Good morning, and welcome to the presentation of Aker Solutions Third Quarter Results 2020. My name is Fredrik Berge, and I'm the Head of Investor Relations. With me here today is Ag Solutions' Chief Executive Officer, Kjetil Nigre and Ag Solutions' Chief Financial Officer, Idar Rekrem. After the presentation, we will open for Q and A. And with that, I hand it over to our CEO, Kjetil Digre.
Thank you, Fredrik. Good morning and thank you for joining us on this call today. This is my first quarter reporting as the CEO of Aker Solutions, and it will also be the last quarter we report under the current structure before the merger with Carnegie, which will be completed next month. So for this presentation, I will focus on Aker Solutions results for the Q3. Let me start with some operational highlights in the quarter.
HSSE has top priority at Aker Solutions and for me. And in the Q3, I'm pleased to say we recorded a positive trend and strong results. In fact, all our key performance indicators are in the best position they have been for several years. This has been achieved by implementing the IOGP lifesaving rules and developing our leadership and culture to deliver a safe work environment and good operational quality. And this year, it has happened in a very difficult time while we in parallel managed the COVID-nineteen pandemic.
In terms of project execution, big milestones were on one side, the successful installation of the top side module for the Troll Phase 3 project for Equinor and on the other, deliveries of subsea equipment to Sinox Lingxue development in the South China Sea. Finally, on operations, our NOK 1,000,000,000 cost saving program, which was introduced in April this year, has now been implemented across the company. We have streamlined the company and the organization and our utilization rate is now better aligned to the activity levels we are currently experiencing. On July 17, we announced a series of strategic and transformational changes. First and foremost, the proposed merger with Kvaerner, but also the spinoffs of our carbon capture and wind development businesses.
Following a busy summer, we have now completed the spin offs and we are ready to complete the merger in a couple of weeks. I will come back with some more details on that process later. These transactions are designed to create a stronger and more focused supplier company that has the right setup, financial profile and competence to serve customers in the oil and gas and renewable industries. The same drivers support the decision to sell IXC, our software development business to Akka Rasa. This company was set up based on our extensive knowledge and usage of software applications relevant to the execution of complex projects.
We will continue working closely with IX3 as the company evolves, while we will no longer be required to fund the development of new software applications. We will not stop or pause with our digitalization efforts. On the contrary, we will continue to work with the people and solutions in IXC as a part of ACE, a company which is being set up by Aker ASA to improve efficiency, drive down costs, and change the way we work and collaborate together Another highlight this quarter was the strong order intake. This was driven by the temporary tax incentives introduced by the Norwegian government this summer. And we are already well underway with the whole project, which was one of the earliest to be announced after the measures were introduced.
In the Q3, we secured several new contracts in both Subsea and Brownfield Services. In Subsea, we have now secured 35 Subsea 3 orders this year based on our standardized tree. This shows that we have a competitive product and that our efforts to standardize are paying off. We also had 2 brownfield service contracts extended during the quarter. And to me, this is the best customer feedback we can get when the client based on ongoing performance and collaboration wants more of our services.
Now let's go to the key numbers for the quarter. Overall operating revenue for the Q3 was SEK 4,700,000,000 excluding special items, down 34% from the same period last year. Our 3rd quarter EBITDA was NOK938 million. Dollars Excluding special items, EBITDA was $243,000,000 down from $570,000,000 a year earlier. This was equal to an underlying margin of 5.2%.
Order intake continued to evolve favorably and was strong at SEK7.1 billion in the quarter. The order backlog increased to SEK29.2 billion at the end of the 3rd quarter. And afterwards, Idar will take you through the numbers in more detail. As I said, we delivered another quarter of strong order intake. The order backlog is back to its highest level since the Q2 last year.
The temporary tax incentives on the NCS led to several new projects being sanctioned. Let me give you a few highlights. Our first subsea win with ConocoPhillips was a very exciting award. In the new Tomolitin Alpha project, we will combine our top side and subsea sea system integration capability. Integrating subsea and top side modifications is one way in which we stand out from the competition.
We will deliver 10 subsidiaries and associated equipment, and we have started on the modification work on integration of the Tomolitan Alpha discovery. Next, the SPS award from Equinor on Breidablik shows that we have a strong portfolio of subsea projects. In the Q3, we announced additional call offs for this project. The contract now covers the delivery of 4 subsea templates and up to 23 subsea trees and associated components. It includes our standard lightweight vertical subsea trees as well as our vector subsea control system.
