Q1 20/21

Jul 22, 2020

Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the IASL Financial Limited Q1 FY 2021 earnings conference call. As a reminder, all participants will be in the listen only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star and 0 on a touch tone form. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to the management. Thank you, and over to you, sir. Good afternoon, everyone. On behalf of T Mobile Finance, I thank all of you for joining us on this call. I am Rajesh Raja, CFO, a complete consumer machine, our chairman, Mr. Alvin, Managing Director, and Ms. Puga, our Chief Risk Officer. I'll hand over to our chairman to comment on the group's strategy and plans for whom to change. Thank you, Rajit, and welcome to all on the call, on this call. So as all of us know, COVID times continue. And the COVID had affected life is still not back to full normalcy and really unfortunate for the humility as a home that, so such a huge loss of lives and health has been caused. And we pray for the practice recovery and conquering of the disease. How about having said that? So we also have so many opportunities for the business. And for arts and Finance, we see opportunities in a couple of ways. 1 is significant saving and operating cost. And the tool is, completely digitizing and accelerating the digital journey for the customer as well as our backend processes. And the two factors that we will significant cost saving or can drive potentially going forward. One is the discovery that working from home is a very easy convenience and can be very efficient as well. And that allows many other organizational and workflow changes. Including delayering of the organization with the largest kind of control and also centralization of many processes which are hitherto decentralized. And obviously, you'll have a lot more state economies, as you centralize the offices. And the second is Now there's an acceleration of digital and everything and acceptance of the same. So the paperless fragences were in a mode is working very well now and is getting traction. Technology is always there, but I think adoption has increased significantly. And that is what probably can drive or can change the way business is done. And this coupled with cloud and mobile technology, is going to change the operating matrices as we go forward. So in Apple Finance, we have moved all our software applications and all servers to the cloud. And, in fact, all, almost all our key people can operate on mobile devices or tablet which provides significant mobility and flexibility without compromising on security. Now as, you know, this will require re imagination and redefinition of most of the professors. And what we are doing to start with a business loan is a complete end to end digital process. So we work more like a fintech company, and this can be followed by we already have a home loan product, but all our home loan products or all all our lending offices can be fully digitized, which will allow us to centralize many functions as I said, and save operating costs. In terms of salary, what I have we articulated last time, just to update and look at 2 aspects, which is growth and, asset quality. So in terms of growth, there were always concerns about, you know, at least in last 18 to 21 months about liquidity. I'm happy to say that liquidity is easing now. And, as far as we are concerned, we got about 1800 rupees of cash and bank balance as a June end, another 1900 2000 cro rupee on online, which is sufficient to meet all our debt obligations, contractual obligations is still, at least, say, February 20th. And we also don't want to carry, more than this kind of liquidity, because that is a significant cost. You know, you borrow at 9% and if you have to put your money in liquid or bank at 3%. Obviously, the cost is, pretty significant. So given that the liquidity is there, but the business environment is improving. And we have seen that the disbursement improved significantly in gold zone as the branch is opened in the months of June. And in fact, out of our 17, 15, 18 of the branches, only 18, 20 branches are closed. Because of their containment job, but most of almost all of the branches are open. And we are seeing that the football and business is increasing month after month. What we have, you know, in in terms of the way we look at asset growth going forward, is, we want to originate assets which are all eligible for, being taken over by banks. So in a way, we complement the banking, a bank by originating loans that they would like to have on their balance sheet, but they don't, you know, they're not able to do on their own. At the term that we do. And, so all our loan origination credit processes, we have, revamped them. Try to make it eligible for banks. We are talking to quite a few banks alliances and partnerships for co lending as well as co lending and co origination. Obviously, in a COVID affected, times, things are not moving as quickly as we would have liked them too. But as soon as I think, the number will be a very we are we are hopeful that the pre appliances will kick off and that basically will be, the model that we wanted to work on. And coming to asset quality, assets in the moratorium have come down from 60% to 31% from May to June. And within this quarter, we'll see further improvement there. I mean, the moratorium assets will further fall, which is good because when you exit from moratorium, these are the assets where when we have a question mark, whether those borrowers will be able to pay or not. We are working specifically on that. And, in fact, things are getting to normal, maybe a little better than what we expected. And in terms of asset quality, also, we have a portfolio of CRE, which is not core where we have not been originating new roles and we are to paper out what we are to reduce this portfolio. We have