Cover something that was. Yeah. Let's kick it off. Next company we have is AerSale, and we've got Martin Garmendia, the CFO. So Martin, thanks very much for making the time.
Thank you for the invite.
Maybe just to kick it off, high level for those that aren't familiar with AerSale, could you talk a little bit about the different parts of the business and what you guys do?
Sure. We service large commercial aircraft, so both Boeing and Airbus platforms. We do that through our asset management side and our tech side. We buy mid-life equipment, so assets that are 10 to 12 years old have kind of exited the OEM warranty period. Then we can do several things with those assets. If they are in a condition where they're flyable, we can put them into our lease portfolio, both the aircraft or remove the engines and put the engines in the portfolio. We also find opportunities where we can sell those assets to other operators, so we'll do that. Or we can break down those assets into their components and parts, and that's our used serviceable material business. On the Tech Ops side is where we have our maintenance, repair, and overhaul facilities, or our MROs.
We have three on-airport MROs in the United States, and we have three off-airport MROs that do landing gear components and accessories overall. Also in our Tech Ops side, we have our engineered solutions group, which creates unique products where we improve the operations of an existing aircraft, either to meet a regulatory mandate or to improve the overall operation of that aircraft. That's usually done through a supplemental type certificate awarded by the FAA.
Got it. That's a good overview. Could you talk a little bit about kind of the outlook for this year? You guys reported not too long ago, but we've had noise around tariffs and other things. Just any thoughts on that, the demand environment has changed?
No. I mean, we've been like everybody trying to keep up with the ever-changing environment when it comes to tariffs. Fortunately, we've been working on various strategies to try to mitigate the overall impact. We've used bonded warehouses. We service a lot of customers that are international. Over 60% of our business has been international. We have the opportunity to, if it's foreign-sourced inventory, to keep it outside internationally, and then we can sell it and pretty much avoid the tariff impact. Where we have had to pay overall tariffs, we have been able to pass the majority of that cost onto our overall customers. That would be foreign material that is being consumed in the U.S. Right now, we're not seeing a major impact overall from the tariff issues. We're not seeing kind of impacts on supply chain or anything like that.
I'm sure like a lot of different industries, everybody's trying to understand what the normalization will be, and then no one's really making any decisions right now.
Yeah. Got it. And then in terms of the year, I mean, I know you guys do not like to give specific guidance, but just qualitative thoughts on the various parts of your business, sort of how fast they can grow.
Sure. Sure. I think we're in a very good position to definitely exceed 2024's results overall. I say that because we are coming into the year with a very strong inventory position. We've been fortunate that we have been able to buy in a very tight market good overall material that will serve not only our USM Business, but also we're repairing some of that material that will allow us to grow our leasing portfolio, specifically our engine leasing portfolio, and also serve some whole asset opportunities. We feel good on that, and that's going to drive our asset management side. On the tech op side, we are starting to ramp up our business. We did complete a major project that we had in Goodyear for a U.S. carrier, but we're starting to work with multiple customers to fill that overall capacity.
Actually, out of everything, there's a silver lining. We're starting to see opportunities where we can go from using half of that facility to kind of using all eight facilities. We also have our expansion projects that are coming in, and we'll start generating revenue. We have our Millington facility in Tennessee, which is another on-airport MRO that came online last year and will start getting commercialized this year. Our two expansion projects, both adding pneumatic capabilities and doubling our aero structures facility. As those facilities come through, and those are starting to come in in the next couple of weeks, we expect revenues to start ramping up. Also on our engineered solutions side, we have our AerSale product that has a regulatory requirement coming due next year.
We're starting to see a good steady flow of those sales, and we expect that to start picking up in the second half of the year. With all of that, we feel pretty good about the prospects of this year.
Yeah. Interesting. Okay. It will definitely come back to the year where I think. One of the things I guess we saw in the first quarter, you guys sometimes can have asset sales which tend to be lumpy. I guess as we look at over the next couple of quarters, anything we should expect in terms of cadence of does a lot of those flow through one quarter, or is it just going to let itself?
Yeah. Whole assets are absolutely lumpy. I think ever since we've gone public, we've told that to investors that that'll definitely have some volatility in our overall earnings. It is a key part of our business. We definitely find opportunities where folks will pay more than we potentially see on leasing those assets or parting them out. That'll continue to be a key part of the overall strategy. Q1, they'd only have one of those overall assets. We, as I mentioned, have been able to build up our serviceable inventory, specifically on engines. We do anticipate that we'll have a higher level of whole asset sales for the remainder of the overall year.
