Good day, ladies and gentlemen, and welcome to the Q2 FY23 earnings conference call of NTPC Limited, hosted by ICICI Securities. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Rahul Modi from ICICI Securities Limited. Thank you, and over to you, Mr. Modi.
Thank you, Michelle. On behalf of ICICI Securities, I welcome you all to the Q2 FY23 earnings conference call of NTPC. We have with us the senior management of NTPC, represented by Mr. Jaikumar Srinivasan, Director Finance, Mr. Dilip Kumar Patel, Director Human Resources, Mr. Ramesh Babu V., Director Operations, Mr. Chandan Kumar Mondal, Director Commercial, Mr. Ujjwal Kanti Bhattacharya, Director Projects. With this, I would like to hand over the call to Mr. Srinivasan for his opening remarks, and then we can have a Q&A session. Thank you for your time, sir. Over to you.
Thank you. A very good evening to all the participants. I, Jaikumar Srinivasan, Director Finance, welcome all of you to the Q2 FY 23 conference call of NTPC Limited. I have with me Shri Dilip Kumar Patel, Director Human Resources, Shri Ramesh Babu V., Director Operations, Shri Chandan Kumar Mondal, Director Commercial, and Shri Ujjwal Kanti Bhattacharya, Director Projects. I also have with me other key members of the NTPC team. Today, the company has announced the unaudited financial results of our quarter Q2 financial year 23, along with half year results for financial year 23. The key performance highlights for the quarter and the half year ended 30th September 2022 have already been disclosed on both the stock exchanges. NTPC has completed yet another remarkable quarter with a very strong operational and financial performance. We have made significant progress on various strategic initiatives, including renewables.
The operational highlights of Q2 and H1 financial year 2023 are as under. During H1 financial year 2023, NTPC has added 1,952 MW commercial capacity to its portfolio, out of which a capacity of 672 MW was added from renewable resources. As on 30 September 2022, the commercial capacity of NTPC stands at 57,639 MW on standalone basis and 70,254 MW for the group as a whole. NTPC group generated 204 billion units in H1 financial year 2023 as compared to 177 billion units in H1 of financial year 2022, an increase of around 15%. NTPC standalone gross generation in H1 financial year 2023 is 176 billion units as compared to 151 billion units in the corresponding previous period, registering an increase of around 16%.
During H1 financial year 2023, PLF of coal stations of NTPC was 77.27% as against the national average of 64.46%, thereby maintaining a spread of about 12% over the national average. For H1 financial year 2023, 4 coal stations of NTPC group, which are Rihand, Singrauli, Bhilai, and Talcher were among the top 10 performing stations in the country in terms of PLF. During H1 financial year 2023, there has been lesser generation due to grid restrictions and fuel supply of 40 billion units and 2 billion units respectively, as against 52 billion units and 3.19 billion units in the corresponding period of the previous year.
As regards the status of fuel supply, during H1 financial year 2023, materialization of coal against annual contracted quantity was 99.93% as against 96.04% in the corresponding previous period. Coal supply during H1 financial year 2023 was 112 million metric tons, including 10 MMT of imported coal. The coal supply during the corresponding previous period was 92.86 MMT, including 0.88 MMT of imported coal. NTPC has registered highest ever coal production of 8.76 MMT in H1 financial year 2023, with growth of over 58% as against 5.54 MMT in H1 financial year 2022. Coal production from Chatti-Bariatu mines has started from 29 September 2022.
Cumulative expenditure of INR 8,527.06 crores has been incurred on the development of coal mines till thirtieth September two thousand twenty-two. Now I will update on various other financial activities. Total income for Q2 financial year 2023 is INR 41,810.96 crores as against corresponding quarter of previous year total income of INR 30,305.83 crores, registering an increase of 37.96%. On half yearly basis, there is an increase of 41.93% in the total income. That is from INR 58,153.09 crores in H1 financial year 2022 to INR 82,536.60 crores.
Profit after tax for Q2 financial year 2023 is INR 3,331.20 crores as against INR 3,156.74 crores in the corresponding quarter of previous year. On half year basis, PAT is INR 7,048.16 crores as against INR 6,417.66 crores in the H1 financial year 2022, registering an increase of 9.82%. Total income of the group for H1 financial year 2023 is INR 88,242.22 crores as against corresponding previous period total income of INR 63,486.27 crores, registering an increase of 39%.
PAT for the group for H1 financial year 2023 is INR 7,395.44 crores as against corresponding previous period PAT of INR 7,134.67 crores, registering an increase of 3.65%. During H1 financial year 2023, our subsidiaries have earned profit of INR 867.65 crores as compared to INR 790.14 crores in the corresponding period of previous years, registering an increase of 9.81%. NTPC's share of profit in JVs has decreased from INR 526.45 crores in H1 financial year 2022 to INR 120.57 crores in H1 financial year 2023.
