Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Supreme Industries earnings call hosted by DAM Capital Advisors Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touch-tone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Aasim Bharde from DAM Capital Advisors Limited. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Yeah. Thank you, Mallika. On behalf of DAM Capital Advisors, I welcome all our participants on Supreme Industries Q1 results conference call. I sincerely hope you all are doing fine and well, and I also thank the management for giving us the opportunity to host them on this forum today. From the management side, we have Mr. M.P. Taparia, Managing Director, Mr. P.C. Somani, Chief Financial Officer, and Mr. Rajendra Saboo, Vice President, Corporate Affairs and Company Secretary. I will now hand over the floor to Mr. Taparia for his opening remarks and post that we can open the floor for Q&A. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you very much, sir. Good afternoon. I'm M.P. Taparia, Managing Director of The Supreme Industries Limited. I, along with my colleagues, Sri P.C. Somani, Chief Financial Officer, and Sri R.J. Saboo, Vice President, Corporate Affairs and Company Secretary, welcome all the participants who are participating in the discussion of the unaudited stand-alone and consolidated financial result for the first quarter ended 30th June 2021. The stand-alone results and the consolidated results are already with you. I'll give briefly on company product operating performance and other highlights.
The company sold 71,264 ton of plastic goods and achieved net product turnover of INR 1,310 crore during the first quarter of the current year against sale of 91,451 ton and net product turnover of INR 1,040 crore in the corresponding quarter of previous year, resulting in volume degrowth of around 22% and value growth of about 26%. Total consolidated income and operating profit for the first quarter of the current year amounted to INR 1,346 crore and INR 267 crore as compared to INR 1,056 crore and INR 113 crore for the corresponding quarter of the previous year, recording increase of 27% and 136% respectively.
The consolidated profit before tax and profit after tax for the first quarter of the current year amounted to INR 213 crore and INR 170 crore as compared to INR 55 crore and INR 41 crore for the corresponding quarter of the previous year, recording increase of 287% and 315% respectively. The business scenario of all the product segment of the company for the quarter ended 30th June 2021 as compared to corresponding quarter of previous year has been as under. Plastic Piping System business decreased by 36% in volume and grew by 9% in value term. Packaging Products segment business grew by 13% in volume and 30% in value term. Industrial Products segment business grew by 99% in volume and 184% in value term.
Consumer Products segment business grew by 40% in volume and 71% in value term. The overall turnover of value-added product increased to INR 560 crore during the current quarter as compared to INR 378 crore in the corresponding period of previous year, achieving growth of 37%. The company had cash surplus fund of INR 381 crore as on 30th June 2021 as against cash surplus fund of INR 759 crore as on 31st March 2021. Business outlook. During the 1st quarter of the current year, the business was severely disrupted due to second wave of COVID-19. This time, the infection was quite widespread in rural areas. April and May are the peak season for PVC pipe system for agricultural application.
As the rural market was badly affected by the pandemic, the agricultural demand took a big hit, resulting in huge volume loss of business in piping segment. The company was thus required to carry forward the pipe inventory, which was kept ready to meet large seasonal demand of agricultural pipes. Plastic Piping System thus saw a volume degrowth of 36% compared to corresponding quarter in the previous year. PVC prices have started going up now after a drop of INR 19 per kilo since April 2021. The demand in construction segment is now revived. Company expects the first quarter loss in volume in piping system not only be recovered, but will show a growth in full year. The upcoming unit to make plastic pipe system at Guwahati will be operational by October 2021.
The company taken in hand to put a plastic product complex in Odisha, with an outlay of INR 121 crore in the current year. The same may be operational in last quarter of 2021-2022. Total CapEx planned for the year has now increased to INR 521 crore from the earlier INR 400 crore, including carry forward commitment of previous year. Compression molded polyolefin fittings have gone into commercial production at Daryala since June to cater to the growing demand in Nal Se Jal scheme . The second wave of pandemic and the resulting localized lockdown has adversely affected the demand supply chain during the first quarter, which is a peak demand period for tarpaulins. The production has also taken a hit during the first quarter due to scarcity of labor on account of large infection in rural area.
The silver lining is that the exports have gone up by around 50% this quarter compared to the first quarter of last year. With the waning of second wave, the laborers are back and the production is now running at full capacity. The good run in export is continuing. The value-added product sales in Consumer Products segment has gone up to INR 23.26 crore compared to INR 13.41 crore in the same quarter of last year. This division is working on digital campaign on several media sites such as Facebook, YouTube, Instagram for brand promotion. Business scenario remains bullish in Industrial Products business barring the initial disruption during first quarter. The division is working with its existing customer for new business apart from developing new customer. Company putting needed CapEx to meet increased business requirement.
