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ESG Update

Oct 25, 2023

Paul Galloway
Group Head of Investor Relations, Anglo American

Good afternoon, all. Thank you very much for joining us. This is our second sustainability presentation of the year. We've got four speakers today. We have to take about 45 minutes, I guess, to go through the presentations and then open up to the Q&A. The takeaway that we'd like you to leave with is: sustainability is integrated into everything we do at Anglo American and indeed has been for many years. So with that, Duncan, I'll pass to you, please.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Thanks, thanks very much, Paul, and good afternoon to everybody, and welcome to our usual second half update on sustainability. I'm hoping today, as Paul said, to take you to take this opportunity to go through with you an illustration of how sustainability is so deeply embedded and integrated into our delivery of projects. And in so doing, take the opportunity to introduce you all to a couple of new members of our executive team. So Helena Nonka is our Director of Strategy and Sustainability, and Alison Atkinson, our Director of Projects and Development, is going to be joined with a very familiar face today in our presentation, Tom McCulley, whom you all know very well and is now the Chief Exec for us on Woodsmith.

In our room together, to be able to take any of your Q&A, we are going to also be joined by Stephen, well known to all of you, and Matt, Matt Daley, our Technical Director. So, moving on to order of play, for this presentation. First of all, I'll start out and give a bit of an update on safety, a recap of how we've set up the team and the organization to deliver our next phase of growth. Then Helena is going to take over and talk to you about our work on climate change during 2023, and how we've fully integrated that with sustainability into our strategic thinking.

Tom is then going to take over, talk a little bit about the delivery of, of two of our major projects, Quellaveco and, and now Woodsmith, which absolutely, in our view, were only possible because of our approach to sustainability. And Ali then comes on, and she'll talk a little bit more about how we're thinking of our future projects and how technology development and generally broader innovative thinking is going to be the key to the delivery of, of more sustainable outcomes across the whole of the mining system. I'll then come back and, and wrap things up, and then we'll go into, into Q&A. So on our first slide, safety, of course, has to remain and will always remain our first value, and that is never going to change for us.

You know, in the first half of this year, we had reported one loss of life at Kolomela in South Africa, and I'm very saddened to say that we have now, in one incident, lost two more colleagues, and that happened in August at our Los Bronces operation in Chile. We are committed, believe me, we are committed, and absolutely do believe that it is possible to stop our people from getting hurt and to prevent harm to the surrounding environment at the same time. As I outlined in July, we have renewed now our focus on three key safety levers for the business. The first of those is that we are supporting all of our operational leaders to increase the time that they spend in the field.

The purpose of them having to spend more time in the field is not only to, you know, provide the leadership and the coaching that's required, but also hear firsthand how our workforce is experiencing the workplace, and learn from that, and therefore, be able to, through their roles, effect the changes that more rapidly are required to ensure zero harm. As I said before, you know, I don't believe that leadership is a desktop or a boardroom exercise at all, and there's no area where this is more important than in leading safe production. Secondly, the focus and at the heart of all of this is our operating model, which is a really simple principle, right?

Plan the work, do the work, check and improve on your performance as the work is being done, and then implement those changes to stick to your plan. I think that absolutely applies to all of our activities, but one of the key areas of focus for us is maintenance and reliability engineering. And so we've spent a lot of time in the first half, along with this visible felt leadership element of ensuring that our planned maintenance work is happening in the way that we had expected it to happen. So properly resourced, properly executed, and with the desired outcome.

And I'm absolutely certain that, you know, the more stable the operations get as a result of the more reliable they are, the less unplanned the work there is in the organization, the less possibilities there are going to be for incidents to occur. And thirdly, you know, we have discerned that many, many of our incidents that are happening in the business today tend to fall into our staff that are part of our contracting community. Now, we've embedded very much on a three-year initiative now to ensure that every person working for this company, an employee or a contractor, is equally valued.

that our contractors are fully integrated into our systems and our processes, with the work that they undertake also being well-planned, also being aligned with our operating model, therefore meaningfully risk assessed, and therefore resourced with the right skills. So I'm pretty sure that these three things, if you focus down on what the to-do is to take us to the next level of safety performance, are the things that are going to make the difference. So very focused on how we can influence the workforce safety beyond our own purview, and in particular areas where we have identified risks, such as commuting through road safety campaigns with local and national governments, et cetera.

Looking at the metrics, we can see a return to improvements in terms of injury rate, across the piece, and our health and environment metrics are also moving in the right direction. However, we are far, far from celebrating this in the light of the fatal incidents that we've had this year, and there is still much to do. We recognize that, but we do remain resolute in ensuring that all our people who come to work every day can return home in the same way that they came to work, i.e., unhurt. On the next slide, as you know, one of my key priorities is reinforcing this operational stability across the whole of the portfolio, and that will give us a really strong base from which we can continue to deliver growth.

Now, we have made a number of changes to the executive team during the course of this year, which brings together a broad range of experience, and builds on all the effort, and experience that we, that we've had over the last decade. But builds on this with new ideas and new energy, that will allow us to move to the next level. Now, we have been making a number of significant changes as well to the design of the organization that support our operations, so that it can be more efficient and more effective as we move ahead. I think this allows us to be a little bit more agile and guard against the development of, of siloed thinking. So sustainability is an absolutely important part of this whole equation for us.

As Helena is going to talk about now, we are making sure that sustainability remains fully embedded in the strategy and in our operational management processes, and is not a separate or a disaggregated function or way of thinking, as it may have been, or for some in the past. It is fundamental to our ability to deliver, and that applies across the whole of the mining industry, in my view. With that, I'm going to hand over now to Helena, just to take you through some of the work that we've done in the last year or so on our strategy. Helena, over to you.

Helena Nonka
Chief Strategy & Sustainability Officer, Anglo American

Thank you, Duncan, and good evening, everybody. I'm Helena Nonka, Strategy and Sustainability Director. As Duncan mentioned just now, we have a new platform, and we have some new faces in our executive leadership team, but our commitment to sustainability continues to underpin our strategy and value creation model. Central to this commitment is really playing our part in addressing climate change and the just transition. However, we're not only solving for being a sustainable business, but for achieving our ambition in a way that is value accretive, by capturing commercial value creation opportunities that inevitably emerge as the world around us also develops and decarbonizes. So we do not really focus on specific tools, technologies, or programs. We focus on constantly increasing our level of confidence in delivery of the overall outcomes.

