So thank you all for being here. We're moving into our afternoon session. We're delighted to have with us Booz Allen. And from Booz, we have Matt Calderone, their CFO. And before we begin, I'm not going to recite the whole thing, but just remind you there will be forward-looking remarks made in the Reg FD. So anyway. So, Matt, welcome. Thanks so much for doing this. Really appreciate it. I don't know if you have any opening comments that you wanted to make.
Sure. I mean, at conferences like this are always fun because there are people that know Booz Allen and folks that are relatively new to the stock or to the industry. You know, Booz Allen, it's an interesting year, right, because it's Booz Allen's 110th anniversary. Not a lot of companies can say that. It's a company that is one that, you know, obviously you don't get to be 110 years old if you don't have a sense of mission and purpose and stewardship. But also, you know, the ability to create and change and innovate and be entrepreneurial. So, you know, Booz Allen is going to be a $10 billion company this year. Hard to believe. We are the premier company in bringing technology to solve mission problems at scale for the U.S. Federal Government with signature positions in artificial intelligence, cyber defense, and digital transformation.
We're well diversified across defense, civil, and intelligence community clients and a wide base of contracts. As I said upfront, you know, we have a spirit of entrepreneurship and creativity in the institution that's really rooted in our consulting legacy. We're not a consulting firm anymore. But a lot of that, the elements of that business model still exist in terms of our ability to get inside clients, understand their challenges, bring creative solutions to bear to solve them, and increasingly work to solve them at scale. We are, I would say, the organic growth leader in the industry. If you look longitudinally, that's the root of our business model and our value proposition to investors.
We've coupled that more recently with the ability to deliver consistent value through effective use of the balance sheet, be it through a very consistent dividend policy, fairly regular share buybacks, and then M&A, which has been accretive, but somewhat episodic. So that's the Booz Allen story. We've got a lot of momentum in the business. Having a great year. We just guided a 13%-14% organic growth for the year. We're [busy]. We're building resilience through strength. I'm sure you have a lot of questions about the budget that no, none of us can answer, but we'll all attempt to do so. We got a lot of momentum.
So the big question, you know, I always get is like, they've grown ever since you guys went public. You've grown faster than your peers.
Sure.
What's the transformation of Booz over the past hundred years? Like, what's the secret sauce that allows you to do that?
secret sauce? I'm not going to go all the way back to a hundred years.
Well.
But as Rossie and I were joking, it's my 25th year anniversary. I actually started on the commercial side of the business, and we've become the people that tell stories about the old days. No, I think, as I mentioned in my opening remarks. You know, these. Look, trends change, right? So, you know, what drives longitudinal advantage, you know, has to be almost cultural and business model oriented. In my mind, it is, you know, the roots of being a consulting firm. It's being entrepreneurial. It's being innovative, being creative at the point of solving a mission problem. Now, the tools we brought to bear have changed over time. I mean, flashback 15 years ago, we were the McKinsey of government. You know, we've transitioned, Cai, as you know, from a place in 2012 where 30% of our workforce had a technical background to now we're approaching 70%.
We are not just selling, you know, what's still the lifeblood of Booz Allen, which is the $5 million, $10 million, $20 million, $25 million task orders, but we've sold $7 billion contracts in the last year. So we're, you know, coupling our ability to do small scale, strategic, innovative work with doing work at scale. But it's still that sense of entrepreneurship, of mission focus, of our ability to collaborate across the institution to bring to bear, you know, AI, cyber, digital mission expertise. That's the root of our success.
So, how important is the fact that, what I understand is your sort of pay is structured sort of like a partnership where everyone at a certain level gets paid more or less the same. But,
Yeah, that's right. We have all of our incentive-based comp is based on overall firm performance. So we have not only not just one P&L, but and this is for what we call senior associates and above. So, you know, let's say, give or take the top 2,000 people in the institution. Their bonus, our bonus, it all scales up or down based on firm performance only. And so how that manifests itself is there really is no incentive, in a meaningful way toward resources.