Yeah. Got it. Got it. Could you talk a little bit about the aircraft and the engine that you're able to acquire now, what the market looks like in terms of used serviceable material availability, and just sort of confidence on your ability to sort of monetize those assets?
Sure. Sure. On the overall market, it continues to be a very tight market overall. Operators still don't have the confidence on the new OEM production coming in and that production being reliable. Until that happens, you're not going to really start seeing a kind of larger wave of overall retirements. What we are seeing are aircraft and engines that need work, that are potentially unserviceable, and we're buying that overall material. That's perfect because that we can break down and service into our USM. We also use our engineering capabilities and our engine know-how on looking at some various components that we've been buying and putting them together. Making engines out of overall parts and getting an additional revenue stream by making engines that we can sell or that we can put in the overall leasing portfolio.
That has worked kind of well for us overall. What gives us the confidence when we deploy capital? We're very cautious when we deploy capital. It could be the only one criticism you could give us overall. We use our proprietary models. We look at the overall market. We look at sales trends. We look at cost of catalog list price of new overall material, and we price it that way. We look at the existing fleet. We see exactly what retirements are going to come through based on vintages of the overall aircraft. We have a pretty good lay of the land. Assets are long-term assets, and we're in the mid-life space.
When assets start coming into that end of life, we start getting out of those overall platforms, and then we start moving to some of the newer assets that are starting to come in. We have our model. We target a 25% gross margin, internal rate of return. Our history has supported that overall position. When we deploy capital, we have pretty good conviction that we're going to get our returns.
Kind of related to that, I mean, the sort of availability has been tight for a while. I think it's improved. Like you said, as we get more visibility into deliveries, maybe it gets a little bit better. Is that a better sort of profitability environment when there are more assets available because you can buy them cheaper, or then do you sell them for less? What's better?
Yeah. It'll overall be supply and demand. Obviously, there'll be more material overall. Prices will adjust accordingly overall. What it will bring us, and we're very excited about it, it will bring a lot of assets. It'll allow us to grow our overall revenues. We're constantly looking at the overall market because there is an overall change in dynamics. Obviously, we had supply chain constraints over the last 12, 18, probably 24 months ever since we've come out of COVID. You've had almost USM material selling at a premium to OEM new because there is no OEM new. You got to be very cautious of that overall market, and we do.
We anticipate, again, as we're looking at overall platforms, not to get too ahead of ourselves because we do anticipate that that retirement wave is coming, and we want to make sure we're in a good inventory position when that does.
Yeah. Got it. Makes sense. You touched on AirWare earlier, but I guess could you just dive a little bit more into that product? What you're seeing in terms of demand for 737, I think, is where it's qualified now, and then any plan to roll that out to other models?
Sure. We continue to work with various operators on the Airware product. For those that aren't familiar with it, it's a very innovative product, allowing the pilot to use a head-wearable display to be able to see all his instrumentation and, through an enhanced flight vision camera, be able to see through the overall weather. We've been working with those operators, but we have found it is a difficult proposition to introduce new technology into the overall cockpit. What we're doing now is we're working with several operators to potentially put these assets in on aircraft to start getting operational history. One of the things that's happening now, we're seeing it, is the events that happened in Washington, DC, that overall tragedy.
What happened in New York with pilots flying blind, there is a need to enhance the ability for pilots to operate the aircraft and to relieve some of that pressure on the air traffic controllers. This technology can provide that. Looking at, and we've been talking about it in Q1, there's ADS-B technology that the government and the FAA transitioned from old radar to GPS tracking of aircraft. That's called ADS-B out, sending the signal out to the air traffic control. There's ADS-B in, which allows that signal to go to the aircraft. Now the aircraft could actually monitor, very similar to technology we're seeing in our cars. I go, having a head-wearable display where you have pretty much 360-degree because it's following GPS, we think it's definitely an enhanced way of using that technology over a fixed HUD or a fixed display overall.
We still believe that this is transformative. I think once we start getting that operational history, it'll be strong. We've convinced the FAA's technical team to give it a 50% visual advantage. We've talked to the overall training team. I don't think until we start having air traffic control see the benefits of that technology, start giving operators priority to dispatch and land, that we're really going to get into the next step. We're there. We're going to start working with these operators to start getting that information.
