Welcome, everybody, to F-Secure's Quarter Three Interim Report session, both online as well as here in the room. We are going to have an investor day in about four weeks from now. So this time around, Sari, our CFO, and as myself, Timo Laaksonen, the CEO, we will leave some of the market dynamics and business model-related matters to later for that investor day. So we will really focus now on the Quarter Three results and the outlook. So let's get started. In terms of a recap of the major events in Quarter Three, our revenue growth was 3.5%, and out of this, actually, direct business was the stronger one, with over 5% growth. Partner business was continuing on the same, at the same pace as Quarter Two, so roughly 3%.
Now, in terms of direct business, we've been already performing well in billings in the past quarters, and now that good development has actually materialized also in revenue, as we see longer subscriptions, and there is always deferred revenue that only materializes over time. So direct business has done very well, and actually, I have to admit that they've clearly beaten our targets that we had set for this year. That's a great achievement. In partner business, on the other hand, our expectations were slightly higher, not massively, but slightly higher, and some of the things we've mentioned in the past are still holding us back on the partner business growth side. More about that a bit later.
We had very strong profitability in the quarter, slightly above our own expectations, and this is actually typical that we have a very strong profit in the third quarter, as our costs are slightly lower in the summer season, then with regards to what have we been focusing on in the past months, so more than anything, we've been focusing on our product and service development. Tons and tons of work has taken place, both with Total as well as with Embedded, and good results on those fronts. More about that on the next slide. We launched our Scam Protection module at the very end of June. I mentioned this at our Quarter Two release session in July, and now we've enhanced the capabilities in that one.
I'll also go into a bit more detail about why we actually named the whole quarter as Scam Protection Taking Off. We are in a transformation process into a clear growth company with high profitability. So this is a transformation that has been taking place in the company already for the past couple of years since we became independent as a consumer cybersecurity company, and now it continues. And what we're doing is that we are putting much, much more focus on the customers that we're serving instead of our more traditional approach, which we've had in place for a long time, where we have focused on regions.
So now we will be looking at the very specific requirements and needs of each of our business segments, and we are organizing accordingly, as part of the planning process that is ongoing and the change negotiations that are related to the same. We're also continuing our active work on providing carrier-grade services as well as carrier-grade product, and these have to do with the service levels that we are expected to provide to our partners, the availability levels we're supposed to have, the cybersecurity requirements imposed on us, and so on and so forth. So it's a very holistic activity that is going on, and you know, just one example of what we're up to is that we're in the very final stages of getting our ISO 27001 certification in place.
We've also had several changes in our leadership team during the third quarter. Three out of eight members. Actually, our Chief Revenue Officer joined on the 1st of October, so that bled into quarter four, but three out of eight have recently joined us, and that's already showing that there is always a new kind of dynamic and good energy, and that has definitely been the case for us. More about that in a moment. So those of you who have attended our previous quarterly releases have seen this one before. So the updates with regards to progress on Total rollout, I have a few numbers. So if you go through what you can see on the slide, I have a few pieces of additional data to share with you.
These numbers that I'm referring to are development between June and September of this year. The number of multi-module Total subscribers has grown by 6% in three months. Total multi-module subs grown by 6%. Total multi-module billings has grown by 13%, one, three. The number of partners who are now providing multi-module Total grew by 10%, and the number is currently 83. Eighty-three of our partners are already providing multi-module Total. Yet, we have still tons and tons of opportunity available for us for growth, as three quarters of all of our subs are still using a single module product from us. We have still, in a way, you could say, 75% of our subscriber base who could go for a more valuable product.
So there is still room for ARPU increase, clearly, within our partners and direct business. Overall, the Scam Protection module that we launched recently has got overwhelmingly positive feedback. I dare say that I have never experienced such a strong positive sentiment from the market that we're on the right track when we are expanding our proposition with this new module in Total, as well as embedded capabilities, so that's very strong. We went to market in the direct business with Scam Protection at the end of September, and our first partners are going live during quarter four. So we've signed multiple extensions to our services with partners, and the launches are expected now starting from quarter four.
And the positive average revenue per user development has continued both on direct business and partner business side. So the theory of Total increasing value, both for consumers, partners, and ourselves, has proven to be right and true. Then the second area of our business developing current offering and new products. So we've incorporated yet another set of capabilities that we acquired as part of the Lookout Life acquisition some 16, 17 months ago. Those have been added into Total. One more remains. The password management capability will be available in the beginning of the new year. We announced a few weeks ago that we have signed a major mobile service provider in Asia.
