Rieter Holding AG (SWX:RIEN)
Switzerland flag Switzerland · Delayed Price · Currency is CHF
3.235
+0.025 (0.78%)
May 13, 2026, 5:31 PM CET
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Earnings Call: H1 2023

Jul 20, 2023

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. A warm welcome from my side. First, our performance in a nutshell. The first half year was marked by a continuously low market sentiment with respective low order intake. However, our financial performance has substantially improved in the top line and also in the bottom line area. Second, the team has worked on the strategic front, and we have developed a performance program called Next Level. This program entails some very tough decisions. We believe that they are necessary to ensure the long-term success of our company. Next Level should allow Rieter to achieve an ambitious financial performance at any time in the cyclical market of textile industries. In order to get there, however, we will need to make some painful adjustments. I will explain what this means shortly. First, let's look at the agenda.

We would like to share with you some insights into the market environment. Kurt will elaborate on the financials. Afterwards, I will take you through our planned performance program, Next Level, and finally, we give you an outlook for 2023. I will go directly now to slide 3, and we'll stay quite brief with the key messages on the first half year, 2023. Overall, we have a solid financial performance with positive EBIT and net profit. Our in- order intake was suffering according to the very low market sentiment, driven by a low demand for textile products. However, our backlog is still healthy and covers the second half of 2023, as well as the beginning of 2024. I was positively impressed about our operational improvements. We further stabilized our supply management and were able to achieve a remarkable increase of our sales volume.

In the first half year of 2023, we turned, therefore, increased volumes, strict cost management, and improved processes into results. Our gross profit, our EBIT, and our net profit showed remarkable improvements. Also, Free Cash Flow improved, but was still suffering from a high level of net working capital. All in all, we made the right step into the right direction and will continue to work hard to improve our operational performance. More details will be presented afterwards by Kurt. Let's move now to the market environment on page number five and six. On page five, you see the market development of 2021 until 2023, based on purchasing decisions of our customers and not based on deliveries. It is clearly visible that after the very strong semesters in the second half, 2021, and first half, 2022, the market slowed down dramatically.

Although the first half year, 2023, is slightly above the second half, 2022, we still suffer from a very low investment sentiment. Our expectation is that volumes in order intake will pick up only in Q4 of 2023, at the earliest. On a regular basis, we measure the operating rate of spinning wheels worldwide. You see this on slide number 6. As you can tell, this operating rate is roughly 10 percentage points lower than in 2022. However, we saw in the first six months a slight improvement from even lower levels at the beginning of the year. We expect that this will further improve towards the end of the year, and that the corresponding demand for consumables, wear and tear, and spare parts will probably recover later in 2023. Let's turn to slide 7 and our presence at the ITMA.

At the lead exhibition, ITMA, this June in Milan, we presented many new innovations, which demonstrate the technology leadership of Rieter in the industry. Our focus was on technology quantum leaps, which enable our customers to have the lowest cost per kilogram yarn. In addition, we focused on digitization, automation, and recycling solutions. The feedback of our customers was overwhelming, and it gives us great confidence that once the market picks up again, our order intake will grow as well. The reservation lists we had for all our new machines were filled within a few days. Let me now hand over to Kurt, who will lead you through our most important financials. Kurt, please.

Kurt Ledermann
CFO, Rieter

Thank you, Thomas. Good morning, welcome also from my side to this call. Let me start with some key figures on slide 9. In the first half of 2023, global market downturns, which were already apparent in the second half of 2022, led to a low order intake of CHF 325 million. Sales of CHF 758 million were recorded. This corresponds to an increase of 22.2%. Gross profit increased by more than CHF 50 million. The biggest contributor was the sales volume growth. The growth margin increased from 21% to 24% and confirms the improvement of the margin quality. EBIT increased by CHF 35.5 million to CHF 25.2 million, or to a margin of 3.3%. Free Cash Flow in the first half of 2023 was at CHF 10 million.