Yeah. Can you talk a little bit about the financial impact of that product, both in terms of how profitable it is once you're producing at a high level, but also the investment that you've made in that? Does that start to roll off, and does that sort of help cost-wise?
Sure. Sure. So the catalog list price is approximately $1.5 million. Now, that's not all our product. Just as a partnership with Universal Avionics, which is an Elbit subsidiary. So that's roughly about a 50, 50 split on that overall product. Our margin profile, we anticipate to be strong. For our other engineered solutions products, it's been in excess of 50%. I go, we have been producing our portion of the overall kit. So we do have a handle on cost. And obviously, there's cost opportunities once we start ramping up production at a greater level overall. The economics are strong. It also gives us a lot of opportunity for potential discounting for any potential initial orders. The economics are definitely strong. We're focused on it. Almost all the investment has already been spent on these assets.
Now it's a matter of getting it out there, kind of almost evangelizing the message of this product and monetizing on that opportunity.
Yeah. Got it. And how do you think about sort of, I guess, profitability for the business overall? I mean, as you mentioned, multiple different kind of subparts of the business and a little bit of noise around kind of product sales. But could you talk a little bit about how kind of the margins in each part are trending from here?
Yeah. I think our overall margin profile will start to increase. Our leasing portfolio has always enjoyed strong overall margins. Again, we're buying assets in a lot of part assets that are pretty much close to pared-out value, so close to that salvage value. Our margin profile has been strong. As that grows, that'll increase the overall leasing portfolio. Engineered solutions product, as I mentioned, have enjoyed a 50% overall margin. That's also going to be accretive to the overall mix. Our USM sales have enjoyed about a 25% margin. Again, you're going to start seeing more of that coming through. We're excited about all those prospects. On our MROs, which are traditionally what you would say maybe lower overall margin opportunities, we have taken a deep dive into kind of our operations and really kind of worked on efficiencies and labor utilization.
We also expect those businesses to start enjoying a better margin profile, which is great because we have a lot of good prospects there to grow that side of the business.
Yeah. Got it. Could you talk a little bit about MRO capacity? I mean, you touched on it earlier, a little bit of expansion there. We've heard a lot of the hangars are full kind of across the industry. How does that stand, and what's kind of the outlook there?
Yeah. We're seeing a lot of overall demand in the MRO space. On the on-airport MRO, we did conclude an overall project that we had with a major U.S. carrier that ended at the end of last year, fully in December. We've been talking to a lot of different customers, and we brought in a new executive to help us with overall marketing and sales of those units. It's been a very strong demand. We're definitely seeing, as you noted, operators both with a desire to bring back onshore some of the maintenance activities that are being performed. Definitely, especially ultra-low-cost carriers, cargo operators, wanting a more specialized and more close kind of maintenance amount. That is going great. We feel very good at the prospects.
Again, we were using about four of the overall bays that are good at your facility. We're seeing opportunities to potentially use all eight bays overall. That excites us. Our Millington facility is, for the most part, we have completely revamped it. It is state-of-the-art, centrally located, very good labor pool. We have a lot of prospects there of customers who like it just in the fact that they can almost have a dedicated facility for them. We have some good overall prospects there. On the expansion projects, on the two other expansion projects that we did on the component side, our air structures business has been busy since pretty much we purchased it five years ago. The opportunity to triple that footprint obviously will mean that we can more than triple the size of that overall business.
We already have customers that have scheduled to do overall audits to get us approved. They have told us once that capability is there and that capacity is there, we're going to take advantage of it. Same thing for our pneumatic project. We're already doing some pneumatics. We're testing that overall equipment. We expect both of those sides will be able to ramp up as soon as those facilities come online. Absolutely still a very strong aftermarket, and we're very well positioned to take advantage of that.
Got it. Got it. A couple of things I've heard from other sort of MRO operators to complain about for a long time now. One is ability to get parts on time to finish some of these job visits. The other is getting enough labor headcount just to do all the work. I guess, have you seen has that been an issue for you? If so, is that starting to get better at all? Is it still a challenge?