That service is expected to go live in the very first months of 2025, January, February timeframe. Hopefully, we can disclose the name at that point in time. We've made significant extensions to our embedded security portfolio. Maybe some of you remember that we announced earlier in the year that we have signed an agreement with a Tier One partner in March, and as part of that exercise, we have developed and expanded our embedded security portfolio, and those have now performed very well in the beta launch that this partner has made, and the production launch is expected now in quarter four. We've invested, I would say, heavily, both bandwidth and funds, to driving our sales and service capabilities to serve the Tier One segment. We've upped our capabilities in production operations.
For instance, our monitoring capabilities have been seriously enhanced. We've put a lot of emphasis on developer experience, as on the Tier One segment, few partners go with Total. The preference is to go with embedded security, so developer experience is of critical importance. In terms of partner care and overall service maturity, we've also made clear service upgrades to how quickly and how in what level of complexity our care is able to take care of, you know, the needs of our Tier One partners. About expanding into new channels and partners, new Tier One partnerships takes precedence over everything else on that front at this moment. We have a strong pipeline of prospects.
When we talk about this segment, we're looking at a relatively small volume of players. I'm coming back to that a bit later on. We don't have... You know, it's not about having hundred cases in the pipeline, but it's about having the right amount of cases where we have the right to win, and we believe that we have a very good shot at expanding our footprint in this segment in the near future. In terms of our new verticals in development, we've scaled down our investment level to a certain degree in Europe. We continue developing Europe, but we see that in Americas, especially in North America, but in Americas, there may be, let's say, faster opportunities for us to pursue.
So we are starting to scan and develop the market for new vertical partnerships, for instance, insurance companies and finance, also in Americas in addition to Europe. This is something that you have seen in different kinds of formats before, so you know, I don't need to go back into 2022 or 2023. This year has really been, for us, about you know, the new version of Total, integrating the capabilities of both F-Secure and Lookout Life into one single product, and we're just, like, an inch away from reaching the finishing line on that one. So that's gone very well, as well as the service turning into an experience that actually talks to people.
There's a whole lot more in the product now that, you know, takes into account what you're doing, what might be relevant things for you, and it talks to you. This has been something that has been very important for us to achieve, and secondly, the different modules of Total are now taking more into consideration what it sees about consumer behavior and potential threats as a whole, not only module by module. Embedded Security portfolio, I already mentioned that it's been enhanced, and that work continues. By the beginning of the year, 2025, we believe that there will be no other consumer security company out there in the field with a wider portfolio capabilities as we will have.
And new Tier 1 partnerships we have signed up to this year, and fingers crossed we can show more results in the near future. 2025 and beyond, our target is clearly, strategically, to become the undisputed leader among all segments of the communication service provider market, including Tier 1s. We've already been very strong in Tier 2s and 3s and 4s, and also on those fronts, we naturally want to grow and continue from success to success. But when it comes to Tier 1s, when they look for the ideal partner for consumer security business, that's the position we want to establish for F-Secure. A few words about what is the transformation about in terms of our go-to-market model and our more customer-centric approach that we're looking for.
This is the way that we are planning to set up our organization from the beginning of 2025. Four different business segments. Strategic partners being the, let's say, about top 30 service providers when we talk about communication service providers. Then, in the later years, naturally, we want to enhance that to other players, like insurance companies, banks, payment brokers, and so forth. We want to expand within the existing accounts and naturally sign up new ones. We are new to this market, so there is a lot of potential over there.
These cases develop relatively slowly, so if we've been in a market with partners in the past where we've seen that, you know, it takes a long time to win a deal, deliver a deal, and start seeing value, the strategic partners, the world's largest players, are potentially even slightly slower, so anything between 12-24 months is relatively typical as a sales cycle. Delivery, anything between six to 12. Heavy dependencies on the service provider's own IT availability and so forth, and then it takes time to ramp up a service. Unless the partner is immediately migrating an existing user base to our service, the growth will be phased over time.
What we want to provide as a value is naturally, as always, a unique partner experience where F-Secure shines brighter than any other company out there, as well as through Scam Protection capabilities. We are driving Scam Protection now with a very strong focus in our research. We have actually even changed the name of our research to Scam Protection Research. So innovation is what we're looking for on that front. In major partners and commercial partners, major partners are maybe you can think of maybe 30-40 of our partners, who are typically regionally very, very strong. So they may be, you know, leaders in a single country or leaders in a more restricted area of geography.
