietnam, but I mean Malaysia, South Korea, Japan. India, actually we report as part of EMEA. Yes, and definitely we look forward for Indian growth. We look forward for being part and big part on the more than 100 airports that are now being built through our Western customers, but also through our local Indian customers. We look forward also to helping India to bring ports and borders and harbors for the 7,500 km coastline with our cargo detectors.
Thank you. My next question was going to be about India specifically, but you basically answered it. Maybe you could elaborate a little bit about your plans to grow in there. Is it just regarding the decisions of the government and then when it starts and then you will grow and make the products made in India? What are your expectations in general? Because there were no specific, well, estimates based on that.
I'll give this question for Arve, but I mean, first, India actually very much the security business has stopped for this year due to some regulatory things, but Arve can then continue on that.
Yeah, we have in India a very strong position in security markets with our line scan detectors. There is a huge on that market for us with the flat panels, both in medical and industrial flat panels. Their manufacturing in India is very important.
All right. One more question when I find it. Yeah, this was just a kind of a bigger question. It seems that you have made like another product family and you have plenty of these off-the-shelf products. I'm wondering, are you moving more towards that you have your own products and the clients can buy them? Or are you still tailor-making a lot of products and is that still part of your strategy and how is the kind of the share going to develop?
Ideally we would have modular products and we can, you know, the basic standard and then we can do some customization and also we increase the value then and the margins. Typically, our products have been customer-specific for computed tomography and then standard for security industrial like line scan products. Now this TFT, sort of, we are both having standard but also some customization. Jyrki, you want to take it further on the roadmap perspective what we have in the pipeline?
Yeah, so we basically do not design typically a single product. Our technology platform actually supports both making a custom if there is a high volume case by a particular customer, or we just continue with the standard. All these new products that we have introduced today are really scalable truly. We can do both.
Excellent. I do have one more if it is all right about capital allocation and your strong balance sheet. I am just wondering, how do you see the necessary investments? Because like you have said, it is a capital-light business. You have EUR 20 million-EUR 30 million net cash. Why is it not shared to the shareholders or why are you not buying your own shares? Is there some reason that you need a great deal of buffer, let's say it like that?
Yeah, I think the answer is first of all, buying shares would be a nicer idea, but there's some regulation that is limiting the volumes would be fairly small. I mean, we need also some buffer. We also look forward on increasing a little bit our inventories because we see that there will be shortages and so on. We have to be ready to support our customers' growth. We need to be prepared for possible M&A if interesting companies and possibilities arise. We also look forward on investing into our new technology. I mean, into photon counting, into sort of a high-performance circuit design, and also the software part. Part of these are not CapEx items. They are more P&L, but also part will be CapEx items. Altogether, of course, they sort of we need cash.
Fair enough. Thank you.
Hi, it's Patrick Campbell from Nordea. Just a question on TFT panels. You said that the sales are currently single-digit millions of euros and the target is to gain EUR 20 million by the end of the strategy period. Is it fair to assume that most of the growth from TFT panels will be driven by the industrial applications?
Do you want to take Chen that?
I think in the near future, you know, if we're talking about next year, the year after, it will perhaps industrial will still be the majority. We do hope that we can also grab some medical share within this period, strategy period.
You mentioned that the medical will probably take a few years at least. What do you kind of see as the potential as kind of the share of medical in the future?
You mean within this time span,
within the strategy period?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. It will be already significant, you know, maybe not to disclose a number, but a significant number from medical.
Thank you.
We continue growth in China. Next, we also will start to have Europe industrial customers. We already have our first European medical, by the way, approved one. I look forward for more, but it takes some years to get those into picture. Also U.S. and South America.
Joonas Ilvonen from Evli. You mentioned you aim to grow your customer share of wallet within security. What about within MBU and IBU? Also, do you have initiatives to further diversify your customer base, let's say within the industrial unit, like markets such as inspection of semiconductors or additive manufacturing or something like this?
Yes, yes. I mean, I think about so far the TFT growth in China has been very much on battery and EV as well as electronics manufacturing. That we look forward to continue. The next stage is the European NDT.
Okay. You mentioned that your industrial unit has relatively low operational efficiency due to its rather low volume. Do you also expect to really improve this now that you're aiming to grow IBU significantly? Do you expect it will work out like that, that you will also have larger customer volumes per?
In industry area, I mean, if we look, the medical has the biggest customers. They are like the GEs and so on. They are mammoths. Security in global terms, typically they are like mid-size, somewhere between EUR 500 million-EUR 2 billion. And then in industry area, typically the customer, they are smallest, but they also are like for medical, they are some big customers.