There is still definitely some challenges in certain overall components and parts. We have seen an improvement on that. We have been able to mitigate when it comes into the airframe material because we do repair some of our overall airframe. Again, it is the lack of actually finding a part because we have a USM inventory. We can repair our own material to get our assets out. Where we have seen pressure is on the engine side because we do not do engine repairs, so we do outsource that. What we have done is, again, we have used our USM inventory. We have built our overall modules. That has expedited the process and also lowered the cost for our repairs. We were seeing probably last year kind of a very long cycle to get those engines out. That has greatly improved, probably still a little longer than it normally took.
That's starting to give us the ability. We have overall 10 engines now that have come out of that overall repair process that are marketing. We have another 10 engines that are starting to come out, and will come out in the next probably two months overall. I go, so we're starting to see that cycle improve overall.
Yeah. Got it. Could you talk a little bit about capital deployment priorities for the business? You guys have done some share repurchases. Is there a plan for that to be a big part of the mix with M&A? Just anything you think about?
Yeah. From a capital deployment perspective, we did do a stock buyback. We were looking at the stock, and obviously, we believe our stock is undervalued. We're trading at below tangible book value. Any share buyback would be buying pretty much our existing assets at a discount. Also talking to investors, we understood that the overhang of the Leonard Green Holdings was definitely putting pressure on the overall stock. We did negotiate an agreement where we could buy $45 million of shares at a discounted price and kind of alleviate that overhang, bring Leonard Green down to a much smaller level overall, and overall decrease our overall share count overall. I don't anticipate or foresee any additional purchases of stock in the current year. I think we have a lot of strong opportunities to continue to buy feedstock to grow the business.
M&A, so we have taken an approach when it comes to not doing M&A, but building it on our own. I think there's definitely some good opportunities that we're seeing out in the market that obviously would be quicker to buy something that's already operating. We'll be looking at potential M&A opportunities. When it comes to M&A, we're going to take a very cautious approach, just like we do with asset management. We want to make sure that anything that we do is accretive overall. It has the synergies to the rest of the business. Again, we'll take a cautious approach, but absolutely, we think there's good capital opportunities for us to deploy. Now, one of the benefits that we have is we do have that strong inventory position. We are going to be recycling that overall capital.
That's going to allow us to continue to grow the company and not have to take on additional debt. I think we're in a pretty good overall position there.
Yeah. Got it. Could you talk about sort of the competitive landscape a little bit? I mean, you guys have sort of a unique business model where you buy an asset, you could lease it out, you could part it out, you could sell it as a whole asset. Just sort of how you compete with others and how you think AerSale can differentiate it.
Yeah. We definitely think that our multidimensional extraction process is key and gives us a competitive advantage. When I'm looking at an asset overall, I'm not just looking at, okay, that's going to be the USM value. I know that if I have cycles remaining, which is pretty much cycles remaining as the engine can fly, that I can have a revenue stream there and operate that overall engine, get that leasing revenue, and at the end of that lease, part out the engine. That gives me an opportunity to be able to pay more because I can extract more overall value. Also, as I mentioned in the overall market, when I'm looking at assets that are unserviceable, but I'm buying multiple assets, I have the opportunity to put things together and make flyable assets and be able to create overall value.
That is definitely important when it comes to operators, especially smaller operators, having one person that can help them move all their overall inventory and definitely working with a counterparty that they have confidence is going to close. It definitely gives us a key in the overall market.
Yeah. Got it. When you think about that model of we've got this asset, we're deciding what we're going to do with it. I mean, is there a key driver, whether it's like interest rates or fuel prices, where things go one way, we're just going to do this? Or is it really just each asset is unique?
Every asset that we look at, we run it through our proprietary models. Again, we're trying to target a 25% IR. We are looking at what is the most advantageous way of extracting that value. It really will depend on the condition of the overall asset. On anything related to aircraft, it's all about the records. It's back to cradle record keeping. We have all of that information. We can do boroscopes on the engines. We can do inspections on the airframe. We have a pretty good handle on, as we're doing due diligence, the condition of that overall aircraft. We are working with our US and Irish counterparts on what is the leasing market for this overall asset. I go, our engineering team or our power plant engineering team, on what is the condition of the engine? Do you think you could repair the engine?
Do we have other components of other engines that we could potentially economically build an overall engine? We will factor all of that in. The last part of that equation is, if we cannot, what is the value of those overall parts? What is the demand out there? There is an inventory listing system that we look at. We know kind of what is out there. I go, we obviously know what catalog list price is. We obviously want to make sure that we are below that overall. We are working with operators on, okay, what are your needs? What are you looking for both from an operator standpoint, working with leasing companies and our own MROs? We are using all of that dynamic to kind of make sure that, okay, we know we definitely have an out.