In our terms, currently about 35, 40, and the total addressable partner base on the CSP side, communication service provider side, is maybe around, let's say, 150 or so worldwide, so both on major partners and commercial partners, which currently is about 150 of our partners, slightly smaller, but very focused on certain regions of a geography or a country. Common aspect, in both cases, we are driving higher total adoption among partners' user base. As I mentioned earlier, there is still three quarters of our subs who are only using one single app or module from our offering, so there is a lot of potential for growth over there. On the major partner side, we're absolutely looking to sign up more partners.
On the major partner side, we naturally want to expand our offering, the value proposition with Total, with further Scam Protection capabilities practically every single quarter from now on out. On the commercial partner side, as I said, same task of increasing Total adoption among the user base, and then we are investing in an enhanced self-service partner business platform. This is, let's say, a continuation of what we've been working on for the past, let's say, eight to 10 years. Currently we call it Partner Portal, which is a very impressive combination and collection of different kinds of capabilities, which we provide for our partners, for them to drive their security business, with guidance on user journeys, marketing campaigns, and so on and so forth.
We are planning to turn that into an end-to-end business platform for our partners, starting from the commercial partners, and then in the next steps, also start serving our major partners with that same experience. In the strategic partners and major partners, we foresee that the customer experience will always be very high touch, but especially on the commercial partner side, we see that the self-service partner business platform will allow us to scale that business from the hundred and fifty partners we today have to hundreds, if not thousands more, that we could have across the world. In direct business, unchanged. Non-paid customer acquisition as the main driver in different ways.
Maybe you've seen that, for instance, free tools area, we've expanded that significantly this year, and that gives people a feel for what our services can do without actually acquiring them, and then providing a neat upgrade to a paid product. And what we continue to do is driving retention and ARPU. On the ARPU side, we're already hitting the target for this year. On the retention side, there is still some work to do, and we'll continue actively working on that front in the years in the fourth quarter as well as next year.
Just quickly, Scam Protection module, you can see there, rounded by the amber square, new kinds of capabilities that we've come up with in Scam Protection module: ad blocker, Wi-Fi protection, SMS protection, cookie pop-up blocker, and there's more to come now in quarter four. With regards to SMS protection, news from yesterday, so this is now available for iOS and Android users. So we won the Customer Experience Award at the first-ever Finnish AI Gala, sponsored by Business Finland and the AI work group in Finland. We have made it very clear that we want to be the best company in terms of security experience in the world, and winning this award feels especially good because it is all about customer experience, using AI to turn customers' experience into a better one while protecting people.
So this was a very happy piece of news that we got yesterday. Finally, the recent changes in the F-Secure leadership team, Bruno Rodrigues picking up three and a half weeks ago the responsibility as our Chief Revenue Officer globally, so responsible for both the three segments of partner business as well as direct business. Niina Lehto and Bruno joined us from Bitdefender, one of the cybersecurity companies out there in the world. Niina Lehto joined us from Nokia. She's driving our services worldwide. And Kaisa Tikka-Mustonen, our Chief People Officer, who joined us from Helvar, who joined us in the beginning of September.
So with these three new team members, I can say that we are ready for the transformation that we are really working on here in the company with their experience, insights, and energy. That's all from me. I will now hand over to Sari Somerkallio, our CFO.
... Hello, everybody. Let's look a little bit deeper into the financials beyond what Timo already mentioned. Our revenue was up by 3.5%, and the organic growth was 1.9%. I already got some questions why are we still talking about the organic growth? It's because this year, still part of the year, we didn't have comparable numbers, as we did the acquisition in June last year, so until the end of this year, we are going to show the organic growth for the, like, old F-Secure, and also, if you look at the small print, there is still this fair value, fair valuation of deferred revenue, which has an impact on the reported numbers, so that's also another reason why this is still relevant.
So the quarters this year and last year are not fully comparable yet. If we now focus on these reported numbers, FX did not have a big impact this time. So with the geographies, so the story continues like it's been already for some time. So it is outside Europe, where we have the best growth. North America growing nicely, but especially than rest of world, which is specifically Japan, where the big growth happens. You see the negative number in Europe, outside Nordics, and we mentioned it already previous quarter that we have some declining customers, and this is where you see this impact.
