Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to the Q1 FY 2023 earnings conference call of EPL Limited, hosted by Systematix Institutional Equities. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in a listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Pratik Tholiya from Systematix Institutional Equities. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Yeah, thanks, Jacob. Good evening, everyone. On behalf of Systematix Institutional Equities, I would like to welcome all the participants who have logged into this first quarter conference call of EPL. From the management team, the management team is being represented by Mr. Anand Kripalu, MD and CEO, Mr. M. R. Ramasamy, COO, Mr. Amit Jain, CFO, Mr. Suresh Savaliya, SVP, Legal and Company Secretary, and Mr. Deepak Ganjoo, President, AMESA Region. At the outset, I'd like to thank the management for giving us the opportunity to host this conference call. I would like now to welcome Mr. Anand Kripalu to give his opening remarks, after which we would like to open the floor for Q&A. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you very much, and hello, everyone. Very good evening, and welcome to the Q1 FY 2023 earnings call. Before we get into the results, I want to thank those of you who were able to attend our recent strategy conference. For those of you who could not, I do hope you had an opportunity to peruse the presentation materials that we had shared during that session. Just for your information, it is our intent to repeat this every year. Coming on to Q1 FY 2023, the inflation environment persisted through the first quarter of FY 2023. Polymer costs continued to rise, energy continued to inflate, particularly in Europe, and minimum wage increased in the Western world, driven by general inflation. All these added to the increase in costs.
However, as indicated in our last quarter's earnings call, the major hit came from EAP, where business was severely impacted due to the lockdowns as a result of COVID in China. Consequently, revenue for EAP declined by 6.4%. Given this context, I am pleased that we were still able to grow the overall business by 4.1%. Excluding EAP, revenue growth was 11.4%, broad-based across all other regions. The Middle East grew by 13.4%, Americas grew by 20.4%, and Europe grew by 10.5%. In the quarter, non-oral care grew faster at 11.7%, while oral care grew by only 3.2%, predominantly affected by EAP. EBITDA margin was 15.1%, not far from last quarter's 15.4%.
Importantly, our efforts on pricing and cost-saving programs have started to deliver. If not for the COVID impact in EAP, our EBITDA margin would have been sequentially higher. Net-net, considering the challenges, we are pleased with the performance. Moving on to sustainability, ESG, and recognitions that we've received. Sustainability remains a key focus area, be it product, process, or people sustainability. Q1 was strong in terms of Platina, and the plan to more than double Platina volumes in FY 2023 is tracking well. The company has been awarded a silver medal by EcoVadis for making significant progress on sustainability. This is a major milestone in our sustainability journey. We received an overall score of 65 out of 100, and we stand at the 90th percentile across all companies, across all industries. Significantly, EPL is now in the top 5% of plastic product companies rated by EcoVadis.
In order to drive people sustainability, EPL donated 186 benches across four schools near our factory locations at Vadodara and Vasai. These benches were made by recycling our own factory plastic scrap. Brazil. The Brazil project is on track. The new entity in Brazil has been incorporated. We have finalized the location of the factory, which is close to one of our key customers. Project team is stationed in Brazil and recruitments are in progress for factory operations. The first commercial delivery is expected by the end of FY 2023. Looking ahead, EPL will continue to drive sustainability in line with our long-term ambition of becoming the most sustainable packaging company in the world. We believe this will be the key source of competitive advantage, laying the foundation for long-term profitable growth.
Specifically in the short term, we expect challenges in EAP to continue through Q2, albeit with lower intensity. However, our comprehensive margin improvement plan, including continued success on price increases, is expected to help us recover EBITDA margins. Additionally, we are seeing early indications of softening of input costs. We expect to see some positive impact of this in Q3. In conclusion, we would like to reiterate that the business is doing all the right things in the face of these challenges and will emerge stronger as these dark clouds pass. Hence, we remain confident of our stated objective of delivering sustained profitable double-digit growth with margin recovery. Thank you. With that, we will now open this up for questions, and I'll be joined by my colleagues in dealing with some of the questions that you may have. Back to you.
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on your touchtone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Sameer Gupta from IIFL. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir, and thanks for taking my question. I have two questions. I'll take it one by one. First of all, sequentially, I would like to ask which are the scores that have seen an increase for us in Americas and Europe? When I say sequentially, it is versus fourth quarter. Here, despite a healthy sales growth, our EBIT margins have actually worsened, and they went at a high level in the fourth quarter in the first place. Is there any increased element of competitive intensity which is inhibiting margins, or what exactly has gone wrong here in these geographies versus fourth quarter specifically?
