All right. If everybody can please go ahead and take their seats. We'll go ahead and get started with our next session. For those of you who don't know me, I'm Matt Niknam, the UCaaS/CCaaS Networking Analyst here at Deutsche Bank. We are very pleased to have Zoom CFO, Kelly Steckelberg, back at our conference. Kelly, welcome back.
Thank you.
Good to have you.
Great to be here. Hi, everybody.
So, maybe just to start, to level set things, can you talk about your top priorities, what you're most focused on at Zoom as we head into the second half of your fiscal year?
Yeah. So we are absolutely focused on driving top-line growth, and that's the continuous theme that you hear from us, and that means a couple of areas of focus and investment for us. First of all, Zoom Phone, which we can talk more about later, but that, you know, very pleased with the momentum we're seeing there and continuing to invest in that. It is also continuing to invest and focus on the maturation of Zoom Contact Center, which is our cloud contact center solution, which is about six quarters old at this point, and we announced on the call last week that we've hit 500 customers, so very pleased with the momentum there. And then, of course, AI is a big focus for us, as it is in most companies today.
And thinking about and focusing on areas of investment, we just hired a new CTO, X.D., who was the Azure CTO for a long time, so came from Microsoft. So really excited about his vision there and working with him on that. And then, of course, you know, we can talk more about things like sales capacity and international expansion, which are key to growth for the future as well.
Great. Great. Maybe we'll just start off with a higher-level question on macro, which seems to have taken a backseat to AI more recently, but-
Yeah
... Let's dig into the macro question. What's the latest you're hearing and seeing from your customers as it relates to macro impacts on the business, and has this varied at all across enterprise relative to the online business?
Yeah. So our customers, while I think we've sort of moved beyond a lot of where our customers are doing reductions in their organizations, that seemed to have happened earlier this year, there is absolutely still a lot of focus and deal scrutiny. So elongation of sales cycles, CFO involvement, and back-end linearity. We've absolutely gone back to the pre-pandemic days, where people leverage as much as they can out of a deal and wait till the end. And while, you know, I think reductions have been a little less front and center over the last quarter or so, we do have customers that, as they're coming through their renewal cycles, potentially have fewer employees than they did when they originally signed up for Zoom.
So our team continues to do a great job of working with our customers in that situation to talk to them about potentially right-sizing their meetings count, but preserving that spend. So what we've seen is very high rate of logo retention, which is great, and then working with them on, "Okay, if you have fewer employees today, we want-" We never want our customers to be paying for something they're not using. And but then looking at how to preserve that spend and roll it into either Zoom One, so they get an expanded bundle, or talking to them about maybe just something like leveraging the savings they could get by moving from an on-prem, say, Cisco or Avaya phone instance into the cloud. And so really focusing on preserving that spend and those logos, and then over time, they have the opportunity to continue to grow.
But if you think about that, even when they're preserving the spend, in a different context, that would have been an upsell, right?
Yeah.
So that, you can see that impact, and you're, you're seeing it in our Net Dollar Expansion number, too. Then from an online perspective, we've been really pleased with the stabilization of the churn rate there. That's been, you know, in the range of 3.1%-3.4% monthly over the last four quarters. We did talk about tempering our outlook for growth there, or for stabilization, I should say, for the rest of the year, and that's due to, you know, slower, sort of, the impact it's having on the top of the funnel. So growth adds are being a little slower than we expected, and that's due to macro impacts.
Got it. You touched on growth as one of the priorities that you're most focused on. So one of the biggest questions, I think, on investors' minds, obviously, as we sort of emerge now several years post-pandemic, is Zoom's forward growth potential.
Yes.
How do you envision Zoom's opportunity and share potential? And I think, I say this in the context of a pretty massive, I think it's about $125 billion UC/CC TAM-
Yeah
... by 2026.
Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, we obviously are. When you look at that TAM, and you look at some of the components of it, you know, a leader in the core meeting space. And then when you start to move through that, in Phone, we are very pleased with the momentum, but are continuing to focus on that as being a very important growth driver for us, as we see some of our competitors that still have a lot of revenue in that space. And I should've, I should have mentioned, it's, it's meetings, too. You know, I get this question all the time, like: "How? Where else can you be taking share in meetings?" But I point to Webex still has about $1 billion of revenue, so there's still opportunity there that we continue to focus on taking.
