Q1 18/19

Jul 30, 2018

Quarterly report

Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the CDSL Limited Q1 FY 'nineteen Investors Conference Call by Axis Capital Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in listen only mode and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation Please note this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Aditya Bhabal of AXIS Capital Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Thank you, Vikram. Good evening, ladies and gentlemen, and a warm welcome to the 1Q FY 'nineteen earnings call of CDSL India Limited. We have with us the management of CDSL, represented by Mr. P. S. Reddy, Managing Director and CEO Mr. Bharat Sheth, Chief Financial Officer Mr. Goran Shah, Vice President and Mr. Nilesh Kattoor, Assistant Vice President. I request Mr. Reddy to take us through the result highlights, and then we shall open the floor for Q and A subsequently. Over to you, sir. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Aditya. Good evening, everybody. Thank you for your continued interest in the stock. And this quarter, maybe it's a mixed result for us in the sense the operational income has gone up. But in terms of for the other income, substantially the investment income has substantially come down because the returns are low. Many take on all these line item wise, Mr. Bharatjit will take you through. But I will give you the overview as So how we are doing and what is the road map in the sense what we expect here to be like? If you see the Depository business, currently, we have a 70% incremental market share, 71% order to be precise in this quarter. And we are currently about INR 1.55 crore DMAT account that we have. That's a good growth, reasonably good growth, I would say. And the aggregate about 47% market share we have it. On the IPO front, the 1,000,000 number of IPOs corresponding to the compared to the corresponding quarter are more, but then the size is not very big. So the number may be looking hosted. But then the number of investors who have applied in number of times, the issues got oversubscribed did not get as much as we thought it will be yielding the income. So that's one area Probably, we have not got as much as we thought we should be achieving. In terms of new businesses that have come in terms of new activities rather, of course, you are aware that IEPF has been there for the last 6 months, Investor Educational Protection Fund Activity. There we started charging the companies annually. And the latest addition for the income stream is the foreign portfolio investor monitoring. So that's also again our tariffs are there in the public, about 25,000 for the top 500 companies and the rest will be paying INR 10,000 annual deal. The channels are of course, it's not going to be very big, but then that channels are the source of revenue that we are expecting in this current year, current financial year. When it comes to the new initiatives, Consider CDS's Ventures Limited. There again, we have done reasonably well. Although the new creations are slightly lower as compared to the last year, the number of fixtures definitely has gone up and there we have done reasonably well. And the most of the mutual fund investments, Of course, all the U. S. Portfolios have gone up. To some extent, the KYCs have gone to the competition, especially the which have got a captive service centers where they were uploading the data. So not so much has come from that part, but then still some mutual funds are doing with CDHL Ventures Limited. So we have done reasonably well The 3rd area is the National Economic Depository. This National Economic Depository has been picking up, gaining momentum. And Abbott, as I said, Last time also on the other lead time I've been whenever I meet investors, I do tell them that till September 2019, we were told not to charge. So there won't be much revenues except from verification. Verification will happen if the number of records increase substantially. So that is where the government and the as well as the depositaries both of us working hosted to bring in as many academic records as possible into the depository network are into the fold. So that will help us to increase the number of verifications. At this point in time, again, it's minuscule. It's a project. As I said, it's about 2019 or 2020, 2021. We should be able to reasonably Say that we are doing well in this space. Then the commodity repository is one which we have recently launched. I believe some people, again, in private access, were concerned that there will be a risk on the depository in terms of Commodity, we are guaranteeing adding the commodity report is guaranteeing quality and quantity of the stock that is in the commodity warehouses. I think that is completely a wrong notion that they have. The regulations itself stipulates what the quality