AGM 2021

Jun 23, 2021

Hello, everybody. Greetings. I am John Chan, Chief Executive Officer of BlackBerry Limited and Executive Chair of the Board of Directors. On behalf of the Board and the management team, it is my pleasure to welcome you to the annual the company's Annual Meeting of Shareholders. As we did last year, we are hosting our meeting in a virtual only format through a live audio webcast to mitigate risk to the health and safety of the company's shareholders, employee and other stakeholders related to the pandemic. Last year, we also found that the virtual format was more inclusive and many more shareholders were able to join us then at our in then at our in person meetings in recent years. Even though the meeting is in the virtual format, procedures have been implemented to ensure that shareholders and proxy holders regardless of their location will be able to participate in this meeting and engage with us. Registered shareholders and valid proxy holders who are participating online will be able to listen to the meeting, submit questions and vote in real time. This year's beneficial shareholders will also be able to submit questions through the online meeting platform. The Secretary of the meeting will cover the procedures for all of this in just a moment. With that said, it is now my pleasure to introduce the member of the company's Board of Directors, who are in attendance on this webcast today. They are Mike Daniels, Tim Duttels, Lisa Bispro, Dick Lynch, Laurie Smaldenauzuk, Barbara Steines and Pam Wasser as well as Wayne Waters. In addition to the Board, we also have members of the company's executive team attending this webcast and we are also joined by Phil Kurtz, the Corporate Secretary and Deputy General Counsel of the company. The formal part of the meeting will be shared by me and will include my annual based on BlackBerry's strategy and performance. Following completion of the formal business of the meeting, we will address questions submitted by shareholders. I would now like to call this meeting to order and as Chair, I will ask Phil Kurtz to add a Secretary of the meeting. Phil will now go over the procedures and items for this meeting item of business for the meeting. Thank you, John. I'd like to start by highlighting a couple of important procedural matters that apply to our virtual meeting relating to questions and voting. Questions can be submitted by any shareholder or proxy holder who logged in with a control number or username using the messaging feature of the virtual interface. If you're logged into the meeting as a guest without a control number, you will not be able to submit questions. Questions will not be displayed, will be read or summarized as appropriate. Generally, questions will be addressed only during the Q and A session after the formal part of the meeting. However, any questions related to procedural matters or that are directly related to an item of business may be addressed earlier. Voting on all matters will be conducted by electronic ballot. Registered shareholders and duly appointed proxy holders will be asked to vote on each item of business only after the presentation of all the business items. In order to expedite the formal business of today's meeting, I will make all motions on voting matters. When you're asked to vote, you'll receive a message on the virtual interface requesting you to register your votes. You'll only have a certain amount of time to do so when the polls are open. Preliminary voting results will be provided during the meeting and final detailed voting results will be published on the Canadian Securities Administrators, SEDAR website and the SEC's EDGAR website and on our website after the conclusion of the meeting. Pina Pacifico of Computershare Investor Services will act as scrutineer for the meeting today. I confirm that we have received the declaration of Computershare confirming that the notice of this meeting was properly given to all of the shareholders entitled to receive notice Together with the management proxy circular in form of proxy. Copies of the management proxy circular and other meeting materials are available under the company's profile on SEDAR and EDGAR and on the Envision website established for this meeting. I've received the scrutineers preliminary report stating that a quorum of shareholders is in attendance. The scrutineers report shows that there are shareholders or proxy holders in attendance on this live webcast today holding 313,680,470 5 common shares of the company, representing 55.4 percent of the shares issued and outstanding. I therefore declare this annual meeting of shareholders to be regularly called and properly constituted for the transaction of business. First item of business is a presentation of the financial statements for the fiscal year ended February 28, 2021. These include the consolidated balance sheets as at February 28, 2021 February 29, 2020 and the related consolidated statements of shareholders' equity, operations and cash flows together with the auditors' report. Copies of these documents have been mailed to the shareholders who requested them And they're also available on SEDAR and EDGAR. We will now proceed with the election of directors for the ensuing year. As determined by the Board, the number of directors to be elected today is 9. Information with respect to each of the individuals nominated for the position of Director of