Hiab Oyj (HEL:HIAB)
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Apr 30, 2026, 6:29 PM EET
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Status Update

Mar 30, 2022

Carina Geber-Teir
Senior Vice President of Communications, Cargotec

Good morning, all. Welcome to Cargotec's investor, media, and analyst call . My name is Carina Geber-Teir, and I'm heading comms at Cargotec. We have had some busy days this week, and based on the recent announcements and our stock exchange release from this morning, we will now talk about the refocused strategy of Cargotec. With me here in the studio, I have our CEO, Mika Vehviläinen, and our CFO, Mikko Puolakka. We will start this call with a presentation by Mika, and following that, we will have a Q&A session with both Mika and Mikko. Please pay attention to the disclaimer. Mika, I will hand over to you now, please.

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Thank you, Carina. Good morning from my behalf as well, and thank you for participating for this Cargotec refocus strategy info session . As you know, we announced yesterday our cancellation of merger with Konecranes. Obviously, this planned merger was our priority. However, we have seen for quite a while now the uphill battle we have with the competition regulators, and hence we've been working together as a team in Cargotec, developing an alternative direction. It is a direction that will deliver strong shareholder value for Cargotec owners. Today, I'm very pleased to share this new strategic direction with you. Let me share with you how we are going to build a new path forward. The future Cargotec will be a more focused company. We will drive sustainable growth around our core businesses, and I come back to the definition of core business in a moment.

We will leverage our competitive advantages in our market positions, our technology offering, and our service capabilities, and we will leverage our strong balance sheet to accelerate the growth through mergers and acquisitions and investments in our core capabilities. How does this new plan look like? First of all, our strategic direction remains the same. Our focus remains in driving sustainability and profitable growth. We know where we are going, but we need to also streamline and refocus. What does this mean then in practice? Here are some of the main ingredients, and I come back to these ones a bit more in detail during the presentation. Hiab remains very much core of our strategy. It is a high-growth, high-performing business, and we plan to accelerate the growth further in Hiab.

In Kalmar, we will focus our offering around mobile equipment and horizontal transportation and related services, leveraging the strong market position we have, our services business and capabilities in automation, robotization, and electrification. We are planning to exit the heavy port crane business. We have also announced today that we are starting a strategic evaluation around the options for MacGregor. Why have we decided to do so? The selected core businesses are our most profitable businesses. They are the businesses where the market structures are attractive, and our market positions are strong. They are also the businesses where the high proportion of the recurring revenues from our services business, where we still have a lot of opportunities to develop them further, and also from the product replacements.

We have an installed base of tens of thousands of equipment with relatively short life cycle, and that drives the continuous revenue from the product replacements. These businesses represent the higher growth opportunities for us, both organically as well as inorganically. With these choices, we have a considerable higher financial performance almost from the outset with the better and higher growth opportunities. How does this new Cargotec would then look like? The future Cargotec business will be built around our market-leading products and services. Our services business is progressing well. We had another record year in 2021, and we have great growth opportunities still. We have significant room for sort of self-help, still improving our basic services, areas such as spare parts, capture rates or maintenance contract attachment rates.

Increasingly, we have opportunities to drive our advanced services through our digitalized offering and increase in number of connected products in our installed base. Our equipment business is growing through underlying mega trends such as e-commerce, urbanization, construction, and moving sort of the delivery and logistics chains as such, but also through the technology evolution and technology changes as the introduction of the automation, robotization, electrification will drive up the equipment value. With the huge installed base of tens of thousands of equipment, these product areas have a high recurring revenues coming from services, but also from the continuously happening product replacement business. In these product areas, we also have great opportunities to grow inorganically through M&A, through product adjacencies and regional expansions. How does the future product portfolio would look like?

Hiab remains obvious as it is, and we have great opportunities to expand that business further. In Kalmar, our focus will be around mobile equipment, Bromma, which is a fantastic business for us with strong market position and good profitability, and horizontal transportation, where we are clear number one in the market today, and we have a clear technology edge against the competition there as well. As well as then all the related services, leveraging our capabilities in automation and electrification. We plan to exit the heavy port crane business either through ramping it down or potentially looking for a buyer for that business. As already said, we are now starting the strategic evaluation of the MacGregor business. What are these changes then meaning from the financial point of view?