Material handling product being intermediary to supply of essential product have done good business both in term of value and volume. Division is now working to introduce various new product application from injection molding and rotomolding process. Expansion of capacity at its plant in Lalru in Punjab and Gadegaon in Maharashtra is nearing completion and shall be operational by July, August 2021. In composite LPG cylinder division, repeated order from existing as well as new customer are continuing. Domestic oil marketing company that is Indian Oil Corporation and BPCL have also floated inquiry for purchases which augurs well for the long-awaited introduction of composite cylinder in the Indian market. Overall, business scenario for this product looks encouraging. Protective packaging business has shown good improvement over corresponding quarter of previous year. New product for export market have been well received. Its retail division for fitness product is also picking up well.
Division is focusing on customized solution and value addition to its original equipment customers. Beginning of the current year, all the polymer prices have shown softening trend. However, after reduction between 13%-15% during the quarter, prices have again started firming up and expect to remain range bound. The company is committed to increasingly meet its energy requirement from renewable sources and investing a sum of INR 35 crore in the current year to install rooftop solar energy generation plant at its various plant location. The same shall be operational by October, November 2021. This is a brief and overall summary for the first quarter of the year under reference. Thank you for your presence. Now, I and my colleague, Shri P.C. Somani and Shri R.J. Saboo are available to reply to various query you may have. Thank you very much.
Thank you very much. The first question is from the line of Rahul Agarwal from InCred Capital. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, good evening. Thank you for the opportunity. Sir, I had three quick questions. First is, this volume which are lost in the 1st quarter, you are saying obviously the pipe volume will recover in the year and actually it will grow. Overall for the full year, given the favorable base last year, should we assume that a 20% volume growth is fair number for the company?
I don't believe that because still anyway, we can't forecast a correct number because there's already a fear lurking of COVID third wave. As the demand has started coming up properly, we believe last year we sold 294,000 pipe system. This year, definitely we will improve our numbers. Beyond that, we cannot commit today.
Okay. Sir, similarly, because of the volatility in PVC pricing, could you help us, any sense on the EBITDA per ton? Last year it was about INR 30,000 per ton. Will it be similar flat YOY this year?
Last year, if you recall, INR 180 crore inventory gain. If you reduce inventory gain, it was around INR 6 per kilo.
Okay. Will that be maintained YOY?
Very difficult to count the numbers.
Okay, fine. My last question was on CapEx. This INR 520 crore of CapEx, it looks like the highest number in the history of the company for any given year. What kind of sales can it add? Turnover?
What type, sir?
How much turnover can this CapEx of INR 520 crore add to the top line?
Normally, in a greenfield project, we get INR 1.5 to INR 1.7 per ton investment, and a brownfield around INR 2 per rupee invested. Out of this 521, around INR 200 crore will be greenfield. Sanjay, am I right?
Yes. You are right.
320 will be brownfield. If you can multiply by the number what I told you, it may be around INR 900 crore, and their full production is going to be next year.
Got it, sir. I'll come back in the queue. Thank you so much. All the best.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Bhargav Buddhadev from Kotak Asset Management Company. Please go ahead. Mr. Bhargav Buddhadev, your line is unmuted. Please go ahead with your question.
Yeah, good afternoon, sir. My first question is on whether there was any inventory loss in the quarter, because if you look at the pipe EBITDA margin, it has held up well at about 21%.
There was some inventory loss, and as we stated in our opening remarks, we used to carry pipe inventory for the second quarter, as we could not exit in the first quarter.
Yes. Sir, despite such a sharp volume decline in inventory loss, how come our EBITDA margins are still held up at about 21%? Is it that there is some reset in terms of the pipe margin?
No, there was more sale of value-added item, less sale of agri item, agri pipe. Agri pipe is a low-margin business.
Right.
There was good growth in our CPVC system.
In our CPVC system?
Yes.
Okay. Can we expect this trend to sort of conti? Hello?
It was a combined factor of giving a reasonable operating margin in the first quarter.
Sir, has our CPVC business-
Sorry?
Has our CPVC business seen growth? Is it possible to quantify what has been the growth in the CPVC business?
In the first quarter, we had a growth of 42%.
42% volume growth in CPVC?
Compared to the previous year.
Okay. For the full year, we can expect a double-digit volume growth in CPVC, sir?
We expect like that.
Okay. Secondly, sir, given that PVC prices were falling in the first quarter, how is the channel inventory? Is it fair to say channel inventory could be one of the lowest in the pipe segment as of now?
You are very right. Channel inventory, they are mostly empty warehouses.
Okay.
They could not buy also.
Sorry, sir?
If they required, they could not buy also due to lockdowns.
Okay. How is the situation now, sir? Now PVC prices have started rallying back. Are you seeing channel also starting to buy now?
No, channel is still not gone too bullish. There's no reason to go too bullish. There's no reason the price to go back to the same old level.
Okay.
PVC is structurally short.
Okay.
The freight costs are very high from Far East and Southeast Asia to India.
Okay.
The landed cost in India increased substantially due to increased freight cost of the containers.
Okay. I understand.
Today you cannot get large material from either U.S.A. or South America or Europe.
Okay. Sir, my last question is on the valves business. In the annual report, we have mentioned that we are manufacturing various valves like butterflies, swing check, et cetera. How big will be the valves business for us, and are we doing any CapEx in this business as well?
