Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the IRFC Q2 FY25 earnings conference call hosted by DAM Capital Advisors Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please contact our operator by pressing star, then zero on your touch-tone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Sanket Chheda from DAM Capital Advisors Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Yeah, thanks, Sruthi. Hello, and very good morning to all of you. We are here to discuss the IRFC Q2 results. As the entire management team, the key personnel will be Mr. Manoj Kumar Dubey, who is a Chairman and MD. He would be doing this call for the first time after joining IRFC, and quite a dynamic personality. He comes from a very rich experience across many industries. The second is Shelley Verma, who is a Director of Finance, and Mr. Sunil Kumar Goel, who is a GM Finance and CFO. So without further ado, I'll hand the call over to the MD, sir, Mr. Manoj Kumar Dubey. We'll follow that up by questions and answers after his opening remarks. So over to you, sir.
So thank you, Sanket, for all good words. Good morning, friends. Welcome to the conference call for Q2 results of FY25 for IRFC. I'm Manoj Kumar Dubey. I'm Chairman and Managing Director of this company. And with me, my Director of Finance, Ms. Shelly Verma, and my CFO, Mr. Sunil Goyal, and also my head of department. Before we discuss the H1 and Q2 results of the current FY, let me have the opportunity to introduce myself in brief. I took over as CMD IRFC on the 10th of October last month. I bring in more than 30 years of experience of working in railway infra, logistics, and railway finance ecosystem. I'm an IRAS officer of the 1994 batch from civil services, and I worked with UTI also before joining railway.
In the last decade, from 2013 to 2018, I headed the railway board's infra finance wing of PPP and extra budgetary resource mobilization. So in a way, you can say that for me, now I've changed the sides of the table. For the earlier days, I was looking at IRFC for getting the money for railway, and now from here, I'll be doing the job from the other side. Meanwhile, from 2018 to 2024, I was also on the board of Container Corporation of India Limited, that is popularly called Concor, a leading Northern Railway logistics company as DF and CFO. Ministry of Railways and GOI, as being promoters of IRFC, have brought me here as CMD for a tenure of five years. Coming to a brief about the latest journey of IRFC, as you know, this company is working from 1986, mopping up funds for Indian Railways particularly.
But the journey from 2015 onwards took a new turn. In 2015, for the first time, apart from funding the rolling stock requirement, that is engines, wagons, and coaches for Indian Railways, Indian Railways also started taking funds from IRFC for their project financing. I was, in fact, in those days in the railway board itself. That journey culminated in a very steep rise in the assets of this company. In fact, from 2018 to 2023, an average of INR 60,000 crore plus disbursement took place. And in fact, there are two highlights. One, in the FY 2021, the disbursement by IRFC to Indian Railways was more than INR 1 lakh crore. And until that year, that was the highest for any NBFC to disburse in one year. Second, in the FY 2023, the total AUM size of IRFC grew more than 5 trillion INR, in our terms, 5 lakh crore INR.
In that particular year, it was highest in the IRFC PFC system. With this steep rise in the business, one more milestone took place in the company. In 2021, listing of this company was done, and nearly 13% shares were divested. You all know that since then, the market cap of this company has grown steep, posing a lot of confidence in the kind of business that we do. The company also has a rare distinction of maintaining GO and POL throughout, and has grown stronger in the balance sheet in the last five, six years. With very high and steep growth in its assets under management for five consecutive FYs, there was no disbursement in last FY and current FY till now.
In fact, our debt-equity ratio, because of the steep rise in the last FY, has grown very high, nearly nine plus, which is now cooling down to nearly seven and a half. This period of six quarters, in fact, when we did not disburse, but our projects which were financed with five-year moratorium time were still giving us a good revenue stream, and that is keeping our top and bottom lines steady and healthy. With the full regular functional board in place now, I've taken over for the next five years, and we have now my full team with me, the company is making concrete plans and roadmaps for renewed lending structure, not limiting itself to railways directly, but also to the backward and forward linkages in railways and logistics ecosystem, which covers almost everything in infrastructure.