Yeah. First of all, I must say this, that we are not pleased with the margins, particularly in Europe, that we have had in Q1. We are all over this in terms of what needs to be done to fix it. Now, specifically to your question, what has moved between Q4 and Q1 is that input commodity costs have actually hardened in Q1 versus Q4, so input costs were higher. We had general inflation-related cost increases in both Europe and the Americas, particularly true with wages and so on. We had specific energy-related costs, and if you're well aware about the energy situation in Europe, that has continued to escalate. Finally, we had some specific production-related challenges, both in Europe and U.S. Europe was specifically because of COVID.
In fact, in Germany, we had as many as 28 people down with COVID at a point in time, and therefore our production got severely hampered. We had some specific operational issues in America. What I want to say is this, that absolutely we are focused on improving our margins in these two regions. We believe that a single-digit margin in Europe that has happened in this quarter is not acceptable. Okay? We are doing whatever it takes, and we believe both volume improvements through operational improvements as well as pricing, not just for commodities, but for general inflation, which is absolutely underway now. All this put together, right, will make sure that we consistently improve from this position. I just want to leave you with a message that, we are pleased of this, right? Especially Europe, right?
US as well, which is lower sequentially, as you have rightly pointed out. We are hell-bent on fixing this with the kinds of things that I have spoken about.
Thank you, sir, for your detailed answer. Just one follow-up here. When you say input commodity costs have hardened, it is because of the lag that is there for us because of the costing inventory, et cetera. Because LME or aluminum, et cetera, those I believe have already softened in one quarter versus fourth quarter.
Yeah. You know, as you would well understand, we carry a certain amount of inventory in our system. Okay? If you look at the graph, you will see that the softening, particularly on polymers, is really happening in June, right? Till May, it was actually increasing. Okay? Therefore, we have actually seen a kind of peaking of costs in Q1, right? As I called out in my opening narrative, the benefits of softening, right, which will happen by the way, because we know what we are buying now, but the benefits of those will really come into Q3.
Got it, sir. That's very helpful. Second question is a little more strategic or a longer-term question. Now, if I look at your non-oral care revenues, historically, I see that it is in AMESA that it has really been in single-digit growth rates over the last four, five years. If I just remove the Creative Stylo that you have acquired in FY 2022 towards the late end of FY 2021, then it is more or less flat. What exactly has, you know, been the story of personal care in AMESA? Has it been that, you know, the underlying market itself has been very weak, or are we losing wallet share here? What exactly is the problem?
Sorry, your question was that oral care has been flat, is it, in terms of growth?
Non-oral. Non-oral care in AMESA. Only AMESA. Rest all have been, you know, in double digits.
Non-oral care in AMESA has grown by 9% in Q1 FY 2023. Okay?
Uh, uh.
In FY 2023-
Let me clarify, sir. I was particularly looking at non-oral care revenues in AMESA, FY 2018 to FY 2022.
FY 2018 to FY 2022, I think we'll have to make a note of this question and come back to you. Okay. I just want to say this, that our recent efforts on beauty and cosmetics and pharma, and you will see examples of that even in our deck today, of conversion from aluminum to laminated tubes in pharmaceuticals, right. That is very clearly gaining momentum, both on the back of CSPL acquisition, which gives us a whole opportunity of customer and manufacturing capacity in extruded tube, right, as well as our own efforts. I mean, I believe we remain confident about our ability to grow non-oral, both in BPC and in pharmaceuticals. There's a big opportunity still in pharmaceuticals, incidentally. There's a large market in aluminum tubes in pharma.
With aluminum prices the way they are and so on, we are doubling up our efforts. You have seen some of the recent wins, including one that, the photograph of which is there in the deck, and that's a reasonably large brand. I think looking ahead, on the past, I will have to get back to you specifically, but on the future, I think we remain confident.
Sameer, if you see the non-oral grant, not going back to 2018 and that number we can take offline.
Sure.
If you see last year, March 2022, AMESA non-oral care has grew almost around 30%. Even if you remove the CSPL is also a strategy to improve the non-oral care. That was a strategic acquisition from non-oral care point. Whether we acquire or whether we put up a new plant or new customer, it is a strategy to improve the non-oral care. Even if you see this quarter, first quarter, is also a growth of almost around 8%-9% in the non-oral care in AMESA. We will take it offline on the number part, but overall, we see a growth in non-oral care in the AMESA region.