been in talks with a few funds or investors. Where you can bundle the entire portfolio and, be the sponsor or contribute to sponsor capital and have external investors. Even these talks are not progressing at a very at a quick pace because of, physical limitations of people to visit and do the division. But I think in next few weeks, we should see good traction there. So with this, I'll hand over to Rajesh again take you through the financial details and then we'll open up for cash and Thank you, Mr. Jane. I'll give you all a brief, update on our business. IFL Finance net profit was INR228.2 crores in the first quarter by 21, up 5% quarter on quarter and 26% year on year, excluding exceptional items, or 194 crores of COVID provision at 70 crores of MPM loss on ForEx borrowings and forward hedge. A loan AUM grew by 10% year on year and 1% quarter on quarter to 38,335 crores. A core segment grew faster at 12% year on year to 33 1001.94 crores. A retail loans including consumer loans and small business finance constituted 88% of our loan book. A tier 1 capital adequacy stands at 15.3% and total capital adequacy at 19.3%. The strong characteristic of our loan book is a large proportion of loans that are compliant with RBI PSL loans, about 63% of our home loans, 48% of business loans, and 91% of our micro finance loans or PSL compliance in aggregate nearly 43% of our loans or PSL compliance. The large share of retail and PSL compliant loans are of significant value in the current environment where we can set down these loans to raise long term resources. Our average cost of borrowing remained flat year on year and declined by 10 basis point quarter on quarter and a standard 9.3%. Consolidated GMPA and NNPS stood at 1.95 and 0.86 of loans, respectively, This is as compared to 2.31.97 in the previous quarter. That is in the March quarter. Provisions coverage including standard asset provision under India's norms state reassess was 183% for the quarter. Even after, excluding additional provisions made, COVID, this stands at 101% of total state free assets. Return on assets for the year was 2.7% and return on equity was 19.5%. Excluding impact of one off items. A brief update on our liquidity situation. During the quarter, we raised rupees 1005 crores to term loans and refinance from banks. In addition, loans of INR 877 crores were securitized or assigned during the quarter. Cash and cash equivalents, and committed credit lines from the bank institutions. So it would be 3745 crores. Were available as of 30th June 2020, we continue to have real exposure to commercial paper. Our funding mix is well diversified including 25 from MCDs, including subordinated debt and MTN, 25% from bank loans, working capital finance, 7% from NFP refinance, and 33% from securitization and assignment. We have a positive ALM whereby inflows cover or exceed expected outflows across all buckets. A brief update on COVID impact. As at the end of the quarter, 31% of our consolidated book was under moratorium. This was down about 60% as at the end of May. That is a previous update to you. Additional provision of INR194 crores was made during the quarter for possible impact of the COVID-nineteen digitization and analytics. We continue to focus on digitization and analytics to improve customer experience and enable a convenient bump shop shop for customers' credit and investment needs. Addition to the 1 click digital personal loans launched last quarter, you launched a 1 click online top up module for gold loans this quarter and are seeing good traction in the same. I have a loan's app has been increasingly used for various transaction by customers and has been especially beneficial thing to lockdown, giving customers Eve and convenience of access. We have got we we have about 150,000 average active users on the app for the month of June. That brings an end to the update. We will now open the floor for any questions. Yeah. Any questions? Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question, please start in one on your touch tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star in 2. Participants are requested to use handsets for asking your questions. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment. I'll look back in queue assembly. Yeah. That cushions. Okay. Stop. I I said, can you stop the cushions? Yes, sir. The first question is from the line of Anita Rankin from HSBC Asset Management. Please go ahead. Yeah. Thank you. I just wanted to know if you can, first, is that give some more color on, like, liquidity In that sense, like, what is your discussions with the banks or, like, some market participants in terms of, like, you know, getting, like, more financing and so on? And secondly, in terms of the, like, you know, prospectively asset quality, how do you see it post monitoring? Like, you know, we are at the end of July and but after the end of August, moratorium will be withdrawn. So how do you see the situation standing out after that for each of your business segments? Yes. Yes. In terms of liquidity, we are, all the banks have been more constructive. What was it after June? And, all my medical vendors for liquidity are opened up under government's passive credit guarantee scheme, banks are subscribed to bond. So we had about 200 crores of bodies to last week. Then under liquidity, which is for a stop duration, you know, that window has just been opened up there, I think proposal will be taken up this week or next week. For term loan also, we have started to discuss an negotiation with the banks. For the loan assignment, I think we did one transition for about 800 course. We got another, few in principle approval. So, I think liquidity is I mean, as all of us know, that system, the liquidity in the system is quite easy at this point in time. Just the program, DSP is now opening up. Maybe just select and selecting. Only banks