Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the NCAB Group Quarter One Report two thousand and twenty. Today, I'm pleased to present CEO, Hans Ståhl, and CFO, Anders Forsén. For the first part of this call, all participants will be in listen only mode, and afterwards, there will be a question and answer session. Speaker, please begin.
Yes, good morning, everybody. We are sitting here in Stockholm, where there is a lot of sunshine, finally. So I'm sitting here together with Anders Forsén and Jenny Lerman, and we're gonna talk about the Q1 result for NCAB. So you can see on the first page there with the agenda, so we're going to talk a little bit short about NCAB and the Q1, in short, Q1 financials, and then we're gonna make a summary, and then there is, as we said, a space for questions and answers. So NCAB. We are 17 companies around the world, and we are delivering our products to 45 markets, and we are 452 specialists or employees, but we like to call ourselves specialists.
And we are working with 23 factories, and also we have a mission where we say that we are selling printed circuit board for a demanding customer, and that's extremely important. And, of course, on time, zero defects, and lowers the total cost. And our vision is to be number one PCB producer wherever we are. So if we enter a new market, we're gonna be the biggest there. So next page. So what is a printed circuit boards? It's actually the board, it's one could say that it's connecting all components. There's a lot of cables, but it's in a board, and you've probably seen it all. It's a green plate.
And the beauty with the circuit board is, it's a rather inexpensive product, but if something goes wrong at the end product, it's extremely costly to make a recall from the market. So we make the only the printed circuit boards, the customer assembled the boards, and we are working in a high-mix, low-volume niche, meaning that we don't supply the high-volume boards because there is no margin in those. And next page, we're describing our journey. So the company was founded back in nineteen ninety-three by three gentlemen. They all have been producing circuit boards. And we have been growing basically every year except two thousand and nine, where we see some similarities with what's happening right now in the market. In two thousand and nine, we handled very well.
We also had a healthy profit in two thousand and nine, and we are actually having the same strategy now. We are putting a lot of effort into growing, even if we are seeing a downgoing trend. And you can see also, we start a lot of companies during this voyage, and we also have made a couple of acquisitions. So the first one was two thousand and twelve, where we entered the American market, North American market. We made two acquisitions, and then we made one in Sweden, and then one in Denmark. Last year, Multiprint, and another one in the US, Altus. And then recently, we have made two acquisitions in Flatfield, in Holland, and BBG in the USA. On next page, you can see the quarter in numbers.
We have grown plus 8% on the net sales in Swedish crowns, and in measuring US dollars is plus 3%, and EBITDA is plus 8%, 8, which we are very proud of. The highlights of the quarter is, of course, the acquisitions of Flatfield in the Netherlands, which we made the first of March. We have also we have found a replacement for me, Peter Kruk, that has been recruited, and he's preliminary. He will start on first of October at the latest. Also, the board, we drew the suggested dividends, and we published also preliminary Q1 results. Then we made an acquisition of BBG in Florida, effective from the first of May. We also made a direct share issue conducted at a market price with trusted institutional investors.
And then also, like, we all are talking about today, how does the coronavirus affect our operations? At first, I mean, the virus struck the Chinese factories, but they are now back in production. So we are saying they're running about 80% of the capacity of all our factories. But then, of course, the virus spread to Europe. So in Europe and USA, they have basically been closed down from end of March. However, a lot of factories are customers located outside the big cities. So I would say maybe 70% of the factories still working, customers. And the labor has actually worked well, despite the difficult logistics situation with less air traffic. And we do get a lot of orders.
During the Q1, we had a good order income, and of course, customers placed some of the orders are for the fall.
... and the factories are very busy in China producing 5G equipment for the Chinese market. So of course, activities, it's a little bit different. We are building customer relationships now via telephone, WebEx, webinars, et cetera, which is a little bit different, but it has been very successful, and we can have one webinar we arranged in Holland was visited by a customer from Germany, France, et cetera. So it actually, we have seen a new way of marketing. And of course, we are having a dialogue to secure the deliveries to customers and factories with the customers every day, and our team in China also consists of almost 90 people working with the factories on a daily basis. And of course, we have also actively seek support from each state in all different countries.
