... Awesome. Thank you very much for joining us today. My name is Mohit Bansal. I'm one of the biopharma analysts, and I'm very happy to have, fourth year in a row, -
Thank you.
With us, Andrew Dickinson, the CFO of Gilead. Thank you, Andrew, for joining us today, and I'll give the floor to you for opening remarks and exciting times ahead on Gilead.
Sure. Oh, thank you. Thanks for having us. It's our pleasure to be here again. It's a great conference. It is exciting times for Gilead. I think you saw we had an incredible Q2, strong performance across all of our business units, increased our guidance for the year, both kind of on the top line, the bottom line. Saw really strong growth in our HIV prevention business, among others, and obviously have launched what we think is a transformational therapy for HIV prevention in Sunlenca. So it's a great, great quarter for Gilead. It's been a strong year for us and on the heels of a number of strong years. It's an exciting time in the company, and we're really pleased with where we are.
Awesome. So let's just talk about the transformative launch. I'm sure you were not expecting those questions on Sunlenca.
I don't know.
But yeah, like, I think the question, basically, like, you see, the comments from the Q2 call were really positive, so you have seen some early response, which was quite positive. So can you talk a little bit about that?
Sure.
And yeah, I mean, what you are seeing in the marketplace right now.
Sure. Yeah, no, it has. It's a, it's been a strong launch. When you think of kind of execution, we have a very experienced commercial team, both from Gilead and from, you know, people that had worked at other companies. When we look at the launch, not just with respect to other HIV launches, but launches overall, the comment was, it's the strongest execution that they've seen in a launch.
I mean, there's an extraordinary amount of planning that goes into a launch of this size, especially for a therapy with this incredible clinical data, and, you know, with a relatively new opportunity that will continue to build over many years. So we realize the importance of the launch, and we're happy that we're off to a strong start. you know, a couple of things to highlight that we highlighted on the call, the awareness of lenacapavir, Descovy, is incredibly high at this point, so 73% unaided awareness, which is probably double what you would typically expect for a good launch.
Mm-hmm.
95% unaided awareness, which is extraordinary, you know, even for drugs that have been on the market for many, many years, as you know. So, you know, the anticipation and awareness of this therapy is really unprecedented. And you see that in the performance of the HIV, the prevention business with Descovy sales up 37% quarter over quarter in the Q2. So the addition, you know, the awareness of a new option for HIV prevention has driven more people to HIV prevention, and you see that kind of in the business. So it's an exciting start and start for us in terms of where we are today.
Got it. I mean, it's great that you say that because you... When you launched Descovy, that was an incredible launch. I mean, you converted 50% in year one. So, I mean, there are some challenges with this particular one because you have, as a Gilead in HIV, you have only launched pills so far, so there are some logistical challenges as well. So how you are seeing those challenges in the marketplace, and despite that, why do you think it is, it has been great?
Yeah, it's... Well, it's a different model. To your point, it's an injectable.
Right.
There are, you know, two ways that patients can access it. One is, you know, physicians can buy and bill-
Mm.
through the physician office for certain treatment centers, or, the drug can be dispensed to patients through what we call white bagging.
Right
... where the order is placed, the pharmacy ships the drug either to the patient or to the physician. So it requires a different commercial build and a different commercial plan. I think that the execution, again, going back, what we've seen in terms of not only the awareness but then our ability to execute, to work with the specialty pharma, to get the drug to patients that have a prescription to work through the prior authorization process, has been really strong. And we're off to a good start. You know, the other metric, obviously, that the market's looking at and that we're looking at is coverage.
Right.
You know, we're, we are well on our way to reaching our coverage goals. So we had said a year ago that our goal was to have 75% coverage in the U.S. after six months, which would be roughly at the end of this year. We are well on track to hitting that. We've had a number of early wins with commercial payers and with Medicaid payers, so two of the largest two of the four largest Medicaid states, California and Florida, put the Sunlenca on formulary immediately with no restrictions. As I said, with the commercial payers, we've had a number of significant wins out of the gate. So we're well on track to hitting our goals, not only at the end of the year, but the 90% by the end of year one, which is really important.