And then Contact Center, we, again, very early in this trajectory, I expect Contact Center to follow a similar path as Zoom Phone did, which means, you know, it's gonna be another year to two years before the impact that it's having on our growth rates is visible to all of you. As a reminder, Zoom Phone is about four years old today. But our customers and prospects are very pleased when they see the actual product itself, the capabilities, and the roadmap that's coming. So we expect to be a leader in all, you know, three of those three key areas for us, which is meetings, phone, and Contact Center. They're just at different stages of maturation of the product, and then, of course, of our go-to-market teams.
You know, we, the phone and contact center are much more reliant on partners, and we are. When we were a meetings-only company, we were 95% direct led, and so it's taken a little... You know, it's taking time for us to build those relationships, build the partner enablement, and sort of dial in those programs, I would say, but that's absolutely a focus for us too.
Okay, great. We touched a little bit on AI as well. I mean, I would say probably the story of the year as it relates to tech, maybe even the broader economy. Can you talk about how Zoom can harness the power of AI?
Sure
To enhance its product set and ultimately increase customers' happiness, just to use the corporate motto?
Yes, absolutely. So there are components of AI functionality that we think are just general table stakes to what you just said in terms of increasing happiness. And Eric talked a little bit about this on the call last week. So an example of what I would call a table stakes is in our chat product. We have AI functionality that can read through a chat thread and then propose a response for you. And so that seems like something that's pretty table stakes, right? We also have meeting summary, which is we've always had transcription. Transcription, or we've had it for a long time, I should say.
Transcription is literally a word-for-word transcript of what happened in the meeting, and we use those to generate, for example, what gets posted after our earnings calls, 'cause we want it to be word for word, verbatim. What meeting summary does, though, is it takes basically the transcript, but it puts it and summarize it in a way that gives you a perception of what was happening in the meeting. And it can detect humor, it can, you know, say, "Kelly responded with," or take action items. So it's a much more consumable-
Yeah
... way of taking that, especially if you've missed a meeting and you just wanna go back through and quickly understand what happened there. Those are all ways that you can really focus on improving the happiness of our customers. There are components of AI today that are standalone SKUs, though.
Mm.
So you know, an example of that is Zoom Virtual Agent. So this is the product that was accelerated through our acquisition of Solvvy, which leverages AI, and it's exactly what you think it is. It's sold—It's a SKU sold alongside a contact center solution that is a virtual agent, that when we implemented it internally in a quarter, it handled about 93%-
Wow!
... of the inquiries that came in. 'Cause these are low-level inquiries, like, "How do I reset my password?" Things like that, that you don't need a human to be interacting with. In fact, you consumers also appreciate it because they don't have to wait. They can get an immediate answer and immediate help. So that's not only driving customer happiness, but it's also driving revenue in the company because it's a standalone SKU. So you're gonna see, from us, you're gonna see a combination of AI features that are table stakes, and everybody gets the benefit from them in the platform, and then standalone SKUs that are monetized separately.
Got it. Okay, okay, sounds good. It's a pretty competitive market. You referenced WebEx, and obviously, there's several others in the space as well. We can't forget Teams, and obviously, there's others.
Yeah.
In a market so competitive, where you have a lot of competitors who can actually leverage existing corporate relationships, and obviously, you're no stranger to that as well, and you've grown pretty rapidly-
Yeah
... over the last several years. How do you differentiate and stand out? You talked about maybe some incremental opportunity in meetings, phone, contact center. What is the quote, unquote, "secret sauce" for Zoom?
Yeah. I think the secret sauce for Zoom starts with the fact that every decision we make is from the customer's point of view, and customers love Zoom. Without saying names, you know, I had an investor this morning. They came in and they just came off a Teams call and then proceeded to tell me how Teams doesn't work. So, I mean, that's the reality, right? Of I think people put up with other products. They don't love other products. And the more that we continue to take this approach, even with, like, all the, the cool things we just talked about with AI, where you're bringing more value to the customers and increasing their love while also showing them great value, I think that's the secret sauce to Zoom.
Okay. Are you seeing any sort of consolidation onto maybe broader-scaled platforms? As you go through these renewals, are you seeing any consolidation onto maybe broader-scaled platforms? And is that sort of a net benefit? I would think it is a net benefit-
Yeah
... to you.
Yeah.
Or, you know, is that creating a headwind at any point?