Right.
I just spent yesterday and, oh, Monday and yesterday in firm-wide executive talent management meetings with all of our top leaders reviewing the top 250. You know, I wouldn't say it was a seamless discussion. But it was a discussion that was very much geared towards, hey, what's best for this person, and what's best for the business? You know, I had this cyber expert in the intel community. Can we transition her over to the civil environment? We see a ton of opportunity, and that happens, you know, at our level. But it happens, more importantly, you know, throughout the institution on a daily basis.
So one of the things I've always noticed that's different about Booz is that, you know, the strategy is get on big multi-award IDIQs and use the consulting heritage to win task orders. And I actually checked, actually preparing for the conference, that you've gone from 33% of total FY 2017 revenues to like 58%. It's like pretty much a straight line. So what's the strategy there? Is that number going to continue to go up, that you're kind of moving more toward more, big IDIQs?
Yeah, I think there's just two, two things that are driving that. I wouldn't say it's been a strategy. It's been a natural evolution of how we're pursuing work and how the market's headed. You know, one, as you know, we're seeing a lot of consolidation of contracts writ large, you know, broader scope, longer duration. You know, we think that that trend plays in our favor. Perhaps wouldn't have 10 years ago. But given, you know, the breadth of our technical capabilities, you know, if you're putting out a five-year procurement, that's mission focused, you're going to want to have access to world-class cyber, digital, AI, and engineering capabilities. And, and you want to we're going to want a trusted partner that can help you, you know, make those capabilities drive mission impact at scale. And that's a relatively limited set.
So as we've grown, and as we've grown in our ability to pursue and win large jobs, I think that's a natural extension of that. But, you know, certainly, you know. We view, you know, IDIQs as a source of growth. I mean, we always say internally, selling starts the day you win the contract. Many of these large vehicles, you know, it's a question I get often, you know. Does it always translate to revenue? And most of them, you have to actually do the work, right? Because the government, you know, even our big Thunderdome contract, right? We've got to prove that out. We've got to sell it, not just within DISA, but to the various, you know, services and commands. And it's got to, it's got to work. So, you know, we think that plays.
It's a natural extension of our legacy, because it's really just an aggregation of a lot of small task orders under one big broad scope.
And yet, so it's like, as I recall, like about 13% of your work are sort of single, single award contracts, and most of them are all intel. So, I mean, I've always noticed that, for the most part, you don't see Booz getting the headline of winning the $3 billion, you know, DES, or one of those contracts. You know, you're it seems a little bit below the radar because of the types of things you're you're going after. Is that going to change?
It's beginning to change. I'd say it's yes, and right. We've gone from, you know, small to large. We're getting more, you know, single award vehicles, Thunderdome, CDC, DMAC.
Right.
You know, some of the recent large wins we've had. Our work with Space Force, etc. But, you know, we're comfortable working in both environments, because in a world where you win based on value, we think that, you know. We bring more value than than anyone else in the industry.
Got it. And so, like, third quarter, you know, you grew, you know, a little under 13%. You hiked the guide to 14%-15%. That really works out to 10%-13% in the fourth quarter. What are the drivers by sectors that get us there?
So we've seen, as you know, strong double-digit growth in both defense and civil this year. You know, I think defense, a lot of the macro trends that, you know, others have seen in the services space, the pacing threat of China, the need for decision advantage, more work on mission systems. You know, the integration of cyber into the OT environment, increasingly at least interest in applying AI to solve mission problems at scale. And, as you know, we have, under the CDAO, the largest AI contract in the defense space there. In the civil space, it's been a continuation of the push for modernization, which has been a priority with President Biden, and previous President Trump. You know, we've grown some of our franchise positions in the VA.
won a big new job down at CDC to expand our position there, and we're doing, you know, an increasing amount of work in CBP and elsewhere. So I would say that's been broad-based. And in intel, you know, we've talked a lot publicly about the loss of F2. But, excluding that, there's a lot of momentum underneath that contract—or sorry, underneath that business. We've won, you know, I'm not sure we won anything at a big headline number, but the breadth of work that we're selling in the intel space has us really encouraged. So, you know, we're seeing fairly broad-based growth across all three sectors.