This reflects the positive trend in operating profit, while the net working capital remains at a high level, which means it has not yet contributed to the Free Cash Flow. Net liquidity mirrors the currently high sales volume. The increase in net working capital is temporarily financed with short-term loans. This is expected to normalize in the second half year of the year, when the current backlog is further processed. As you can see on slide 10, Rieter recorded a low order intake of only CHF 325 million in the first half of 2023, lower than in the corresponding period of the previous year, however, higher than in the second half of 2022. The order intake in almost all regions was characterized by the reluctance to invest in new machines.

Only in China, order intake did increase due to investments by spinning mills in improving their local competitiveness. At the same time, demand for consumables, wear, care, and spare parts declined due to the global market downturn. We currently see a quite strong project pipeline under negotiation. However, high interest rates for investments as well as low demand in textile end markets are weighing on order intake. The business model of Components and After Sales is less cyclical than the Machines & Systems, hence, the reduction of order intake is less prominent. On June 30th, 2023, the order backlog was at around CHF 1.1 billion. This is more than CHF 1 billion lower than last June, but still extends well into the year 2024.

As in the previous year, cancellations in the reporting period were around 5% of the order backlog, also impacted by the effects of the severe earthquake in Turkey. In the first half of 2023, Rieter posted sales of CHF 758 million, as you can see on slide 11. This corresponds to an increase of 22.2%. The business group, Machines & Systems, recorded a very strong project execution, despite some postponements because of the earthquake in Turkey. Machines & Systems and after-sales growth is supported by a base effect. The acquired winder business was only consolidated as of Q2, 2022. 2022 includes 3 months, while 2023 includes 6 months in sales of this business.

The business group Components experienced a base effect, as the SSM business benefited from a significant peak in a specific market during 2022. This was not repeated in 2023. Although decreasing, Rieter still faces issues with material shortages. A dedicated cross-functional task force to improve the situation is still in place. Let me move to slide 12. Gross profit increased by more than CHF 50 million. The biggest contributor is the sales volume increase. The growth margin increased from 21% to 24% and proves the step-by-step improvement of the margin quality. This includes higher price quality, higher productivity and efficiency in project execution, as well as strong focus on cost management. R&D, as well as SG&A, increased mainly for the following 3 reasons: the base effect from the acquisition consolidated only as of Q2 2022, as mentioned before.

Expenses for alternative technical solutions to overcome material shortages and higher marketing expenses related to the ITMA 2023, an important trade fair that only takes place every four years. Rieter posted in the first half of 2023, an EBIT of CHF 25.2 million and an EBIT margin of 3.3%. Let's move to slide 12. As communicated on July 10, Rieter sold the land in Winterthur, which is no longer required for the operations, to Allreal. The company is acquiring the land with a total area of around 75,000 square meters. The agreed sales price is CHF 96 million. Transfer of ownership is expected to take place in the fall of this year, after fulfillment of the legal and contractual completion conditions. Rieter anticipates a positive impact on EBIT of around CHF 70 million-CHF 75 million in 2023. The resulting cash flow is at CHF 85 million-CHF 90 million. The new Rieter campus, currently under construction, is not part of this transaction. With this, I hand over the word back to Thomas.

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Thank you, Kurt. Let's now turn to the next agenda item. Next Level on slide number 14. In my first couple of months here, I had to learn what all of you already know: We are in a cyclical business. In the past, Rieter was financially performing below expectations, not according to yours, but also not according to ours. With the actual cost structure in products, but also in overheads, we risk sliding into negative profitability whenever we face a low market scenario. The team has worked hard to develop a program which shall enable Rieter to create long-term value for our customers, employees, and shareholders. Rieter, as a technology leader, is planning a performance program called Next Level. Before I present the details, let me say this: This program is extremely urgent, but also contains some painful elements.