First of all, these are the Cargotec 2021 numbers that you're already familiar with revenues about EUR 3.3 billion and operating margin of 7%. Now, if I look at this business by business, obviously, Hiab numbers remain as they were in 2021, and MacGregor numbers stay as they were in 2021. To help you to better understand then the implications, we have now split the Kalmar business into the focused areas and areas that we plan to exit. In Kalmar's case, that means that roughly, sort of EUR 100 million of the revenue with the heavily negative operating margin is moving out of the business, and the remaining Kalmar business was operating actually at the double-digit operating margin.

It's also important to notice that the core businesses actually enter 2022 with the record high backlog in the core businesses around the mobile equipment and Hiab with EUR 2.1 billion of order backlog. That gives us a great basis to actually move forward. If you look at this change and take a hypothetical assumption that the Cargotec, MacGregor would not be part of the Cargotec business anymore, we would have exited the heavy crane business. How would 2021 numbers look like in Cargotec case? That would have meant that our revenue would have been around EUR 2.6 billion. Our operating margin would have been about 10.1%. Service sales, about 31%. It's also very well-balanced portfolio with both Hiab and Kalmar being about EUR 1.3-EUR 1.5 billion revenues.

It's also good to know that these businesses, the so-called focus businesses, have delivered a combined double-digit operating margin for the last eight years. Few words about all of the businesses. Hiab obviously is excellent business. It has a great track record of delivering profitable growth. Between 2013 and 2019, before COVID impacted, Hiab had actually grown 7% on average over the years. This growth is supported by the mega trends, urbanization, construction, e-commerce, and other modes of delivery and logistics growth as well. In Hiab, we plan to continue to drive the growth at twice the rate of the market. There are also great opportunities in Hiab services, again, self-help, spare part capture rates, maintenance contract attachments.

More and more and increasingly, we see opportunities to add value and drive value for our customers through the digital development and high number of connected products, giving them better customer insight. Also, in Hiab, the technology plays increasingly important role, and the electrification of the truck fleets, and then automation, making the deliveries more easily for a lower qualified operator, are important value drivers for our customers. The technology development and investments in Hiab will further drive opportunities for growth and margin expansion. Also, as Hiab has multiple adjacent opportunities, we have a solid pipeline of acquisitions, and we also have a track record of delivering successful acquisitions, such as the Effer and Galfab that was announced at the end of last year.

We keep on pursuing those M&A opportunities, both in terms of product adjacencies as well as the geographical expansions. In Kalmar, we will shift our product focus. Kalmar Mobile Equipment is a great business. It has delivered over 10% operating margin in all last eight years, and it has grown actually in average about four percentage points. Again, here, the mega trends in terms of the logistic shifts and changes in the industry are driving the underlying growth, and our market position is great. We are actually number one in most of the product categories in here.

Compared to the heavy port crane side, the market structure is considerably more attractive with large number of smaller customers and the steel content, for example, of those in products is a lot less and the technology intensity is growing and our sort of technology advantages is going to deliver us even stronger position there. Our technology position is very strong, and we are leading the market, for example, in electrification and robotization, and all of these products are now available in electronic form, electric format as well. As I already said as well, we are now starting the review on MacGregor. MacGregor is a good business with a very strong market position and good growth prospects. Now, the question for us is, does that fit into our refocused strategy?

MacGregor is a market leader in all of its main segments, both in merchant as well as in offshore. The growth outlook actually for MacGregor right now is good. There has been a change in cycle in merchant sector, and we see rapidly changing energy environment driving good opportunities in offshore, both in terms of renewables, i.e. offshore wind, as well as we are likely to see sort of further expansion and investments in the oil and gas sector as well as the European sort of energy landscape is changing due to the Ukrainian war. Also, after the acquisition of TTS, MacGregor team has done a fantastic work to put the business in a great shape.

When we are looking at the future direction on the Cargotec, now MacGregor does not necessarily fit into that one, but it's a good business with the right owner. Hence, we have started the evaluation of the strategic options, including the sale. Now, let me share with you next what you should be expecting from us in the next 12 months. As said, we are now starting the strategic evaluation around MacGregor, and we will keep you updated as that evaluation is going forward. We also plan to keep you updated on the other actions, including the port and heavy crane business, and our plan is to hold a Capital Markets Day later this year with the more detailed information.

