All right. Thank you everyone for being with us today. Really pleased to have CVS here as our next speaker at the conference. As I'm sure, again, all of you know, CVS operates a diversified healthcare services business focused on health plan and pharmacy service assets largely. With us from the company, Brian Newman, CFO, and Steve Nelson, President of Aetna, and Larry McGrath, Chief Strategy Officer. Maybe Brian, we'll start off with a bit of an intro, kind of a higher level one. You've been with the company almost a year and a half now. We hosted you with one of your first meetings with investors in New York at that time. The company's made a lot of progress. I guess broad base, I guess, what would you attribute the progress that's been made, and in general, how are you feeling about the business?
Yeah, thanks. Probably momentum is the word I would use, Steve, that if you look across the various portfolio of the companies, Steve, to start with yours on the Aetna side, since 2024, we've been on sort of a steady march to get back to target margin. And Steve's been doing an extraordinary job leading the execution, very disciplined. So momentum, a lot of momentum in the Aetna business. If you look at the pharmacy business, similarly, that business was negative for a few years. Last year, we posted mid-single digit growth. This year, we'll be up mid-single as well. So suddenly the investments we were making in terms of technology, in terms of colleagues, it's starting to pay off. On the Caremark side, we'll deliver the guide this year, so in that sense, they have momentum.
We did call out some of the headwinds for 2027, but overall, feel like the business as it transitions, I see that business getting back to target margins, clicking through after 2027. And then finally, the last business, HCD, I feel very good about Oak Street in particular.
Yeah.
About four quarters ago, they kind of arrested some of the profit challenges, and it's been slow and steady progress.
Yeah.
The last thing I would say is capital. As you think about the balance sheet and leverage, a lot of momentum there. We are getting to a place where we are happy and start to spin off cash. Overall, I think you do all those things, the momentum adds up to a say do, and you do what you say, and I think we are building credibility.
Great. Then, maybe a similar type of question for you, Steve. You have been leading the Aetna organization now for two years. We have seen significantly improved performance. I guess taking a step back, can you talk about what some of the most impactful changes have been to how you and the team are running the business, and are there specific areas now where you feel like Aetna is now fundamentally better positioned to manage through volatility and compete better in the market going forward?
Yeah. Just to kind of build on Brian's comments, we do have a lot of momentum, and I will kind of point to some of the reasons for that. It starts, honestly, for me, when I joined two years ago, the opportunity to participate in an organization that is incredibly well positioned to have a real meaningful impact on the U.S. healthcare system. Our ambition is to become the most trusted healthcare company in America and to simplify healthcare, and Aetna plays an incredibly important role in that. So really, a lot of the momentum and progress we have made starts with aligning our employee base around that purpose. I know this is not hardcore financial engineering, but this makes a difference, and we have seen a lot of rallying around, hey, we do important work, and people are excited about it.
That is one thing that we started talking about a couple of years ago. Along with that was a real focus on the fundamentals of the business.
Yeah.
When I say fundamentals, I mean everything from creating a stable operating platform, to making sure that we have our hands around forecasting.
Yeah.
That leads to then disciplined pricing, discipline around how you do MA bids, all those things. Just discipline and strong execution in the fundamentals of the business have been a theme. Very excited about how that has led to this momentum. But then on top of that, we've been able to really focus on what we call distinction and creating innovation, whether it's leading the way prior authorization reform, trying to think about how we engage with providers differently-
Yeah
helping consumers navigate, and we have leading digital capabilities. All these things are now coming together where we have both the fundamentals, and we have leading capabilities, and we've built a really strong team. Out of the 13 senior executives at Aetna, 12 are either new to role or new to Aetna in the last two years. This is all coming together for us. I'm always going to say we have more work to do.
Yeah.
But the competitive positioning that we have, I think allows us to navigate sort of the choppy waters that you mentioned, better than I would say for sure we could two years ago, and I think honestly better than some of our peers because we have those fundamentals down. Really excited about the progress we've made and very bullish about where we're going from here.
Got it. Okay. Obviously for the industry as a whole, cost trend is very front and center given the past couple of years. As you have gotten, I guess, more run out on the second quarter and maybe some initial indicators for Q3, would love to hear what kind of update you can provide on medical cost trend and where that stands now.