During H1 financial year 2023, we have accounted dividend income of INR 640.94 crores from our subsidiaries and joint venture companies, as against INR 613.46 crores received during H1 financial year 2022. The regulated equity as on 30 September 2022 was INR 74,865.53 crores for NTPC on standalone basis. As regards fund mobilization, in the current financial year, NTPC has signed term loan agreement of INR 2,000 crores, INR 1,000 crores, and INR 2,000 crores with HDFC Bank, UCO Bank, and Bank of Baroda respectively, totaling INR 5,000 crores.
NTPC has issued bonds aggregating to INR 3,500 crores during H1 financial year 2023, INR 1,500 crores at the rate of 5.78% per annum on 29th April 2022 for a period of 2 years, and INR 2,000 crores at the rate of 7.44% interest rate on 25th August 2022 for a period of 10 years. Average cost of borrowing as on H1 financial year 2023 is 6.22% as compared to 5.96% in H1 financial year 2022. Moving on to CapEx. In H1 financial year 2023, we have incurred a group CapEx of INR 16,664.19 crores as compared to INR 15,137.67 crores in the corresponding previous period.
The capital outlay of NTPC standalone has been estimated at INR 22,454 crore for the financial year 2023. Further to list few other highlights. NTPC Group has a strong commitment towards renewable energy. NTPC has diversified into producing energy through cleaner and greener sources such as hydro, wind, and solar. Company has also forayed into a variety of business areas, including fuel cells, e-mobility, green hydrogen solution, and waste to energy. NTPC Group has already commissioned 2,524 MW of RE projects under EPC mode till the end of the second quarter. Presently, 5,348 MW of RE projects, including ongoing projects of NTPC REL, are under construction. Further bids for 650 MW have been won, which will be awarded soon.
NTPC is well on the way for development of solar park of 4.75 gigawatt in Gujarat. Further plans for development of another 21 gigawatt ultra mega renewable energy park is in various stages. NTPC's wholly owned subsidiary, which is NTPC Renewable Energy Limited, has incorporated Green Valley Renewable Energy Limited as its subsidiary in a 51-49 joint venture with DVC. The main object of the company is to develop, operate, and maintain renewable energy park and projects in reservoirs and land owned by DVC. NTPC has acquired 50% share in Jhabua Power Limited, JPL, through corporate insolvency resolution process. JPL, located in Seoni, Madhya Pradesh, has an operational capacity of 600 megawatt. This is the first acquisition of power assets for NTPC through the CIRP route, a step forward in accomplishing NTPC's long-term capacity addition targets.
Under the scheme of amalgamation, merger of Kanti Bijlee Utpadan Nigam Limited and Nabinagar Power Generating Company Limited, wholly owned subsidiary of NTPC, was effected by MCA order dated 26th August 2022 after being approved by shareholders and unsecured creditors in line with the order of Ministry of Corporate Affairs, dated 20th January 2022. NTPC and Indian Oil Corporation Limited signed a non-binding agreement for proposed formation of a joint venture company for meeting the power requirement of new projects of Indian oil refineries. Going forward, NTPC proposes to form a JV company between its subsidiaries, NTPC Green Energy Limited and IOCL, for supply of RE RTC power to IOCL. Among the several MOUs signed by NTPC and its subsidiaries, a few are being highlighted here.
NTPC Renewable Energy Limited has signed an MoU with Government of Rajasthan for development of 10 gigawatt ultra-mega renewable energy power parks in Rajasthan. NTPC REL has signed a MoU with National Fertilizers Limited to collaborate in the field of renewable energy green chemicals, and mutually explore possibilities of supply of 90 megawatts RE RTC power in phases, and synthesizing 50 TPD green ammonia for captive use for production of industrial products by NFL. This is the first of its kind novel initiative by two leading CPSEs to support the country's commitment to achieving renewable energy targets and reduce greenhouse emissions. This comes in the backdrop of NTPC announcing its green hydrogen initiative and plan to build the country's first pilot project for synthesizing green methanol, setting up green hydrogen filling stations, green hydrogen blending in PNG and green energy storage projects.
NTPC has signed a MoU with GE Gas Power, Mitsubishi Heavy Industries Limited, and Siemens severally to demonstrate feasibility of hydrogen co-firing blended with natural gas and gas turbines installed at various NTPC gas plants. Under the significant collaboration, the companies will jointly explore the pathways to reduce CO₂ emissions from gas power plants. NTPC signed a MoU with Moroccan Agency for Sustainable Energy for cooperation in the renewable energy sector. The purpose of this MoU is to outline the framework for general understanding between the parties regarding their mutual interests and their assessment of cooperation opportunities in RE sector. A MoU has been signed between NTPC and Rajasthan State Mines and Minerals Limited for supply of high purity limestone for FGD plants of NTPC stations.
NTPC has signed an MoU with National Sports Development Fund and Ministry of Youth Affairs and Sports for the development of archery in India, with an aim to provide world-class facilities with international exposures and platform to the talented pool of Indian archers. NVVN, our trading subsidiary, transacted 15.25 billion units during the H1 financial year 2023, as against 11.98 billion units during the H1 financial year 2022, registering growth of around 27%. NTPC has been bestowed with the Dun & Bradstreet Infra Award 2022 for excellence in power generation. NTPC has been recognized as one of the Most Preferred Workplaces of 2022 in the premier edition of the Most Preferred Workplace 2022 organized by Team Marksmen in association with India Today.