In terms of the capital allocation moving forward, obviously we will accelerate the M&A pipeline in our core businesses around Hiab and around core Kalmar product areas. We are continuing to drive the competitive advantage we have in technology by investing into electrification, robotics, and digitalization. We maintain a very strong focus on our Mission Climate actions because the climate changes and the sustainability is a great business opportunity for us. Obviously, as a part of these changes, we are then also reviewing the operational mode and the group functions with the refocused businesses. The great thing for us, of course, is that despite the uncertainty introduced by the merger, our top leadership, as well as the leadership levels in the next two layers, have remained pretty much intact. This, of course, gives us great basis to move the strategy forward at the rapid pace.

Also good to note that these changes do not impact our 2022 guidance. Our guidance still remains that the comparable operating profit in 2022 will be higher than it was in 2021. Now, I think that I strongly believe that refocused Cargotec is an attractive investment opportunity. In all of our core businesses, we are either clear number one or at least a strong number two. These are also markets that are highly attractive from their structure point of view, and these are markets that have an underlying growth that is visible in our numbers as well. We also have a very strong balance sheet, and we can leverage that balance sheet by investing into the M&A and investing in our technologies.

We will have a very strong businesses, high operating margin businesses that will produce further cash flow for those investments. The climate change is a great business opportunity for us, and we keep on investing on those opportunities by accelerating our efforts in electrification, robotization, and digitalization. We are making good progress in our services business. We still have significant opportunities, both in terms of the more basic self-help type of efforts, as well as more and more in the advanced services through digitalization and connected products. The ambitious climate focus and the strong commitment for the sustainability remains very much in core of our strategy. Personally, I'm very excited about the new focus strategy. I am absolutely convinced that this will deliver significant value for our shareholders, our customers, and our employees. Thank you for listening in.

Carina Geber-Teir
Senior Vice President of Communications, Cargotec

Thank you, Mika. A great opportunity with a lot of actions. I think we are ready for questions together with Mika and Mikko. Please, operator, do we have any questions?

Operator

Thank you. Just as a reminder, if you do wish to ask a question, please press zero one on your telephone keypad. Our first question comes from the line of Aurelio Calderon from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.

Aurelio Calderon Tejedor
Equity Analyst, Morgan Stanley

Hi, good morning. Thanks for taking my questions. I've got two. I'll take them one at a time, if I may please. The first question is around how easy you think it will be to exit the heavy crane business in Kalmar and all the services that you do for those large cranes, if you see any risk of losing those, if those would be part of a potential kind of discontinued operations, or if you still plan to service those cranes. If so, what is the risk that you may lose those sales?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

First of all, in terms of exit, we will exit that business. We are obviously looking for a potential buyer that portfolio would fit into that one. In case we can't find a buyer, we will simply ramp down the business. We will not take any further business in, on that one. The services business we plan to retain, and I think we have the capabilities and a great team to actually service those ones. We already today do quite a bit of third-party services and trade modification, et cetera. I see good opportunities to retain in that business as long as we have the capabilities to serve our customers well.

Aurelio Calderon Tejedor
Equity Analyst, Morgan Stanley

Okay, thanks. In terms of any potential dis-synergies from the exit of the heavy cranes business and the MacGregor business, are the businesses really integrated from a procurement standpoint, or are they really independent and run as kind of four different legs of your portfolio?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

There obviously has been sort of certain shared sort of sourcing, but the sourcing comes from a very different sort of sources in a sense, because MacGregor, of course, the sourcing primarily happens next to the shipbuilding, in China, close to Chinese shipyards, in Korean shipyards, et cetera. Whereas in the heavy crane side, we will then source next to our production facilities as well. Again, as we plan to sort of actually exit sort of the potentially all the heavy crane side as such, we would not necessarily seek for the synergies. Our future business will be more around the sort of a smaller higher profitable equipment.

Aurelio Calderon Tejedor
Equity Analyst, Morgan Stanley

If I can just squeeze one more in. On Hiab, you're mentioning that you would be looking to new product adjacencies or expanding geographically. Is that a focus in the U.S. or would you try to expand even more in APAC?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Both and obviously there are still a good number of sort of smaller local companies that usually have a relatively high market share locally with product offering. In Hiab kind of business, the barrier to entry is quite high. Typically you would say that if you are below 20% given product market share in any given market, it is very difficult to make a profitable business. Customers require a good service network and presence because obviously the equipment is mission-critical. We can identify and see a number of sort of local champions, both in APAC as well as in Europe as well as in U.S., Galfab being one example of that one in U.S., where we have a sort of continuous discussions going on.