Low carbon solutions like the electrification of oil and gas facilities play an important part of our future workload. We're already working on the feeds for the electrification of Equinor's Troll B and C platforms. And during the Q3, we signed an engineering procurement construction and installation contract for the integration of a high voltage electrical boiler package as part of the electrification of Lundin Energy's Edvard Grieg platform in Norway. The electrical boilers will replace the heat generation provided by the gas turbines on the platform today, making Edvard Grieg a fully electrified platform. During the Q3, we also secured a 5 year contract extension from ExxonMobil Canada for the provision of engineering, procurement and construction services for the Hebron platform offshore Newfoundland.
We also booked a 3 year contract extension to a framework agreement for work at North Sea Fields operated by ConocoPhillips. Finally, the front end business is still active, pointing to more work to come in the future. We secured 23 new front end contracts ranging from feasibility studies to full feeds. And by that, we have 112 front end orders year to date, one more than the record level of 2019. These provide a solid base for potential future order intake.
Current ongoing feeds include Jan for Chevron in Australia, the Troll West electrification and the Hydrogen B upgrade, both for Equinor. We also had 3 projects being converted from FEEDs to projects this quarter, 2 for ConocoPhillips on Tom and Litton and the Hebron project for ExxonMobil. So now let me give you an update on where we stand in the process to merge the 2 companies, Aker Solutions and Kranil. On July 17, the merger plan was announced and since then we have passed several key milestones on the way to completing the merger. We have identified a new management team and are in the process of completing the rollout of the whole organization.
A new Board of Directors has also been elected. This will be effective from day 1 of the merger. Combining the 2 companies will create a stronger supplier company and we are working to release synergies and further efficiencies, both from digitalization efforts and a new optimized organization globally. As a small company, we will be better positioned to serve the oil and gas industry and we have also set targets for the share of low carbon and renewables projects to grow significantly in the new Aker Solutions. The first day for the new Aker Solutions will be November 11 according to our current plans.
And this date will be the 1st day of trading as 1 single company. At the same time as announcing the merger between Aker Solutions and KAARNE, we also started the process publicly to spin off the developer roles of Aker Carbon Capture and Aker Offshore Wind to shareholders. This process has created significant value for shareholders. Both companies started trading as separate units on August 26. The combined market value of all three companies today has increased more than 300% versus the market value on July 16, the day before the news broke.
We look forward to continue to work closely with both companies on both offshore wind and carbon capture projects, such as the Norsen CCS plant in Norway. Now, let me turn to the outlook. Following the complete standstill we experienced when the pandemic broke out, activity has picked up. We are currently tendering for about SEK 40 2,000,000,000 worth of new orders. This is split fairly evenly between Norway, Brazil, Asia Pacific, but we are also working on attractive prospects in Africa and North America.
I will not go through every project we are bidding for, but one project you have heard about is the Nuwaka development in Norway. We are currently performing a concept study on the Nuwaka and Fula field to optimize the full Nuwaka development. In addition, we are preparing a digital execution of the project that will transform the way we deliver complex projects together. And as always, the timing of these awards remain uncertain. However, the map shows how much market sentiment has changed since the first half of the year.
So to summarize, we concluded another quarter with strong order intake. Our increased backlog improves visibility for 2021 and beyond, and we have implemented the cost saving initiatives we announced in the spring. And as we are prepared to merge Aker Solutions and Kvaerner, we are working to release synergies and further efficiencies. We are also getting close to completing some projects that were won in a very competitive market a few years back. This will support our financial performance in the future.
Sanctioning activity on the NCS is expected to continue in the near to medium term as the temporary tax relief measure give operators additional incentives to sanction projects before the end of 2022. At the same time, our discussions with clients on international projects are progressing again after everything was put on hold this spring. They are now starting to bring back robust projects to the market. This is the last time we report as Aker Solutions the way it looks today. We plan to come back to the market to give you an update on the outlook and direction for the combined company before Christmas.
And with that, I will let Idar take you through the numbers in more detail.
Thank you, Cetel, and good morning. I will now take you through the key financial highlights of the 3rd quarter, our segment performance and provide some financial guidance. As always, all numbers mentioned are in Norwegian kroner. So let me start with the income statement. Overall operating revenue for the 3rd quarter were was SEK 5,500,000,000.