will do and what is not his responsibility, especially in terms of quality and quantity that's very specifically expressed in the stated in the regulations. So in that field, NMC, that is the commodity exchange basin on Ahmedabad has issued a surplus saying that the E and W, or electronic negotiable warehouse receipts kept in the depository or rather repository are eligible for delivery on the commodity exchange. Similarly, MCX has issued a circular just a week, not even a week old, okay, informing that the CCRL held E and WOS and valid for delivery. So although it's not going to be a very big business because the deliveries and commodity exchanges are small. We expect it to grow as we go along. But more than that, what we are looking at is the pledge by the are the loan against these commodities by pledging the stock or E and WRs instead of banks. And that is where we are working all of them, including the regulators are working day in and day out to convince banks as to why they should go for it. And discussions are also on with the RBI, especially the banking regulator to push for such kind of operation. To enable EMWR based bridging and then lending. Then comes the other we have the yen, what you call, Insurance depository. As you all know that the insurance depository has not taken up, but we are all waiting for the C3D postponed to come and then phase out the insurance processing, which is not doing so well. And in the BMAT account itself, we are expecting the investors to hold all their assets. Probably that will take some more time. Although maybe on a month on month or on month in 2 months, the meetings are taking place at the highest level, wherever this needs to be pushed. I expect in the next 3 months Some kind of changes to happen. And this is my belief, of course, I'm not holding any promise, but these are all regulatory changes. But we expect some moment to happen in this front, especially in the form of regulations. Then The RPA business which we have taken, You're aware that it is in the press, of course. LCA proposes to admit all the unlisted companies will be in phases, okay, into Demag. That's what their desire or road map is. But to begin with, all the public limited companies will be told to or maybe told, not that I can guarantee again, to dematerialize their stock and keep them with the edge of the deposit rates. So that is going to be a good Business opportunity, both for CDSL as well as for CVL under the RTA. So CVL can cater to them as an RTA and CDHL can be a depository. So that line of business also is expected to has come and we are developing an online system for these companies to be admitted Seamlessly and hope that will happen by the end of August, September. Okay. That's what our thinking is. But again, it has to be enabled by way of a regulation or surplus from the NCA, New Share Company IFRS. Hope that will also happen between this time frame that I am talking about. With these words, I will now give it to Barchett for discussing about the financials. Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. Very warm welcome to CDSU Con call. First, I'm giving you June 2018 versus June 2017 that is year on year basis consolidated results. The consolidated total income is placed that is 0.24%. That is from INR 50.45 crores in June 2018 is compared to INR50.33 crores in June 2017. The operational income increased by 12% from INR40.55 crores rose to INR45.29 crores, which was offset by reduction in other income where the mark to market in June 2017 was INR520, that is INR 5 crores 20 lakhs, which reduced to INR 1.94 crores on the current quarter. However, the reduction in 8 is 14% that is from INR 25.47 crores to held 2 legs, which was mainly on account of increase in depreciation due to purchase of new premises and reduction on deferred tax effect. The expenditure was higher by 18% on year on year basis that is INR 18.64 crores for June 2017, increasing to $22.07 for June 2018. Further excluding other income, the pace improved by 6% over June 2017, whereas sorry, PBT is improved by 6% over June 2017. Now consolidated results on quarter on quarter basis that is June 2018 to March 2018. Although the consolidated total income is down by 18%, that is INR 50.45 crores in June 2018 as compared to INR 61.65 rose in March 2018 mainly on account of overall weak market condition and reduction in other income. The other mark to market gain in March 2018 was INR 6.4 crores, which reduced to INR 1.94 crores on the current quarter. Although the reduction in Page 15% that is from INR 26.09 crores to INR 22.02, which was controlled by expenditure. The expenditure was lower by 11% on Q on Q basis that is INR 24.9 crores for March 2018, down to INR 22.07 crores for June 2018. Whereas on standalone business, on June 2018 hosting June 2017, standalone total income up by 2% that is INR 