You know, once F2 works its way through the comp set, I think you'll see our intel business, you know, not necessarily growing at the same pace as defense and civil, but growing at a reasonable clip.
Got it. So, you mentioned hiring and employment, employee deployment improvement is a plus for growth. And can you elaborate? Because I was interested that you said, well, you know, used to take us six to 60 days to get a new hire billable. Like, what's that number today? And where can it go?
Yeah. So, to maybe take your question up a level, you know, we've demonstrated over the last seven quarters, I think, very consistent, robust growth in headcount. And that's been both from a hiring perspective. The volume of people we're hiring, you know, we're seeing almost double the number of applicants that we did at this time last year on a monthly basis. To our time to get them billable. And we've dropped that, as you said, from, you know, give or take 60 days to the 30-45 day range. We're also seeing a significant uptick in employer referrals and any meaningful decline in attrition. Right? So both sides of the labor equation have stabilized. We're hiring more consistently, and there's less friction in the system. And we're losing fewer of our current talent.
That's driven, you know, really what we termed. We chose this term intentionally, and the earnings call remarkably consistent performance in labor on the labor supply side this year. And hopefully, you know, some of those trends are enduring. I think, you know, we and our government clients have also learned some of the lessons from COVID, both in terms of more flexible work arrangements, for us, how we do remote hiring. You know, flashback to 2018 and 2019, we were still holding a lot of hiring events, you know, big conference rooms like this. It's hard to believe, right? And it's just so much more efficient to hire the way that we're hiring now, using, you know, technology and the ability to do remote screening and things of that nature.
Got it. So, everyone in the sector's basics. I mean, I've been shocked, you know, followed the sector for over 10 years, and like. It's like never been better in terms of easy to get folks, attrition rates are kind of really way down. So if you think about that time from hire to 10 when they're billable, if it's now 30-45 days, can it get better? Or is that as good as it gets?
That's a good question. I'll have to ask Kristine Martin Anderson, our Chief Operating Officer, that question. Yeah, I think there's always going to be. Let me put it a different way. You don't want your bench to be zero.
Right.
Right? I mean, you want to have an available bench, like any service business, you know, particularly given, as you know, our history of tactical selling. So we're always hiring people, you know. Not just for jobs where we have, you know, a what we call sold and funded rec, but, you know, in advance of where we think demand may go. A lot of these large jobs, you're either have contingent hires, or you're hiring, you know, a cyber expert in advance of thinking you're going to win something.
Right.
So, you know, in the aggregate, can you get below 30 days? You know, probably, but I'm not sure I would want to. I think, you know. Our bench, you know, we said on the call, I said on the call, you know, remains at the lower end of historic norms right now, which says we're absorbing people, you know, fairly efficiently, and we hope to continue a pace.
Got it. Also said you expected just an EBITDA margin to be more level across the quarters and in prior years. I mean. So I always don't get surprised, because many companies, the fourth quarter is the good one with yours. It's like, ugh.
Yeah, right.
But so why is it more level? I mean, is it just why? How come?
Yeah. So, you know, as you know, typically our seasonal pattern is our Q2 is our best margin quarter, and Q4 is our most challenging, I think. You know, I said in Q2 we did anticipate a relatively flatter profile this year, and we still expect that to play out. It really has to do with, you know, the timing of when we're incurring certain costs, both recoverable and unrecoverable, and when we have, you know, sort of some full year visibility into what our cost profile is going to look like. You know, as you know, in our business, you know, where a lot of our work is cost recoverable. How you think about balancing that across the year, it matters. But that's why we've always said, and I know it's harder to, you know, to judge from the outside.