Besides, NTPC has won several awards in safety, CSR, quality and environmental categories. These were some of the key highlights I wanted to share with all the participants in this con call before we begin the questions and answers. Thank you so much.
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchtone phone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Mohit Kumar from DAM Capital Advisors . Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good evening, sir, and thanks for the opportunity. My first question is on the interest cost and late payment surcharge. I think you've accounted roughly 3.9 billion in the interest cost related to the electricity late payment surcharge rules. Can you please explain how much is the amount which is being availed in this scheme and how we have done the accounting, and is it one-time charge? The finance cost has been restated for last three, four financial year and last quarter.
Late payment surcharge, we have booked around INR 392 crore. This you are mentioning or you are talking about the discount?
Yes. Is this a one-time charge and why it has been done?
No, there are two different things. One is the surcharge which we are levying periodically. The other thing is we have booked a finance charge as a one-time. Which one are you referring to?
Sir, referring to the one-time charge which you have booked. Can you please explain it? Yeah.
One time charge. There is a scheme for, you know, restructuring the loans, outstanding loans. Installment has been given to many of our beneficiaries for different tenure, maximum being 48 months. This installment will be paid, and since there is no further LPS if they pay this on time. From a time value of money perspective, we have calculated the present value and accounted the differential as a financial charge.
This is a one-time charge. Am I right?
Yeah. Yes, that's right.
Secondly on this. What is the status of renewables monetization? Are you on course to meet the guidance that will do the monetization by FY 2023?
See, broadly at 2,861 MW of, you know, renewable capacity has been identified for monetization, existing assets. Broadly this has a book value of over INR 10,000 crores. We propose to offload some, anything between 10%-20%. We are in the process, but we expect that by the close of Q3 or in any case, before the end of the year, we'll be able to conclude this transaction.
Sir, if I understood correctly, we are not selling a stake in NTPC Green. We are selling a stake in only this identified 2x600 MW. Is that understanding correct?
This is CK Mondal, Director Commercial. Actually, we are transferring our existing RE assets to a separate company that is NTPC Green Energy Limited. Our existing NTPC RE and the NTPC REL will be also under that company. We are offloading some 10%-20% stake in NGEL. It is not corresponding to the particular asset. It will be-
Understood.
Stand corrected to that extent.
We expect to monetize by the Q3. Is that right?
Our plan is there. It is scheduled to be by December, maybe some plus minus for some date, maybe December or January to come.
Understood. Thank you and all the best. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Anuj Upadhyay from HDFC Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, thanks for the opportunity. Sir, in the opening remarks you mentioned that the profit from your JV has declined to somewhere around INR 120-odd crores compared to INR 526 crore on a year-on-year basis. Any reason for this non-performance, sir?
The decline is broadly from one or two subsidiaries, the Meja Urja Nigam Private Limited and Hindustan Urvarak & Rasayan Limited .
Okay. Why is this so, sir? I mean, the reason for the decline.
See, for the Meja plant, we had an issue with the boiler, so we had to take the boiler and shut down for around five months and repair it. Now the boiler is back in service. We'll be able to recover substantial amount of this AFC from the remaining days.
Okay. Secondly, can you just mention about the capacity which you plan to add for FY 2023, 2024 and if possible 2025 as well, and the bifurcation among the projects. It will be very helpful.
The capacity addition plan that we have for the year 2023-24 is around 7,000 megawatts.
Combined, right?
Combined.
Okay.
This includes Telangana or North Karanpura. These are the coal capacity being developed by NTPC directly. THDC Khurja project, which is our subsidiary, one unit. THDC hydro pump storage in Tehri, 1,000 MW. NTPC REL solar, 2.95 MW. NTPC directly solar, around 1,000 MW. For 2024-25, we are aspiring to add another 6,000 MW, out of which 1,180 will be NTPC directly, which includes North Karanpura last unit, Tapovan Vishnugad hydro projects. Patratu II, one unit. Patratu II second unit also will come. THDC thermal Khurja second project. THDC Tapovan Vishnugad Pipalkoti project. NTPC REL solar around 1,300-1,400.
Okay. Overall we are planning to add 13 gigawatts over FY 23, 24, 25, right, sir?
Yes.
Yes, 23, 20-
Three years.
Three years.
Current year, we are targeting around 5,000 megawatts of capacity addition. If you take the current year and 2023, 2024, 2025 taken together, it will be around 18 gigawatts.
Got it, sir. 18 gigawatts over the next three years. Fine, sir. You mentioned, sir, there is around 21 gigawatts of renewable capacity which is under various stages of planning or development. This includes the 10 gigawatts you mentioned about Rajasthan, right, sir?
Rajasthan you were talking, sir? Yeah, yeah. Out of the 21 GW of Khavda and renewable parks, 10 GW are in Rajasthan.
