Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to Jindal Stainless Limited Q1 FY 2024 Earnings Conference Call, hosted by PhillipCapital India Private Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Ms. Vikash Singh from PhillipCapital India Private Limited. Thank you, and over to you.
Good evening, everyone. Today, we have with us from the management side, Mr. Abhyuday Jindal, Managing Director; Mr. Anurag Mantri, Executive Director and Group CFO; and Ms. Shreya Sharma, Head Investor Relationship. Without taking any much time, I will hand over the call to Shreya to take the call forward, and also thank the Jindal Stainless management for giving us the opportunity to host the conference call. Over to you, Shreya.
Thank you, Vikash. Good afternoon, everyone, and a warm welcome on the call. We have shared our quarter one FY 2024 earnings presentation with the stock exchanges, and today's call discussions will be on the same lines. Please note, some of the information on this call may be forward-looking in nature and is covered by the disclaimer on slide two of the earnings presentation. Now, I would like to hand over to our Managing Director, Mr. Abhyuday Jindal, to start the call. Over to you.
Thank you, Shreya. Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to the Q1 FY24 earnings call for Jindal Stainless Limited. I would first like to discuss the key business highlights of the quarter ending June 2023, following which Anurag will take you through our operational and financial performance. Despite global challenges, we delivered a healthy sales volume growth in Q1 FY24, up 8% on a quarter-on-quarter basis. Backed by continued growth in the domestic markets and government push on infrastructure, our sales volume grew across diverse segments. Demand has also grown on the back of new age businesses like ethanol blending, renewable energy, process industries, demands such as thermal power plants, refineries, et cetera, as all these industries consume stainless steel. Pre-festive season demand also picked up in consumer segments, which further contributed to the volume increase.
On the export front, our focus remained on servicing markets like the U.S. and Europe. Nevertheless, to push volumes and overcome the slowdown in Europe, we continue to develop new markets and products for exports. The export sales during the quarter increased by 45% on a quarter-on-quarter basis. On the domestic front, the industry continued to struggle due to subsidized and substandard imports, which capture as much as one-third of the Indian stainless steel market. This adversely impacts the MSME sector in particular. The industry is still awaiting a positive decision by the government on imposing a countervailing duty to curb dumping of mass and subsidized stainless steel in India by China.
On a more positive front, I am happy to share that JSL has completed the acquisition of JUSL by acquiring the remaining 74% equity stake for a cash consideration of INR 958 crore. This now makes JUSL a 100% owned subsidiary of JSL. This acquisition consolidates all the critical facilities of stainless steel manufacturing under one umbrella and would result in improved synergies between both the companies, thereby enhancing value for all stakeholders. Further, with the aim to increase operational and delivery efficiencies, we entered into an agreement with Dassault Systèmes to strengthen our production, planning, scheduling, and execution processes. This is another step towards creatively demolishing legacy systems and adopting new age models of digitization and automation for faster decision making.
Jindal Stainless is determined to give its customers the best-in-class service, such improvements will go a long way in empowering our customer-centric approach. As an acknowledgment of our keen focus on providing tailored solutions to customers, I'm happy to share that JSL was recently honored with the Go Global Award by US-based Dana Incorporated. The award recognized Jindal Stainless among 1,800 nominations, spanning 29 countries, for successfully supplying stainless steel solutions to Dana for more than 15 years in several countries. Coming to the ESG front. We remain committed to a greener, sustainable future, fueled by environmental responsibility. With manufacturing through the electric arc furnace route, which enables 100% recyclability, we are already contributing to a circular economy.
We also aim to reduce our carbon emission intensity by 50% until FY 2035, from FY 2022 baseline levels, which were 1.91 tons of CO2 per ton of crude steel, and achieving net zero by 2050. At last, I would like to share, we are honored to partner with ISRO for prestigious Chandrayaan-3 program by supplying critical special alloys. It is a matter of pride for us that we have indigenized various specialty steels and are the prominent supplier to almost all Indian missile programs, satellite launch vehicles, submarine rocket launchers, and various combat equipment. With this, I would now like to hand over to Anurag to discuss the operational and financial performance of the company. Thank you.
