Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Multi Commodity Exchange of India Limited Q2 FY 25 Earnings Conference Call. Joining us on the call are Mr. Manoj Jain, Chief Operating Officer, MCX; Mr. Chandresh Shah, Chief Financial Officer, MCX; Mr. Praveen D.G., Chief Risk Officer, MCX; and Mr. Rishi Nathany, Chief Business Officer, MCX. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Manoj Jain, Chief Operating Officer, MCX. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you, Del. Good evening to all of you, and a very warm welcome to the earnings and analyst call of Multi Commodity Exchange of India Limited for Q2 FY 2025. We are glad that MCX has concluded yet another quarter on a significant positive note. The company's PAT in Q2 sequentially grew to INR 153.62 crore, as against INR 110.92 crore, which is an increase of 39% sequentially. The operational revenue for this quarter has increased by 73% to INR 285.58 crore compared to the corresponding quarter of the previous year, and if we compare it sequentially, it has gone up by 22% from INR 234.37 crore recorded in Q1 2025.
On the trading front, average daily turnover, that is the ADT of futures and options, during Q2 FY 2025, saw a significant increase, rising by 27.49% to reach INR 2.2 lakh crore compared to the previous quarter's INR 1.72 lakh crore. The increase was propelled higher by options ADT indeed, which grew by 31.71% to almost INR 1.93 lakh crore in Q2, versus 1.46 lakh crore in Q1 of FY 2025. The exchange continues to broad base its investor base, too. The traded clients witnessed a quarter-on-quarter growth of almost 20%, reaching about 6.8 lakh during Q2 of FY 2025, as against 5.67 lakh in the previous quarter of this financial year.
Noteworthy, on September 16, 2024, the total turnover consolidated for futures and options combined recorded an all-time high of INR 4.73 lakh crore. Options accounted almost INR 4.5 lakh crore out of that. As we all know, there are two critical pillars of a commodity exchange. First is the efficient price discovery, and second, the key risk management against adverse events and price movements. We witnessed this in real time when the change in customs duty rate in gold and silver were announced in the Union budget on July 23, 2024, which led to an immediate fall in domestic prices of these commodities in the spot and derivatives market. MCX was able to provide protection to all our bullion market stakeholders who had hedged on this platform.
That was also a historic day for MCX bullion futures and options, both clocking record volumes, futures at INR 55,000 crore plus and options at a whopping INR 92,000 crore plus notional turnover. More significantly, this instance underscored the importance of domestic stakeholders to hedge within India, as the unanticipated change in price resulting from a change in duty rates could only be held on a platform which fully reflects duty-paid Indian commodity prices, something which even the offshore markets cannot offer. On the product front, we have a significant development. In order to encourage hedging and improve the hedge efficiency, the exchange has modified existing Gold 1 kg options bi-monthly expiry contracts. Gold option contracts will now include monthly expiry contracts, and this will be in force with effect from Monday, November 11, 2024.
Another new product launch, we are happy to announce the launch of cash-settled cottonseed wash oil futures. This was launched on fifteenth October twenty twenty-four. We appreciate the support given by our stakeholders in generating making it success, and we continue to look forward to your support there. This contract is of five ton trading unit, and Kadi, Gujarat, is its delivery center. This new futures contract is designed to provide transparency, efficient price discovery, and a vital hedging mechanism for various stakeholders for the cottonseed oil industry, including cottonseed crushers, edible oil refineries, wholesalers, and traders. In line with MCX continued efforts towards developing Indian standards for metals, the exchange has recently empaneled one more Indian lead producer, Messrs Jain Resource Recycling Private Limited, at their Tamil Nadu plant. These have been added to the MCX good delivery list.
With this, total number of empaneled lead producers are now eight, and we continue to strive in expanding this list in future. This trend of empaneling domestic refiners, a part of the national vision of Atmanirbhar Bharat, would serve the nation by creating domestic benchmarks, reducing price disparities, and encouraging quality recycling of metals. MCX has always been conscious of the needs of stakeholders in the commodity value chain, and has been at the forefront in creating and modifying products and processes to suit the varied needs of these stakeholders. In recognition of these efforts, MCX was bestowed the Exchange of the Year title at the India Gold Conference on twenty-third August, twenty twenty-four at Bengaluru. In order to foster transparency and rationalize the transaction charges, MCX, under supervision of the market regulator, has recently introduced a single-tier transaction charge structure for each of the futures and option segments.