Sure, Amit. I'll take it offline. Thanks for your time, sir, and thanks for taking all my questions and so on. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Sanjesh Jain from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah, good evening, sir, and thanks for taking my question. I've got few of them. First on the America and Europe, particularly Europe, what led to a sequential decline in Europe in the revenue? Because I guess you were also in the process to take certain price and all, despite that there is a 5.5% decline sequentially in Europe. As far as EAP is concerned, I think the worst was in the Q4 from the lockdown. From Q1 onwards, we actually started seeing some unlocking in the China side of it, despite that there is a sequential decline in the revenue. Can you help us understand or reconcile what is leading to the sequential decline in the revenue?
Your first question was Europe, and the second is on China. Is that correct?
Yes.
Now, on Europe, I spoke about it. There is a small sequential decline, right, between Q4 and Q1. Now, having said that, I think, you know, this business is not unseasonal. It is seasonal. There are significant differences quarter to quarter in specified regions. Okay. For instance, we know that, you know, in the Chinese New Year quarter, right, there's a lot of disruption in China and volumes tend to be lower. Similarly in Europe, there are some quarters that are higher. If you look at the performance of this business sequentially, all right?
Now, having said that, what I do want to say is that despite the growth that I spoke about in Europe, which was a 10% revenue growth already, this growth would have been higher if not for certain specific ongoing challenges that we have had operationally related to COVID, specifically, where in Germany, we were just not able to run our plant and feed demand. Actually, there was unmet demand left in the quarter in Europe. Okay. In the normal course, right, the revenue itself would have been higher than what, 10% odd growth that we have reported. Now, on China, you'll have to repeat your question. Are you clear about the question, China. No. Yeah, if you don't mind, please repeat it. It was a little muffled, so I couldn't follow it.
Got it. Let me rephrase it. On China, I think the worst of the lockdown impact was in the Q2. In fact, Q1 was where China was in the process of unlocking, and I thought there could be a pent-up demand in China post the unlocking happening, and the sequential decline in China again, can you help us understand what led to a sequential decline in EAP?
Yeah. Again, I'm not gonna comment necessarily on sequential decline, but, I want to say this, that the real impact of China happened in Q1, not in Q4. There was just this early indication towards the end of Q4, right, that the lockdown is happening. But the real impact, the shutdown of plants, the shutdown of our customer locations and so on, actually happened in Q1, with April and May being very severe, and with each passing month, the severity reducing, right? That's why I called out in Q2 saying that some impact will continue, so it's not bouncing back like a rubber band, right? Because by the way, all restrictions in China have not been lifted as we speak, right? There are selective lockdowns that are continuing. But I have called out and said that the intensity of the disruptions is reducing, right?
We have seen a bit of that reduction as we have traversed this quarter between April, May, June. You know, June was not as bad as April was, but April was very severe. We expect that things to sequentially look a little better, even though there will be impact in Q2. Okay? That's why we've called this out in full transparency, right? Because if you read the situation on the ground in China, you will know that, isolated lockdowns are still quite prevalent in China.
Sure. Some bookkeeping question here. One on why this quarter we have a very high elimination revenue. The strong growth in each of the geographical segment is actually not showing up in the total revenue because there is a very high jump in the elimination. Can you explain what has led to such a high elimination? That's number one. Number two, there is a significant drop in laminate sales that has dipped by 24%. Why there was a lower sale of laminate?
Yeah. As far as elimination is concerned, that's a normal accounting process, Sanjesh. In order to keep the demand requirement in other countries and other subsidiaries, normally the laminate sales to internal company is plus or minus. This quarter it is high because of the demands which we are seeing in coming quarters, so the laminate supplies are more.
Okay. Laminate supplies are more, but our total revenue has not gone up to that extent. That means are we saying that in Europe there was a challenge in production, so we produced it in India and sent it, that's why or China, and that's why there were higher elimination? No, I got the elimination was not, but-
Higher laminate sales to the subsidiary, intercompany sales.
Okay, that did not turn into higher sheet sales, right?
It'll happen, Sanjesh, subsequently.
Yeah, so it is, that's what I'm saying that it is for the future demands which we are seeing the growth in all the geographies. This quarter specifically, the laminate sales is higher to take care of those future demands. There are certain inventories which are in the sea also and all those things.
To that extent, our India or China, wherever the laminate supply has done, that revenue is slightly looking higher because we have done a lot of intercompany transactions, right? Is this fair?
Yeah. That's the accounting. Like, that's why you are seeing consolidated level higher laminate eliminations.
Got it. Why was the lower laminate sales dipped by 24%, on year-over-year basis?
See, there are two things will continue to happen. During COVID period of time, we have built in certain inventories, okay? We can't continue to operate in that kind of an inventory. Over a period of time, we need to reduce. When to reduce, how to reduce are sequentially there are two more elements are happening. Sustainable laminate conversion is happening also in a higher accelerated rate. Some months we sell more of sustainable laminate in the intercompany, some months we sell less. Over a period of time this year, you will see certain fluctuations in intercompany sales because we are trying to adjust inventory. You got it?