We manage it on a full year basis. So we feel very comfortable with, you know, our guide in the, you know, approximately 11% range. I think it's the right level for this business, given where we are.
Got it. So, the guide for, you know, it was 11%. Yeah. But your margin has moved up over time. I think you've been trying to focus a little bit more on sort of technology, bleeding edge type stuff, where you can make more money, you know, with labor utilization improving. Can that 11%? Is that as good as it gets? Or is there any opportunity to improve it?
Yeah, I don't want to get ahead of guidance for next year. I think. As I said, we're comfortable at this number. I know in our investment thesis we'd guide into the mid to the mid 10s. Yeah, I think we're comfortable at 11 for where we are now. You know, if you look at what are the elements that'll drive margins higher? I mean, as you know, you know, governments are a very efficient buyer. You know, fixed price jobs typically have a higher margin than T&M, and the two of them are significantly higher margin than cost plus. So, you know, are we going to shift our portfolio, or is the government going to shift their buying to more of a fixed price model? You know, perhaps, right? I think we know a lot of us have talked about outcome-based contracting for a long time.
Particularly with, you know, some of the efficiencies that AI can produce. You'd think that that may be in the cards. We know that clients are experimenting on this, you know, around this, the edges on this on a small scale. We're not ready to call that in a meaningful way. So that's, you know, let's call it from the in the contract level profitability. Then, institutionally, we are getting scale out of the business more than we'd anticipated. I think that's largely what's driven, you know, our margins up over the past five years. We do anticipate continuing to get scale out of the business. The question is, do we reinvest that into our people and into growth? And/or, you know, do we drop it to the bottom line? I think, you know, we have some optionality there.
So when you look at your numbers, I can't remember the exact number, but I think it was like your gross margin has been basically flat as a pancake. I think it was 53.5. I can't remember something like that. It's just like.
Yep.
You know, and it's all been basically SG&A, SG&A coming down. So is this a leverage model? So like, if your growth slows, it's harder to improve the profitability, I would assume. But if you basically continue, you know, the good growth. There should be opportunity to improve the profitability.
That's why I said, yeah, we, you know, we are getting scale out of the business, to your point. And, you know, the question is, what do you do with that scale? And, you know, we've been reinvesting in, you know, capabilities and solutions that our clients need. We're seeing a lot in AI. We've also been reinvesting in higher wages for our workforce, particularly as we've transitioned to become a more technical workforce. And, you know, that's helped drive our attrition rate down, as well as dropping some of that, some of that, to the bottom line. So, you know, we do think that we will continue to get scale out of the business, assuming we continue to grow at the pace we are.
So theoretically.
Theoretically.
That gives you the opportunity to get those higher. So what about.
Look, there are also other offsetting things. I mean, some of these larger jobs, particularly technology jobs, you know, may have a higher billable expense ratio or ODCs, which tend to be lower margin. So that's not why we're not, you know. We're not making a long-term call, but we are getting scale out of the business.
I guess you've made the point that, when you look at your mix of business by client, that civil tends to have a higher percentage of firm fixed.
Correct.
Basically you go to Intel. It's cost plus, so that the hierarchy is the higher margin, civil, defense, Intel. How does that mix look going forward? Because it looks like Intel is growing a little bit more slowly than the others. And is civil, you know, in the current budget environment, still going to be able to grow as fast as it's grown?
We see a lot of potential in all three sectors, as I talked about. You know. We're still working through, you know. We're, I think, in Q4 of absorbing the loss of F2 this quarter. But, you know. Both civil and defense are growing almost 20% this year. You know, are we going to maintain that rate next year? You know, that's a little heady. We'll get, you know, we'll talk more about that in May. But we see, you know, significant potential in both of those businesses, and intel, you know, as I said, you know, they've hit bottom. The second derivative is very positive. So, I mean, if your question is, are we going to get some margin lift from just mix shift? I'm not sure. I'd assume that.