The other thing that we've highlighted is the J-code, which is the reimbursement code for this specific drug, was granted earlier than expected. That will be effective on October first, and that's really important, especially for the practices that do buy and bill. Many of those practices have been burned historically, where they will prescribe and dispense a drug that doesn't yet have a J-code, and it's difficult for them to get reimbursement. So having the J-code and having it come at least a couple months earlier than we may have otherwise expected is gonna be important for the launch as well. So it's all of those things taken together that we're looking at that gives us a lot of confidence in terms of where we are and the progression of the launch so far.
Got it, and there was some chatter, probably in the late August, about the CVS comments there. So can you comment on that? What are you seeing there? Not just CVS, I mean, you actually, from Gilead, there was an email after that saying that, I mean, we are on track to-
Sure
achieve the goals here. So how you are thinking about all those things?
Yeah, I mean, we're in the middle of hundreds of payer conversations and negotiations. So, you know, typically when you launch a drug and you're dealing with commercial payers, it's not unusual for some payers to not even consider putting a new drug on formulary until six months, twelve months, or eighteen months after the launch. In many cases, companies talk about kind of where they're gonna be with commercial coverage at year two. We're focused on six months and twelve months. So as I highlighted earlier, I think that, and we don't comment on our discussions with any specific payer, as you can imagine.
You know, I, I do think that the early data, there are a number of wins that, and we'll share more over time, that are really important with significant, you know, with payers that are sophisticated payers who take the same view that we take, that this drug has incredible clinical efficacy, and they're happy to put the drug on formulary with unrestricted access. Some of that may be driven by the USPSTF preventive mandate. I think a lot of it is just driven by the clinical data and the pharmacoeconomic benefit that this drug clearly provides. We have a lot of confidence that not only are we gonna get our hit our goals, but we're gonna get there over time.
You know, the other thing that I've said here that's important is, you know, we've taken an appropriately firm stance on commercial discounts on our HIV therapies over time. And yes, Sunlenca is no different. I mean, this is a drug that, again, under the mandate, should have broad, unrestricted access. We believe that that's warranted not only kind of statutorily, but again, given the clinical data. And we'll have discussions whether, you know, some payers will negotiate more than others, but at the end of the day, we're confident that we'll have broad coverage and that we're well on track.
So we spoke to another big payer on the same day this news came out, and that payer basically said that there is some effort being made to make this drug being administered by pharmacists, not just a healthcare provider. Like, do you think it is realistic in near term, or this is probably a long way to go?
I think it's more of a longer-term thing.
Right. Yeah.
I would guess.
Yeah.
I think in the near term, the drug's gonna be administered by either a physician or in the physician's office by a nurse. Typically, theoretically, could the drug be administered in a pharmacy, like the COVID vaccines? Of course, but that's more of a long-term thing, I think.
Got it. Got it. Very helpful, and then, let's just talk about USPSTF as well. Like, how significant... Like, if there are any potential changes, like, how significant are they? I mean, the product was growing even before... without that until October last year, so-
Right.
So would love to understand.
Yeah, I mean, I think the mandate's been in place for a while, but it wasn't fully recognized by payers until more recently, to your point. So when you look at our HIV prevention business and the incredible growth, you know, over the last 10 years, but in particular, if you look at the last six to nine months, a lot of that is being driven by kind of the broad recognition by payers that the preventative therapies, including the HIV prevention therapies, need to be offered on an unrestricted basis with no co-pays. And that's been a tailwind for us. But to your point, prior to that being recognized by many payers, you saw very strong growth in the PrEP market, and we don't expect that to change if there's any change to the coverage mandate.
