Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to Ülker Bisküvi's Q2 2024 earnings conference call. At this time, all participants are in a listen-only mode. Please note that this call is being recorded. Following the presentation, there will be a question-and-answer session. I will now hand over to Beste to introduce the call.
Thank you, Tim. Hello, everybody, this is Beste from Ülker Bisküvi. Welcome to Ülker Bisküvi second quarter financial and operational webinar. Here with me in the room are CEO Mete Buyurgan and our CFO Fulya Banu Sürücü to discuss the second quarter results. I'm now handing over to our CEO, Mete Buyurgan , to start the webinar, Mete Buyurgan , go ahead.
Thank you, Beste. Hi, everyone. Welcome to our second quarter investor meeting. Let me share some key highlights, before more detailed information. As you know, one of the most important priority for us as Ülker is market share. It's always a big priority for our existing markets which we are operating in, and I can say that we are keeping our leading position in every market which we operate, actually, especially in the domestic market. I would like to say in the last three, four months, we keep increasing again our market shares. In terms of operational, financial update, we keep the pace on our consistent operational performance across key metrics.
Effective product mix and supply chain management, operational management is in a good place again, and key focus on operational profitability as we are going to announce in the next coming slides, we are having very great, greater performance on our profitability levels. In terms of sustainability, you know, so we had implement— We had started to implement our sustainability program about, like, nine years ago, and we are right now becoming a global benchmark standard, actually. So we got so many awards, but one of the key highlights for our sustainability program, as a new news, is our Ülker Bisküvi Turkey factories have received a zero waste to landfill certification. This is another groundbreaking milestone for our sustainability program.
Right now, we are working with third parties as well, so we are focusing on regenerative agriculture program together with our farmers. So this is going to be another new phase, new chapter of our sustainability program in the next coming two years. As you may know that there is a slowdown in domestic market based on the government action in order to reduce inflation and almost every segment of the consumption in every segment, consumption are decreasing right now based on the depends on the slowdown in the country, in the economy. In fact, as you may remember from the first quarter investor meeting, we had expected slowdown in advance on our AOP assumptions.
So we are confident through our performance, but also we are confident on the next coming quarters, how we are going to manage the slowdown in a great way, actually. So we are in line with our targets, year-end targets, but also we are getting precautions. On the other hand, we are having lots of advantage versus slowdown in the economy and the consumption, thanks to our low-cost operating model. It is giving us a huge agility and the flexibility to keep our profitability levels in the same manners. Another important update, or highlight, is our bond initiative as of last June, almost two months ago. I would like to thank to our CFO, Fulya Banu, and all our team for their leadership.
Of course, based on our operational performance, we had the first sustainability-linked bonds issue, which was, like, $550 million, and the maturity date is 7 years, actually, and the interest rate is quite competitive versus other Turkish entities. Another important news at that time was, for the first time in the history of capital markets in Turkey, a three-notch, three-notch rating increase at one time by S&P. So, it was another important success for our company in terms of, based on our results again, and based on all our efforts for years, consistent efforts for years. Coming to operational performance, you know, mostly our success in the profitability and the growth is relying on our operational excellence performance, actually. So, we are having a net loss reduction. Still, we keep reducing the net loss.
This is again a global gold standard right now. Our ratios are becoming like a global standard, industry standard. We are deep diving on our existing production lines, and we keep gaining or creating some extra volumes, capacities on the lines. One of the most important initiative in the last two years was end-to-end value stream mapping projects to all factories, so that we are refocusing, reengineering all our processes, depends very based on the best optimum agility and simplifying the processes, actually. And IoT process has been finalized in all our factories. Right now, we leverage digital technologies for designing future of manufacturing.
This is giving us a huge opportunity in terms of getting the real-time data from our production lines, so that all our manufacturing supply chain teams can easily make consistent and bold decisions through the real-time data, which gives us an opportunity in terms of reducing the cost as well. So lost time accident rate is another standard for us, a very important standard. In the last 10 years, actually, this is a journey, and this journey, so we keep decreasing the lost time accident rate in all our operations, which is another quality sign of our operational excellence. Most of you know that our we keep progressing consistently in our operations and in all, all our geographies which we operate.