And the phenomenon was not new previous quarter, but it's been going on for some time, but we just decided that it is so significant that we want to say it. Timo mentioned how well total is going, so there are parts that are growing really nicely. But modest growth in total is related to the fact that we have still some of these declining partners. On direct side, a nice increase of 5.2% in revenue. Organic number was lower. And here we can say that the nice thing is that we achieved these numbers with practically no paid marketing. No paid acquisition cost, so a very good result thinking about that.
If we move into the expenses part, so here you see that the cost level has gone down since last year. In general, quarters are here fully comparable, so this actually means that we have spent less on OpEx. Why it has gone down? On admin side, it's similar to last year, so we've been cost efficient. No inflation coming through, basically. On the R&D side, this looks like it is a smaller number, but as we've said earlier during this year, so CapEx has been higher. So basically, we are capitalizing more of the work that we do internally. So if we look at, like, the gross amount we are spending there, so we are actually putting more money on R&D compared to last year.
But in OpEx, you see a reduction. And then in sales and marketing, so here we have spent, as per our plan, we have spent less money, especially on this direct business marketing, and that's why you see a saving here. And this has, of course, led to the higher profitability. If we first look at the left-hand side of this page, so the gross margin, which has come down from the earlier levels, so now this is since the first quarter of this year, so there is a small increase happening. So we are working on getting this number up.
It will be hard to reach the earlier numbers of higher than 90% with having so much more of embedded business, but we still work hard to get this on an upward trend, and we know what to do and there are also areas within the embedded business where higher volumes, which we see in the future with the Tier 1 strategy, so we will get some benefits of getting higher volumes. And on the right-hand side, you see that the Adjusted EBITDA at 40.3%, it is really good, and even if it is normally a good quarter with lower activity, leading to lower cost levels in Q3, so of course, really excellent result compared to last year.
So it is higher CapEx, which is related to internal work, very much lower marketing and cost efficiency in general, that we can say have led to this nice profitability in the quarter. Briefly about year to date, so here we still see that the reported growth numbers are higher than last year, significantly because of the acquisition impact. And this is something that next year we'll look at fairly comparable numbers. And in EBITDA, the same impact and even actually better growth than in the top line, development in the right direction, and where we see that the scale brings also profitability. Very briefly about cash flow.
We tend to have changes between the quarters, and you saw in Q2 that we had a very strong cash conversion, and it's about how things are around the quarter end. And now we had had good, very good cash flow in June, and this was reflected into what we see in the third quarter. But year to date, cash conversion at 75% versus just below 60% last year. So we can say that so far, cash flow is good, good during this year. In June, we for the first time we used our RCF, and we have paid that back, so no RCF in use at this moment. And in terms of some balance sheet KPI, so the deleveraging continues.
So, as you remember, our leverage target is to be below 2.5 times in a normal situation, and we are going in that direction, even if it is not so big differences from one quarter to another, and similarly, equity ratio is increasing. Regarding the outlook, now that we just have a few months left of this year, now we have narrowed the ranges based on our view of this year, and in growth we now say we'll be between EUR 144 million and EUR 147 million, which means that we don't expect, like, huge growth for the final quarter. Still, the Tier 1 benefits and growth, so that is still around the corner and will not help yet much in Q4.
And still, we see that these customers that are declining, so that impact is still there. So that is why it is limited. And in terms of profitability, so there we've narrowed this to EUR 50-53 million. And what is worth noting is the bolded text that is new in the background for the outlook. So we've had higher CapEx during this year, but we expect the level in Q4 to be clearly lower than it's been in the three first quarters. Because we have finalized some projects, and now we are using the same resources for other internal work. So there have been some project deliveries either have happened or are about to be closed now. So that's why that number will be lower. And finally, now reminding, we mentioned in...
after Q2, that we are going to have an investor day in November, and now we've sent out an official invitation for that. So please remember to register for that, and there we will dig deeper into the customer side and the offering, many of the things that Timo mentioned, so we'll go one step deeper there.
Thank you, and now we are happy with Timo to answer any questions.
Hi, Walter Rossi from Danske Bank. Thanks for the presentation. Also congratulations on the Tier 1 partnership you announced now. So a few questions on that, actually. The new Tier 1 partnership, can you open how you expect it to ramp up in terms of sales over the next few years?