are opening up. I don't think that they would probably open up for all the industries, but they still They started discussing. They started taking our proposals and, discussing the applications and looking very constructively positive. So I have a, you know, my assessment would be the liquidity from has eased and will continue to ease from here on. We also look at interest costs going down As of now, the diabetes in AAA and AA and other papers has widened, to historic highs. So the divergence has to narrow So one has to look at reducing interest costs as well. Secondly, asset quality, as far as we are concerned, we don't have any concern on gold loan and home loan. And if you look at, you know, in the month of June, our collection efficiency for home loan and the microfinance both has gone up more to beyond 75%. And for Golar is nearly 100%. So, the only segment that one is really cautious about his business loan, but they're there also. You know, there is a government scheme where you can have a top up low or 20% to ease, the liquidity pain. And we really have to, you know, wait and watch how long the monitoring lasts. Will there be another agreement or what? And when we exit from moratorium, how things are? But as I said in my opening remarks that we've been able to bring down the loan assets and the moratorium from 60 to 30, And I would think that the next 2 to 3 months before we fully exit from moratorium, there may be further brought down to anywhere between 15 to 20. And that is the asset where, you know, there's a risk of exiting from moratorium and looking at quality. I I don't think there's a significant impact. It should be manageable. Okay. Okay. And we have taken a lot additional COVID provision in this quarter and last quarter. So, you know, that should be that should more than suffice. Okay. Okay. And just one more question, if I may. Why has the AUM, like, increased in this quarter? Like, I was in, like, some additional disbursements in some, perfection? Or Yeah. There's a department. So in Golden and Home Limon, both, we have, reservations are picking up their gathering momentum. And the Golar a Golar AUM has grown by 4% quarter over quarter. Home Loan AUM has grown by 1% quarter over quarter. Business loan has been flat where, you know, the new disbursements are some equal to say what has been, run down So, and, even within the quarter, if you look at our business during the month of June, there were almost twice that of the month of May, and April was almost checked. So there was there was any disbursement in April, but I think, this business is already, you know, we are seeing that they are, picking up. Okay. Okay. Alright. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Laksh Sharma from Lombard Odier. Please go ahead. Hi, thanks. Thanks for the opportunity and thanks for the presentation. A few questions on the, if you can help me understand on the first quarter, what has been the cash movement in terms of the expense which we have done during the entire first quarter? And on the debt repayment side, scheduled and unscheduled debt repayment, which have been, done, and any monitoring which was available during this first quarter. On your borrowing. Thanks. Any more details? I'm with monitoring on your borrowing, from bank to Texas. So were there any, and that was available this quarter? Alright. So in terms of moratorium, we had requested all the banks. So those who did not give you a payment on time, Almost all the public sector banks have more accepted the moratorium on principle. Interest is something that we are paying on time. And the other private sector banks have not accepted world to him. That also, you know, whenever the installments for you, we pay them as in when, you know, in time. So if you look at slide 17 in our presentation, that basically, I just, you know, there is a that payment scheduled based on monoclonal given or not given. So now at least picture is clear, that the certain banks that are given, some lenders are not given, based on that, if you look at the that obligation scenario, then and with the cash and bank balance that we have and on online, We are covered till February. And the slide 18 is the ALM 2, which there's an RBA is a submission that we do for RBA. We do for settledown companies. There's a consolidated picture, which basically takes a static situation that we are not gonna disbursed further, but and we are gonna connect only the standard part of it. And only the fixed deposit which are incumbents free, we can take a liquid. So based on that, also, we have a positive surplus, you know, 5 years, and that's what we attract. So that is about the moratorium and the, liquidity part of it. In terms of trade disbursements, you know, when I go to the as you have the branches open, so people have, you know, the many loans have been repaid and they can say if you You look at only disbursements in last quarter that they are to the tune of almost around 2500 crores. But if you see the loan book, it is flat. Because many of these are, like, you know, the, the revision actually, because it doesn't mean it happens a lot because typically, go loan in for 3 months. So people keep paying the loan back and, you know, and there are new borrowers who take the loan. So businesses except for Mumbai and Delhi, most other parts of the country, we are seeing that in the month of June July, you know, things are pretty much getting back to normal. I won't call them pre COVID level, but at least 60, 70% of that level, is happening. Like, in the whole group, we had discussed with 185 crores in the month of June. And, you know, in a normal month, we'll look at 300 crores. Understood. And would you be able to share what collections have you been, have you received, let's say, in the June month? And how's the Our collection efficiency, our collection efficiency means what we want to