The revenue was positively impacted by SEK 804,000,000 gain on the dividend transaction of Aker Carbon Capture and Aker Offshore Wind. Excluding these effects, the revenue was SEK 4,700,000,000 down 34% year on year. The revenue decline was primarily driven by the field design sub segment, as previously guided following the record activity last year and continued progress towards finalization of several ongoing projects, some with COVID-nineteen impacts. Our reported Q3 EBITDA was 938,000,000. Excluding special items, EBITDA was $243,000,000 down from $570,000,000 a year earlier.
This was equal to an underlying margin of 5.2% compared to 8% in the same period last year, reflecting the lower activity level and impact of the coronavirus, partly offset by our fixed cost reduction program. We have included restructuring cost of $114,000,000 in the quarter related to additional rightsizing of the organization following the lower activity level. Depreciation and amortization was $301,000,000 in line with our previous guidance. Our reported 3rd quarter EBIT or operating profit increased year on year to €637,000,000 from €245,000,000 Excluding special items, EBIT was minus €39,000,000 and the margin was minus 0.8% versus 3.7% in the previous year. This reflect our project portfolio with lower activity level as well as a few projects won in a very competitive market not yielding satisfactory margins.
The negative impact in 3rd quarter from these projects is approximately NOK 150,000,000. These projects are now in the finalization phase. Net financial items were negative $116,000,000 in the quarter, and our profit and loss tax charge was equal to a tax rate of 62%. The tax rate in the 3rd quarter was negatively impacted by a non cash impairment of tax assets in Brazil and Angola of 177,000,000 dollars We ended the quarter with a net income of €199,000,000 and the earnings per share was 0.75 kroner. Now moving to our balance sheet and cash flow performance.
Our working capital or net current operating asset ended the 3rd quarter at €429,000,000 driven by our strong focus on cash collection, in addition to other measures to improve working capital performance. Following the normalization of our working capital during last year, we continue to expect working capital to trend around SEK 1,000,000,000 going forward. Our cash flow from operations in the 3rd quarter was SEK496,000,000, reflecting our working capital improvements. Cash flow from investing activities was positive €109,000,000 dollars reflecting the sale of IX3 and a reduced CapEx spending. As previously communicated, CapEx and R and D will be significantly reduced by about 40% this year compared to 2019.
Excluding IFRS 16, we had a net interest bearing debt of SEK 1,900,000,000 at the end of 3rd quarter, down from SEK 2,400,000,000 at the end of 2nd quarter. Our net interest bearing debt to EBITDA ended at 2x. And as a reminder, the leverage covenant on both bonds and the revolving credit facility are at 3.5 times pre IFRS 16. Our total liquidity buffer at the end of the quarter was at a healthy $5,900,000,000 including our revolving credit facility. In the current environment, our main financial priority remains on cash flow performance and protecting the company's balance sheet.
Now on to projects, where 3rd quarter revenue was down 37% year on year, driven by field design following the record activity last year as well as continued progress towards finalization of several ongoing projects. This resulted in an underlying project EBITDA of €190,000,000 with a margin of 5.3 percent for the quarter, down from 8.1% last year. EBIT excluding special items ended at $3,000,000 reflecting our current project portfolio with significant lower activity level and, as mentioned earlier, a few projects not yielding satisfactory margins. 3rd quarter order intake in project was strong at $5,400,000,000 with a book to bill at 1.5 times, increasing our backlog coverage moving forward. Now some further details for Subsea and field design within the project reporting segment.
Revenue from Subsea project decreased year on year to $1,600,000,000 and revenue from field design normalized to 2,000,000,000 dollars 3rd quarter order intake was strong with $2,000,000,000 in Subsea and $3,400,000,000 in field design. The backlog in projects increased to $17,800,000,000 further improving our visibility. In services, activity decreased year on year in production asset services, primarily related to adverse impact of the coronavirus. Activity in the subsea lifecycle services remain more resilient. Underlying EBITDA in services was 131,000,000 with a margin of 11.8%, up from 11.2% in the same quarter last year.
This resulted in an EBIT of CHF 69,000,000 with a margin of 6.2% versus 7.2% a year ago. 3rd quarter order intake in services was strong at SEK 1,700,000,000 with a book to bill of 1.5 times. The backlog ended at $11,500,000,000 Now over to the order intake and backlog performance for the group overall. We had another quarter of strong order intake at 7,100,000,000 dollars equal to a book to bill of 1.5x when excluding the revenue from dividend transactions. Our backlog increased to SEK 29,200,000,000 further increasing our visibility.