And we're not gonna speculate. I think, again, the efficacy and clinical data of these therapies, but in particularly, Descovy, really speaks for itself. The pharmacoeconomic benefit is strong. So I think that the, you know, the discussions around what could happen if the USPSTF mandate is reversed, it's a fair question, and it may be missing the point. The efficacy is so strong, the pharmacoeconomic benefit is strong. I think that's the biggest driver of why many of the payers are coming to the table and very quickly putting the drug on formulary. So more to come. I also think the administration, if you look at many of the recent comments from the administration, you know, emphasize the importance of focusing on infectious disease.
Right.
It gives us a lot of confidence that, you know, the growth that we in the market are expecting should be realized over time. It's a really incredible therapy.
Got it. Very, very helpful. Thank you for that. The other topic I want to touch upon is that, you know, like, there are different buckets in these markets. I mean, like, first of all, HIV prevention is still underpenetrated a lot.
Yeah.
Like, I mean, what, 250-400 thousand patients on the drug, which should be 1.2-3 million. So how do you see market evolving? Like, there's Apretude, which is like an injectable, so could that be the first to go, then Descovy, then Truvada, plus naive patient? Like, how do you think about the market evolving towards, Sunlenca?
The HIV prevention market?
Right.
Yeah, I think what we've always said is the first area of focus are people that are already on HIV prevention-
Right
-today, and the most obvious are people that are on other inject... you know, another injectable option. We believe this is a more convenient injectable option with the best, you know, with unparalleled clinical data. And you should see over time, a significant move of patients that are on other HIV prevention therapies, including the injectables, over to Sunlenca. And as you said, you know, they're the market is only maybe a quarter to one-third penetrated today in terms of a, using a pretty narrow definition of HIV people that should be on HIV prevention therapy. So we think that there's a significant opportunity for very significant market growth, not only in the U.S., but outside of the U.S. as well, we should highlight.
But in the US, within the narrow definition that the CDC is focused on, people at risk of getting HIV, you have a long way to go. And then, if you think more broadly of people that could be at risk, we've highlighted the fact that there are about ten times more people that are diagnosed with a sexually transmitted disease in the United States every year than are captured by the CDC definition of people that are at risk of getting HIV or at high risk. So you could see the market evolving over time, where you have a much broader set of people that are at risk of either STDs or HIV, being candidates for HIV prevention, including college-age people, first responders, et cetera.
This is a market that is, you know, in the first couple of innings, you know, would be the analogy of development, and there are many, many years ahead of us for to develop and build out this market. And then, you know, to your point, again, I think in terms of order of priority, it's less order of priority. It's just, you know, all of the people that are on HIV prevention today should move over to something like Sunlenca over time, given the guaranteed adherence and the significant clinical benefit relative to the orals that are available today, that you see in the clinical data.
Got it. Very helpful. Thank you. So the other question, like, again, I mean, like, so obviously, this is an important product for you. Expectations have been rising on this, so, I mean, when you look at the street expectation, I know you cannot guide for anything, but do you think, like, how do you think about the street's expectations, and then are they in the right place at this time or not?
Yeah. I mean, we don't, you know, we won't comment on street expectations or give guidance beyond the high-level guidance that we've given.
Mm-hmm.
You know, I think about this. First of all, again, it's an important launch for us. It's an important launch for the industry. All of the early execution and metrics are promising, and you know, we think about this both in terms of the short run, the medium term, and the long run, and have a lot of confidence in all of those areas. So, while I can't comment on kinda street expectations specifically, we have a lot of confidence that, you know, in each of those phases, you should see a strong launch, and that this is a really important therapy for patients and for us in the development of our HIV business and our business overall.
Got it. Helpful. Maybe let's just talk about HIV treatment. I mean, again, it doesn't get talked about a lot, but, I mean, you raised the guidance and-
Right
... actually, like, we were expecting this to be a flat year. But again, you are growing despite the Part D headwinds. You're growing at 3% at this point. So can you talk a little bit about the trends there? You have had a tailwind of pricing as well for quite some time now. So how is this market evolving, and is there some kind of, you know, inflection in patient growth as well here?