If we talk about port also, if you talk about anything which is doing something with the logistics, we'll come out in our purview of a memorandum of articles. Meanwhile, going further, the company will keep augmenting its core competence and be ready to leverage our balance sheet strength to make very attractive funding available to all sectors as per our mandate and MOU. You may be aware that IRFC's weighted average cost of capital has always been lowest amongst the peers, and we intend to further bring it down, leveraging our strong balance sheet, having more share of 54EC, and our zero NPA and zero tax status.
Coming to our Q2 results and numbers, as you have already seen, it has been as steady as it could be, and I assure you that coming couple of quarters will be giving a lot of pace to growth and growth trajectory of the company. With infrastructure story of the country for the next 20 years, I would say, is completely intact, and the story of infrastructure in railways in particular is fully intact. I see a very bright future of IRFC. With this welcome remarks, I welcome you all to this Q&A session with us. Thank you so much.
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touch-tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. Participants, you may press star and one to ask a question. The first question is from the line of Sanket Cheda from DAM Capital Advisors Limited. Please go ahead. Mr. Sanket, your line is unmuted.
Yeah, hi sir. So my question was that in the last two years, we have seen developments in other PFC and MDFCs as well. So PFC, as you see, like earlier, used to do only power. Later, they have been mandated to do infra, which is non-power as well, as we see renewed CapEx after many years, and the signs of private CapEx picking up is already visible. So in the case of IRFC, so far, we have been only into railways, railway-related financing. Any thoughts on, say, moving to different sectors or getting those mandates, and any change of strategy there or any inclusion of other sectors as a part of strategy? So anything that you can highlight would be useful.
So yes, Sanket, this is the most pertinent question for us. So number one, as you rightly said, that the PFC and REC, from their core sector of power, they are now into everything as infra-finance companies. So likewise, we also have a mandate from RBI to lend to anybody. There's no restriction from that side. Having said that, till now, we have been funding only to the railways for two reasons. One, as you see, that our AUM and the mandate size is as big as RFC and PFC, with the appetite that railways have with us. So obviously, till now, we never looked forward to anything else rather than meeting the targets of the railways, which used to be very high.
In fact, I mentioned that in the last five FYs, before FY 2023, the average disbursement was INR 60,000 crore, which was more than, in fact, to PFC and RFC also. Yes, going forward now, first thing that we have already started looking towards the other entities who are having forward and backward linkages with the railways and the logistics sector. In fact, if you are tracking us, we are entering into an arrangement to fund the NTPC for purchase of their wagons, which they use in the railway system for their coal logistics. Similarly, there is everything, including even the hotel construction, which is linked with the railway tourism, which we can fund. Also, yes, we are making a strategy, and we are very much planned to go forward in the next quarter and the next FY ahead to look into these prospects.
And one more thing, as you know, that in railways, we do the bulk of lending with a margin of 35 basis points and 40 basis points. Once we go outside purview, we don't have that restriction. So obviously, we'll be doing the lending at a very attractive rate. In fact, better than and competitive than the peers. This is what our motto will be. But still, our margins will be high, and that will show a good growth in my path also going forward. And the next culmination, as you mentioned, yes, going forward, the quarter to quarter will unfold with you and share with you. Yes, our aim is also to be as good at funding anything and everything in the infrastructure of the country like PFC and REC.
In the coming years, I would say it's not visible in the next two quarters because the business lying in the ecosystem backward, forward, or railways itself is sufficient right now. But with the growing muscles and things going forward, yes, that is the destination for this company also.
I think, sir, as far as the pricing is concerned, we see that REC, PFC cost of funds are around 7, 7.2. And they landed around 9.5. So they make about 2.3, 2.5. We have been operating at a very thin spread. If we continue to do so for the others infra, is there a possibility to gain the market share from the others NBFCs dealing in infra segment or any thoughts there?
So Sanket, your question has got an answer. The moment we go in, I would say railways. In railways, yes, it is zero NPA business. It is a sorted business. And we have an arrangement of funding them at 40 basis points and 35 basis points per project. Once we go out, obviously, the lucrative market, as you rightly mentioned, the kind of basis points which I'm not saying you are saying me that it's 300 basis points or 250 basis points. So those lucrative aspects are there for us also to grasp. Yes, as our WACC has been, since our rated cost of capital has been lowest in the market, if we go out as and when, which we are going to be very soon, it's not that we are going to crash the market of lending, but yes, we will surely be the most attractive lenders in the ecosystem.