Got it. Yeah, I understood. Very clear.
Yes.
One on the gross profit margin. This quarter we have seen a very good jump in gross profit margin sequentially. This is sustainable margin from here on, and it will only improve with falling raw material prices. Is this assessment fair?
Yes. We continue to see our effort to continue to recover the price is on. We are done in some places, some places it's ongoing. We'll continue to see margin improvement. Plus, there are lots of work on War on Waste. You know, we explained in the last call, cost efforts and everything is continuing. Those will also start yielding as we go along. You will continue to see gross margin improve.
Yes. Got you.
Yes.
One last from my side on Brazil. We have disclosed that we are going to invest close to INR 1.3 billion in Brazil. What is the asset term we are looking at this investment and when should we see it like full utilization level in Brazil?
Yeah. You know, like I said, our intent is to start commercial production by the exit of this fiscal. The decision to go ahead with this investment met the thresholds we have in our business for a payback. Okay? It has met our internal thresholds. We believe that we could even beat that case because right now we have done the entire evaluation based on the commitment of one customer on the back of which we have gone and set up this facility and made this investment. But there are several other customers who are very keen to do business with us. At the moment, we have operations on the ground, we believe that many of them will come to us, and that will help us to beat the threshold case based on which we took this investment decision. Right?
Now, by when will we fill the capacity and so on, I think we will wait and see how this evolves, but these are the broad contours of our investment decision.
In general, what is the rule of thumb for asset turnover here?
You know, I don't think we'd like to share specifically what is our thumb rule, right? It has met our internal thresholds and our internal hurdles, right? That is why we have gone ahead and our board has approved the decision to go ahead because it was financially attractive, right? That's the only reason why we've gone ahead and done it.
Got it. Thanks for answering all my questions and best of luck to you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Sumant Kumar from Motilal Oswal. Please go ahead.
Sir, the price increase we have taken in the month of July.
Have we taken any price increase in the month of July? See, we are taking price increases every month. Okay? Including price increases in July. Right now, it may be different customers and different geographies, but somewhere some customer price increases are happening. I think the larger message I'd like to give is this, that we have doubled or tripled our intensity of price increases, coupled with our efforts on driving cost savings so that we can get margin improvement. I think we have seen increasing success on price increases, not only relating to polymers and input material costs, but also price increases related to general inflation, which are becoming more and more critical in the Western world because input materials is only a part of the cost increases that we are suffering, right. I feel, you know, confident that our pricing effort is paying dividends.
You know, the cost movements in the world today are dynamic. Too is the need for pricing to be dynamic. Pricing, you know, in this industry follows cost increases. Every time there's a cost increase, there's a price increase that we are pursuing, and therefore it is ongoing, and every month there is something that's happening.
How much price increase we have taken effectively in month of July?
See, I can't give you a specific number like that because whatever number I give you will not be correct. Okay? The reason is that in some geographies, some customers, we took significant price increases in Q1, right? In some geographies, some customers, we'll be taking significant price increases as we speak now in Q2, which is July included. Okay? I'm hesitant to give you a number specifically on that.
Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Thank you. A reminder to all participants, you may press star and one to ask a question. The next question is from the line of Shivaji Mehta, an Individual Investor. Please go ahead.
Hi. Thank you for the opportunity. In one of our earlier investor calls, we had mentioned that we want to achieve a mid-teen margin in Europe. Now with the current situation, the current energy situation in Europe, which looks more structural than temporary, do you feel that this target is achievable?
Now, obviously, there are all kinds of hurdles and barriers to getting there. I think our first objective is to be in the teens in terms of margin. Okay? Then we get to mid-teens. Okay? You know, we are putting in every effort to make sure we get there. First, let's get into double digit, back into double digit where we were earlier, right? Then into the early teens at least, right? I'll say this, that while mid-teens remains aspirational, single-digit margin is unacceptable. Okay? Therefore, we will do what it takes to get into double digit and then gradually make our way into the teens and then into the mid-teens. We are dealing with this energy. You know, the energy thing is quite exceptional, huh?
Both the energy thing and the general inflation-led wages that are going up in Europe is quite exceptional, right? Honestly, it would have been very hard for anyone to forecast 9.5% inflation in Europe. Energy costs not just doubling, even beyond that. Anyone would have found it hard to forecast this even a quarter or two ago. It's the dynamic nature of the environment we're in. We have to keep changing our tactics and strategies to deal with this new information or this new challenge. I just want you to know that, we are all over it, right? I have every confidence that we will start making progress towards double-digit, and beyond.