And we also, of course, we are focused on reducing our costs, as much as possible. And the impact, of course, this will impact, coming quarters, 2020. So a little bit about the acquisitions. First of all, we acquired Flatfield, a company in the Netherlands, and they were the biggest supplier in the Benelux area, and also they have a lot of sales in Germany. They had a turnover of about SEK 300 million. The profit was on SEK 25 million, with 50 employees, mainly in Netherlands and Germany, but also 15 located in China, and they have all been incorporated with our operation. And the purchase price was SEK 182 million, with an approximate multiple of seven.
And we have consolidated into NCAB as of March the first. And then, just a couple of weeks ago, we made an acquisition of BBG in Florida, in Largo. They are a leading supplier in the US market, also selling to Canada. They have a little bit different setup because they buy about 75% from Taiwan, which then means that we do not need to pay any import tariffs when they import into the US. The revenue was about $280 million in 2019, and with a profit level of 18%, and 30 employees, whereof 10 in Taiwan. And the purchase price was $125 million, which is also a multiple of 7. And they will be consolidated into NCAB as of the first of May. Mm-hmm? Anders. Mm-hmm, okay. Anders Forsén here.
We'moonre back to the next slide, a little bit about the revenue and EBITDA for first quarter. We managed to see a growth in all segments except East, and the East was of course affected very much by the COVID-19 or the corona situation, especially in China, where all our customers were closed for three, four weeks. Even if you can see a growth number, they are very much connected to acquisitions. Nordic, we did this Multiprint acquisition in March two thousand and nineteen, and the main reason why we still made a small growth was due to that. Also Europe, we show a 16% growth, biggest part of that is coming from the acquisition of Flatfield.
And in North America, we also present the growth, main part coming from acquisition of Altus in November, and also that from 2020 report, the tariffs has net sales. So we have changed a little bit in the reported structure, more to follow the recommendations from IFRS. Going back to the EBITDA margin, we still see a very stable and good margin for Nordic. They were a little bit down in Q4, but we are back to almost 17%, which we are very proud of. Europe continues on a rather stable level of 6%, and North America have been doing very well the last couple last year, you could say. We've seen a positive trend since second quarter 2019. So they are now up to a very decent level.
East margin is down 2000 this quarter, and the reason is, of course, that we had a low revenue in China, and also that we had some negative impact from the weakening ruble versus US dollar in Russia. So we got a one-time hit when we recalculate the trade receivables and trade liabilities, mainly. So we don't see this as a new trend. Going back to the next page, you can see that we still continue to show a growth. We reached last twelve months just about SEK 1.8 billion, and we continue to have a stable growth margin, which of course, is very important. We don't see any trends that the margins would do differently due to the corona situation.
Going back to the next page then, as we said, we see, yes, we are growing, but we are growing due to acquisitions, so the organic growth is a little bit slower, but we're anyway happy to present that result due to the situation. I mean, when we saw, we can believe that the production stop in China would affect the revenue rather much, and of course, it is affected, so it's good to see that we managed to keep the revenue stable, and what is more important is to see that we still have a very strong order intake, 27% increase in first quarter. Of course, we have to bear in mind that part of it is from Flatfield, and also we see a trend that the customers are placing order for a longer lead time.
And that's of course, they were worried about the situation in China, so to be able to secure the deliveries in second and third quarter, they placed orders with longer lead times. So that's part of the reason why we can see this strong order intake in first quarter. But anyway, it's good to see that we are still working good with customers and getting a lot of orders. Next page, if we go down to the EBITDA. Excluding the costs for the transaction costs for the Flatfield acquisition, we managed to increase the EBITDA to SEK 43.7 million, which is 9%, which is very much close to last year, where we had 9.1%. We're also happy to see that earnings per share increased compared to last year.
The main reason for the positive effect there is that we also have some positive currency effect from the result. So even if we report a 7.8% EBITDA margin in the quarter, we have to remember that part of it is due to one-time cost for the Flatfield. So still, we are running on a stable EBITDA margin of about 9%. Going to the segments, Nordic, as I said, small growth. Main reason for the growth is, of course, that we now calculate, Multiprint acquisition full quarter. It was only one quarter last year. And I think, Nordic was the segment most affected, by the current situation, except for East. And the reason is that they are very much time to delivery, customers in Nordic.
We don't have so much inventory, so of course, when the deliveries didn't come from China, we had a lot of delays, which impacted the revenue negatively. Anyway, we managed to keep a stable gross margin, and we also kept a very healthy EBITDA margin, so EBITDA increased from SEK 21 million to SEK 22 million. And also here, we can see a very positive growth in order intake, 37% on Nordic. But of course, here as well, it is that it's longer lead times, so the orders are sort of spread out over a longer time. Going to Europe, we show a growth of 16%. Main part is, of course, from the Flatfield acquisition, which we made starting from first of March. You can say that Europe is very different in different regions.