That is going without saying. And for security, we are going to move out to the railways, apart from the railways funding, to the other sectors from next quarter onwards. So that is on the cards.
Sir, the other question was that one is that what kind of a growth CAGR we should expect over the next two years, three years, five years that you would have under the plan? And particularly outside the railway-related financing, which has been a zero NPA business for us, whatever other things that we do, how do you see the share of that piece moving in, say, three years or five years? So will it be, say, 10% of the AUM in three years, 15%, 20%? How do you see that?
Sanket, I won't be putting any numbers on that. But as you see, what we are working straight away, one, that a steady pipeline should come from the railways. That we are already in discussions. And once the things unfold, as you know, railways declare this right in the beginning of the FY. And the beauty of the railway is that the whole disbursement takes place in the same FY. In comparison to other companies where sanctioned projects are not mandatorily disbursed in the same year, it may get disbursed in a couple of years, three years. In our case, once the railway declares in the budget that this much of funding will be taken from IRFC, it is disbursed in the same year. So that is one stream.
Second stream, we are not putting any numbers, but as you see, once we grow and go out in the market and start taking anything in the logistics field and the infra field, obviously, we are going to grow. And since my numbers outside railways is zero, my CAGR for those fields will be high. But whatever margins will come from that business, as you've already seen that my peers are doing at 250 basis points and 300 basis points also in some cases. We'll look at the quality of the assets, and obviously, our growth will be quite phenomenal if you want to let me know in the next two to three years. That is the plan in the hand. I will refrain from putting any numbers on that, but every quarter, when we meet you, the numbers will keep unfolding for you.
Sure, sir. Sure.
Thank you very much. The next question is from the line of Kamal Mulchandani from Investor Capital Services. Please go ahead.
Hello sir. Thank you for the opportunity. I just wanted to ask, what is the disbursement target which we are planning for the current year and the next year? Apologies if I might have missed the answer to this question earlier.
Right now, we are not giving any targets. As I mentioned to you, for the last six quarters, I mean, the last full FY and this FY for the first two quarters, there has been no new disbursement. Of course, because of the moratorium that we have given on the project side, we are adding them every year in tune of around 25,000 crore. That will keep coming. Apart from that, after taking over last month, we are working very actively with MOR and MOF also, Ministry of Finance also, A, to start our steady business from the railway side. And B, we have already funded to NTPC, and we intend to start looking at the prospects in other sectors also. I will not be giving numbers, but going forward, I can assure you that our disbursement as well as the project sanction will tick up steadily.
So just wanted to understand that we are funding other infrastructure sectors apart from railways. So is there some guideline from the ministry or something that they won't be needing any funding from IRFC going forward?
No, no. Let me be very clear. Let me be very clear. As I mentioned to you, the funding to the MOR, which is our mainstay and which is the main mandate, that should keep continuing. What size of the funding will be there, that they announce every time in the budget. Okay, so the 1st February, when the budget will come out, we'll give a full clarity for the next FY. For this FY also, as if you understand the government budgeting system, there is something called revised estimate, and this revised estimate comes in the month of January, right, for this current FY. There may be a chance that if they feel like giving us something, that can come up. There's no guarantee of that, but if something comes, the same will be disbursed in Q4 only.
This is the beauty of the business that we get from the railways. It's not like sanctioning and the disbursement will take in three, four, five quarters. Whatever, if at all something comes from the GOI and MOR for us to be disbursed, that surely will be disbursed in this FY only. So it all depends how it unfolds. And I think the story will be unfolding in January and February so far as government business is concerned. I hope I have made it clear.
Okay. Thank you so much. Sir, just wanted to ask, what is the contract size of the deal which we have done with NTPC?
That is INR 700 crores. This is just the beginning because this is the first time they have gone a leasing model with us. As you know, we don't do the funding in that loan kind of thing. It is the same model that we do for the Railways. It will be a leasing model for 15 years. And the first tranche of 30 basis points they have entered with us. And this is a very lucrative business we are looking forward to coming from NTPC and all petroleum companies who are main customers of Indian Railways. So they are now thinking of owning the rolling stock on their own rather than depending upon the Railways. So this will be a very lucrative business going forward if you get a good pie of it because we are the only company who are in the leasing business of the rails.
