Hello, everyone. I am Fernando Hasenberg, CFO of CMPC, and I would like to welcome you to our Fourth Quarter 2024 earnings webinar. Joining me today, I have Francisco Ruiz-Tagle, CEO of CMPC, and Claudia Cavada, our Investor Relations Officer. Please note that the statements made today during the presentation and Q&A may include forward-looking statements to assist you in understanding our expectation for future performance. These statements are subject to some risk and could cause actual results and events to differ materially. In the Q4 2024, sales amounted to $1.9 billion, EBITDA was $332 million, and net income was $10 million. The pulp business generated an EBITDA of $230 million, with an EBITDA margin of 27.6%. EBITDA decreased by 27% quarter- over- quarter, primarily due to a lower average pulp price.
The Softys business showed an EBITDA of $104 million, decreasing 5% quarter over quarter, with an EBITDA margin of 13.1%. These figures reflect unfavorable exchange rate fluctuation in some markets of the region and weaker macro consumption trends. Biopackaging generated an EBITDA of $19 million during the period, with a margin of 6.6%. This represents a 27% decrease quarter- over- quarter, driven by higher production costs and operational expenses. Year- over- year, EBITDA remained stable, reflecting a higher recovery in sales volumes offset by increased costs. In the Q4 , the composition of our sales was $833 million from the pulp business, $787 million from the Softys, and $288 million from Biopackaging. Therefore, consolidated sales totaled $1.9 billion, with a 3% decline quarter- over- quarter and a 2% decline year- over- year.
Quarter- over- quarter, the decrease was due to a combination of lower sales in pulp and Softys, partly offset by higher Biopackaging sales. For pulp, in the quarter, there were lower selling prices, which were partially offset by higher volumes. Softys faced a challenging scenario on the FX side and consumption trends, which resulted in lower sales. In the Biopackaging business, revenues increased due to higher sales volumes. Compared to the Q4 of last year, revenues decreased as a result of lower sales in Softys for the same reason behind the quarterly comparison. At the same time, pulp grew on higher volumes, and Biopackaging saw improvements in both volumes and prices. Operating costs reached $1,257 million, reflecting a 2% increase quarter- over- quarter and a decrease of 10% year- over- year.
This represents 65% of total revenues in the Q4 of 2024, which compares to 62% in the Q3 of 2024 and 71% in the Q4 of 2023. The year- over- year improvement is in part the result of the implementation of our competitiveness strategic pillar. Other operating expenses account that comprises distribution costs, administration expenses, and other expenses by function, amounted to $330 million in the Q4 , increasing 3% quarter- over- quarter and stable year- over- year. Compared to the Q4 of 2023, administrative expenses decreased in Softys and increased in pupl and Biopackaging. The ratio in other operating expenses to revenues was 17.2% in the Q4 of 2024, compared to 16.1% in the Q3 of 2024 and 16.8% in the Q4 of 2023.
Given the aforementioned effect on a consolidated basis, the company's Q4 EBITDA was $332 million, where the contribution of the pulp segment was 65%, Softys was 30%, and Biopackaging was 5%. Net income totaled $10 million during the period, a decrease from the $147 million in the previous quarter and $35 million in the Q4 of 2023. The quarter- over- quarter decline was due to a lower EBITDA. In the year- over- year comparison, the decline was due to variation of non-operational figures such as deferred taxes and adjustment units. Now, I would like to turn the presentation over to Claudia, who will provide more details on our results by businesses.
Thank you, Fernando, and good morning, everyone. I'll start with the pul business. pulp production was 1,075,000 tons, increasing 2% quarter- over- quarter and 23% year- over- year. The year- over- year increase reflects the entry into operations of our BioCMPC project in Guaíba. Hardwood production was 883,000 tons, up 5% quarter- over- quarter and 26% year over year. The quarterly variation is explained by reduced maintenance downtime at Guaíba mills. Softwood production was 192,000 tons, decreasing 9% quarter- over- quarter and up by 10% year- over- year. The quarter- over- quarter decline reflects downtime at Pacifico mill, according to maintenance schedule. Regarding pulp sales volume, they increased by 10% quarter over quarter and 30% year- over- year, reflecting a higher dynamism in our markets. Hardwood volume was driven by higher exports to China and the rest of Asia.