As you know very well, again, our vision of being a leader player in our region, we are stick with the targets, and we keep progressing accordingly. Actually, in Turkey, our growth rate in terms of revenue is 8.5%. Please note that this is all inflation-adjusted numbers, excluding North Africa data. Turkey exports is decreasing based on the... There are two dimensions why we are decreasing in our export business. Firstly, you know, the exchange FX rates are very stable, but more importantly, we are shifting some of our products to our respective factories in the respective markets, in order to be more competitive in the region. So this is another impact, actually. North Africa, this is not inflation-adjusted, of course.
62%, as you may remember, in the last years, North Africa performance was a little bit struggling based on the very high inflation, but our team in North Africa had a great start for this year, and they keep growing very fast. In Central Asia, you know, we had a great success story for years, actually, consistently in the last six years in Central Asia. In overall Central Asia, there is not a big problem in Azerbaijan, Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan. In those markets, we keep growing, but only the key market, Kazakhstan, similar to Turkey, there is a significant slowdown in the economy, and therefore, in the consumption. So it is affecting our EBITDA and revenue growth.
But again, I am confident that we are going to have a increasing phase starting with the back-to-school piece of time, especially in Q4, which is the highest season in the region. The slowdown started in Central Asia, in Kazakhstan, as of January last year, this year. So this is still the same situation, but we will see, I think, a sharp increase in Q4. And Middle East is keep growing in terms of EBITDA and in terms of revenue growth. So as a result, our revenue split, 69% is coming from domestic, while 31% is coming from our international business. In terms of regional market share, Turkey, we are still very significant snacking company, snacking players, almost in every subcategory.
Middle East, we keep our strong position, leadership position in biscuits. North Africa, again, we keep our leadership position in biscuits. And Central Asia, we reach to 16% market share in the chocolate category, which is number two in some of the markets as well. One of our most important growth engine is innovation for years, as you follow us very closely. So in domestic markets, 12% of our revenue is coming from innovation, while 7% is coming from international sales for innovation, through innovation. So overall, 10% of our revenues, net income, is coming from our innovation and NPD projects, actually. So this, as I mentioned, this is becoming more and more significant, more strong pillars of our growth. And I believe that it's gonna be keep the pace for the next coming three, four years through this-...
capabilities and strong muscles of innovation. So that's the summary, quick summary of the operational performance and our strategy update. Now, our CFO, Fulya, will keep going, keep informing you about financial performance.
Mm-hmm. Thank you, Mete Buyurgan. Good morning, good afternoon, everyone. Thank you for joining our call. Let me begin with the highlights for Q2 results. We delivered a solid Q2 and first half of the year. Volume grew by 1%, delivering at 153,000 tons, and revenue landed at TRY 15.3 billion. Gross profit grew by 4%. Our EBITDA grew by 3% on an absolute basis. But despite many challenges and volatility, we were able to deliver gross margin and EBITDA percentage increases again this quarter, like we did in every quarter in the last two and a half years, and this quarter was no exception.
Net income landed at TRY 1.3 billion profit, significant improvement versus prior year Q2 results, and we were able to close the quarter two on a strong basis. Gross profit at 30.6%, and the EBITDA margin is 19.2%. When we take a look at the volume and revenue contribution by category, snacking volume remained flat with almost 0.1% contraction in Q2, driven by the changing category and product mix. Snacking sales value, sales value, slight decreases, mainly driven by low effects impact. The shift from second quarter and first quarter, if you remember, first quarter, sales revenue and volume growth was record high, and in Q2, we were expecting to slow down and then a normalization and stabilization.
We will also talk about our full year guidance over the coming slides as well. When we take a look on the regional breakdown, domestic versus international, it is, much more clear how effects, several stable effects versus inflation balance impacts us unfavorably. On a domestic basis, total revenue stayed almost flat, whereas gross profits, increased by 13%, and we landed at 27.2%, which is significantly higher than what we had in the prior year, in the same quarter. EBITDA landed at 19.1%, 3% increase versus what we delivered last year. On an international basis, total revenue, yes, there's a slight decrease. There's a decrease in terms of revenue. Gross revenue and EBITDA absolute value decreases are driven by the decrease in total revenue in absolute value terms.