Given the cyclicality of the business and the company's previous underperformance, we have to make radical changes now. On slide 15, you see the goals of the program: strengthen our sales excellence, sharpen our customer focus, improve the cost efficiency in our production, and optimize our fixed cost structures, the so-called overheads. With this program, we want to create an agility which allows us to stay successful in the cyclical machinery business. Let's move to slide 16. The challenging market situation over the past two years was marked by severe disruptions in the global supply chain, in conjunction with rising material, energy, labor, and production costs. I took the share price development of Rieter. The whole company story is well reflected in the price. The cyclicity of our industry is a threat. We must create much more resilient responses to it than in the past.

On slide 17, you can see the dilemma we are in when we talk about the cyclical markets. Our DNA is still driven by new Machines & Systems. In a high market scenario, we create a negative business mix between this business group and the After Sales and Components business groups. In order to execute backlogs, we have to increase our capacities aggressively, add to our supply chain management hassles, and invest more into R&D and production. When the market drops, we face excessively high cost structures and painful capacity adjustments. We must create a solid cost base, which allows us to financially perform well at any time in the cycle. This means agile structures and being brave enough to be selective about which jobs we take on board. Let's move to slide 18. In all fairness, we have not managed the cycles well enough in the past.

In reality, our shareholder return has been insufficient when you look at the EBIT in the last five years. Looking indicatively into 2024, based on the low demand in the textile industry now, we bear the risk that Rieter will again deliver negative EBIT margins in a low market scenario. This is an unacceptable scenario for us, this is why we are taking actions now. Let's move to slide 19. In Next Level, we are focusing on a few key performance measures. First, sales excellence. Push After Sales and Components business to create a better business mix. In addition, we are adapting our sales processes to capture market opportunities with better prices and more plannable volumes. Second, competitive products. We must bring our product costs down through tougher supplier negotiations and value engineering solutions in the area of simplification and standardization along the whole value chain.

Third, effective supply management. COVID, and the boom afterwards, have shown us the fragility of our supplies. Eliminating disruption effects and ensuring a sustainable supply management with second sources for critical components is key for future success. Last but not least, agile structure. We still have too much decision authority at the headquarters. We want to empower our key markets. In addition, we plan to create so-called product power hubs, where product management, R&D, and manufacturing footprints for end spinning technologies are aligned. We want to align this in our key manufacturing sites in Germany, the Czech Republic, India, and China. Winterthur will become a strong innovation and research location for the group, also being the worldwide competent center for our preparation machines. As a consequence, we aim to close our location in Ingolstadt, in Germany, and adjust our footprint in Switzerland, Germany, and the Czech Republic.

On slide 20, you see the key financial elements of Next Level. The different initiatives shall mostly be implemented in 2023. Some of them might take a bit of additional time into 2024. After full implementation, the expected benefit of Next Level will be around CHF 80 million per year. Considering one-time costs of CHF 45 million-CHF 50 million, we will achieve a payback period of less than one year. Let's turn to the hardest part. Here you see the planned full-time equivalent reductions on slide 21. I wish there had been another way. We left no stone unturned. We examined every option available. If we want to ensure the long-term success of our company, there is no easy way out. We need to make difficult choices now, and we need to make them with urgency. Here's what we intend to do.

As per June 30, we had 5,555 own full-time equivalents, without temporary personnel. With the planned overhead reductions and transfers, we shall have a net FTE reduction in the overhead area of around 300 employees. In addition, we intend to adjust our capacities according to the expected volumes for 2024, by another 400-600 FTEs worldwide, in the area of direct and indirect operations employees. This figure mainly depends on the final sales volumes for 2024. This reduction will happen after the release of temporary capacity, which we have in our factories. As a consequence, we expect a planned FTE base of 4,600-4,800 employees after the full implementation of Next Level. Please turn to slide 22.

I already said in the initial remarks that Next Level should bring Rieter to a new level of financial performance. Depending on where we are in the cycle, we do have the ambition that we at Rieter achieve always positive results at any time. This means for our EBIT ambition, in a low scenario, between 0%-4%, in a mid scenario, between 4%-8%, and in a high scenario, between 8%-12%. The Rieter Board of Directors and the Group Executive Committee are confident that the planned strategic and operational measures will lay the foundations for a more profitable and sustainable development of the entire group. I now come to the last part of the presentation, the outlook, which you find on slide 24.