40.4 crores in June 2018 as compared to INR 39.52 crores in June 2017. The operational income increased by 12% from INR 32.48 crores to INR 39.52 crores, which was offset by a reduction in other income, where the mark to market share in June 2017 was INR 3.58 crores, which was reduced to INR 1.02 lakhs on the INR 1.02 crores on the current quarter. Also, the dividend income is lower by INR 73, although the reduction in paid is 15% that is from INR 22.73 crores to INR 21.9 crores, which was mainly on account of increasing depreciation due to purchase of new premises and reduction on deferred tax credit. The expenditure was higher by 18% year on year that is INR 16.79 gross for June 2017 increasing to INR 21.9 crores for June 2018. Further, excluding other income, hosted the PBTF improved by 14% over June 2017. Whereas standalone on the basis of quarter on quarter that is June 2018 to March 2018. The standalone total income is down by 17% that is INR 40.4 crores in June 2018 as compared to INR 48.85 crores in March 18, mainly on account of overall weak market conditions and reduction in other income where the mark to market gain in March 2018 was INR 3.76 crores, which was reduced to INR 1.03 crores on the current quarter. Hello, the reduction in sales is also fairly important. That is from INR 19.5 crores to INR 16.3 crores, it was controlled by controlling the expenditure. The expenditure was lower by 12% on Q on Q basis, that is INR 20.96 crores for March, it came down to INR 18.51 crores for June 'eighteen. Now I Open the forum for the question and answer session. Thank you very much sir. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question and answer We have our first question from the line of Batool Mehta from Mozilla L'Oswal Asset Management Company. Please go ahead. Hi, sir. Good evening and thanks for the opportunity. So could you talk about the incremental revenue streams that you would expect given some of these changes like listed companies coming about and 1 or 2 other things that you spoke about. So can you broadly talk about what the numbers could be like with these new revenue streams? Well, we were given to understand that there were about 65,000 unlisted Private Limited, Public Limited Companies, which are expected to come into the stream. Now, A, how many will be mandated to come in? We do not know at this 51,000 public limited companies. 65,000 unlisted public clinical companies. Right. Okay. Now it's an approximate figure. It could be 1,000 more, 1,000 less. And now it was expected I don't know how many will be mandated to come into the stream, into the dematerialization. Assuming that all of them will come, okay? Then if it is not mandatory to admit with both of us, then they choose between CDSL and MSDN, Okay. So again, it depends on who will go where and engineering that is 50%, 50%. That's one variable. The second variable is the tariff. Now tariff is going to be decided by MC. Obviously, this is something on a major scale they wanted to do it. And nobody should complain. That's what they're desiring. So they will keep it at a very obviously, Sealy tariff will not be applicable, that is for sure, okay, during the course of discussions that they have suggested, hosted rather, I would say. But what tariff they will defend, I'm not too sure about it at this point in time. So I will not be able to say What will be the revenue that will make through out of this business? Right. Right. Sure. Spend. Any other revenue streams that you would expect? You spoke about insurance. You spoke about a couple of other things. As I said, The corresponding thing to the unlisted companies is the RPA business that CGM is expected. Again, it depends on those numbers only, okay? And there won't be any much transfers in this area because they are all on this side. And how many people will choose CDFL RPA versus Many other big ones, okay. We do not know again at this point in time. I will not be able to give you unless that particular Activity started. Right. And coming back to the we are also trying to diversify The EVO team system, it will various other types of activities, okay? For all these years, we have been doing only with the companies and shareholder meetings, etcetera, etcetera. Now We have also now started to see information utility insolvency professionals, okay? So they are another set up for customers who are using it, okay? Now we are also moving into the academic institutions where the elections can be held, okay? So we have already done Tata Institute of Social Sciences, okay? The student union elections we have done then. So we are trying to see how we can put to you multiple users. So that's helpful. Again, as I say, Acceptability is important, thanks to the brand name that CVSL has. So acceptability comes automatically. Right. Yes. Maybe for the quarter, sir, could you give the