Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Manish Mahawar from Antique Stock Broking Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you, Ranny. On behalf of Antique Stock Broking, warm welcome to all the participants on the 2 Q FY 2025 earnings call of Sharda Cropchem. Today we have Mr. R. V. Bubna, Chairman and Managing Director, Mr. Shailesh Mehendale, CFO, and Mr. Jetkin Gudhka, Company Secretary on the call. Without any delay, I would like to hand over the call to Mr. Bubna for opening remarks, post which we will open the floor for Q&A. Thank you, and over to you, Mr. Bubna.
Thank you, Mr. Manish. Good afternoon, and very warm welcome to everyone present on the call. Along with me, I have Mr. Shailesh Mehendale, our CFO, and Mr. Jetkin Gudhka, Company Secretary, and SGA, our Investor Relations Advisors. Hope you all have received our investor deck by now. For those who have not, you can view them on the stock exchanges and the company website. As you are aware, we are engaged in marketing and distribution of wide range of agrochemical products, that is, herbicides, insecticides, fungicides, and biocides, catering to diverse global customer base. We prepare comprehensive dossiers, seek registration in our own name in all the countries where we intend to market our products. We allocate substantial resources to receive the registrations and thus establish our foothold in the market.
Our total product registrations stood at 2,934 as on September 30th 2024. Additionally, 1,034 applications for the product registrations globally are in the pipeline. For Q2 FY25, the total revenues have grown by 34% from INR 581 crores to INR 777 crores, with volume growth at 21% year-on-year, mainly through agrochemical segment, with Europe being key contributor. Volumes from agrochemicals grew by 25% year-on-year, whereas non-agrochemical segment degrew by 23% year-on-year. Gross margins have improved by 250 basis points to 27.6%.
For FY 2025, for H1, sorry, for H1 FY 2025, the total revenue have grown by 28% from INR 1,219 crore- INR 1,562 crore, with volume growth of approximately 30% year-on-year, mainly through agrochemical segment. Volumes from agrochemicals grew by 36% year-on-year, whereas non-agrochemical segment degrew by 31% year-on-year. Gross margins are 28.4%, which is substantially higher, mainly due to stock devaluation done in the first half of last year. We expect gross margins to improve in this financial year, with the price expected to increase.
The CapEx of H1 FY 2025 stood at INR 155 crores as compared to INR 217 crores in H1 of FY 2025, and we expect the CapEx to be in the range of INR 400 crores- INR 450 crores for the full year. With this brief overview, I would like to hand over the call to our CFO, Mr. Shailesh Mahandale, for discussing our financial performance. Thank you very much. To Shailesh.
Thank you, sir. Good afternoon, everyone. Coming to the quarter two FY2025 performance, revenues stood at INR 777 crores in Q2 FY2025 , versus INR 581 crores in quarter two FY 2024, with an increase of 34% year-on-year. Coming to the split, agrochemical business increased by 44% year-on-year to INR 634 crores, whereas the non-agrochemical business increased by 2% year-on-year to INR 143 crores. Gross margins stood at 27.6% in quarter two FY2025, as against 25.1% in quarter two FY 24, an increase of 250 basis points. EBITDA for the quarter increased by 125% to INR 85 crores, versus INR 38 crores in quarter two FY 2024, with EBITDA margin at 10.9%.
PAT stood at INR 42 crores in quarter two, FY2025, from loss of INR 28 crores in quarter two, FY2024. Coming to the H1 FY2025 performance, revenue stood at INR 1,562 crores in H1 FY2025, versus INR 1,219 crores in H1 FY2024, with an increase of 28% year-on-year. Coming to the split, agrochemical business increased by 43% year-on-year to INR 1,313 crores, whereas the non-agrochemical business decreased by 18% year-on-year to INR 249 crores. Gross margin stood at 28.4% in H1 FY2025, as against 16.5% in H1 FY2024. EBITDA for the half year period stood at INR 173 crores, with EBITDA margin at 11.1%.
PAT stood at INR 70 crore in H1 FY 2025, from a loss of INR 116 crore in H1 FY 2024. Working capital days stands at 126 days, with an improvement by 32 days as compared to as on March 31 2024. We remain net debt-free company and have cash bank liquid investment of INR 656 crore as on September 30, 2024. We can now open the floor for the questions and answers. Thank you.
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchtone phone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Viraj from SiMPL. Please go ahead, sir.
