Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for standing by. This is Lizanne, the moderator for your call today. Welcome to the post-result conference call of AIA Engineering Limited. We have with us today the management team of AIA Engineering Limited. At this moment, all participant lines are in the listen-only mode. Later, we will conduct a question and answer session. At that time, if you have a question, you may please press star and one on your telephone. I would now like to turn the conference over to the AIA Engineering management team. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Hi. Thank you so much. Very warm welcome to everyone. This is Kunal, and as usual, I also have Sanjay Majmudar here with me. I will start with a quick rundown on numbers for this quarter, and then, we'll get on to Q&A. You know, I think this was a steady quarter, nothing exceptional to report on any metrics. We produced 82,000 tons, sold 74,000 tons, which brought our nine-month sales to about 225,000 tons. We've done so, and, you know, we targeted to be closer to 300, you know, for the full year, up from 291 for full year last year. So, overall, about a 10,000 ton growth, you know, we expect between...
We've done about 8,000 tons in nine months and a little more, you know, as the year closes. Rest of the numbers are in line with Q3, Q2. One change has been our realization, which has dropped from INR 165 to about INR 154, and largely because of product mix, you know, and we keep talking about product mix. Two aspects of it: one is grinding media versus non-grinding media, and the alloys that we sell in each of these categories. We do 11%-30% chrome. So, you know, and that, you know, generally influences the realization. So, the 74,000 tons out of 154 realization translated to 1,146, 1,146 crores of sales.
Leading to an EBITDA of INR 395 crore as compared to INR 444 crore in sequential second quarter and INR 483 crores in the third quarter last year. EBITDA at 33.79%, almost comparable to second quarter EBITDA, which was at 34.32%, and a profit after tax of INR 279 crore. Moving on, similar export benefits, our treasury income is comparable to previous periods. We had some foreign exchange gain this quarter, about INR 17.40 crore. So total other income at INR 83 crore. Our working capital, again, you know, largely in sync. We've had some increase in WIP and FG, but that's more accounting related, which is stock in transit. Otherwise, working capital continues to be at par with previous periods around, you know, 90 days.
This quarter is about 100, but overall, 90 days of working capital. From a sales standpoint, we've done of the 74,000 tons, 53,395, you know, in the mining segment, and non-mining is 20,745. 9-month mining is at 158,000 tons and up from 144,000 in nine months last year. So it's a nice 15,000 growth as far as mining is concerned. Our non-mining has shrunk by about 6,000 tons, and I think nothing exceptional. It's just, it's a timing issue more than anything else. In the previous period, we had some more with some OE orders, you know, that, that materialized in that period, but you know, nothing material to report, you know, for that period. Total CapEx for this year is at INR 146 crore.
We had identified INR 600 crores of total CapEx, of which INR 500 crores of total CapEx, of which INR 200 crores was to go into the grinding media plant, which we are on track. It's in the, you know, stage of installation or being set up. We hope to commission it, you know, between December and March 2025, December 2024 and March 2025. Total cost for that plant will be INR 200 crores. We are also spending INR 200 crores on various debottlenecking efforts. We're buying land, we're setting up some warehouses, et cetera, to support the whole operation. INR 100 crores towards renewable.
So all put together, we are at about 500, and of which we spent INR 146 crores in nine months this year, and another INR 50 crores approximately for till the end of the year. So it'll be INR 200 for the full year. We've also, you know, transferred money towards the purchase of shares in the Australian company called MPM at a 30%... We now have a 30% stake, and we transferred money for that at INR 43 crores. So there's a total outflow of INR 186 crores for non-OpEx reasons. Our net cash for the period is at INR 3,100 crores, odd, and I think overall, as far as business is concerned, I think we— two paradoxes.
One is from a business standpoint, I don't think we've been more excited or better situated for the opportunity in front of us, right from our balance sheet, our excess capacity on the ground, our network and team in place, and the solutions that we have for the customers, and the opportunity, largely the 2.5 million ton forged, you know, grinding media market, which will, you know, which we're looking to convert to high chrome. At the same time, we recognize the and we've spoken about it in previous quarters, about the challenges that, you know, that we have to overcome to convert. And a lot of that is linked to, you know, customers' mindset, you know, customers' perception of risk when something one changes from forged to chrome.