The rationalization in transaction charge has effectively reduced the charges for the vast majority of our clients. The exchange has also asked members to ensure that the charges levied on clients are true to label. That is, fees levied on the end client by a member should not exceed the exact amount as charged by the exchange to the member. On sixteenth October, twenty twenty-three, if we all recall, MCX and MCX CCL together went live with our new age commodity derivatives platform successfully. We celebrate the first anniversary of that historic event, and we congratulate all who were involved in that mega project. We once again extend our sincere gratitude to all stakeholders, regulators, technology service providers, data vendors, and member brokers for their ongoing support, guidance, and courage to us. We really thank you.
With this, I conclude the opening remarks and look forward to discussing more during the Q&A session. Thank you.
Thank you. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Amit Chandra from HDFC Securities. Please go ahead.
Yes, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. So you mentioned about the increasing participation wherein the number of retail traders on the platform has increased significantly, but our intention was also to increase the FPI participation. So if I'm not wrong, it was in the range of 1%. So if you can provide some update, so what is happening there? What steps you are taking to increase the FPI participation? And also on the, like, co-location part, can there be any chance that the co-location can, you know, come to the MCX as well?
Did you say fine, thank you? Yeah. Yeah, so thanks for the question. First, to answer your question about FPIs, we already have around 117 FPIs registered on the exchange, and we are getting more and more of them to trade on the exchange. You have to understand that it is still early days yet. It was only few months back that FPIs were permitted and enabled on the exchange to participate, and we have been seeing healthy participation. We have been seeing a lot of OI coming from the FPIs, both in crude and natural gas. And we hope that, you know, going forward, if the regulator so permits, we could see FPIs, you know, trade in other commodities as well, if the regulator so allows.
In terms of FPI participation, the ADT has been increasing, and we hope to see that this will increase further. In terms of co-location, as of now, the exchange norms do not allow for co-location in commodities. As and when the regulator allows co-location in commodities, we will definitely look at bringing it to market.
Okay. And sir, now secondly, you know, you have announced that we are, you know, we are launching the monthly expiry, you know, the gold contract. But, in terms of the other products in the pipeline, so, you know, it has been, like, a year, since the new, you know, platform has been running. And, I suppose, the first year was where we were, not very keen in terms of launching a new product. Okay. So from here on, as we have completed one year successfully, so can we see some accelerated launches in terms of, some of the products which are in the testing phase, as of now?
So lastly, you mentioned about the monthly series on the contract, which will increase the number of expiries, specific, you know, specific to crude on the option side, and the index options as well. I know the index options is, you know, the second product which will come after the monthly series, but if you can provide some timelines? And where we are in terms of the testing of these products at the back end, and what's like pending from the regulator side?
So, while I cannot give you any specific timelines, all I can tell you is that, the exchange always keeps looking at various commodities and new contracts or, variants of existing contracts to bring to market, and we are actively pursuing that. As and when we do get a regulatory approval, and we have done all our internal testings and everything, we will definitely bring it to market. So in a nutshell, yes, you would see us trying to bring more products to market in as we go forward.
Just to supplement Rishi, Amit, I'll add that, see, there is always a launch cycle, and things get launched gradually, with the successful launch of cottonseed wash oil also, so that proves the system capability, scalability, and we have also announced the monthly expiries of gold one kg. Yes, there would be a cycle as and when the right contracts and the right approvals and the launch timing is appropriate as considered, you will see a gradual launch. That, that's the whole idea. I mean, we are going ahead slow and steady.
Okay. And sir, in terms of the cost, obviously we have managed the cost well, but the technology cost has not come off in this quarter. So is it because after the completion of one year, maybe some of the extra cost related technology that was required is coming off? Or is it the new base, or there is some one-off in that? And also, if you can you know elaborate on the AMC cost, which will you know it you know which is likely to hit in quarter three. So is it on track, so the AMC cost will hit in quarter three?