The pipeline overall is relatively strong, but obviously a lot of these businesses that we talk to are family-owned, and they have their own set of dynamics and sometimes it takes quite a while until those deals are actually carried out. We keep on developing the pipeline, and that looks very promising.

Aurelio Calderon Tejedor
Equity Analyst, Morgan Stanley

Great. Thank you very much.

Operator

The next question comes from the line of Antti Kansanen from SEB. Please go ahead.

Antti Kansanen
Senior Equity Research Analyst, SEB

Yeah. Hi, Mika and Mikko, thanks for taking my questions. Sounds like a quite value-adding plan, if I may say so. I have a couple of questions on the exits, first of all, on the Kalmar side. If you don't manage to sell the business and you are ramping it down, what would that kind of look like? What are the dedicated assets that you have in that business, the amount of personnel that you have and so forth?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Yeah, if we are not able to sell that one, then first of all, we have existing commitments that carry out till 2024, 2025.

Mikko Puolakka
EVP and CFO, Cargotec

Late 2024.

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Late 20-

Mikko Puolakka
EVP and CFO, Cargotec

Early 2025.

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Yeah, late 2024 in terms of obviously we are committed to sort of carrying through those projects. It's a very asset-light business model. We don't have any manufacturing. All of those cranes are subcontracted primarily in China at the moment, and also the personnel related directly to the sort of design of that one is quite limited. Quite a lot of the engineering work, after that we disbanded that joint venture in China, was actually moved into the external engineering services company as well. The potential employment effects and restructuring is relatively modest because it is a sort of high, very asset-light business model we are in already.

Mikko Puolakka
EVP and CFO, Cargotec

The whole Kalmar business area assets employed at the end of last year was approximately EUR 630 million, and majority of that is related to the mobile equipment, so the high volume equipment business.

Antti Kansanen
Senior Equity Research Analyst, SEB

Okay. On MacGregor, I mean, it didn't sound like it would be core asset in the case of the merger would have gone through. Is this something that you have been in planning and discussions already regarding potential buyers and so forth, or are you now kind of starting that process from today onwards? How should we think about the timetable of finding a buyer for that asset?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

As you know, it's very hard to predict what the timetables in this one is. We are now starting the process.

Obviously, it's been under consideration for quite a long time, but right now, this is a good time to look into that one because it's very clear that the market has turned around after this was an extremely long, much longer sort of downturn than I think anybody expected in maritime sector. It's good to see now that both the merchant marine sector had a very strong vessel order intake in 2021, and then also changes in the offshore environment are making this a good time to consider the potential exit in that business.

Antti Kansanen
Senior Equity Research Analyst, SEB

Okay. Then the last question from me would be on the core, on the remaining businesses. The services share was roughly 30% last year.

What are your expectations going forward on accelerating the service growth beyond the equipment growth, and what are kind of the relevant target levels that new businesses can achieve over, let's say, five years or even longer?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

I think we will come back to the more detailed target setting. I am aware that we don't have all the sort of numbers yet there later this year with the Capital Markets Day when we are progressing with the plans. If you look at our services businesses in Kalmar and Hiab, we've been growing at a good clip, sort of close to a double digit some years or double-digit numbers, some years high single-digit numbers. As I said, it's sort of still a very good opportunity for us.

We still have quite a bit of work, sort of self-help wise, in terms of still driving in certain markets, the spare part capture rates, still driving to higher attachment rates in maintenance agreements. Our performance by market to market still varies, and we need to sort of bring up the whole performance level to acceptable level. Increasingly, we see opportunities in sort of where more and more products are connected. We get data from there, we get good insights on that one. How do we develop more advanced services together with our customers as well? I think it's an excellent growth opportunity, and I would say that the growth numbers you would see, and I see no reason why we should not be able to at least maintain that level going forward.

There simply are a lot of opportunities just sort of taking the service market that is already there today.

Antti Kansanen
Senior Equity Research Analyst, SEB

Yeah. Then regarding investments in these core businesses, is there something that you've been holding back throughout the merger process that we now perhaps see accelerating CapEx or accelerating M&A after the future now looks clearer in that regards?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

I don't think as such the CapEx requirement. As you know, we have very asset-light operating model, and as long as the current capacity in our manufacturing locations will stay, I don't see an increase in CapEx requirements.

It's certainly so that in f rom technology point of view can be sharpened further and focus even further the capabilities we have developed, for example, around the port automation now more into directly into the horizontal transportation and then around the mobile equipment. Some of that capabilities, as I already said in my presentation, in Hiab we require more and more robotization and automation capabilities also as that offloading and loading becomes more automated down the road as well.