We are investing some money more into increasing the range of valves.
How big will be this business, sir, as of now?
We started building up-
Okay
We expect the business will go on growing. Besides number, not possible to say.
This will also be qualified as a value-added product, sir?
I think all value-added.
Okay, sir. I'll come back in the queue. All the very best, sir.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Girish Choudhary from Spark Capital. Please go ahead.
Good afternoon, sir.
Good afternoon.
Thanks for taking my questions. A couple of questions. First is on the volume. Just to better understand this, you mentioned that the main reason is due to agri-business. How much this agri-business declined in volume terms? Generally, first quarter is the peak season, how much is the agri mix in the total business?
Total agri pipe and borewell and column pipe, we lost a turnover about 24,000 plus turnover. Out of 24,000 tons, some quantity used in housing also. Housing also, there was complete lockdown in South India. Precisely cannot say how much is agri pipe business, but we can safely say that out of 24,000 tons loss in business, 22,000 plus were lost due to poor demand in agriculture segment. Major was agriculture pipe loss.
Okay. This quarter, basically, you're sort of mentioning that you lost 22,000 tons in the agri business.
Second quarter is not agri season. Agri season may start by last week of September. Then we may see some impact only on the third quarter, in boost in demand agri market. July, August is rainy season.
Okay. Second is that, on the Packaging Products, this is the only segment where we have seen a decline in margins from the first quarter FY 2021 levels. Margins falling from 15% to 12%. Any reasons for the same? Is it due to lower Silpaulin sales or any pricing pressure here?
There are two reasons. One, the lower production in the April, June quarter of Silpaulin, Secondly, the South market was mostly remained closed, and South is big market during this season. Thirdly, the company consumed high cost of material because this Silpaulin is company making all from imported raw material, and we had continuous commitment, which we keep it for nearly three month our requirement. Their prices were falling, but we have to consume that high-cost material. These 3 factor combined have reduced our margin, of course, limited film product.
Okay. Looking ahead, where do we see the margin settling in this segment?
Looking ahead, we remain quite optimistic.
Okay. Can it go back to the 15% levels?
Yes. Precise number I don't say, but next year we will restore our margin fully. We have now restored fully our margin. In our protective packaging segment also, our fitness products are picking up very well. Our exports are picking up very well. In protective packaging film, we are getting more and more value-added items, and we are increasing our export also. We believe our operating margin for the full year will be quite satisfactory.
Got it. Sir, just one more question. On the balance sheet, we have seen the cash balance coming down to INR 380 crore as of June versus INR 750 crore in March. Just wanted to understand what has led to this decline. Is it CapEx or higher working capital?
Buildup of inventory and also CapEx, but more was buildup of inventory because we could not exit in first quarter, so we had to carry the inventory in second quarter.
Okay. We can expect this to sort of roll back as and when the.
We hope so.
sales improve. Yeah. Okay.
We hope.
Got it. Thanks a lot, sir.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Kashyap Javeri from Emkay Investment Managers. Please go ahead.
Thank you very much, sir, for the opportunity, and congratulations on quite a strong show in a challenging quarter. I have just one question.
Sorry to interrupt, sir. This is your conference operator. There is a disturbance coming from your line, sir.
Just give me one second.
Thank you.
Just give me one second, sir.
Yes, we'll wait.
Is this better now?
Yes, sir. You may go ahead. Thank you.
Okay. Sir, congratulations on quite a strong show in this challenging quarter. I have just one question, which is with respect to some of the comments that we have in annual report. We have spoken about the opportunity opening up in the fire sprinkler system with respect to MS and GI pipes. If you could quantify what's the total size of that market. I'm not asking what could be potential for us, but what is the total size of the market there, and the differential between CPVC, GI, and MS pipes as of today.
Fire sprinkler, total market size, we cannot participate because there are several types of fire sprinkler required. Mostly the vertical pipe system, we cannot participate. Light fire sprinkler system only we can participate. Fire sprinkler, we can get full advantage only until BIS, this is not formulated for fire sprinkler. Our company is seeing that our business is increasing for fire sprinkler month after month. We expect this year business will be better than previous year, but still we are not able to get the larger volume of business because we are all waiting for several BIS certification program, where it is still under the printing process in Government of India.
Okay. Differential between the cost, if you have it handy.
Cost is actually, CPVC fire system is much expensive than mild steel. Our CPVC fire system is really effective. With mild steel, remaining under pressure of water, the pipe get corroded and at the time of fire, it will be after seven to eight years, the water will not come out of the sprinkler.
This is not a cost effective purpose. This is more from the point of safety of the human beings living in that building. Our system in Europe and U.S. is already widely spread. They don't use this mild steel fire sprinkler system. More and more shifting is taking place to CPVC. India still, the system has to be fully in place from the BIS level.
Okay.
The business will be better, and we expect that our business will go on growing every year.
Okay. If I can squeeze in just one more question. In material handling, what would be the contribution of e-commerce now?
Somani, any idea? E-commerce, I have no idea.