As a result, we constantly adjust and mature our approach as new opportunities emerge, but we do not compromise on our ambition level. I will touch on our progress here, and on our overall approach. Sustainability already is, as Duncan said, and will continue to be a prerequisite for value creation in the industry. We see this in a number of tangible ways in which sustainability creates value, in terms of access to resources, access to capital and markets, and access to talent, as well as supporting operational continuity and efficiency. With societal expectations constantly evolving, the environmental footprint of future operations will need to be much lighter, and safety standards will continue to increase. New operations may be in areas that are complex to operate in, for one reason or another.

So it's very clear that sustainability is absolutely the key to the future. But where you can establish the business as a partner of choice, then the value upside is highly significant. In fact, sustainability is fast becoming a prerequisite to develop and operate the mines, with an increasingly wider range of sustainability requirements now embedded into permitting. And we have seen this value realized in the development of Quellaveco, and we are now seeing it at Woodsmith, as Tom will outline a little bit later. And we also expect to see it at Sakatti, as Ali will talk about, a little bit later as well. And at the same time, as customers set their own sustainability ambitions, they seek to source traceable, responsibly produced raw materials from suppliers who share their ambition level.

We have talked previously about the increasing importance of those traceable, certified, responsible production to customers. In terms of business continuity and efficiency, it's really. It's more than about permitting. Our approach to sustainability is central. It is really enabling us to achieve greater levels of community support at key assets, as well as the support we receive to continue operating, for example, through COVID lockdowns. We built Quellaveco during two years of COVID disruption, and have been able to ramp it up successfully, despite the political and social turmoil affecting many areas of the country. So sustainability and profitability, in my view, go hand in hand, which is why we are now further maturing our approach to sustainability by integrating it into strategy.

In practice, as we have talked about consistently, we must deliver production from both our existing assets and our growth options as responsibly and as profitably as possible. This is where I believe we have a very different approach, with sustainability considerations embedded into our strategy and value creation model, from portfolio choices to everyday operational decisions. This approach, as you know, is underpinned by FutureSmart Mining, which integrates innovative thinking, technologies, and our approach to sustainability, and drives us to consider issues holistically and to see opportunities where others see challenges. I believe that this approach is key to demonstrating to our host communities, governments, customers, and partners, as well as to current and potential shareholders and society more broadly, what responsible and sustainable mining looks like.

We aim to be the partner of choice for those who, like us, focus on long-term, sustainable value creation. Just to reiterate again, sustainability for us is not about tools, programs, technologies, or activities. We are not solving for these things individually. It is, we see it as a core competency that we embed in the way we develop and operate our assets and market our products. We, of course, rigorously track and measure our progress towards our ambition, but our focus on, is on strengthening our level of confidence in delivering on our ambition and the desired impact in the way that drives sustainable and profitable business outcomes. We're always looking for opportunities to mature and evolve our approach when we find a better way.

Now, in terms of updates, on our climate and decarbonization pathway, as you know, we continue to work towards carbon neutrality by 2040. But as we do the work and continue to gain experience, we will update and mature our pathways as required. We have seen good progress on the two main drivers of our 2030 and 2040 decarbonization roadmaps, which are renewable energy and methane emissions, with a 12% reduction in Scope 2 emissions achieved since 2020, driven largely by renewables, and a 27% reduction in emissions associated with methane, contributed by improved gas management. However, at the same time, other technologies may take longer to roll out, but new technologies or processes may become more feasible and more competitive.

So we have a fairly clear pathway to our 2030 target of of 30% greenhouse gas reduction versus 2016 baseline. But naturally, we have a bit less certainty around the pathway from 2030 to 2040. But we are absolutely clear in terms of what are the key drivers and how we should approach working on increasing our level of certainty. And in solving for this, as Ali will explain, we are, we are technology agnostic, and we focus on sustainability and commercial outcomes. And also, I think it's important to emphasize again that our unique ecosystem approach means that whilst we are focused on creating value and commercial benefits for our business and our operations, we are also thinking more broadly than this.

For example, as our Envusa partnership shows, by supplying renewable energy to the communities rather than just to our own operations, we are not only providing decarbonization benefits to the broader economy and society, but it is also actually cheaper and more value accretive to do in this way, as it enables us to partner with others to share the investment capital and risk. And we have examples of a similar approach that we have deployed in the social impact space, where we are also bringing outside investors and capital to help us deliver on our commitment in a more cost-effective way. So this is a journey, and over the last several years we have come a long way, and in some areas our confidence has improved, while in other areas there is more work to do.

But we are absolutely committed to continuing work to work constructively with our partners and to get the work done. We remain flexible as we learn. We are not afraid to adapt our plan where required in order to meet our ultimate ambition. And in terms of our progress on the key, key components, key drivers of our climate change trajectory, so there are three aspects. So I will talk about renewables, I will talk about methane, because these two are the key drivers of our decarbonization roadmap, and I will touch upon our Scope 3 emissions work. So on renewables, you know, as we have said before, our renewables work principally addresses our Scope 2 emissions, which are largely from our Southern Africa electricity usage.

As you know, we entered into Envusa partnership with EDF Renewables to create a regional ecosystem of 3-5 gigawatt of wind and solar power to help stabilize the grid and generate more than enough to power our operations. Envusa builds on our long-term renewable energy agreement in South America and Australia. These are NPV-positive solutions to a key challenge, which is energy security and cost. Envusa is expected to provide energy to our operations at a much lower rates than we incur now, so it's about 20%-30% lower. Again, extremely NPV-positive solution.

Work at Envusa is now progressing well, and we will not only deliver value to our operations, but like I said earlier, we will also support South Africa's decarbonization journey, which will in turn make a major contribution to supporting the just transition that brings wider socioeconomic benefits across Southern Africa. So this is hugely positive, and importantly, it relies on partnership and the longer-term relationships that we now have in the region. So in terms of one, methane from steelmaking coal operations is the largest component of our Scope 1 emissions, and significant progress has been made to reduce, and ultimately eliminate, vented methane emissions.

In the short term, this has been actually primarily achieved through more controlled operational practices, together with small amounts of capital investment in gas compression and flaring capacity, that have allowed this discipline to be more effectively embedded throughout the operations. As a result of that, in 2023, our steelmaking coal business is on track to abate approximately 60% of methane emissions, including 5.3 million tons of CO2 emissions by beneficial third-party use of gas. The gas is captured and delivered to on-site gas-fired power stations with our partner and operator, EDL. These power stations have an electricity generation capacity of about 145 MW, which can power more than 100,000 Queensland homes each year.