the company was set forth in the management process circular and each of the nominees has agreed to serve as a director if elected. As at previous meetings, we'll be nominating and approving individual and Office of Directors. By law number A-four of the company sets out a procedure requiring shareholders to provide advance notice If you wish to nominate any person for election as a director of the company. The company has not received notice in accordance with the bylaw from any shareholder intending to propose a nominee for election at this meeting. Since there are no other nominations, I move to elect the directors named in our proxy circular. Again, I remind you that voting on all matters to be active on this meeting will take place electronically after the presentation of all voting matters. The next item of business is the reappointment of the independent auditors of the company. I move that PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP be reappointed as the independent of the company until the next annual meeting of shareholders and that the Board of Directors of the company be authorized to fix their remuneration. The final item of business is the approval of our annual non binding advisory resolution on executive compensation or say on pay vote. This resolution provides that on an advisory basis and without diminishing the responsibilities of the Board of Directors, shareholders accept the approach to Executive compensation disclosed in the management proxy circular. I also move that this resolution be adopted. That concludes all of the items to be voted on at this meeting. We'll now move to electronic voting on the items of business presented. As mentioned earlier, voting today will be conducted by electronic ballot. I'll now take a moment to ask that the balloting be open to registered holders and appointed proxy holders. Polls are now open. And at this point, All registered holders and proxy holders who have properly logged in with their control number or username and wish to vote will be able to see on the screen all motions brought forward at this meeting. Please register your votes by accessing voting page and selecting the for or withhold button next to the name of each proposed director and with respect to the reappointment of PricewaterhouseCoopers as the company's auditors and then by selecting the for or against button next to the advisory vote on executive compensation. We'll provide registered shareholders and proxy holders with another brief moment to complete their electronic Once the balloting closes, the voting page will disappear and your votes will be submitted automatically. The scrutineers have provided me with a preliminary report of the ballots. On the election of the directors, all 9 nominees have been Directors of the company to hold office until the next annual meeting of the company in June 2022 or until their respective successors are elected or appointed. The motion to reappoint the auditors is also carried and PricewaterhouseCoopers LLP has been reappointed as the independent auditors of the company. These motions were carried by a substantial majority of votes cast. Finally, the say on pay resolution was also approved by majority of the votes cast. Nevertheless, the level of support for the motion was below our expectations. The compensation nomination and governance committee Our Board believes that the company's compensation program needs to be competitive in a challenging market for talent. The Board and the committee believe that the executive compensation That were made during the past year were appropriate and necessary to attract and retain leadership to execute the company's strategy. With this said, while the resolution is advisory in nature and not binding, the Board and the committee will review the results of our vote today in connection with our ongoing evaluation of the company's compensation program. As noted earlier, detailed voting results will be published on SEDAR and EDGAR and on our website after the conclusion of the meeting. It's now my pleasure to turn the meeting back over to John to provide an update on the company's business. Ahead of that, please note that John's presentation and the Q and A session later in the meeting may contain forward looking statements. Shareholders should be aware that any forward looking statements are made based on certain assumptions and are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results, performance or achievements of the company to differ materially from those disclosed here today. We're adopting for this presentation the cautionary language regarding forward looking statements that is set out in the company's annual report on Form 10 ks, to which we refer you for additional details concerning the risks, uncertainties and assumptions relating to our forward looking statements. Please note that the slides for John's presentation are available in the Investors section of the blackberry.com website. And now John will conclude the formal part of the meeting. Thank you, Phil. And there is no further business to come before the meeting. I declare the formal part of the meeting to be concluded. So for everybody And I have a short company video to show you. And then right after that, I will do a brief discussion of our performance and strategy of the company and then followed by Q and A. So could we please queue the video, please? Since day 1, we've been