No. You see, our products are not through the e-commerce route. What we are doing here-
No. I mean material handling products which are going to e-commerce segment. Material handling products.
Yes. E-commerce companies or third party logistic companies who are ultimately doing this work for the e-commerce companies.
Right.
The market is definitely growing up, and this is the reason of this business doing well even in the pandemic period also, because the e-commerce deliveries are happening more, and the products are required. Exact quantum and the value is not known.
Okay
These are the focus area where we are working, and we are really finding it fruitfulness.
Sure. Thank you very much, sir. That's it from my side. Again, congratulations on quite a strong show in this challenging quarter.
Thank you very much.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ritesh Shah from Investec. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, sir. Thanks for the opportunity. Sir, my first question is a clarification. Did we say that out of 48,000 tons on the plastic piping side, 24,000 tons was agri? Did I hear it right, sir?
No, we said destruction in demand was 24,000 ton.
Okay.
Compared to previous year same quarter, the demand destruction was 24,000 tons due to lower sale of agri pipe, column pipe, and borewell pipe. Out of which, majority has been marked to be used by farmers.
Okay.
Maybe 22,000 tons.
Okay.
2,000 ton might have been used in housing.
Right. Sir, if one had to break up broadly agri and non-agri, how much should the decline be? Did the agri part of the business decline by, say, something like 70%, 80%? How should one understand it?
Agri business declined by 60%.
Around 60%. Okay. Sir, this means that the EBITDA per kg, what you have shown on the plastic piping side, it is really, really good. It will be more like touching what probably CPVC EBITDA per kg would be. Sir, just trying to understand, has the PVC, CPVC mix drastically changed? You did indicate that the growth for PVC was nearly 42%. Is this the only variable, or are there any other factors like higher sales on tanks, walls, fittings, that is also what contributed to this healthy EBITDA per kg in the plastic piping business, and this is a more sustainable number? Sir, if you could help explain this.
CPVC 42% growth has come due to lower base last year.
Okay.
Last year, April was completely closed. Majority was also very much closed in housing.
Okay.
Workers have migrated, there is no construction worker available. I am recalling you the last year first quarter.
Correct.
Migrants and worker was not there, construction activity started. April was not closed this year.
Correct. Sir, has the ramp-up on tanks and walls or fittings been significant, which has also helped on a very healthy margins over here?
No, business is good now. We are doing all those business where the margins are healthy.
Correct. Sir, what I'm trying to understand, is this a structural shift in the product mix going forward?
Sorry, say it again.
Sir, is this a structural change in profitability in the plastic piping business? That is what we are looking at.
This shift has changed the company business profile. We are intending to go on increasing the share of value added item year after year. We are intending to increase the sale of export market year after year.
Okay.
This is not a structural change taken this year. This is going on for last four, five years.
Okay. That's helpful. Sir, just I had one more question. In the press release, you have indicated molded olefin fittings, which have gone into commercial production. Just wanted to understand the end application on this on the agri side. Is this something which is specific and new?
Not for Agri pipe. This goes in house connection. It's only the end pipe. Nal Se Jal scheme is going throughout the country. Government is committed to connect the maximum number of houses by 2024.
Correct.
Connecting the pipe to the house, you require fittings.
Correct.
End pipe. Yeah.
Sir, how is this product different from what we already have in the marketplace? Is it something new and unique to us?
It is very unique to our company. It cannot be used on PVC pipe. For the housing connection, they are using polythene pipe or medium-density polyethylene pipe. For that you require different type of fitting. It is a very different type of fitting.
Sure. Thank you so much for the answer, sir.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Sonali Salgaonkar from Jefferies India. Please go ahead.
Thank you for the opportunity. Sir, my first question is, in the opening comments you said that you are hopeful of recovering the loss in volumes with the full year prospectively showing a growth. What could be the key steps that we envisage to take for showing this growth in plastic pipes? For example, any new launches or increased distribution, et cetera.
All things together, distribution, launching new product. That is now electrofusion and multi-thread fitting we have heard. We are going to launch electrofusion polythene fitting, which are required for joining the pipe for infrastructure. We are going to introduce PEX piping system, which is required for housing, for carrying hot water. We are building more capacity in our furniture, more capacity in our material handling system, more capacity in industrial component, and more sale we expect from our composite cylinder, more sale we expect from our component packaging division, more sale we expect from our protective packaging products. Every segment, we are seeing better demand prospect now. We are seeing this happening in this month only.
Understood.
Barring COVID third wave, which maybe how much severe could be, nobody has got idea. Suppose they become more severe than second wave, anything whatever we are saying may go kaput.
Got it.
In the current situation, when vaccination is going on with 5 million doses per day and may go to 8 million to 10 million in next month per day, and the vaccination and the sero survey showing that we are developing herd immunity, we remain optimistic. We keep positive thoughts. The business conditions are going to better.
Got it, sir. Sir, my second question is, you mentioned about this Nal Se Jal. We understand that during COVID-19, there was a certain gap between the progression of this project. Any updates in terms of which states have already rolled out Nal Se Jal, and what is the kind of progress on this?