mix of individual line wise growth? So if you were to look at you will say transaction business or corporate actions. So could you give the split of the 50 On a year on year basis, I think. On a year on year basis growth and also the absolute numbers. Yes. Year on year basis on consolidated account, Annual ratio charges increased by 17% that is June 2017 versus June 2018, 9th. June 2017, INR 13.44 crores is my annual issue charges. It has increased to INR 15.67 crores. Right. Yes. Transaction charges from INR 9 crores to INR 9.66 crores. That is 7% increase. And giving major items only here. Yes, yes. Yes. Then consolidated account statement charges from INR 1.66 crores to INR 2.04 crores. Rose to INR5.55 crores. That is increased by 9%. 5.9 crores, right? Yes. Then online data charge is from INR 6.15 crores to INR 6.84 crores. That is 11% increase. So these are the Mainly. Yes, majorly. And during this period, the total Demat account increase has been how much, sir, on a Y on Y basis, say over 1Q to 1Q? Yes, got it. Last year, we have opened approximately 24 lakh accounts And the 34 lakh plus accounts, I wonder if you said that. In this quarter, in June, what is the 5,111 yes, March 18, 26, 511,368 accounts were opened. All right. Overall, 1 crore, 53,000,000 like 51,426 accounts are there compared to 20%, 25% increase on a y on y basis. [SPEAKER UNIDENTIFIED COMPANY REPRESENTATIVE:] And overall incremental market share, if you see, that is number of account opens. For this quarter, 71%. Right. For the last 12 months would be also similar, quite similar. Yes, you bet. All right. Sure, sir. That's it from my end and wish you all the best. Thank you. Thank you, sir. We have next question from the line of Pratesh Chirra from Lucky Investment Managers. Please go ahead. Sir, I wanted to know the status on price increases, which come to you on a regulated basis on some of the revenue line items. So what is the status there for FY 2019? There are no price increases as such. It is as same as of last year. There is no price increase. Okay. And what part of your revenue, which you gave out, issuer charges, transaction charges, would be linked to the market activity? Definitely, see, if your charges, number of followers are going to incur because last year was a good year when More number of IPO and corporate expense were there. There my income has increased 17% compared to last year. And transaction charges also similar, it's linked to market activity? Yes. Definitely, it's linked to market activities. Lastly, I wanted to know the status on new licenses for getting new deposits? That is 3rd deposit, yes? Yes, yes. There is on and off are news flows which come across where talks are there to invite a new depository or issue licenses. So what is the status there? No, it's like this. What you read maybe in the newspaper was based on the Gandhi company recommendations. Now that board has board means CB Board has considered the Gandhi company recommendations, they are doing away with the concept of a sponsor. In the olden days, the sponsor meaning must be a Columbia Financial Institution, stock exchange, etcetera, etcetera. Not everybody and anybody qualifies to promote a depository. Now that, what should I say, entry barrier in the form of sponsor requirement has been done by ADC. Now which is yet to come into a regulation, which regulations have to be amended and it will be made maybe in the next 2, 3 months' time. Now once that is made, anybody can set up set up eligible investors. They have replaced it with eligible investors. Now we will allow to have a maximum of 15%, so nothing more than 15%. The regulations are going to be much the same way as for an stock exchange, like other market infrastructure institutions you call them. So even if the 3rd deposit becomes, I have always been saying, Even if the 3rd deposit comes, we're not for them plug and play. The reason is they need to have the deposit and Network. Without deposit participants network, they cannot operate. Now today itself, if some of the deposit participants Q2 itself is a crowd. So if the third one will come, what will be called? I don't know. So it is even if the 3rd deposit comes, What is that the competitive advantage that they have? Is the pricing is more between the deposit fees for which region they will come? My answer is no. Today, my average transaction charges are INR 5, okay? So there's no much room for them any new entity to Even if I just said new entity comes, the deposit fee participants are needed. Then each one has to again invest in a 3rd deposit fee also because there is a cost associated with the back office software development, etcetera. So why would anybody when the product is by and large identical, so why would anyone choose a third deposit is the question. But still, if somebody comes, they can they are welcome. We are