Given the economic situation and the ongoing cyclical market weakness, we expect below average demand for new equipment in the coming months. A revival is not expected until the Q4 2023, at the earliest. We also believe that demand for consumables, wear and tear, and spare parts, will not recover until later in 2023. For the full year 2023, Rieter expects a reported EBIT margin of around 5%-7%. This includes the special effects from the sales of the Rieter Areal of about CHF 70 million-CHF 75 million, as well as the one-time cost for Next Level of around CHF 45 million-CHF 50 million. Both special items amount together to less than 2% and are included in this reported 5%-7% EBIT margin. Sales are expected at the previous year's level of around CHF 1.5 billion. With this, Kurt and myself close our presentation. We are now available for your questions.

Operator

The first question comes from Christian Arnold from Stifel Schweiz. Please go ahead.

Christian Arnold
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Stifel Schweiz

Yes, good morning, gentlemen. Many questions from my side, go back to line. Take things you mentioned on page 22. At the same time, you were saying negative EBIT in 2024 is not acceptable. Looking at the orders and the assumed sales development below in CHF 1 billion, I mean, the likelihood is very high that it actually is negative in 2024. Can you comment on that?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Christian, you are spot on. Thank Thank you for this question. It's clear that when you look at the moment, our half year orders on hand are at CHF 1.1 billion. If we are performing in sales, let's say, in a similar way, like in the first half year of 2023, there's something like CHF 350 million-CHF 400 million left. Assuming that we might have a similar or maybe a slightly better order intake in the second half, you are right, we are landing at about CHF 800 million as a going-in position for the year 2024. This would be good enough to achieve a sales volume of CHF 1 billion. Why?

First of all, if our assumption is right, that in the cyclical market, you know, we are expecting towards the end of the year of 2023, that the markets will pick up again, they also will pick up again in the first half of 2024. Whatever we sell, you know, in the first couple of months of 2024, still is early enough to become sales in the second half of 2024. In addition, it's also important to know that the total cycle time between order intake and sales for our component business and for our after-sales business is much shorter. In fact, you in minimum, have to add half a year of normal order intake of Components and After Sales, which is definitely above CHF 200 million, probably more to the magnitude of CHF 300 million.

If you take this CHF 300 million of After Sales and Components of H1 in 2024, plus the CHF 800 million of order backlog, at the moment, I still can confirm that we aim to achieve this CHF 1 billion or even slightly above. However, looking ahead, I cannot yet guarantee that in the new Machines & Systems business, you know, when exactly the markets will pick up. We have seen there are a lot of projects. Kurt have mentioned that, a lot of projects we are in negotiation.

The customers are hesitating, first of all, because of financing costs, and secondly, they are hesitating because the textile market, the end market, has not yet picked up. There also, I believe that towards the end of the year, we will see some light at the end of the tunnel. The question is right. We have asked that question to ourselves for that as well, and the answer we give to you is also the answer we have given to ourselves.

Christian Arnold
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Stifel Schweiz

Okay, thank you very much. Maybe on the expected benefit of around CHF 80 million per year, you said that the program will be concluded, 2024, maybe 2025. How much of this CHF 80 million saving do you think you can already achieve in 2024?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Well, it's difficult to give you an exact number, but let me first try to split this CHF 80 million a little bit, because I think this helps to answer that question. If you take the CHF 80 million, not all of them are personnel-related, because we have different pillars in our Next Level program. Roughly CHF 50 million is really working on our overhead cost. The main impacted locations are in Switzerland and in Germany. CHF 20 million, we are expecting from continuous cost leadership and cost reductions on our products. About CHF 10 million is coming from our improvement in the way how we are managing sales, you know, being a little bit more picky, if we can, in all fairness. Being a little bit more picky in the quality of the orders we take on board.