Antti Kansanen
Senior Equity Research Analyst, SEB

All right. Thank you, guys. That's all from me.

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Thank you.

Operator

The next question comes from the line of Johan Eliason from Kepler Cheuvreux. Please go ahead.

Johan Eliason
Equity Research Analyst, Kepler Cheuvreux

Yeah. Hello, Mika and Mikko, and congratulations. I think this was obviously a logical move after the deal fell apart. Maybe it should have been with Hiab done the other way around, but who knows? Just on MacGregor. So that was obviously on the table already before you joined the company to sort of be separated out. What makes you think it will be possible to do this time around? I noticed you say something about legal comments if you are able to sell it also. I mean, you have these Chinese joint ventures. Would it only be possible to sell it to your Chinese joint venture partners, or could sort of Korean, Japanese guys also bid for the business?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Well, first of all, of course, we have not done any decisions yet to sell that. We are starting the evaluation around that one. Of course, that evaluation then will include, you know, the potential buyer analysis and others, et cetera. I'm not aware of any legal restrictions we would have in our joint venture businesses in terms of change of ownership as such.

Johan Eliason
Equity Research Analyst, Kepler Cheuvreux

Okay. I think I thought you wrote something in the presentation here, something about legal. I thought they were related to those, but it's not.

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

No, I think they're obviously like all of these changes, they are subject to the sort of employee representative discussions and agreements in there as well.

Johan Eliason
Equity Research Analyst, Kepler Cheuvreux

This time around, why do you think it will be possible to sell it rather than in 2012?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Again, we have not made the final decision to sell it. I think when I look at 2012, I simply think it was a good value creation opportunity. I guess it was maybe a year or two or three years late at that stage, because what we saw happening, of course, was the downcycle starting that obviously impacted the valuation of the business as well. Now, the downcycle has been considerably longer than I think anybody expected in the maritime sector. If you look now at the market development, we see very good growth prospects for the business. Usually that's the better opportunity to look for potential buyers if we decide to do so.

Johan Eliason
Equity Research Analyst, Kepler Cheuvreux

On the larger port cranes, which are closing down or maybe finding a buyer for it, can you say anything about the installed base? What sort of market share would they be having out there? What sort of service business are you having with them today?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

It's part of the reported service business in Kalmar, but it's a smaller, clearly smaller part than the mobile equipment related. It's good to remember that a lot of the port service business is in-house as it's heavily unionized. By far our biggest service business is around the mobile equipment and related services, where you have a lot of industrial and smaller customers who are quite used to sort of outsourcing to service opportunities.

Johan Eliason
Equity Research Analyst, Kepler Cheuvreux

Now, I mean, you have historically said this has been a break-even sort of business. I guess that included the strats and the shuttle carriers as well. Is it fair to assume that all the profits you had was from the service business, so this comparable operating profits of - 20.8% is basically matching the profits you have from the service business?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

The two profitable parts of that business have been the services business and then the straddle business. In straddle, as I said, we have a very strong market position, and we have a very, very strong technology offering there as well at the moment. Really, I mean, the evolution, and I've been around this quite committed personally also for the port automation for a number of years, and I think that's still going to happen. Very clearly what we see that in the heavy side, that automation is overshadowed by the effect of the very high steel content you have on those cranes. The very heavy competitive pressure coming from Chinese suppliers who are also investing into automation and the market structure that has a very high buying.

You know, you have a very concentrated power base of port operators buying that equipment. You compare that to mobile equipment, which you have considerably smaller customers, high spread of customers, large number of customers. Your market structure is considerably more healthy. The barriers to entry are higher there because you require the services networks and resale networks to be able to do that one. The straddle business is a very good business for us. We plan to maintain that one. The straddles are actually manufactured in the same facility in Poland as our mobile equipment as well. There are synergies in there as well. We, as we already discussed partly in previous question, we plan to maintain all the services offering also for the crane business when that's available.

Johan Eliason
Equity Research Analyst, Kepler Cheuvreux

Okay. Thank you very much.

Operator

Just as a very final reminder, if you do wish to ask a question, please press zero one on your telephone keypad now. We have one more question from the line of Massimiliano Severi from Credit Suisse. Please go ahead.