Yeah. Look, absolute costs, I am going to now talk about trend for a minute, but absolute healthcare costs are still much higher than any of us would like to see them. It is very on the front of our large purchasers' minds, CMS.
Yeah
Consumers, so it is not where it needs to be. We have taken that on. I will start with sort of some of the very tactical things. We have 2,000 initiatives lined up in managing trend.
Wow.
We are executing really well on all those. Then you get to some of the more innovative, disruptive things that we are doing, whether it is new products, and we see an appetite amongst our larger purchasers to try new things and be innovative. So, creating more incentives for people to utilize high-quality providers, for example, and then incentivizing them to make good choices, and then empowering them. We think about navigation, more advocacy. Then leaning into partnerships with providers has been, I think, a hallmark of what we have been doing, and I think you are going to see us have a real breakout there in terms of building trust with providers. I talked to a provider. In Hartford, there are 40 providers there at a conference gathering we have today, and look, they are tired of the finger-pointing as well.
The idea to get on the same page with them, reduce friction, create more streamlined processes, whether it's prior authorization or just how we help people navigate the system, we want to do that together. That will actually lead to lower costs.
Yeah
I believe, if we can execute on that. I believe that we will. Look, I think that the trends are, and Brian can talk about this, but we don't see them necessarily going down. We see some pockets of favorability, particularly in Medicare. But it's a high trend environment, so we remain cautious, prudent in kind of how we're thinking about things because we need to finish the job of getting our business back to target margins.
Yeah, I know we don't generally comment on inter-quarter trend, et cetera. But net net, Steve referenced there were some pockets of favorability in MA in particular. But I think this prudent comment, it's the way we approach our forecasting philosophy of looking out at the balance of the year. I think it's kind of a prudent and respectful view of trend.
Yeah, maybe that's a good place to take it next. Obviously, MA outperformance was a meaningful contributor in the first half, and I think the way the company has described the results is that you really didn't take necessarily all of the outperformance through into your guidance. So either reinvest it or sort of put some of that into maybe the back half of the year. I guess, how do we think about how you've set up the back half of the year and potential opportunities for outperformance or reinvestment if trend stays where it appeared to be in the second quarter?
Yeah, I will catch that. There were some in the first half of the year, some things like PYD and exiting the exchange business, so there were some elements flowing in there that you had to account for. We flowed some of the upside through in the balance of the year. Steve, it goes back to this prudent and respectful outlook. I think we are building momentum. Steve and the team are doing an excellent job in terms of with the discipline and the execution. I think it sets us up for a reasonable, as reflected in the guide, with opportunities for outperformance.
Okay, great. Maybe one for Steve. As we think about your MA business, you have made a lot of progress, still have a ways to go on the margin front. I guess, how do we think about the MA margin objectives that you built into your 2027 bids, I guess, to the extent there is any contrast versus 2026 that you would want to draw? I guess as you have started to maybe gain some insight, competitively, how do you feel like next year looks from a competitive dynamic perspective, and maybe any early leanings on maybe the growth, non-growth perspective?
Sure. Yeah. First of all, our priorities for our Medicare Advantage business are very clear. We need, and we are committed to returning it to the appropriate margins in Medicare Advantage. The last two years, we have taken that approach and that discipline into the bid planning, and we did the exact same thing for 2027. Our key priority is getting the business back to target margins. The good news, I think for us is, as we have laid down this really strong foundation over the last two years, we got after it quickly and executed really well on the last two bid cycles and AEP. So we have been able to improve our geographic mix, our product mix. We have landed, I think, better than expected in 2026 in terms of our membership mix. We have leading star scores.
That is all coming together, and we are going to take that momentum into 2027. To the extent that we can find, I would say, surgical opportunities to have stability in our benefits, that is actually good for our members, good for our future star scores. It is good for retention, and we can actually now have, with less potentially churn in those very strategic and surgical kind of geographies and products, we can actually have more impact on their health outcomes, too.
This is good. We think it is really great for our business, good for our members, and so it is positioned well. We are going to continue to focus on our margin recovery, but at the same time, as we have opportunities to be thoughtful around certain geographies where we think we can create more stability, we are going to do that. We took all that planning into 2027.
I cannot comment much more than that until we see sort of the competitive landscape, but I feel really good about the business going into 2027.