The CHF 20 million, I'm expecting to come next year. The CHF 10 million, I'm also expecting to come next year. The CHF 50 million, this is depending on the consultation we have on our Swiss location here in Winterthur and the German locations. This might be the case that some of these savings only start during first half of 2024, somewhere in the first half. If you take, you know, of this CHF 50 million, two-thirds to come, then I think, you probably are on the safe side, and this would bring us definitely to a positive result for 2024.

Christian Arnold
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Stifel Schweiz

Thank you very much.

Operator

The next question comes from Emrah Basic from Baader Helvea. Please go ahead.

Emrah Basic
Sell-Side Equity Analyst, Baader Helvea

Yes, hello, can you hear me?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Yes, there you go.

Emrah Basic
Sell-Side Equity Analyst, Baader Helvea

Perfect. Yeah, just another question regarding the cost reduction. The, the reduction program, do you expect further one-off costs then in 2024, and if so, how much approximately?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

... you mean if there are another one-time costs to be expected in 2024?

Emrah Basic
Sell-Side Equity Analyst, Baader Helvea

Yeah, when you, if you proceed with the reduction.

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

No, we aim, first of all, you know, the cost we will have actually this year, we will also book this year. For the remaining now already announced changes, we would build up a provision by the end of the year. There should be no one-time costs net in the 2024 results.

Emrah Basic
Sell-Side Equity Analyst, Baader Helvea

Okay, great. Thanks. Do you see any risks to the execution of the current backlog when reducing your workforce now in the first step?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

This is a very valid question. I think when you go to the chart of the FTE development, you see that there are, in fact, two different type of headcount reductions. The first part are overheads. Overheads in administration, overheads in product management, overheads in R&D. They are not so much volume dependent, those 300 net FTEs have no impact on our execution capabilities. We talk more about the 400-600 employees, the direct and indirect employees in our production facilities.

There, of course, we will, you know, we will not make a one-time cut, but we will reduce capacities according to our execution volumes, to avoid that we do have an execution issue at the end. I can confirm that this company, and I would say the whole industry, is very knowledgeable how to deal with these fluctuating volumes. We will not do silly and stupid things, but we will reduce those capacities according to the need of the volumes to be delivered.

Emrah Basic
Sell-Side Equity Analyst, Baader Helvea

Okay, perfect. Thanks a lot.

Operator

Next question comes from Sebastian Vogel, from UBS. Please go ahead.

Sebastian Vogel
Equity Research Analyst, UBS

Hello, and good morning. I have also 2 questions. The first one is on Turkey, and I was wondering if you can share your thoughts on how you think the next sort of 12 months will pencil out in terms of order momentum potentially coming back, or how do you think the situation is evolving there, with regard to your business?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Well, actually, we have seen that our order team intake is on an all-time low. In all fairness, over the last couple of months, order intake was as bad like in the first half year, 2020, when we had COVID. This can't be a sustainable level for the market, we know markets will come back. We had some hope, I have to say, you know, that maybe, we have announced that, at the year-end closing call, we are expecting this after ITMA. We also had fantastic feedback from our customers at the ITMA. It was really super impressive also for me to be, you know, the first time there.

There was an extremely positive feedback from our customers. We also felt that they are hesitating to push the button now to execute investments because of the financing situation and still some uncertainties, because their customers are still also on a low capacity level. This will change. I have no doubt at all. The only question is: Is it really towards the end of 2023, or does it slide into 2024? That's the only, you know, the real unknown factor. These new investments into Machines & Systems, we see it should come up towards the end of the year, but maybe it takes another three months. That's the reason why we are pushing so much now after sales and component business, because component business, the majority of the component business is also replacing components on existing machines.

Here we talk much more about the existing installed base, and this does not change. The only question there is: How strongly are they utilized, the existing machines? That's the reason why we have shown the utilization or operating rate of those mills, where we stand at the moment at 70%. Last year it was 80. At the beginning of the year, we showed a little bit more than 60, and in a high phase, it would be up to 90%. There is still a way to go, but also here, we believe it comes back.

This, of course, helps us also then for sales, because whatever we have as an order intake in Components or After Sales, has a much shorter cycle time to become sales. That's how we see it, expecting or to a certain degree, also hoping a slightly better second half in order intake than in the first half, and definitely picking up in 2024.