Why not?
Just depends.
I mean, it looks like the revenue.
Defense is 45% of our business, right? Civil's 35%. So it's a.
Well, I mean, I guess the lowest margin is in. I mean, there's simple math. The lowest margin is Intel. It's coming off the bottom, but it doesn't have the momentum, because you still are anniversaring, you know, but the NSA contract. So I would assume the revenue mix continues to shift somewhat toward civil and defense versus Intel.
Yeah, it's funny. Yes. And if you actually look, I mean, civil business has grown faster than the other two sectors, FY 2019. But if you look at our contract mix, it 2019 to 2020 to where we are now, it's almost exactly the same.
Okay, okay, good.
I think Cost Plus has been 53% in both views.
So we haven't talked much about the commercial international. It's smaller. It basically was kind of fading away. And then this last quarter, it kind of looks like it started to come back. Where's that going?
Yeah. So let's take those in two parts. We've exited our international business. And that was largely a business that was built on the back of us supporting allies in the region, doing, you know, work at, you know, quote-unquote, commercial rates. But as you know, in the Middle East, you know, there's the lines between commercial and government clients are relatively fungible, but supporting a lot of the modernization in the Middle East that, I think, we'd all hoped we would happen. So that's done. What's left is, you know, a commercial cyber business doing high-end commercial cyber consulting and incident response. That is a really nice business. You've been following us for a long time, Cai. At one point we talked about commercial as another leg of the stool, I think, now characterize it as a nice piece of the puzzle.
Right. It's a small piece.
It's a very nice part of the business. It's got a lot of natural synergies and connections with our government cyber business. If you think about, you know, you know, threat vectors and the attack surface, and even a lot of these nation-state gangs that are, you know, the same folks that are holding up a regional hospitals network are the ones that are going after, you know, some of our, government assets. And, you know, I think we all just we all heard what Director Wray said a couple of weeks ago about the current state of U.S. infrastructure. So it's, we're actually bringing the commercial business.
We're. We're connecting it, you know, more than we ever have with our government cyber folks. Zero trust. You know, the work we're doing in Thunderdome. There's some natural applications in the commercial space. So, so we like that business for what it is. It's a nice piece of the puzzle. High-end commercial cyber, mainly. For U.S. clients or U.S. clients that have, you know, offices overseas.
Is it growing? Is it likely to grow in line? I mean, it's not big enough to really make a huge difference, but.
You know, it's.
Higher margin. So if it grows.
It's higher margin, I think. You know, there are two pieces to it. Our incident response portion of our business has grown meaningfully this year. Commercial cyber, you know, no different than a lot of the commercial consulting firms has struggled, given some of the sort of macro effects.
Got it. So if we look at your potential bids. I mean, you basically had a 0.7 book-to-bill in the third quarter. Which is huge for you guys, because that's seasonally not so hot. So what you're like about a 1.4 trailing 12. Is that too high? I mean.
Did we sell too much work? Is it?
Yeah. Well, I mean, what's your target? And, you know.
I mean, it's a it's gonna sound flippant, but our target is typically sell as much as you can. I mean, historically, what we've said is, you know, for us to meet our numbers in our investment thesis, right? So let's say. You know, high single-digit growth. You know, we need 3%-5% headcount growth on an annualized basis, and 1.2-1.3x book-to-bill.
Right.
We're ahead of pace on both metrics. So we feel like we're well positioned for next year. But next year is also going to be. I'm sure you have questions about that, you know, one with a lot of uncertainty. So. You know, taking a step back. I joked about selling as much as possible. You know, our view has always been. You know. As you know, the way our business lines up with the government fiscal year. You know, it comes in the middle of ours. So strong first half, uncertain second half.
Right.