In the case of softwood, the increase is a result of a combination of higher exports to China and the rest of Asia, partly offset by lower exports to Latin America. Pulp prices during the Q4 of the year were, on average, $749 per ton for softwood and $577 per ton for hardwood. This is a quarter- over- quarter decrease of 2% for softwood and 16% for hardwood. Compared to the Q4 of last year, prices were higher by 6% for softwood and 1% for hardwood. As a result, revenues for the pulp business totaled $667 million, decreasing 3% quarter- over- quarter and increasing 25% year- over- year. Regarding the forestry business, sales volume was 800 at 61,000 cubic meters, down 6% quarter- over- quarter as a result of lower sawn timber, pulpwood, and other product sales. Additionally, volumes of plywood, sawlogs, and millwork increased.
Year- over- year, a 5% decrease is a reflection of lower sawlogs, sawn timber, and other products, which was combined with stronger pulpwood, millwork, and plywood. With this, revenues for our pulp and forestry business totaled $833 million, down 3% quarter- over- quarter and increasing 21% year- over- year. For hardwood, cash costs reached $227 per ton in the Q4 , decreasing 6% quarter- over- quarter and 21% year- over- year. The QoQ decrease was driven by lower energy costs. Additionally, there were decreases in materials, labor, and wood costs, while chemicals costs increased. For softwood, cash costs reached $358 per ton in the Q4 , stable from the Q3 2024 and decreasing 9% year- over- year. Compared to the previous quarter, higher material costs were offset by lower wood and labor costs.
Year- over- year, cash costs decreased across all categories, with the most significant reductions in energy and wood and smaller decreases in labor, materials, and chemicals. EBITDA for the pulp business decreased 27% quarter- over- quarter and increased 215% year- over- year, recording $230 million, with an EBITDA margin of 27.6%. The quarter- over- quarter decline was driven by a lower sales price, while the year- over- year improvement is primarily driven by higher volumes and lower cash costs. Now moving to Softys. During the period, the main currencies in the business experienced significant depreciation against the dollar, leading to lower sales and results for Softys in comparison to previous periods. Revenues totaled $796 million, reflecting a 6% decrease compared to the Q3 and a 20% decrease compared to the Q4 of 2023.
In the quarterly comparison, while volumes were stable for tissue and 2% higher for personal care, currency erosion drove revenues in US dollar terms to fall 6% and 7% respectively. In the year- over- year comparison, volumes were down 4% for tissue and stable for personal care, and given the currency depreciation, revenues in US dollar terms were down 22% and 18% in each case. Softys EBITDA for the Q4 reached $104 million, with a margin of 13.1%. EBITDA decreased 5% quarter- over- quarter and 32% year- over- year. In both cases, the variation was mainly due to currency depreciation in Chile, Brazil, and Argentina, plus soft volumes year over year, given challenging conditions for consumption in the markets of the region. Now going to Biopackaging business.
Quarter- over- quarter, sales volumes to third parties increased 4%, mainly due to higher sales in corrugated boxes and other papers, along with a recovery in corrugated papers and paper sacks. This was partially offset by lower sales of boxboard and molded pulp trays. Year- over- year, sales volume increased 3%, driven by boxboard, molded pulp trays, corrugated boxes, and other papers, offset by declines in paper sacks and corrugated paper. Revenues amounted to $288 million, representing a 4% increase both quarter- over- quarter and year- over- year, driven by higher sales volumes despite a still challenging environment across different industries. As a result, in the Q4 20 24, EBITDA decreased by 27% Q on Q, driven by higher costs and operating expenses, and year- over- year, EBITDA remained stable, reflecting a recovery in sales volumes, which was offset by increased costs.
The EBITDA margin was 6.6% in the Q4 2024, down from the 9.4% in the Q3 and 6.9% recorded in the Q4 2023.