One in Rajasthan. Okay. It excludes the 4.5 GW in Khavda project.
Yeah. This is in addition to 4.5 Khavda MP.
All right. Any timelines, sir, for Khavda? I mean, how the progress is being going on over there? By when we are expecting the bidding to begin?
We have already started work on about 1,255 megawatts. We have awarded the packages for the balance of systems. We've already started work there. We've also started work on the park side. We hope to proceed further with more capacity awards within this year. Balance we hope to award within the next year.
One clarification, sir. What I had understood is probably this entire Khavda project will go for a bidding, and it won't be directly on an allotment basis. This 1,255-megawatt you are saying, is this something which we have won under the bidding scheme or it was directly been allotted to us as a park developer scheme?
No. No, no. I think your understanding is not right. This entire capacity has been allocated to NTPC Renewable Energy Limited, and we shall be developing the entire capacity on our own. There's not going to be any bidding there.
Is this applicable for all the companies, sir, who had participated over there in Khavda? I guess it was, we had GIPCL, we had Adani, and some other PSUs as well.
That is a choice they have to make. I can only talk about our company.
Okay. Fair enough, sir. Thanks for the opportunity.
Thank you. Before we take the next question, a reminder to all the participants, anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchtone phone now. The next question is from the line of Rahul Modi from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Thank you, sir, for a detailed discussion so far. Sir, a couple of questions that I had. Now, the regulated equity has gone up quite substantially due to the inclusion of the two subsidy projects in the standalone books. Can you help us with reconciling the profit numbers as, you know, obviously the growth seems to be a bit muted. Partly that can be understood due to the reduction in the other income, I believe in the late payment surcharge. Sir, what are the other aspects which probably we need to look at to reconcile? Because the growth in the regulated equity has been quite significant. Is there any adjustments which is happening due to the projects?
Mr. Modi, your voice broke in the end. Can you please repeat your last line?
Yes. Is it audible now?
Please proceed.
Yeah. Just completing my point, is it due to the merger of the two projects within the standalone, any adjustments that we need to pay attention to? Thank you.
Yeah, there are one or two reasons. I mean, if you want to see the peculiar aspects during the quarter, one is, as I mentioned, that this is a financial charge which we had for the discounting of receivables. That is one aspect. There'll be some tax aspects of merger close to around INR 190 crores. So this would be the peculiar items.
Of course. INR 190 crores?
Of course, you know, the other income is gradually on the lower part because of, you know, better payment trends from the DISCOMs.
Sure, sir. Can you just throw some light on the deferred tax assets? You know, because how much of this is pertaining to the renewable assets which probably gets normalized over the course of the year, apart from the regulated business?
Maybe we can provide this information to you separately.
Sure, sir. Thank you.
Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Aniket Mittal from SBI Mutual Fund. Please go ahead.
Yes, sir. A few questions actually on the solar front. If I remember correctly, for execution of the solar projects, we were talking earlier that we would procure the modules ourselves and then do the balance of system works with the other players. Just wanted to understand, on that front, what are we currently doing in terms of executing this? Are we
Are we looking to procure the modules ourselves and heading in that direction?
Yeah, Niket, we are doing that only. We have broken up the project into packages. One package is the balance of system, and we have already awarded that for Bikaner project. The modules will be procured separately.
Fair. In this balance of system that you're providing, are these fixed price contracts to the EPC players?
Yes, these are fixed price contracts.
Okay. In some of the earlier packages that you would have awarded to the EPC contractors, given the increase in module prices that's happened, are there any renegotiations that have happened?
No, they cannot happen because, in all these projects, the tariff which we have bid at, those are also not open to negotiation. There cannot be any negotiation of these at all.
Okay. Fair. Just another aspect. All right. Understood. Just another aspect that I wanted to understand on the new energy space. There are a couple of tenders that we've come out with on the battery storage solutions. I think we came out with a large 3,000 MWh tender, and there's another 500 MW tender. I just wanted to understand the rationale for this, and what is it that you are trying to use these battery storage for?
The one tender which we have come out for is a 3,000 megawatt hour energy storage tender. That's agnostic to the type of storage. It can be battery or pump storage or any other storage. That is mainly required for the C&I customers. We are in discussions with to tie up supply of power on long-term basis. That's primarily for that. The 500 megawatt battery one, we are actually trying to look at the SECI tender, which is now done. We understand there are other storage tenders in the pipeline by SECI, so we might look at that. That's the rationale.
Okay. The 3,000 mega-
Sir, sorry to interrupt. Sir, on the management line, I would request you to come closer to the Polycom and speak, please. Kindly proceed.
Yes. This 3,000 megawatt tender is something that you will tie up with other discounts, is it?
No, no. What I said was that this was for, mainly for supply to C&I customers-
Okay.
with whom we are in discussions.
Okay. Fair. Just one last question. On this, you know, one-time charge that you've taken, related to these, the late payment surcharge rule that's come up, could you just elaborate, A, what is the total quantum of charge that's been taken? And B, how have you accounted it for both in the balance sheet and the P&L?