not worried in that sense. Okay. And usually in your Opening remarks, you mentioned about CAMS uploading the KYC data which led to slower growth. So that you're referring to the online data services revenue stream of yours? That's right. Online letter, essentially KYC. They service the mutual fund investors, isn't it? From they will accept the investors' request For buying the mutual fund units, etcetera. So when a new investor comes, probably they may be uploading it directly into the KYC No. Cams KRA. This revenue stream is reported in CDSL Ventures, which is a subsidiary of those, right? That's right. So could you just elaborate a little bit more what exactly has happened in this revenue stream and the industry dynamics actually with camps? No, no. Still we are the market leader. We have 1.75 crore, what you call it, KYCs, okay? And the KYC usage also has increased. It's not that we have fallen short. But what I'm saying is We are always there to capture the growth that is happening in various segments. One segment that has grown substantially well is the mutual fund industry. So but that is more, what should I say, skewed in the sense that only 2 of the major Yes, sir, managing that. And the substantial part is the cash. So to that extent, hosted some KYCs have been channeled into the CAMS KRA. Yes. And to the extent only the mutual fund KRS, not the otherwise. Okay. So your observation is that bulk of the growth was in MF KRA. And in mutual fund KRA, CAMS has a slightly better dominance, and hence the growth was with CAMS, and we had a slightly lower growth. That's how it would look. That's the way I read it. That's the way I read it. But still, we are number 1. They are still far behind, okay? Not that they have all taken our input. What is our market share and the size of this market? Well, what I learned is about we have INR 1.75 crores and Maybe the NDML has got 1.74 so simply 70 lakhs and CAMS has got maybe 50, 60, something like that. Lakhs, 50, 60 lakhs of 50. Okay. And what total revenue potential in this revenue recorded in last here for the whole market, sir? Yes. For us, I think it was about INR 29 crores last year. So what it would be for NDML, Cam? We will not be able to tell anything about it. No problem, sir. Thank you very much. Thank you. We have our next question from the line of Prakash Giri from Anaveed Portfolio Management Services. Please go ahead. Yes. Thanks for taking my question. I wanted to get some sense from you. Last year, we added around 25.1 lakh Demand accounts, typically, what is the time lag for revenue of these accounts? Is it immediate? Is it with a lag? And they start with Transactions or IPO, what drives these accounts in terms of IPO is the driver for these accounts to get opened. Okay. That's why we most of the time we depend on IPOs. And if IPOs come and more and more, then we will hosted? Yes, good number of incremental. Incremental. At the same time, we will also have a good issuer income also. Polio base will increase. In fact, this year, this quarter rather, yes, polio base is more Then what it was in the corresponding year on last year rather. So you can say the negative 17% versus 18% is the full year. Yes. In FY twenty seventeen-twenty eighteen, we have won around INR 30 crores from folio basis. It has increased to INR 37 crores for 2018 2019. So against 58% of total Istio charities From folio basis, it has increased to 63% from folio base income. Okay. Understood. Just to mention, the mark to market impact was INR 1.94 crores this quarter, right? Correct. What was it last June? I missed that number. On a consolidated basis, it is from 5.20 Lex to 1.194 Lex. Okay. 5.90 Lex. Okay. Basically, it's 3.4 percent for lower other income due to the same QM. Yes, same QM. And assuming interest rates remain this, do you think second half onwards other income should normalize because then the base of Income percentage growth will be more as compared to the first one. Okay. Going forward, it should be better. Understood. And I also missed the figure of online data charges, if you could give me. I heard 6% Against June 17, 6 crores 15 lags against it 6.85 crores. 