However, both gross profit percentage increased from 34.4- 38.6, and EBITDA landed at 19.3% on, in our international markets, which is a very healthy level. On our consolidated financials, the first six months of the year, we delivered very solid, strong financials. Total volume grew by 9%, revenue 4%, gross profit 12%, and you can see the gross profit margin reaching from 29.2%- 31.4%. EBITDA, we landed at 20%, whereas the first half of last year was at 19.1%, so our EBITDA margin and gross profit margin keeps increasing. Net income, +3.6 positive, whereas it was almost at breakeven in the first half of last year. Our balance sheet gets stronger and stronger.
As you know, our three pillar capital strategy focus continues and improves significantly. Net debt EBITDA decreased to 1.3 based on the calculation from the face of our balance sheet. We wanted to share the EBITDA percentage development in years for our regions. North Africa, increasing from 11.5- 14.2, and the first half is 14.8%. Middle East, there is also a slight increase on the Middle East EBITDA margin from 20.7%- 21.9%. Central Asia, decreasing to 12.4%, mainly due to the macroeconomic volatilities and positions that we face in Central Asia. Balance sheet highlights. As Mete Buyurgan mentioned, we completed Eurobond very successfully. First sustainability linked Eurobond of Ülker Bisküvi, seven years with very favorable rates.
So, a significant important refinancing is completed very successfully with a significant demand from the market. And from covenant perspective, based on the covenant, per our syndication contract, we ended up at 1.19. So our balance sheet, our cash position is getting stronger and stronger. Again, our three important pillars, capital strategy and focuses, liquidity, cash, and stronger balance sheet, you can see the all the actions we are taking pay off. Working capital days, we were able to decrease it from 110 days last year to 95 days. A huge focus on key working capital items. Here, the target is not to minimize, here the target is to optimize it, so that we can utilize all of the resources much more optimally.
In terms of highlights, our total hedge is around 50%. As Mete also mentioned, we have received excellent rating increases from both S&P and Fitch. As of today, we are above sovereign by two-notches by S&P and one- notch above sovereign by Fitch. We think that our balance sheet strength is also appreciated and recognized by our rating agencies and by the market as well. In terms of outlook, we did not change our outlook. In Q1, we shared with you that we are going to end up here at TRY 85 billion net sales, with an EBITDA margin of 18.5%.
Even though there has been a small slowdown in Q2 in terms of sales, we believe that in Q3 and Q4, we will be able to cover everything, and we will be able to land at net sales of TRY 85 billion and EBITDA margin of 18.5%, which we shared with you in the prior quarter. In terms of priorities, we shared with you very clearly our key priorities for 2024. All the priorities, all of our focus, are in line what we have said. As you can see, inflation, pricing, investment, and our branding, innovation, digitalization, and supply chain and portfolio optimization will continue to be our key priorities in 2024 as well. So thank you so much. I hand over to Mete again.
Yeah, thank you. Thank you, Fulya. So as we have published and announced our 2024 priorities at the beginning of the year-
Mm-hmm.
So we were expecting, as you see on the screen, that inflationary challenges versus actions, so they are in, all in line with our strategies. We are getting the right decisions at the right time. So we are also trying to manage the cocoa price increase through our hedging policy. Of course, there is going to be a significant increase in cost in cocoa. However, we are in line with the global competition actually, in terms of cocoa cost through our actions. Prices versus volume, as a half one result, as you saw that, the volume increase is very significant versus last year. Even we are ahead of our budget targets, AOP targets, so it is showing us the health of the growth, actually, the quality of the growth of our company. We discussed about the innovation and our brands.