Yeah. Hi, am I audible?
Yes, sir, you are audible.
Yeah. Thank you for the opportunity and congratulations on good numbers in such a challenging environment. Just few questions. First, on the AgChem business, you know, when we talk about 25% volume growth in Q2, can you give a color of how the industry in major markets where we participate, how has the industry performed versus the volume growth we have seen in those markets? And any perspective in terms of the inventory and the demand environment, which is happening?
See, what is your good name? Because we could not hear you in the initial stages. What is your name?
My name is Viraj Kacharia.
Viraj?
Yeah.
Mr. Viraj, it is very difficult for us to give a precise comment on the industry as such, you know, because we form very small part of the industry, and we do not keep track of how the industry is doing.
Sir, but any perspective you can give, how is... Have we gained any share in any of those markets, or we have grown in line with what, broadly, the, how the market would have performed?
See, Mr. Shailesh has given you a fairly good idea about how we have grown and what have been the figures. Would you like him to repeat the same once again?
No, that is good enough. Sir, second question was, you know, if you see a 25% volume growth, and in terms of price also, we have seen a very healthy 20% pricing increase in AgChem business. And this pricing trend, even on a quarter-on-quarter basis, that seems to be sustaining. Question is, if we look at the gross margin or the spread, you know, we have seen a moderate when compared to the normal environment, where we used to do 30%-31% gross margin, we are still at 27%. Have you focused on volume and market share versus profitability? Or what explains the, you know, lower gross margin?
See, as you may be aware, our industry had passed through a very bad phase in the financial year ending March 2024, and we have not fully recovered from that big fall that we had in that year. So the prices are at the rock bottom in last year. The prices are improving and the rate of improvement is very slow. So we hope that the prices would go up, demand and supply would be able to match, and that will give us an improvement in our gross margins.
But in terms of competitive intensity, is there any change in the competitive landscape?
In terms of what?
Competitive landscape in NAFTA and Europe.
Competitive? Can you repeat your question once again, sir?
So in terms of competitive landscape, is there any change in our key markets of NAFTA and Europe?
No, there is not much change.
Okay. Just last question. See, in the AgChem business... Hello?
Yes.
See, we did a CapEx of around 155 in the full year, and we've been talking about 400-450 for the full year.
Yes.
Now, given the way we have seen an improvement in working capital and the cash level, even post this CapEx, you know, which we'll be doing, we will still be generating a good-
So the cash balance over a period will keep on building up. So any plans for the surplus cash? How do we use it?
No, we keep ourselves prepared for any upsides in the requirement of the capital in terms of working capital, credit to the customers, and also for unexpected sudden increase in the CapEx for the registration purposes.
Hello. Sorry to interrupt, sir. Mr. Viraj, may I request you to join the question queue again for follow-up questions? Okay, thank you. The next question is from the line of Bhavya Gandhi from Dalal & Broacha Stock Broking. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi. Thanks for the opportunity. Sir, can you just help me understand, because I have heard a lot of Chinese companies have started taking direct registrations in, European region. So if you can help us understand, has the competitive landscape changed?
So far, there's not much change at all, and not that, to our knowledge, maybe very small. The Chinese companies have got the registrations. The process of registration is very cumbersome, time-consuming, and requiring high capital requirement. So, so far there's not much of an impact of the Chinese companies in the market in European region.
No, I mean, sir, I mean, compared to last five years, have you seen that Chinese people are directly penetrating in Europe? That is what I wanted to understand. I understand the intensity might be low at this point.
They are making efforts.
They are making efforts.
How long will they be successful, and how much will they be able to pursue? That has to be seen.
Okay. And in the current scenario, because Chinese people are having extra supply, don't we have some pricing power in terms of procurement? Because already there is excess supply. So are we not able to procure things at a lower cost? In fact, that should have aided our margins, right? Gross margins.
Mr. Bhavya Gandhi, we are living in a sort of technologically transparent situation. The prices in China are low. Nobody will give a very big margin in Europe. This is going to improve, but the pace of improvement is going to be slow. At present, the Chinese people have also sold off most of their excess stock, and they started producing. So there's a fairly good match between the production and the consumption.
Okay. Got it, sir. That's it. I'll get back in the queue. Yeah, thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Darshita from Antique Broking. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thank you for the opportunity. Could we get the region-wide volumes for the agrochemical segment?