6.85, okay. And lastly, on the unlimited set of companies, would there be Clarity in terms of onetime charges or recurring charges. So will it be just as the MCSS, there'll be recurring revenue or there'll be a onetime charge to hosted. B. Balaji:] We will have both the segments. One is the application processing fee, so it's a one time charge. And then on an ongoing basis, year on year, they have to pay. Okay. So there will be some one time charge? Some one time charge and some recurring host. And any thoughts on the regulatory or the MCS side to get, say, maybe the Private public company first and then the private set of companies on the unlisted space by the year end or anything which we have shared? So By when do we get clarity on this? In 2 months' time, you should get that clarity. That's what might So in case regulatory mandate is we see revenue stream maybe in the 3rd quarter itself. That's Yes. 3rd quarter, yes, it should be. You're right. That's the way it is. You're right. Thank you, all the best. I'll come back with you. Thank you, sir. We have next question from the line of Amit Chandra from HDFC Securities. Please go ahead. Yes, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. So my question is related to the annual issuer charges opportunity. So currently, we have around 10,000 issuers. Out of that, 4,000 issuers are the unlisted ones. So what is the tariff plan for the unlisted company that we have now. So is it also regulated by SEBI or like if you see the slab basis, so the INR 9,000 per issuer is the lowest slab. So are we charging these unrestricted company is it lower than that? And how it is now? And what do you expect the charges to be for the upcoming opportunity? We are charging the same semi tariff we are acquiring it. We don't deviate from that, Okay. So that's the way it is that currently we are doing it. And then going forward, what will be the tariff and other thing? I think I will not be able to comment on this sales. Okay. So like you're saying, the tariffs for the listed and the understood, now the companies are the same. So it is Yes, we are applying the same tariff, okay? Okay. And so much. That's it. Okay. Because if you see for NHDL, the number of unlisted companies The market in NHTL is around 10,000. So There also the tariff structure is currently severe or there is some kind of delay wherein you can charge based on your own discretion? Yes. There is a leeway to charge based on our own discretion Because unlisted rate companies are not regulated by this. So but then for us to give a justification, We are simply saying this is a secretary you have to pay. So those who sure is interested will come and don't come. It's okay because there are no transaction charges. Please understand that there are no transactions in these unlisted companies. Whereas, as we understand from the market sources and then from the what we call from the Paris Court that NSDL has put up on their sites also. They charge only one time and then there were no annual issue fees. But in the current year or in the last year compared, they started charging annual issued charges also, Okay. And only just now they started it. For all these years, there's no such annual reserve charges. Okay. So it's just like that. Okay, sir. And sir, on the transaction charges, So how many number of transactions we had? So if you can give a comparable figure Y o Y. So the number of debits this quarter, the only comparable figure for the last quarter same year? I think generally the confidential information, but it is as compared to the immediately succeeding preceding quarter, it is much lower, no doubt about it, Okay. And but as compared to the Corresponding quarter, it is slightly higher. Okay. And sir, on the Mutual from KFC Business. You said that a lot of business is shifting to TAMs, KRI and ETR. Not shifting. I think there's This is a long motion problem I am communicating. That's shifting. The new KYC is going there because the industry is host? They are integrated in that sense, the camps and then their services. RTA services are integrated, Okay. So that is the reason and there is a growth in the industry. The industry has actually gone more there, okay? That doesn't mean we are lagging behind. I'm sure hosted. So as far as my understanding the strength of CVL KYC was the in person verification and the original document verification. So that deal purchase, so CAMS also provide these kind of services? Or it's like largely online related, I don't know, EQIC and online submission of documents in Online, we are also providing we are providing Visa and we are providing online account opening, etcetera. So a lot of people are also using this An other based account opening, essentially. We are forwarding it. By the way, CDFL has been recognized as a global AUA by the ADA, okay? And there's a notification issued by the government, okay, other as we should it. So There are many issues around other number storing and number you say, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. So Not that everybody can do this kind of thing. Now that gives you extra strength to the CBL To open more and more KV field costs, to do the more and more KV field costs. Okay. Or we can say that now the pricing is also affected there because cans is charging less Yes, you are in the industry, so you are very much they may be doing it, all that, but then it's fine. That's fine. You see, I have to be safe to my constituents also. Depository participants are doing also good amount of business. Sir, because the first one, I would