collect and what we end up collecting on a on a aggregate basis in microfinance, which is a good news because that is something where you are worried, in the month of June, collection efficiency are 75%. In homework also, it's more than 75%, 76%. In gold, as I said, it's close to 100%. It is more than 100%, but then that covers the earlier months also. So collection efficiency in these three core segments has improved, and is like, you know, is, in business loan is about 52%. So, you know, this is how the collection efficiency has been. I'm giving you the number, not from the quarter, but for the month. Sure. Understood. Understood. So this is better. Okay. So is this efficiency based on the amount which is you to be collected from the customer as of that particular time? Or Exactly. So has been adjusted for the moratorium. No. There's a good case. So the amount which is due in that month, but it does not include the amount collected for previous month. But I tested for monitoring that. So whatever we build, so supposing that your amount is due in the so if if I include the overview, then it may be more than 100%. But I look at it, whatever is due to be paid in the month of June. Out of that, how much I cover? How much I recover? So normally what happens, this is what the non recovery gets into 0 to 30, and that gets collected over a few, you know, next couple of months. Okay. This is actually this amount. What I'm telling you is is not considering auditorium. So it's the it's not from the total billing. Okay. It's from the total billing and the So okay. So for the 2, the month of June, our aggregate collection efficiency was 65%. Which is in Hong Kong, we are 76. And, microphone are 75. CRE, which is considering development was lower at 30%. Go to the other 89%, but as I said, that included the previous ones also. Okay. Okay. I mean, just to be clear, I mean, so that I can mix it up. So basically, what you need is selected for business stone, 60% efficiency would mean that, if the The business on 50 3 percent efficiency would mean all the business loans, how much we are collecting? Understand. So that's basically more compare more in comparison to the lesser pre COVID level. Correct? No. Yeah. Yep. We so business loan, we collected 53%. But because our workload in connection is low, pre COVID level, if you look at the month of January, then I collection of business in business loan growth around 86%. Understood. But in all other segment, it's moving pretty close to pre COVID level. But, like, in the home loan, typical efficiency would be 95% plus. But right now, we are 75 because 30, 22% of customers would be under moratorium. But not more to hear, it would be pretty close to pre COVID level. Okay. Okay. Just one last question for me. So on the on the monitoring you mentioned, so if I compare your slide, you know, the liquidity table that you have on slide 70, versus the previous quarter slide which you had shared with us. It seems like that there has not been much of a moratorium away from banks. In total. Would you be able to share the the exact amount? How much has been, available? Actually, a good amount has been raised in moratorium because in the previous last quarter slide, there was a blue and orange orange portion, which is, so if you look at in the month of July, the total due was 9 20 in the previous slide, with or in the month of July, but what to settle the eligibility with the month of August, If you see the 1.56, the 4.54 was if we, you know, assuming that all banks, the motor that instead of 434, we're having 466 now. So most of the PHU banks, what we had expected, they have given more to him. There are very few guys that have not given materials. But what you are seeing currently is the picture is not clear because if the monitoring is given, then the, you know, the scheduling done based on the material. If not, then we are taken as due on, you know, whatever day it falls due. Got it. Got it. Okay. Thank you. Thanks. That's it from me. Next question is from the line of Amit Manji from Keypointe. Please go ahead. Yeah. Hi. Can you explain what what is the reason for the NIM expansion that we are seeing on a quarter on quarter basis? Is that because of the rising share of gold loan? Yeah. Because, see, the incremental notes are on the portal. So if you see see in the last quarter, the growth has been the incremental loans are only. And the other component, like, have reduced a little bit. So the is that the reason you see that, you know, the NIM has expanded. Okay. And then in gold points, are the yields likely to go up further as your lending rate, I guess, is now around 1.83% which will be around 24% annualized. So would you continue to go up and go loan segment? No. No. I don't think our lending is 24%. I don't know where we got the data from. At the branches, basically, when we check, basically, the price is at 1.8. No. No. No. I think what happens in Google is, the customer basically based on their credit and tracker card, they get a lower rate also. So suppose you are a good loan customer and you've been always paying in rate can go down to 14% also. On a weighted average basis, we have 19.4%. So it remains in this range only. Okay. Understood. And, in in what's the outlook on the cost of funds has the new corporate capital that you've been raising over the last quarter And you're also in July coming at a lower rate than your current or faster borrowing? So we have seen 10 basis points for last quarter, but we expect to further go down. So so, you know, what happened when the liquidity crisis has been there? People I mean, many NBCs like, you know, and we also were not really haggling or negotiating too much with the banks on interest rate. But as we go forward, I think we should be able to negotiate and bring it further down. Okay. And what is the aggregate loan loss provisions that you're now