Just a second. The amount of receivables which we have put to this scheme is around INR 6,108 crores. This has various maturities. Some of them will be a 48-month horizon, some will be 36, depending on the quantum. This is eligible on a step-up manner, depending on the number of days of this. Accordingly, we have worked out the present value and accounted for the differential.
Okay. What's the differential that you've accounted for?
Three hundred and thirty-three crores.
Okay. Are there any other further receivables that can go under the schemes that will require us to again reevaluate?
No, the scheme was effectively open for a limited period, and whoever had subscribed to that has been taken into this scheme. We don't anticipate any further increase in this amount.
Okay. Those were my questions. Thank you.
Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Apurva Bahadur from Investec. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. Sir, couple of questions. Firstly, if you could share the fixed cost under recovery late payment surcharge and the PLF incentive numbers for the quarter, that'd be very helpful.
See, the fixed cost under recovery for the half year is INR 718 crores. However, I may just add that, this is a transient figure because, you know, ultimately the evaluation of your allowance and disallowance is done on an annual basis. This is a target availability declared capacity on an annualized basis. It doesn't follow an even trend, depending on the, you know, the operational level of Q2. We stand here, but, as we go ahead, this will be further mitigated.
Sir, what would be your expectation by year-end? To what level should we hit?
Ar-around two hundred and fifty crores.
Sir, I assume the late payment charges will be very low this quarter, less than INR 100 crores.
For the quarter, it was 229 crore.
Okay. Sir, again, coming back to, I think, the previous questions on this one-time charge that we have taken, for this LPS scheme. Now, sir, wanted to understand the impact of this for future quarters. Does this mean that the entire cost of the EMI which we are going to bear, we have taken a one-time upfront charge, and going ahead, we should not account for the incremental finance cost on this? Essentially our finance cost in future quarters will be lower?
See, it is a one-time, you know, discounted differential, which we have calculated due to the, you know, time value difference. However, as we go ahead and we start getting the money, this will be unwound.
Okay. Makes sense. Sir, also, I think on this question of this EPC contract that we have given for executing our renewable projects, I think one of the large contractors recently stated that there have been certain deferments in large projects because the module costs were quite high, right? I think last time on our call, we had discussed that some of our projects will be delayed by a couple of months. Has there been any further deferments on that?
Yeah. Actually, I believe many of the people have approached the government for giving more time, particularly because of the very high module prices which everyone is facing. What we understand is that the government is considering some kind of a 12-month time extension in all without any condition. This is what we have heard. There is no document as yet as such, so I'll not say that it's going to happen or not going to happen. Definitely there is some relief being sought from the government because people are otherwise not in a position to do the projects and also face up to the LD.
Fair enough, sir. Sir, one more question, I think, on this renewable monetization that we are still currently undertaking. You highlighted that we intend to sell stake in this NTPC Green, which will house our renewable projects. Wanted to know for other new energy initiatives, like what we are doing on hydrogen or storage, is that also a part of this overall portfolio which is under discussion, or is it purely for the renewable projects that we are currently looking to offload the stake?
Look, NTPC Green ultimately will become a holdco, the green vehicle under NTPC. For example, the NTPC Renewable Energy Limited, which is currently our vehicle which we are using for bidding in all these projects, that will also come under NTPC Green. The NTPC Green will be housing some projects on its balance sheet and some through subsidiaries and JVs. That's how NTPC Green works.
Okay. The entire portfolio will be monetized basically.
No, the portfolio will be monetized as NTPC Green.
Yeah, yeah.
All this hydrogen and storage and all will also come under NTPC Green, either through subsidiary or project.
Fair enough, sir. Sir, last questions, if I may, and this is more so on the bookkeeping side. I missed our CapEx numbers for H1 FY23, and if you can also share for 23, 24 and 25 guidance, that will be very helpful, sir.
On the CapEx side, as the finance has already informed, we have reached already 16,600 crore already. Our target this year is of the order of around 27,500 crore. Right? For next year, we are on the drawing board because some of the new projects are being added from the solar side. I can give you a flavor that NTPC standalone plus NTPC group company, the CapEx next year will also be of the order of 25,000 crore- 26,000 crore, taken together.
Sir, similar number for 25 as well? Yeah.
Yeah. For year after that, as I told, that our capacity addition plan is more or less of the same nature, and we'll be adding progressively a bit more of renewable. The CapEx side, the cost, total amount might slightly come down, but we'll be maintaining anything beyond 20,000 year on year in the foreseeable future. Additionally, we are going to add new coal capacity. You must be knowing that we have already awarded Talcher Thermal Power Station 2x660 MW. This itself will be around 10,000 crore project. We are going to award another three-four projects very soon. So that will bring a lot of CapEx into NTPC CapEx expenditure, timeline-wise. These projects will be completed by 2028-2029.
If I take up the order of, say, for 40,000-50,000 crore expenditure for these coal power projects, then from 2025-2029, 2030, we can simply add around 15,000, 12,000 crore per year on the coal power project, total cost-wise. Right?