Now all the states have become active. All the states have become active to install Nal Se Jal scheme. All are racing to see that the scheme can be completed, if not by 2024, definitely by 2025. All are moving very fast, all the states.
Got it, sir. Sir, my last question is, could you help us understand what is your rural versus urban mix in terms of your overall sales? We understand that you said that construction demand is looking up quite well. Is construction mainly urban or rural/semi-urban for you?
Demand is much better in tier four, tier three, tier two town also. Construction is good in rural area also. Construction is good now in urban city, metro cities also. Construction is revived in most of the country.
Got it.
Money is available at lower cost, and the salaries have also increased, so EMI is manageable. I think things are looking quite positive.
Sir, for our overall sales, what could be the rural versus urban mix?
No idea. We have got distribution networks throughout the country.
Got it, sir. That's it from my side. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Achal Lohade from JM Financial. Please go ahead.
Good evening, sir. Thank you for the opportunity. My first question is, in terms of the market consolidation in the plastic pipe business, I just wanted to check your thought. Are we seeing most of that consolidation played out, or given the issues the smaller guys face in terms of getting the material or working capital or whatever, are we past that consolidation or there is a long way forward?
We have not heard any merger taking place in Plastic Piping. We have not heard.
Well, I was more asking from unorganized to organized shift, sir. From that perspective, sir.
Unorganized also has a role to play, so they will business. We organized player also will go on growing. They also have role to play, so they will also remain in business. We believe that.
Right, some of them did face issues in last four, five quarters. Are you saying they're coming back or they are still lying low as of now?
We don't keep track of unorganized sector. We know definitely the PVC price have gone up too high. Our polymer price gone too high. Some of them are struggling for working capital, we have not had any great pain.
Secondly, sir, with respect to the valves, what would be the market size? What is the opportunity here, in terms of the aggregate industry level?
Of the piping segment?
The valves.
Valves.
Yeah.
Valves is a big market, but more of metal valve only. Precisely what is the size of plastic valve market, we have no clarity. Once we get clarity, we can share with you. Metal market worldwide may be more than $60 billion. Worldwide, all type of industrial valves market may be $60 billion. Metal.
Understood. That's very helpful, sir. Thank you so much. Wish you all the best.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rajesh Ravi from HDFC Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi sir. Good evening. Sir, I have a few questions. First, few housekeeping numbers sort of. How was the average PVC pricing for you in first quarter and versus fourth quarter and the current pricing? Similarly, if you could share some trend on the CPVC in Q4, Q1, and Q2, that would be helpful.
Sorry to interrupt, Mr. Ravi. There's a disturbance coming from your line. Request you to mute your line while the management answers your question.
Your voice was also not clear. Please.
Yeah. Am I audible now?
For me, you are audible.
Yeah. Okay, sir. Sir, just wanted to get some sense on PVC prices in Q1 and in the preceding fourth quarter, and how is the scenario now? Also if you could throw some light on the CPVC pricing trend over last two, three quarters, including Q2.
The PVC prices were at peak in the fourth quarter of last year. In this quarter, the PVC price has gone down by INR 19 a kilo. Beginning second quarter, they've gone up by INR 2 a kilo.
Okay. On an average level, how was the pricing change for you, sir, in fourth quarter versus Q1?
Overall, gone down by INR 19 a kilo, so you can take your average maybe INR 11, INR 12 per kilo.
Okay. That is what you saw.
Average for three months.
Average. Okay. On the CPVC side, how has been the price volatility?
CPVC prices remain quite high level. There is not much change.
Okay. Not moving up also?
No, it is going up only, nothing coming down.
Okay. Wait, how much is the prices increased in 1Q or in Q2 as we stand?
There are many suppliers. Every supplier has got their own pricing. There are three public suppliers in the world, and they've got their own pricing.
Mm-hmm. Okay.
Everybody pricing is a very classified information.
Okay. No issues. You talked about the inventory loss. Hello?
Yeah, please.
Yeah. Inventory loss, possible to quantify that we have booked in first quarter?
Some inventory loss we must have incurred in the first quarter. Major inventory loss we have carried forward for the second quarter.
Okay.
Exit from the stock of pipe.
Okay. If prices don't go up, that will lead to an inventory loss booking in 2Q.
Depend on the situation.
Yeah. Obviously. Okay.
For the full year, we are not factoring much about it.
Okay.
Inventory remains volatile always.
Okay. Sir, you talked about the volume trend across plumbing and agri segments for you YOY. However, if I have to look on a Q on Q basis, how would these numbers would have played out, the agri and plumbing both growth or decline versus fourth quarter?
First quarter is not an agri season. You can see on the agri season compared to last year this quarter.
Okay.
April, May, June are the peak month for agri demand.
As we told you, our company lost 22,000 tons during the year.
Correct. Okay.
Reduction in demand for agriculture pipe system. Pipe system means multi-layer pipes.
Okay. That would have largely played out in April and May. June and July, things would have started to normalize for you.
Partly June also.
Yeah.
Hardly much demand agriculture segment, it is raining throughout the country.