One minute, please. See, region-wide volume in the European region, it is five thousand six hundred thousand. NAFTA region, it is two thousand twenty-one thousand. Sorry, two three two one thousand. Latin America, nine hundred and seven hundred and ninety-three thousand. Rest of the world, six hundred and fifty thousand. Total, nine thousand three hundred and fifty thousand. Am I clear?
Yes, yes, got it. Could we get the region-wide gross margins?
Region-wide?
Gross margin.
Yeah. The gross margin in European region is 38%, in NAFTA, minus 1.5%, Latin America, 31%, and rest of the world, 38%. Overall, 29.5%.
Okay. Uh-
This is for agro.
Right, this is for agro, right. What led to the negative gross margin in the North America region?
Because of the excess stock, which was still left, from the previous year, and which was purchased at a higher price than the prevailing prices in North America.
Okay, but in the last quarter, so in the first quarter of FY 2025, we did 22% gross margins. And then this quarter is about -2%. So what changed here?
Remember, 22% gross margin in NAFTA? I need to check up.
FY2025 .
I don't have that figure of last year right now in front of me.
Okay.
Give me a few minutes, let me see.
Sure. Okay, and could we get the volume, price, and forex growth number for overall revenue?
Yes... volume. Give me one minute, madam. The volume growth has been approximately 21%. Foreign exchange impact is about 3%. Price and product mix impact is about 10%, and total growth is about 34%.
Okay. Could we get the region-wise registration breakup?
Yes, please. Region-wise registrations: Europe, 1,627; Latin America, 757; NAFTA, 303; and rest of the world, 247. Total, 2,934.
Okay. And, I had a question regarding the gross margins on sequential basis. If we are to see our gross margins have deteriorated on sequential basis, I think which has led to our margins, coming down by about two hundred odd basis points from first quarter to second quarter. What could be the reason behind this?
Margins have come down?
On sequential basis, from first quarter to second quarter. Despite the contribution from Europe region increasing, our margins have come down on first quarter to second quarter basis.
Let me check up. Madam, my team is taking a little time to get on to those figures. Can we have the next question in the meanwhile?
Sure. No, that's all from my end. Thank you so much.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Madhur Rathi from Counter Cyclical Investments. Please go ahead.
Sir, thank you for the opportunity. Sir, I have a broad-based question. Sir, as I understand that our business model is that we get whatever our competitor is the-
Sir, can you please-
Sir, your words are not very clear.
Is it audible right now? Is it audible right now?
It is audible.
Yes. So I understand that our competitive edge, that our business has whatever competitor is, that in the renewal or the re-registration, the cost is much lower than the initial registration, as well as the time that is required is getting extended. So we get a clear competitive edge in that perspective. But sir, with climate change and the crop being resistant to the older generation of the molecules, as well as the toxicity content restrictions by various governments, as well as new version of the similar generic molecules that market coming in. So my question is, sir, how has the cost of renewal, as well as the data that we need to provide to the authorities, has moved over the past few years? Because, with so much, like.
With so much R&D and development going in the new molecules, as well as the older molecules being changed or newer versions coming in. So, I wanted to understand on that perspective.
See, the cost of renewal on the older market is not very high. It is mainly, most of the bureaucratic costs and the fees and other things. It's only the newer molecules, where the research and development is continuously going on, and the innovators keep on adding additional data to the registration, which are required to be repeated by any, generic who wants to renew their product, products. So older product renewal, the costs are not very big, and the demand is also going down. Newer products are more effective and more in demand, and there, the cost of renewal is also going up. Am I clear?
Okay, sir. So a follow-up question, sir. So as the older products that we have an edge on, so in new products, we're considering ourselves as well as some of our competitors, so the timeline will be similar for everyone, right? Because the older products are not working or their effectiveness is reducing. So this makes... So I'm trying to understand how does this make our business kind of prone to competition going forward?
See, Mr. Rathi, the trends are different from region to region, country to country, and from farmer to farmer. Some farmers feel very comfortable with the older products, and they are managing their business also. Some farmers find that the newer products are more effective and more result giving, they're using the newer product. It's a mixed trend, very difficult to classify why this is happening and this is not happening.
Okay. Sir, so, I think, just as a, like, from a different portion. Sir, so, what I understand, going through your previous con call is, sir, for the older-
Sorry to interrupt, sir. May we request that you return to the question, please?
It's just a follow-up question.