Yeah, it's interesting. I mean, the HIV treatment business is doing really well-
Right
... to your point. So to just kinda step back, we had expected with the Part D reform this year that kicked in for the HIV business to be flat year over year. The Part D headwind was about a $1.1 billion headwind for us overall in terms of revenue, $900 million specific to the HIV business. And in the middle of the year, we updated our guidance to say that we expect, as you said, the business to grow, the HIV business to grow, 3%, and if you exclude the Part D impact, that would be 7% growth. The important thing is that the vast majority of that is demand-led growth, right? So, we are seeing strong demand-led growth.
The HIV market is still growing 2-3% in the U.S., and Biktarvy continues to take market share, and all of that kind of leads to the strong demand-led volume growth. There has been a tailwind in pricing, to your point. It's been a smaller piece of the equation, but one that's important, and that's driven largely by, as the Medicare redetermination process kicked in more recently at the end of the national emergency related to the pandemic, where you could reevaluate Medicare coverage. Many of the patients that lost Medicare coverage moved to commercial plans, whether it's. We've also seen a strong unemployment rate, you know, more people returning to work with more commercial coverage.
Some of that is the government, healthcare exchange plans, but it's all driven a more favorable pricing mix for us in HIV, where you have more commercial coverage than expected and less Medicare coverage, or less Medicare claims than expected, leading to a positive mix. But I would highlight again, most of the growth is demand-led. The vast majority of it is demand-led. There has been a pricing tailwind, which has also helped. But the business, to your point, the HIV treatment business is probably underappreciated and is doing really, really well. The growth in the HIV prevention business has been so extraordinary, in particular the last two quarters, but certainly over the, you know, even over the last kind of nine to ten years, that it overshadows it a little bit. But the HIV treatment business, and Biktarvy in particular, is doing really well.
Got it. So this is very, very helpful. We get a lot of questions around the... Like, I mean, obviously the macro headwinds are there, or, I mean, the chatter is there. So there are two-- It comes in two flavors. So, like, before we get to macro, like, there's one topic I want to discuss is the, there are some questions around as we get into late two thousand thirty, two thousand twenties, Biktarvy has a longer patent life, but your competitor is losing patent. So do you see that as a risk, at all, or, or how, or it's manageable issue?
It's manageable.
Right.
I mean, you know, there's. So the answer is largely no. I mean, I think that the Biktarvy is the gold standard for a whole, for many, many reasons. I mean, it is by far, when you look at kind of efficacy, safety, you know, the ability to put patients on therapy immediately without genotyping, the lack of resistance, I mean, it's absolutely the gold standard in HIV treatment, and we don't expect that to change. So, you know, the. And, you know, again, you highlighted earlier, I know it's HIV prevention, not HIV treatment, but you see what we're able to do with Descovy in HIV prevention relative to Truvada.
When Truvada went generic, it just reinforces that in the HIV market, patients and physicians tend to wanna be on the best therapy, the safest, the most efficacious therapy, and we don't think that's gonna change. It, you know, there will always be discussions with payers. There are every year in terms of kind of the payer dynamics. We have very modest rebates on our HIV products generally, given the strength of the data and the strength of the portfolio, and, you know, we'll continue to focus on that to make sure that we're receiving kind of fair value for what we're bringing to the market. But no, I don't think it. You know, it's all included in our, in the market's assumptions, but it should not have a significant impact on the business.
Got it and this market is on, like, fifth phase class of agents at this point, right?
Exactly.
It's seen a lot of evolution.
Yeah, and the other thing to remember there, I should highlight, is there are a number of new launches coming, right?
Right.