Hi, Amit. So the IT costs are gradually increased, but still there is some breakeven, and we can say on nominal, marginal savings compared to what we would have paid in the previous arrangement with 63 Moons . And you are right, the AMC cost of TCS will start coming in from quarter three. So we'll have to wait and see if they, in the numbers they will reflect.
Okay, sir. Thank you, and all the best for the coming quarter.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Prayesh Jain from Motilal Oswal. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi. Congratulations on great set of numbers. Just firstly on the premium to notional turnover ratio on the option side, that has gone up in this quarter. So how should we look at this sustainability of the same going ahead? And particularly on the gold contract also, if you could highlight whether, you know, that would lead to a drop in premium to notional turnover ratio?
So see, the Premium to Notional Turnover Ratio is covered by a host of factors, including volatility, and it is very difficult to predict what would be the Premium to Notional Turnover Ratio going forward. So we can't, you know, give any future visibility on that.
Okay. But sir, with respect to gold monthly contracts, ideally, if the period reduces, that would lead to a lower premium versus the current contracts?
See, ideally, if you look at it, I don't think so. Because firstly, if you traded a bi-monthly contract, the premium is higher at the beginning of the contract, but the volume correspondingly is lower. And then as you mature into the contract and reach the expiry, the volume goes up and the premium goes down. Now, if you flip back in from two months to one month, ideally, I think it should have a similar effect, if not better. So I do not see any negative effect of bringing a monthly contract into the picture. So overall, the premium behavior will still remain the same. That will be high during the launch and lower during the expiry.
Okay. So secondly, on the SGF contribution bit, you know, how do we see that going ahead? And, you know, we had contributed in this quarter as well. So if the volumes continue to surge the way they are, do you think we need contribution to SGF on a regular basis?
So, Prayesh, yes, as a strategic, thought process, we do look upon a gradual contribution on SGF on need basis. And, you would see such numbers, though numbers are small, but idea is to continue to, strengthen our SGF, for future scalability and new product launches. So that's a strategic thought process.
Got that, got that. And just, you know, one bit on the computer and technology expenses that has gone up in this quarter. What are the reasons for the same?
So in fact, for this quarter, it is marginally reduced. But Prayesh, last year we had warranties and all. So as and when the warranties expire, so the AMC cost starts coming in.
Mm-hmm. Okay. Okay. All right. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Parikshit Gupta from Fair Value Capital. Please go ahead.
... Hello, am I audible?
No, sir. Could you come a bit close to your handset? You sound a bit distant.
Is it better now?
No, sir, not really.
I'm using my headset.
Yeah, now it's fine.
Okay, thank you very much for the opportunity, and my name is Parikshit Gupta. So, my first question is a more fundamental question. While we understand that the volumes of trading usually increases during times of economic uncertainty, we saw this in the post-COVID era, as well as during this, you know, calendar year, because of the geopolitical tensions and the unfortunate events in Middle East and Europe. I just wanted to understand, is there a way to understand if the volumes that we see right now, how much of it would be sustainable going forward?
Okay, so Parikshit, to answer your question, first of all, volumes are only not driven by geopolitical concerns. If you see that the overall participation base of the exchange has been going up, which means all the participants on the exchange, whether it be hedgers, physical market participants, retail traders, HNIs, FIIs, everything is going up. Now, when overall participation goes up, naturally you would see better turnover. Also, what adds to volatility in the market is, of course, the geopolitical tensions, but it is not just those which drive the market. So there are a host of factors which drive volumes. So, you know, it's very difficult to quantify that how much geopolitical tension will happen and how much it will sustain volume or not.
But all I can say is that, if we continue with the trend of growing participant base, our volumes will anyways continue to grow from strength to strength.
Absolutely, sir. I completely understand that the driver of volume is the market increase in the market depth, so, thank you for explaining that. My second question is on the India International Bullion Holdings please. I will understand that even in the previous quarter, you mentioned it is very hard to predict how much of a business might it generate going forward, and that the revenue was about, the business generator was about two crores overall. Do we have any sense for the current quarter and the next quarter as well?