Please ask him to speak little slowly and loudly.
Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Sir, what I understood is from our previous con calls, is that, sir, if a product is getting, either the formulation is changing or, we need to provide some kind of additional data for a, newer version of molecule, our cost increases. Is that understanding correct?
Yes, it is correct.
Sir, so won't the renewal process, which is, which was a lower cost for ourselves, providing us a competitive edge, won't that be affected because of all these new molecules coming in or the similar, or due to climate change, the molecule is not working effectively?
Sir, your question is not very clear to me. Sir, and nobody can generalize these things. It depends from molecule to molecule. You cannot say that the trend is a trend for all the molecules or most of the molecules. Every molecule is an individual product, and it has lot of characteristics which are not repeated in the other molecule.
Okay, Mr. Madhur Rathi. So, may we request that you return to the question queue for follow-up questions, as there are several participants waiting for their turn. Thank you. The next question is from the line of Himanshu Binani from Anand Rathi. Please go ahead.
Thank you for taking my question, sir, and congratulations on a good set of numbers, and happy festive season to the management. So sir, my first question was largely on the outlook for the second half. So as we begin to enter into the second half, and which happens to be, like, meaningful for a company like ours, so now how do you see in terms of the region and maybe if you can, like, give any expectation from any regions where you are expecting a good growth, which is likely to be there for the second half?
Mr. Binani, we have divided our business only into the four regions, Europe, NAFTA, Latin, and rest of the world. And I feel in all the four regions, the second half is going to give fairly good results, better results compared to the first half. Also, because of the cropping pattern, because the seasonality of the business, the second half is always better than the first half all these years, and this is going to continue in this year.
Got it, sir. And so secondly, my question was, continuing from the earlier participant's question in terms of the region-wise gross margin. So what I understand is that Europe, which, we have witnessed somewhere around 400 basis points improvement on a YoY basis, while on the Latin America market as well as into the rest of the world region also, we have, like, declined. And sir, maybe if you can, like, give a reason basically in terms of how, how to actually look into the margin profile going ahead also, and the reasons for decline, the reasons basically for declining.
See, I'll tell you now I have the results of the first quarter and the second half quarter together. In the European region, the gross margins have improved from 35.5%- 37.7%, 37.6%. NAFTA, the gross margins have gone down from 22.3% to -1.7%. This is mainly because of some stocks had to be devalued and prices have not picked up. Latin America, it is more or less steady from 32.4%- 31.3%. Rest of the world is also more or less steady but slight improvement from 37.7%- 38.2%. So there's not much change in all the other three regions except NAFTA. NAFTA is only because of some specific situations and coincidences.
It cannot be termed as a trend, and NAFTA will also improve in the second half.
So, sir, this decline in the NAFTA region has got to do with any major decline in particular product or something?
... I feel it is there due to some products, but not a trend.
Okay. Okay. So the inventory overhang, that remains or that is like largely over, and it is like, it is more of a product specific problem than that of the overall market?
It is a product specific problem. The inventory is more or less over.
Got it, sir. Got it. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Nandi.
Happy, happy Diwali, sir.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Pradeep Rawat from Yogya Capital. Please go ahead.
Yeah, good evening, and thank you for the opportunity. So I have some basic question. So I just wanted to understand more about our conveyor belt business. So we procure the belts from our supplier and sell it to our customers. So is that understanding correct?
Yes, it's correct for all the products in the total business. We don't manufacture neither the agrochemicals nor non-agrochemicals.
Yeah.
We procure and supply.
Yeah. So in agrochemicals, we do provide a value by having those registrations. So in belt business, what kind of value do we create in the value chain? So why doesn't our customer buy directly from our suppliers?
Mr. Rawat, in everywhere that possibility is there, that the customer can buy from the supplier source, but many... I mean, most of the time does not happen. You do require a service provider between the source and the consumption. And as a service provider, we give a good service to the customers, service in terms of quality check and also timely delivery, which it does not happen when the consumer goes directly to the supplier.
Okay, and what kind of margins do we have in this segment?
We have margins of about 15% to maybe 20% in this segment also.
20% gross margins?
Yeah, gross margin is 20%. This is gross. One minute. Yes, Mr. Rawat, 20% gross margin overall, but in Europe it is 22.7%, NAFTA is 20.1%, LATAM 17%, and rest of the world, 20%. So more or less, on an average, 20.5%.