Through our pre-drainage gas activities, we also supply a significant amount of natural gas to the domestic gas network, which also supplies local industrial customers. And this use of natural gas is also benefit overall Australia emission reduction. And the remaining 40% of methane is emitted from, in the form of, VAM, or ventilation air methane, and other fugitive emissions, which is in lower concentration and is our next focus. We have been increasing our level of confidence in terms of how we can do this, and this, this will take more than one step, and we continue to work on pathway to deliver technically and commercially viable solutions. And it's worth highlighting as well, that this work has already created enormous opportunity in terms of how gas is captured and used, and this is real, and this is happening today.

There is still a lot of work to go in that last 40%, and we'll continue to evolve our plans and pathway to get there. Finally, on Scope 3, our approach, as you know, is to develop partnerships, particularly with our steel customers, to address the decarbonization of the steel industry, which is largely outside of our direct control. This is progressing well, and we recently signed an agreement with Vale Steel to add to other major steelmaking partnership that we have already been working with. So good progress, still much to do, but we are committed to this journey, and because we see sustainability as a key driver of commercial and stakeholder value. For longer life assets, it's critical that we embed the latest thinking and technologies into sustainable modern mine designs from the outset.

With that, I'll pass over to Tom. Thank you.

Tom McCulley
CEO, Crop Nutrients, Anglo American

Over from Helena. Now that we have sustainable plans, we need to put these into action. I'll talk about a few of the foundations from our sustained success, starting with how we delivered Quellaveco, and how we are taking those lessons and applying these to the good work already done at Woodsmith. So Quellaveco, from a technical and financial sense, was a success. It was on time, it was on budget, and is ramping up successfully. But the success was far more than just the technical or financial aspects. Quellaveco set a benchmark for how projects integrate with stakeholders in a more collaborative and supportive way. We understood the need to work for the mutual benefit. We understood the challenges, the obstacles, and the risks that we faced. We, with our stakeholders, understood if we didn't get this right, we would not be successful.

Just to ensure you understand the scope of the challenge at Quellaveco, our area of influence was not just a single community or district, it encompassed the entire Moquegua region, including all three provinces within the region. The Quellaveco mine has critical components from the sea level in Ilo, all the way up to the high mountain at 4,000 meters in altitude, which included a challenging geographical landscape with a population of significant cultural diversity and needs, which we had to successfully manage to deliver Quellaveco. One of the things I learned from my first day in Peru, Quellaveco needed to be successful for the country and for the region.

It really was a project that was a source of pride for all of Peru, and I understood right away that we were under a different spotlight, and we couldn't fail, as the country needed the mine to be successful, to show that Peru was indeed a mining country. As a Quellaveco team, we understood from the beginning that the way we integrated with our stakeholders had to be done better than we have ever done before in order to meet the community's expectations of us. The success of the project wasn't going to be judged in Peru or in the region based on financial metrics. It was going to be defined by how well we integrated with the region and if we fulfilled our commitments. For them, this is what really mattered.

We were able to do this by extensively engaging with the community, starting with our groundbreaking Dialogue Table. After that, we kept engaging with the community to adapt to their changing requirements, be it the need for more jobs, local supplier opportunities, social development projects, and importantly, how we ensured clean water was always available for the community. Make no mistake, there was high expectations of delivering on our 26 Dialogue Table commitments from day one, and we took those very seriously, and we used those as our foundation to build trust with the community. I'm proud to say we were able to deliver the project without any significant social issues during a time in Peru that was tremendously challenging for many mines operating around the country.

This was done through constant and open and honest collaborative engagement and relationships built with the region and the communities surrounding the mine. Our success was made possible by our bottoms-up engagement strategy, building a solid social platform to contribute to a sustainable operation. During construction, we improved our trust creation strategy by expanding the scope of our local accountability forum called the Makegwa or the Quellaveco Monitoring Committee, where the national and regional authorities, as well as local communities, participated. In addition to the oversight of the Quellaveco commitments set in the Dialogue Table, this committee participated in reviewing the project's progress in terms of the environmental impacts and controls, local employment, and the development of local suppliers. This committee played a crucial role in maintaining the transparency and helped give credibility to our activities during the construction for the whole community.

On the previous slide, I mentioned that Quellaveco was a source of pride for the country and the region. One area this pride was magnified was technology, which was great for us as we planned on Quellaveco being a mining technology leader from day one. The Moquegua region, while it has a rich history in mining, also sees itself as a growing technical hub for Peru. We were able to integrate our technical roadmap into the region's educational facilities to not only deliver a fully digital mine, but support the region in their growing ambitions and developing new skills and capabilities for the future. We successfully started up the first greenfield automated hauling and drilling operation globally and in Peru, as well as we started the first fully digital mine with an on-site integrated remote operation center.

Doing all this from the start was only successful due to the dedication, the education, and the commitment of the people within the local area. Another source of pride for us and Peru is we were able to start up the mine on a fully renewable energy from the start. The message this sent was clear: If the newest mine in the country can be 100% renewable, then other mines needed to follow our lead, and that's the path for Peru. Quellaveco is Anglo American's most technologically advanced mine, and this is incredibly powerful for the Moquegua region, and now is a real source of pride for the people. They are proud to say that one of the most innovative mines in the world was done in their region, and very importantly, by the people of the region.

As I said from the start, when we talk about successful delivery, this implies technical success. But to be successful, you need to have a solid foundation, and ours was the level of trust we built within the community, starting with our 2012 Dialogue Table agreement. The key to success of the Dialogue Table was we invested the time needed to ensure that we addressed the community's requirements for the future and how to ensure that the mine was part of the community for the long term. This negotiation process meant that we had to be willing to include community feedback into our mine design and our approach to the use of water, which I'll provide details on later in my slides.

The outcome of the Dialogue Table process was 26 commitments, spanning the entire life cycle of the mine, from construction to operation, all the way through to closure, with the main focus on water, followed by the environment, the employment, and educational opportunities. These commitments not only supported the community's needs; it actually made the project better. It made the project personal to the community, and it also made us more sustainable. Over the course of the project, the Dialogue Table was our foundation, and not only did we hold ourselves accountable to these commitments, the community were also able to do so via the previously mentioned monitoring committee.

As the project was developed and times passed, the needs of the communities changed, and while we willingly adapted to those changing needs, we kept our foundational commitments of the Dialogue Table to ensure these guided the company and the community in the right direction. Quellaveco's water supply is a great example of what we call shared value. Essentially, the concept ensures that the community and the mine both could experience a benefit. Our solutions didn't have winners and losers. We both won. The example on this slide is about a new approach to water, which was a significant risk and is a significant risk to any mine, especially in Peru, where there's a big source of conflict between the communities and miners. But we jointly were able to come up with a mutually beneficial solution.