carrying on the balance sheet, including the COVID provision? Is 182% including COVID and without COVID is 101%. So even if we exclude COVID, we are covering our all our JMPs with provident other than COVID, but including the standard asset provision, which is as for RBA norms. In rupee terms, that will be around 1300 crore plus of provisions that we will have. Right? No. It appears that we have about 700 730 or 7.50 in the dream. Okay. What do you think is right, actually? Because 454 is our COVID provision. So put together ID number right below 200 total rupees. Okay. Okay. Thank you. That that's it. Thank you. Next question is from the line of Silicomargui from Unitiated. Please go ahead. Yeah, thank you for the opportunity. Sir, you were, giving the collection efficiency segment wise. I just didn't get the number for a business loans and MFA loans. Business loan is 53% in the month of June. MFI loan is 75% in the month of June. But, you know, MFI was 0% in April, 3% in May, But two numbers are these are mf5or75business1r2p3. Okay. But in the business loans, almost 50% is under moratorium. Right? Yeah. So may the collection efficiency, sir, will be thirty seven percent. Is included in the month of June? Oh, no. In the sense, if, already 52% of the loans are under, moratorium, how can you have 55% collection efficiency? Are some of the customers that are monitoring and paying up? No. So customers in the moratorium, we can select the earlier use. So what happens is that, if there is 30, 60 BPD earlier, so those dues are being collected. And, you know, some of these people are also eligible for top up loans and government guarantee scheme. So the idea of use can be collected there. Okay. So, Sabrina, you are a customer of moratorium. You are free to work within this month. But, Sabrina, you can pay that now. That is what we try to collect. Okay. And how much of the AUM has got to the government rated the support SME segment support? Very as of now, we are not that much. It's it's not significant amount at all. I mean, we have a in terms of eligibility, we can disburse up to 500 to 700 crores. But that process has just started. Okay. And would you go the full distance? You'll, reach standard modes or the number of units? Okay. The thing is that even the borrower has to agree. We can't force it. And, so this this is a contractual decision. Both are agreeing. We should also be, so probably not maybe only a part of that be utilized. We'll not be able to discuss and guarantee. Okay. Some of the borrowers are asking for it. Some of the borrowers will be comfortable in giving them. Yeah. I was just wondering why would the borrower object to that because he's in the moratorium and he definitely needs some cash flow to start the business again. And there's a government money which is coming in. Everything is favorable from a borrower point of view. Why would there be any borrower object to this? So what is happening is that, some of the borrowers have been paying. They're not taking multi room also. And, some of the borrowers have they do not increase the debt burden for 2 reasons. One is either they have a good liquidity or 2, they're not very confident of their business environment. So, you know, what will happen, and this is about another counterintuitive phenomena, but someone in customer says that my business is started not doing. Why do I take more money at this point in time? So let me reopen. Let me see how things are done only. I'll take a part of that. Because borrower knows at the end of the day, you know, he has to repay that money sooner or later along with interest. So where the business has not started fully there also they don't need money. Got it. Got it. Sir, and among the segments, this business loan itself, looks to be a very, sticky one in the sense that decline is monitoring the lease is the least in this particular segment. Are you approaching collections differently in this segment? What are the initiatives you have taken your end because this seems to be the key to recover, to improve the recoveries going forward. Any particular initiative that you're taking your end to address this? No. I think it's a very good question and very fine. So we have intensified collection effort, and we have in touch with all the borrowers. And, at least, you know, we think that, it's just a question of time. Most of them basically as soon as things get normal. And maybe in this part, we'll see a good number of those customers coming out of moratorium or opting out of moratorium. So we have you know, at this point in time, in business school, we are not developing new loan much. So our states and collections, both the teams are, engaging with the customer tracking them very carefully. And trying to see that how quickly we can get them out of work earlier. All right. Sir, and in the business world, can you give out some sense as to how much is agriculture, related, the AUM, how much is daily related? Which can give us more comfort as to, the recoverability of those market related loans. Aggregates and limited, we don't have much of this thing. In the business. But in business loan, there's all there's no legal exposure there. Okay. Someone interested in aggregated, say, trader wholesale trader who, does agriculture and, who did the agricultural? Okay. Maybe more important. The or 77, 70% plus of those those will be secured by a property, their laptops. So and the product will, there is, you know, it's basically ourselves. And if you look at our the loan to, value the collateral is at least twice. So 49% is the LTV. So there, I think we'll have to afford because in case of a default, you can purchase can get the, property and, record the money. And typically, we are seen historically. And then you have a loan, but the particular property, which is with good margin of safety than your property of loss in radio. In in