Right. If I can follow on that one, has the competitive landscape changed significantly within the medical market? As you said, the medical market is very consolidated among the few large OEMs. Has there been any significant changes to that recently? What about the security market? It's not nearly as consolidated as the medical market, but has there been any changes there in terms of OEMs?
Two questions. Medical for Chen and security for Arve. The consolidation in medical and how is it going forward?
I think the answer for medical is simple. It is changing. The landscape is changing. We do see, for instance, in the field that we are working in, a medical city as an equipment OEM, we see the uprising, you know, of a few Chinese players and they are very fast grabbing the market share. We also see new competition to our field in the CT detectors. I mean, that's also part of the life. We have to deal with it.
Okay. You are positioned more in the mature products, so you do not take that many product development risks. When it comes to your R&D levels, where do you see them developing now, now that you are emphasizing this software quite a lot? You already discussed this software question quite a lot, but can you just summarize? Do you see it growing across all the application areas? Not just within industrial and medical, but also within security and in all the different technologies, not just TFT.
Would you like Jyrki to take this one?
Yeah, basically we are putting R&D resources into photon counting. Our plan is to come out with product releases certainly before 2030. As I said, we expect the real business volumes and business numbers like 2035. Photon counting is certainly one place where we put our R&D head cheese. Software, as well as Hannu said, we already have like 20 plus firmware software engineers. We have been adding more staff on there and thus creating the capability for more software. So far, software is a part of our hardware. We sell the complete package. We do not have a separated software sales per se. Certainly these are the focus areas. Also TFT for sure. We are now in a good growth phase. In the short term, we will be investing into TFT R&D.
All right. Maybe a couple more questions. When we talk about the medical market, which segment do you see has most growth potential for you? Is it, for example, dental? It has been quite small for you historically. Also, you already talked about this TFT panel share within MBU. It was only 15% of your mix currently. Did you, or are you ready to elaborate where it might go in the future from 15%?
I assume that I will take the question. For the flat panels, we do see good opportunity in both dental and the surgical. Reason being that on the dental side, DT had the same flat panels, you know, the smaller flat panel for dental already, and we have a pretty good customer base. And we have been promoting our TFT and there's a strong interest. But as I said, that is a slow-moving industry. Then on the surgical side, there is a good overlap of the customer base with the CT. So and we have also been promoting and get a good feedback on our performance. But then, you know, it's again a slow-moving industry. We will follow up and we believe that we will, you know, have significant sales in both areas.
Maybe my final question. So this cargo segment within security, and you already mentioned this new X-Cargo product, you expect like EUR 10 million, expect it to grow by EUR 10 million by the end of this strategy period. Is it true that you kind of, I know, almost like from close to zero or so? Is it true that you did not really have a proper cargo product before this X-Cargo?
You want to take that one?
Yeah, we have some cargo sales, but not really this kind of surprising interest as we have with the X-Cargo platform, which then is like a step to the next level in cargo inspection.
Cargo business, it's interesting, also has been, I mean, it's in the U.S., it was quite hot, I mean, late 1990s and early 2000s and so on, especially towards the Mexican border and so on. It goes a bit like waves. Now there's a new growth wave sort of coming because of what's going on in Europe and the Ukraine war and so on, plus also Asia. Everywhere, of course, these geopolitical concerns have become on the table of the politicians and governments want to invest into security.
Thanks. That's all from me.
Thanks. Hey, let's take some online questions. We have some very good ones here. We have one for actually for Sari on people and culture topics. How would you assess your capability to engage the entire organization to practice continuous improvement and lean? How would you assess our lean capabilities?
True feedback, to be short. Lean Six Sigma is absolutely something that applies to all behaviors, be it leadership development, any capability development. Kind of the same measurements. Guy was speaking about being fast, doing more with less. Reducing variation, as an example, in leadership development is one of our targets. How we measure it is that we ask our people on the impact on the quality. From there, we understand how we stand today and where we are heading, setting targets against it. Perhaps that's the short answer around the feedback.
How would you score it in school, number from 4 - 10? Our capabilities.
Our capabilities in terms of what in particular?
Our peer, our peer competitors and so on.
That's a tough one. We are, let's say, evolving. We are on the journey. Culture is about behaviors and developing over time. I think we need to be pretty relentless and hard on ourselves and say that we have room for growth. Maybe on the scoring side, let's have the employee scoring, the feedback we are receiving from our people on our leadership as an example. From 1 - 4, we score at 3.5.