It's taking longer than that, longer than we have, you know, imagined, and which is where we were hoping to be at 320,000 tons, at least. You know, we will be falling short this year. We continue with our overall, I wouldn't say a guidance, but at least an indicative direction of saying 25,000-30,000 tons each year, you know, we are looking to add. But it's contingent on a lot of these conversions coming into play. And we've got customers, you know, or prospects, where each customer can give 20,000-25,000 tons to customers, you know, who are between 5,000 and 10,000 tons. You know, it just... the timeline is, there is uncertainty around timeline, and we hope.
We are doing all we can and, you know, hoping that a lot of that opportunity materializes soon enough. Macro from a mining environment, I think, our solutions have a deep, you know, opportunity, just because we are improving, you know, operational, you know, parameters for the customer, and especially at a time when, you know, the grades, head grades of copper are falling, you know, and plants need to run at optimal utilization. I think our products feed into that, and seeing, and reducing operational costs, which is power, wear cost, you know, for mill internals, reagent costs, et cetera. So I think overall, we remain very, very excited about the opportunity.
At the same time, like I said, it's taking a little longer to convert, and we hope to share better news as we move forward. Before we get into Q&A, maybe Sanjay can share, you know, a quick update, and then we can get into.
Yeah. Good afternoon to all. So now, thank you very much, Kunal. I think Kunal has covered most of the points. Most important point being the fact that we continue to remain completely committed and focused on the conversion opportunity. As I had indicated in the previous call, it is likely to take a little more time, and therefore, we see this year getting flattish, maybe a very marginal growth of 8,000-10,000 tons in sales as compared to last year. But we should continue seeing good traction in the coming years. But having said that, the process is harder, long, but we remain very, very excited about it, and we are quite confident that eventually it is just a matter of time, and all our efforts are completely in the right direction.
We do hope to share some the more exciting things as we move ahead and we achieve those goals. I think even on the CapEx, we've done about INR 146 crore. We've done under target, under 150 odd crore in the current fiscal, and then another about 200 odd crore in 2024, 2025. So all those expansion projects are on stream. So I think with this, let the house be open for Q&A.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin with the question-and-answer session. Anyone wishing to ask a question may please press star and one on your touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Mohit Kumar from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Yes. Good evening, sir.
Good evening.
Thanks for the opportunity. My first question is on this, is there impact of freight costs in this particular quarter? And are you seeing that the freight cost has jumped substantially in the quarter because of Red Sea, and does that impact, that will impact the Q4 also?
Yeah, good question. I think I should have added that in the starting commentary. While this quarter, we've not seen the current PNL for Q3 does not reflect the increased freight cost, but surely going forward, there will be a freight cost increase, which has surely come along because of the Red Sea, you know, insurgency. And, but, you know, as a concept, most of it is a pass-through. Most of it would be, the effort would be to pass it on. So we are also on a wait-and-watch, you know, basis right now, hoping that this is temporary and it is something that, you know, it doesn't require to us to engage with the customer. So while we remain on wait and watch, there will be some costs that we'll have to eat in the short term.
If we find these costs to be stickier and, you know, looking that it persists, there will be, it will be absolutely passed on, like we did in the 2021, 2022 phase, where shipping went up by three-five times.
Understood. My second question is on the non-mining sector. The volume has been declined last nine months. Does it mean that there's some weakness in the cement industry, which is percolating to a weakness in volume, which looks like the FY 2024, there's a decline in the overall volume YOY for the entire fiscal?
Not really, not really. The non-mining, and that's why when non-mining was a little higher, we kept explaining that, you know, if there is this smaller term, shorter term, you know, the demand that that probably came in. See, a lot of our solutions for cement also have much longer wear lives. You know, so our castings, for example, like, for wear mining liner, their average life could be three-six months. Our tube mill liner for cement could be five years, seven years, sometimes even 10 years. And same thing for vertical mill parts that we sell to, you know, cement and thermal power business, right? So there was some amount of demand, some amount of, I would say, a little backlog that came in from, you know, that that didn't get processed in 2021.