No. Overall in the CPVC and all, has the normalcies been achieved in month of July?
CPVC are normal in June also. CPVC has nothing to do with the rainy season.
Okay. Sir, on the CapEx that you have talked about, INR 520 crore total. What would be the year-end capacities across various categories by FY 2022 end?
You see our present capacities on March 2021 were about 697,000 metric tons, comprising of 509,000 of Plastic Piping, which we will increase to about 550,000 now after this CapEx of the current year.
550,000. Okay.
Yeah. The Industrial Products, which was INR 71,000 at the beginning.
May go up to 80,000 by end of the year.
Okay.
Packaging Products, nothing much. From 86,000 to 88,000, because we are not expanding Packaging Products capacity as such, except Silpaulin capacity by 2,000 metric tons. Consumer Products, from 31 to 33. The expansion capacity will come in the Piping and Industrial Products.
Okay. Anything specific in the consumer, in the furniture segment and in the industrial segment, the sharp decline that we have seen in this quarter, if I'm looking on a Q1 basis, which you see will more of a short-term nature than things will recover? I am asking this because in furniture, in your presentation, you have been mentioning that the industry is consolidating. The industry size is shrinking, and you have been gaining market share. How should we look at that segment? Though it is small for you, but because that's a large high margin business for you.
Which one? Furniture business we had a growth last first quarter now.
Okay. No, I'm looking at QoQ basis, the sharp decline.
Sorry to interrupt, Mr. Ravi, but I would request you to rejoin the queue for follow-up questions, sir.
Sure. He is looking at quarter four and quarter one now.
Our business is not sequential growth business, not sequentially growth also. We can compare quarter to quarter, last year to April, June this year. We always compare business to our previous quarter. We are not a bank and not an IT company. Very difficult to give us any sequential comparison.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, please limit your questions to two per participant. Should you have a follow-up question, I would request you to rejoin the queue. The next question is from the line of Sneha Talreja from Edelweiss Securities. Please go ahead.
Good evening, sir, and thanks for the opportunity. Sir, just 2 questions from my end. Firstly, you mentioned that your exports have gone up by 50%. What is the percentage of exports in our total revenues, and is it only in the Packaging Division that we understand?
It has gone up in pipe division and packaging division and also in cylinder also. Packaging, cylinder and pipe. All the three divisions there is growth in exports.
Can you quantify the % of total sales in each of these divisions also? Just to see how much are we exporting in each of the divisions.
Each of division, sorry, we do not know. You can say overall, I think we have grown $5.9 million. How much?
Five point-
Sorry? Our overall export was $5.9 million for the quarter.
Oh, sure. I'll calculate the other thing, sir. Sir, my second question was related to the tanks business. I think you have been doing reasonably well. Is it fair to assume that the business has reached a sizable size of If at all, you can give a qualitative statement here that what would be the size? Is it beyond INR 150 odd crores or so right now? Is it fair to assume that number?
No, we can only say that we are going on intensifying our reach in tank business.
When the 2 new plants are coming also, we'll be making tank. By end of the year, we'll be making tank at seven plants. Our reach will make it very comfortable to our user. The freight rate will be lower, and customer can do business with a lower stocking with them. This tank requires huge storage area.
Right.
We will store for them, and we will be servicing them very efficiently from our seven plants.
Sure. Any revenue or targets that you have for this particular division?
It's classified information.
In class. Oh, okay. Okay, got that, sir. Thanks, sir. I'll get back in the queue.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Utkarsh Nopany from Haitong. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi. Good afternoon, sir. Sir, the first question is, our total sales volume degrew by 16% in April and May month. It has further gone down by 31% in the June month over previous year. Just wanted to know from you, how is the demand scenario in the current July month over previous year? Is it much better now in the positive territory or it has fallen down?
Anyway, there are 10 more days to go for July, but up till now, our sales in July in volume also are better than last year July.
Okay.
Talk to you only about 20 days.
Sure, sir. Sir, second is, you have mentioned that all the states have become quite active on Nal Se Jal program. Just wanted to know, are you seeing good demand traction from Nal Se Jal program on the ground currently? If yes, what would be the expected market opportunity to be created out of this program? Which pipe segment are expected to benefit? Is it UPVC, CPVC plumbing pipe, or SWR, HDPE pipe?
It is LDPE pipe, MDPE pipe, PVC pipe, and fittings. All will be benefited, and CPVC pipe also. All benefited. The states have become active, and it is going to come as the period goes. We can talk more and more number properly in the month of April next year. Demand is being generated now in most of the states on Nal Se Jal scheme. They are all getting active.
Okay.
In fact, varieties of pipe made from various materials.
Sir, lastly, you have mentioned that the PVC resin prices have started moving up, and it is expected to remain firm. Do you see any risk to the Agri pipe demand, say, for second half of FY 2022 if resin prices remains high?
Agri pipe, this is not a quarter now for Agri pipe. Agri pipe peak quarter is gone. Now, July, August is the rainy season. Agri pipe start reviving a little bit from last week of September and partly in October. When farmers require pipe, they require pipe. When the farmers were getting infected, they were not leaving their villages, so there was no development work took place this year.