determined to change the world. Our devices placed the office in the palm of your hand and changed how we work Forever. Our vision has expanded. Now we're pairing artificial intelligence with our trusted security and putting it everywhere. For too long, security was about what you stopped, but the Internet of Things is making everything smarter, Including cyber threats. We've never been more connected or more vulnerable. As ransomware and cybercrime explode, Security needs to do more. It needs to stay ahead of threats. It needs to keep you safe. It needs to be intelligent. Prevention is the best medicine. This is especially true for IT systems. Much like vaccines prevent infection, Our intelligence security is a prevention first approach that stops cyber attacks before they can launch. If there is a breach, we have remediation Solutions and services ready and in place. We help our customers solve their most critical security challenges. We protect more than 500,000,000 endpoints, including over 195,000,000 cars. We have design wins With 23 of the top 25 electric vehicle OEMs, ensuring vehicle safety and security. 45 Fortune 100 companies trust us with their security. Our security is NIAP certified as classified. It is the highest Security level awarded for government and industry. While cybersecurity lets you stop threats, intelligent security gives you the freedom to reach higher, Okay. I hope you like the video. This video, we are very proud of the fact that this is all done in house without spending money outside of the company and getting other people to do it. So it's heartfelt and genuine, I would say. I'm pleased right now to be able to provide you a I will call the update our State of the Union update. I put up a slide here about 2 converging very large market force. 1 in cybersecurity, I'm sure that nobody would need me to explain more about all the ransomware that's coming on daily basis. And also the whole idea of smart, we call it smart everywhere. And this is really later on, we'll talk about what is included, but it included obviously Transportation, Cities, Devices, Individuals and so forth. And you could see that we put up a number of trends that we believe are what is really driving it. Let me start let me name a couple of them. For example, the top left one And this really was driven by the fact that remote working has been picking up steam. Mobile is really the key primary devices people are using to interact with each others, with work, with Home Life and with that advancement of mobile, 5 gs and everything that behind it and you could see the cybersecurity requirements goes up and the risks and the threats are increasing every day. So that's a big driver. There's also because of all these ransomware and the attack that some of them are highly visible in various part of the world. The supply chain security becomes more and more important. So much so that in the United States President Biden most recently have announced how announced a major effort in securing the software bill of materials. And I'd like to comment on that a little later, but that's really play right into what BlackBerry could do and do well. AIML, as you all remember, in the last 3 years, we've been investing quite aggressively on embedded AI and ML at different levels of models. And we pride ourselves from doing the protect first strategy, which is shown in the video and is a differentiator for us and we can discuss that later on also. Now Smart everywhere, it is a concept of smart car as it connects to smart city and smart home. We have a pretty good footprint in that too. Things that are driven the Smart everywhere, obviously, is the whole concept of IoT powered by 5 gs powered by cloud computing, powered by quantum cryptology. And so You could see some of these very big trend in the market. Edge computing as well as cloud computing, The convergence of that is also a huge opportunity for the market and obviously for BlackBerry. So I'm very pleased to be able to show you that everything BlackBerry has been working on in the last X number of years, maybe even dated back way beyond the last 7 years of the company journey to pivot from hardware to software. And beyond that, right before that, that we have so much technology and know how in the areas that could drive and participate in these markets of cyber and smart. This early I said is a large market. This of course these markets combined today as a $45,000,000,000 total addressable market. One third of that is on IoT, the other 2 thirds on cyber. But as you can see, the estimate growth, The CAGR is about 19% for compounded annual growth. But the interesting thing is you could see the IoT picking up quite a bit estimated for the next 4 years. And by 2025, it will actually be equal to the size of the cyber market, although the cyber market expect to grow 50%, as you can see, from $30,000,000,000 to $45,000,000,000 or roughly $44,000,000,000 So the bulk markets are very robust, very, very big and are very fast growing. Because of that, the beginning of this year and this is really a journey that we've been on for a number of years. But the beginning of this year, we decided to create 2 business unit, then one go after the cybersecurity and the other go after the IoT market. But we also know that it shares a lot of technology to power these two platforms. On my side here, On cybersecurity side, it's composed of the endpoint