Okay, great. Just to touch on Star Ratings, obviously the Star Ratings process, it has become a lot more volatile in recent years. There is now kind of all kinds of litigation to add to the mix. I guess, how does Aetna manage this key driver, this key input in the current environment, and I guess how do you think about the range of potential outcomes with regard to the Stars program over the next couple of years?
Yeah. Look, we are really proud of our track record in stars, and we have maintained a leading position. That is due to really good execution, a great team on this, and then the power of the CVS enterprise. As you think about the inputs into the stars, whether it is medication adherence, operational excellence, and then improving HEDIS outcomes, all those things we are really, really good at and that shows up in star scores. Look, we are going to continue to, through sort of the volatility you talked about,
Yeah
we are going to stay focused and strive for excellence there. But we are in a blackout period, so no opportunity really to comment beyond that. But really proud of our track record, and we are focused on being really great there.
Okay, great. Then maybe we'll leave that there on MA and talk about Medicaid for a moment. Obviously not as large of a business, but still very impactful given where the industry is fundamentally. I guess, where are you expecting Medicaid margins to land this year? Have either rates or costs developed at all differently versus your expectations?
On, sorry.
Medicaid
Medicaid. Yeah, I missed the first part. Medicaid for us is a really important business for us to be in. It's important to our mission, and we take a lot of pride in serving that membership. But we've also been really thoughtful about the footprint and the geography where we are. For perspective, it's a relatively small part of our business in terms of revenue and membership. But it's performing very much in line with our expectations. We've had great success in interacting and partnership with our states.
Rate advocacy is something that people talk about and throw around a lot, but there's a real skill set there, to have the right partnership, the right trust, presenting the data the right way, and we've had good traction with our state partners. We see trends, I would say, in line with those rates that we've been advocating for. So that business has made good progress, or we believe it's in a good position to continue to make progress.
Got it. Yeah, obviously the big watch area now seems like it is Medicaid work requirements for the expansion population. I guess, how is the company thinking about that policy change and what it could mean for the pacing of Medicaid recovery and kind of the risk or not you think that presents?
Yeah. I think the work requirements and eligibility and what that does to membership in general, I think there is a lot to play out there, and we are going to continue to work closely with our states because states take a lot of pride in offering these benefits and solutions to their populations, and we are a partner with them on that.
So we bring solutions, ideas, and opportunities we think to create not only great outcomes for their members that they serve, but also helping them think through solutions and making sure that when there are new policies or new regulations put in place, how do we help communicate to their members, our members, their citizens? How do we work together on that? So that is what we are doing. I think that there is still a lot of game to be played here in Medicaid and how this all plays out.
I think states are still kind of forming their strategies and opinions about how they are going to implement these. But so far, we have had really good, I think, engagement with our states. I think it will play out how it plays out, but we like our position, and we like our footprint and the partnerships we have with states.
Got it. It seems like that you have made good progress on margins, and hopefully you will make more progress as we see 2027 develop. I guess, as you think and start to think more about what the business looks like as margins are more fully recovered across the portfolio, what are the things that are most exciting about kind of prospectively once that has occurred and how to think about maybe growth becoming more of an engine for the business going forward?
I am so glad you asked that because there are a lot of things to be excited about. Once you get the fundamentals in place, you start getting credibility, not only with investors, but internally inside our, and with our employees, and then, in particular, with our members. We can be a little more disruptive and innovative. Aetna has a legacy of being innovative in terms of product and clinical programs, and we are getting back to that. A few examples. I mentioned earlier, the leading digital capability, so number one ranked website, number one ranked digital app. The reason that we have leaned into that so heavily is that we want to see our members informed and engaged.
We think if we can do that, then we can use product innovation like Smart Compare where you have the opportunity to compare quality providers. You have alternative health plans, our version of that, where we can actually incentivize you to go to those providers. There is a win-win for everybody there. On top of that, we have created clinical programs that are around some of the biggest drivers of trend right now. For example, autism. I think the industry spent $460 billion last year on autism. We have created a holistic, really proactive program for folks and families, parents that have kids that are autistic, and we are getting after that and seeing a real impact there. We are embedding nurses in hospitals so they can take a holistic view to the discharge planning process that something we used to do 20, 30 years ago.
Right.