For the most part, we'll try to not go down a one-way street. If we're looking at an overall asset and we say, look, I think there's a leasing opportunity here, we'll always make sure that we can still make an overall profit if we were to part it out, which would be the lowest kind of revenue extraction process.
Yeah. And as the assets are going through that process, how long does that take from when you first get it to when you monetize it? Is there any sort of inventory value risk or anything, or is it pretty well set?
No. From a timing perspective, again, it depends on the overall asset. We've been fortunate to buy some engines, again, not that many at this time around, that are ready to go. You pretty much can market it out. We've had deals where we've bought a series of assets, aircraft and engines, and we've been able to sell those engines within days, if not within hours. There's other assets that we've been able to grab, and immediately we need to send them out for repair. It needs to go out to the repair process. We need to get all the overall inventory. That could take two to three months. Then we'll bring back the asset out, and we'll start marketing the asset at that point.
If we're going to break it down into USM, again, you're refurbishing a lot of that overall material, whether within our facilities or with other facilities. Again, that process takes about probably two to three months to start getting that inventory on the shelves. As far as pricing risk overall, as I mentioned, we're looking at overall market. We're working on very stable markets. We don't anticipate any of that overall risk. In fact, catalog list price goes up every year. If anything, that inventory continues to be worth more. Again, the key is dealing with in-demand platforms. That's why we stay in the mid-life space more into the end-of-cycle market so we can start exiting those spaces. Again, we'll refocus our efforts now on the newer assets that are starting to get into that mid-life cycle.
That helps us hedge a little bit of that price volatility and price risk.
Yeah. Got it. Got it. Could you talk about used serviceable materials, used parts, kind of what the demand is and how that's sort of trended over time? I think years and years ago, we didn't use a lot of it, and it's sort of grown. Have you seen any increased demand for it given that the industry overall is pretty tight in terms of supply?
Yeah. I mean, I think USM, at least over the last few years, has enjoyed pretty good acceptance level, definitely more than PMA parts or product manufactured parts overall. We haven't seen that overall. Absolutely, after COVID, when there was no OEM production, USM was heavily favored because that was your only option. Even PMA parts got additional favor in that ever-tightening market. Our position has always been that the only limitation on USM sales is having the availability of well-priced USM parts that you can put into the overall market. You're giving the market assets that are pretty much the same OEM quality because they are OEM material, remanufactured up to the overall specs at a significant 20%-30% discount. The market will continue to use USM if it's available.
Obviously, if the only thing we had was USM, we could not service all the overall engines. We believe the market will continue to be strong. Key that you have assets and platforms that are in demand. We expect that market to continue to be strong overall. We are seeing, obviously, much better production of new OEM material overall. I think it's that cost savings aspect that still is going to make USM attractive now and going forward.
Got it. You mentioned PMA, which are essentially kind of third-party manufactured alternatives for the OEM part. Is that something that you've seen more adoption of? Would that be something that could be a bigger part of your business at any point in the future?
We look at it. We have product manufacturing authority. We primarily use it for our supplemental type certificates. We use that to certify the foam on the AerSafe kit or certify the overall antennas that are used in the AerTrak system overall. That is where we have limited it. We brought an executive that does have PMA experience. That is something that we are always looking to potentially expand. Now, I would not do PMA parts or try to come up with a $5 bolt and come up with an overall solution. We would look at something that is more higher dollars and better profit items. That is definitely something we have capabilities to do that we are looking to potentially expand.
Yeah. Got it. Got it. Could you talk a little bit about the freighter conversion market? And you guys had some 757s. I think you're doing passenger to freighter conversions. What kind of demand are you seeing there on the freighter?
Yeah. So obviously, during COVID, cargo was pretty much on fire. I mean, everybody was getting everything shipped. Overall, then we had kind of probably 18 months ago kind of this shift in consumer sentiment. All of a sudden, people did not want to buy goods. They wanted to have experiences. We saw kind of a decline in the overall demand for freighter aircraft. We have at this point six 757s that are pretty much fully converted that are being marketed for sale or lease. Fortunate for us, we have seen an uptick in demand for those assets over the last six months. We are working with multiple operators to potentially sell. The majority of those opportunities will be to lease those overall assets. We feel good. The 757 is a very unique aircraft. It has a large payload for a narrow-body aircraft, wide range.