For sure. You know, I think every CFO, every organization is looking for opportunity to drive efficiency, and vendor consolidation is a great way to do that. We have continued to add features and/or standalone, you know, products, if you will, that allow them to do that. Some great examples of that are our Whiteboard product, our new Scheduler product. These are all things that they are potentially. You know, the improvement, I would say, of our Team Chat product. Those are three examples where they could be paying standalone vendors for functionality they now can get with Zoom. There's, you know, potentially some upsell for some of those, but Chat is included, Whiteboard is generally included in the premium bundles. So we continue to see opportunities for improvement there.
And then, of course, when you start talking about big products like Phone and Contact Center, there's, there's huge opportunities there.
Let's maybe jump into enterprise, and maybe we can talk a little bit, just to level set, what you're seeing in the enterprise business and then some of your expectations for the back half of the fiscal year.
Yeah.... So enterprise continues to be a big focus for us, obviously, and the growth driver of the company. We did in Q1, as a reminder, we had not only a reduction in the company, but we had a reorganization in our sales team. What we saw was in Q2, as you can expect, our, like, the commercial and the mid-market teams that have much shorter sales cycles, you know, they were very quick to get back on their feet and saw a lot of success in Q2. Now, as we look into Q3, what we see is the more upmarket teams, our, what we call our majors and enterprise teams, where those sales cycles are longer, right? They're 9 to 12 to 18 months.
In Q2, what they were doing was building pipeline, and now as we come into Q3, we see the benefit of that. We see stronger pipeline entering Q3 than we saw in Q2, and I think that the impact of the reorg is behind us now, and we're moving forward, and that's what you're going to see is stronger case of execution in both the upmarket and the commercial teams for the rest of the year.
Okay. Okay. When we think about new customer adds, and I, I appreciate a lot of the color you give within enterprise. We've seen that continue to moderate in recent quarters, and I think it was around 2,000 this past quarter. Is that more a function of just slower pacing of growth adds, or is there, like, a churn dynamic there as well?
Yeah. So the churn, as I mentioned earlier, has been really stable in terms of logo churn. We've seen some seat count attrition for all the reasons we've already discussed, but logo churn has been very, very stable. So what you're seeing is more an impact of, again, of macro and the top of the funnel, just having slower additions there.
Got it. Okay. Good. And maybe if we can pivot to online, the latest you're seeing there, and then maybe some of the expectations to think about for the back half of the year.
Yeah, sure. So when we- on the Q1 call, so coming into Q2, what we had indicated as a reminder was we were then, the forecast was for dollar, dollar stabilization. So as a reminder, you know, online grew really significantly during the pandemic-
Yeah
... and has had, you know, a declining growth rate for the last kind of six or seven quarters. So we're very focused on getting this segment of the business stabilized. We indicated in Q1, we expected that to stabilize for the rest of the year at around $480 million a quarter. We were very close to that in Q2, but we also, you know, given the guidance or the prepared remarks, expected that to temper in the back half of the year a little more than we saw in Q1. What that is a factor of is we've seen the, you know, the churn rate stabilize, but also impact to the macro on the top of the funnel and just having that grow a little bit more slowly than we originally anticipated.
Got it. You talked about churn and how that's somewhat stabilized, and I think a majority of the base now is sort of beyond that 15-16-month tenure level.
Yes, yes.
What are the bigger drivers of churn? Can we just go back to why churn is, you know, north of 3% per month, and is there an opportunity over time to maybe drive that lower?
Yeah. So for our online customers, we want them to use the platform when it serves them well. So we do not have any friction. We let them come and go on and off the platform as it suits them, and that has always been the approach that we've taken. So there's no friction in the cancellation cycle or process on Zoom.
Mm-hmm.
If you go all the way back again to pre-pandemic, it was about 3.1, 3-3.5%. So we're back in that range. Now, can it get better? I mean, we are modeling it at these levels. However, what I would say is this is a very different platform than it was three or four years ago. It's so much better. The ability to onboard new products is really helpful. As we know, the customers that have more than one product are much more retentive, and every day we're adding products like Scheduler, for example, which lends itself very well to the online buying cycle. It's a product that can be used by an individual. It's really easy to implement and to understand. So as we have more products like that, not only does it drive revenue, but it drives retention.
So the buy flow has also gotten better. Like, everything about the platform is just better. So I think that it probably can get better. We are taking the conservative approach of not modeling it that way.
Sure.
But again, it's a very different platform than it was four years ago, so potentially.