management, endpoint security as well as secure communication as well as Critical Event Management. On the IoT side, it's really very much driven by the embedded OS, a brand that many people know is called QNX. And BlackBerry Ivy is a in vehicle data platform today and will expand to other part of the IoT devices. Cryptology, we own a company called Sertacom And it actually specialized in lithical cryptology algorithm as well as providing safety security certificate, PKI and various others highly secure Quantum Prevention Detection Technology. So we're very proud of those technology. Last but not least, we have a small business in asset tracking, but it's also tied very much to the whole IoT device and how IoT device take advantage of analytics, take advantage of the backbone of network. But we also know, as I said earlier, that there are Many technologies that we have that is really beneficial to both of these market trends. I have 3 of them we label out there, 3 major ones. I'm sure there are a lot more. And this is managed by our lab. There's a BlackBerry lab focused on future technology and also focused on the fact that these are megatrends that both of these product platform as well as the market focus that could be utilizing. The obvious one is data lake. Earlier in the video, you saw us having been able to tap into 500,000,000 endpoints. And so it creates a very big source of analytics, data and information. So we wanted to be able to share those information freely between the whole cyber platform as well as the IoT platform. As we see it, it will converge at these two platforms, our Q2 market. Then of course, the embedded AI ML model. In the IoT world, obviously, each of the devices should be protected. And we have some very unique and differentiated technology that is very lightweight and actually doesn't even need network or Internet update to continue to protect endpoints. So that technology by the way came to us through our Cylance acquisition. And then last but not least, we talk about securing software secure software development platform. We've been developing software for highly sophisticated application in the last 30 plus years. As you all know, our cell phone, which of course we develop everything all the software included, on the most secure cell phone that ever existed, other than a very specialized government cell phones, so forth, but at least for commercial application. So we employed and deployed a lot of our own technology and created a lot of technology to manage their life cycle of development. So when we're very excited when the government start focusing on securing supply chain, especially on software building materials, Lou stated you call it the SPOM. So we believe that we could really help contribute to debt the government and we actually were able to provide product and platforms to made that a reality. So it's a huge opportunity for us going forward. So what is that all combined to? I mean, what does that actually mean to the market? What are the market that we are really focusing on. And this is actually consistent for the last 5 years that we've been presenting our strategy. Our strategy is really in the heart of the smart city. It is in a we believe the Securing the IoT, both the connections as well as the communication is something that we could do and we do well and the industry needs and the market needs and the society needs. So you could see here that our dream is to connect everything that has that is a IoT device that has an IP address and be able to share the data, protect the data and connect seamlessly on a either a continuously connected or occasionally connected fashion. So we started a lot we have a pretty good footprint in the car and in some of the major enterprises and governments and we're going to expand from that point. And this is where the market validation comes in. And I want to share with you some of the highlights that we're very proud of. For example, going coming from the left to the right, 18 of the G20 countries uses our technology either doing it for security reasons or connections to the mobile devices or messaging technology among their own interactions. So there are many applications that we are and in the G20 countries, so 18 of the G20. I think this week we announced that a outside independent analyst firm have estimated that we have 195,000,000 cars using our embedded software, QNX. And we agree with that because our internal count is also about the same. So we could validate that. And that numbers grew from $175,000,000 a year ago. Despite all the pandemic, despite the slowdown in auto productions. You could see that we're picking up the market share quite nicely. I don't know of any other provider, technology provider or the competitors that provide these numbers. But just loosely speaking, there's about 1,000,000,000 cars on the road, if to at least 20% of that is used in BlackBerry. And then 500,000,000 endpoints, we already talked about that, is going to be the basis of our data lake and analytics. And we believe that we could share the data between the cybersecurity world as well as share the data between the IoT world. The next one is, again, this week announcement, we were very, I guess, excited about the fact that Frost and Sullivan, and again, an independent analyst firm, named Ivy. And I had a slide on Ivy a little later, and named Ivy a leader in automotive in smart city. That is right