Okay, understood. And my next question is, so we do procure agrochemical from some Chinese player or Indian player. So do we require those suppliers' facilities to be vetted by regulatory authorities?
No. The regulatory authorities only vet the product, not the source. But there is a restriction. We have to declare the source to the registration authorities, and also provide a document from the source that they will support us and supply that product to us. And once we receive the registration, there's a binding on us that we can source the product only from that source. We cannot go to any other source.
So we can empanel more than one sources for a particular registration?
Yes, sir. I was about to come to that. We can add an additional source after having registered our product through first source. We can add two, three, four additional sources, which help us to de-risk our business and maintain the competitiveness from the sources.
Yeah. And, sir, can you also highlight on the contribution in revenue from products launched in last five years?
No, that is very difficult, because again, we are not bound to the products which are registered five years or six years or three years. We go by availability of the market, supply, and our margins. If we find that for some product there is excess supply, margins are shrank, we don't touch that product, irrespective of when it was registered.
Yes. So I just wanted to understand that, if we do a registration today, would it be able to generate revenue post five years or ten years down the line in the similar manner that it is generating in today's terms?
No, sir. No, sir, that does not happen. Because if I am registering a product today, the number of competitors will be very few, maybe only the innovator or one or two. But over a period of ten years, there are always, sorry, a reality that at least two, three, four more competitors come in. So when the competition is more, the margins are hitting, and the prices are also too competitive.
Yeah. Thank you, sir. I will join back the queue.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rohit Nagraj from Centrum Broking. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thanks for the opportunity, and congrats on good set of numbers. So first thing is on the pesticides pricing, so what is your understanding in the recent months? Have the prices across the board stabilized and now improving on case-to-case basis, or they are still at a lower level itself? Thank you.
Mr. Nagraj, all the three words you said are applicable. One is that, the prices, the downtrend of the prices have gone away. And secondly, the prices are improving and the margins are also improving. What was the third one?
So there's stability in the market?
There's a stability in the market.
Right. Fair enough, so second question is, particularly in the case of Europe, how has been the change or increase in registration costs over the last five years for newer molecules? I mean, has it gone up significantly? What is your understanding of the same when we are registering new products?
See, first of all, there's no molecule which is our molecule, but it's a trend. The cost of manpower, cost of testing and R&D, all the things are going up year after year. So the cost of registrations is also going up. Secondly, the innovators find out a lot of other new techniques, new facts about the products and impurities and their effect on environment, human beings and other things. All those improvements in the technology adds to the cost. And the new registrant, if we had to go through five steps, and if the two more steps have been developed since then, then the new registrant has to go through all the seven steps from the day one.
So their costs are definitely higher, and that makes it very uninteresting for the new persons to come, is when you find that the costs are so high.
Right. And just one last question, if I may ask. In terms of the high-cost inventory across geographies, have we completely now utilized and probably the low-cost raw material has now started coming with us, and incrementally, that is the, you know, positivity from the gross margin perspective? Thank you.
Whatever you have said is absolutely true. The high-cost inventory has been sold off, and we started procuring, and we are selling at new prices and new costs.
Sure, sir. That's all from my side. Thanks a lot, and Diwali greetings. Best of luck.
Thank you, sir.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ronak Chheda from Omkara Capital. Please go ahead.
Pardon, we could not hear. There was aircraft flying over our building. Can you repeat once again, please?
Yes, sir. The next question is from the line of Ronak Chheda from Omkara Capital. Please go ahead, sir.
Okay.
Yeah. Hi, sir. Am I audible clearly?
Yes, please.
Yes, sir. Sir, I have two questions. One question was on the Latam market, so just wanted to get a sense from you in terms of demand. Since from September onwards, the crop season is going on, so how has been the market demand for us, especially in Latam region?
It is gradually growing, but again, there are still most of the Latam countries have huge economic problems. Their currencies are depreciating, and lot of financial and commercial problems in those countries. That is affecting the business. People are not able to pay on time, and in many countries, the governments are restricting them to buy only on a longer credit, and even the governments do not permit them, give them liberty to pay after the due dates. So a little bit of a complication on this front in the Latam countries.
Got it. But you said demand is still intact. That is what you're seeing, sir?
Demand is. It's difficult to say it's still intact when they are not able to buy. Then the demand has no connectivity with us.