And the margins will obviously be better than what we are getting from the railways. So that's one of the brighter sides that we are looking forward to, and we'll try to monetize it and grab it as quickly as possible.
Okay. So will there be any change in the tax rate because of this, or it will continue to be zero?
So let me hear from my Director of Finance on this.
See, currently, we have opted for, as you know, opted for Section 115BAA. Because of this depreciation on the leased assets, we are not paying any tax. Since this NTPC business is also on the leasing model, so we'll continue to get depreciation. Because of the accumulated depreciation for our funding to MOR also, for the next couple of years, we don't see any tax payments.
Okay. But we'll account for some credit cost for this to some extent. That would be there.
Yes. Whatever is the borrowing, that would be cost. But because of the accumulated depreciation and further depreciation on the finance, whatever finance lease we do subsequently, we'll get depreciation on that also. So we don't see any tax payments coming for the next couple of years.
Minimum.
Yes.
Okay. No, just wanted to confirm on that point as well that since this is some financing to other than railways, we'll be booking provision for credit cost. That we'll account for, right?
Correct.
Provision towards NPA or something.
Can you please explain what kind of a provision you're talking about? For standard assets.
Again, loan losses. Again, loan loss. Yeah, correct.
We are currently doing 0.4% for whatever funding we have done for RVNL. Same provision we'll do for this exposure also.
Okay.
So that doesn't have much of impact, as you see, in the RVNL we have done. So it is forward, backwards. So it is coming back again and again.
Okay. Got it. Thank you so much.
Thank you very much. The next question is from the line of Naman Kumar. Please go ahead.
Hello. Am I audible?
Yes, yes. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hello, sir. Thank you for giving me this opportunity. The first question is with regard to project assets. I understand five-year is moratorium period. But after that, once the lease gets signed, what is the duration of primary lease period? Is it same as rolling stock, which is 15 years, or is it more than that?
Let me hear from my CFO.
We'll follow the same method as we are following in case of a rolling stock. The primary lease period would be 15 years, and in case of a project asset, secondary lease period will get reduced from 15 to 10.
Okay. Got it.
And 30 years remain the same. A five-year moratorium takes out of the second line of 15 years. So 15 years remain the same, and then the next 15 years reduced to 10 years.
Okay. Okay. Got it. Thank you. And my second question is with respect to no targets being given to IRFC. I know we have discussed a bit on this with prior questions as well. But if you can give some clarity, why is it? Because historically, I've gone through previous year's annual report, like 10, 15, 20 years. I have never seen that Ministry of Finance has not given any target to IRFC. So there must be something which is happening to which might be you guys may be privy to. So if you can let us know, that would be very helpful for the investors to understand what is going on.
Because I read one CAG report wherein they raised a question or they raised an issue of Ministry of Railways is paying substantial chunk of its collection to IRFC in the form of principal payment and interest payment on leases. So if you guys have any privy to what is the rationale for the last six quarters or for the last two years and Ministry of Railways has not given any funding to IRFC, that would be very helpful.
Naman, most of the things are in public domain only, so nothing which is being hidden from any of the shareholders of the company. Let's hear in a proper manner. As I mentioned in my opening remarks also, if you look at the disbursement from FY18 to FY23, that was steep and abnormally high disbursement that IRFC did to the railways. The average was INR 60,000 crore. If you listen to my opening remarks, FY21 was as high as INR 1 lakh crore plus in one year. There is something called debt-equity ratio that RBI also maintains for every company. In those days, my net worth was nearly INR 40,000 or 39,000 crore. This debt-equity ratio went more than nearly 10%, which is quite high in terms of RBI's guidelines also. There were two things.