Sir, can you please share some details on these three-four projects, what, which ones and what capacity, and by when will these be awarded?
See Talcher 2x660 MW, we have already awarded to BHEL last month.
Yes, sir.
Next, in our target, we are going to come with NIT for Lara expansion, which will be 2 x 800 MW. We are working on three other projects which are at different stages of planning and development. One is Sipat, 1 x 800 MW. Second is Singrauli, 2 x 800 MW. Third is Darlipali , 1 x 800 MW.
Sir, I assume these will be awarded by FY 2024?
Father, sorry to interrupt. I would request you to please rejoin.
Sure, sure. Thank you.
Thank you so much. We have the next question from the line of Nikhil Abhyankar from DAM Capital Advisors . Please go ahead.
Hi. Thank you, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. Just to add to the previous question, sir, you have just mentioned that we have Lara 600 MW and 2,400 and around 3.2 GW, three other projects. Can you just give us a timeline of the ordering for these projects year-wise? Say FY 2023, we have already done one. Will we have anything else in 2024, 2025 and so on?
See, Lara, our target is to award by March 2023.
Okay.
Our Sipat will be, you can say within Q2 of the next financial year, that is FY 2024. Singrauli and Sipat, both will come in the FY 2025.
Darlipali will come when?
Darlipali, there are some forest land issues which we are settling and once we settle, we may bring it to FY 2024 itself, if we can get the forest clearances. Otherwise, it will go to FY 2025.
Currently, coal capacity addition plan that we have in pipeline is 4.8 gigawatts. Am I right?
That is already decided by us.
Okay. Is there any chance that more such projects will be added?
See, we are going by the requirement of the country and Government of India suggestions, and we have been told by the Government of India, which we discussed earlier also, of the order of 7,000 plus.
Okay.
660-megawatt. We have identified many other projects. As we told during our investors conference in Bombay, each of our existing projects has an expansion capacity. Adding 660 megawatt here or there can be possible. Large projects like Meja, for example, two into 660 megawatt is possible. Then Telangana, three into 800 megawatt is possible. We are working on this from various points of view, like coal availability, environment clearance, actual requirement in the grid. We are a bit cautious, but we are steadily moving.
Understood, sir. Sir, also, can you just throw some light on the acquisition of Jhabua through NCLT? Like, do we have any power tie-up already there?
I'll request the commercial to speak on that. Jhabua.
Yeah. Jhabua, we have acquired along with the lender, and we are having 50% stake on that. Already, most of the power is tied up, and some power is being under the waterfall, we are selling in the market.
Sir, can you also just, you earlier mentioned there were the associate companies. Can you just quantify those losses? Hindustan Urvarak & Rasayan Limited and for Meja.
Losses. I think HURL. I don't have the data in front of me. I can hazard a guess, it is of the order of 700 crore- 750 crore losses they have posted.
Okay.
If we consider our 30% holding, then the loss is on the books of the HURL, not on NTPC. If you ask for the reasons, he asking for me. The primary reason is that HURL, we have already commissioned the first unit, that is at Gorakhpur, first project rather, out of the three projects which are being developed. Each of the projects, Gorakhpur, Barauni and Sindri, having a capacity of 12.6 lakh metric ton capacity, right?
Mm-hmm.
Gorakhpur has come on stream on third May 2022. There are initial stabilization problem, and there are some leakages in ammonia tank, other things which has been set right. We could achieve only 37% of the capacity till September 2022. The good news is that's the reason why it has gone of the order of 715 crore of losses. In October, our full capacity is 1.05, and we have already reached. We have bounced back, and if we can continue with the production in at this rate, I think in this current year itself, we'll be making it almost zero. Additionally, on the horizon, the Barauni will be commissioned sometime in December.
We are looking for the MC of Barauni maybe by 15th of November, and MC of Sindri by, say, 15th of December. If that happens, then Barauni will come on stream as commercial sometime by 31st of December and Sindri by 31st of January. Hopefully with initial teething problems, within this financial year, next financial year will be very good for HURL.
Understood. Thanks a lot, and all the best.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, in order to ensure that the management will be able to answer questions from all participants, please limit your questions to two per participant. Should you have a follow-up question, please rejoin the queue. Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Atul Tiwari from Citigroup. Please go ahead.
Yes, sir. Thanks a lot for the opportunity. Just one question on the average realizations that has been disclosed at about 4.7 or so. There has been a very sharp increase of about INR 0.85-INR 0.90 over the past six months. Any particular reason for that? I mean.
Atul, I'm sorry to interrupt. We are not able to hear you properly.
Hello.
Can you please use your handset?
Sir, my question is on the average realizations which have been disclosed. There has been a very sharp increase over the past six-seven months in the average realization. Is it all driven by imported coal or is there any other reason to it? And what is the proportion of imported coal that is being used?
Wait. What is it? Sales you are telling or realization?
Realization.
Yeah. Realization, I mean, there is no linkage between realization and imported coal. Imported coal, duty imported coal sales have increased definitely. But as far as realization is concerned, we are, we realize 100%.