And, you know, in all years, but particularly this one, where there is some uncertainty about what the funding and political environment's gonna look like. You know, we have told our folks, just keep going. Sell as much as you can, hire as much as you can, build as much as you can. You know, we have an internal mantra of resilience through strength.
So what sort of impact would election outcomes have? I mean, like, does it really matter if it's? I mean, there are obviously multiple potentials. Either you get a Trump or a Biden, and you get who got who has the Senate, etc.
So, as you said, we've demonstrated the ability to grow above market in under different political administrations, and historically, if you look back, you know, Republicans tend to spend more than Democrats do when they have the White House.
Right.
You know, right? I mean, Clinton, Clinton and Obama were the two presidents where we saw retrenchment in federal government spending. You know, we believe we have positioned our work. You know, we're focusing on what we call missions of national importance, right? So, you know, whether it's pacing threat of China or AI, cyber, you know, in these longer term signature contracts that, you know, theoretically should be immune. You know, more immune to, you know, the whims of different political administrations. But, you know, and you've seen this in our business, too. When there's uncertainty about direction, that's when things tend to, in the service business, get gummed up for a bit, right? So, you know, historically, you know, the outgoing administration, their priorities have.
You know, really, you know, kept funding going for, let's say, six months to a year, until the new mission takes in, and then there's a period of changeover.
Right.
You know, the extent, you know, weather and how that changeover happens, I think this year. You know, there's more uncertainty around that than perhaps in transitions past.
Right, right. So what are the, you know, when you step back, what do you see the greatest challenges, you know, facing the nation, the government that, you know, that you guys address? What are the key drivers to your business?
I think there's three. You know. From a mission standpoint, certainly our defense and intel clients are all focused on the, you know, the pacing threat of what's happening in the Indo-Pacific. Not to downplay what's happening in Europe or the Middle East, all of which are important. But that's. You know. The principal focus of most of our clients. That's one, two is just the pace and the impact of these waves of technical change. And what it does, not just to mission, but to the tools you have to solve it, and the need to integrate across technologies, being, you know, commercial or homegrown, you know, AI and cyber. I mean, it's not just each of these as a one-off, right? And I, Cai, I think you came to our AI event.
Right, right.
You know, we had a brief discussion about the intersection between AI and cyber, and that in and of itself.
Right.
It's just an extraordinarily challenging topic.
Right.
So it's, you know, how do I understand what's the next wave? What's the current wave? How does it impact me? How do I integrate it? You know, what does it mean? You know, is it something I have to defend or attack or protect or utilize? And then, you know, I think in the near term, there's a lot of interest in AI. Folks don't know exactly what it means in most parts of the government, and in certain parts, you know. Image classification.
Right.
Battlespace management. They're perhaps, you know, further advanced than others. There's a lot of interest in AI. Folks don't know what. No different than what we're seeing in the commercial world. You know, we're in the early experimentation stages in most parts.
So, you know, at your AI demo last fall, you highlighted, you know, Booz is the leader. It was like 7% of your workforce. I can't remember the exact metrics. So, basically, how do you feel you stack up? Because you say you're the leader. I mean, everyone here, you know, defense IT companies, they're all talking about, man, I got AI. I got AI. I mean, everyone has AI. But so, where's your position?
I got some in my pocket, right?
Where's your position? And do you think the gap, if you feel there is a gap, is that gap widening? Is it narrowing? How should I think about where that goes?
It's a good question. So what we said at our event was, you know, we estimate about $550 million-$750 million of our revenue.
Right.
So give or take 5%-7% is directly related to AI. Number one. Number two, we have over 2,000 AI professionals using a fairly narrow definition. And number three, the halo effect of when AI is a meaningful requirement on a large procurement is significant, that we are, you know, much more likely to win. At least we were at the time. In October, when we had the event, you know, we have, you know, two of the three largest AI contracts in the Federal Government, right? The work for the CDAO in Advana. And, you know, our eMAPS work. I think what that has given us is a couple of flywheel jobs on which to build a base of experience about how to make AI relevant, which is really the question, right? At scale.