One that all of a sudden in five years, if you look at if you are watching my balance sheet for 30 years, you look at my assets in the last 25 years and the asset in the last five years. That will give you the real picture. So the rise of the balance sheet and asset under management was so high in five years that it was a little difficult not to take a pause and put the things into the right perspective, let the debt-to-equity ratio also cool down, and have a new strategy. So this is the primary reason of that. Nowhere it is opined by Government of India that henceforth no disbursement will be done by IRFC. This is the prime reason that we foresee as a company on behalf of the Government of India. Now, there were some vacancies also in IRFC.
Now that I've been put in the place and now I've pulled board with me, we are already in constant discussion with MOR as well as MOF, and since nothing has come out in clarity, so I'm not putting in numbers, but as I mentioned in the last question, that some things would come out with clarity in the month of January for RE, that is this FY, and in the month of February for next FY. Because government is very clear if there is anything allocated to IRFC that comes in the part of budget only. So there is no ambiguity so far as that is concerned. So this is part A. Part B, after listing and with the size of balance sheet, which is nearly 5 lakh crores, it is incumbent upon this company now to diversify.
There is no requirement now just to be dependent upon the MOR funding only. So balance sheet strength and my net worth strength gives me a lot of legroom to start looking at the quality assets in all the infrastructure. As you know, national infrastructure pipeline forecasts huge capital investment coming in various sectors of the country for the next decade. We want to be part of that, and we need to enjoy that pie also in a manner that we also get good numbers on our bottom line for our shareholders. At the same time, we position ourselves as an NBFC who is lending to all the people who are in the growth story at a very competitive rate. We have an excellent reputation in ECB market. We are the ones in the country who get the ECB lending at the cheapest rate.
We are the only company who has come out with a 30-year tenor bond in the market. We are the first company who got their bond listed in GIFT City. So this strength we want to leverage not only for railways going forward for all the sectors. And if you heard other questions, beauty for me is that if I do a railway business, I'm getting 40 basis points. And if I do a business outside the railways, as somebody mentioned, Naman mentioned, or somebody mentioned that the ambit is at 300 basis points. So if I do those businesses, even in smaller numbers than what I'm doing for the railways, my path is going to be very, very sound and steep. So next two, three years, that roadmap and plan we are making, and everything will be unfolding, as I said, every quarter onwards.
Maybe January when we are meeting with Q3 results, maybe I'll be coming out with numbers also what MOR is giving us and what MOR is planning to give us. But right now, this is the projection I can share with you. I hope I have clarified.
Yeah, yeah. This was really, really helpful. If I can quickly one more question, it's more fundamental question regarding the interest cost. So suppose when we lease a rolling stock, just a conceptual question it is, suppose we lease a rolling stock of INR 100 crore, and that time, that particular year, my borrowing increment or borrowing rate for the year was 7%. So I'll lease it to MOR for 7.4%, right?
You're right. This is the WACC plus. But at the same time, we have to understand our business model. It's not only risk; our risk are also part of it. If there is any support, if that borrowing I have done, say, from a floating rate, then interest rate variation is part of it. If that borrowing I have done from ECB, then currency variation is part of it. So it's a cost-plus model. So cost plus some of the risks are also part of it. But you're right. If it's cost is 7, then 7.4. At 7.4, I'll be calculating my lease interest.
Okay, so Naman, as you understand, you understand the philosophy and for all shareholders. You understood the philosophy of my lower basis points margin with the railways. I'm 100% insulated with any kind of market fluctuation.
Yeah, yeah. I understand. My question is more from the standpoint that the lease 7.4% is fixed for 15 years. Now, that 100 crore borrowing which I did, I may have done that not for 15 period only. Some borrowings may be for 10 years, some borrowings may be for 5 years, and some borrowings may be for 15 years. So what happens after 5 years? 20 crore was borrowed for 7%. But after 5 years, I have to reborrow because that borrowing I have to pay. So 20 crore, I now borrow at 6%. So that 1% extra benefit which is arising, accruing, does that also get passed to Ministry of Finance, or does that belong to IRFC?
So if it is done from the fixed rate, supposing it's done, if I fund it from 10-year bond, then that benefit comes to us. But at the same time, you have to understand there is a capital recovery also. So I'm also getting some capital recovery. So that also goes into the repayment of the debts which I have borrowed for funding of that particular asset.
Okay, okay. Yeah. Okay. Got it. This is helpful. That's all from me. Thank you.