Companies saying, "Let's keep surplus capacity," and maybe added, you know, some bit of it, more than anything structural.
Exactly.
Our guidance. What we've seen over the last five years is non-mining is around 75,000, around 80,000-90,000 tones, and we expect that to continue at that level. Now, we've gone to 100,000, but I think 80-90 is a fair figure to consider when you know plotting the non-mining business.
Understood, sir. Thank you and all the best.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is on the line of Rohit Singh from Invest Analytics. Please go ahead. The line for the current participant has dropped off. We'll move on to the next question. That is the line of Karan Gupta from K3 Capital. Please go ahead.
Yes, thank you. Appreciate the opportunity. Just one question. Can you throw some light on your, the capital allocation policy going forward, you know, with INR 3,100 crore of net cash, that seems to be a sizable amount. So what are your needs going to be, and are you working on some policy on returning capital to shareholders?
So, so yeah, thanks for the question, Gupta. So you see, we are, we are following a little conservative policy right now. As, as you would be aware, yes, we are growing. There are a lot of opportunities that are coming, so we are constantly doing CapEx about, on average run rate of INR 200-250 crores a year, plus incremental working capital. My working capital, gross is a little longer. Net is about 100 days, but I have to invest significantly in that. Having said that, we have comfortable cash. We believe that there could be some opportunities which might warrant us to deploy some unexpected cash.
So therefore, what we have internally decided, that till we reach a particular level of penetration in the overall global mining space of at least a sale of 300,000-350,000 to about close to 400,000 tonnes, we will have to continuously incur CapEx, and we might want to have an opportunity to look at any inorganic possibility. Therefore, we are maintaining a little higher cash. We are consciously reviewing it every quarter, and we will therefore take an appropriate call, but not in immediate future, not at least for next one year.
Okay, sir. That's helpful. Has there been any thought of maybe using some leverage on the balance sheet, if at all?
See, we are using to a significant extent our export packing credit limit to the extent of about INR 400 crore-INR 450 crore, where there is an interest subvention. We effectively, in rupee terms, the rate of interest goes down to around just in the range of about 5%. Correct? five, five, 5.7%. We don't have any term loans. We don't need any term loans. We have enough cash on the books, but except for that, there is no need for any leverage at this point in time.
Okay, thank you. That's all from my side.
Yeah.
Thank you. The next question is on the line of Amit Anwani from PL Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Thanks for taking my question. My first question is on just to reconfirm the CapEx. We used to talk about INR 5 lakh 40. That is on track, right? INR 50,000 for current.
Very much. Very much.
Right.
We are already at 440, and another 80,000 tons, plus another 20 or 1,000 tons, so it will be 540.
Great, sir. So just wanted to understand, on mill liner, you know, we started the journey, four, five years back, and so what is the traction which we are developing? So we talked about Australian market and few other markets, which evaluated products on mill liner.
Yeah.
So, just need to understand, are we on track, and what is happening on the mill liner now?
We are, we are very much on track, and we remain rather quite excited about the opportunities which are unfolding. So that is the reason why, in order to strengthen our design and market acquisition portfolio, we acquired this 30% stake in this Australian company, MPS, which are experts in complementary mill lining designs, apart from the other available patented design that we have. We see this as a very good opportunity. We are currently at a run rate of around 34,000 tones of mill liners already on an annual basis, and we continue to, I would say that it is a very important development in our long-term strategic planning to take a major conversion possibility, because that goes as a line item when, you know...
We overall approach any mine, so we, we talk of mill liners, we talk of grinding media, and then we also talk of the beneficiation benefits. So grinding and beneficiation are our focus areas, and mill liner is exactly panning out the way we have anticipated.
Sure. So my second question is on, as you highlighted that, you know, there's a delay happening with respect to, conversion because of the acceptability by the customers. And I can see, you know, almost from, about seven-eight years, so earlier because of the, anti-dumping, across two geographies.