Of course, we never give up investing our brands, so we keep investing on our brands. And in terms of share of voice, especially in our domestic market, we keep our leader's position right now. And, digitization and exploration of AI, as we discussed, like IoT, Internet of Things, and robotic processes, we are in a very good shape. Supply chain, we always, the endless journey to keep modernize our supply chain operations and our procedures. And also portfolio optimization is very important for us, so we are, always optimizing our portfolio. So I must say that as a nutshell, in a nutshell, we are in line with all our priorities, and we are in a good shape, through our strategy, versus our strategy. So thank you. Thank you very much for your participation, and now we are looking for your questions.
Thank you. We will now move to the question and answer session. If you would like to ask a question, please press star two on your phone and wait to be prompted. If you're dialed in by web, please click Ask via Audio. We'll just wait a moment or two for the questions to come in. Okay, our first question comes from Evgenia Bystrova from Barclays. Your line is open, please go ahead.
Yes, hello, good afternoon. Thank you very much for the presentation. I have a few questions, and I would like to go one by one. So my first question, in terms of your exports, you said that you're redirecting your sales from Turkey or exports from Turkey to other regions. Do you have any particular target in terms of revenue split between different regions, exports in Turkey, or just in general between domestic and international revenue? That would be my first question.
Thank you for the question. In fact, our target is about keep the international business, split in terms of our overall revenue, is up between 30%-35%, actually, as for years.
Okay, and in terms of redirection of exports, to which regions would you say is the key priority to redirect exports?
Yes, of course. Middle East, Central Asia are still focused export markets, but also we are having a significant increase of exports in U.S. market, in some European developed markets, including U.K. as well.
Okay. So then my second question, you had international sales decline of 18%. Could you maybe please provide a breakdown in terms of, what percentage or what part comes from volumes decrease or pricing or effects, just to understand the dynamic?
Okay. Thank you for the question. The main decrease is mainly from Central Asia. Middle East and North Africa businesses are on track. So both regions could manage to grow their sales volume by 5% and 3% respectively. However, main decrease is from Central Asia due to a slowdown in consumption and overall economic contraction in Kazakhstan, and Turkey export is also down due to stable effects. You know, the effects increase and inflation increases around 77%, and effect is pretty much stable, and that also impacts us negatively. So in total, those are the main reasons why the sales are down by 18%.
Okay, thank you very much. And in terms of cocoa prices, I didn't hear maybe properly. So what is your outlook for next year? Have you already secured the volumes and prices for next year, or in which quarter do you usually procure those contracts? And in general, any color in terms of how much higher the costs might be also would be very helpful. Thank you.
Thank you. Yeah, this is an important question. So we are having almost 65% of coverage for next year. So we are already covered for the next year, actually, for 2025, about 65%-70%. We are always having four years actually. We are always having some mid and long-term strategies for the procurement of supplying of cocoa. And my perspective is about cocoa, you know, there is right now a stabilization on the cocoa prices. We are expecting better prices, I mean, lower prices, after the second half of next year, actually. Of course, this is still very high versus last previous, but we are expecting, yes, some relief after the second half of next year as well.
Okay. And did you say 55%-70% in terms of volumes is secured?
65% in terms of volume, of course, right.
Mm. Okay. And my final question is about related party receivables balance. I think there was a decrease quarter on quarter. Could you please confirm this? And also, if you could remind us what are the terms or amortization schedule for those receivables also would be very helpful. Thank you.
Okay, thank you for the question. The change is mainly due to FX fluctuations. So total receivable balance consists of different currencies, like they compose of Turkish lira and also foreign currencies as well. Change in FX and accrued interest is the main reason why it has decreased.
In terms of timing for its maturity, could you please remind us what is that?
Overall, it's two months. 30-45 days.
No, I mean, so the balance with the parent that is outstanding,
Oh, it's been outstanding for a long time. I think it's been outstanding for some time, so.
When do you expect that to mature or receive it back?
We are working on the payment schedule, sir.
Yeah, we are working on the payment schedule and plan, actually.
Mm-hmm.
So there is no, there will be no problem in terms of-
Yes
... offsetting the receivables section.
Mm-hmm. Okay, thank you very much. That is all from my side.
Thank you.