Sebastian Vogel
Equity Research Analyst, UBS

Then follow up specific on focusing on Turkey with the earthquake backdrop. The sort of, I guess, around like CHF 80 million runway that you have seen there in terms of sales, is that also something what we should get used to for a little bit further until all the sort of work is being done there, that the industry or the local industry can be back at full swing, so to say?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

I think in the midterm, you can expect that Turkey is back at full swing. Now, Turkey, of course, is also suffering from a low textile product demand, like other countries as well. Now, you know, after the earthquake, we made our own investigation. We were visiting every single mill. We were classifying them into totally damaged, to be totally rebuilt or slightly damaged or having not really issues. It was quite amazing how fast the Turkish mills came back. They really were doing an extra effort to come back to the market as quick as possible because they feared that they would lose volumes to other markets. Now, still, we have, of course, a couple of mills who have been destroyed, and they have to be replaced.

There are plans also to replace them, so to, you know, to rebuild the building, to buy new machines. Here, it's also a question of financing. The financing will happen via the insurance companies, and this takes a little bit of time. It is not, you know, overnight, and you get a couple of CHF million sponsored by the insurance company. It takes some time, and this will take well into 2024, until we can see that now the order intake in Turkey will pick up. Then you have to add another year until this order intake goes into sales. So the sales volumes for Turkey in 2024, I am expecting still at the low level, then 2025, latest 2026, it will come back.

Sebastian Vogel
Equity Research Analyst, UBS

Got it. Many thanks.

Operator

We have a follow-up question from Christian Arnold on Stifel Schweiz. Please go ahead.

Christian Arnold
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Stifel Schweiz

Yes, a question for Kurt. How much was the external growth? How much sales came from actually this consolidation effect we still had in H1?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

What's the number? I think after sales of CHF 6 million, this I have. Altogether, roughly CHF 30 million. If you want to have the exact numbers, give me a call, and I can give you the numbers.

Christian Arnold
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Stifel Schweiz

Okay. Okay, I think you had some moving costs for the Saurer activities, right? Was that already booked in H1? If so, how much was this additional cost? Is there anything caught in H2?

No, this is fully booked in H1. In Q2 of H1, it's a low to mid, CHF million, single-digit CHF million number. Around. 5-7. CHF 5 million-CHF 7 million, something like that.

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Around CHF 5 million, I would say.

Christian Arnold
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Stifel Schweiz

Okay. Maybe, you also said that you will close your facilities in Ingolstadt. Could you remind me if these properties belong to Rieter, or actually you have rented these properties?

Kurt Ledermann
CFO, Rieter

This is a rented property. After the restructuring in 2018.

Christian Arnold
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Stifel Schweiz

Yeah.

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

It was rented then.

Christian Arnold
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Stifel Schweiz

I thought so. Thank you very much.

Operator

We have another follow-up question from Sebastian Vogel from UBS. Please go ahead.

Sebastian Vogel
Equity Research Analyst, UBS

Perfect. I have 2 follow-ups, if I may. Quickly, given all these moving parts on your side, how do you think on CapEx for the remainder of the year and the beginning of next year?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Well, in all fairness, if you look on our balance sheet, there's not so much money we should spend for CapEx. The team was very restrictive, you know, approving any CapEx requests. Still, we do have some CapEx, of course, because we also have the move of our winder business within Germany from Übach-Palenberg. This is the facility of Saurer, where our winder business was still in, into a new facility in Heinsberg, and this has a substantial impact of CapEx investment. Taking all this into account, I think, we should say we will be maybe like in something like CHF 50 million or so in CapEx. Around CHF 50 million, I would say, but this is not the new normal level.

No.

Christian Arnold
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Stifel Schweiz

you have to mention here.

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

No.

Christian Arnold
Senior Equity Research Analyst, Stifel Schweiz

This is a special effect from this. The new normal will be between CHF 30 million and CHF 40 million. If you want to make your plan, put CHF 35 million in your plan.