Yeah.
And COVID, and then now we were on track and doing capacity, but again this year we are missing majorly. So past nine years, we have never, you know, added more than 25-30,000 incrementally. I think it's just two-three instances.
Yeah.
So any change in strategy? Because again, you know, this year also we targeted 25,000 plus addition.
Yeah.
We are going to be flattish, and we are doing so much CapEx. Any read through or any change in, you know, basically you understand the problem, that the acceptability is leading to delays in incremental volumes. Just wanted to understand your thought on that.
So you see, whenever—I mean, of course, I've been quite repetitive on this issue, and I will once again slightly elaborate. So the process is extremely long and time consuming. Again, it is not possible to exactly predict how it happens. So let me give you an example. Today, we are working in almost all leading geographies where—and we are working with almost all known or even relatively unknown names in mining space, with focus on copper and gold being the driving force, and of course, iron ore also happening. The problem is, these mines are very large. They are highly bureaucratic organizations. Earlier, of course, I must be very honest with you, what was the situation prevailing before nine years, and today is considerably and totally different in the sense that we have also climbed up our learning curve.
We have now understood how the mining overall operates, what are their expectations, what are the threats and potential opportunities both. We have significantly strengthened our knowledge base by, you know, doing a lot of research on the DP or the down process, that is the beneficiation process, plus this extraordinary trials that we have done on the mill liner unique design, plus significant strengthening and training of our teams. So all these things are happening. Having said that, as Kunal explained, structural, on a structural standpoint, if we look at the opportunity landscape and where we are positioned, we are extremely, extremely excited, and we continue to remain excited and focused on the process. There is nothing that we see as something as a major deterrent, which forces me to change my direction or my strategy.
As I explained on the previous call also, this year, we had predicted that the conversion pace or the time that it's taking is more. Certain very important mines with extraordinary opportunities are also in the process of being developed, and the only thing is the time. I don't think that you should very honestly read anything negative, but the reality is that, yes, it is a time-consuming process, it is unpredictable, but we are on track. And if you look at the overall opportunity landscape, vis-à-vis is where we are positioned. On a medium to long-term scenario, we will be hopefully definitely be in a position to talk about higher numbers, but at this point in time, we are conservatively saying definite possibility of around 25,000-30,000-odd tons incremental volume growth in the coming year.
Sure, sir. Lastly, on the overall, conversion market, roughly about 2.5 million tons. So I, I recollect, I think we used to highlight 2 billion, so just wanted to clarify. And second thing is, is the competition doing better than, us in the sense that, the overall global conversions has been at a faster place, pace than, you know, compared to AIA, conversions of, of customers, yeah.
No, I really don't get what you are saying, but can you, can you repeat your question? Yeah.
Sure. So one is we highlighted 2.5 million tons of conversion from forged to high chrome. So just wanted to understand that the overall conversion versus AIA, which is facing delays, the overall, you know, global conversion, is it faster than.
Yeah. So the point is that we are the only ones leading the whole charge towards conversion from forged to high-chrome. Yeah.
How about director, sir? Is it not into this?
Yeah, they are also working on it. So between us, you know, a lot of that conversion is happening. We are not sure of how much surplus capacity they have in other things. They are not a public company, so we don't have access to that information. But I would imagine as, as we understand, a lot of that conversations right now for conversion, because what we are offering is a whole suite of products, right? Which is we are saying we'll take responsibility for the grinding circuit, which is mill liners and grinding media, you know, for the grinding mills, right? And so the conversation is very different. The conversation is not to say you're using our product, and I'll just give you the same product at a cheaper price, which is your general export, India export story.
What we are saying is that a lot of our intervention is adding to disproportionate savings for the customers, and that requires them to at least adapt to a different solution, you know, get used to a new supplier, the products that you know. So all of that, I think what's taking time is just getting used to that there is this whole change management process. I don't think there is anyone else doing conversion to chrome really besides us, given this context.