Thank you very much. The next question is from the line of Umang Shah from Kotak Mutual Fund. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi. Good morning, and thanks for taking my question. Sir, I just have a couple of them. One is, from what I understand from the discussion so far, it appears that should we understand that capital is a constraint to growth, and probably then in that case, why not probably raise more equity and bring our gearing ratios down and probably look at growth? Is that an option for us?
No, no, no, no, no. I think let's clarify to you that I said that since we were going so far, so we as a company thought that let it cool down rather than infusing more equity. I mean, that is not the constraint at all. In fact, to tell you the fact, our board has already approved ourselves INR 8 lakh crores of.
Total borrowing.
Let's hear from DF on this one again.
Now, my current debt-equity leveraging is 7.83, so there is absolutely no constraint of further growth, and plus, I'll be adding, and the capital this year, as you know, since my exposure is more than 99% exposure to MOR, my capital adequacy is more than 700%, so there is absolutely no constraint with respect to equity for the growth, and further, every year, I'm adding to my net worth, which will give me further headroom for the growth, so as far as the capital requirement, there is absolutely no need for any capital infusion for growth. We are very comfortable with this, actually.
Naman, what to add to you, it is more than the equity, if you understand. You see, for the railway assets, we don't have to do a lot of appraisal. So it's all safe coming from the government, almost sovereign. So we never had a very big appraisal team with us. That was not required at all. So my strength lies in bringing in the cheapest funds. So my resource operation team is very, very renowned, and they are very good at bringing the money. Now that we are trying to pour into the lucrative business outside railways, our focus now lies on building up our business development team and appraisal team. In fact, in the railways, I had the expertise of five years in appraisal itself, working on the client side of PPP and EBR. We did with General Electric and also for Madhepura and Marhowra factories.
So those expertise are brought in, and we are now already in the process of creating a very robust appraisal team, taking all the talent from the market in our team. And this appraisal team, once it is in place, it is already a work in progress in a very fast manner. We will be looking at the lucrative project outside railways. And this remains Adam's sake. The only thing that you mentioned that let there be a clarification by January and February about this FY and next FY, what size ticket size we are getting for the government. So as far as equity is concerned, there is no concern at all. And in fact, in a couple of years, we have added more muscle to our net worth. Now it is more than INR 50,000 crores. So there is no issue on that count. I hope I have clarified.
Yeah, sure. This is quite helpful, sir. In fact, my second question you have sort of partly answered, which was in terms of building capabilities as we try to kind of look at funding projects outside the railway infrastructure ecosystem. Sir, are there any specific areas of infrastructure which you have already identified? And the second part of the question was regarding the private sector exposure, right? I mean, so far, as you rightly said, we have been operating in an environment where the exposures have been almost sovereign, right? Zero risk. However, if we just go back in history and if we look at some of the other state-owned MDFCs and their experiences along with private sector infrastructure companies, clearly that has been a bit more patchy, right?
How should we look at it in terms of strategy, in terms of our ability to underwrite and our intent to underwrite private sector exposures?
Umang, on a lighter vein, this company has brought me here at CMD, and I always claim that with my government experience of 30 years and delivering at a fast pace within the ring fence of three Cs, that is CBI, CVC, and CAG, we have developed the expertise of doing the right kind of appraisal and not being rash in getting any kind of business. So that is the expertise that I have brought, and this is something I'll inculcate in my team down below. Having said that, there is no strict no-no to anything. Every business has to be evaluated in its proper manner. We will be looking at the, as I have been telling in all my question answers, that we will be looking for the quality of assets.
We are a zero NPA company, and we would like to maintain that kind of good thing that we have with us that we remain there. So obviously, going ahead, even in the sectors outside railways, we will be very, very handsome. I'm not saying strict. Strict is not a good word. We'll be very, very handsome and prudent in analyzing the kind of quality of asset that is being offered to us. We'll be very attractive in offering a rate to asset which is very good in ratings. For the fact that for me, I'm used to offer railways at 40 basis points. So just I'm giving you a flavor. I'm not giving you the numbers that this is the number I'm going to give. So please don't quote me as the kind of numbers I'm giving you.