I mean, there's not only, you know. In the coming years, we'll have a new, we would expect, switch option in a daily oral doublet of lenacapavir and bictegravir, which we think is a really exciting additional treatment option for certain patients. And then we have the broadly neutralizing antibodies with lenacapavir, as well as all of our long-acting therapies that should be coming to market. All of those should help us take additional market share, and blunt the impact of any kind of generic launches. But maybe the last thing that I just, you know, you saw this in prevention, and we've highlighted this historically. Even in treatment, the long-acting therapies should provide an efficacy advantage because, you know, even with the daily orals, patients that have HIV, you know, even though these are life-saving therapies that are incredible, they don't always take their pills-
Right
... every day, and sometimes people will go off therapy. The long-actings, just like you see in the data for prevention, should lead to better efficacy in HIV treatment. It won't be the same degree of benefit in terms of the magnitude relative to each other that you see in prevention, where people are really not adherent to the daily orals. But you could and should see an uplift in terms of efficacy from the long-acting HIV treatment therapies as well. That will go into kind of how people think about the therapies that they're prescribed and that they take in the future.
Got it. No, that's very helpful, and I'll talk about the pipeline. I do want to talk about the pipeline here. So, I mean, you hosted a massive presentation last December, which was very helpful. How are you thinking about, you know, timelines of the HIV treatment, longer-acting HIV treatments here? And I think your own market research suggested that injectables are probably going to be very good if they are quarterly or every six months. So how far are we from getting to those?
Yeah. Well, I think we've said we have seven programs in clinical development, others coming, you know, the relatively high degree of probability that many of those will hit the market between now and the Biktarvy loss of exclusivity in the middle of the twenty thirties. So, you know, I think we're in a great spot. I do think, to your point, the two therapies in the future that are likely to have the greatest impact and would have the greatest adoption would be a monthly oral and an every six-month injectable for treatment again, and we think both of those are possible, and we have multiple programs that are exploring those.
So, it's too early to specifically give any specific guidance on kind of approval timelines beyond the therapies that are already in late-stage studies in phase two and phase three. But we're you know, we have an incredible team that's bringing those forward quickly. Number of programs, multiple shots on goals, give us a lot of confidence that we will get there. So and again, to step back, I mean, I think it's likely that at some point we have multiple weekly orals available, a monthly oral available for treatment, and then an every three-month or every six-month or both, injectable option. But the ones that have the potential to be the biggest are the every six-month injectable and the monthly oral.
You know, in some ways, it reminds me of the era between Atripla and Biktarvy. You had, like, multiple drugs launched, and then they all sold a lot.
Right.
So could it be like that kind of situation before you get to this every six-month, monthly?
Yeah, I think that's a... You're spot on. I think that's likely. There's a lot... I would expect that you'll see multiple launches.
Mm.
It's hard to say today which therapies would be the biggest, the most attractive. We have to see the clinical data at the end of the day. Different patients and different physicians have different needs or desires that you'll see. But you could see a number of launches with drugs like the Genvoya equivalents-
Right
- or the Odefsey equivalents-
Atripla back in the day.
Right.
Yeah.
That, that are important for a period of time, and that as you launch additional therapies, they may be cannibalized, and that's okay. I mean, our goal is to give physicians and people with HIV as many different treatment options as possible that really work best for them. The other thing that we don't always talk about that's important, if you look at the HIV market, the percentage of people in the United States that have HIV that are, one, you know, not aware that they have HIV is much higher than you'd expect. The percentage of people that are diagnosed with HIV but are not drug-treated is shockingly high, and then of the people that are drug-treated, those that are not under control or undetectable is high.
When you kind of put it all together, I think roughly 50% of the people in the United States that have HIV are either, you know, not diagnosed, diagnosed but not drug-treated, or not at undetectable levels, meaning that they can still, you know, transmit HIV to others. Which, all of which means there really is a need for additional treatment options that help us reach all of those people and reduce that number significantly. So, you know, even though it's a really well-developed market overall, there's still a lot of potential and need for new treatment options in HIV treatment in the US-
Awesome
... and globally.
Thank you. So let's just touch upon the topic of, you know, macro headwinds from the MFN to Medicaid side, and also Medicaid potential funding cuts, which could come. So, I mean, how, as a company, you are thinking about these, and do you see them as a manageable risk? Or, like, how do you PrEPare for all that?