Sure, sir. Just to add, what you feel would have been, you know, the conversion rate right now out of 2.5 million tons, forged to happen?
2.5 million tons is being serviced by chrome as we speak.
Okay. Thank you very much, sir. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Mm.
The next question is from the line of Swati Jhunjhunwala from BOB Capital. Please go ahead.
Yes, thank you for taking my question. My question is on the volume. So, this year we have missed the volume addition mark by of 30,000 additions in FY 2024. For FY 2025, when we are seeing 30,000 tons incremental additions, does this include the 10,000-18,000 that we have missed this year, or is that over and above that?
See, the thing is that, and I'll just share the context again, we are not, you know, we're not changing the funnel where, you know, you make four cold calls and one converts, right? That's the metric when you're saying, you know, the backlog adds up or not. Our expectation, or rather our hope, and our effort is to do much more than that. It's just that there is uncertainty linked to when that conversion will happen, how long that will take, and which is where, because everyone keeps asking us how to model and what to use, 25, 30 is just an indicative figure. It's not coming out of a funnel conversation, saying, "Here's what we are doing, and here's what..." And the backlog gets added, right?
I mean, what we have missed this year is not the opportunity. It remains, the effort remains. You know, it's a fair chance I do more than that, but there's a fair chance it takes longer, you know, and that's just the nature of our business right now.
Understood, got it. Thank you.
Thank you. A reminder to the participants, anyone wishing to ask a question, may please press star and one. The next question is on the line of Rohit Singh from Invest Analytics. Please go ahead.
Hi, am I audible?
Yeah. Please proceed.
So my question is on the margin side and the realization side. So what is the outlook for the current quarter in terms of margins and the realization?
I think, margin we've discussed enough times, where our guidance, we're not giving a margin guidance, but we are saying that our business will do enough to do a 20-22% margin. You know, we've done better, but we are not sharing a precise quarterly margin guidance. And as far as our realization is concerned, we expect it to be between INR 150 and INR 160, depending on the product mix.
No, like in last quarter you predicted, you mentioned the EBITDA 300-400 BPS. So in that manner, I was asking for you, is there any further downward estimate of the margins? That is what I was asking for.
There, there is, from current levels, there could be a further adjustment because of the freight that's increased, right? So near term, there is a likely increase in freight cost because of the Red Sea turbulence. But longer term, medium term rather, you know, if that is sticky, it can pass through. So, but, but on a longer-term basis, so longer-term basis, our margin guidance remains at 20%-22%.
Understood, sir. And just, I joined the conf call a bit later. So what is the guidance of volume for FY 2024?
So as we explained, actually, our target is about 25,000-30,000 tons for FY 2024-2025. We have shared the details that, yes, there are a lot of mines on which we are working. This volume could be little higher, but we remain conservative, and this is about 25,000-30,000 tons. That's what we have said as a target.
For FY 2024?
2024, 2025. 2024, so 2024, if you go by the same run rate, we should be around 300,000 tons, sales.
Understood, sir. Understood. That, that's it from my side. All the best for the future.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is on the line of Anirudh Shetty from Solidarity Investment Managers. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi. Thank you for the opportunity. Just one question from my end. You know, in the past you have mentioned that copper and gold are opportunities that, you know, could do better than the others in terms of growth. So, in the industry, in the overall industry, the 2.5 million-ton market, and for our business, what would the share be from gold and copper respectively?
So this is almost equal. Again, in terms of opportunity, we are equally focused on iron ore. What we said was, what we said was that copper and gold are the current areas of focus, given the fact that we should be able to demonstrate the strong benefits that we are offering on the table. Again, we don't share the industry segment-wise volumes, but you can broadly say that between the three, more or less, they are equal.
Okay. And is, so would that be true for us as well? In our volume mix, are we more or less equal across these three?
Yeah, I think so.
Okay. Thank you.
Yeah.
Thank you. The next question is on the line of Chirag from Centrum Broking. Please go ahead.