Thank you. Our next question comes from Cemal Demirtaş from Ata Invest. Please go ahead.
Thank you for the presentation. My question is about the financing side. We don't see the details of the others, but when I make a rough calculation, you have TRY 1.6 billion, the FX plus the interest expense and some other non-operating costs, and it's a little bit higher compared to previous quarters. We see that your debt level is declining. What should we expect for the rest of the year in terms of financing expenses? That's my first question. After Eurobond issue, possibly your debt level is lower, and what might be the catalyst ahead for Ülker's for further rerating, do you have, you know, what are the plans for the future?
The last question is about the trend in the third quarter so far. How do you see the second quarter was weaker compared to the first, and seasonally, back-to-school season, we should be seeing some recovery in the third quarter. How do you just do you see that right now regarding the third quarter? Related to export question, your international revenue growth, one of my colleagues asked the question. I would like to understand the impact of inflation accounting, because in many other companies we see the same thing. Their international, like Arçelik, their revenue went down by, international revenue went down by, like, 11%. But in reality, in dollar terms, putting the inflation accounting aside, the decline was much lower, around 1%-2%. So, is there any difference also in your numbers?
When you see the inflation accounting number, right, we see 18% decline, but when you look at with the rough international numbers, nominal numbers, we see lower pace of decline. Thank you.
Cemal, thank you for the questions. So I will answer finance-related questions, then I'll hand over to our CEO related to, to the trends and Q3 expectations. So financing expenses and the expectation for the balance of years, we do not expect any significant variation of, what we have shared with you before. So our net debt EBITDA targets are pretty much the same, and our capital strategy target is also the same. Strengthening liquidity, decreasing, the leverage and strengthening balance sheet. So the journey continues with also the numbers, including the working capital numbers as well. Related to refinancing, yes, Eurobond is final.
What is ahead of us is the next indication, which is due in April 2026, and we will start working on that in the second half of next year, or the second half or third or fourth quarter of next year, in 2025. Related to inflation accounting, yes, exports from Turkey are restated per the new inflation accounting numbers. And international business revenue decreases as FX growth is below the inflation is mainly because other regions are not, like, MENA region and other regions are not restated per inflation accounting, whereas we restated for Turkey numbers. And the decreases, as shared before, due to FX growth imbalance with inflation imbalance. So for the third question, I hand over to our CEO.
Hi, Cemal, thank you. For the third quarter's estimation, and maybe the fourth quarter, we believe that slowdown in the economy will be going, keep going, actually. But one of the advantage for us is, you know, back to school period of time, people are gonna going to come back to the cities. So every time, you know, third quarter is always a fast growing quarter for us. It's gonna be more difficult, of course, versus previous years, but we are expecting, again, the fast growth pace in Q3 and Q4, especially Q4 is going to be very get very better than the others first half, actually, I must say. Any missing questions, Cemal?
No, that's okay. One point, additional point in terms of your guidance, do you see any upside potential to your guidance? Because as far as I see, your inflation figures or expectations possibly were lower. Did you have, did you make any change on the that side? So do you see any upside or downside to your-
We, we-
-revenue estimates?
Okay, we don't expect any upside or downside on our year-end estimation. And it's always, you know, it's much related with the slowdown in some major markets that we discussed, like Kazakhstan and Türkiye. So if there's going to be some positive momentum in terms of consumption, yeah, we can make some upwards positive estimation or corrections in as of at the end of Q3. But as of now, we are stick with the existing targets estimation.
Thank you. Thank you, Mete.
Thank you. Our next question comes from Ece Mandacı from Ünlü & Co. Please go ahead.
Hi, thank you very much for the presentation. I just wanted to ask you about the volume performance. First quarter was extraordinarily strong. Second quarter, we have seen 1% growth on a year-over-year basis. I assume this is just snacking, right? It's not including the other part. So going forward, should we still see some growth or some contraction maybe? But you're also mentioning the back-to-school period for the Turkish market. So, it would be helpful if you discuss more about the outlook about the volume performance specifically for Turkey. And as of the second quarter, this 1% growth, is it due to the growth in Turkish market? Because, for other markets, for Central Asia, you have mentioned the, and for the exports from Turkey, you have mentioned the downside effect. Thank you very much.