Sir, average tariff as disclosed in Item G in the key metrics that you disclosed for the first half is 4.77, and last year it was 3.86. There is a jump of about INR 0.91.
Understood. It is all because of this imported coal.
Okay. What proportion of the coal used is imported coal in this period?
We are blending around 7.9% in the first year. We are blending.
In the first year. Okay, and that is likely to continue for some time, or that is coming off with the improvement in the availability?
Right now, right as of today, the blending is only 3%.
Okay. These tariffs will come up. Sir, my second question is on the Talcher order.
As the domestic coal situation increases.
Okay.
The blending proportion will gradually come down. In this quarter three, the coals received will be more, so therefore the blending requirement will come down. Hopefully there should not be much of blending in the remaining half year.
Okay. Sir, my second question is on the Talcher project, now that the order has been given. What is the size of the order? Could you give some idea about when we can expect the commissioning of the project? What are the timelines of execution?
The size of the order as given to BHEL with GST is of the order of 8,200 crore. I don't exactly have the number. 8,200 crore, huh? Is it? Anyway, this is to be commissioned the first unit in 48 months from the date of award, and second units within 6 months thereafter.
Okay.
If you provide that 22, that means 26. 26th August, the first unit will be on stream. Within that financial year itself, 2026, 2027, the project will be completed.
Okay. 8,200 crore you said the size of the order, right?
That is the EPC.
That is the EPC.
± some INR crores. I'll give you the exact number. Aditi will give you exact number.
Okay.
This is the EPC only. We have some other element which is not part of the EPC, like the railway siding, the makeup water pump, and also ash disposal system outside the boundary. We are planning to use mine wide. Those parts are not included here, which will go for the different calls from packages and we'll award. Our estimate is the project cost will be of the order of INR 11,000 crore, including IDC and all the elements.
Okay, sir. Okay. Thank you. Thanks a lot.
Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Kriti Jain from Canara HSBC Life Insurance . Please go ahead.
Sir, with regard to this joint ventures, last year we made a profit of INR 1,000 crores. When things normalize with this major stabilizing in and this fertilizer units at HURL are getting normalized, what is the likely profit we can see a contribution from this joint venture, sir?
See, if you look at the contribution from profits of the subsidiaries, it was INR 867 crores from subsidiaries and INR 120 crores from your joint ventures.
Okay, sir.
Both put together around INR 980 crores. However, if this thing stabilizes, we expect that it will. The losses which we are seeing here to the order of around INR 300 crores, that will come down and probably they'll start making some profits. You can expect profits to go up by around INR 400-450 crores.
We will, from this INR 980 level, we can go to INR 1,500 crore run rate, sir?
Half-yearly basis, so you can, you know, double it up for a year to yearly.
Sorry, sir. Half-yearly we will see INR 500 crore increase, sir?
Sorry.
No, no, sir. On a half-yearly basis, we used to do 500 crores. That will go to INR 1,000 crores or how we should see, sir?
No, I am saying that INR 545 crore, INR 540 crore-INR 550 crore was there in quarter two, and INR 867 crore was in the half-yearly basis.
Mm-hmm.
As far as the subsidies are concerned.
Yes, sir.
However, as far as the joint venture is concerned, which used to be, has come down.
I'm sorry to interrupt you. There was a slight disturbance on the line with the static. Can you please repeat the last sentence?
Yeah. No, around 1,377 crores was the profit from subsidiaries for the last year, full financial year 2021-2022, and another 1,000 crores was from the joint ventures. With these things stabilizing, we are expecting that there will be an some 500 crores increase in the profits.
Sure, sir. Sir, my second question is with regard to this late payments scheme getting implemented with DISCOMs not allowed to have overdues. How will our receivable shape up and also like, sir, with regard to the long-term receivables, how much rundown will happen yearly basis, can you guide, sir?
Sir, I think we have securitized INR 6,100 crore and monthly we are getting an installment of INR 218 crore every month.
Okay. Sir, going forward.
Regularly we are receiving that.
Okay. Sir, going forward our receivable days will be in the vicinity of 50 days, 60 days, sir? Or how it will be?
It will be less than that. It will be less than 45 days.
Sure. Thanks, sir. Thanks a lot, sir.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, this would be the last question for today, which is from the line of K.P.N. Vijay Kumar from Spark Capital. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good evening, sir. What is the portfolio size in terms of gigawatt that would be monetized by December that you mentioned at the NGEL level?
Can I repeat your question?
Gigawatt to monetize NGEL.
What is the portfolio size of renewable projects in gigawatts that would be monetized?
No, it is not dependent on the portfolio. It will be. We are basically diluting the equity. Entire RE assets will be NTPC Green Energy Limited. Even NTPC REL, NGEL also will be under this company. We are diluting the stake of NGEL to the extent of maximum 20%.
Sure. Given there would be inclusion of hydrogen, the storage projects, et cetera, et cetera.
Yeah. All grid portfolio will be under this, sir.
Instead of a monetization of specific asset, it is a stake sale in the green energy company.