Pre the dialogue table, Quellaveco was permitted to draw water from dewatering wells around the mine. While this approach was initially approved by the community, their views changed, and at the dialogue table discussions, it was clear the community was not comfortable with this approach anymore. What we jointly came up with was a water scheme that solved our requirements for water for the mine, while addressing the community concerns around a need for year-round fresh water for agriculture and other uses.... For me, the solution agreed was brilliant. Most of the water for the region comes from the high mountain areas, and it flows, and flows into the water basin via two sources. One, the Titire River, which is shown in the insert photo, and two, the Vizcachas River, which is the main photo.

The Titire River, as you can see from the small photo, is naturally contaminated due to its volcanic origins, making it unsuitable for human and agricultural use. While the Vizcachas River is much higher quality water, but typically has large seasonal variations in volume. Therefore, outside the rainy season, there is very little flow in the river. As part of the dialogue table commitments, we agreed to take 80% of our water from the Titire River. In addition, we agreed to build a dam with a multi-year reservoir capacity of 60 million cubic meters on the Vizcachas River to help regulate the flows and mitigate the seasonal variability in volume and quality, therefore, providing year-round cleaner water for the downstream users. Effectively, we solved a major problem for the region.

The solution effectively became a swap for communities of bad quality water from Titire for good quality and a reliable water supply from Vizcachas River during the dry season. This approach is considered a prime example of best stewardship practice in the field of water for mining. This joint approach eliminated the need for wells and provided the community with a long-term, sustainable water supply. Ultimately, this is an excellent example of what we see as shared value. As mentioned previously, Quellaveco needed to be different, and from my first days in Peru, it was clear that the community was looking for a company that would stand with them in good times and in bad, and be a partner with them to help strengthen the region for the future generations.

Macaigua, like many communities that are far away from the country's center, wanted to have someone they can count on. They wanted someone to be with them. This was great news for us, as we wanted to be part of this community as well, and we recognized our role in capacity building for the future, whether it be from health, the agriculture, the education, or employment. Through constant engagement, we accomplished our socioeconomic priorities highlighted on the page, and the community started to recognize the contributions and difference Quellaveco was making. And then COVID happened, and this is when we became a full, trusted partner for the region. We stood by the region and supported them through some of the most challenging times they experienced. We helped with basic health needs.

We played a significant role in testing vaccines, and supported the main industry in the region, agriculture, to ensure the community could get through COVID and thrive again in the future. Above and beyond the material contributions we provided, which were so necessary, we voluntarily made decisions by our teams to go into the field and support the families that needed help the most. This is where we put our purpose into action. We truly reimagined mining to improve people's lives at Quellaveco. I can say I was never prouder to work for a company that took the role in the community to heart and was able to put it into action so successfully. I know, without a shadow of a doubt, we became an integral part of the community after COVID.

We were now seen as the company they can count on to do the right thing and be there in good times and bad. And for me, we achieved what the community always wanted. We became their trusted partner. So building off Quellaveco's success, we are building Woodsmith in a way that will set the benchmark for modern and sustainable mining. Like Quellaveco, Woodsmith had a great foundation. With the agreements we have in place from the start, we will build off those to continue to foster a positive relationship throughout the life of the asset. One of the key shared value programs at Woodsmith has been to minimize the impact, both visually and operationally, and we are doing this in a unique way, unlike mines of the past. At Woodsmith, none of our underground equipment will be seen from the surface.

We transport all the materials from the mine to the port via our underground tunnel, and we have no waste, use very little water, and use zero chemicals to make the final product. While some say this may increase the CapEx a bit, it has created the same shared value approach as Quellaveco, in that the community and the company both benefited from the decisions made. For us, specifically, this benefits us by reducing the OpEx via the use of the tunnel, while this also has the long-term positive benefits to the community. From construction to operations to closure, this mine is a positive example of how to build, operate, and close a mine the right way.

How this mine exists in this location is probably a world's first, and we hope this will show the way of how mining can be done for the future. Finally, beyond the low visual impact, we still needed to play our part within the wider community. As I noted at Quellaveco, the community focused on the environment, the community needs, and the needs of the people, and it's very similar here at Woodsmith, which aligns well to Anglo American's sustainable mine plan. Regarding the environment, on the last slide, I highlighted some of the key features on the environmental aspects, which we are doing now, and these will continue into operations.... highlighted a few weeks ago that the site today during construction is the worst it will look. It only gets better from here, and not too many mines can say that.

Regarding the community, we continue to have a positive impact, with GBP 1.2 billion spent through the regional and national economy to date. Donated GBP 6 million to the local independently run foundation, which has five objectives focused on education, health, hardship, environment, and community facilities, all of which align to our goals at Anglo American. And like Quellaveco, our commitments extend into operations, where we contribute 0.5% of revenue during the operation at Woodsmith. We are also active in other areas, such as providing additional funding for developing livelihoods, education, and health outcomes locally, which are all extremely important. Regarding people on Woodsmith, to date, we have created over 1,650 high-paying jobs, with 60% being from the local area, and supported local businesses with $120 million of local procurement.

To date, we already achieved nearly twice the number of local jobs in construction than we expected. While that number will fluctuate, we have actively been engaging with schools to ensure that the skills we need for the future are available in the area when we need them. In closing, while we had two different mines in two different countries and vastly different communities, they both had a similar foundation, built over time with face-to-face dialogue, which was built on trust and fostered through constant engagement to ensure we are integrating with the community and ultimately working to achieve shared value benefits to the community and the mine over the lifecycle of the mine. At Anglo American, we know the right way to build a mine with our stakeholders, and these two investments set up Anglo American to lead the way as mining transitions to a more sustainable future.

Over to you, Alison.

Alison Atkinson
Group Director of Projects & Development, Anglo American

Thank you, Tom, and good afternoon. I'm Alison Atkinson, and I took up the role of Projects and Development Director five months ago, coming into Anglo American from an organization where project delivery was existential. I'm pleased to say that in this short period of time, I've now visited most of the sites across Anglo American, giving me a first-hand look at how we operate, the context in which we operate, and in particular, our approach to projects, big and small, that extend our operations and improve production. As you might expect, this is playing into how I and the team are looking at how we best take all of what we have learned and up our game even further for our future developments.