Our second and third quarter order intake was significantly better than expected earlier this year, driven by the recovery of the oil market and the government incentive measures. The outlook for order intake has improved, and we now see encouraging signs for project sanctioning moving into 2021 2022. Finally, over to our guidance. As you know, during the first half of this year, the activity in our industry was significantly impacted by the coronavirus and steep decline in oil prices. However, the outlook has improved with government measures and recovery in commodity prices.
And for the year overall, we continue to expect revenue at around SEK 21,000,000 to SEK 22,000,000, dollars excluding the revenue from dividend transaction. As we move forward, our increased backlog, combined with a healthy feed and tendering activity, should turn into a number of interesting opportunities where Aker Solutions is well positioned. This, combined with our leading capabilities within energy transition and low carbon solution, make us more optimistic about the outlook moving forward. We will also continue to leverage on our front end capabilities to capture opportunities and engage with our customers at an early stage. And as activity level picks up further, it is it will be important to harvest the scale effect from our improvement programs and cost and asset base.
So to sum up, the Q3 was a transformative quarter for Aker Solutions, unlocking significant shareholder value through the spin offs. And importantly, we announced the merger with Kvaerner to create a leading execution and we are on track with our cost and CapEx reduction measures, and our merger process is on track. This should provide a good foundation moving forward for the Merge Aker solution, and we will get back to more detailed information regarding the merged company during the Q4. And with that, I would like to thank for you listening and hand it back to Fredrik.
Thank you, Idar. We are now ready to open the call for questions. Operator, you may now open the line for questions.
Thank you. And the first question comes from Michael Alsford in Citi.
Hi, good morning. Thanks for taking my questions. I've got a couple. I'll start with the first one. Just on your outlook guidance, you don't seem to be referring much to the view on margins, given the weaker margins in 3Q.
So I'm just wondering whether you could give an update of where you expect margins to trend into 4Q and into 2021. Are you going to still see the headwinds around these poorer performing projects? That's my first question. Thank you.
Yes. We have not sort of given specific guidance on the Q4. Personally, I think guidance on each quarter is probably a bit both difficult to do and we need to look it on a more longer term. But as mentioned in my presentation, the underlying margin for the Q3 was 5.2%. We have included a negative impact from those projects I mentioned of around SEK150 1,000,000.
If you adjust for that, you will get slightly above 8% in EBITDA margin for the quarter. And with that, I don't have any better sort of guidance of margins for the Q4 than using sort of more than average margin year to date.
Okay. And then just an unrelated follow-up. I just wondered whether you could again outline where you see the share of low carbon projects in the new combined Aker Solutions going forward? So what it is today and then where you expect it to be over the medium term? That will be helpful.
Thank you. Yes.
First of all, I can see that the new and combined company has complementary both competences and capacities that are relevant for this and also ongoing opportunities. And to us, the way that we are engaging in low carbon opportunities is quite broad. We are already into the area of electrification of existing on field installations, particularly offshore Norway. And then we have, as previously mentioned, been key to both shaping and then now also spinning off the Aker Carbon Capture and Aker Offshore Wind, which have opportunities that we will be part of when executing. So I think and we also see that in our dialogue now with all our key customers, this is becoming a clear and clear topic, really sort of covering more and more of the agenda we have together.
And in my mind that it seems like this is really going to get traction in not only Norway where we are ongoing with electrification projects, but also towards carbon capture, starting with the example around Mosen, which is then due to be decided by parliament and kicking off on the Q1 next year, but then also abroad.
Okay. Thanks. And on Nordson, what would be your share of the scope? I think Aker Carbon Capture have given an award number, but that would be I guess a lot of that will be for Aker Solutions to prosecute on. So could you
give us a sense as to
how big that could be, please?
Yes. First of all, I'll just say that Aker Carbon Capture was an integrated part of Aker Solutions and the way we are collaborating now through both formal agreements and the way we are handling the different opportunities are still in very sort of close collaboration. So we will be part of both that opportunity and other opportunities that Aker Carbon Capture is looking at. Just now we are looking at the Nulsen project and we are setting up the right way of both covering the roles and then collaborating to make sure that that project becomes a true success. What we will definitely do is to be key in both engineering and design and also how we control the total plans and the cluster initiative.
But then the weeks to come and towards final sanctioning of the project and contract award, we will then detail out the exact roles and then obviously the share that Aker Solutions have in that
project. Okay. Thank you very much.