We did not do that. The industry has not done that in a long time. We are doing it in a new, different way with all the technology. Just the streamlining and innovative ways that we have led the way in terms prior authorization reform. these are all going to lead to, I think, lower cost, a better experience, and actually better health outcomes. So we are really excited, and I have said this several times, but I have seen more progress, honestly, in healthcare in the last couple of years than I have seen in the last decade. We are going to hit the gas on that, and as the enterprise, CVS Health, we have a lot of assets to bring to this. I did not mention this in my first statement, but the CVS team is a great team.
I am proud and honored to be kind of up here on the stage with these guys, but also the team that is not here. I am really excited about the future here.
Okay. Got it. All right, we'll give you a little bit of a break and
Okay, thanks.
just not talk about, yes, now.
I can talk about it for a long time.
Yeah. We'll see if we need that at the end or not. All right. When we think about, obviously one of the key developments in the quarter for the services business was the developments with 340B. I think one thing first that investors have kind of been clamoring for is some way to maybe approximate the impact 340B is having on the business this year. One framework that's kind of been offered is, "Hey, is there a way to think about this that maybe it's a similar order of magnitude as the level of incremental rebate guarantee pressure that you're facing in the business this year?" Which was around a $250 million item, or not larger or smaller. Then maybe we could kind of start to dovetail that into how we're thinking about 340B in 2027 as well.
Yeah, I understand the interest and focus on 340B. A couple of thoughts. One, the size of the program has changed, certainly. It's evolving this year, and will evolve into next year. The reason we called out 340B, normally we don't talk about headwinds and tailwinds this early in the year during the Q2 call, was a desire to be transparent. When we see things, we're sharing them, et cetera. That's part of our management philosophy. That said, I don't see the 340B program going away. It helps a lot of people, so it's there to stay. What I will say is I do see it stabilizing at the end of next year from our lens. I think about the 340B headwinds that exist this year and next year, and we were able to absorb those challenges within the guide for HS this year, and so manage it accordingly.
As we think about next year, I put out an 8.44 floor, which was kind of blessing consensus during the second quarter call to kind of give people a comfort level that that would be the minimum for the enterprise because we have lots of ways to deliver paths to growth. But Larry, you want to give any color on 340B?
Yeah, just maybe emphasize a couple of things that you raised there, Brian. As we think about the 340B program, I know it's been incredibly noisy and continues to be noisy. No one's advocating for it to go away. As we thought about the program, 2026, it's going to be smaller than it was in 2025. The way we're framing guidance for 2027, it'll take a step down again. It'll be smaller again. So like Brian said, we think 2027 is based on everything we know today is kind of a good proxy for where the program will stabilize.
Brian mentioned, when we thought about how to frame this for you all, we do not break out individual drivers within HS, let alone within pharmacy services within HS. That is why we kind of anchored on the 8.44 as a reasonable floor.
Yeah
Even though we were pulling that conversation forward a quarter. Just to emphasize, when we spoke about that 8.44, we did not assume that we needed to do anything heroic or beyond our normal prudent guidance sort of philosophy to get there. So it does not assume capital deployment beyond offsetting dilution. It assumes a normal level of prudence in Steve's business, for example, around cost trends, et cetera. So, we hoped and hope that that kind of gives folks some sort of context on what it is we are talking about in 340B. We also, of course, called out some membership disenrollment that we might see in Caremark, given the selling season and what we have seen from some of our health plan customers or what we are likely to see from their enrollment books as we go into 2027.
Okay. Then just in terms of, I know you are not going to be incredibly specific about this, but just in terms of the 2027 headwind, is it fair to think that this is similar in magnitude? Are there reasons to think that the headwind is actually bigger? I guess when you think about the key assumptions, it seems like the two things would be annualization of this year's impact, and then whether there is further manufacturer actions. I guess, how have you thought about those two things?
I think rather than get into kind of 2027 specific guide, let us come back. We will give headwinds, tailwinds in a month or so on the next call, and then obviously frame up the segment guide. But, I think we are building credibility and a track record from an enterprise perspective, so do not want to get into the 2027 guide on the segment specific.
Okay. Maybe we could come back to some of the comments on the selling season.
Yeah.
Obviously, it seems like it is a bit softer. Some of that seemed to be attributed to wanting to make sure the company has the right kind of contract structures in place. When we think about the clients that would be exiting the platform, I guess, is there any way to think about the profitability of these clients? On one hand, you would think that if these are the clients where maybe some of the rebate guarantee issues have been cropping up, maybe those are not the most profitable customers that you kind of have in your book. I guess, how do we think about what is driving the softer selling season and the profitability impacts of losing some of these customers?