Thank you, Abhyuday. Good afternoon, everyone, and very warm welcome to the on call today. As highlighted by Abhyuday , we have delivered a strong result on account of our diverse product mix, coupled with our agile supply chain that has enabled us to capitalize on the new markets and products throughout the quarter. With this strategy, we have registered a 54% volume growth on a year-on-year basis, despite the global headwinds. With this backdrop, let me now discuss the operational and financial performance during quarter one, FY 2024. The standalone revenue rose by 25% year-on-year, and 6% on quarter-on-quarter basis, to INR 10,027 crore. EBITDA and PAT increased by 35% and 47% to INR 1,118 crore and INR 666 crore respectively on a year-on-year basis.
On the subsidiary front, our global facilities moved in tune with the prevailing market condition across the world. Global stainless steel sales remained to be under pressure due to continuous subdued demand and reduction in prices. Performance for our domestic subsidiaries also impacted from negative inventory valuations due to the falling raw material prices. As of 30th June, the net debt of, on a standalone basis for JSL is stood at INR 2,956 crore. Despite the CapEX, the debt for the debt equity is maintained at 0.2x, and the Net Debt to EBITDA is stood at 0.8x. The CapEX side, if you recall, FY 20, for FY 2024, we earlier guided for INR 2,500 crore-INR 2,600 crore in our last call.
Now, looking at the progress of few projects, we expect some of the FY 2025 CapEX to be pre-fund in FY 2024. This would be in the tune of INR 500-600 crore. This is broadly on account of NCI projects, equity infusion and ReNew Power projects, and few other ancillary projects. With this CapEX outflow, the CapEX outflow of JSL is now expected at INR 3,000 crore during FY 2024. The combined remaining CapEX of JUSL of around INR 253 crore, the total CapEX between JSL and JUSL is expected in the range of INR 3,200-3,300 crore in FY 2024.
The majority of same will be funded through internal accrual. We expect the net debt could increase by approximate INR 800 crore from March 2023 level of rupees INR 2,591 crore. On demand outlook, as Abhyuday Jindal already discussed, we are confident of domestic demand with the government push on infrastructure spending. The PM Gati Shakti project is not only expected to reduce cost of logistics for our industry, but also generate some additional demand for projects like airports, station development, freight corridor, TTC. The PM vision of a $5 trillion economy, the pipeline project looks promising for the industry. With this, I would now like to hand over, end my discussion and would request the moderator to open the floor for Q&A session.
Thank you. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on the touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question comes from the line of Amit Dixit from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Hi, good evening, everyone, and congratulations for a good fixed number. I have a couple of questions. The first one is on the level of operations. We are already operating at, if you see the annualized level of roughly 2.2 million tons. Considering the fact that this is a pre-election year, there could be further demand growth from infra push and of course, export volume, as we mentioned, we are looking for newer market, and it is also revising from what. What kind of volume growth can we expect in this year? If you could be more specific about the volume that we can expect this year, and maybe the growth in next year, that would be very helpful.
Amit, you know, definitely, we are very confident of achieving our guidance, which is 2.2 million tons this year. That we are very confident of achieving. We would not like to increase this guidance right now, because even though domestic market is supporting and it is good demand, we are able to push material, it is still export and Europe mainly that is still down. Until that picks up, which we are expecting next couple of months to start seeing some recovery, I would like to give a better or increased guidance for this year. 2.1-2.2 is what our guidance is for this year. Next year we expect another 20%-25% volume growth over this.
From a volume perspective, that is what we are quite confident of achieving.
Yeah, that's very helpful. The second question is essentially now, you know, we have a capacity of 2.9, operating at 2.2, and given the time that, you know, it takes certain time to actually put up capacity, and we have there, you know, further scope of downfield expansion. When would you really think of, you know, capacity expansion at Jajpur, given the long-term prospects in the country for stainless steel, we didn't call it sanguine? At what level of capacity utilization would you consider the next leg of brownfield expansion?