See, we cannot give any future predictions on business of IIBH. All we can say is that it is a relatively new exchange. The gestation period and the profitability cycle of any exchange is a long-term process. Having said that, IIBH has already, broken even and also delivered a small profit. So we hope that going forward, it will continue to grow from strength to strength.
Understood. Thank you very much. My final question is about cash on hand. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I believe the cash on hand for investment is about INR 1,500 crore at the end of this quarter. Do we have any plans of deploying that capital in sight right now?
So the amount what you are mentioning includes our current investments into SGF also. See, the cash will be utilized in the business. We also have to maintain some cash for safety in case of any claims or any issues. There is also some bit of growth capital. We may have to invest in technology in near future. So we are retaining that cash, but the board is aware, and board may take a call on how to utilize the surplus cash in future.
Understood. Thank you very much. That's all from my side. I will... Thank you again for your time.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Mohit Motwani from Tara Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi, thank you for the opportunity. My first question is on the premium ratio. I know that, you know, you have said there are a host of factors, but in the previous calls, you have also said that, you know, many participants are trading out of the money options, as a result of which it ultimately translate into a lower premium ratio. Now, in the months of September and October, we have seen an uptick in the premium ratio, and it has coincided with the heightened volatility in crude. So just want to, you know, clarify if this increase in premium ratio can be directly attributed to the heightened volatility, or there is some difference in the behavior of participants as well?
See, that is very difficult to quantify. The premium ratio is a function of various factors, as I already told to you, so it's very difficult to dissect and give it to you.
Sure. Sure. Okay, and my second question is a bookkeeping one. So, can you let us know what was the revenue from options and futures? And how to think about the effective tax rate, since it's been in nineteen to twenty percent rates in the last three quarters, so how to think about it in the, for the near and medium term?
So see, revenue for futures was approximately 30%, and options was approximately 70%, and effective tax rate will remain in the range of 21-23%.
21%-23%, right?
Yeah.
Sure. Thank you. That, that's all from my end. Thank you so much.
... Next question is from the line of Chintan Sheth from Girik Capital. Please go ahead.
Thank you for the opportunity, am I audible? Hello?
Yes, we are audible.
Yeah, yeah. Sure. Okay, sorry. I was not getting the... So, my question was, first question was on the new launches. You mentioned, monthly gold option contract will be launching on November eleventh. Have I heard correctly, or it's futures contract?
No, no, so in gold, we have bi-monthly futures and bi-monthly option contracts. The bi-monthly futures will continue as it is for now.
Mm-hmm.
We are now making the options monthly from November onwards.
Okay. We were thinking about launching the futures first and then the options later? I think that was the plan earlier, or am I incorrect on that part?
No. So whatever the plan was, that is being implemented.
Okay, okay, so we were looking for option monthly only, to start with, and, futures, we are not looking at it currently.
I didn't say we are not looking at it. I'm saying that we are implementing options first, and there are-
Okay.
We could, you know, see that experience and then take a call.
Sure. And secondly, on index futures and options, which we were planning, because that will be the precursor to it, you know, to the weekly expiry, which we can launch, given that now the SEBI has regularized it, and limiting it to single index contract. What are the management's thought or any indication where are we in terms of testing and filing to the SEBI regulators for the approval?
So while I can't give you specifics, all we can say is that there are a host of products we are looking at studying, which are in various stages of testing or, study or applying or, you know, the pipeline is there. And what I can say with certainty is, going forward, you will see, a few product launches.
Okay. And just on the revenue split, you mentioned currently 30, but if you can allow the absolute - this is on the standalone revenue? If you can allow it on the-
Yes, standalone.
Okay. Standalone, then, then I'll be comfortable. And on the consolidated cost front, if I look at the software support cost, which declined from INR 22 crore to INR 24 crore, INR 21 crore around, sequentially, despite the, you know, revenue energy basket continuing to performing well, I believe that revenue share to CME should have sequentially increased, implying that the other software costs highly likely to get reduced during the quarter. If you can quantify how much of the revenue share we were shared with the CME on the energy contract this quarter?