Got it. And then maybe just one other bigger picture question on online. As you think longer term, maybe we can just talk about the strategy for serving the cohort. And I reference this, I know higher churn maybe is or elevated, it's 3% churn, but there's really no cost of acquisition. It sounds like-
Right
... it's a lot of self-serve.
Right.
But there were a lot of free options available, and I'm just wondering, is it a segment of the market you think is worth pursuing and continuing to invest in?
Yeah. So the online segment is absolutely an area that we, I mean, we... In fact, over the last year, right, we really doubled down, if you will, on our strategy by breaking it out. We have a GM. She reports directly up to Eric. Wendy, and runs that as a standalone business. She has a digital marketing team now, so it's really almost an end-to-end business for her. And it serves a very important not only is it a very profitable segment of our business, it's a very important channel for the direct business as well.
Right.
It's a very important funnel because customers often self-serve, come in, buy a number of meeting licenses, but as they grow into that and they want to either add more licenses or they want to try a product like Zoom Phone, for example, which might lend itself to better being served by a direct sales organization, we see them then transition from online to direct, which is great. It's a very cost-effective funnel in that, in that way.
Yeah.... Okay. Let's go back to some of the bigger growth opportunities, particularly within enterprise. Maybe I'll start with Zoom Phone. So I think you recently surpassed roughly $500 million in ARR. It's about, I think right now it's around 11%-
Yeah
of revenue. Can you talk about the opportunity you see in Phone, and maybe over time, how significant you think this business could become?
Yeah
- for Zoom?
Yeah. So we continue to see, you know, big opportunities in Phone. There's a lot of competitors still sitting out there with a lot of revenue. While we have surpassed, I think, you know, at least our main competitor in terms of seat count, there's still a large amount of opportunity there, and that's what we're absolutely focused on. And, you know, we've always said from the beginning, we thought that Zoom Phone could be 25-ish% of our revenue, and I think, you know, we're not there yet, but you can now start to see how that really comes to fruition. Given the amount of revenue it's generating today and the opportunity and the win rates we have against others in this space, I think you can really see how that's a possibility.
And as we think about just the competitive landscape, why, and I assume there's an element of platform in here, but why do customers choose Zoom?
Yeah.
If you can maybe reference some of the bigger sources of share gain you're seeing.
Sure. I mean, certainly where we're taking the most share is from on-prem solutions like Cisco and Avaya. And, you know, Phone is one of those areas that IT organizations have put off moving from on-prem to the cloud for as long as possible because nobody wants to do a phone implementation, right?
Yeah.
And it just works. You pick up your phone, and there's a dial tone, it works. However, I think with the, you know, the future of hybrid work being here to stay for most of us, organizations realizing that having dedicated landlines in offices doesn't make sense anymore, and giving employees the flexibility to have a soft headset that they work from home, or having it attached to their mobile device, so they don't have to carry around two phones at a time, is very, very beneficial. And not to even mention the ROI that comes with that in terms of the per-seat price is always going to be cheaper, and then getting rid of that on-prem hardware and the people that are supporting that is really brings a lot of savings.
When you look at other cloud providers, the reasons that we win is it's a much more modern architecture, and we are still very price disruptive, even against other cloud providers. We're about half the price. And so when you take all of those benefits, and then they look at, "Oh, wow, and then I get to natively integrate with Zoom Meetings and Zoom Contact Center and all that-
Yeah
... There is absolutely a lot of benefit. The, you know, we-- you talk about a lot more, but we haven't talked about as much, but, like, the ability to one-click, you know, launch from a meeting into a phone call or into... in from a chat, into a Zoom meeting or into a phone call is incredible, and that would-- you get the true benefit of that by having the full platform experience.
Great. Contact center's another area, maybe a little bit more nascent, but you talked about-
Yeah
500+ customers in 6 quarters since launch. Where are you seeing the early wins, and are there maybe specific verticals or customer segments that have been more early adopters?
Yeah. So, and this is very similar to how we saw Zoom Phone start is, you know, stronger in the kind of commercial mid-market segment. And there's a combination of customers of that size using it for their external customer call center and maybe larger organizations using it for their internal help desk, like for their people experience team, for example. We have seen, though, you know, our largest customer to date was an international outsourcer, and they originally bought 2,000 seats and now are in the process of doubling that, so implementing up to a little over 4,000 seats. So it shows you the, I think, the resiliency of the platform and where we are and the capacity and the roadmap.