You know, Amit, to answer your question, firstly, we feel that 3 million ton melting for next couple of years is quite sufficient, two-three years. Where we further want to increase our capacity is actually in our downstream processes. Cold rolling is one area that we further want to increase, and that would be the maybe next sort of capital investment that we do. You know, from increasing our melting capacity point of view, we would still like to wait for another year before we take the decision to see how our you know, completion or commissioning happens, how the market reacts. Is there more duties, less duties? What is the global scenario as well?
We would like to take a call, but till then, definitely we want to increase our cold rolling capacity.
Amit, just to give you the, put you in the perspective, the current sales is not entirely from our production, because we always have a window, as we explained last time, to buying off the slab and capturing the volumes in our sales. That's the reason. The new facility is ramping up gradually, not the 100% ramp up is still not achieved for the new facility. We always have a flexibility of getting these slabs and rolling it out and selling the, still maintaining our sales volume. We will take a call gradually and how we move from.
Great. Just squeezing a bookkeeping question here. What would be the net debt as of now, if you consider JUSL acquisition and complete and everything? What is the net debt as of now?
Including JUSL, you are talking about?
Yeah, yeah, including JUSL.
Including JUSL, the net debt today is at INR 4,904 crore on the June end, when I said today is June end. Basically the INR 2,956 crore for JSL and INR 1,948 crore for JUSL, INR 4,904 crore of debt, net debt.
Okay, great. I have other questions, but I'll come back in the queue. Thanks and all the best.
Thank you.
Thank you. Before we take the next question, a reminder to all the participants, please restrict yourself to two questions each. Next question comes from the line of Ritesh Shah from Investec. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. Two questions. Sir, first is, if you could please detail down the CapEX that we have for FY 2024 and 2025. If you could spell out the broader heads for JUSL debottlenecking for 2024, 2025. Second is NPI Indonesia. Third is the maintenance CapEX. Fourth, Rathi. Fifth, if there's any spillover CapEX of the ongoing expansion, and renewable, what is our equity contribution? I think these are the broader five heads, and how should one look at the incremental ROC on each of the five heads? That's the first questions.
Okay. Ritesh, you're talking about FY 2024, 2025 or 2024?
Sir, separately for 2024 and then for 2025, that would be great.
Currently, I think, I would say, as currently, what our committed CapEX, especially all these, projects which you mentioned, Rathi, as well as the ReNew Power, and then, other CapEX is, it's all. What we are saying is that, close to INR 3,200-3,300 CR in FY 2024. FY 2025, I think it's a bit early to guide right now, because, whatever the committed projects are there, based on that, FY 2025 CapEX may not be large at this stage. I think, as we go along and then how we spend this CapEX, then we'll be able to guide you better for FY 2025. In FY 2024, the expected CapEX, is in the range of INR 3,200-3,300 crore.
Again, this depends on some of the performance of these projects, how these projects progress. Like, there are milestone-based payments in NPI project of Indonesia. The way they are progressing, that's why we think that probably some of the CapEX which we are envisaging earlier in FY 2025 may actually fall in at the end of FY 2024 itself. Eventually, it will be, the project starts early, then it will be better for shareholder returns. Similar is same for the other projects. That's what our guidance is for the FY 2024 CapEX.
Great. sir, can you please break it up on the INR 3,300 crore number?
It's a multiple level of CapEX, as we said, INR 3,300 crore. JUSL was there, QC INR 958 crore. NPI, we are taking close to INR 1,000 crore. Again, it's quite depending on the progress, there are milestone-based payments. Maintenance and sustenance would be around INR 500 crore. Rathi could range between, because we are just trying to see some of the additional CapEX. It could range between INR 75-100 CR of that. ReNew Power, as we said, there we, it's equity infusion. We can't say exactly the number because of the confidentiality reason, you can understand it should be in the range of around INR 150 CR number of the equity infusion. These are the broad numbers for the CapEX.
So specifically, can you highlight what is the incremental ROC that we are looking at? One is for Rathi. I don't know how to ask the same question for the INR 150 crore of renewable Renew Power equation. I had a follow-up question on NPI specifically to Indonesia. Rathi, basically, how should we look at the incremental CapEX, incremental ROC?