Number one, and number two, to train a group of practitioners that have actually deployed AI in an operational environment. And that's. You know. That's the advantage. Is it growing? Is it shrinking? You know, I don't know. There's a lot of experimentation, as you said. But, you know, we feel very good about our positioning. And, you know. We always say. You know, we don't do AI in a lab. We do, you know. Our focus is not AI in a lab. It's AI in an operational environment, and we have experience doing that. And that. For our clients, that mission relevance. And, you know, getting out of, you know, the theoretical. You know, this is not ChatGPT. This is we've used AI to solve this specific problem this specific way.
Right.
You know, has a lot of sway.
Got it.
How lasting is it? You know, we hope it's lasting, but that's, you know. It's a competitive world out there, as you said.
The next question is, so what other capabilities are your clients interested in? Or do you expect them to be interested in over the next, you know, 12-18 months?
I mean, we've talked about it, right? AI, cyber. A lot of interest in space, and you know. Our specialty really is in the data. You know, around space, both you know, management of things, unmanned. I mean, I don't know if there's any magic to it. We're doing a lot of work at the intersection, as I said, of some of these technologies. You know, AI and cyber, AI and mission. There's a lot of emerging interest in quantum. You know, the role that the intel business has historically played for us. Our intel business has been as a place where we incubate exquisite, cutting-edge technologies because of the nature of the intel community. They typically will invest ahead of when things become broadly applicable. That's certainly true from a quantum perspective. We see a lot of interest there.
A lot of interest in 5G, although it's not, I would say, a material part of our business. A lot of interest. But going to quantum is the big question, right?
Got it.
Quantum encryption, and when or if is that gonna happen?
Right. So I guess next, my favorite question. So the DOJ investigation is now over, and since it started, you went from 57-60 days, to 65-68. Now the matter's behind you. Can the DSOs get back to 57-60 days?
Yes.
Okay.
So, well, let me unpack that a little bit. First, obviously. We can talk about the outcome, but glad to have the DOJ settlement behind us.
Right, right.
As are our regulators, as are the clients, our clients. So we've been working fruitfully and well with our regulators, DCMA and DCAA. To do two things. One is to quote unquote get back in, and because what had happened is basically all of our audit activity had stopped.
Right.
Since FY 2012. To get back to what I'm calling, we call normal course. And let's say FY 2022 to beyond. That's, you know, normal course audit activity. That's going exceptionally well. We had a good result on our FY 2022 audit that, you know, caught it, prompted us to drop our reserve two quarters ago. Not always easy, you know. We argue and we fight and whatnot, but we and our regulators have devoted significant resources. We're getting back to normal course, which is great. Because I think, you know, we and they share the same objectives of transparency and no surprises, and what have you. So that's working its way through the system. And then there's what we're calling the backlog, which is really FY 2012 through FY 2021, that 10-year period. We started working on that as well, as you can imagine.
What did you work on in that?
The FY audits from FY 2012 to FY 2021. You know, we are going through the process with our regulators of how to address that, and they've begun some of those audits, as you can imagine. You know, auditing activity. It's now, you know, over a decade old, is challenging. Again, really appreciate the spirit with which that's happening. And I'm getting to answer your question. As a result of that. Or, you know, us not being audited. You know, we do have, let's say, five to six days' worth of DSOs tied up in receivables, long-term receivables related to those past audits. That at some point will clear. Now. Will they turn into cash? And we'll be able to build. We'll be able to bill against them. You know. Will that be offset in part or in full by the results of these audits.
I don't think, you know, we don't know yet. That's gonna be, you know, likely. You know, I would say two years before we know. So, you know, the way I would think about it is, there's a five to six day, you know, permanent tax on our DSOs sitting there until that backlog is completed. I wanna make it very clear. You know, we are not expecting nor projecting necessarily any cash inflow.
Right.
But it's just sitting on the books.