smack in the middle of our strategy. This is why it's exciting on that front. I'll talk about IV a little later, but it's a in vehicle data platform, but it could expand beyond the in vehicle. I'll give you a little bit more data. And then last but not least, 45% of the Fortune 100 company are good customers of ours, mostly a very large enterprises, a lot of them in the regulated industry, financials, health cares are probably the leading verticals today. I spoke earlier about we're going to talk a little bit about Ivy. Ivy was announced as a project in December 2020, December of last year. Actually, we've been working on this for X number of years, almost, I would say, almost 3 years. He started with putting AI technology in a car. And we actually demonstrated that at CES a couple of years back. So it was a joint activity, joint development with AWS. Again, joint development of AWS is very rare. AWS have a lot of partners, but developing together, they don't do very often. So this is a level of seriousness in the partnership. It's also We are also the exclusive provider of this particular technology, the in vehicle data platform to AWS, at least for a period of time. However, we also both agreed between us and AWS Therefore, this could be commercially viable and a big opportunity, it should be able to interact and work with other people cloud in beyond AWS. So therefore, our spec included the ability to connect to the Google Cloud as well as the Azure Cloud of the Microsoft and other cloud. I'm sure later IBM, Oracle, we will be looking at those too. But initially, we will include Google and Microsoft. And so the activities really got formally kicked off in December 2020. As you can see on this timeline, We already have done a lot of things and we're very proud of the progress being made. We launched Innovation Fund. We in March, we created an advisory council and announced it, I think, this week. With a couple of very big name in the market. I know here the high definition map providers, part of that. A council, GEICO Insurance is also part of the council. TELUS, a telecommunication, one of the top 3 telecommunication in Canada is one of the council member. And Cerence. Cerence is in auto and they're a spin off of Nuances and they specialize on voice recognition and integration into the guts of the car, so to speak. And so we're very, very pleased and very proud of the fact that we'd be able to create this council. And the idea of this is to create more use cases for iD for the in vehicle data platform. Then we talk about the IBB name as a market leader. And then we also announced, I think today, this morning that we have made our 1st Innovation Fund investment of a company, a startup called Elektra vehicle. And this is very exciting because they use Ivy Analytics to manage the performance of the battery of the cars. So this is obviously mostly focused on and Electric and Hybrid Vehicle. So but it's very exciting what they could do and so stay tuned on that. And that will be one of the application that Ivy will be able to provide to the OEMs. We are on track to provide early access product in October and we expect the first version of our platform will shift February of 2022. So everything is on track. We're making a lot of progress. We're spending a lot of resources and time and money and energy in preparing for the market acceptance of this really great platform that we expect to do extremely well down the road. Okay. Moving away from Ivy, I want to just briefly update you all on the accomplishment of FY 'twenty one. FY 'twenty one was a very strange year as you all know. It was difficult to navigate because of the pandemic, but we have created we have accomplished quite a bit. And so the team has done well even working remotely. And so I'm going to go through it very, very quickly, so bear with me. So the top left, BlackBerry continued to win a lot of certification with the government, government around the world actually, but government of the United States were the leaders of that. We are NIEP certified. We have classified scatters as the video has said. We have commercial the commercial software for classified use, we achieved that with DoD and so the list goes on and the list and VISTA and so forth. HemWave is that RAM certified and that business is also expanding. We were able to block the $165,000,000 attack or at least $165,000,000 attack in ransomware or cyber attack in general. In fact, so much so that you seldom hear and touch wood and this is not a challenge, You seldom hear that BlackBerry system or user has been attacked or successfully attacked. So we were able to prevent most of them, including the latest notorious one, DarkSide, Condi, Nobelium, and there's a long list of names of different viruses that run somewhere. Then we talk about the 195,000,000 vehicle that is embedded in using BlackBerry QNX software. And we also have 2,000 plus new patent granted and with 500 more being filed in a year. We launched 59 for our new products in a year to prepare for that to platform that I outlined, which by the way, we're spending 24 and our revenue invested in R and D. That's a high number. That's akin to a startup type numbers. And we're very proud of that and we'll obviously as much as we could Afford, we will continue to fund that activities. On the QNX side, we despite the fact that we have a slowed down because of the pandemic. A lot of our