What I've learned as I've joined this industry, and reinforced by what Tom has just shared, is that none of us are in any doubt that where we operate and where we're planning to develop projects, particularly Greenfield, will become more challenging, whether in remote areas of the world and the logistic issues that brings, in the heart of communities where we must be the best of neighbors. Everyone I have met, both internally and externally, are thoughtful in how we collectively deliver value sustainably, given the great good our metals and minerals will achieve, be that the energy transition, carbon reduction, improving the living standards and food security. I believe this will require us to bring the next generation of technologies to solve for those expectations. With the examples of Quellaveco and Woodsmith, this is something Anglo American has been doing for years.

We have demonstrated that we know how to do this and have the experience to deliver on where we're going to next. So the opportunities ahead of us should be broad and varied. We still need to develop sustainable solutions for the challenges that we in the industry face as we look to develop those ore bodies that are fundamental to the successful transition to a green economy and the social economic development of many countries. I'm going to focus on two points. What are those technologies, both singular or combinations, that continue to support this? And how do we better deliver it through the core discipline of excellence in project management so that we repeat and improve on the success of Quellaveco? FutureSmart Mining is fundamental to this and in action.

You know, in, you know, as an industry, we're not only faced with a number of sustainability challenges, we're also finding new ways to extract more value out of the assets we're already developing and operating, and the solutions need to solve for both. Our approach to solving both of these has to be systemic, improving our current mines to be as future smart as they can be, doing more for less, such as reduced water usage through dry stacking our tailings, reducing waste through smarter rock cutting techniques or processing techniques, improving our environmental footprint on the ground, whether that be underground mines such as Woodsmith or the reforestation in Brazil, or in the air, reducing our methane gas and diesel truck emissions, all while executing production safely and creating the most positive impact in all respects, financial, environmental, and social.

And we can only do this by being innovative, collaborative, systematic, and focused. What technology should we use? I believe we should be agnostic on the technologies required to solve these challenges, and we don't believe that one technology will solve for all of it. So our approach has to be to solve for the system rather than those point solutions, adapting tools and techniques, perhaps from other industries, perhaps more at scale. We will invest internally to develop this technology where the size of the prize is large enough and where external parties are not developing solutions at a fast enough pace for our ambition.... This was our approach with the hydrogen truck.

None of the OEMs at the time were working on a solution, so we started to tackle it ourselves to demonstrate the specific hydrogen technology, and we have the proof of concept in action at Mogalakwena for a year. Whether that's where we ultimately land, we'll see, as we're also working with the same team on intermediate solutions towards decarbonizing our diesel fleet. Again, we're technology agnostic, and we are in the thick of it, so we know what it takes to get it done. We're taking a portfolio approach, a toolbox of solutions integrated into mining systems to maximize success rate and impact. And solving the key challenges in the industry, whether it's water, extraction, air emissions, energy, waste management, and efficiency, is a major focus for all of us. At the same time, so is the project management and its successful delivery.

Water and the challenge of dewatering tailings is an area we've made some brilliant progress. Our hydraulic dewatered stacking technology, or HDS for short, enables us to almost instantaneously extract water from specifically designed sand berms placed in the tailings lakes. This reduces the pressure on the tailings dams, and therefore increases safety and takes our ability to recycle water to an entirely new level. Our HDS technology was developed after the success of our coarse particle recovery technology, or CPR, which is demonstrated by the numbers that have come out of our El Soldado mine. These are truly, truly big. 23% reduction in fresh water usage, a 1.7% increase in copper recovery, 14% increase in throughput, and a 20%-25% reduction in steel ball consumption. That goes to operating costs in a big way, and this is not lab scale data.

This is demonstration scale data at 8 million tons of processed ore. A real example of where we're harnessing technology in smart systems ways, which makes us safer, better neighbors, while increasing production. Combining CPR and HDS starts to give us a system solution that extracts more value out of our assets, improves safety of our tailings dams, and reduces water consumption. Now, take that one step further. If you could reduce or even eliminate tailings, which could be done through successful development of underground mining techniques, perhaps by increasing hard rock cutting, utilizing novel sensing techniques, which would reduce waste at source, combine that with improving material recovery through flotation techniques, building on the CPR success, the impact of future smart mining systems is real, and it meets the needs to be sustainable in the broader sense.

Now, this sounds very technical and production-focused, and it is, but the significance of these successes is not just what it achieves numbers-wise. It massively supports our communities living and working around the mines, with access to better and greater volumes of water being just one example. Another are the jobs that become aspirational and moves from trade to technical skills and the societal benefits that these skills will bring. And it's not just the mining assets that we're focusing on. Helena also talked about how we are solving our emissions through renewable energy ecosystems across the regions where we operate. These key enablers give us the license to operate, to do what we need to do. So what's next? Well, taking the principle of systems, the enablers that go with that, and the relationships, our approach will broaden.

To leverage academia and different industries to allow us to access or co-create solutions, while also accessing alternative sources of funding and developing the skills for the workforce of the future. If we are smart, and we are building on what we've achieved so, so far, this should be NPV positive and should not be about landing ourselves with a big bill, as many of these solutions are value accretive. As you all know, technology doesn't just go from development into implementation. There are material project management capabilities, systems, and processes that need to be deployed to make implementation successful. So let me now move from the what to the how. I've just come back from Sakatti, which is located in central Lapland in Finland, with high metal concentrations across the PGMs, copper, nickel, cobalt, and others.

You know, a true polymetallic ore body, very much aligned to Finland and the EU's critical minerals priorities. It is in a remote part of the world, and Sakatti could be our next greenfield project. It is designed as the next generation of future smart mining, building on what we have learned from Kiilizeko and Woodsmith, and particularly in terms of minimal surface footprint and using technology and innovation to deliver even better sustainability outcomes. Sakatti is set to be remotely operated, low carbon underground mine with an electric mining fleet, using technologies and mining methods that will create zero waste and enable high degrees of water recycling, contributing to a sustainable supply of critical minerals to support the energy transition in Finland and the EU.

Now, this approach underpinned our environmental impact assessment, and I'm pleased to say that the relevant authorities in Finland have approved the EIA, and on the mature assessment, highlighted a few areas where some key considerations for important hydrology. This is a fantastic achievement and a major milestone for the project, reflecting the true collaboration of all involved. We will continue to drill over the season to refine the modern approach we must and will take in developing this mine. We will take our time on this early-stage development. Detailed study, not only on the mine itself, but in its implementation and operations, will be critical to its delivery.... After all, it's the upfront detailed development that sets the foundation of this asset for decades to come.