See, Rathi, it's our new entry into long products. Right now, we would like to see how the markets, how it progresses in terms of our products in the market. Our initial estimate is that the payback of Rathi would be, say, around five to seven years. We are giving a longer guidance for Rathi, because we also need to see how we penetrate on the various product lines in the Rathi. I think, because it's a plant which we are now starting, the product range which we are getting, that's why we are saying that five to seven years would be the expected payback of Rathi.
I think, better way to talk about Rathi is probably end of this financial year, when we actually start all the lines, and then by the time we assess the market.
Sure.
Second question. Go ahead, Ritesh.
My second question was on the Indonesia investment. It looks good on the face of it. However, I find it honestly difficult to comprehend how we will repatriate the money back. Earlier, we had indicated pretty attractive four to five years of payback. If you could please give some color, like, is the idea to procure metal or is the idea to get the money back? Is it something which is viable? Is it allowed to export nickel or nickel matte right now, basically from Indonesia?
Okay. Let me answer your first part. The repatriation route, we the way it is, we are structuring. The JV operational JV will give the monthly dividend. Whatever their surplus, they actually distribute the monthly dividend in the ratio they will distribute. We will be routing it through Singapore, because between Singapore and India, there is a tax efficient treaty. Whatever we receive as a dividend from Singapore entity, it will be taxable as a dividend in our end. Again, that will be compensated from the dividends which JSL distribute to its shareholders. That tax will also if simultaneously we pay the dividend higher than the dividend received, which will be the case because this is a smaller investment.
This entire dividend will also not be taxable in our end in JSL. Between Singapore and Indonesia, there is a 10% withholding tax. On net, the expected is, we are still, based on the current law, it looks like around 10% of the taxation on a net basis. With monthly dividend coming from this entity to Singapore. From Singapore to India, we can always see whether we want to keep things monthly, we want to do quarterly, that's our flexibility.
Sure. Just last follow-up question. Specific to this project, is the ore supplies assured? How should we look at it? Like, does Xingcheng assure it that the mining supplies, the ore supplies are completely back for the smelter? Is there any risk or it's something which we have already hedged for?
No, it's completely assured by them. In fact, they have been running more than 120 such plants, are operational. It's a very well-structured model, and they charge, have a similar charge for everybody. It's not that, as per very transparent system, it's not that they do differential pricing of any of the inputs first. It's quite assured and.
Very well tried and tested model in the recent past. Before we went in also, we did a lot of study and we spoke to their other partners as well, and then we went ahead with this decision. From a raw material assurity, there is no challenge at all.
Sure. That is helpful. Thank you so much. I'll join back. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you, Ritesh.
Thank you. A reminder to all the participants, please restrict yourself to two questions. Next question comes from the line of Kirtan Mehta from BOB Capital Markets. Please go ahead.
Thank you, sir, for the opportunity. Am I audible?
You're not very clear, Kirtan. Just if you can speak loud, bit loud and closer to mic, please.
Sure. Just want to understand the sales mix that will evolve during FY 2024 in terms of the 200, 300, and 400 series, how would the sort of that mix grow from FY 2023?
See, first, let me just put one rider there. It's not the sales mix which is target to achieve, frankly. What we target to achieve is the capturing the best with our supply, agile supply chain and manufacturing process, capturing the best margin products from the various segments, irrespective of the particular grades. That's what our key focus area is that. It's not prudent to compare that how the year-on-year basis this, that mix is capturing. We can give you the mix of last quarter, just for your information.
Sure, sir.
Last quarter, 200 series, 300 series, 400 series mix was 33, 46, and 21.
Right. Another question was in terms of the global slowdown that we are seeing. That has an impact on the stainless steel price. How would it play out on our margins during Q2?
See, we are still sticking to our guidance of between 19,000-21,000, and we are still going to stick to that. This is again because of the inherent strength that we have created inside our organization, that we're not dependent on any geography, any sector, any industry to a very large extent. You know, that way, that's why we are always able to, and always are, achieving our guided numbers, because we're able to transfer and increase sales in one sector, like Anurag would say, that we are not pre-deciding that in 200 series, we have to do 30% or 25%. It is depending on where we see the growth coming, where we see good margins coming in, then we're able to push material more to those geographies or industries.