Okay. Got it, sir. Thanks a lot, sir.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Priyank for Individual Investor. Please go ahead. Mr. Priyank, your line is unmuted. Please go ahead with your question.
Yeah, sorry. First of all, Taparia . Thanks for giving this opportunity.
Yeah.
My first question is that, in the balance sheet as of 31st March, we have cash and cash equivalent of INR 760 crore, which is mainly invested, for example, you can say, in the liquid mutual fund. Seeing the current trend in the market, don't we feel that a certain percent of this, for say 50%-60%, if we invest in the blue chip company shares, which are performing good and the good sector, the return can be maybe 30%-40% per annum at least as compared to 8%-10%, which may be earning from the liquid. We have seen that certain companies in the market, they are investing the surplus in the good company shares. What's your strategic initiative on this front?
We don't invest in share market.
Sorry?
We don't invest in share of any company. All companies are good. We don't invest.
You are saying that we are happy with the liquid mutual fund return, we are happy with this one.
Yeah, definitely happy.
What I'm saying, that even the government is promoting to put 20% of their corpus of PF in the share market. Suppose if a certain person invest, I think return will be more, which will be good for all the shareholders, including you promoter also.
We are not government.
Okay. My second question that is, we have seen the new plant of cylinder, this plastic cylinder, for the last five, six years ago. We would like to know that, for example, in this quarter, what has been the effective utilization of the capacity and what is your target utilization as we have mentioned in the press release that now IOC and BPCL, they are also floating tenders. What is your target utilization for this capacity during Q2, sorry, during FY 2022?
Well, the best part is that now the division has gone to EBITDA plus, no more EBITDA minus. When the Indian consumer start using our metal cylinder, we are very confident they would like to switch over from metal cylinder to composite plastic cylinder. It not only protects them from any pilferage, from any shortage in filling, it protects them from their life because this metal cylinder burst and people die. Composite cylinder burns out, it doesn't blast. It protects the life also. We are very confident. Our capacity today is between 450,000 to 500,000 per annum. We hope that very shortly we should be able to sell quite substantial portion of the capacity.
Sir, what is the current utilization? In FY 2021, what was the utilization?
The first quarter, we sold around 8,000 number per month.
Okay.
Second quarter, we expect much better. It is long way to go.
Yeah. Sir, next question on the CPVC. As we all know that the margin in CPVC is very good. We would like to know that what was our volume, sorry, what was turnover of CPVC in 2021 and what's our targeted turnover for 2022?
We told that in first quarter, we had a growth of 42%.
No, sir, that was because of this lower base, so better to have a full year number. What was the full year number for 2021, and then we can achieve this growth.
We expect that we will grow between 20%-25%.
Sir, what was the volume for 2021?
Volume is classified information.
Okay. Sir, are we taking any strategic initiative on this CPVC part? Like, for example, Lubrizol has come in the market, and they have signed some collaboration with some other company.
Sorry to interrupt you, Mr. Priyank. Sir, this is the conference operator. I request you to rejoin the queue for follow-up questions.
Okay.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Mohammed Mansoor from Optimum Securities. Please go ahead.
Hello.
Hello.
Hello. Sir, my question is regarding Supreme Petrochem. If you could give a brief overview of the product vertical-wise performance and the trending in the polystyrene and styrene monomer prices, and what are the spreads right now. The second question would be, sir, on the CapEx. Are we confident we will finish the CapEx of PS and EPS in quarter four FY 2022, by end of this financial year? Sir, in the AGM, you mentioned about the tie-up for mass ABS. It has been two, three weeks. Are we expecting an announcement soon?
There are 3 questions out of 1 question, but I can reply all of them. That first part of the CapEx, material CapEx we planned around ₹260 crores for polystyrene and EPS capacity expansion. We are confident that all will be in place first quarter 21/22. All the verticals are doing well. The polystyrene and EPS demand were very weak in the first quarter domestically, but fortunately, we had a good demand in export market, so polystyrene and capacity we could run flat out and we could export it. EPS capacity had to keep closed because EPS is not easy to export. For mass ABS, our negotiations are going on very properly, and we hope that maybe before end of August, we will be able to make announcement.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Chirag Shah from ValueQuest. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Thank you for the opportunity. Sir, my question was first on volume. You mentioned that by the end of this year, you hope to achieve last year's volume, at least. This recovery will be led by more agri or piping? Where are you seeing the most traction?
The recovery will be every segment.
Okay.
Demand restriction took place to place. After all, we sell agri parts throughout the year, but July, August are very lean month. January, March are better months. We are very confident, not only that we will achieve the last year number of 294,000 ton, but we expect our business to grow than 294,000 ton for the year.
Got it.
We are maximum players in housing segment, and housing segment, we remain quite optimistic.
Got it, sir. Sir, second question was on inventory losses. You mentioned that on a full year basis, you are not expecting major inventory loss. Is that statement correct?