The revenue we are making payment to CME is shown as product license fees. It is item number B in expenses. It is not part of IT expenses.
Sure, so I'm talking about that only. Sorry, I'm talking about that only. The cost, it declined from twenty-two to twenty point something, twenty point five.
That is the IT cost. And what you're talking of, CME is in product license fees. That is the-
I see.
second line, which is increased from INR 13 crores sequentially to INR 17 crores.
13 to 17 crore?
Right.
Okay. I was also getting that number. Okay, thank you. I'll come back to you. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Shalini Gupta from East India Securities. Please go ahead. Shalini, your line has been unmuted. Please go ahead with your question. As there is no response, the next question is from the line of Sanketh Godha from Avendus Spark. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thank you for the opportunity. Sir, can you tell me how much is the float income in the current quarter, and corresponding margin money, what we have in the exchange or clearing corporation? And also just wanted to know your update on SEBI thing to share the floating income with clients. Anything what you have heard on those lines? That's my first question. Second question, sir, was the other income, which was up almost by 34% sequentially. We just wanted to understand what led to that increase, and also if you can quantify the nature of cash in hands, that is other investments, what led to that increase in the other income? Yeah, those are my two questions, sir.
Yeah, Sanket, so, the treasury income was around INR 20 crore for this quarter.
Yeah.
It has increased from 18 to 20 crores.
When you say treasury income, it is float income, right? Margin income.
It is, it is everything. It is float income, it is our own surplus funds, everything.
Okay. It increased from INR 18 crores previous quarter to INR 20 crores in the current quarter. The percentage I need to understand.
Seventeen, seventeen to twenty. Seventeen point something to twenty.
Okay. Mm.
Yeah. And the next question you said was on the cash?
Yeah, the cash on books, because the other income, other operating, other income, which I see it is INR 25 crore-
Yeah.
That is basically the interest income down on the cash what we have, right? So just wanted to understand-
It's largely that. So, see, the absolute amount of the surplus funds also increases. Margin money held with us also increases with the open interest, so the other income from that also increases.
Okay. Got it, sir. And lastly, if you can speak about. See, we launched the scheme, it did not take off much. And we in the past had an agreement with the electricity derivative to be launched through IEX as underlying. So any update on new products like electricity derivative? Because now the platform is up and running, it's been a year from now. So just wanted to understand the new product launches.
Yes, Sanketh, so as I've repeated earlier, is that we are working on the entire product basket, which we want to launch. While we cannot give you any specific timeline or any specific product right now, what we can say is, going forward, you will see certain launches. Since you have already spoken specifically about electricity futures, we have, you know, we are still waiting for the regulators to approve that. There is still that which we are waiting on. As we go ahead, you will see more launches, and I'm sure that will add to our product basket. So, Sanket, I want to add one more thing.
Yeah.
It is not like, the new products are getting launched and it will be add up to significant volumes, okay? Every product will have some amount of gestation period. That means it will take time to really mature. So while every effort will be made to launch the new products, but we should also be judiciously be launching it such that every product will get enough, time to really mature. That is how we have to look at it.
Yeah, fair point, sir. Got it. So in that sense, you would say that steel will take its own time to evolve and become a vibrant product in our market?
So there will be multiple. See, if we launch, there is, it is not always feasible or practical that every product will be a successful product. It takes time to really mature. Second, we also will examine, if at all, any modifications are required in the contract, and we'll also go to the market and study what could be the possible reason that really has led to not significant interest in this particular contract. So it is a continuous exercise. So it doesn't mean that immediately we can consider it as a failure, but so we will be, definitely will be studying this product specifically. And again, if needed, changes will be done to the product, and also accordingly, we'll again bring it forward the product for the trading.
Got it, sir. And last one, do you see any revival in nickel, sir? Or you can say that globally the product has become almost dead for the futures market?
Yeah, Nickel is a very good product, in fact, but because of that earlier episodes, it certainly has died, but we are confident that again we will come out with that product. We'll try to revive that one, but difficult to say what kind of changes right now we'll bring into this particular product, so but we are. It is very much within our radar to really see that how we can able to improve the performance of this contract.