That's why our guidance, we are still not changing, because we still not see any uptick in export front. That's why between 19,000 to 21,000 is what we would like to say.
Right, that can be achievable on a quarterly basis as well, not necessarily only on an annual basis.
Full year, full year is what average I am saying, but on a quarter-to-quarter also, it will be around this number only.
I think the guidance of what we would say is, let's stick to quarter, sorry, year-on basis, because there are always, in that port, like, this type of business, because there could be some time a quarter-end, if there are large high fluctuation in raw material prices, there could be time lags. With our range, we should be able to achieve it on a quarter-to-quarter basis, but our guidance is actually for full-year basis.
Understood. Do you really see a pressure on the Because when we look at the gross margin indicator, we see that there is some bit of the gross margin indicator seems to be declining. Could there be a pressure on the Q2, or Q2 looks comfortable based on the sort of the sales looking that we have?
Q2 looks comfortable. There is good demand in the domestic market, so, Q2 looks comfortable as of now.
Actually, gross margin, Kirtan, is because of the product mix. If we do higher 300 series, the raw material cost increases, because it has a nickel, high nickel content, so gross margin comes down. That's how the gross margin... In our business, the gross margin is really a completely subject to the product mix. It's not like a steel, where the gross margin and EBITDA can be re-related.
Understood. Just one more follow-up in terms of the 300 and 400 series, what would be sort of the expectation at this point of time, how do we see the growth in the market as a whole, in terms of the Indian market?
300 series will always remain very strong, because that is the highest and the most common series that is sold. The highest growth we see coming more in 400 series. You know, that is where more and more we are also as an organization trying to push, and we see good growth coming, higher growth coming in 400 series.
Right. Thanks. I'll get back to the queue. Thanks for the clarification.
Thank you.
Thank you. A reminder to all the participants, please restrict yourself to two questions. Next question comes from the line of Vivek from DSP Mutual Fund. Please go ahead.
Sir, good afternoon. I'll just ask my two questions sequentially. The first is in terms of, you know, the CapEX this year, and then next year, you said you'll announce later. In terms of, debt governance, in terms of debt to EBITDA on a consolidated basis, do you have any guidance in terms of where you will go? Because you've been very conservative so far. The second question is, there was another group company that was in the coking coal segment. Is there any plan of acquiring that? Those are my questions. Thank you.
On debt to EBITDA, our guidance, in the sense that we are comfortable of around 1.5, but I know we are much below than that. That's what we say, okay, 1.5 is of debt to EBITDA, depending on the, what kind of project we get, is comfortable for us. Not that we will, because right now we are running at just 0.8. We have enough headroom. It doesn't mean that we are running for that headroom. We'll always be cautious of our projects and the CapEX plan. The second question was.
Any plan to merge?
JCL? No, because JCL, is a coke oven business.
There is no requirement of coke in stainless steel production, so we don't feel the need to merge JCL with JSL.
Okay. Thank you very much, and good luck.
Thank you.
Thank you. A reminder to all the participants, please restrict yourself to two questions. Next question comes from the line of Renjith Sivaram from Mahindra Manulife Mutual Fund. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hello, hi, sir. Just an academic question, if you look at some of the stainless steel pipe manufacturing companies like Ratnamani or Venus, they are showing good number.
You are not audible. Can you please come closer to the mic and speak?
Am I audible now?
Yeah, better.
A little soft, also a little louder would be better.
Just on an academic level, if you look at some of the stainless steel pipe manufacturers like Ratnamani or Venus, they are showing good growth, they are planning capacity expansion and all. Do we cater to their raw material requirement in terms of stainless steel billets? Some of these players say that there is a shortage of that, and they import these billets from the export market.
This is more for seamless pipes. Is that the question that you're asking?
Yeah, yeah.