Thank you very much, Claudia. Capital expenditures in the Q4 totaled $261 million, which compares with the $194 million reported in the Q3 of 2024 and $220 million recorded in the Q4 of 2023. The quarter- over- quarter comparison is explained by higher maintenance expenses. Regarding free cash flow during the period, there was a net outflow of $109 million compared to an inflow of $61 million in the Q3 of 2024 and $144 million outflow in the Q4 of 2023. When comparing quarter- over- quarter, the lower free cash flow is attributed to lower EBITDA and higher investments in the Q4 of 2024. Year- over- year, the increase in free cash flow is primarily explained by higher EBITDA generation and a greater reduction in working capital. We closed the Q4 of the year with $4,857 million in net debt.
Gross debt was $5.6 billion. Cash and cash equivalents, including financial investment with short-term maturities, were $697 million, almost $700 million. The net debt to EBITDA ratio closed the quarter at 3.15 times, lower than the 3.3 times in the last quarter and 3.46 times in December 2023. Regarding our debt profile, the average rate is 4.79% and the average maturity is 5.66 years. Now, I would like to share an update on the 24-25 fire season. On January 20, in the context of a large forestry fire at Los Sauces, three forest firefighters of one of our contractors, Serfonac, lost their lives while combating the flames at the fire in CMPC Forest. We are sad, and the whole CMPC team deeply regrets this loss.
In terms of the impacts of fires on the company's plantations, during the current season, approximately 1,400 hectares have been affected compared to the 100 hectares affected in the same period last year. The average in the last five years for the same time period has been 1,600 hectares. The company has made an important effort to increase and optimize its firefighting resources and thus provide an early response to fire outbreaks. To date, the company has 140 fire brigades and more than 1,000 firefighters supported by 10 helicopters, 11 air tankers, and three coordination aircraft. Now, I would like also to highlight some important events that occurred during the Q4 . In November 2024, CMPC was recognized for the second consecutive year as the world's most sustainable company by the Dow Jones Sustainability Index ranking for the paper and forest product sector.
This recognition is aligned with the company's strategy 2030, which has sustainability as a central component, and with the work that has been done since 2017 on the environmental front to combat climate change. Additionally, the School of Economics and Business of the Universidad de Chile recognized Luis Felipe Gacitúa, Chairman of CMPC, and Francisco Ruiz-Tagle, the company's CEO, for their outstanding professional careers. Gacitúa received the 90-year lifetime achievement award for his more than three decades of contribution in the telecom and forest sectors, especially in sustainability initiatives. Ruiz-Tagle was inducted into the FEN 2024 Circle of Honor in the Economy category, highlighting his significant contribution to the country's development and his commitment to the community. Finally, in December, at the Board of Directors Summit Chile 2024, CMPC received the Board of Directors of the Year 2024 award. On this occasion, 164 companies were evaluated.
The objective of this organization was to recognize the boards that have demonstrated exemplary leadership in overcoming the challenges of implementing the Financial Market Commission Rule 461. Now, I will turn the mic to Claudia for the Q&A section.
That you are welcome to make your questions, just raising your hand or typing in the chat box. We have already the first question that comes from Rafael Barcellos, Bradesco. Rafael, hello.
Hello, can you hear me?
Yes.
[crosstalk]
Okay, I can hear you.
Well.
Volume.
Okay. Okay, so good morning and thanks for taking my questions. So my first question is related to your pulp costs. So, I mean, your pulp costs have fallen significantly in recent quarters, right? But the company is still not generating a reasonable level of free cash flow, right, with prices at around mid 500. So I just wanted to understand, I mean, how do you see your pulp costs evolving in the coming quarters or if we really need to see pulp prices at a higher level in order to see a more reasonable level of cash flow generation, okay? That's the first question. And then my second question is about the Natureza project. I mean, could you please provide an update on how the project is evolving and, of course, whether you will submit the project to the board this year, right, in 2025? Thank you.