say the market, cap to market intermediaries are doing good amount of business. I can't discriminate. And I don't think anybody is doing it there. And the Capital Market Intermediates are not doing this Do you think that this Talonav platform like with this Talonav platform coming in, the role of RTA is coming down, so host? That also could be a reason. Well, I would not be able to comment on somebody else's and its impact on their business. It's not fair. And yes, multiple channels are available for investors to Apply for mutual fund investments. And so much the more, the better it is. That's the way I conclude this. So how do you see it, sir, like the on-site charges going forward? So you expect a further drag in the revenues From here on or like do you expect to stabilize? I can only see growth but not even stability or not even a drag, I would say that. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. Thank you, sir. We have next question from the line of Pitain Jain from Invesco Asset Management Company. Please go ahead. Sir, what percentage of our KYC business comes from the mutual fund deck And which are the other major segments? We will not be able to give you that breakup. It's not in the public domain. Okay. But which could be the other areas, maybe not the percentage? As you said, the Capital Market Intermediaries, The stock brokers, all stock brokers are not by DPs, but every stock broker has to upload the KYC on one KRA or the other. Okay. So we have about $200,000,000 to $59,000,000 or even more. I don't have exact figure immediately. The market intermediaries are uploading data in the KRA. Okay, okay. And my second question is on sequential basis, our employee cost is down by 16%. So what explains this drop? For the March quarter, what we are providing all the provisions on the basis of actual liability as well as performance linked bonus and all besides in the month of March. So that's why there is a sequential gap. Are there salary hikes also given in Q4? No salary hike. Yes. Performance linked bonus, they are decided in the month of April, Which we will when the accounts are being getting finalized in the Board meeting of the April, they When they're considering the annual accounts, they will decide all these benefits. Sure. And which quarter would see the wage hike impact? No. There is no wage hike. During every 2 to 3 years, we are doing wage hike as such. In October 2016, we did it. Thank you, sir. We have next question from the line of Deepan Shankar from TrustLine Portfolio Management Services. Please go ahead. Thanks a lot for the opportunity. So just want to understand what are these motivations for these unlisted companies to For joining this TMAC, without even regulation, so currently we see a lot of unlisted companies have come in. So what are the motivations for them? Well, many of the promoters may decide to do it voluntarily, that's one. 2nd, when they go and then raise the capital from the banks or some when they go to flatter their stocks for loans and other, so the bank insist that you please go to these depositories and then be materialized. That's the second reason. Thirdly, some of these the Investors and others, they insist that we must go for dematerialization, then only we'll invest it. So and this is kind of the reasons for doing all this. Okay. So currently, are we focusing on this segment to add as a new client even before regulation? Yes. We have been aggressively pursuing the But as somebody was pointing out in the meeting, until recently, there is an attraction of the tariff on the other side. So a lot of companies were going there because they were charging just one time fee and there's no annual issue charges that we were doing it. And we have been insisting on annual issued charges. Annuity is important for me also. And now that by and large, the tariffs are on the same footing. There's no competitive advantage in the sense. So for them in terms of tariff. So now they are aggressively doing this. Okay, okay. So any status update on this monetization of academic Depositories and Insurance Repositories. No, insurance repository is a non starter. In fact, the Major insurance major share is by the LIC, who is having about 70 plus percentage of the market share of $75,000,000 And they have not joined in this initiative as yet, okay? Okay, got it. So that's why it is not taking off. And when it comes to the National Economic Depository, as I said already, till 2019 September, We are not allowed to charge because that's what the MSR directive is. And more than the payments from the universities and economic institutions. We expect a lot of economic institutions start uploading the data, Then the verification takes place. That is where we expect the revenue streams to come. So the economic institutions are slow in uploading the data And that's where we are