We have a very strong development in Germany, and we also see from the revenue that the Flatfield operations in Germany is also going very well. On the other hand, we see a very weak situation in Southern Europe, where both Italy and Spain have been more or less closed down. We also see that UK operation we have are rather dependent on automotive, and they also suffered a lot during the first quarter. So we see very different trends. So we can say that the southern part is going down, while Germany is increasing a lot. But anyway, the number shows a small growth for them, for the whole segment. Also here, we managed to keep a stable EBITDA level.
And if you look historically at what Flatfield have been doing, they have been doing a little bit more than 6%. So I think we should be continue to have around on a stable EBITDA level for Europe. Order intake increased 21%. We're also proud of that. That's good. Going into North America, where I know we have been struggling for a while, but we saw a positive trend from end of 2019, and we can see that continue, which is good. We saw a increase of net sales of 19%. A big part is, of course, from the Altus acquisition we made in November. And also the rest, you can say, is connected to that the change of reported structure, where we have the tariffs at the net sales.
On the tariff side, we can see that there have been some evening up. We have taken away the tariffs for two and four-layer boards, the most simple boards. Of course, maybe it's not that much volume for us, or money at least, but anyway, it's a sign that something might happening, which is positive. The acquisition of Altus PCB we did in November has gone rather well. 100% integrated into NCAB and we see a good development of the margin. We can also see that the profit level have been increasing thanks to the acquisition of Altus. So we are running about close to 10% EBITDA margin in US, and we have improved that a lot during the last three, four quarters.
Even here, you can see very strong order intake, 40% higher than last year, but also here, we have to bear in mind that it's a much longer lead time. Going down to East, we were suffering on revenue side in China. First of all, we had the Chinese New Year, and then the factory, or the customers were closed for about three weeks. So of course, revenue were hit rather badly in February. On the other hand, we saw a growth in March, which was positive. Russia continued to do rather well in the first quarter. Result, EBITDA, of course, we were suffering from the weaker revenue in China, and even if we had a good revenue in Russia, we had a big hit on the exchange rate when the ruble went down dramatically.
In especially March, but that is a one-time impact. Order intake for East also positive, 20% increase and mainly in the Chinese operation. Next slide, then we also made a directed share issue, Hans Ståhl. We did that in connection with the World Group acquisition. So we got 1,850 new shares, and it was a very positive process, and we had a book building process where we actually got a lot of new good investors, some new investors and also a lot of old ones that continued to buy more shares in NCAB. We're also proud that the price actually was SEK 155, the same as the closing price for the Friday when we did the share increase.
And of course, this gives us a lot of financial flexibility, that gives us opportunity to hopefully continue to do acquisitions at this time, and also to secure other activities in the company. So we are very, very financially stable, which is good. Then next slide, some balance sheet KPIs. Return on equity, a little bit lower than we was December, but it's mainly due to that we have increased equity. And of course, we have a little bit higher net debt since we have taken new loans for the acquisition on Flatfield. Equity is still rather good. Net working capital, still below 10% of last 12-month revenue. I mean, we do not have very much in our stock and inventory, et cetera, so we are very cashly.
Flatfield, on the other hand, had a little bit different structure. They had more inventory business, stock business, so they had a little bit higher working capital than NCAB had been working with before. And of course, due to this new stock share issue we did in April, so after April, we actually have disposable cash for about SEK 500 million. That is very, very safe and very strong, and we have good possibilities to act in the future. Hans?
Mm-hmm. Yes, so the summary of Q1 is that we are extremely happy that we have been able to make two acquisitions, important acquisitions, and also the order intake is very strong. And of course, part of it is the customers are ordering for a longer time. But I also think that we do take market shares. And gross margin, EBITDA remains very strong. Factories are very busy in China as they are building 5G network in China. And the direct share issue has given... will give us a lot of opportunities because there will be a lot of opportunities during these times for the coming year. And of course, the corona pandemic will be negative in the coming quarters. So that was the summary.