These are the newest of the 757s. These are the last to be converted. They have the latest technology, winglets, glass cockpits. They are definitely a very attractive addition to any freight operator. That is what we are starting to see, kind of that pickup in demand overall. We feel pretty confident we will be able to deploy those six assets next year.
Got it. Got it. Are there more left beyond that that are still in the works or?
Overall, we have the ability to potentially convert to additional assets, but we'll do probably those more on a spec basis. If somebody has a demand, then we'll do the conversions at that point.
Okay. And then you use other customer types. I mean, on the defense side, coming on demand there, and how big a part of your business is that?
The military part is a small part of our business. It's been less than 5%. I think last year might have been less than 2% overall. There's an opportunity there that we're definitely seeking. Obviously, our MROs can work on components that would serve military aircraft. On the asset management side, there are definitely some platforms that are commercial derivatives. The P-8 Poseidon is a derivative of a 737-800. That is a market that we can definitely continue to grow. We were one of the first companies to sell USM sales to the U.S. government overall because the U.S. government used to have a stigma on USM. That's definitely something that we are definitely pursuing. We have the support of a board member who's a former military officer to kind of tap into that overall market and grow it.
Yeah. Yeah. Got it. Cool. If anyone in the audience has one? Yep. Sorry.
Justin, had a 757 increase in demand you mentioned on freight, right? Is it due to this sort of more to the tariff situation, the freight price we have in China tariffs, or is it more from the market change that we see going through?
Yeah. As I mentioned, we started seeing the increase before the overall tariff situation. I think it's been overall markets normalizing a little bit more, and there being some increased overall demand. That's, I think, where we're attributing it right now. The tariff situation is a little bit interesting in that, again, these 757s or narrowbody aircraft aren't very—they don't do transatlantic. They do more kind of intercontinent. There would be opportunities if all of a sudden you're not serving necessarily from China, the U.S., but you're moving more of that inventory within Asia or into Europe, that these narrow-body aircraft could potentially be in greater demand. We actually had sold a lot of these 757s to YTO and SF Express that service Alibaba in China to serve kind of that overall market. That potentially could actually go our way.
We're definitely seeing with other overall demand opportunities that we're getting those assets. So there's definitely interest in those assets.
Got it. Yeah. Shegoupo.
In terms of that, when you said that airlines will need some signals from where you like to say they have more confidence in improving the demand in their production, what does that mean? Do you know, in your opinion, what does that do? Do they have to see the new production to be more confident? In your opinion also, do you think the fall where they have a demand kind of a season went down, would you be like the best time for the retirements in the field?
Yeah.
Everything stays the same?
I think from a fleet manager perspective, you want to see probably at least six months of repetitive production demand. You want to make sure that on the Airbus side, that your turbofan issue has been repaired so that you're getting pretty good reliability on the engines that are servicing the new platforms overall. I think once you have that, again, for an airline, the most important thing is to have seats filled and have that capacity to meet that overall demand. They'll take a very cautious approach to make sure that they'll keep the assets to make sure they can service that customer need because that is their revenue flow. Again, when that does start to feel a little bit better, the fleet is definitely older. You'll start seeing some of those opportunities for them to transition some of those aircraft out.
What's good is that when aircraft start getting transitioned and get retired, they don't ever fully retire. I go, when they're leaving the majors, they're starting to transition to what we call tier two, tier three operators, operators that fly in Latin America or Southeast Asia or the ultra low-cost carriers overall. Those assets will continue to live a second life, some as passenger aircraft, some as cargo aircraft. You'll continue to see that overall demand that will obviously displace older assets that those operators use. Again, I think it's an exciting time. We're hopeful, and we're seeing some good numbers being posted by Boeing that they'll finally have gotten over some of this issue. We were in the Boeing camp. We had bet that they were going to get this resolved a lot sooner than now.
I think we were in the months, and obviously, at this point, it's been years. We're starting to see some positive momentum there. I think if the market can start seeing that, there'll be some deployment for new OEM production, and that'll start benefiting us on retirements.
Great. I had one question left, and you asked it. Maybe that's a good place to wrap it up, Martin. Thanks again for coming.
Hey, perfect. Thanks for the invite again.