doing a lot of education both for all to all stakeholders. And government is also actually pursuing it. They are calling for a lot of seminars, meetings, etcetera. And that's how they are trying to profit out And these are all revenue might start before September 2019 itself. Come again? These revenue streams are you were talking about verification. As I said that maybe till 2020, we have to wait for these things to take off In a reasonable sense. Okay, okay, okay. Sure, sir. Thank you and all the best. Thank you, sir. Thank you, sir. We have next question from the line of Gautam Gupta from NRC. Please go ahead. Thank you for my question for taking my question, sorry. I No, no, no. Do we have any idea by when will the tariff structure for NAD be decided? Maybe. Tariff structure for NAD will be decided only Sometime July 2019, something like that. Okay. And to Sir, a small question regarding we said we have about 1.55 crore accounts on the Demat side. How much would be BLD out of this? So DSD accounts, it's about 50% of the accounts, 55 lakhs, 55 lakh accounts Approximately DSD accounts. But they generally they don't affect us. In fact, DSD account means that you don't charge the AMC. Yes. We don't charge the A and C. That's what it means. And we don't lose anything because we are not charging anything. Sure, sure. That is too good, Deepa. I understand that. Yes, yes, yes. So last question, slightly speculative, if you'll permit me. But we hear a lot of portion of the e governance, land record digitization. So anything that we see coming up in the next 2, 3 years for us in terms of new revenue streams? We have been constantly pursuing at various levels for new businesses. And it takes time to fortify. And another important thing is there are a lot of stakeholders. And when we say stakeholders, I would also include vested interest also in that stakeholders, okay? So sometimes they don't allow the things to digitize. And non transparency helps some of the projects. So that's why there is something holding back. NAND upload, NAND records are not getting uploaded in academic institutions because there are some courses which do not want this to be completely digitized. If everything is this way, we will go to the universities and then ask them for this certificate, right? Things like that. So It will take time. It is a transformation that we are is a challenge for us, and we are in that business of transformation. And we will do it. Okay. Thank you so much, sir. That's it from my side. Thank you, sir. Your next question is from the line of Nilesh Joshi from Prospero Finvest. Please go ahead. Hello. Thanks for providing an opportunity. Sir, my question is related to CBL. When RTE activities will be commercially started and how big is this activity? I can say that it will be commercially started. In fact, we have soft launch, and we are not actually not done anything at this point in time, but we are expecting these unlisted companies to be admitted into Demat. Now this will happen parallelly along with that. Now how big is the opportunity? Probably, I will not be able to I got a guess here. It's not fair. And but I would only say that it's a good opportunity that we can take off. It will add some revenue, reasonable decent amount to our line of business. Okay, sir. And then so second question, How many companies have been appointed CDSL as designated regulatory for monitoring the FTI Limited? Okay. I can only because it's not in the it is in the on our website. You can see that how many companies Which we are doing it. There are about 1700 plus companies are the ones which are doing it, okay? And Almost all about the 3,500 companies are so far up or less than that 3,200 companies only has given this kind of mandate. So almost half of it is with us in that sense. Okay. Half of which is with the CDSL. That's good, sir. So can I ask you, sir? How much KRA is registered in the Q1? And what is the growth rate? March 2018 quarter, INR 1.70 lakh KYC was there. It has increased to INR 1,74,000,722. So it's INR 2.4 lakh 40,000 Yes. More than 40,000. And in KRW business, the CDL is number 1 in the market. Am I right, sir? Absolutely right. Okay, sir. Thank you, sir. Thank you, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question. I now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments. Over to you, sir. Yes. Thanks to all of you for a fairly valuable time and showing your interest in the company. And I hope we'll continue to show this interest in the company and we'll continue to improve our performance and we'll try to do better each quarter, God willing. Thank you. Thanks to all of you. Thank you very much, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, on behalf of AXIS Capital Limited, that concludes this conference call. Thank you for joining with us, and you may now disconnect your lines.