But say, in comparison to 40 basis points, even 150 basis points, even 120 basis points, sounds very nice. So we are preparing ourselves for that, and our motto will remain that we will look for the very good quality of asset. And I assure you that IRFC will be having one of the best appraisal teams available with a mix of government people who have done appraisal as well as people from the industry who are very experienced in doing the appraisals. Right? From the CPSE, we are open to take people from the private also. Once this appraisal team which is already in progress of getting formed, we already have a team, and we want to strengthen this team. We'll be looking at all kinds of business available. You mentioned in terms of private thing, my mandate doesn't stop me from giving to anybody.
but having said that, we remain in the similar manner as I said, we don't want to play 20-20 match. We are a very responsible company, and we are very much answerable to our shareholders. We'll be playing a test match kind of very disciplined, knowledgeable, and good business kind of thing that we'll do. And those things and those numbers will unfold quarter after quarter in our business because we need to walk our talk. And this is the convolute started. Every quarter, you see that the growth is there, and there is also an assurance that we won't be landing in an asset which is going to be bad. This is the motto that we'll take forward in doing the business in the coming quarters and the years to come. Right.
Perfect. Thank you, sir. That answers my question. And just the last one, which is sort of related to the first question which I asked. Sir, we have now IRFC now listed for quite some time. And is there any timeline which the board has decided or discussed with SEBI as far as the minimum public shareholding is concerned? So is there any dilution which can happen around the corner to bring down the promoter shareholding to below 75%?
Umang, that's a very genuine question. But as the same deal company, I won't be answering this. This question goes to my promoters. So better throw this question to DIPAM Secretary. I'm sure they are doing something, but it is for them to answer this question. But as you know, SEBI guidelines are sacrosanct for everybody. We are not out of that purview. So whatever SEBI guidelines are there, that is applied on everybody. And our job as a manager of the company is to see to it that we are doing good business. We are doing a solid business, and we are doing a risk-free business. So this management is committed to that. So far as diluting the shares are concerned, the statutory limitations are there. And this particular question will be answered by DIPAM Secretary and not me.
Understood. Perfect. Thank you so much for patiently answering my question, sir. Thank you.
Thank you, Umang. Thank you.
Thank you very much. Before we take the next question, we would like to remind participants that you may press star and one to ask a question. The next question is from the line of Sanket Cheda from DAM Capital Advisors Limited. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi sir. So the answers have been elaborate. Just on one thing that you didn't allude to is specifying maybe your growth intentions or putting a number to it. But just sometimes, would that be useful? Maybe we will look at least growing by, say, 20%-25% AUM. Maybe 20%, 18%-20% would also be quite a meaningful number on our base, and of that, say how much could be the new infra piece or the other lending besides railways?
So, Sanket, we won't be putting any numbers. As I clarified to you, that's not the intent of the management. Management can give you the numbers and what kind of business is coming on the platform. That, I think, I have discussed in a very elaborate manner about the government business as well as the private business. I have done detailed talking on that. Numbers will be slowly not put. But as I mentioned to you that so far as the numbers coming from the government, those numbers cannot be kept secret. Those numbers will be coming in the month of January and, of course, in the month of February when we take the budget on 4th of February. So I think if you are so keen about numbers, let's have some patience. It's not far off. It's approachable. That's part A business.
Part B business, as you know, any kind of arrangement, MOU, all the business we are getting from the other side, immediately goes to both of the exchanges. And every shareholder is aware of that. Like NTPC, the moment we did it, the very same day we posted it on exchanges. So let's follow our trackers on the exchanges. Anything coming on those sectors outside the government parlance will be surely and on timely will be posted on the exchanges. Numbers I'll refrain from quoting as we do in the government parlance.
Perfect, sir. Yes.
Thank you very much. Participants, you may press star and one to ask a question. As there are no further questions, I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments. Thank you, and over to you.
Thank you, Sanket, and thank you, Dan, for making this good beginning with us for the new board. I'm sure going forward, we'll be bringing new insights and new facts and figures for our shareholders through you. And I thank you all. And let's wish that we meet on a very high note and a positive note for the next quarter. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
On behalf of DAM Capital Advisors Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.