But then Kai has some numbers regarding the external sort of companies and so on, like on Kaizens per person. Kai, where do we stand on there?
As I mentioned shortly, we are now 6-7 per production workers per year. We are targeting 12 in the end of the strategy period. Toyota is level 15-50. I found something in the internet that's 50, and we have cooperation with Toyota as well. They do 50 per person per year.
We can be one of the highest in Europe with the number seven.
Yes.
There are a couple other from online. One is relating to the China risk. How are you planning to manage your China risk? Further, wouldn't it make sense to diversify your manufacturing footprint? If I take that one, we are diversifying our manufacturing footprint. I mean, we have now, we have invested in Oulu, as Kai was explaining, and it's possible that 15% of next year's revenue actually is made in Oulu. We are also now, we have the India factory inauguration in December. We want to be local in India. We don't believe that you can very long actually export products from China to India. You have to be local and help India to grow from that point of view. We already are working there.
A further question from the same person is that do any of your U.S. customers see China manufacturing as an issue? Actually the answer is we have not seen it. He's further asking that have you lost any deals because of this? The answer is no. Actually, nobody's making detectors in China. Everybody has a waiver. We also can sell to U.S. government because there's nobody who's making detectors in the U.S. U.S. companies and customers are very pragmatic. Of course, there's politics. I think the big topic is the sanction list. You cannot sell to companies who are listed in the sanction list.
That's something that we have to watch. We have a software system for that. Any time we ship, we check from the software because these things, by the way, these change. I think U.S. put just more than 20,000 new companies at the end of September to the sanction list. That was quite surprising. This is a little bit more of a political topic, not so much on companies.
I must state that we have lost sales quite considerable that we did not bring up. After the Ukraine war started, we lost 5% of our sales. This is something you see in our numbers. 5% we had sales for Russia and Belarus. That's out. Like I said, we have to be careful. There are some customers out there who happen to be or become to the sanction list that we cannot sell. On the other hand, we could have more sales. This is something that is restricting things. Looking a bit more on the online questions, and we sort of answered to this, but I still state it, and this goes to Juha on what measures is DT taking to develop sales of TFT products in Europe.
Yeah, okay. This is of course a big opportunity for DT. I believe that our success on improving the TFT sales or growing with TFT sales in Europe comes by understanding our customers' needs and how our products can solve their problems. For that is something which is typically quite a strong area for DT. We do understand customers quite well. We have now sharpened our sales organization also a bit to have more clear focus areas for all the customer interface people and so on to understand the applications better. The second thing I would like to highlight is pricing. Arve already touched this a little bit. Actually we are super competitive in Europe at the moment with the TFT sales. We have been quite aggressive on certain points as well. We actually believe that we have some room for price increases.
Maybe the third topic I would like to raise is that we definitely will put extra focus on these high growing applications. Defense definitely is one of those applications which is at the moment growing fast. They are using traditionally lots of NDT inspection CT in quality control tool in their production lines. Now, due to the situation, there is a big, big demand to ramp up new production lines and increase the capacity of the existing production lines. This kind of tools like the Jumbo here is aimed for that kind of purpose, that it can really improve the throughput of our customers.
Juha is now, Juha's number one target and priority is to sell TFT in Europe. That is part of the EMEA sales. As a proof of action, we are spending as an example next week two days in Germany with Juha on going and selling to customers there. Okay, one further question from online. This goes to Sari on performance culture. How has the company's performance culture evolved over the past three years and what initiatives are driving its development today?
Whoa, that's a big topic, performance culture. I'll try to be short. Looking at the past, I would say two things. We have been putting a lot of focus on clarifying and aligning our strategic targets, how we define them and communicate them across the organization to our people. This is this OKR-based target-setting framework that Hannu mentioned. We are following that up on a quarterly basis. Frequency has been enhanced there significantly, I would say. Second is on the skill.
We believe that performance culture is about behaviors. It's daily behaviors, us here. How do we in concrete terms speak to ourselves, collaborate with one another, and share the feedback, give and receive? So focus on skill development has been there. And when we look at, you know, the initiatives going forward, these are the ones, same areas where we continue to improve. Lean Six Sigma practices, continuous improvement again applies. So relentless development also in this front.
Thank you. We can turn back to the on stage. Any further questions? Thank you. I think we have concluded and thank you for your attention. Thank you everybody watching us online. It's been fantastic to share our strategy with you. And we are so proud of the company and looking forward for its growth. Thank you.