Hello, yeah, thanks for the opportunity. So sir, the question was on mill liners. So just to clarify, you mentioned that 30,000 metric tons would be approximately the mill liners volume. That is for this year, correct, sir, FY 2024?
Yeah.
Yeah. So, sir, we had put up a plan to 50,000 metric tons. So any.
I just want to clarify, we are also manufacturing mill liners in certain other multipurpose facilities, so this is a combined figure I have given you.
Okay. So the in.
Seven-30. Yeah, it's a range, actually.
27 to 30?
Yeah. This year, that's what the expectation is.
Sure. Sure. So sir, a 30,000 metric ton plant, the new greenfield plant that we have, plus what would be the capacity of the other mill liners that we have in other plants?
When we are talking of a multipurpose plant, there we can manufacture these mining mill liners. The total capacity will be about 70,000 tons, all put together, for mill liners. We can do more, but because we have the plant is also used for other products.
Yeah.
You can consider total 70. Yeah.
Okay. Okay. So basically, at least for the next two-three years, we will not be looking at further expansion of this new mill liner plant, correct?
Correct. No.
Okay. And this, volume, of 300,000 metric tons this year, and possibly 25,000-30,000 metric tons capacity addition for FY 2025, that you are, I mean, you are, you know, likely to do, so that includes this incremental opportunity of mill liners, correct?
Yeah, of course. Yeah.
Sure, sir. And, is it possible to, broadly mention that how much mill liner would be more profitable compared to the grinding media?
That product wise, profitability is difficult to discuss, but every product has its own profit profile, but you'll have to look at it in a totality, because I can't do just one, right? It's a whole set of internals that we sell, and there's only so much mill, you know, casting I can sell or liners I can sell in sync with grinding media. So you'll have to look at it as the whole pool together.
Okay. And on this Australian company where we have taken 30% stake.
Yeah.
So here, eventually, you know, what is the, you know, I mean, business plan? So, are we eventually will be taking over the entire company or they are going to be our own owner?
No, no, no. So they will... We want to eventually take up a majority stake, but we will not take over the entire company. The current set of people who are experts, they will continue the operating team. We were not going to disturb. They will continue the operations. We are only adding strategic as well as marketing related inputs.
Okay.
We'll be taking up a majority. That's the plan.
Okay. Their mill liners are of different material than ours, or is this similar product?
No, no, no. So, you know, there are different categories of mill liners. This is a complementary design capability that we are increasing, and they do have a set of customers who are also using those designs and manufacturing complementary types of liners. It's a little complicated, but yes, it complements and it strengthens our portfolio of aggressively marketing mill liners in this mining segment.
Okay. Sir, what would be the global addressable market of mill liners?
In my view, what we are totally currently manufacturing, the metal liner part, is about 300,000 tons.
Okay. And the one that this Australian company makes?
It's a part of it. It's a part of it.
They are not making.
They are not making liners. Mind you, they don't have any manufacturing capacity.
They are getting it delivered.
They are a design and a service company that, you know, and which have access to the market. There's IP and there's access to the market that they have.
Okay. Okay, sir. Got it. So thanks. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is on the line of Anupam Gupta from IIFL. Please go ahead.
Yeah, good evening, Sanjay Majmudar. So sir, a couple of questions. Firstly, on mining, where you said that the timeline to convert is relatively uncertain. Can you give some idea of what sort of, let's say, potential volumes are under trial at this point of time in terms of customers, or instead of which color where?
Higher quantity, Anupam.
Sorry, come again? I didn't get you on so.
Yeah, yeah. But the learning is that it will take time just because of the nature of the market, the conservatism, all the things that you said. You know, like I said, that's the paradox, right? Where we are, we feel the most confident about the product, but there's a natural law that we can't violate. That's something that we'll have to respect the time that customers take to warm up to it and say: Now I'm ready to go, you know, migrate. It's something that we'll have to... That's the nurture part of the market that we'll have to participate in. And, you know, there are customers where, which is 25, 30,000 tons at each level, right?
If two such convert, it is a 50,000-ton conversion. It's just that.