Definitely we are increasing our billet production capacity, because that is one of the input materials into Rathi steel as well. Per se, for our customers, directly, I'm not able to answer. In terms of are we enhancing our billet capacity? Yes, that we are, and that input is going to be used for Rathi. If we see good margins and good demand coming up from these pipe manufacturers, then we'll be happy to supply to them. As of today, because we're still in the construction phase, no excess capacity is available at this point.
Okay.
That is the, I mean, that is what I understood to be your question.
Yeah. Thanks for that. I'm just curious, like, whether we will be also trying to forward integrate into any of these industries, because the kind of growth we are seeing. Will we also look into, in future, looking into a stainless steel pipe manufacturing or something like that?
We have no plan to forward integrate, because, you know, we are as a leader of the industry, we are catering to every sector, every segment. Generally, what happens is, if we enter into any of our customers' area, they become very uncomfortable and they don't appreciate that at all. We more than getting into directly into some downstream thing, we prefer the Jindal Saathi concept that we did with the pipe and tube segment. That has worked very well for us. It has increased our sales volume, it has helped us increase the margins also in that sector. On these cards, where we are actually an enabler for our customers to produce the best quality, produce the best product that they can make, that is the approach we would like, and we feel more comfortable with that.
Okay. Okay, sir. Great. Thanks.
Thank you.
Thank you. A reminder to all the participants that you may press star and One to ask a question. Next question comes from the line of Ritwik Seth from OneUp Financials. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, good evening, sir, congratulations on a great set of numbers. Sir, I have few questions. Firstly, if you can throw some light on the subsidiaries performance. This quarter, we have seen a decent performance from the subsidiaries. What is the outlook there, and has it stabilized, especially the overseas subsidiaries?
Actually, the domestic subsidiaries are doing well. It is more our overseas subsidiaries which are still lagging behind, and that is only because they are export market-dependent. You know, our service center in Spain is totally dependent on the European market. We don't export from there at all. We see the recovery happening in the next 2 months there as well. Both Indonesia and Spain are totally dependent on export market. When they pick up, their performance will improve. Domestic, our both subsidiaries, otherwise, Lifestyle and the Steelway, are doing fairly well, and they will continue to perform at higher levels.
Okay. This run rate, one can expect, and if overseas turns around with export markets picking up, then...
That will also improve.
That will also...
Correct.
Okay.
Correct.
Bulk of this, INR 70-75 crores EBITDA, must be coming from domestic subsidiary. Is that a right?
Domestic subsidiary, our service center subsidiary, basically.
Right. Okay, got it. Second question is on the ramp-up of our, brownfield expansion. How has it been, since commissioning? If you can throw some light. Did we, do any volumes from that, or, not in this quarter?
Already. Yes, commissioning is on track. Like we said, that we will increase or, you know, basically increase the speed depending on if market, again, demand picks up in the export market, further ramp-up we will do. As of now, it's not been major quantity from the new expansion we have been able to push. I think from August onwards at least, I would say 4,000-5,000 tons every month should be start coming from the new capacity.
Okay.
It'll pick up subsequently over the following months then.
Okay. Every month, 4,000-5,000, you said?
Starting from August, will be 4-5, depending on the market demand, we can increase or whatever is required can be done.
Sure, sure. Okay. sir, couple of bookkeeping questions. What was the CapEX in Q1 FY 2024 that we incurred?
around INR 1,400 crore.
Basically about 50% of approximately the CapEX for FY 2024 has been incurred in Q1 only.
Yeah, because.
JUSL.
JUSL and, the some of part of this and as well as large part of NPI, first tranche was paid.
Okay. We have already paid for the INR 958 crore JUSL in Q1?
Part of it, not the fully.
Part. Okay. Okay, sure. Okay, so last question from my end. What is the EBITDA number for JUSL in Q1?
EBITDA for JUSL in Q1 was INR 205 crore.
205. Okay.
Yeah.
Okay, thank you and all the best, sir.
Thank you.
Thank you. A reminder to all the participants that you may press star and one to ask a question. Next question comes from the line of Ashish Kejriwal from Nuvama Institutional Equities. Please go ahead.