Next question is from Sahar Islam in Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead.
Good morning. Thank you for taking my questions. It sounds like the projects margins particularly in 2021 underlying should be better. Could you just confirm like what level you see those going to? And if they are better, is it because pricing is better or because you get some of the benefits of cost savings?
And then my second question was on working capital. So you had a very good performance in 3Q and you're well below the working cap levels you're guiding to. So should we expect a normalization in 4Q in working capital? Or do you expect to end the year with a better working capital performance than you're expecting in the medium term?
Yeah. Kjetil here first. Ida covered the issue of margins a bit earlier and he can revert to that as well. But just also, when we talk about the project that we are due to complete, I just want to also describe how we are now closely working that together with our clients, and really being in a countdown mode to make sure that they are as successful as they can be now at the very end. Then also looking forward, one sort of key focus here is obviously that we will bring learnings from our history and also making sure that we mobilize the right competence and we will also capitalize on the improvement initiatives we have going to make sure that all of this, including cost cuts, are supporting when ramping up on the newly awarded work.
On the pricing side of things, our view is that it's fairly stable. So it's really up to us now to improve further and make sure that we are delivering projects precisely and in a stable manner.
Peter?
Yes. Just confirming what Kjetil said, of course, the project mentioning is a drag on our margins and we will finalize those projects and finishing them strong over the next 6 to 8 months. And thereafter, as Cattel mentioned, we will ramp up with newly awarded project. And of course, our target and mandate is, of course, to have some margins on every project that we embark on. So when you can sort of complete those projects and continue working on new projects with sound margins, you should see improvement in margins going forward.
That combined with the cost cut program and as previously mentioned the €1,000,000,000 cost cut program is fully implemented and we see clearly the effect coming through our earnings this quarter and continue into the Q4, as well as our ambition to reduce the CapEx and improve overall cash flow for
the group.
The working capital question, you had we had a strong quarter this quarter with SEK 429,000,000 in operating or working capital. We expect fluctuation going forward and previous guidance have been fluctuation around SEK 1,000,000,000.
And just to follow-up on that, do you expect to get back towards the €1,000,000,000 at 4Q? Or is that normalization over the next year?
I don't want to sort of be very specific, but we will, of course, have a high focus on cash collection and working capital improvements. And we clearly delivered on that in the Q3. But this can fluctuate quite a lot from one day to another. And if depending on the cutoff dates and the various quarters, you could expect to see quite large fluctuation from one day to another during a quarterly close, not let's say, we have seen example that, that can vary with SEK 300,000,000, SEK 400,000,000 around a quarterly close from one day to another. So the best guidance I
have to provide to
you is the SEK 1,000,000,000 fluctuation around SEK 1,000,000,000. And then we will come back with more information later on, as Kjetil mentioned, when it comes to the merged entity and our working capital situation for the merged entity going forward.
Next question is from Fredrik Lundin, Carnegie.
Yes, good morning. The time of the merger announcement, there was a clear plan for SEK 1,000,000,000 annual cash flow for the joint company longer term. Do you have any view on how that will shape up in 2021, 2022 as it's not included in the financial guidance in your slides?
Yes. Thank you, Fredrik. We what we announced on the 17th July is still valid and we are continuing working on our sort of merger and strategy plans and we'll come back to you on more sort of precise guidance. But our clear target is to grow the top line for the company going forward. We will cut the cost and most of the targets that we set that the SEK 1,500,000,000 is already implemented and as well as the CapEx reduction.
So our target to generate SEK 1,000,000,000 in average over the next years to come is still valid. Of course, it's an average number and you will probably have somewhat lower in the first phase and then growing from there.
Great. Thank you.
And our next question is from Hakan Amundsen in ABG.
Yes, good morning, guys. Just a question on the impact of the tax breaks given to well, in Norway. I guess oil companies will be eager to progress quite quickly with awarding new projects. I was just wondering if this has an impact on your competitive position and potentially the margins you can achieve on these awards relative to the order intake you have in the last couple of years in Norway?
Well, again, back to where we are now as the onboarded in Aker Solutions, we have had a lot of dialogue with all our key clients. And as I said, agendas and discussions is obviously about renewables and transformation together, as I already mentioned, but then particularly for the ones operating in Norway, we see also a clear sort of increase in opportunities and we are in dialogue on what they are and how to actually solve them. And we see that the combined company with the complementary competence and capacities and really sort of a broader offering is highly relevant for most of the positive effects coming from the tax incentives this year.