... till I don't do it, there's no point in speaking about it, right? The proof of the pudding is having it. To that extent, you know, we are just keeping it at, because there's no point in me saying this much and then, you know, trying to explain why it didn't happen. The fact is, we are saying it as is, which is there's uncertainty linked to the timing of when and how that conversion will happen. And, and that's just, you know, we'll try and share as much more color as we can going forward.
Okay.
Yeah.
Okay. Just to clarify, let's say, will this be more in geographies where you have lesser presence, like say Peru or Chile, where we are trying to enter in?
Today, we are ready to set up even further capacity. We don't have to. We cannot afford to stay, you know, in one and not in the other, on any matrix. So whether we are in a market or not in a market, we are making efforts across the board to go, you know, penetrate, right?
Okay.
And there are different stages with each of these customers. I don't think it's more geography linked as much as how, where the company is and what stage it is, and what is their priority, right? How do they look at the whole change management process? So it's a little more nuanced than trying to say one geography or one... I understand where you're coming from, but unfortunately, I don't have an objective answer to this.
No, the only thing to add what Kunal said, I think you may take it like this: We are present in all important geographies where significant mining is happening. All.
Yeah. Okay, okay.
Yeah.
Understand that, sir. One question on the non-mining volume, they have been at this 90 KT level for some time now, although on the domestic market, cement market has also grown, domestic thermal coal market has also grown, and CapEx has also happened. Anything, why is the reduction not happening there?
No, I'll tell you, I'll tell you. See, as Kunal explained, one mine location could offer a 25,000-30,000 ton opportunity. Correct? One mine, single mine, or even more.
Mm.
Our entire country's cement, even at present high level of production, is being serviced on a volume of 27-28,000 tons. So the requirement per ton of cement produces minuscule as compared to mining. That is point number one. Therefore, even though the cement production may grow, say, by 10%, 15%, my volume growth will be from 25,000 tons or 27,000 tons to maybe, again, see, initial supply versus replacement. So all this cycle. So we, we continue to enjoy a 95%+ market share in cement in India. We have never lost any customer so far. Globally, we are in more than 130 countries in cement. Still, globally, we are talking of a 70-75,000 ton supply, ex China, 35% market share. So the market itself is small, although growing, so there's the incremental volume impact is absolutely insignificant.
Same is thermal. Thermal, correct, but the growth in thermal at present is not that much. The power is more focused on renewable. Whatever we are able to supply in thermal, we are doing is 7,000-10,000 tons. That's about it. 5%, there is no impact at all on the overall scheme of it.
Understood. Understood. Fine, sir. That's all from my side. Thank you.
Thanks.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Pritesh Chheda from Lucky Investments. Please go ahead.
Yeah, sir, the 50,000-ton mine, the liner capacity that you had added, what is the utilization there?
Currently, overall is about 50%.
The 440,000-ton total capacity that we have, what would be your guess in terms of the utilization of that, how many years it will take?
See, I want to clarify two things. We don't share plant-wise capacity utilization figures, but overall, for castings, including mining liners, the larger VSMs and other type of liners, overall utilization is in the range of 50%-60%, and that's about it.
Yeah, I know that. The 4 lakh 40, how you have on ground, how many years it will take to utilize that?
See, we are, our internal target is that we can theoretically go up to 80%.
Mm-hmm.
Our target is that we want to do it in three years. Now, let us see. But this should not.
Sure.
Be taken as a guidance. Don't catch me.
No problem, sir. 440, 80% utilization, three years.
Yeah.
Okay. Thank you very much, sir.
Yeah.
Thank you. A reminder to the participants, anyone wishing to ask a question, may please press star and one. Participants, if you wish to ask a question, you may please press.
Operator, I think we are done with questions, so, I think we can just wind down the call. Yeah?
Thank you.
All right. Thank you everyone for joining, and Sanjay and I remain available offline for any further questions.
Thank you, and have a good evening.
Thank you.
Thank you, members of the management team. Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes your conference for today. We thank you for your participation and for using Chorus Call conferencing services. You may please disconnect your lines now. Thank you, and have a great evening.