Like all companies, we're looking at a lot of scenarios and PrEParing. We spend a lot of time in DC, having discussions not only with the administration, but with the representatives and senators, helping them understand kind of the drug pricing in the US and why the system is the way that it is, the value of the innovation that we're bringing. You know, I'm not gonna speculate in terms of what's gonna happen with any potential MFN or Medicaid changes. We do think it's manageable if there are changes, and we think that the clinical profile of our drugs across our entire portfolio is so strong that it gives us a you know really strong position to help people understand the benefit that we're bringing to patients.
So, you know, there's a lot going on, but at the end of the day, we're having positive discussions. It's hard to say exactly where it's gonna go, but we do think that there's a growing recognition of the importance of both the healthcare sector, the drugs that we're developing. There's also been some comments from the administration recently in terms of the focus and importance of really focusing on infectious disease, which I think is encouraging and, as you know, is a huge piece of our business. So, when we kind of put it all together, we think it's manageable and, you know, we'll look at. We'll continue to monitor a number of different scenarios.
Awesome. So let's just talk about the oncology pipeline, where we are seeing also, like, I mean, kind of, like, you know, people were excited, then they are not excited, and now, like, you are seeing some interesting data here as well. So Arcellx, first of all, I mean-
Yeah
... you have some interesting data coming up and filing coming up next year at this point, right? So your partner has talked about big numbers, that it could be a big opportunity in fourth line. How Gilead is thinking about it, internally in terms of opportunity, and you have a differentiated safety profile, so how do you see that?
Yeah, so you're referencing anito-cel-
Right
- which is a BCMA cell therapy for multiple myeloma that's in late-stage clinical development.
Yeah, yeah.
You'll see the full kind of phase III data set, fileable data set, later this year. We haven't said where, but it'll be later this year. The filing, I think you said this time next year, you meant the approval, directionally.
Approval, sorry. Yeah, sorry.
Yeah, not the filing.
Yeah.
And we haven't guided specifically the kind of specific filing or approval dates. Our partner has said that they expect to file by the end of the year, which is a reasonable assumption. And then the other thing that you highlighted is our partner has said that they think it's a really large commercial opportunity, and they've given kind of specific guidance on the size of the fourth line-
Right
- plus opportunity. We won't give specific guidance, but what we will say is that we share their view that it's a very large opportunity that's underserved. There is another CAR T available, in multiple... Actually, two CAR Ts available-
Right
- in multiple myeloma today. One, though, that is the significant kind of market leader. We believe, based on the data that we've seen historically and shared publicly, that we have a CAR T that is likely to provide better efficacy and safety advantages. And so it's a big opportunity. I mean, overall, we absolutely share their enthusiasm for having what we believe is likely to be a best-in-class CAR T in this area. It's a really big opportunity.
As you know, multiple myeloma is significantly larger than the other hematological conditions that our existing cell therapies are approved for. Even the fourth line, to your point, is a really big opportunity. Then, of course, we're also underway with the studies that would allow us, hopefully, to move into earlier lines of treatment, both second-line plus, and then ultimately first line for certain patients.
Got it. Very helpful. And similarly for seladelpar, the initial launch uptake has been pretty good, actually.
Yeah.
And so your expectations, I mean, I think Street was below your expectations in the beginning. So, your internal expectations for this product, has it changed, or is it still... It has always been high?
Yeah. No, it's, we've always had a lot of... And by the way, I wanna come back to oncology to make sure-
Yeah
I answer your question on Trodelvy.
Yeah, yeah
and talk about the full oncology portfolio.
Please talk about that, yeah.
But on seladelpar, this is a drug that we acquired from a company called CymaBay last year. It was approved and launched. The launch has gone incredibly well. Q2 sales almost doubled Wall Street expectations, so the launch is off to a really strong start. It's a competitive market. There's another therapy that was launched just before this by another company. We think we have the best-in-class therapy. I think you see that in the commercial progress so far. So to your point, we've always been bullish on it.
I mean, we think that the CymaBay acquisition is one that, in the long run, is gonna provide a really nice return to our shareholders, and it's just one of the many pieces that we've put together over the last, you know, six to eight years to diversify our business and to grow our base business. We're encouraged by it. I mean, there are four launches that are either in progress or underway, and anito-cel will be the next one, but you have the seladelpar launch. You have additional launches with label expansions on Trodelvy.