Got it, sir. Perfect. That's it from my side. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Devesh Agarwal from IIFL Securities. Please go ahead.
Hello?
Yes, sir, you are audible.
Yeah, hi, this is Devesh Agarwal from IIFL Securities. Thank you, sir, for the opportunity and very good afternoon, and congratulations on, healthy set of numbers. So my first question to you is basically, very much our dependence is now on four products. That's two on the, bullion and two on the, energy side. Does this worry you? And, historically, base metals have been a good contributor to our revenues as well. But what are the challenges that you are facing on the base metal side? And do you see a scope for, the recovery of base metal volumes from here on?
Yes, historically, like if you take some years back, of course, metal happened to contribute significantly to the volume. But we all know that, we had to make this, contract a delivery-based contract. And, also, still you know that there are some issues out there related to the GST taxation, with multiple delivery centers out there. So these are the factors that is really, dragging this particular, metal basket. But, it is not like it is not, significantly worrying factor, because, if you take any global exchanges, yes, there are certain products which really contribute significantly to the exchange. But if you look at the MCX, you have a diversified basket, because you have bullion, you have metals and energy, and also we could be able to take some lead also in the index product.
So that's why it's not immediately worrying, but of course, we will make every effort to diversify that one. So one of our efforts have been witnessed in this monthly launch of this monthly gold 1 kg options also.
... But sir, we've been hearing this, that because of the increase in the size of the contract, base metal has seen a decline in the liquidity. Are there any dialogues with the regulator to kind of agree cut down on the size of the contract? Is that a possibility, or at this point in time, there are no discussions around that?
You are talking about nickel?
No, generally base metal contracts, sir, including copper and others.
Many already we have launched. No, no. Just to explain that it is not the size of the contract. What Praveen was trying to tell you is that earlier these contracts were cash settled, and then they were moved to a deliverable contract. Moreover, from a single delivery center, there have been multiple delivery centers, which leads to issues in GST. That is why these contracts are facing the kind of headwinds they are. Having said that, we are trying to work on whatever we can to make sure that these contracts also revive. If you see from last fiscal to the current fiscal, base metal has also shown a decent improvement. Going forward, we hope that the base metal contracts will also do very well.
Right, sir. And secondly, sir, you did mention about new client addition. Could you just share some profile in terms of, are these people who are active on equity and have now started trading commodities? So that gives us basically a size that on equity side, we have almost fifty lakh people trading equities. And are we heading to that direction or some profiling of these new clients that you have added over the last two years?
So, we are a commodity exchange. We do not have an equity segment, so even if they are trading on equities on another exchange, we will not know whether they are trading on equities or not. So for as far as we are concerned, all the people who are trading in commodities are trading with us in commodities. Having said that, we have a very healthy mix, which has been consistently maintained of you know, futures to options as well as you know, all these people coming in trading on the exchange. So, anyways, see, let me tell you that in equities or currency or whichever other segment, you would only find investors or traders. But commodities is very different that apart from these investors, traders, FPIs, et cetera, you will also find a lot of physical market participation.
You'll find actual hedgers and people who are actually in the business. So I don't think those hedgers will be trading in equities. Apart from that, the rest of the people who are trading, it is very difficult to say whether they're trading in equities or not.
Okay, sir. And sir, in terms of new contracts, we had in the past talked about cheese contracts. Any update that you can share around that, whether we are still pursuing that, or what we-- at what stage is that product at?
See, again, I will not be able to give a specific timeline on that. We are in the testing phase, and once we have done it, we will definitely come back to you.
Sure, sir. And the last one from my side. The date that you set for the launch of the monthly gold expiry, is it twenty-first or eleventh?
Eleven November.
Eleven November. All right. Thank you so much, sir, and all the very best.
Thank you so much.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Heena Algara from UBS Securities. Please go ahead.
Hi. Thanks for the opportunity. So just a couple of questions. First, which gold future contract would be the most active on the platform, you know, that is seeing like high volume traction? And secondly, could you help us with any expected timeline for the new CEO joining?