I think everything is relative, and that is important to keep in mind when we talk about a softer selling season. Last year coming into this year, we had $6 billion in new wins. Retention was up in the 99%+ . The rest of the industry was more in the average mid-90%. I think what has happened is we have gotten more disciplined as thinking about the evolution of the model, the op model, and being thoughtful about the risk profile of legacy contracts we want to carry into the new world. So we have been very thoughtful and disciplined, but there is not a big share shift. It is kind of going from that 99% to more in line with the mid-90%, et cetera. So, Larry, you want to color it up?
Yeah. So Brian is correct. So you are talking about a retention rate going from above industry levels to in line with industry levels. When we describe it as being a less robust selling season, Brian is right. We obviously had a very strong selling season last year. We had gross new business wins this year, just less impactful, less robust than we saw in the previous year. The other element that we were trying to signal to you all was that the messaging that we are hearing, that I am sure you are hearing from some of our health plan customers around selective exits around the exchanges, exits or plan exits or footprint shrinking in MA or in Part D. On those points, we have to see how it plays out. We obviously haven't had the enrollment period in MA yet, for example.
We haven't had a final read on exactly what exchanges are going to look like. It's going to take time for us to see how that all plays out. But again, to Brian's point, we want to be transparent. We want to highlight that these are issues that we are considering as we're finishing our kind of op plan.
Okay, great. Then maybe to talk about the pharmacy and consumer wellness business. Obviously, a big highlight for this year is the performance there, and it looks like you're seeing much better performance in terms of gross profit per script than really you've seen in much of the companies, kind of past about 10, 15 year cycle. Is it as simple as really the CostVantage model is really playing out as the company hoped? Does it introduce the kind of pioneered that going back a couple of years? Or are there other significant factors that we should be considering there, too?
Yeah, the business is, I go back to my opening words of momentum, that PCW business has good momentum. The team's done a good job. It was tough a couple of years ago when we were down 5% in terms of the trends. Even during the downtimes, we chose to invest in the business. We have the new model, obviously, you referenced, that's kicking in. We've got some tailwinds from the Rite Aid acquisition. But the core underlying performance of the business, some of the investments we made in the colleagues and in technology is paying off, and we're still doing that. We're having a good year this year. We've chose to put some money back into technology. To keep the engine going to more of this last year and this year, we'll see mid-single digit growth. That's a big step up from the mid-single digit declines.
I think the trajectory and the momentum of the business has changed, and it's more durable going forward. Candidly, I'm excited about it, both front of the house and back of the house in terms of the pharmacy store.
But Steve, maybe just to add on, I'm so glad you called out CostVantage, right? That's been such an important development for us. And when we spoke about rolling out CostVantage, one of the things we highlighted was that we want to get to a position where we earn a fair margin on every script that we dispense.
Yeah.
And that's been incredibly important. So as you've seen the growth, obviously very high profile growth in GLP-1s, for example, we earn a fair margin on every GLP-1 script that we dispense.
Yeah.
On benefit or in the cash market. So as you've seen that growth, that's a tailwind that our PCW segment has been able to avail itself of, whereas that's not true of everyone in the industry.
No.
But at the same time, we continue to share our best in class cost of goods sold, and the improvements that we make in our cost of goods sold every year, we share that with our payer partners. So that our PBM in-house and Caremark, but also every PBM that we are contracted with on payer gets the benefit from the improvements that we make there every single year.
Great. Maybe one follow-up on services. Obviously, we have seen MA results come in better for you, but also for virtually all of your MA peers this year as well. When we think about the performance of Oak Street, I guess, what have you observed so far in the first half of the year? Have you made any improvements to your Oak Street guidance within the overall framework, and I guess how are you thinking about the next couple of years and what is going to drive Oak Street losses down as you move the next couple of years?
Yeah. If trend improves, that is going to be a positive for the Oak business. I go back to what I mentioned earlier. We doubled down in terms of focusing on the profitability of that business. We took a big impairment last year, remember? I think since that time, I think it has been four or five quarters, the team has consistently delivered sort of month in, month out at expectations. Arresting the profit decline was a big focus. Now it is continuing to grow and improve the profitability. I look out to the next couple of years, and I think that business will turn positive, which will be a big change for the portfolio. Very positive.