Got it. And sir, just wanted to check, on the supply, concentration, do we have some number of, what would be our total, supply from, let's say, top five suppliers from China or top 10? If you have that number handy, that would be great, sir.
What did you say about supply? What are the possibilities for us?
Sorry, I'll repeat myself. So, what percentage of our procurement from China would be from top five players or top ten players, if you have that number, sir? Just wanted to check the percentage for suppliers.
But we are buying from the most good quality and good manufacturing standard companies, and whether they are top or not is difficult to say for us.
No, no, sir, in our concentration, would it be, let's say, 30% of our buying would be from, let's say, top five players, or, five players, large players from China? Would that be a, reasonable number?
I would say 80% of our procurements are from the top 20 suppliers.
Got it, sir. Got it. Thank you so much, sir, for answering my questions. Happy Diwali!
... Thank you. The next question is from the line of Raman KV from Sequent Investments. Please go ahead.
Hello, can you hear me, sir?
Yeah.
Hello, can you hear me?
Yeah, yeah, we can hear you. Just if you can-
Uh.
Yeah, you can wait for one minute?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I can wait.
Definitely.
Sir, can you... Sir, you are audible. Can you please say something?
Hello, can you hear me now?
Yeah, you can, I can hear you.
Yeah, yeah.
Okay. Sir, I just want to know the guidance for the, with respect to the next quarter, as well as for FY2025.
Yeah, just a minute.
Yeah. So you're talking about guidance for revenue as well as EBITDA?
Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yes, sir.
We, as informed in the past, also in our earlier calls, will continue to have a revenue band between 15%-18% and EBITDA band between 15%-18% for the financial year 2024-2025.
Okay. And EBITDA margin also, you're planning to maintain near 15%-18%?
Yeah, yeah.
And what about-
Slightly more only, but the band will be 15-18, both revenue as well as EBITDA.
What about volume-
Actually, more. Yeah.
And what about the volume growth, sir?
Yeah. So, I think we'll be more or less same range on the volume side also.
Gotcha. Of 15%-18%?
Yes.
Sir, I just wanted to know. It's usually that the second half of the year is much better. So is there any visibility in the demand, at least with respect to this past one month, October month?
Just, one minute. Will you please repeat your question? Mr. Bubna is back in his seat.
Yeah.
Yeah. Can you repeat your question, please?
Are you asking me?
Yes, I am.
Okay. So usually the second half of the year is much better in terms of the business. So, are we able to see any demand growth in the past one month? Like, is the demand growth visible?
Demand is slowly growing.
Okay, it's slowly growing, but not as much as it was anticipated.
No, this is the trend. I wouldn't say it's not as much. In the normal way, the demand start growing-
Mm-hmm.
-in the month of September, October, and they reach up to the top by January, February.
Okay. Okay. Thank you, sir.
Mm-hmm.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Manish Shah, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Thank you for the opportunity, sir. Sir, my question was regarding the vendors we purchase from China. Of the total agrochemicals, what is the percentage we purchase from China?
I would say more than 90%.
Sir, what are the... What is the size of those players? Because one of the previous participant asked that they can go directly. You told that the cost and other things are very high burden. So what are the sizes of those players just so that they can't compete on those parameters?
Mr. Manish, you have forgotten one very important factor in agrochemical business. That is the registration of the products. So when we register a product, we are restricted to buy only from the source which we are registered. I cannot buy from anybody else. Similarly, any of my competitors cannot buy from the same manufacturer if it's not registered. You understand me?
Yeah, yeah. Sir, I got your point, but I just wanted to ask the size of the players from which we purchase from China. Approximately, what are the sizes?
What do you call a size? You tell me the sizes, and I'll pick up.
Like a $100 million, $200 million, $300 million dollar company.
There are many, many hundred million, two hundred, three hundred million companies.
What is the biggest one from which you purchase?
Maybe a few billions.
Few billion dollars. That means their size is quite big.
Very big.
Okay. Still, people are purchasing from us and not directly from them, and those people also are not directly going to the developed countries. So I think that question is irrelevant, that they can go directly or not, right?
Yes, sir, it's not a free play here. The players are very restricted.
Okay.
A manufacturer cannot go to any supplier unless the supplier is registered by him on his registration, a consumer, and the consumers who register the product themselves.
Yeah. Sir, another question was that, sir, from next three to five years of horizon, where do you see Sharda Cropchem going, sir?
... We think that we'll keep on growing at the same pace that we have grown in the last five years.