Right.
Then the other, the remainder is just, you know, we get, we need to get better, and that's been a focus of mine. We had a good cash quarter last quarter. But, as I said, you know, we're not spiking the football on the 45-yard line. You know, we've made progress, but there's a ways to go.
Right, right. So what does the DOJ settlement mean in terms of legal fees? I mean, I know you haven't disclosed it, but I mean, just notionally. You know, presumably they're lower. Is that anything that sort of has a noticeable impact, or is it that it doesn't really matter when?
Yeah, it shouldn't have a material impact.
Mm-hmm. So if you do get the, you know, back to toward the 60 days. What, you know, sort of. So what kind of cash flow conversion do you think you can get?
So yeah, there's no reason why we can't get 200%. 105% free cash flow conversion. We've been there historically. There's been noise in our numbers the last couple of years because of the DOJ matter. Because of, you know, 174, which, you know, as we all know, is, you know, systemic, and because of a couple, you know, some other tax matters that are working their way through the system. But that's been our objective. That is our objective. We will get back there.
How big is 174 for you, and what does it do if it goes away?
So. We originally estimated it would be $140 million last year and $100 million this year. When we actually did our detailed contract analysis, in part given the growth in the business a nd ended up being $155 million this year and $110 million. Sorry, $155 million last year and $110 million this year. So, that's why when we raised cash flow guidance last qarter by you know $28 million in the midpoint. That d idn't include the additional $25 million, we're gonna have to pay for 174, which was really a $53 million raise. But so we have. We will have paid in $265 million. Cumulatively over the last fiscal year in this one.
And then, if the legislation changes, do you just? I mean, basically, you go for a rebate, or you just basically, like Lockheed was saying, we're just, you know, gonna not stop paying our taxes and use it that way.
Yeah, we've had early discussions about it. I think. You know, our instinct is more along Lockheed's path that we just take it as a credited against future taxes. But. I'll take that problem.
So, so basically, sounds like cash flow should be getting better. What's your M&A pipeline look like, and how should I mean, you guys have been. I'd say. You've been much more open in terms of cash deployment. You've done special dividends. If you go back, you've done dividends. You've run repurchase. You've done big acquisitions. You've done venture investments.
Right.
Where do we go in terms of?
Where do we go?
Cash?
So I would say our M&A priorities haven't changed. We still, you know, look first and foremost at, you know, can we find strategic long-term or creative M&A? Didn't find it last year. We were close in a couple of things. We've said publicly. Smaller deals. You know, we do have a robust pipeline, I think, and I know you've heard from others that, you know, we certainly anticipate, and we're beginning to see a, you know, more supply in the market of, you know, let's say, more midsize assets coming out with maybe a little bit more interest rate stability and advance the election. But you know, we're gonna be patient and disciplined, and I know that's hard to model, Guy, and that's why we've, you know, you're right. Over time, we've had a balanced approach, but if you look in a given year.
Right, right.
You know, we've toggled one direction or another. You know, we don't need to buy for scale. You know, we're not looking for financial arbitrage per se. Obviously, we want, you know, good value.
Right.
Things that are creative. You know, we're looking for M&A that will really advance us in one of these technology areas. Or increasingly have a business model that we think we can leverage. So, you know, those are hard to come by. But we're leaning into it.
Terrific. So we're right pretty much at the hour. So are there any final comments you wanna make in terms of what people should take away about Booz?
Thanks. I appreciate that, and I appreciate you having me. It's been a great event. As I said at the beginning, I, you know, we've got a lot of momentum. We feel good about where we're positioned strategically, and, you know, we have a business model that's very much built on, you know, resilience through strength. So that's our mantra. You know, we are. As we said in the call, we got our pedal to the floor. It's a good environment. I'm sure you've heard that from others.
Yeah.
You know, we look forward to, you know, talking about where we're gonna be next year in our earnings call in May.
Terrific. Thank you very much. That was great.