Thanks, Rafael, for your question. I'm going to take the first part. Regarding our cost, as part of our strategy, we have been working significantly on improving our cost structure. That's our competitiveness pillar of the strategy. We believe we have been very successful on that, but there's still plenty of room to improve. Particularly during this quarter, we had some specific events that affect our costs. For instance, we have a 45-day stoppage on the Guaíba 1 mill that is significantly longer than a regular year maintenance stoppage, and that was related to the revamp of the Guaíba 1 mill. During the year, we also had some operational issues in Santa Fe, in Guaíba as well, that affected our overall cost performance. But we have been advancing. The specific consumption on most of our main chemicals and other raw materials is improving.
So we should see better results in the coming quarters.
Francisco, maybe you can.
In connection, thank you, Rafael, for your question. In connection with the Natureza project, I have to say we continue advancing and would say in a regular way. We are now in a process of getting environmental permits. We are studying and in connection and a very well connection in the sense that we have been working and attending the requirements for having the normal approvals, environmental approvals, and advancing without any issue. Of course, we are also in a process of preparing the engineering and all the first part of this kind of a project. We don't see at this moment the approval of this project in the board of the CMPC during this year. It will be most probably mid next year.
Okay, great. Thanks. Very clear.
Just as a quick follow-up, Fernando, I mean, on the cost side, I mean, could you please be more specific on the potential for a cost reduction that you see on your pulp division?
Yeah, it's hard to be more specific, Rafael. We have plenty of initiatives that are underway. But no, we cannot disclose how much we can improve, but there is room for improvement.
Yeah. I can probably add some here, Rafael. We have a very strong initiative, competitive initiative that is always analyzing the opportunities we have. And probably a couple of things that we can mention regarding your concern is that in the wood, for instance, we have the opportunity of improving in some of the Chilean plants, the specific consumption of wood. And because we had some no problem, but we didn't get the best specific consumption in some of the mills, so we are already solving that. But this is marginal, but it's important. And also in energy, because of the instability of some of the mills, like Santa Fe in some part of the year, or for instance, in Guaíba, when we had the big climate issues last May, also we had some energy instability. And so I'm giving you two examples where we have opportunities, for instance.
Okay, thank you.
You're welcome.
Thank you, Rafael. Now we have a question coming from Eugenia Cavalheiro, Morgan Stanley. Eugenia, hello.
Hi, hi everyone. Can you hear me?
Yes.
Yes.
Good morning. Thank you for the call. I just wanted to check with you, what are your views on the trajectory of pulp prices and how do you see market dynamics given the recent events that we had in the sector? So just trying to understand what do you see for the year on pulp prices.
Thanks, Eugenia. Regarding pulp prices, as it has been announced by many players, prices have increased in January, about $20 in China and about $50-$60 net in Europe as well. In softwood, the market is still more tight than in hardwood. So we also were able to increase prices in about $20. Going forward is still hard to tell. There is a chance that during February, we will be able to increase again prices, but there's still a lot of discussions going on. For the rest of the year, we expect higher prices because we believe we are very near the floor, especially in hardwood. But we cannot anticipate yet what's going to happen, specifically because there's a lot of uncertainty in some market dynamics. Demand is still weak in some markets.
Paper prices have not been able to adjust and margins at paper makers are still very tight in some markets.
Thanks. Thanks a lot.
Thank you, Eugenia. The next question comes from Bank of America, Guilherme Rosito. Guilherme, good morning. Are you there?
Yes, good morning, everyone. Thank you for taking my questions. So my first one is on Natureza. I'm just wondering, as you guys get ready to show the project to the board, how are you guys thinking about financing of the project and the options on the table? I mean, how are you evaluating doing 100% on debt or maybe raising some cash via other mechanisms? Just want to get your thoughts on that. And my second question is on Softys. I'd like to know what kind of margins are you guys targeting for the year, just considering the competitive landscape in Brazil and the currency depreciation we've seen. Thank you.
Thanks, Guilherme, for the question. As Francisco mentioned, the approval of the project Natureza will not happen during this year and is probably going to happen by the first semester of next year. Therefore, it's too early to announce the financing strategy. As we have said before, what is more important is that CMPC has always had a commitment for having a strong balance sheet, and that's something we will maintain.