And, sir, this margin destruction which happened last year, I think that is gone now. That will not come back for at least the next one to two years?
It is gone forever, in a nutshell, as we say, you know.
What, sir?
It has gone forever. Last year's situation has been witnessed by us for the first time in our lifetime, in the last thirty-five years. It was not there so bad in the last thirty-five years, and it cannot remain that for very long.
Yeah, sir. In the last conference you have told that there are a lot of suppliers have closed themselves off, and only thing is that the prices can go up from here. So you- do you think in the next, calendar year, there might be some increase in the prices?
There would be some increase in the prices.
You are seeing that as a trend possible?
Pardon me?
That might be possible, that it may sustain for the next one year or so?
I am using the word might be. There will be an increase in the prices, and there will be an increase in the margins. But I think from the last quarter-
Sorry to interrupt, sir. Mr. Mahawar-
Yeah.
May I request you to rejoin the question queue for the follow-up questions?
Yeah, yeah. Thank you for answering also. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Manish Mahawar from Antique Stock Broking. Please go ahead.
Yeah, Bhavya, just two questions. One, in terms of a depreciation, if you look at the first half depreciation on a YoY basis is lower, right? So, just, how do you see the numbers for this year as a depreciation?
Sir, I don't think we have studied that from that aspect. Depreciation is normal. Our depreciation policy is to depreciate all our expenditures over a period of five years. And our expenditure in the last three to five years has been in the range of INR 400-500 crores, so depreciation will also be in the same range.
Okay, but first half, there is no changes in terms of depreciation because depreciation ideally has to go up because we have capitalized around INR 155 odd crores of amount during the first half.
Sir, our depreciation will start after we receive the registration. So if we have realized some registrations in this period, the depreciation will start from the next quarter onwards.
Okay. Okay, understood. So basically, the second half run rate should ideally inch up, right?
Yes. Let me, sir.
Yeah.
Mehendale will explain you.
Manishji, you can look at our annual amortization or depreciation amortization pattern, and accordingly look at the overall this depreciation. First, you will find more or less same amortization in the H2 also.
Okay. Okay, understood. And the second thing, Shaileshji, I think you have guided for this year, top line growth of around 15%-18% on a YoY basis, right? For the FY2025. That's right?
Yes.
If you look at the first half run rate, right, so it seems like second half will be a bit muted, your guidance, so is guidance conservative or you are maybe cautious?
Yeah. So Manishji, I have explained to you that we will achieve much more than this. Our guidance is conservative on between the band of both EBITDA as well as top line of 15%-18%, but we will achieve more than that.
To answer your question in your words, Manishji, we are cautious.
Okay. Understood, sir. Thanks, and all the best. Yeah.
Yes.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vivek Rathi, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Sir, thanks for taking my question. Just one kind of there-
Sir, you are not audible. Please use your handset.
Hello, am I audible now?
Yes, sir, you are audible now.
Okay. So just wanted to check if the registration process, we have mostly companies in China which are registered. So don't we look at any other place like India? And the second question is, this registration, once we do, how long does it last? I mean, how long we are eligible to continue with that? Thank you.
See, first of all, let me explain to you that manufacturers don't register their products in the foreign countries. Very rarely. The manufacturers concentrate on manufacturing in the best possible way, and most good quality and other things. They do not spare the capital for registration purposes. Secondly, what was your next question, sir? I forgot.
Sir, it was.
Uh?
I mean, hello. Hello, hi. The second question was, how long does this registration process, I mean, the timing, once we are registered, how long we are eligible for now?
The products are having a shelf life of five years, normally. Some products may be for four years, three years, and some products may be for seven years. After that process, that period, the registration has to be renewed, and the renewal process can be also simple, or it may involve some time and, you know, some additional cost. But you are allowed to market your product even when the registration, registrations are being renewed. The registrations, I mean, the marketing is not stopped when the registration has stopped.
Okay. Thank you, sir. Thanks.
Thank you. That was the last question. I would now like to hand the conference over to management for the closing comments.
Thank you everyone for joining us. I hope we have been able to answer all your queries. We look forward to such interactions in the future. We hope to meet your expectations in the future, too. In case you require any further details, you may contact us or Mr. Deven Dhruva of SGA, our investor relations partner. Happy Diwali and happy festivities to you all. Thank you once again.
Thank you. On behalf of Antique Stock Broking, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.