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Yes.

Sebastian Vogel
Equity Research Analyst, UBS

Got it. One other follow-up question on the supply chain situation. I mean, given now you're also trying to work there and improve things, how long do you think you will be still facing supply chain constraints in your business to such a level where it still sort of hurts your way of bringing out the business or bringing out the machines out of your factories?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

There are two elements. One is, let's say, supply management, so critical components, supplier management. This, let's say, hassles we had because of the volumes will disappear within this year. There will be nothing left next year. I think we cannot claim for four years that we have supply chain issues, you know, in all fairness. We and the team has super improved the performance, I have to say. The waiting time for customers, the waiting time for missing material has been dramatically reduced in the first six months of this year. I'm very confident that we will get rid of that topic latest by the end of the year. Somewhere in Q4, this should not be an issue anymore. There are still some elements, but not so much.

The second topic, maybe also regarding supply chain, is product cost improvement. This will become a continuous process for us, so this will not stop at the end of this year. We will now prepare that we have this announced, let's say, cost improvement of CHF 20 million in the year to come, in 2024. Also there, I think the ideas, the organization, the tools, the process, will be well in place in 2023 to achieve those results in 2024.

Sebastian Vogel
Equity Research Analyst, UBS

Got it. Many thanks.

Operator

We have a follow-up question from Emrah Basic , from Baader Helvea. Please go ahead.

Emrah Basic
Sell-Side Equity Analyst, Baader Helvea

Hello, I have another two questions. You mentioned that the reservation list of the ITMA is full. Could you add some quantitative color to that? Like, if it were to all materialize, what this could mean, potential orders, just on a high level, like going forward?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

I can give you one example. I mean, we had so many machines we were presenting at the ITMA. This will maybe take another extra call, but I give you one example. We have presented our new J 70. That's the new air jet machine, which had a phenomenal feedback from customers. This is a new product, and we are running already a couple of machines in the market on customer sites, because we want to make sure that we meet our customer requirements and their expectations about quality, about how fine the fabric is, speed, and different ranges of applications. We are still testing that. We said: Well, okay, we want to present it because we don't want to wait another four years.

We made a reservation list for the first 20 machines to be supplied in the second half of 2024. That's the idea, huh? We still are testing, we are still ramping up then our manufacturing. We do the appropriate industrialization, because very often there you make a lot of mistakes. In the second half of 2024, we would like to start with deliveries. We could have filled three-digit numbers for reservations. When you take just one machine, half a million, you can imagine that this has a substantial potential for us in the future. Easily, we could have filled a three-digit number. We said, "No, we want to make the things right from the beginning," because otherwise, if you then have, you know, an early bird issue, then you pay three times the cost than if you do it right now before you really go into the market.

Emrah Basic
Sell-Side Equity Analyst, Baader Helvea

Got it. Perfect. Thank you very much. The second question would be regarding your, the Rieter site, the sale to Allreal. Is there some sort of profit-sharing agreement on the development of the projects afterwards, or is this going to be a done deal in H2, and nothing, no relationship to it anymore afterwards?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Yeah, it's the CHF 96 million we communicated, and the rest of the details we do not disclose in this contract.

Emrah Basic
Sell-Side Equity Analyst, Baader Helvea

Okay. Thank you.

Operator

Okay.

Gentlemen, so far, there are no more questions from the phone.

We now move over to the questions from the webcast. The first question comes from Andrea Frey from Credit Suisse: Can you please provide a rough guidance for net debt for 2023 and 2024?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Yes, okay. 2024, of course, is a long time range, but 2023, as you can see in our balance sheet in the half year now, we have quite a high level of net working capital, especially our inventory level is very high, also our trade receivables. This is related to the sales volume we had in the last two months. We expect this clearly to go down to the end of the year. We also expect then, after the end of the year, a further normalization. Of course, it depends then on the sales we have and the order intakes we have. The level of net working capital is really driving this.