So the gold contract, which is most active, is the one kg contract, and that is where we see maximum traction, both in futures and options. Regarding the new CEO, I mean, I'm sure that we'll inform the market with the specific date.
Sure, sir. And also, apologies if this question has already been answered earlier. I was cut off for a couple of minutes. So in terms of the new product launches, would it be possible for you to share what is in our pipeline from which we've already applied to SEBI for approval?
So, ma'am, as I said earlier, that there are a lot of products on at various stages with us, with our IT teams for testing or with regulatory approval or whatever, where we are in various stages of seeking regulatory approval. Now, it will be very difficult to quantify that. Having said that, what we can definitely say is that going forward, you will see a better pipeline of product launches.
Right, sir. Okay, thank you so much.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Subramanian Iyer from Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.
Hello. Thanks for the opportunity. I had a question on the composition of volumes. So, when I looked at SEBI data, what it shows is that there are two big parts in your basically composition of volumes. One is proprietary traders, and then there is others. Basically, the farmers, foreign participants, hedgers, domestic financial institutions, all are very low as per the SEBI data. What is the major composition of major component of others, which is almost 50%? Is it retail? I mean, how much of it is retail, and what are the other nature of participants?
So, we'd just like to clarify that we have a very healthy ratio of client to prop, whereas in this quarter, if you see, 52% in futures and 43% in options have been clients, and the rest only is prop. So it is quite evenly balanced. Within the client space, the ratio between who is a hedger, who is not, that is something we cannot provide.
I'm sure. Thank you.
Just to add to what Mr. Rishi has said. As you are aware, they will not be the contributors. If you see in the market, hedgers will not be the contributors, principal contributors to the volume. In fact, they will be adding to the open interest, because their interest is more into the hedging, not into the trading. Okay? So if you look at even the open interest like that is what I think we've been publishing to the market also, that what hedgers as a percentage to the open interest. And of course, again, it is dependent upon disclosures made by particular people, whether you say a value chain participant or something. But the true intent of the market participant never will be known.
Thanks. And, what proportion of volume is actually contributed by retail?
We don't have that number, but if you look at the client participation, I think that anyway, that those details are given in the part of our presentation.
If you see the page eight of our presentation, it shows you what is the percentage of client trading.
Sure. Thank you.
Welcome.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Arpit Shah from Stallion Asset. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hello, am I audible?
Yes, sir, you are.
Yeah, just thank you for disclosing the premium numbers. Thank you for that. Exchange on the data front, which we had requested earlier on. My question is pertaining to if you can quantify the AMC charges, which is gonna be charged in Q3 FY25, so through TCS. So what would be that charges?
See, we cannot share that number, but, if you track the IT cost, you will get some idea about that. Contractually, we're not allowed to share that number.
So that will be a bump up in the information technology cost?
Yes.
Some proportionally will be added to depreciation, or everything will be placed on?
Sorry, it will be?
Added to depreciation.
It will only be in IT cost only.
And the IT cost depreciation, as was announced earlier on the previous call, there will be around 6o crores for TCS. Would that number include TC, AMC, or that is a separate number, 60 crores plus AMC or 60 crores includes the AMC numbers over here?
We have never given any future guidance on any of the numbers.
In one of the earlier call, we had discussed the 60 crore, that is the number which is going to be technology cost. So would that number include the AMC number, or that would have been separate?
No, no, no. So, the cost will be. We may not have given that in this context. Maybe you are probably linking it to some other number which would have been given. But as Chandresh just now mentioned, we are not disclosing the private contract details. Even the 60 is in which context, not sure, please.
I think INR 60 crore was the, in the context, that was the number that you're probably, that was probably the cost that we were paying to 63 Moons on that specific volumes. Since now the volumes are increased, we would see operating leverage from that cost line. That INR 60 crore was in the context, I think so one of the Q4 or Q3 call, we were, we were speaking on that number. Hello?
Yep. See, that arrangement with 63 Moons was different. It was a little bit of variable kind of thing.
Yeah.
But, the arrangement with TCS is very different. So the numbers you'll have to wait and see for the coming quarters.