There are still some features and functionality we know that we need to really start to win those key large enterprise deals, you know, like the 10,000 seat deals, which is absolutely what we aspire to. But there's still some features on the roadmap that are coming to fruition that the back half of this year that we need for that.
So how do you just, I mean, and, and this is going to delve into a broader M&A question that's, that's on, and I'll ask, but maybe just as we think about contact center, maybe what's lagging or what do you think, what are maybe some of the pieces you think you can fill to enhance the product offering relative to cloud-based peers, and how do you think about scaling between organic and inorganic?
Yeah. So it's a really interesting discussion because where do we differentiate between peers is back to, we have the most modern native platform out there. You can look across any of the contact center providers, and I would stand by that. Now, what they have, some of them, is they have these larger enterprise customers, and so I think the question is, if you were to consider an acquisition, and you know, we've obviously done that very publicly in the past, you know, what do you get? And what you get from that is you get some of those customers, you get potentially expertise, you get maybe a channel, because the channel relationships in contact center are even more important than they were in Phone and vastly more important than they were in Meetings.
Those are areas that we're investing and we're building those relationships, but you could definitely fast forward some of that if you were to do an acquisition.
Got it. Got it. Okay. Let's talk about profitability, and then I'm, I'll sort of work my way down to margins, down to cash flow-
Sure
and get the use of cash.
Yeah.
You're obviously scaling up market. You're investing in new growth opportunities. We've talked about online, which maybe had stabilized and is maybe seeing some pressure at the top of the funnel. How should investors think about the path for operating margins between where you are today and the longer-term targets you laid out at Zoomtopia last year?
Yeah. Yeah. First of all, our longer term model, our long-term model targets, which are much lower than where we're operating today, are really designed to give us room to invest as we see the opportunity for driving growth. And we are very thoughtful about this interplay between driving growth and being thoughtful about what we're investing. So what we've highlighted, though, is we do expect gross margins to come down a little bit as we continue to, or start to invest more heavily, I should say, in AI.
Yeah.
We guided to the rest of the year, they'll come down to 79.7. You should expect them to be about in that range. Then operating margins, you know, Q2 was exceptionally high. There was about a 200 basis point benefit in G&A. That was a one-time benefit, so you shouldn't expect that to repeat. But even in that, you know, 35%-38% rate is still very-
Yeah
... strong operating margins. We are continuously focusing on organic opportunities for investment in R&D, especially. You should see, and that will come from both contact center as well as AI. Then sales capacity. As we, you know, move past the sales reorg and we see stabilization in there, I think we'll continuously look for opportunities for growth, is what I would say. So that could be international expansion, that can be channel investment-
Uh-
As we see the opportunities there, and that's why you could see some potential impact in the margins.
Got it. Got it. I'll ask a question about stock-based comp. I know this was much more topical a year ago, 18 months ago, but I'll ask it anyways.
Yeah.
How do we think about stock-based comp expense going forward? And I know I think you've kind of stabilized in this $260 million-$280 million range, the last couple of quarters.
Yeah.
Any variations to anticipate?
Yes. So as a reminder, we had a program for the last maybe year and a half to two years, which was a supplemental grant program, which was, if you can imagine, all the way back to the time that our stock price was very high and we were hiring employees, that as they came up to their first year of vesting, the value they saw at that point could have been a lot less than what was reflected in their offer letter. And so we were giving these supplemental grants. We sunset that program on February of this year. And so what's happening, what will happen is the expense associated. That, and those supplemental grants had a big impact on our stock, of elevating our stock-based comp.
So the way to think about it is, that's going—they're tied to the underlying grants, but it's going to depreciate, if you will. It's getting amortized in, and that's going to depreciate over time until 2027. It'll, it'll all be—the impact of the supplemental grants will be gone. And to give you some perspective, in Q2, if you looked at our stock-based comp, about a third of it was associated with supplemental grants. So that's how much you can think about by 2027, it'll be gone. It's not going to be a step—it's not going to be like just a step function. It's going to go down over time, but that gives you parameters in which-
Yeah
... you can kind of model out how you expect that to come down.
Okay, great. I'm going to pause if anybody in the audience has any questions. Any questions, feel free to raise your hand. Otherwise, I can keep going. Okay, capital allocation, we got here.
Yeah.