Correct. The question is what is the size of portfolio considered when valuing for this stake sale?
NGEL is NTPC plan to add 60 gigawatts by 2030. This is that way you can say. Right now I think we are having only operating unit. How much is 2,000?
Currently what we're looking at is that we'll transfer 2,800-odd MW of capacity and it also comes from NTPC Renewables, which is working on close to another 4,000 MW. That's the number which we are looking at immediately if that's the question. I have already mentioned earlier, our entire green portfolio of NTPC on a long-term basis will now be consolidated under NTPC Green. That is a 60 GW number by 2030.
Correct, sir. My only question is if the valuation includes the existing operational portfolio of about, say, two + seven or eight.
Yeah.
That will give a different value. While if you have a valuation for 60 gigawatt, that will give a different value for the equity investor. That is why I was trying to understand what would be that size that the equity investor is looking at.
Usually that's something which I cannot be debating with you in any case. That's for the potential investors to decide. What we are showcasing to them through the VDR is a separate issue, and probably it's not right for me to discuss all those details here.
Sure. That detail would be out after this deal is over by December?
Let's see. Let the deal happen first.
Okay. That's it from my side. Thank you and all the best, sir.
Thank you. Sir, we have two more participants who are waiting in the queue. Can we take those questions?
Of course.
Okay. We have the next question from the line of Anupam Goswami from B&K Securities. Please go ahead.
Hi. Hi, sir. My first question is on the monetization of this. Right now we have about 2.8 gigawatts that we... It includes, you know, the potential work that is going on in the hydro and STO, and the storage, and on the battery level. Is it very prudent to, you know, to dilute about 20% right now, rather than, you know, having a little significant portion of the work done and then going for it? Because the valuation can vary accordingly. What is the thought process behind this? What? Why was the monetization needed so early?
Well, we have a mandate from Government of India to go for monetization. We are going for monetization. As far as the quantum of monetization is concerned, we plan to go up to 20%. It may be less, but there is a maximum ceiling of 20%. It will all depend on what is the valuation we are getting from the prospective investors. Based on that, we will decide the extent which we will proceed.
Okay.
The quantum what we will offer has also got to do with, I mean, how much is the interest that the prospective investor will invest. We'll take a call on that as we go ahead. Also let me chip in. You have a very interesting question you have raised there, which is a very strategic question. The issue is whether we disinvest 10% or 15%, the future projects will be developed for which he is also going to invest money, not me alone. His valuation in future will take care of that investment, which he is in any case investing, apart from the upside that is projected. That's why we have already indicated 60 gigawatt as our aspirational portfolio. I think that gives the reason for us to look for 10%-20%.
Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Kondina Nimmagadda from J.P. Morgan. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. Just one question from my end. If I look at the under-recovery number you quoted around INR 700 crore, it was around INR 400 crore, if I remember correctly, in June. Just trying to understand what led to this increase per se, and what is the quantum of fuel cost under-recovery, if any, within this.
See, the increase is because of some of the units that we have taken for overhauling. Due to the increased work, the overall duration has increased. Going forward, as our director of finance has said, by the end of the year, most of this will be recovered. The projected under-recovery by the end of the year is only INR 250 crores. That too mainly in only four stations where we had major equipment issues. The remaining under-recovery will be recovered.
Okay. In that case, there is no fuel cost under-recovery, if my understanding is correct.
There's no fuel cost under-recovery.
sir, secondly, even if I add back this under-recovery number and look at the implied ROE, that looks quite a lot, around 13.5%-14%. How should we read that?
Please repeat your question.
Sir, I was trying to just add back the under-recovery to look at the implied core ROE. Even that number looks somewhere close to 13% or 14%. Just trying to understand how to read that number or if I'm missing something out here.
What is the question? I did not follow.
Can you please clarify, sir?
If you are adding this under-recovery to the PAT, you are getting a return of 14% on equity. This is what you are saying?
On core ROE, yeah. The core ROE number. Just trying to understand if I'm missing something out here.
Cannot be added to the PAT. Of course. See, broadly, your approach is correct, but then, you know, there will be some. There is an element of, you know, discounting which we have done. That, as we go ahead, that would be progressively be unwound.
Okay. Yeah, my part. Okay.
Thank you. As there are no further questions from the participants, I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.
Okay. Before Director Finance gives you the closing comment, let me add one news to all of you, that as you must be knowing that, on the CapEx side, we are progressing very fast. All the FGD projects are coming at different stages of completion, and we'll be investing lot in the CapEx. On the core side, we are going to add, as we have explained. We're also looking at various options in terms of, further capacity addition for which, different types of planning is on the board, including RE. That way, the CapEx is only going to shoot up, and, accordingly the future of the company is going to look brighter and brighter. DF, sir? Yeah. On behalf of the management, I thank all the participants, for this, attending this conference call and their queries.
Some of the details which we said that we can give it separately. You can feel free to call us and get those details. I also would like to thank Rahul Modi from ICICI Securities for organizing this. Thanks a lot.
Thank you. On behalf of ICICI Securities, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.