In connection with Softys, your question connected with Softys. Well, my answer is that we believe we have an important strong position in the market in Latin America. What it is too is that because of the devaluation of the currencies in several of our markets, of our main markets where we have more presence, our margins were affected, especially during the last quarter of this year. Softys has a very strong plan and has been working on the domestic prices in every market where we participate. We are still expecting maybe that margin in the range of 15% and up. This is our target there. We understand we have been living a very competitive situation in some of the markets, for instance, like in Brazil, one of them.
Perfect. Thank you so much.
You're welcome.
Thank you, Guilherme. We have a next question coming from JP Morgan, Tatiana Gandhi. Good morning.
Good morning. Can you hear me?
Yes.
Yes. Okay. So my first question is regarding the pulp prices. So you mentioned a little bit, and this is the dynamic that we have been seeing in the market, that the spreads between hardwood and softwood have been widening and not decreasing. And we see a lot of shutdowns. So the softwood market is a challenging one. My first question for you guys is, are you having any conversations or could have any plans on increasing capacity on the softwood market since we have some good prices at this moment? And my second question goes to the cost on the packaging side. So the margins in the quarter have been a little bit lower than our expectations. And we know that you have been working a lot, especially as you just mentioned in the pulp segment.
So is there any space for you guys to do the same type of working that you're doing in the pulp segment also in the packaging one? Thank you, guys, for having my questions.
Okay, Tatiana, thank you very much for your question. The first question, you know what? The project, the future we plan is, I mean, we plan the future of the company, of course, in the long term. And we are not seeing too much opportunity for growing softwood. Actually, we are basically planning to keep the capacity we have. And it is true that that market is tight today, and you see an important difference between the two fibers. But more concentrated in the future in short fiber. And it has to be with our Natureza project. Not seeing now, for now, any increase in softwood. In connection with the packaging, your question, yeah, we are doing the same strategy.
We are having for pulp, we are developing that in packaging in the sense that we have a lot of competitive contracts, internal competitive contracts with the different units we have in packaging like boxboard, corrugated paper, and boxes. And so we are studying, we're actually working on improving, of course, our margin there also. What is happening today in biopackaging is that we faced during the 2024 an important decrease in the construction market. And in that sense, it was affected the sack, especially business. And the reduction in some of the consumption of some of the countries where we are participating affected also the packaging. So this is why we probably didn't have the better results in boxboard or in corrugated boxes.
But, answering your question, we have very specific initiatives, of course, today working on that for improving our margin and always improving our margin because we think that we have the opportunity to be one of the best players, at least in the region, in those products.
Francisco, maybe just to complement on that and related to what Francisco mentioned about the markets, the construction market, but also the demand for boxboard. In general, in Biopackaging, volumes were lower. And because of that, the dilution of some fixed costs is tougher. We have been stopping some machines, especially conversion machines in the paper sack business. But it's not that easy, and it takes longer to adjust the cost structure. But as Francisco mentioned, the competitiveness strategy also pushes us to improve our cost in the Biopackaging business, and you will see results.
Thank you.
You're welcome. Thank you, Tatiana.
Thanks, Tatiana. We have a next question coming from Itaú Marcelo Furlan. Marcelo, good morning.
Good morning, guys. Can you hear me? Can you hear me, guys?
Yes,
okay. Hey. So thanks for taking my question here, guys. My first question is just a follow-up on Eugenia's questions regarding China. So do you guys have any view regarding how are paper makers' inventories? I know that you guys already discussed a little bit regarding paper makers' margins. So if you could also provide more details on margins specifically for your clients in China, it would be helpful. And my second question is related to capital allocation. So could you guys provide a little bit more color on CapEx for this year regarding growth and maintenance CapEx? In terms of growth, what would be the main avenues that you guys are expecting for this year to allocate CapEx? So these are my two questions. Thank you.