Thank you. Thank you for the question. In the first quarter investment meeting, we were saying that we are expecting a slowdown for Q2, and it was the case. So in fact, we were expecting earlier slowdown, but April was quite strong, like the first quarter. In May, especially the impact of Ramadan, there was a impact, negative impact on the consumption, but also in June, it was the slowdown was very strong actually, in terms of demand. So this is, as I mentioned, what we expected and what we factored in our AOP plans actually, while we were in the budgeting process in the last years.
So we are expecting, of course, a very better quarter versus Q2 in Q3, because as you mentioned, and as I, as I explained previously, that the back-to-school period of time, schools will be opening, these kids, people will be getting back to their home from the summer houses and so on. So, it's obviously giving us a positive impact, positive pace for the growth in terms of consumption. By the way, you know, this is not special for Ülker. As you may know, and you, you may join to other retailers' investor meetings as well, in Q2, there is a significant slowdown in the retail part as well. So, this is not just for snacking category, but also all, almost all categories, including textile, fashion, automotive industry, furniture, and so on.
So there was a serious slowdown in Q2. By the way, we keep doing actually very well in August. We had a very good start in August, and last month, in July, we were in line with our targets, I must say.
Thank you.
Okay, thank you. Our next question comes from, Leyli Cowell from Jefferies. Your line is open, please go ahead.
Firstly, I'd just like to say thank you for taking the time to answer our questions. On my side, I also had a few questions I was hoping to ask. So yeah, you mentioned a few of your targets for 2024. I was just wondering if you might be able to share your total debt target for the end of 2024?
So we-
Thank you.
Thank you so much for the question. So we do not disclose any specific method, EBITDA numbers, but, we share very clearly our strategy, decreasing leverage or sustaining these numbers is our, key priority. So we keep delivering very healthy method, EBITDA numbers, quarter by quarter. And based on that, and based on our strategy, you can assume that, this is our objective, to, to sustain it, keep it or decrease it. Hope that helps.
Great. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, my second question would just be, is it correct to assume that your pro forma cash position would increase since your 2025 bonds was not fully tendered? And if so, what would you plan to do with this extra cash?
What we will do is, there are a couple things that we will use this extra cash. First, financing cocoa, financing working capital, and until 2026, we do not have any big projects where we are going to refinance our syndication. But working capital, and there might be also some few CapExes, not huge CapExes, for our to increase or expand our capacity, might be the uses of cash.
Great, thank you. Then final question on my side. I was just hoping for maybe some elaboration on the performance of your exports over the last year, and if you've experienced potential decline and why?
Sorry, can you, can you please ask again?
Yes. I was just hoping to understand more about the performance of your exports over the past year.
There is no problem with the volume in our export business, export part, so we are in line with last year. So there is no decrease in terms of volume. This is basically coming from... By the way, please note that there is some crisis in the region-
Mm-hmm.
like Israel, Europe, Palestine issues. But despite all those tension in the region, Russia and Ukraine as well, so despite all the tensions, we didn't lose any volume in our export business. The, the reason of the decrease in the revenue part is just because of the FX is stable as its numbers versus foreign exchange rates.
Great, thank you very much.
Okay, thank you. Just a reminder, if you have a question, please press star two and wait to be prompted. We have a question from Hanzade Kılıçkıran from J.P. Morgan. Your line is open, please go ahead.
Hi, Metin. Thank you very much for the presentation. I have a follow-up question on cost side. How much cost inflation do you expect in the rest of the year, I mean, based on your palm oil and also cocoa contracts? And, I think, for global confectionery companies, it looks like that 5%, I mean, mid-single digit growth is becoming a common consensus in hard currency. Is it also same for you?
Can you repeat the second question again, please?
So for confectionery, for global confectionery companies, it appears that around mid-single digit cost inflation in hard currency is becoming a common consensus for the rest of the year. So is this also same for you based on your current cocoa contracts and also palm oil contracts?