unsafe, you have been fairly and not, you know, more than a year. We have tightened our credit underwriting policy. So, typically, we are very careful in terms of what is the debt validation, what is the credit score. So I, you know, if you ask me, as I said, that more than 2 types of book is, you know, with the cultural property, And also, I I don't expect, you know, any significant business. Right. And so would you continue to take a COVID specific provisions in the coming quarters also? You already built a provision of around 4.70 crores. Right? So would you continue to do that over the next, few quarters? No. We don't have to. This is for RBA guidelines. So what RBI said is that, for your monoclonal assets, you will take 10% provision, 5% in March, 5% in June. So I think it's done now. So I don't need calls to be required unless RBA comes back and they send the modem to him in the asking. But, otherwise, it will not be needed. And from your own internal assessment, sir, the 31%, what do you think will be the final NPA that one would expect in Q2? I think the COVID provision that we are carrying based on RBI guidelines plus the ECL assessment is is far higher than what we'll actually need. So I don't think our losses will be, you know, anywhere close to this. Right. So your last question is on the management transition. So I think we are carrying a fairly conservative in terms of provisions. So we have a high probability. Thanks. So on the management transition, with the exit of Mr. Bali, are you looking to hire someone in the CEO role or would you continue with the interim? No, I think We are not looking at hiring time. Continue, sir. As of now, I'm there in the job, sir. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Abiram Ayir from Deutsche, Deutsche CIB Center. Please go ahead. You would expect the current participant to please unmute yourself as needed from the handset. As there is no response from the current participant, I have muted the line. The next questions from the line of. Also, we would request the participants to please limit the questions to this participant. We are you can go ahead, please. Uh-uh, congratulations, first of all, for recording a reasonable set of numbers in this tough time. I only I had two questions. 1, I think, the positive just highlighted about the trade cost. The cost should not be beyond the provisions that you already carry. Is that, in the semi correct? Yeah. Okay. And the second question is on the hotel book. I think you just mentioned that a large proportion of this for your thanks for putting in a point for my in which, you will only invest part of the capital. I think initially about 2 quarters ago, there's a timeline given. By end of December, you expect this book to be moved out. Has that timeline changed? And if you can get for some light on that timeline, that will be You're saying December 2020. Oh, no. What is the time that you're talking about? Yeah. At the same time that this was given about December 2020. It was an issue. I think you know, we, you know, whatever has to be done will happen before December 2020. And, So, you know, there are a couple of things. 1, the process has been a little slower still for this. I mean, we have a very good time till December 2020, but we are still engaging with funds and talking to them. But the second point which is important is that as far as our loan book is concerned, the CRE in particular, What is happening is that the stress and real status, is not something where you can paint the entire sector with Bangladesh because our exposure mostly an affordable segment. And, actually, you know, contrary to normal or popular belief that I had the because people are getting conservative. So we are seeing good traction in some of the projects in the affordable segment. So, like, you know, some project in even during this lockdown period, there is a good number of bookings as well as inquiries. So we are not in a desperate situation to agree to any terms and get this book out. But at the same time, given the fact that statistically, we are not doing any new roles, in this sector, and we want to emerge as a 100% digital oriented, the MPSC, we are, you know, we are working on this. The timelines remain the same. It depends now because the way So there are 2 things. 1 is, getting terms which are fair, fair to both sides. And secondly, you know, as soon as things resume normalcy, then people should be able to do diligence because most of these investors would like to physically see the projects or at least maybe, you know, some sample of it and, you know, negotiate themselves. Hopefully, that should get done before December 28th. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Reika from DSPH Fund. Please go ahead. Hi. This is Vivek here. I just had a couple of questions one around the home loan portfolio. Did you say home loan? Is it all a retail loan? Or do they include lab also? And because of the cost I mean, and other lenders are able to reduce costs depending on the ratings and so on. Are you seeing any churn of your portfolio, to other lenders, which has where the customer gets, acquired by others, in this case, or banks? We'll be on a lab. We report separately. So if you're a home loan, then it's your home loan. Everything has had 18.6 Lakh, and there's about 1 third of our portfolio. And the lab is included in business loan. As I said, there are almost 2 types of business loan will be lapsed. I don't have a precise number, but we can share that also. And, so they are completely different. The rate ticket size in lap also is not very significant because, maybe business room is combined there. So I'm gonna lap a separate. Now to the second part of your question, in COVID, we have not seen significant requests for balance transfer to banks, but normally, we are competitive, you know, because our money yield, I mean, as of