Right
which I'll talk about in a second.
Yeah
- in breast cancer. And then, of course, the HIV prevention launch with Descovy, all of which are significant growth drivers for us. It's a pretty unique position in the industry today in terms of having four very exciting launches. I think there are four of the five or six most watched launches in pharma that are either underway or soon underway at Gilead that will drive growth. And then circling back to your question on oncology more broadly, you know, anito-cel is really exciting. Cell therapy and, you know, is incredibly exciting overall in terms of the, you know, progress that we've made in the last decade and the benefit that cell therapies are bringing to patients. I mean, our Trodelvy data we released earlier this year-
Right.
Data in earlier lines of triple-negative breast cancer, for both PD-1 positive and PD-1 negative. Really incredible data with Trodelvy, which is poised to become, you know, the clear standard of care in triple-negative breast cancer. It is now in later lines, but this brings us into kind of the first-line setting, and that's gonna be, we believe, a significant inflection point, for Trodelvy, which is a billion-dollar plus drug today, but should grow substantially. So the market in first-line triple-negative breast cancer is twice as big as the later lines that we're in today. But the most important thing is the treatment duration-
Right
For patients is much, much longer in the first line, as you'd expect. And you see that in our clinical data. You see that with other therapies. So when you put it all together, you know, we expect just in triple-negative breast cancer alone, significant growth from Trodelvy. And then you have other opportunities with Trodelvy in hormone receptor-positive breast cancer, lung cancer, et cetera. So I think that that's another one that we're really excited about, the potential growth for Trodelvy over time and the totality of what we're doing in oncology.
Awesome. Thank you for that. So, this is very helpful. And then, like, one last question before we conclude. I mean, so now you have a lot going on. You have new launches, pipeline progression as well. But at the same time, like, I have to ask about the BD as well. So when... Like, how are you thinking about BD at this point? If you do something, would it be more like a CymaBay or, I mean, or maybe even earlier at this point?
Yeah, well, I mean, first of all, there's gonna be a steady state of what I call ordinary course business development.
Mm-hmm.
We, you know, in the last six to eight years, we've done hundreds of deals to really build out our portfolio. So I'll talk about BD, and then we should just talk about kind of the build-out of our internal research-
Right
and development and the strength of our portfolio overall. But on the BD side, we will continue to do late-stage deals. We love the CymaBay deal. We've said, you know, that's kind of the template for late-stage, de-risked assets that fit in our existing commercial infrastructure, where you have significant synergies. Now that we've built that out in oncology, both at Kite and at Gilead, we can think about acquisitions there differently. So you should expect that we will add to our late-stage portfolio on a regular basis over time, and we, you know, we generate an extraordinary amount of free cash flow that allows us to reinvest in our internal portfolio, our external portfolio, and then return a lot of that to shareholders as well. So, I think the CymaBay deal is a good one. I mean, we're never...
We're kind of focused on what we call smaller M&A, but we always say that we could do kind of a medium-sized deal. So, you know, but deals in that, CymaBay was a $4 billion deal, are very comfortable for us. We can do larger deals than that, given our cash position, but we will focus on diversifying the portfolio. And then the final piece is, you know, we've made substantial investments in internal research and development since I joined the company nine years ago, and in particular, when our CEO, Dan O'Day, joined the company six years ago. We were underinvesting in internal R&D. We've made the investments that are required. We're now investing at what I believe is a much healthier level, and our portfolio, in terms of the quality, breadth, and depth, has never been stronger.
You hear that from our new CMO, Dietmar Berger, who's been a great addition to the team. And I think you'll see more of that over the coming years. So it's a pretty exciting time, both in terms of the launches that are underway, the size and quality of the portfolio and where we are, and then what we can add to it in the future, to your point.
On that high note, thank you very much, and-
Thank you.
On behalf of-