We remain optimistic on that part because market conditions are very volatile on polymer pricing, and we really are optimistic that we may not end up with any inventory loss. We remain optimistic. We can't be reasonable. 100% certain, I cannot be.
There will be some losses. Is that understanding correct? Because of higher cost inventory.
We don't say we'll be having loss. We say we will try to quit. Definitely, last year we gained INR 200 crore. This year, there will be no gain. As on today, doesn't look like. We can't say. We are handling all commodity polymers, price is going rising and going down many times. Polymer price by the local makers are changed 17 to 20 times in a year.
Right. Sir, what were the price reduction taken by you in month of May and June?
We reflect the reduction made by the local makers. As I told earlier, in PVC, price went down by ₹19 a kilo.
Got it. Thank you, sir. All the best.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Kashyap Javeri from Emkay Investment Managers. Please go ahead. Mr. Kashyap Javeri, line is unmuted. Please go ahead with your question.
Hello.
Hello.
Yeah. Am I audible, sir?
You're very much audible. Please.
Oh. Just one question, a clarification. When you said that CapEx has gone up from INR 400 crore to INR 525 crore. Our annual report already mentions about that Odisha CapEx. What is incremental CapEx in Odisha about?
Odisha?
Yeah. You mentioned that INR 400 crore CapEx has gone up to INR 525 crores.
In the ₹ 400 crore-
INR 121 crore in Odisha. In the first phase.
Yeah. That additional INR 120 crores is because of acquiring of the adjacent plots that we were mentioning about?
That is already there with us.
Okay.
Now we are putting investment in building and machinery.
On that additional land.
No, no additional land in Odisha.
No, no.
Okay. That ₹400 crore CapEx where we had spoken about Cuttack, Odisha, was only land cost.
Yeah, 400 to Odisha and Tamil Nadu project.
Okay.
Including those two projects, these are the INR 400 crore what we have committed already and we have planned.
Okay.
Now, one by one, we are now taking up those project in hand. Now Odisha.
Okay
We have crystallized, and we are taking hand now.
Okay.
That's all the
After product selling is project.
Sure. Got this, sir. Thank you.
Thank you.
Yeah.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Vipul Shah from Sumangal Investments. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. My question was, what is the price differential between metal cylinders and composite cylinders?
Composite cylinder price are expensive than metal cylinder.
Can you comment by how much in percentage terms?
We recently didn't check.
If they are pricier, then oil marketing companies may not go for it, because it will be costly for consumers.
It doesn't cost them. The consumer pay more deposit, because it's more safe for them, and they are given full quantity in a bi-composite cylinder.
Okay, sir. Are we planning any major CapEx in this area, sir?
Which CapEx? Which area?
composite cylinder.
First we will sell out the capacity.
Okay. It is around INR 5 lakh you said, no? Per annum.
450,000 to 500,000 pieces, which we are staying with there for last six, seven years. Let us sell the capacity, then we have got enough land. We got enough potential to increase the capacity, and we have got plan to increase the capacity once the market is going in a full way. India is buying huge quantity of cylinders. Our is very small quantity.
Okay, sir. Thank you, and all the best.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Sailesh Raja from BNK Securities. Please go ahead.
Thanks for the opportunity, sir. Sir, my question is pertaining to Supreme Petrochem. Sir, we are creating PS EPS capacity of 1.2 lakh tons, and also 60,000 tons of our ABS. In your view, how long it will take to fill this capacity, and what is the incremental revenue you are targeting from this new capacity?
Now revenue will relate to the price of styrene.
Okay.
Very difficult to talk the revenue. We believe that in polystyrene capacity, partly we're selling domestically and partly we will export. EPS capacity, we are expanding very small. We have only 30,000 ton. We should be able to load the plant very quickly.
Okay. Sir, we can fill it in 2, 3 years, sir?
I think we should sell everything by 2022, 2023.
Okay. Sir, is it fair to assume a blended sustainable EBIT of INR 20 per kg for this PS, EPS, and ABS product? With INR 600 crores CapEx, what is the payback you are targeting, sir?
What INR 600 crore? We took INR 260 crore only.
Including ABS?
ABS up till now, the technology tie-up is not further. We have not announced the investment.
Okay, sir. Sir, now Supreme is closer to a billion-dollar company. Can you please host a separate investor call or some press release? That would be very helpful, sir. Also, sir, can you please share quarterly product-wise volumes in 1Q FY 2022 and 4Q FY 2021?
Of Supreme Petrochem?
Yeah, Petro, sir. Yeah.
We will share the revised Supreme Petrochem paper.
Okay, sir. Yeah.
There are questions.
Yeah. Thank you, sir.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, due to the time constraint, this was the last question for today. I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.
We thank very much to all the participants for their very intelligent question. We hope we satisfied them. We thank them for taking great interest in the working of our both the companies. We thank all of them very much. Myself, my colleague, Shri Somani Ji, and Shri Saboo, we all thank them all very much, and we wish them very safe and healthy journey going forward.
Thank you. On behalf of DAM Capital Advisors Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.