Looking at our strategic plan going forward, we have kind of made four squares. We have four strategies, and of course, increased market share in Europe, USA, and East. We still have an extremely low market share in these countries, so there is so much more to do. And part of this is, of course, the acquisitions we have done, and also to deepen the relationship with the existing customers is a huge potential because there are many of them where we just maybe deliver 2-3% of their total need. And of course, expand geographically, not only meaning that we expand to all different countries, we also expand within the countries. Like Germany, we're setting up more offices, same in the US, also we're setting up more offices in different areas.
And also to consolidate the market, we see a huge potential, which we have shown here also by these two acquisitions. But the thing is that the Chinese factories, they are consolidating, becoming bigger and bigger, and the smaller kind of traders, they will struggle. The smaller customers also today buying directly, they will struggle because they get too small in these big factories. So we have an extremely positive view on the future. And then we have the financial targets on page 24, which is what we are delivering on. And if you see the growth, it's where we are, not really making them, but that should be seen over a couple of years, it's 8%. Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm. Thank you very much, Hans Ståhl and Anders Forsén. I just would like to remind everyone that our next quarterly report, Q2, is on July twenty-fourth, and now we're open for questions.
Okay, thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, if you have a question for the speaker, please press zero one on your telephone keypad. I remind you that if you want to ask a question, you will have to press zero one on your telephone keypad. And we have our first questions from Robert Redin from Carnegie. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, morning. Yeah, sort of groups of questions, please. So one is on the order intake and the outlook into Q2. Order intake, they're positive in Q1, but you say it's sort of a longer order book than normal. Could you say something about the sales development or the trends in April or quarter to date? How should we think about that strong order intake, on the other hand, the uncertainty into Q2?
Mm-hmm. It's as Anders said, it's a little bit different depending on where we are in the world. I mean, the southern part of Europe, yes, it's weak. In general, yes, it's weakened, one could say.
Mm-hmm.
But Germany is still, if we talk about countries, it's still pushing hard. So it's amazing to see how this country or how we are doing in Germany. In some way, I can say that April was still rather stable, but we saw a negative trend in the order intake after Easter. So the second half of April was a little bit weaker if you measure day by day basis, as I say. So there was a trend shift after Easter, but April still looks pretty okay.
Mm-hmm. Okay, so no dramatic drop in April, but a weakening trend?
A weakened, exactly. Yeah, yeah, and then it is, as I said before, it's different, different markets. Of course, there have been low activity in Spain and Italy, mainly, also partly in France.
Right. Of course. Mm-hmm. Okay, thanks. And then on that, margin in the USA, it was strong in quarter one. And of course, Altus is a part of that margin improvement. But, can you say something about how the margin has developed excluding the input of Altus?
I mean, we have been working for a long time on to improve margin in the USA, and that kind of have paid off in the long term. One could also say that we are kind of, as you remember, we have shifted from high volume to more high tech stuff, and that the high tech has a much higher gross margin, which gives then a higher margin on the bottom line. Finally, it pays off all the efforts we have put into the US. We could also see from the Altus business that we start to use our price agreements, that we have a little bit better pricing.
And that has been seen maybe in the end of the quarter, but there have been some effect on the gross margin on the old Altus business as well, which is positive. And to tell, I mean, we have been working with the cost structure for a long time in USA, and that started to pay off last autumn, and we can see the trend continues, so that feels good.
Okay, so good traction on the margins then, also-
Yeah
on the line.
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
The final question is on acquisitions. So you're down to pretty large acquisitions now, but you're also taking in a fair amount of new money. So should we interpret that as the M&A pipeline remaining sort of strong? Or is it a precautionary measure, or how should we think about the M&A pipeline going forward?
Of course, this is to give us the opportunity, at least, and I mean, we still have a pipeline of potential acquisitions. But we also know it takes some time. I mean, both for Flatfield and BBG, we started the discussions in autumn 2019. So it will take some time, but there are opportunities in the market. We do have a pipeline. And of course, I think this corona situation would create some more troubles for some smaller actors. So of course, there will be some opportunities. And by having this new cash, we at least can act quickly if we have the right opportunity.
Okay, sounds hopeful, too. Thanks. Those are my questions. Thank you.
Thank you.
Okay, thank you. Our next question is from Andres Rolfsson, from DNB Markets. Please go ahead.
Good morning, and congratulations to a great report, and thank you for taking my questions. I have two of them. The first one is regarding your two new acquisitions. They're rather big adds, almost 30% to your top line, and they have pretty much the same margins, EBITDA margins, that you have today in the running business. How do you see them? Is there a possibility to raise that level, or are they, so to speak, already running on a way on a level that, so to speak, is the normal?