We will also continue to build the project delivery capabilities, as the rigor and discipline in executing a high-confidence plan well is as fundamental as is the support of the stakeholders and neighbors who are critical to those decisions that push a project along. In addition to those skilled partners we will work with to construct and implement our plans. As Tom has said, great projects are done brilliantly when that is in place, alongside a mature design and robust plan. We are replicating, continually learning, and improving our approach as we go, and putting it into practice at scale across other parts of the portfolio. We believe this is a competitive advantage for us and a fundamental part of our journey to sustainable mining.

Delivering on our ambition is crucial, as we have to produce the metals and minerals needed for the energy transition and the ongoing economic development in a responsible way, because that is the only way. Back to you, Duncan.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Thank you, Ali. So the approach that Ali and Tom have highlighted is a critical enabler to growing our portfolio by addressing the needs and the expectations of our stakeholders and the planet itself. While demand for our products also stems from these needs, underpinned by three key global trends: decarbonization, the pull for higher living standards, and food security, the need for food security. Now, of course, decarbonization will be driven through cleaner energy and applications in cleaner forms of industrial and transport systems. The pull for higher living standards is going to be demanded from a growing and a more urbanizing global population. Of course, we don't talk about that much anymore, but it is true, and it is going to continue to happen. Food security is, is now more acute than I think it's ever been.

There is an increasing recognition now of the huge strain on global agriculture to feed this growing population and to do so in a way that doesn't continue to wreak havoc on the environment. I believe our current product mix and future growth options play very, very strongly into these three key themes. So we see a more holistic view, creating value for us and our stakeholders, as key to growth. Turning this growth into value is enabled by sustainability and technology. As Helena said, it is complex, and it is iterative, but we now have built the experience for it. We are not talking about distant theories. This is real. It is happening right now up at Woodsmith, for example.

It's a major new mine in the UK, under a national park, that will be barely visible, enormously beneficial for local, the local communities and the economy, fully automated, no waste, no chemical processing, low carbon, and a groundbreaking product to meet what is set to become an acute societal need for food. This is why sustainability matters and how we bring it to the fore as a critical enabler for our business. And that brings to the end, the presentation. And happy to open up for questions now, for the remaining 40 minutes or so that we have together. So, operator, we can admit the first question in whatever format will work.

Operator

Thank you. Before we start, if you'd like to ask any questions, please press star and number one on your telephone keypad. Our first question comes from Sylvain Brunet from BNP Paribas. Your line is now open.

Sylvain Brunet
Managing Director and Head of Mining & Metals Research, BNP Paribas Exane

Good afternoon, Duncan and team. The two questions, maybe the first one, is on safety and the contractors vetting process and training that you guys have got in place. You alluded to that, Duncan, but if you could get a little bit more of a sense of your assessment after what happened in Chile. In other words, could this have happened to Anglo's permanent employees? Is there any penalty system in place to make sure contractors stick to best practices, for instance? My second question, staying with safety as well, are you able to identify, and you mentioned a lot of technology solutions, the potential left across countries and operations for a switch towards more automation technology systems that would allow you to remove staff from the frontline?

I don't know if it's possible to get some sort of figure behind that, how many operations can still be converted into available technologies, and any sense of the timeline associated with that, please? Thank you.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Okay. Hi, Sylvain. I'm going to ask Matt just to talk to you about what we're doing in terms of the safety management systems and processes that we're putting in place for our contracting community. Look, I think the reality is that the conditions associated with some of these fatalities are not just associated with contractors themselves directly, right? And I don't want to, for a moment, say this is a problem that is not owned by the management of Anglo American, and therefore it's the contractor's problem at all. This is not true.

You know, what it is, is that there's generally a large turnover of people within the contracting community, and just keeping pace with the development and standards, et cetera, et cetera, is a challenge for us. And we are determined to get on top of that. So you know, this is fundamentally more about leadership management systems and culture that you have in the organization, and how that rolls over into everybody that is associated with the company. And we own that, and we will take responsibility for making that a more feasible and a more reliable outcome. So I'm gonna hand over to Matt just briefly.

On the tech, on the tech systems side of things, you, your question very specifically was: Is there more scope for more automation within, existing operations? And I think, you know, the answer to that is, a qualified yes. I mean, if it was, if it was immediately obvious, we would have done it by now. And there are little elements, as, as Ali pointed out, you know, this is fundamentally about the whole system working together, and, and integrating this, into older operations is slightly more challenging than integrating it into, into new operations, like a Quellaveco, Woodsmith or a Sakatti, where you can start, start absolutely from scratch.

But we have certainly shown that, in places like Mogalakwena, Los Bronces, for instance, and in some of our other operations, that, you know, you can grab great chunks of this thing, in terms of, you know, reliability, engineering, automation, you know, truck automation, so on, and you can do the conversion. You generally do that conversion along the normal, safe, sustainable capital deployment process. So, you know, when you're bringing something down, you're changing a piece of kit out, you change it for the new, the new kit, but of a newly installed platform. So it does happen. It just happens at a slightly slower rate.

And that's what we're trying to accelerate through our systems and planning processes now. Matt, do you want to just talk a little bit more about the contractor safety processes that we're putting into place, please?

Matt Daley
Technical Director, Anglo American

Certainly. Thanks, Duncan, and good afternoon. Good morning, everyone. First point, and really important one to make, is that we look at all of our workforce, so contractors or employees, in exactly the same way. We have the same rules, we apply the same standards, and we, of course, have the same right for anyone who works for Anglo American on one of our sites to stop work if they feel like it's not safe. In terms of a specific program around our contract workforce, it's really started with us listening to our contractors, and we've done this through traveling to the different geographies where we operate and having town halls, which have been about getting feedback from contractors around the experience they have, some of their frustrations and opportunities to improve.

Now, that's all been incorporated into a Contractor Performance Management program, which is really holistic. So it's looking at how we select contractors, how we assess capability, really importantly, how we scope the work, acknowledging that contractors often do one-off, high-risk, and specialized work. We are reviewing how we onboard contractors to make sure they're familiar with our systems, our processes, and our technical standards. And then, really importantly, we're looking at how we supervise and provide assurance across the company. So this program has kicked off in a number of geographies, but really advancing in South Africa. It's a three-year program of work. We're into the second year, so running this out over the next 24 months. Duncan, I'll hand back to you.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Thank you, Matt. Okay, Savannah, next question, please.

Operator

Our next question is coming from Alain Gabriel from Morgan Stanley. Your line is now open.