The business, obviously, you generate a lot of cash flow. I think your guide is for about $1.2 billion-
Yep.
or a little over $1.2 billion.
Yep.
You have $6 billion worth of cash and short-term investments on the balance sheet.
Yeah.
How do you prioritize capital allocation and use of excess cash?
Yeah. So this is a discussion we have every quarter and with our board, and every day with Eric and Sanjay, who runs Corp Dev, and I. And again, it's all back to: are there opportunities to accelerate top-line growth organically and inorganically? And organically could be all the things that we just talked about, you know, hiring more salespeople, growing our channel programs more quickly, hiring more engineers, anything to accelerate product development and/or sales capacity. Inorganically, of course, includes either thinking about someone, you know, in our space, looking at a possible acquisition of someone in the key areas where we're operating today. It could be someone who's a little bit smaller to accelerate development, which is what we did with Solvvy and Workvivo, and it worked very, very well. Or it could also be someone of, of scale that maybe sits beside us.
So think about opportunities for expansion into an area of workforce productivity, and I know that's a broad word that means a lot of things, but there are opportunities, whether it would be like file storage or project management, that the benefit of those is it increases the opportunity and the time that you're spending on Zoom and the platform of the day. It also makes the platform more and more retentive, always. You know, the more data you have invested in a platform, the less likely you are to want to change it out. Those are the discussions we have every day. You know, the cash on the balance sheet gives us the flexibility, where we define something, especially a scaled acquisition, that we thought would meet all those criteria. I mean, the first thing we always look at is: what does this bring to our customers?
So look at it from a technology perspective. What about the culture of the company? And do we think it would be a successful integration? And then thirdly, is valuations, which certainly valuations have become more and more attractive over the last year, but we always look at it through the lens first of the customer and what are they getting, and then back into the rest of it from there.
Smaller... It's going to be my follow-up question. Smaller private companies, it's a little bit maybe more openness or willingness to transact or engage, at least?
For some of them, yeah. I think the ones that, you know, maybe two or three years ago had aspirations of going public, are now realizing potentially that's not going to be possible for them, or they're seeing, you know, consolidation in the space just because something that during the pandemic was a product, is now really more of a feature and not really-- doesn't lend itself well to being a standalone company any longer. So yes, I think you're going to see more and more consolidation.
We saw a great example of that, one of your peers, last quarter, so-
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah.
You have Zoomtopia coming up in a couple of months. Any initial insights you can share in terms of what we can expect this year, maybe in the context of potential product or platform enhancements or strategic focus?
You're asking me to steal all of Eric's thunder, which he really doesn't like. So first of all, if you all haven't been to Zoomtopia and would like an invitation, please, Charles can help you with that. It's a great opportunity to come and see. It is really where we display all the new products for the upcoming year. It's a great opportunity to see customers and have interactions with them. We are very excited. We, I mean, we have a whole new technology team. In addition to XD, we have a brand-new head of product, Smita Hashim, who also came from Microsoft. She is incredible and amazing, and we have a chief development officer, Mu Han, who came from Microsoft.
So we have an extremely talented and visionary technical team. You'd have a lot of opportunity to hear from them at Zoomtopia, which I find very inspirational and compelling, and I think all of you would as well.
Great. Great. So maybe just one last question as we sort of wrap up here. Can you talk about what you think from your seat... It's a tough question, but I'm going to ask it anyway.
Okay.
What's the market missing? Where does the opportunity reside for either new or existing investors?
Yeah. I think what the market is missing is, first of all, the love for this platform and the potential that it has for growth and productivity in, in our existing customer base today. I think that, while we don't take any of our competitors ever for granted, I think that the overhang is misunderstood. That, I, I just gave you that example of, you know, somebody complaining about being on a Teams meeting, and we hear that all the time. And, you know, again, we never take our position for granted. We always think about every decision we make around the product, the platform, our go-to-market approach from a customer's point of view, and we will continue to do that.
But at the same time, there is a love in the marketplace that doesn't exist for other customers, you know, or other products, I should say. I think the fact that Microsoft is going to start unbundling, I think is helpful for us. I think this perception of free and competing against that is a very difficult place to be, and so having a more level playing field certainly helps. But I think that is overblown, you know, in investors' minds. With that said, it's incumbent upon us to show you how we're going to continue to generate growth and margins at the same time.
Great! It's a great place to end it. Thanks, Kelly. Much appreciated.
Thanks, everybody. Great to see you all.