I think they might be a little bit different. We think. I mean, first of all, these two are rather big acquisitions, meaning that they still have rather good purchase prices. I don't think we can expect the same impact on margin as we have seen on the Danish Multiprint and Altus. But of course, there are some areas where we can improve. I think for the Flatfield one, we can. We have noticed that we have a much stronger quality focus. We are using a little bit different factories in China, and I think also we have a stronger follow-up. We are quite sure that we can improve the quality work to the customers, or the Flatfield customers.
And that will hopefully pay off at some time, maybe in higher margin or at least in lower claim costs. And for the U.S. one, they source a lot in Taiwan.
Of course, that is really interesting for us, and get the better sourcing in Taiwan, as you would say, because we don't have the tariffs and also from some political risks. That is good to have a sourcing outside China. Taiwan pricing is much higher than China, so there is a difference there. But the gross margin in the BBG acquisition is far lower than NCAB, so over time, at least, there should be some potential in increasing that one, but it's difficult to say right now.
Mm. I think, yeah, it just come into the figure, so to speak. The other question is regarding the, perhaps, like a longer-term view, talking to some other companies, they're talking about and trying perhaps to-- I mean, there's a long lead time to change where you produce things. But regarding China, there are some thoughts that might be a hurt, the hurt- will hurt them in the longer term, having so much production companies in China. How do you see the long-term view regarding production of different circuit boards, for example? Would you see that you need to move to other countries to not be so depdent on China?
Yeah. Well, of course that would be excellent if one could do that. But as China is acting right now, they are building new factories, they are putting a lot of resources in building new factories, and the fact is their building is really state-of-the-art, fully optimized, et cetera, et cetera. So it's from a kind of being able to offer the best product to customers, one have to go to China today, and at least within 10 years' time. But still, we think this with Taiwan is a good option we have if something will happen with China. But I think that China will dominate completely within at least minimum 10 years going forward. So that's where we have to be, whether we like it or not.
Personally, I do like to make business with the Chinese. I think they are the perfect partner for us.
All right. And finally, perhaps one more question as regarding now that a lot of countries opening up here, rather slowly, of course. Can you see, or is it possible to see how that will affect you? I mean, you're saying it could be probably a slower quarter, number two quarter here, but if you look into, is it possible that you could be surprised at how quickly it can come back or so?
Hopefully, yeah, let's hope for it. But I think we all think it, it's gonna take a while because it's a rather complex supply chain for... I mean, we just look at the cars. It takes a long time to start up a factory because they are carrying product from all over the world. So we believe it's gonna take a while.
Yep. Thank you so much for taking my questions.
Thank you.
Okay, thank you. Our next question is from Jon Hyltner, from Enter Fonder. Please go ahead.
Hi, but first, all my questions are about the acquisitions. If we start with the BBG acquisition, where you have suppliers, or you get access to factories in Taiwan, if I understand it correctly. Does this work similarly for BBG as it does for you, that you have a big chunk of customers, and then you get access and better prices at the factories, but in this case, in Taiwan instead of China?
Yes, probably, but we are at this stage. We don't know how much more Taiwan jobs we can put at the Taiwan suppliers. Of course, that is the aim, to negotiate with them also about to lower the prices and get better conditions.
But it's the same principle that they consolidate orders from many customers and place them to the few number of factories in Taiwan. So, of course, it is the same way as we are working with our Chinese operation. We also have this team of 10 people working in Taiwan, securing quality, lead time, et cetera. So in that way, we're working in the same way, but from two sourcing countries. And BBG have maybe 25% in China, sourcing in China, and the rest from Taiwan.
Will you be able to get better access to these factories from your other subsidiaries that you have in the U.S., for example? Will you work together and then come with even bigger purchasing power and get access to perhaps more factories in Taiwan?
Absolutely. Absolutely. I think they today have about five, six different factories. Maybe that we will shrink that number at least to focus on getting more purchasing power in some of them. So, but of course, the whole group will actually get access to these Taiwanese factories. So there is an opportunity for these factories to expand.
We also opened up one factory in Taiwan when the tariffs was initiated last year. But still, the pricing was difficult and the logistics was very expensive since you have so low volume. Then, of course, together with the volumes from BBG, we will have better logistics pricing, et cetera, that could open up some new possibilities.