Alain Gabriel
Managing Director, Morgan Stanley

Yes, thank you for taking my question. I have two of them. So the first one is on... basically, the business has done significant progress on the ESG commitments over time. However, the environment in which you operate is never static. Where do you see the external challenges getting worse, both social and regulatory? And where do you see the biggest improvement across your portfolio? And here I'm referring just to the external factors, basically. That's the first question.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Thanks, Alain. So, where is it getting worse? Well, the one thing is absolutely true, it's, it's never static, and, and, and you have to really be quite adroit and adaptive to it. Certainly, I, I think that, you know, the regulatory environment continues to be relatively challenging in terms of being able to move at pace, particularly in terms of some of the technology development issues that we're looking at. You know, every time you're thinking about a new technology and you want to implement it, you have to basically re-permit large parts of the mine. You know, permitting processes take, take quite a long time to get there.

But I think, you know, the collaborative engagement with many of the regulatory authorities and the governments are very accommodating and understanding of the need to do this. And then, certainly in many countries now, driven by this and some other externalities, there is a real will to look to try and accelerate the administration of permitting processes, as opposed to, you know, change the materiality of any of the content of the permitting processes, but the acceleration of the administration, which would be extremely helpful. And, well, you know, if we're really being honest with ourselves, the other externalities that are really potentially, you know, you can look at it both positive and negatively at this point in time.

But the fact is, in an inflationary environment where money costs something today, you know, the rate of development of some of these technologies externally that we could rely on has probably slowed down a little bit. But I think that this will itself be rectifying in the way that some of the governments are thinking about policies and drivers. And, you know, the real fundamental needs for technology solutions, not only in the mining industry, but the world, will of course, become more valuable over time, and therefore will speed up. But those would be the two key issues that I would speak to off the top of my head.

Alain Gabriel
Managing Director, Morgan Stanley

Thank you. That's, that's very clear. The second question is sort of a follow-on on this one. So on South Africa, how confident are you about your ability to push your climate agenda, given that we're heading into the next election cycle, and clearly, the government priorities may be different than what you would like them to be? How, how should you think about that? Thanks.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Well, you know, the biggest component of South Africa in our climate agenda is the conversion of hydrocarbon-based energy to cleaner and more renewable forms of energy. And whoever the government is going to be in South Africa, they have to deal with an energy scarcity situation within the country. You know, the solutions that we're looking to provide, which, as I said, fundamentally support and drive our own decarbonization agenda, are very much linked with the South African government's requirement to provide energy of any shape or sort to foster growth and development from within the country.

Actually, it is a great synergy in terms of the provision of additional energy, and especially if it is in the form of clean energy in the way that Envusa is looking to do. Actually, I don't see any challenges in that respect from the potential elections or change in makeup of government going forward.

Alain Gabriel
Managing Director, Morgan Stanley

Thank you. Thank you.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Okay, next question, please.

Operator

Before we jump into the next question, again, if you'd like to ask any questions, please press star and number one on your telephone keypad. That's star and number one on your telephone keypad. Our next question comes from Myles Allsop from UBS. Your line is now open.

Myles Allsop
Mining Research Analyst, UBS

Great. Thank you very much for taking the question. Maybe the first question on the hydrogen truck. You know, we've seen other competitors of yours sort of moving more down the trolley assist route in terms of electrifying the fleet. Are you still convinced that the hydrogen truck is the right solution? And how flexible will you be in terms of looking at the other options?

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Hi, Myles. Thanks, thanks for that. Look, as Ally pointed out in her part of the presentation, you know, we are completely commodity agnostic or technology agnostic in terms of what drives better performance in the business, both from an operational and productivity safety point of view, and from our own climate change agenda. And as Ally pointed out, you know, a couple of years ago, three or four years ago, when we were looking to find solutions to our Scope 1 and Scope 2 emissions, there were three major drivers of that. You know, the eradication of carbon emissions associated with diesel usage was one of the key enablers.

You know, at the time, Tony O'Neill and myself did a, you know, pretty extensive tour of the world and suppliers in terms of who was prepared to work with us and deal with solutions and try and help come to an outcome that worked for us at the time, and there weren't very many takers, I have to tell you. And at that point in time, you know, we started to say: Well, you know, how would we do it if we could do it?

And that's, and that sort of led to what, you know, what I believe is probably one of the world's most rapid and most successful prototypes, in the form of a hydrogen electric hybrid vehicle, which we saw running around a mine in real production, for about a year. You know, trolley assist for us specifically doesn't necessarily answer all of the questions for us, right? I mean, trolley assist may be an extremely expensive solution for us, relatively speaking. But to the extent that there was one of our mines that lent itself to a very cost-effective trolley assist solution, we would absolutely deploy that, if we could.

So as we've pointed out, you know, we learn a lot, we develop a lot, and we have to keep iterating to get to the answer. Where we need to be is carbon neutral by 2040. And for us to do that, we need a solution for diesel. And hydrogen may very well be a very big part of that solution, but so may other technologies.

Myles Allsop
Mining Research Analyst, UBS

Okay, thanks. And maybe going back to your Scope 1 and 2 emissions, obviously, there's been fantastic progress over the last 3 years. As you look forward, is the low-hanging fruit kind of going now and the actual NPV impact of achieving your 30% reduction gonna get more and more challenging? And could you give us a sense as to the CapEx that you expect to spend, you know, to deliver the 30% reduction by 2030 over the next 8 years?

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

... Okay, so look, I mean, has the low-hanging fruit gone? I'm not sure there was ever low-hanging fruit in this space, to be honest with you, Myles. And for sure, you know, large elements of that are now embedded into the pathway to 2030, for sure. And so is the cost for that embedded in the business between now and 2030. So I think the bigger challenge is what happens between 2030 and 2040. So we've got pretty clear pathways, you know, on all of our climate goals from here to 2030 in a relatively deliverable sort of way that is embedded in all the forecasts that we've been providing you.

But you know, it gets a little bit more challenging, particularly in VAM and diesel, through to 2040. That being said, I think you have to look at this, not through the lens of what does it cost today, but in the same sort of way that you, that what we're trying to bring to life for you in these, in these projects and sustainable outcomes, solutions to projects, development, and operations, is that it's actually an investment, okay? I mean, at the time that we were doing Quellaveco, there were many people that were saying to us, "This is much higher cost to the capital intensity, et cetera, et cetera, is much higher cost than it needs to be.

Look at the comparatives, et cetera, et cetera." But we absolutely stuck firm to belief that the value in doing this right is extraordinarily high on a returns basis, NPV basis. You know, just a few days, which leads to a few weeks of stoppage in the development of a mine, in the operations of a mine, you know, permits that aren't achieved, et cetera, et cetera, has an enormous cost. And so will not solving the carbon issues related to emissions by 2040. So these things will generally have a very positive return, and we see that with the energy equation. I mean, on-- I mean, Stephen's got all the numbers, and he can probably talk more precisely to them.