Yeah. We're expecting a reasonable amount of revenue from it in 2025, and then growing most likely in multiples in the following years. Time will tell how well the service picks up. We have also entered this new Tier 1 account now with a relatively narrow part of our embedded offering, so there is room also to expand the scope with new capabilities, most likely having to do with something completely new, such as scam protection. So not only user-base related growth, but also expansion of the scope.
Maybe I could also comment that I know that our disclosure policy doesn't say any, like, exact limits to what we give as a press release or what we give as a stock exchange release. But the recent one and the one we announced in March, so they were press releases. So in that sense, not so significant that we would see that it would have an immediate impact on the share price. So if there is something that is so huge that it will really change the thinking, so then it will be a stock exchange release. But I know that we have not said what the limit for that is, but... And we are considering actually if we should define that.
All right. Fair enough. Thanks. Were there any startup fees from this latest deal booked now in Q3, or will some startup fees be booked in Q4?
In billings? Yes. And those startup fees are typically recognized over time, during the duration of the contract. But, in this case, not a massive amount. Clearly smaller than what we signed up in March.
All right. Okay, thanks. You've said previously that you have a handful of Tier 1 partners that you are maybe not negotiating, but in discussions with. So can you again kind of say what is the potential there among Tier 1 partners? How many Tier 1 partners are there to be won? And actually, how many do you consider Tier 1 partners from the-
Yeah
... existing ones?
I don't have a precise number for you, but I mentioned that we consider that there are roughly 30 communication service provider Tier 1s in the world that we can target. When you leave out the countries where you cannot go and do business reliably with cybersecurity, certain countries are ruled out for us, like China, Russia, so roughly 30, and we are already serving a number of these, and we hope to be able to provide you with a precise number in our investor day. I don't know it today precisely yet, but soon we'll share that number.
All right. That's helpful. Then, still, on the number of partners that there are, can you go through all these categories: strategic, major, commercial? You know, roughly how many are there, and how many do you have right now?
Yeah. So in strategic partners, we have roughly five right now, and those vary between massive scope and smaller scope. Like I said, in the relatively midterm, let's say the next three years, we see that there are about 30, 30 names that we will be going after. Then with regards to the major partners, we have about 35-40 currently. And there are maybe 150 or so in the world that could fit that category. Many of them in countries currently where we do not focus our operations, like the Middle East, Africa, Latin America. So we are focusing on a sub-segment of that for now. Then in terms of commercial partners, we have about 150 as of today, and the market is thousands.
All right. Thanks. Really helpful. Still on the ARPU, is it correct that I have in my Excel that you at the end of 2023, you had 72 partners selling total, and now you have 83?
We had 72 partners selling Total, either a single module or a multi-module. Now we have multi-module partners that are 83. So that's a big difference.
Okay. But based on those numbers, seems that the development has picked up this year.
With multi-module, absolutely, yes. With the introduction of Scam Protection, we will have even better chances to now get our partners to sign up for more than if they have, for instance, previously had only endpoint protection.
All right. Thanks. Still, two questions, actually. On your dividend kind of target, which is to pay 50% of the result as dividends, paired with your target to repay the debt by EUR 30 million a year, do you think those are both achievable? And should you do both?
Yeah, we are aware that there are some challenges with making that add up, and of course, anyways, we need to refinance the debt at some point, because during the maximum five years, we will not pay back all of it, so of course, this is something that we are all the time looking into, that how to refinance and how to make the formula add up, working on those same questions internally.
Okay. One last one on the cost savings and change negotiations you announced. Is it so that we shouldn't expect any kind of net savings impact from those?
Correct.
Yeah.
That's the correct assumption.
You're gonna invest all the savings back into the-
Yes.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. All right. That's it. Thank you.
Thanks.
Hi, it's Atte Riikola from Inderes. Maybe first about the declining partners in Britain and Germany, so has the situation gotten worse after Q2, or is it going in similar rate?
Similar rate. We have good expectations in terms of Germany, as the partner is migrating our service backends in quarter four to the latest version. So that will make them now total ready. Then how quickly they will be getting onto total is another question, but let's say that the readiness in that sense is now much better, and our projections are that that erosion will clearly slow down starting from the beginning of next year. With regards to England or the UK, we don't have reasons to believe that the situation would change in the short term.