Thanks, Marcelo, for your question. Yes, as I previously mentioned and as part of your question, you know that there is excess of capacity in China that compresses margins and, of course, puts a lot of pressure on the pulp demand as a consequence of that. We have seen some stoppages, but it's tough to see the discipline we will expect under these circumstances with some paper makers, especially in China. Different is the case of Europe, where you have the higher-cost players reducing their capacity when their margins shrink. So yeah, but that's a reality we have to live with. Regarding your second question, can you repeat that one, please?
Yes, sure. Sure. Just an update regarding the capital allocation for this year in terms of CapEx, growth, CapEx, and maintenance. Thank you.
Yeah, of course, we have our budgeting process. We approve our operational budget, but also our CapEx budget. We are working with a CapEx for next year between $600-$700 million. About half of that is plantations or CapEx related to our forest asset. We also have some maintenance CapEx there.
Okay. Thank you so much, guys.
You're welcome.
Thanks.
Thanks, Marcelo. Now comes the next question with Goldman Sachs, Enrique Marques. Enrique, are you there?
Hey, guys, can you hear me?
Yes.
Great. So just two follow-ups on the Natureza project. First one regarding timing. During the last call, you mentioned that you were expecting to get environmental permits by Q1 2025. Just wanted to check on how's the timing of that? Are you guys going to be able to get it on the Q1 or not? And then second question, follow-up. I know you mentioned it's too early to comment about the financing of the project, but I just wanted to know if there's a possibility that you could cut dividends to be able to focus on the project's CapEx. Is that a possibility? Is that something you guys are thinking about or no dividend policy will not be changed by any means because of the project? Thank you.
Thank you, Enrique. Well, as I mentioned before, we have been running in a very regular way our environmental permits. Yeah, during the Q1 , the H1 of the year, I would say we should be receiving the approval for the previous approval, licencia previa. And then for building the project, you need the licencia de instalación, installation permit. And we are totally under the normal timing. So we're not seeing any problem in this. We also created a very formal team in the state where we're working, and especially the authorities, Ministério Público, FEPAM, authorities, the environmental authorities, and the company working on all the requirements, the environmental requirements, and working, I would say, without any issue, any problem in that. So this is my answer for the environmental permits. And probably you can mention some about the financing and what we are thinking.
Yeah. Thanks, Enrique. Regarding dividend policy, in the last general shareholders' assembly meeting, a 30% dividend policy was approved. Unfortunately, in Chile, the law requires companies to pay at least 30%. The only way to reduce that percentage is to have 100% of the shareholders' approval, which for a company like CMPC, it's not possible. You will have to bring all 100% shareholders to a meeting to approve this. So that's not something we can work as a reality or a real alternative. So the most reasonable way to think about our future dividend policy is maintaining this 30% we have today.
Thank you, Enrique, and we have another question coming from Juraj Domic, LarrainVial.
Hello.
Hello, good morning. Can you hear me?
Yes.
Perfect. Good morning, everyone. Thanks for the presentation. I was wondering if you could provide us more comments on the increase on the maintenance CapEx for the quarter. I know that you mentioned some incidents at the beginning of the session, so I don't know if it related to that, and just that's my question.
No, the most important one, and it was part of the Guaíba One revamp. That was a very significant project for us and for the future of Guaíba One line. It was a 45-day stoppage, so that increased our cost. But also, we had other major maintenance during the quarter, like Pacífico. So that's mainly what explained the deviation on maintenance cost.
Just to clarify, the cost of the maintenance of every program, maintenance of mills was very much what we budgeted. We are spending in terms of the budget; we are spending what we program for every of this maintenance period. And just to clarify, the linear 1 in Guaíba, that was the one that took more time. It was also a program revamp of the line, and so it was a program period. And that line represents 20% of the total production in Guaíba. So it's not the most important part of our production, but it was harder to start with the line after this long, several days of maintenance. It was harder compared with what we budgeted in that line. And it created some extra costs, but I wouldn't say that is the most important thing in terms of maintenance for the company.
Okay, perfect. Thank you.
Okay. You're welcome.
Thank you, Juraj. We don't have more questions, so I think that's all for today.
Okay.
Maybe anyone wants to make a question? We still have a minute. No?
Thank you very much, everybody, for the meeting today.
Thank you. Have a good day.