But, you know, we've exited a carbon-heavy contract. Looked like it was a cost at the time, turns out it's completely NPV positive by $hundreds of millions. And I think this is going to happen with the rest of our carbon journey, too. Stephen, do you want to add anything to that?

Stephen Pearce
Finance Director, Anglo American

Yeah, thanks, Duncan. So just a refresh, perhaps, of some of the numbers. So in South America, so in Chile, when we converted to the renewables, it was $600 million+ NPV positive at the time, probably more now. In Brazil, it was $300 million NPV positive when we converted across to the fully renewable system. In South Africa, that's probably where we've got the most of the journey in terms of the electricity off the grid to go. But the whole Envusa journey, because we're doing it in partnership in a multi-user way, expected to cost us around $300-$350 million over the decade. What does that deliver for us? Well, South Africa represents about 40% of our energy off the grid, but at about 60% of the emissions from our energy off the grid.

And so I think a really great journey in front of us, and also delivers reliability of energy supply. Really important things. Those values very difficult to determine, but just the investment in Invorsa will be probably at least $500 million, closer to a $1 billion of NPV positive impact in terms of lower energy cost into the business, plus reliability factor. The other major thing coming up for us is VAM. Now, the team, Dan and the team in Australia have done a brilliant job. We already capture a lot of the vent air methane and put it into electricity generation for the local communities.

But they've recently undergone another renewal, if you like, of capturing it via the reticulation system, and that's proved to be very, very positive in terms of outcome of methane capture. We probably thought a few years ago we might have to spend maybe $600 million on that, but the technology that we're looking at now, while still emerging, looks like it could be quite a bit cheaper. We'll do a small trial program. And in fact, the solution may be applicable across the broader met coal business in Australia. That leaves us with the trucks, which represents about 15% of our emissions from diesel. Duncan, I think, has spoken about the journey, whether that's diesel hybrid, initially battery electric, or ultimately fuel cell. It'll be a journey. Technology will change.

Cost of hydrogen, for example, we expect would come down dramatically over the next decade into the 2030s. So I think lots of opportunities as we look to implement that, hopefully in a similarly cost-effective way as we look to play our part and partner with others. And that's a really important point. If you partner well with other people, this can be quite a value-accretive journey. So all up, I'd say we're $hundreds and hundreds of millions ahead of what we've spent versus the value and the cost savings that were generated. Thanks, Duncan.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Thanks, Stephen. Okay.

Operator

Thank you.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Next question, please.

Operator

Our next question. Thank you. Our next question is coming from Maxime Coghe from Oddo. Your line is now open.

Maxime Kogge
Equity Analyst, Metals & Mining, ODDO BHF

Yeah, good afternoon. Thanks for taking my questions. Regarding Invorsa, you will actually no longer consolidate this activity because you own less than 50%, so there will be no dedicated CapEx. But can you still outline the amount of financial investments it's going to represent in the next few years?

... and basically, do you see an impact mainly in terms of power reliability in South Africa, or also in terms of costs there, and, and by how much? That would be my first question.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Okay. Stephen, do you want to... You can do the whole of that question, I think.

Stephen Pearce
Finance Director, Anglo American

Yeah, yeah, I'll give it a crack if I've caught it properly. So, yeah, we're likely, in combination with others, so EDF Renewables and some local BEE partners, to end up owning about 35-ish% of Envusa. So you're right, it will be off balance sheet. And so we'll be one of the off-takers in terms of power. To use really rounded numbers, if we're building out 3 GW of electricity, let's say that's $4 billion, just to use simple math. You normally finance this through Envusa itself and through the generation companies. Typical of infrastructure, let's call it 80/20.

So if you've got about $800 million of equity required, and we've got one-third of that, that's how you roughly get to the $300-odd million that we will contribute over the next decade to build out Envusa to that sort of scale. We may go beyond that, depending on broader business opportunities. And so it's that $300-odd million of our investment, we become one of the customers of Envusa. It's off balance sheet. It gives us potentially a much lower input cost than what we would see versus remaining with Eskom, given the assumptions around their price inflations, et cetera. So a really positive journey.

The reliability, it's a harder one to quantify specifically, but we know we are impacted, predominantly in PGMs, in South Africa. You know, this year we guided around 140,000 ounces of impact. So if you add that back, multiply that by 5, 6, 7 times, obviously, you know, you're talking hundreds and hundreds of million dollars of benefit from reliability, as we progressively build that out. It won't come from day one, fully acknowledge that, but hopefully a good journey together.

I think private enterprise can play in South Africa to provide some of that generation capacity, obviously help build the grid out and the whole country, including us, end up with both a cost-effective, renewable, and reliable energy source to energize industry and development across the country and region. Thanks, Duncan.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Yeah. Thanks, Stephen. So, just, I mean, it is absolutely both, right? It'll be lower cost than the alternative that's available to us, and just it is, it is much more likely to be more reliable than the current source of energy to us.

Maxime Kogge
Equity Analyst, Metals & Mining, ODDO BHF

Okay, that's very helpful. And by the same token, yeah, you met issues too in South Africa recently in terms of water supply in the PGM business. So do you see here some room to in-source the water management, or is it a bit far-fetched to consider that you could one day take care of your own water management yourself?

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Well, you know, it's unlikely to happen anytime in the short-term future because much of our water is a function of a national system that exists in South Africa. So, you know, it's much more about ensuring that that system stays robust.

Maxime Kogge
Equity Analyst, Metals & Mining, ODDO BHF

Okay. Okay, makes sense. Yeah. Thank you.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Yeah.

Operator

Again, if you'd like to ask any questions-

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

Okay, next question, please.

Operator

Again, if you'd like to ask any questions, please press star and number one on your telephone keypad. That's star and number one on your telephone keypad. Looks like we don't have any incoming questions as of the moment. I'd now like back to hand over to the management for their closing remarks.

Duncan Wanblad
CEO, Anglo American

All right. Well, look, thanks very much, everybody, for spending the time with us. This is an absolutely critical topic for us. You know, I really like to talk about it at all opportunities that we've got. I think this is a complete competitive advantage if you can think about this in the right way, but more than just think about it, do it. It takes years and years of learning and experience to build a capability where it is actually fully integrated into the business, and I think Anglo American is a long, long way down that journey. So, with that, thank you very much all for your time, and enjoy the rest of your day.

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