All right, then maybe an overall, if you think about your market situation and outlook, I think you have earlier mentioned that you have seen some signs of improvement, but how are we in the situation right now?
Yeah. The market overall varies from geography to geography, and from what we are perceiving is that in the U.S., the market is relatively fine and healthy and normal. In Japan, we are seeing clearly increasing interest towards consumer security propositions, so that's a good one. In Asia Pacific, consumer security is not a primary need for many people in the lower ARPU countries in mobile or broadband services, so it's still... You know, there is interest, but it is limited in the worldwide scale. In Europe, the situation is not, or the market is, not good. Let's put it that way. It's not very bad either.
It was much worse, like, a year and a half ago, but it's not yet good, and as you know, Europe is a very important area of business for us, maybe something like 60%-
Mm
... of revenue, 65%, 60%.
Now when you have integrated the Lookout Life product portfolio into your own, so how is it affecting your R&D resources? Because I guess because there you have had some similar kind of products, and now there is no need to develop those, so how you're organizing the R&D operations now?
So we have everything in one product right now in terms of the app, but then we've been putting enormous efforts on the scam protection area, or massive efforts on the scam protection area, so that's all new. We've put a lot more focus on mobile-centric value propositions. F-Secure always used to have mobile apps also, but let's say that the capabilities within the mobile client have just mushroomed in the last year, I would say, and that continues. There is almost like an endless demand and hunger for more value in scam protection for mobile-first users, and then finally, our embedded security offering continues to develop at a rapid pace, and it will not stop.
I said that by the beginning of next year, we will have a very wide portfolio of services, but the demand from our bigger partners is once again, "We want more. We want more differentiation. We want a more holistic coverage of security for our consumers." So the innovation goes on at a rapid pace. I would say that there are shifts between different programs, but especially scam protection, mobile-centric approaches, and embedded security are all requiring more investment.
Maybe adding to that, so now the development is on the new integrated products and no, nothing specific for Lookout Life, but of course, there are some legacy products around where we have not migrated to the new platform yet. So some maintenance with, similarly to Timo just mentioned the Germany case, so there are also F-Secure legacy backends.
All right, and can you say anything about the CapEx, CapEx run rate going forward now when you have mentioned that the capitalization will go down in the coming quarters?
Yeah. Well, I think we just said about the quarter for this year. So. And it depends very much on the project we will have at hand because there is always some work if we get the Tier 1 deal and a significant embedded deal, so there will be something that will be CapExed. So it yeah depends on the deals. Now that we've done most of the acquisitions and integration work, so less of these like infrastructure type of CapEx projects. So most of that is behind.
All right, and it seems like the Q4 will be pretty soft on growth-wise, so if you look at the comparison period in partner general, I think the revenue was somewhat over EUR 33 million on that, so now this year you have been going below that and probably also in Q4. So was the comparable period somewhat strong, or was there anything special there?
No, typically, we don't have any significant seasonality. Something within direct business, but otherwise not.
All right. That's all from me.
... the chat, and the first one: Are you planning to update your long-term financial targets in the upcoming Investor Day?
Yeah. That is a good question. We launched our current midterm targets around the time of the acquisition, which was a year and a half ago, and it goes until 2026, which is already quite close by. So of course, we are looking into that.
One question on Europe. I think you partially already answered to this one, but have you recognized any new customers with declining user base during the quarter since European sales has gone down from the H1?
Are there new partners that might be declining?
Yeah, doing-
... against what we've already perceived before?
Yeah.
The answer is no.
Any indication or simple example how much scam protection could increase average ARPU?
So average ARPU, naturally, if you look at it across the whole partner business, for instance, or you look at it across the whole direct business, is very different kind of a ballgame. And also within our partners, like I've said, there are different module combinations that a certain partner is selling. But let's say that it can be anywhere between 15%-30%, somewhere around that. That gives a ballpark.
Thank you.
It makes the product, in general, more appealing, so we can maybe get users who would not buy into it without.
Yeah. Scam protection is specifically interesting for mobile users. Of course, also for desktop, but for mobile users it provides a lot of value. For instance, on iOS, it's been a struggle in an Apple environment to provide security capabilities, but scam protection is an excellent one in there.
Thank you. Those were all the questions from the line.
Okay. With no other questions from the room, we thank everybody for participation, and hopefully see many of you in the Investor Day coming up in roughly four weeks. Have a great day. Thank you.
Thank you. Bye.