customers unfortunately have to shut down for a period of time, but we still managed to win 69 Design Wins. Design Wins is important for us in QNX because the revenue cycle start with the design wins and it takes a very long time. So this is a very high longevity kind of a business cycle. So we have 21 auto wins and 48 generally embedded wins and generally embedded including medical devices, other transportations, etcetera, etcetera and manufacturing and so forth. So much so that on the electric vehicle front, the EV front, you count by volume the top 25, we counted that 23 of the 25 uses our software and it counts for about 68% of the market share. And we also are on track to be carbon neutral in 2021. In fact, I think we would I think people were told me that Last 5 to 7 years, we have reduced carbon footprint or emission by 88%. On the financial front, because of the pandemic, we actually saw a decline of revenue and the revenue dropped by 16%, a lot of them primarily driven by the QNX Royalty because of the planned shutdown, auto production shutdown. That said, our backlog for QNX Royalty have gone up from and by 9%, from $450,000,000 to $490,000,000 We are able because of some of the shutdown, we're able to manage our expenses well. We have an EPS growth of 38% year over year. We came in at $0.18 a share with adjusted EBITDAR at $167,000,000 and that's a 12% growth and it's roughly about 18% of revenue. So we have made a little bit of progress. We're obviously not done in pursuing the timeless model. We generated cash, dollars 74,000,000 We have a good cash balance. We have a good reduction on the debt that save us I think save us about $16,000,000 in interest a year and our recurring software ratio is still at 90%. So those are actually reasonably good results in a very difficult year. In the last just a big wrap up on the financial. In the last 5 year, our revenue CAGR grew about it was 11.3%. Just to remind everybody that this number does not include hardware revenue in this and it also The salary includes the service activation fee that powered those hardware handset. Gross margin has improved about 2,700 basis points in the same period of time. So my last slide. What are we working on and what are we investing? This is going to be a year that we're going to focus a lot on market go to market marketing go to market and Growth. So and because we have a 2 EU and 1 lab system organization, So I laid that I'm not going to go through every single point. But on the cybersecurity side, we believe our product is now not only up to date with the market, it's even advanced ahead of it. And then a couple of days on our earnings call, I'll talk a little about new products being released and this hybrid side, which we are very excited about. And the most important thing is increase the channel reach, increased the market reach and increased the headcount to so called the feet on the street headcount. And that's going to be a continued investment for that cybersecurity business unit. We talked about the lab quite a bit. I think the definition of some of the trend on how we convert that into a product, into offerings, the most important thing and our thoughts with an eye of the future technologies. And we do a lot of university joint research also. So that's the lab priority. And IoT priority is actually even relatively simple. We will continue to make progress on IV. We'll continue to invest in and also invent use cases for IV. But on the QNX side, we're going to continue to upgrade not upgrade, but continue to take advantage of increasing ARPU, the average revenue per unit growth in automotive. That only means that we're going to either get into more auto or more or bigger footprint in each auto. And we feel very good about it because I do believe that we are the top name in that industry. And of course, we continue to go expand on the general embedded market. So with that, That's the material I have prepared. With that, I am ready for Q and A. Now before I do that, Tim Foote, our Head of Investor Relations, will provide details of the protocol for the question period and he also will be the one who moderate the Q and A. Thank you, John. We will address questions submitted by shareholders and their proxies in attendance on this webcast for approximately 15 minutes. Shareholders and proxy holders have had the opportunity to submit questions in advance and may also do so now using the instant messaging feature of the virtual interface. As a reminder, we are unable to receive questions from guests You have not logged in with a control number or username. We'll now give attendees a moment to submit their questions. We will answer as many questions as time permits. And before answering, we will read out or summarize the question. Questions that are redundant, offensive, not primarily related to the business of the company or otherwise out of order will not be addressed. Please limit your questions to topics relating to today's subject matter And keep your questions brief. Let's give everyone a fair chance to ask a question. Okay. So, John, first question that we have is in recent years, we've been heavily focused on profitability and cash flow. Given the investment plans you've just mentioned, has your viewpoint changed? Yes, that's a very good question. Yes. For those people who have heard me said it in the past and know kind of my focus, When I first showed up at BlackBerry 