Quarter, would it be a significant number or would it be a very same low?
I can't comment right now. You'll have to wait and see the results for third quarter.
Okay. Okay. Thank you so much.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Sanketh Gora from Avendus Spark. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thank you for the opportunity again. Sir, we saw the crude volumes to pick up in the options market because the margins were meaningfully very high in the futures market for crude and natural gas. But in gold, it is meaningfully still low. So just wanted to understand that, despite, I understand that you launched a monthly contract which should increase the vibrancy of the product, but given the market requirement is still very low in futures for gold, do you think it will trickle down as greatly as it happened in crude or natural gas for gold in your internal assessment?
Very simply, we are bringing products to market. We are trying to provide that bouquet of products which the market wants. Now, whether the market trades in futures or they prefer to trade in options is choice of market participants. Our job is to provide that platform and a wider variety of choices.
Got it, sir. And lastly, your margin in the crude still remains at 33%, right? It has not changed. Initial margin, I mean, sir. Mm-hmm.
It is around that level.
Okay. Okay, okay, sir. That's it from my end. Thank you.
Thank you. Last question is from the line of Chintan Sheth from Girik Capital. Please go ahead.
Yes, thank you for the follow-up. The question I had was on the participation side, in the presentation itself, we are seeing, you know, client trading percentage in the options has been on a decline. So this quarter is around 43%, let's say, pre-quarter that it used to be above 50%, on the option side. Anything to read into it, whether it is driven by, you know, involvement of FPI coming in? That is also, I think, reducing the clients trading percentage. So anything you want to point out, sir?
No, there is nothing specific to point out. We still have a very healthy ratio. So in the Q2 of FY 2023-2024, it was around 47%, now it's 43.5%.
Right. Right.
Having said that, the overall volumes are growing and the overall client percentage is... While the percentage has gone down, but the overall volume of clients has also gone up. So as long as that continues to grow in every segment and every participant segment continues to grow, I don't think there is anything much to read in it.
Yeah. So just to add to what Rishi has said, in a growing market, I think we should not be really worried about the percentages. In fact, overall markets, you can see that growth is happening. Of course-
Mm-hmm.
There is no significant change that is happening in terms of trading clients percentage.
And also that the overall number of clients is going up, so that is also something we have to address.
That is interesting, that the number of customers are also growing, but the percentage is declining. That is, that was the observation I was coming to. It should ideally, with the increasing participation-
Growing volume. So I'm saying it is a growing volume, right? In a growing volume-
Right.
I say that all the things will move on.
Absolutely.
There will be here and there-
Yeah, percentages could change over quarters from one segment to another and back, right?
I agree. I agree. Okay, got it. And on the cash side, if you can, you know, just point out that the total cash we are currently cash and investments, free investments, which we are holding, and you mentioned board is, you know, aware about it. But anything in terms of where are we in terms of what will be the utilization of the same? What should one expect over the course of the year?
See, cash utilization, I already had responded earlier that,
Mm-hmm.
The board will take a call on what is to be used first.
Right.
But the cash is retained for business growth, investments in infrastructure, IT systems, and development of new software. Also for having, maintaining some capital to unforeseen circumstances and buffers.
How much we are planning to, you know, do the CapEx on the infra side this year? And what is the current cash balance?
Not a significant increase in CapEx, but in near future there could be some further investments.
Okay. And how much cash we are currently, cash and investments we have on the balance sheet date?
Around INR 1,000 crores.
Thousand crores. Including investments, it should be around, more than that, right? Those are the investments-
Talking about the surplus cash, not the investment in associates and subsidiaries.
Okay, surplus cash is thousand. Okay, got it. Thank you.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question for today. We have reached the end of our Q&A session. I would now like to hand the conference over to Mr. Manoj Jain for closing comments.
Thank you, Daryl. Once again, our heartfelt gratitude to all our stakeholders, regulators, participants, and our analysts for your continued attention, feedback, and encouragement. We continue to grow and add value together. Thank you. Thank you very much.
Thank you. On behalf of Multi Commodity Exchange of India Limited, that concludes this conference. Thanks for joining us. You may now disconnect your lines.