In addition, we will see, of course, the cash flow from the sale of the land here in Winterthur. This will be here in Q3 or latest Q4. We expect it in the second half to come in as well. This is another, cash flow-wise, is another CHF 85 million-CHF 90 million that reduces the net debt. This will shape the balance sheet in the next half year. Does this answer your question? Okay, you are not online. Sorry, you were the web question. I'm not right. Sorry. I hope this answers your question.

Operator

The next question is coming from [Till Hirzicon]. He's asking: How many job cuts do you expect at the headquarter in Winterthur? What means overhead here in Winterthur?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Maybe I pick that up. You remember I refer once again to the overall slide we have shown about FTE development. Starting with 5,555 people, and someone, somehow ending at the end of the full implementation at 4,600-4,800. There we have this topic of 300 people overhead reduction. This also includes the site in Winterthur. When we talk about overhead, there is no difference in Winterthur to other sites. We talked about administration jobs. You know, this can also be HR, finance, sales support. These, all the typical jobs for administration, because our volumes will go down in the future.

The second topic is that we are introducing these product power hubs, and today, we have product management functions and also certain R&D functions here in Winterthur. Some of them we will reduce because we believe we have too many projects, and we want to focus on those with strategic priorities. There will be also a reduction in those two functions overall in Winterthur. As a third component, there will be shifts. Some of the R&D and product management functions will be shifted from Winterthur to other locations. However, some of the functions we have in other locations will be shifted to Winterthur. There is a whole potpourri of different, let's say, dimensions.

All in all, you can, with the plus and the minuses, there will be something like 100 positions net, being on the discussion for Winterthur. I want to say that we are now starting a consultation process. These are vague figures because we are a very responsive and responsible employer, and we will now discuss with our employee representatives, what can we do? Are there other possibilities to achieve the expected results? Once we have closed that process, then we can really communicate final numbers.

Operator

The second question from Mr. Hirzicon is concerning research and development. How does Next Level go along with the new research campus, which stands for innovation? Will Rieter concentrate R&D at the headquarter in Winterthur?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Well, it is a little bit of follow-up question of before. We, more or less in a year, we will move to the new campus. The new campus is a very functional building. Why functional? It will include a big technology and innovation center. We want to test different type of applications there. We need the center to train our people in the field. We also need the center as a demonstration project for our customers. Inviting customers to show them what we have, the latest technology, and even training their employees. Winterthur is extremely important for us as the new real technology and innovation center. Now, in terms of products, all the preparatory machines, the product management and the R&D, will be concentrated in Winterthur. We will move some of those functions from other locations to Winterthur.

Because it's very important that at the beginning of the yarn production process, you really create high quality, because you cannot compensate or correct that enough in the end spinning technology. It's a concentration of preparation machinery and a very high importance of this new technology and innovation center.

Operator

Okay, the next question comes from Sebastian Hoyer, from Vero Capital. Could you remind us of your shareholder structure now, after recent changes?

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Yes, we can. This is 33% Peter Spuhler holding, a well-known shareholder, and there is almost 8% BigPoint Holding AG, which is Mr. Haefner. I think.

Operator

That's it. I have no more questions.

Thomas Oetterli
CEO, Rieter

Thank you so much for attending this call. I hope we were able to answer all your questions and to give a little bit more transparency about our plans. I think it's very important that you understand that first of all, Next Level is super important for us. It has a certain urgency for us, but that we are all convinced we are doing exactly the right thing. The Board of Directors and the Group Executive Committee are fully convinced that with the execution of this program, we will financially perform in the future, at any time, independent where we are in the cyclical markets. We believe that this will happen. We are committed to that.

We will work very hard on that, and we need a little bit luck, definitely also from the market development, that order intake will pick up. I would say for 2024, I'm not so much worried. Once the market will anyway come back. I wish all of you a good holiday season, for those who go to the holidays. Looking forward to see you again on our call for the first quarter volume discussions. Thank you very much, and goodbye.

Operator

Ladies and gentlemen, the conference is now over. Thank you for choosing Chorus Call, thank you for participating in the conference. You may now disconnect your lines. Goodbye.

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