Yeah. Thank you. Thank you for the question. First of all, we don't expect a significant increase in palm oil, so we are again covered, like cocoa, almost till September of next year. So we are not expecting any significant palm oil increases. So there will be no impact on our next year plans and the year-end plans for this year as well. For cocoa, of course, we keep having an increasing cost phase on a phasing impact quarterly basis. But as I mentioned, we are covered so that we can estimate or even next year costs, actually. So we are going to have a clear cost structure for cocoa so that we are going to be able to monitor our desired prices in order to keep our margins.
So single digit for confectionery is not possible if we are—if a company, multinational company, operating in chocolate category using chocolate, because, you know, in cocoa prices is almost triple versus one and a half years ago, the prices of cocoa. So there won't be a one digit increase, but rest of cocoa, yes, right, especially wheat prices, nut prices even, are having, like, single digit increases, which are reasonable actually. So the, the biggest issue is the cocoa, I must say.
Okay. But, given that, lira is expected to be stable in the rest of the year, this still gives a margin advantage, which you plan to invest into price hiking, amidst lower consumption, right? Because you keep your margin-
Yes
... stable.
Yes, for-
But actually, you have some room to improve your margins under this cost environment.
Yeah, for the rest of the year, for this year, yes, you are right. We are expecting at least keeping our margins. But, you know, in order to eliminate the slowdown impact, we keep having more supports to our consumer promotions and advertising, but we don't expect any lower margins, of course. So we are going to be in line with our targets at the end, for rest of the year, at least.
Okay, thank you very much.
Thank you.
Thank you. We have a follow-up question from Evgenia Bystrova from Barclays. Please go ahead.
Yes, thank you very much. Just a quick follow-up on your CapEx. Could you please share maybe your guidance for this year and maybe next year? What are your key investments in terms of expansionary activities? Thank you.
Yeah, thank you. We are very careful on our CapEx in the last five years, in fact, especially. Now, at the moment, we are out of... We are running out of capacity in some of the products, so we are going to have some investments on those specific lines, but it's not going to exceeding maximum like 3% of our net sales, net revenues. So we are going to be playing in a band of 2%-3% to our revenue.
Mm-hmm. This is for this year and also next year?
Both. For this year and next year, right.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Okay, thank you. We have a text question from Irfan Kamal from Phillip Capital: What is the reason for the decline in revenue in the Middle East?
There is no decline in Middle East, actually. I think there is some misunderstanding. There is no decline in revenue in the Middle East part.
Understood. Thank you.
Only export and Central Asia.
... Great, thank you. Okay, so we have another text question, and apologies if some of this has already been answered, but I will read it out. So this is, Yewande Onabulo from, Barings, asks, what's the outlook for volumes and pricing in H2? Number two, why international operations were weak in the second quarter? And number three, what's the impact of cocoa prices on margins, and how should we think about it?
In fact, we answered all those three questions previously through the other questions, but very shortly, we are, in terms of volume and pricing, we are having our pricing actions on the right time, and so we will keep our margins. In terms of volume, we are going to be strict with the year-end estimations. As for why international operations were weak, it will be discussed several times, so we cannot say our international operations are very weak. Even North Africa and Middle East parts, despite all the tension in the region, are doing great. So there's only a slowdown in Central Asia, not entire Central Asia, in only Kazakhstan markets. Otherwise, Azerbaijan and all other countries, major countries, are growing very well, keep growing very well.
Impact of cocoa prices on margins, as we discussed again, cocoa prices are having, of course, important pressure, creating an important pressure on margins. However, we have got the right actions, even from, starting from the first quarters, so we don't expect a significant shrinkage on our margins for the chocolate products. But also, we have a, you know, very diverse category, actually, in our portfolio. So we are going to replace or recover some of our margins from other categories as well.
That's great, thank you. I'm not seeing any other questions at this point, so maybe I can hand back for closing remarks.
Thank you, everybody, for joining in Ülker's second quarter lecture. Hope to meet in the third quarter results, in November.
Thank you very much. That concludes the discussion for today. Thank you, and have a nice day.