Massimiliano Severi
Equity Research Associate, Credit Suisse

Yeah. Hi, it's Massimiliano. Thank you for taking my question. I have two, actually. The first would be on automation projects, do you see disadvantages in not being able to have a full suite of products anymore? I mean, in the past you had also Navis, and now you're exiting the larger cranes business. Do you think it's a headwind for the Kalmar One sales going forward? Or since it is OEM-agnostic, you can sell it basically to everyone and you don't see headwinds from exiting the large cranes businesses?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Yeah, that's a good question, and I think Johan touched that partly already. Our thinking around the port automation has, of course, heavily evolved over the years. We started with the thinking that there will be a complete package and sort of almost pre-integrated automation solutions for greenfield ports. That included automation systems from Navis, our own automation system, and then related products. When we now look at the automation market, and I think that's still sort of continuing, but it's very clearly almost exclusively on the brownfield implementation. It's done piece by piece, you know, port area by port area and quay by quay. It's very clear that sort of the complete offering is not really required because most of the customers are buying these in separate packages at the moment.

We can still offer the automation sort of control system, TLS as we call it, Kalmar One, for the customers who would like to connect the equipment in the same areas as well. That certainly will be available from us as well. We see it's quite important that the equipment competitiveness we have in the straddle options is just extremely strong at the moment, and we will be very much focused on delivering those capabilities.

Massimiliano Severi
Equity Research Associate, Credit Suisse

Yeah. Makes sense. Thank you. My final question would be on the Stargard factory in Poland. It was part of the divestment package. In case you find a buyer for the large cranes businesses, would it potentially be something that you could dispose or sell it to a client? Now Stargard is back as part of the core businesses and it will stay in Cargotec's perimeter?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

A good question. I probably should have been more clear. The only sort of heavy side that actually has been manufactured in Stargard was the straddles. Now that the straddles will remain in our portfolio, all the operations we have in Stargard will remain. When we talk about the heavy port crane side, such as the ASCs and gantry cranes and STSs, those are actually not manufactured in Stargard. They are manufactured by external parties, primarily in China. As I said already, that part of business is very asset- light. We don't have any of our own manufacturing operations there.

Massimiliano Severi
Equity Research Associate, Credit Suisse

Perfect. Thank you very much.

Operator

We have one final question from the line of Erkki Vesola from Inderes. Please go ahead.

Erkki Vesola
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Inderes

Hi, Mika, Mikko. Can you hear me?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

We can hear you fine, Erkki.

Erkki Vesola
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Inderes

Yes. Thank you. Well, if you discontinue with the, for instance, RTGs and RMGs, don't they have the same customers as the straddle carriers have? I mean, is there a risk of losing customers when you kind of narrow your offering?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

I think what we have already seen actually is that these are very large buyers with very sort of high own technology development and need and very clearly when we look at all the deals that we have had lately in the last few years and all the deals that are upcoming, people buy specific products based on their own competitiveness. This kind of complete solutions are not really very much in the cards anymore. We feel that our technology offering is such competitive in the straddle business that that will sort of continue and we don't really see a sort of combination of the different crane types on that one.

If one needs, these straddles can be then connected to the automation system by our own or by a third party.

Erkki Vesola
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Inderes

Okay. Thank you. Still coming to the port crane profitability. You mentioned the Chinese competition, but what weight would you put on lack of volume there, and or has there been poor execution, et cetera? What's your take on that?

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Yeah. I think it's a fair comment. I mean, one thing we have to admit that the plan to actually move the heavy crane business into the Chinese joint venture was, I think, on a high level, a good one. In hindsight, of course, the competitiveness of that business did not remain at the level we were in there. We did not have the volumes that are probably required on that one. Simply, from market structure point of view, it's a very challenging market because you have a very concentrated buying power, heavy Chinese competition, and a lot of steel content on the product structure. It's that combination. I think there are limits on how good that business can be, even if you execute very well.

Erkki Vesola
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Inderes

Okay. Thank you so much. My comment is that you are going in the right direction. Congratulations for that.

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Thank you, Erkki.

Operator

As there are no further questions, I'll hand it back to the speakers.

Carina Geber-Teir
Senior Vice President of Communications, Cargotec

Thank you for the great questions. Thank you, Mika, Mikko. As Mika already mentioned, we will come back with a Capital Markets Day later this year. Meanwhile, there will of course, be the Q1 result, the 27th of April. Thank you, and stay safe.

Mika Vehviläinen
President and CEO, Cargotec

Thank you.

Mikko Puolakka
EVP and CFO, Cargotec

Thank you.

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