now, our portfolio is around 10%, but that comprises of mix including, you know, the segment where we are lending a slightly higher rate. And normally, we are fairly competitive. We have banks and housing finance. And so this sound a little bit of a surprise to many analysts. But what happens in home loan, we get refinance and we get refinance depending on the the type of group even at 7% or less than that also. So we can compete based on the segment. So there are rumors where we give loan with 9% or sub 9% also. And their segments will be charge 11% also. But some balance answers happen, but there's nothing more extraordinary traction there. Okay. Great. One related question is that know, the moratorium in the home loan segment, is it, is it like more self employed or employed or is there any characteristic that emerges out of that segment? Yeah. So you're right. It's more satellite people. Relatively, I take a moratorium, more as compared to salaried people. And, although the self employed percentage in total, AUM has gone down to 42. But and some salaried people also have taken moratorium. But, relatively, it may be slightly higher than self employed. Okay, sir. So one other question which I had the last question is that are you going to be refocusing a little on your SME business going forward? In terms of, you know, the good, the, is the most secure goal, higher yielding goal loan, and, and, you know, microfinance loans and defocusing on the SME loan part. That's my last question. No. I'm happy that you asked this. So I don't we are not defocused, but in the near term, pill environment becomes very clear about the business. See, today, what has happened is that everybody is uncertain about moving those what businesses will face, what kind of cash flow problems, then things become fully normal. So we are committed to this segment from a longer term perspective. But there are 2 things in the short term. The investments will be slow because we are cautious. And as of now, we are seeing much greater opportunity to expand gold loan. Followed by home loans in the affordable segment. But as things become normal, we want to do this business completely digitally. And that is what we are building. Our system are back end, our processes. But, you know, given that we have golden branches, And in the nearby area, we have great opportunity to do this business where, you know, on a smaller ticket, 5 to 10 lakh rupees, you can get 18, 19% yield. And your incremental operating costs may not be significant because you use your network. So it's a great business from a longer term perspective. Next 3 to 6 months, you may not do much. Until we are very clear in the economy and environment. Okay, sir. Thanks a lot and good luck, sir. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Abhir from Deutsche CIB Center Private Limited. Please go ahead. Yeah. Hi. Can you hear me now? Yes. Hello? Yep. Yep. Thank you for the presentation. So first question that I had was on the number of employees. If you did a is reduced by around 700 employees over the last quarter. So is this drop more permanent? Are we or is this more of a reaction to the lockdown? And, how was how many how much of it would be in collections, or in in the collections department? Yeah. So you know, several people are comprising of all kind of people, but, correction department people, I don't think we are reduced much. So, you know, what happens in our normal attrition itself is, in 3% to 4% in the quarter, but what we have done is that we are not hiring more. And, the actually, I don't think we have, you know, we have reviewed the number of people in collection department. So that remains more or less intact. But as we digitize, and there are some redundancies that happen in various departments. But this is normal. So, even if you see our cost, operating costs, including manpower, has gone down to 45 courses this quarter. And we are targeting 200 korogular power savings in this year without impacting our capacity to land. But this has been achieved without reducing manpower significantly. So the senior level people are taking a salary cut, and that's how you see 17 crore reduction in the salary, the total manpower cost. And 3 4% is our normal attrition in the quarter. Only thing is that we have not replaced them. Got it. Got it. Thanks. The other question that I wanted to ask was with respect to the CRE loans. The average loan amount has actually increased by a lot of, like, from 28 crores, in March to, like, 37 crores right now. Is that a rational for the same? I mean, is this because interest have started being capitalized or, could you let me know why? Sorry. Come again? So, the portfolio average price certificate size for CRE loans has increased from 28 close to close to, like, 37 crores right now in 1 quarter. So could you let me know the rationale for that? Hello? So I think some of the roles have not consolidated it. And I don't have a precise breakup data, but I can check that. So Hello. I I don't have a breakup, but I can check this. I think some of the local have consolidated. It's okay. It's a it's a result of consolidation. Okay. Thank you. I'll get back in line. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Prashil Shah from capital. Please go ahead. Yeah. So the moratorium, book has more or less halved. So could you share if how many of how many of the borrowers would have paid the entire, all the installments for the past, 3 months? In terms of so those who are not paid 3 installments, they come as our JMPA. Okay. So if you are not able to qualify, then I'll go from the auditorium book So people who have who have exited the monitoring book, how many of those guys would have paid all their installments? How many would have paid partially? So okay. People opting out of moratorium that's there, but there's not very significant number. I don't have the data, but I can check that out. I don't have the details just for in time, but I know that people opting out more him and paying all the installment. There are few, but not too many. Okay. Alright. And and on slide, you know, this slide basically 1718. So you said slide 18 was consolidated and slide 17 was transformed. What's the difference between the 2 when it comes to the Right. 