And just to add to that, when it comes to our competitive position, we both companies, Kvaerner and Aker Solutions have been working on improving their competitive position, that being a project in Norway or outside Norway and that will continue. So we believe that we have a significant improvement in our competitive positions and with the interesting opportunities that is coming up. As you know, and we see it from studies and stuff that we are doing now that there will be interesting opportunities over the next couple of years and expect sanctioning on that one. As you probably know, in Norway, you need to submit the plan for development within end of 'twenty 2. And we therefore expect to see a pickup of, let's say, new sanctioned project during 2021 and into 2022.
And then as you all know, it will take some time before you see immediately uptake in the top line, but very interesting opportunities ahead of us.
All right. Thank you. Just an unrelated follow-up. I'm sorry if I missed it in the introduction, but could you give some numbers on your software Yes. The sales value on the
Yeah. The sales value on the IX3 entity was at SEK 222,000,000 SEK 172,000,000 SEK 172,000,000 is paid in the Q3 and the remaining SEK 50,000,000 will be paid based on certain milestones going forward. So that is the transaction. And what we and as Kjetil mentioned, our digitalization efforts will continue with full force. But we are not the company that is going to be the development company of those.
And therefore, we will save, let's say, the CapEx that requires as well as the operating expenses that we historically have had in by developing that company. So all in all, we said that if you look at the operating expense savings, we estimate that to be on an annual basis around NOK 50,000,000 taking into account also the license fees that we are going to pay for using those applications. In addition to that, of course, the CapEx savings comes on top of that one.
All right. Thank you.
And our next question is from Renault Saola in Anaconda. Please go ahead.
Yes, good morning. Thank you for taking the question. My first question is about the renewable profile that AKIA Solutions has post the spin off of Aker Wind Offshore and Aker Carbon Capture. In other words, what I understand that you are now an asset light engineer, but what percentage of your sales will still be done and by on renewable projects going forward? What is your assumption of the split of sales within 2 to 3 years?
And on carbon capture, we've seen yesterday a big announcement by BP, ENI, National Grid, Shell and Total to do a joint venture called North Endurance Park, which will undergo major carbon capture projects. I would like to know if your company's AKIA Carbon Capture or AKIA Solution as a backup engineer will be part of these projects.
Well, first of all, just sort of reiterate on something that we have communicated earlier on, and really linked to ambitions for the company going forward. As we said early on, both engineering wise and our yards and others are involved in projects as we speak, and we see the opportunities coming. And our ambitions going forward is actually to look at 1 third of our revenue coming from what we call sustainable energy solutions and projects in 2025 up to 2 third in 2,030. And to me, it's really sort of inspiring to see how the 2 companies, when being formed into 1, has this complementary competence and capacities and broad offering also towards the renewable area. And just to remind ourselves, we are already in the Kvaerner setting, part of the Highwind and floating windmill project in Norway.
So we are there with the right competencies and also projects ongoing and we will work closely with Aker Carbon Capture and Aker Offshore Wind on their initiatives and also towards other customers.
Yes. I just want to add to that one, Kjetil, that I have already picked up that some believe that our ambition is not as high as before on the renewable side after the spin off, but it's actually more the opposite. I think that create even stronger platform for realizing our ambitious target on renewables going forward. So that I think is an important message from us.
And to the last part of the question, I think we should just refrain from commenting on NRO. We are there on the technology side in general. But I don't think it's relevant to comment on that specific project.
Other than we are following, of course, closely all those projects that might be relevant in our targeted area. So that's important.
Sorry, just to follow-up. Whom do you see as your direct competition in carbon capture project business in on the engineering side?
I think carbon capture is a technology area in itself. So I think that is more to know the technology owner side than us as a general competent broad offering supplier towards those type of industry projects. And yes, so I think it's a differentiation here between technology ownership and us being a lot sort of clearer and in one way cleaner supplier to both Aker Carbon Capture and others having initiatives in that area. So it's really a strength for us that part of it and the spin off of Aker carbon capture.
My question was more do you see people like Technip or over engineering in front of you when you bid for a carbon capture project or?
Well, again, just I think the technology side of it, they provide sort of distinct offerings. We will then collaborate with different owners of technology in different projects, agrocarbon capture and others. And then sometimes we will compete in those projects with Technip and others, yes.
Thank you.
And there's no other questions at this time.
And we will end the call. Thank you all for listening.