Okay. That is great. When we think about obviously AI, and AI investment is a huge theme across all of our companies. I guess, how do we think about what CVS is doing? Obviously, you have a variety of different businesses. I guess, how do you think about the way that potentially that impacts maybe more like regulated businesses with the insurance company and kind of targeted margins that investors have come to think about over time? I guess, how do you think it impacts more of the unregulated businesses where margins might have more opportunity to be less constrained?
Yeah. Everybody is talking about AI today. Maybe Steve, I start, and then you can kind of bring it to life. We have been investing in technology. I referenced in our PBM business, Steve certainly investing with the Aetna portfolio, but for a while, we have actually generated over $1 billion in productivity. We have invested a lot of that back. It is sort of invest today to grow tomorrow. The thing about CVS Health, I think our approach to AI, Steve, is it is not just technology to cut cost. There is an element here, do more with the same from a growth lens perspective. We are very balanced in looking across the portfolio, where can we take the productivity and the technology and leverage it to grow faster and to hit the top line as opposed to just take cost out?
There's a governance component as well that I think is really important. Tilak leads our technologies group, myself. There's a group of us who review where the AI is being deployed. Steve, in your world, there are areas like prior authorization that we are very careful about technology, maybe.
Yeah. I totally agree with what Brian said in terms of obviously part of on the CVS, but Aetna specifically, as we think about returning the business target margin, our operating cost structure is key to becoming best-in-class health plan. We are investing in technology and AI specifically to get to a best-in-class cost structure. That's definitely part of the agenda. Then from there, it's capabilities and it's also creating tools that our workforce can use in a better way to make their jobs easier. We're leaning into all those. A couple examples. One, in the helping people to be better consumers of healthcare and helping our providers out. We actually have now agentic AI capabilities for our members to schedule appointments, so we can actually schedule appointments on their behalf.
This is an agent doing this, and it's incredibly efficient, and it's really thorough, and it makes the experience for both the provider and the member dramatically better. On the colleague side, we have a group of folks that we call Aetna One Advocate, and it's like a concierge medicine kind of approach. They get inbound and outbound, and they do outbound outreaches as well to help our members navigate their care pathways. It used to take one of our colleagues 90 minutes to prepare for one of those conversations. Now it takes them two minutes. This is a better experience, lower cost, better outcomes. I have numerous examples. Prior auth, Brian mentioned. We're now more than 90% approval ratings within 24 hours and then 83% higher in literally real time.
These are leading statistics and then you get into operational platforms and credentialing, for example. Our providers are really excited here. It used to take us 30- 120 days to get credentialing done. We can now do that in a day because of AI. This is going to transform some of the ways we do things, but it's not all about cost, to Brian's point.
Yeah. Okay. And maybe just the last question then would be on capital deployment. Obviously, the company will likely be increasingly able to deploy capital over the next couple of years. I guess, what do we think about as the key priorities and maybe the key kind of contrast points versus the capital deployment profile of the company, maybe in the past five or 10 preceding years?
Yeah, and just like Steve could talk about Aetna all day long, I could talk about capital all day long. It's been a huge focus of mine since joining the company. We've gone from kind of leverage of 5x back in 2024, debt to EBITDA. Now we're in the mid-3x, which supports the BBB rating that we want. So we're in a very good place from a capital deployment. I will also share with you, we have a framework, total shareholder return, that is a very disciplined approach. We have a capital review committee that meets regularly. Where does the next dollar of our cash go? I think you'll continue to see the discipline, but as you said, Steve, it's getting time to turn back on share repo to look at bolt-on acquisitions.
Because a hallmark of CVS Health is across the enterprise, is the ability to generate cash. We see that coming back this year. We've said we would turn back on share repo next year. I think we're getting closer to the leverage, so we'll come back and update later this year in terms of if we do that sooner or not. But net, we'll be looking at bolt-on acquisitions to support the growth. We're going to support the dividend. I think we've paid down $4 billion in debt this year, so we're making good progress on where we're at. But I guess what I would leave with the investors, really confident, really proud of what we've achieved, but a lot of discipline and governance around the deployment going forward.
Okay. Fantastic. I think that's all we have time for. Thank you so much for your time today and the discussion.
Thanks. Appreciate it.