What capacity does Taiwan, in total, have? Are there a big number of factories that you don't work with today, but if you would grow bigger and source more from Taiwan, you could double or triple the amount of factories you work with there to get big volumes from Taiwan to the US, for example, instead of from China?
Yeah, of course, but we don't see that we're gonna get more factories. Probably, we're gonna place more orders with the factories that they have. So that's the way we would like to work, if they can meet up to our demand. We have pretty tough demands for quality on the factories, so that has to be seen.
Okay, and you also mentioned that prices are much higher in Taiwan versus in China. So then I guess you speak of PCBs of the same quality, and when you buy them from the factory, they are much more expensive in Taiwan than from China.
Yeah, correct.
Roughly how much more expensive?
I would say on average, we're 15%, roughly. A little bit depending on what sort of product. If we talk about it, about high volume, yes, they are much more expensive. But if you look at the prototyping, quick turnaround, high tech, it's not that a big difference.
So the... Your key market of low volume, difficult or high quality PCBs, then the price difference, Taiwan versus China isn't that big. Is that what you are saying?
Correct. It's a good add-on to our factory palette, so.
There's no tariff to Taiwan, to U.S.
Correct.
So that would mean, well, that would mean then a 25% price benefit for US customers.
Yeah. Yeah, we could say, yeah.
Sorry for so many questions, but I'm thinking about the U.S. market. Everyone and Anders mentioned this before, but everyone is talking about the big insourcing trend that could happen. It already started with the tariffs, tariff war between China and the U.S., and now with Corona, perhaps everyone will try to move home factories, instead of outsourcing. U.S. still has a lot of production of PCBs, I think.
Yes.
What's the price difference or the cost difference of producing in the US? And is there a risk of this type of production going from China to other developed countries? And what would you do if that happens?
Now, I mean, the cost difference is huge. And the factories today in U.S. is predominantly ITAR business. I mean, they are selling to the military, U.S. military, and also the high-tech boards. So, I mean, the low-tech boards, they will never, ever be able to produce in the U.S. So that has to come from Asia. So, and for us, it could be the insourcing could actually be good, because what they first insource, that is actually production of PCBA. So the assembly of the components on our boards, that's maybe being brought back to the U.S. So we don't see any threat that we're gonna build factories in the U.S. for low-tech boards. We don't think that will happen.
They need to have the low tech boards.
Yeah
... Also, to be able even to produce your segment of more low volume boards.
Absolutely. Absolutely. And also as a proof of this is that they have actually taken away the tariffs on the kind of more low tech boards. Because the USA will go bust if they can't produce the low tech boards to that price level, so.
Okay. And, the reason for the Chinese being much more having lower costs, is it mainly personnel or is it that they've invested in highly efficient,
Mm-hmm
... production?
That's an interesting... It's both, actually. If you go like twenty years ago, it was all that, was lower cost, lower salaries, but salaries has gone up. So now it's access to money to build the factories, because today they afford, they can build factories that is fully automated, et cetera, et cetera. So therefore, they have a cost benefit, and they don't need to pay so much for the money.
Okay, final question, and a completely different one. If you look at electronics in general, I mean, computers, laptops, et cetera, I mean, it's been pretty high demand during this Corona period. I don't really know the end customer exposure for your PCBs. I know we're going to high-mix low-volume products, but that's about it. Can you say anything about the end customer? Have they been affected during this Corona period? Is it products that if it's a lockdown, they are not being bought, or is it the opposite, that these products are being bought by your customers, the end customers anyhow?
Yeah, it's a big variation, I would say. I mean, we have some customers in the automotive transport sector that has kind of gone down a lot, and then we have some medical customers also. I mean, we are delivering boards for ventilators. That's a huge demand, and there are a number of products in the industry that what we have seen has not been affected. And also we do get a lot of orders for the kind of braking systems now for the high-speed trains in China, because China is pushing hard now to recover from their kind of slump in China. So it varies a lot. A lot. But I think in general, we don't focus very much on consumer goods, so I don't think you can see a trend.
If the consumers buy more PCs or whatever, that will not have an impact on us in that way, but there might be some other areas in semi-consumer or technical areas. And as I said, especially in the med tech right now, that has been increasing a lot.
All right. Thank you very much.
Thank you.
Okay, thank you. There are no further questions at this time. Please go ahead, speakers.
Okay, thank you very much for listening to us, and hope to see you or hear from you next time we report the Q2 results. Thank you.
Thank you. Thank you. Okay, thank you. That does now conclude our conference call. You may now disconnect.