7 years ago, I know we need to pivot the business and profitability and financial stability was the most While we do that, we continue to make investment while we can and to build the confidence of our employees and partners and customers in our company. So we created a pretty good culture of making a profit. And I do believe that Business is about making profit for the shareholders and then business in software particularly is about creating profit. That said, I think last couple of years, I have realized that the shareholders will be more rewarded for growth. And because we now have a pretty stable culture of not going to get into financial trouble, So we I have shift gear a little bit. The team has shift gear a little bit. We're going to be focusing now more on growth. Given the fact that we have 2 very big market we talked about earlier, cybersecurity and IoT, given the fact that we participated quite deeply into it And given the fact that there are some emerging businesses like the Secure Supply Chain businesses that we could participate in or market we could participate in, I feel that this is a good time for the benefit of the shareholder that we should try to go capture that. So There will be a balance and the whole idea is once the growth comes in, it will kick into profit. So I think the short term, We will spend a little bit more money, maybe at the expense of some of the profitability. But again, it's going to be measured. Great. Thank you, John. A number of shareholders, there's probably not much you can say on this, We're asking for an update on the patent sale, whether there's anything you can say about that. No, unfortunately yes, I know this is We have a question that will come up. We're in an ongoing discussion. I'm bound by the confidential nature of the discussion. So I really unfortunately can't say much. I'd only say that it is ongoing, it's making progress and that's stay tuned. Okay. Thank you. Have you considered changing the name of the company back to Research in Motion? I know this is a question that's come up a number Yes. He's always came up. I like the name Research in Motion. I think RIM is a really good name. I think it's also Given the whole IoT world, the kind of the network centric nature of our business and the cyber part. I think On the Move is really Research in Motion imply On the Move is actually a very appropriate name. If I think about changing it, well, no, not at this point. I think right now, let's just focus on getting the growth for the 2 businesses, getting a good pipeline of products coming out and go to the market. Once we are in the in a more growth oriented space, I will consider changing the name I would at least I will consider recommending to the Board that we should take your name. This is not a John Chan decision. Okay, excellent. Certainly not along. All right. We've got a question coming Whether there's anything you can say about Onward Mobility, this is the company that's looking The owner mobility is the one that we license our phone technology to, both the software as well as the hardware of it. And they were supposed to build a 5 gs Keyboard BlackBerry phone. I know they had made good progress on that. I actually don't know much about the status. Our involvement really has been able to license the technology to them. And then if they need help in the technology, they will come back to us as professional services. So we're really not quanto involved as much other than the licensee. Okay. Super. Last question I've got here, John, is do you see IoT or cyber As having the biggest potential for growth? I mean, if you look at the TAM or the totally addressable market in a growth rate. They both have really high growth rate. And cyber It's a bigger market today and the growth rate is 50% for the next 3, 4 years. And so and and IoT is going to grow faster than that, but it's a little smaller today. So I think I expect both of them to grow. As I in establishing a 2 BU, I don't really have one preference over the other. Reason of establishing the 2 BUs is For the shareholders, so they have a better understanding of the potential of our business and a better reporting so that they could track the progress of our business, makes all of us more accountable in that sense. And so that was one of the basic reasons. And the other basic reasons, Operationally, they're slightly different. So on the cyber side, it's really more on the enterprise sales cycle, 69 month sales cycle and really more of a software itself type motion. On the IoT side, as I said much earlier, it's really about design wins, right? So it's different. And yes, the revenue doesn't come immediately, it comes a lot, but when it comes, because the cycle of the revenue is usually 5 to 7 years. And when it comes, it will be very persistent at a very high margin. And in addition to that, IB will bring us yet another business model, which are more usage based business model rather than a production kind of business model. So there are different approach to the business. I wouldn't pick one versus the other at this point. Okay. Very good. Well, that's all we have time for now For the question and answer session. Okay. Well, thank you for asking those questions. I don't mean you. I mean the audience. So that ends today's meeting. Thank you everybody for attending and we very much look forward to welcome you again at next year's meeting and have a good day.