Good evening, everyone, and many congratulations again, sir, for consistent good performance. I have three questions. One, after, you know, we have obviously successfully acquired the remaining stake of JUSL. After acquisition of JUSL and including their debt in our books, is it possible to share what could be the net debt figure now?
Net debt, with, including of, JUSL as on June now was INR 4,900 crores. Including of JUSL.
Sir, you know, because INR 3,300 crore was JSL, and then INR 1,950 something is for JUSL, and part, we have to pay for acquiring JUSL. That's what I was looking at. If or to put it another way, what could be our peak Net Debt by looking at the CapEX, which we envisaged and the cash flows?
Yeah. Okay.
which we invested?
Okay. Let me give you the number. June closing net debt of JSL and JUSL was INR 4,904 crore. As we mentioned, with all this CapEX, largely will be internal approval, but we expect the debt would go up by another INR 800 crore. The closing date of March 2024 could reach to an INR 5,300 crore range, INR 5,300 crore-INR 5,400 crore, I think.
I think on this number, you must be talking about the sharp increase in the working capital also. I will do the math later on. I know.
No, sorry, I haven't got your question. Sharp increase in working...
Uh.
Yeah, increase in working capital, obviously, because of the higher capacity, of 1 million ton, which will require higher working capital. We have taken all of that also.
Okay. Is it possible to share what's the gross block post JUSL acquisition?
Gross block-
The gross block for JUSL was INR 3,040 crore, plus the JSL gross block. whatever.
Okay.
You need to add to JUSL, INR 3,040 crore.
Okay, fair enough. Lastly, in terms of ferrochrome, I understand that we don't sell ferrochrome, but over the last one year, definitely our cost of production for ferrochrome must have come down because of lower coke and thermal coal prices. Is it possible to share what kind of cost savings we have observed in ferrochrome versus last year?
Ashish, that is a figure that I would prefer not to share because, you know, maybe offline I can share with you.
Okay.
I would not like to share these kind of figures, on these calls because it is, you know, somewhat.
No issues.
I will send it to you. I'll ask Shreya to send it to you offline. I think I'm more comfortable with that.
Sure.
You know, because these are our efficiency practices and everything that I would not like to.
Sure, sure. No issues. Yeah, that's my question. All the best for the future.
Thank you, Ashish. Thank you.
Thank you. A reminder to all the participants that you may press star and one to ask a question. Next question comes from the line of Vikash Singh. Please go ahead.
Thank you, sir. Sir, just one clarification. As you said, you are doing well. What percentage of our total sales could be trading volumes?
Trading volumes. No, don't do any trading. It's not a trading volume. It would be a more raw material strategy, whether through scrap or through slab. It's not really pure trading. Even slab, we do the rolling over here.
Sir, just one clarification: Is it safer to assume as we ramp up our and replacing this outside purchase of slabs, so our margins could have some little bit of positive impact? Because obviously we would be foregoing some of the margins in purchase of those slabs.
See, it's a factor of everything. It can go up, it can go down, depending, because it's on sales on. You know, nickel, our raw material is very volatile. That's why it is difficult to per se say, particularly on the slab front. That's why the best thing is to give the overall guidance. You know, we likely said that because we're part of so many industries, so many sectors, that individual guidance become difficult. Overall guidance of between INR 19,000-INR 21,000 EBITDA per ton is the best way to, I would say, study and look at it.
Understood, sir. Thank you.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question for today. We have reached the end of question and answer session. I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Vikash Singh for closing comments.
I would like to thank the JSL management for giving us the opportunity. Shreya, for any closing comments.
Yeah, Mr. Jindal, please.
I'd like to thank everyone for attending this call. I would like to reiterate that it is the strong economic activities that are pulling up core sector demand across segments in the domestic market. Our agility in sales and operation planning, and extensive use of digitization for faster and more efficient decision-making, has helped us deliver a robust performance. Going forward, we will continue to strategize business as per market dynamics. I hope we have been able to answer all your questions satisfactorily. Should you need any further clarifications or would like to know more about the company, please feel free to reach to our Investor Relations team. Thank you, everybody, once again.
Thank you.
Thank you. On behalf of PhillipCapital India Private Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us. You may now disconnect your lines.