17 is also consolidated. And slide 18 is also consolidated. Slide 18 is done in the format of, the ALM to what we submit to RBI. But when we submit to RVI, we submit for 3 entities separately. So slide 18 is based on ALM format, ALM 2 what goes to IVI is based on that. So they give us some guidelines on how to prepare the asset liability mismatch or matching. So there, what they say is that you take a static balance sheet as if you are not going to disburse anymore, and you're going to recover only the standard loans and not anything else. Or other recoveries that's beyond 5 years. That's how are you to prepare that. And you're able to take only fixed deposit which are encabbrance free, which are free and cashable. And then Basically, you take care of all your operating costs and operating current liabilities also. So there is now slide 18 is done. Slide 17 is nothing, but what we've done, forget about everything else, what is our obligation, month after month after month, what are we to pay, to the banks or any other lender? And based on that, what is the cash we have in hand at this point in time? So in slide 17, we don't take any of other current liabilities like rent electricity or salaries. And at the same time, we don't take any cash flow which we will receive from even standard assets. Okay. And then coming back to the monitoring part, so you said that home loan, 76% collection efficiency was there in the month of June. Right? Yes. So, sure, right. So if the collection collection is the collection efficiency, just that seventy 6% is come, does that include people in moratorium or does that not include people in moratorium? No, that's all the people, including monitored and non moratorium. So the what is not received in mostly non auditorium people. Okay. Okay. Alright. Thank you. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Lakshmi Ayir from Masterman Networks. Please go ahead. I have two questions. My first question is about slide 6. When I compare with your previous presentation, I see that your English bills have reduced by about 500 crores. What are you saying? That is your first question. Secondly, on the slide 17, again, when I compare it with the previous with, slide 17, if you balance, I see that your liabilities have gone down by almost 1000 loans. Like, for example, I can understand in August you'll you'll get a moratorium from the bank. So your liabilities are down by 7800 close. But that should not be the case for, like, December November because the not going to be any more at all. And so the rough thing, what you have to say, whether it was, whether you look at it in March, whether you look at it now, should be the same Lisa Nikka. So can you repeat your first question on the slide 6? What was it about the balance sheet? Your investments were about 700 crores in March. And now they're about 200 all closed. So what has gone down by about 500 close? So, we had government securities which we sold off in this, quarter. So with my quarter, the 700 course and almost final group is a GSEK about the holding on our balance sheet. Oh, okay. Okay. Okay. Now coming to slide 17, you know, when these banks are giving loan and the PCGS, they're asking us to prepay their loan for next 6 months. So, you know, what they say is that, okay, we'll give you money for 3 years. But what I will do in next 6 months, you pay us in advance. So that is one thing that happens, in this environment. And secondly, whenever mean, there's a monitoring that is also factored into this. Okay. The monitoring, I can understand over since I've been out there. So what we do is, sometimes our bombs, you know, I'm say I know. I understand that. What you're saying is that while for the general So our, sometimes, you know, we also buy back our bonds, from the open market, and we are staying with them. I don't have the breakup of all the numbers, but this could be possible reasons. Okay. Okay. Fair enough. What was due? You pay us back immediately. Okay. Oh, okay. Okay. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Pulkit Anand from Privadel Capital. Please go ahead. Yes. Hi. Good afternoon, everyone. So my question is about the the loan loss. Sorry. It's not the loan of services. The write offs about the 88 and 88 crores, you have returned the statement. Can you give a color on that? Yeah. Yeah. Indore. So 100 and see what happens when we do the accounting as per Indares, the interest stripping is netted off from the provision. So out of 107 crores or whatever provision that we have, 18 crore is the interest shipping part with gets knocked off when you see those reports with the results which are, as per index format, submitted to exchange. In the presentation, we include the Indian crore in the shipping and other income. This is interest slip on the secured assigned assets. Okay. Okay. Thank you. That was my question. But only difference between other income and provision, in the regions that you see, as you know, sent out exchanges in the format and the presentation that you have. Yeah. Thank you. As there are no further questions, would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments. Thank you so much. I really appreciate your time. And, you know, stay safe. And if you have any, information department, now, you can be in touch with, a new Burgess who's been relations manager. Thank you so much. Thank you. On behalf of ISN Financial Limited that concludes today's conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect the lines.