Right. My second question is on, you know, if the commodity prices just stay at these current levels, and we are able to get the price hikes that we are seeking from the customers, what kind of margin levels would you feel we can be at going ahead? Is it that the pre-COVID level margins of 20-21% at the EBITDA level, do you feel that is something that we can achieve, you know, if we are just able to get the price hikes and the commodities just stay at where they are?
Yeah. I can't tell you whether this will go back to those numbers, right, specifically, because you also know that with all the inflation that's happened, there's also mathematical translation loss in the absolute numbers, right? However, do we expect that our pricing, our cost saving initiatives and the softening of commodities as they happen, as we are beginning to see the early signs, that a combination of these will get us back to the kind of profitability we had? That is absolutely our ambition, right? To get back to the kind of profitability. What percentage margin there is a matter of mathematics. That is our intent, to make sure we continue to persist on pricing, that we continue to drive cost savings, and we harness as much of the commodity softening as we can.
Now, the caveat to all this is, do recognize that there is some part of our business that is contractual, and softening of commodities will also therefore impact pricing with those contractual customers, as indeed we have seen it happening when things have gone up. The only difference is that when it's gone up, pricing has lagged the cost increase. When it goes down, hopefully it will lead, right? We will be able to retain some pricing before the prices go down based on input commodities. Okay? We should aim to gain back some of the stuff that we have lost. That is the equation. Absolutely, the ambition is to get back to the order of profitability that we had.
It's a shift thing because, you know, the commodity has to soften and lots of things need to happen. That is what we are working towards.
All right, sir. Thank you. Thank you for the answers, and wishing you all the very best.
Thank you so much.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, you may press star and one to ask a question. The next question is from the line of Resham Jain with DSP Investment Managers. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi. Good evening. I have a couple of questions. The first one is on the competition. Given that, yes, we are seeing some good performance from our side, but I think there'll be many smaller players who might be seeing much more higher pressure than us. Are you seeing some of these smaller marginal players going out of business or are on the verge of moving out or something like that? If you can just give some sense around that.
I can't comment on whether some of the smaller customers have gone out of business or shut down. What I can tell you is this, that, our business wins, right? The momentum on our business wins continues strongly, which means we are winning business that was hitherto done by other competitors, right? That reflects strengthening of our business and correspondingly weakening of some of those competitors. I think that's the way for us to really think about this.
Okay. Right. Secondly, on the overall equation between the production cost, let's say between Western world versus, let's say, India, are you seeing export opportunities also emerging for you or because of the nature of the product, that might not be the possibility?
I think as you rightly pointed out, there's a production cost advantage in countries like India. This is, we are transporting primarily air, right? It's not very cost competitive in terms of transportation. In the recent past, freight cost also has gone very high, right? There are certain diameters possible, there are certain diameter not possible. There are supply chain challenges. Most customers doesn't want to hold inventories. We need to look end-to-end to see whether we have a winning proposition in terms of making it in low-cost countries. Which we continue to evaluate. There are exports we do, there are exports we don't do. We look as the case arises.
Let me just add to what Ram said. You see, I think the power of EPL is that we have local manufacturing across the world close to the demand. We have a unique opportunity to actually ship laminate out of places like India and China and make the tube, which is the air part, right, closer to where the demand lies. Based on an exception, we can export out of India. As a rule, it is far more efficient for us to ship the web, make the tubes closer to the demand, right, and deliver it locally there when freight will be much, much lower.
Understood. I have one last question. On the cash utilization, let's say for this year and next year, how are you looking at it? Because you have a very healthy dividend payout ratio. Just from a cash utilization perspective between CapEx dividends and working capital, how are you thinking about it?
Resham, I can't be very specific on the numbers, but priority-wise, first is the business and the growth and then whatever is the cash available, which you know that we are consistent on our dividend payments.
What is the CapEx plan for 2023?
CapEx plan, again, the guidance is same that normally, in a three to four-year average range, we invest the depreciation amount. In FY 2023 also it will be more or less same or equal to that depreciation. One thing which I just want to inform here is that the Brazil project is separate out of this CapEx because this is a greenfield project and it's a strategic project.
Okay. Thank you. All the best.
Thank you. A reminder to all participants, you may enter star and one to ask a question. The next question is from the line of AC Agalpan, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Good evening. Thanks for entertaining me. Regarding tax, between Q4 and Q1, I find increase. Also depreciation is also slightly higher between Q4 and Q1. Any reason for the tax increase?
Can you come again?
Between Q4 and Q1, tax increase is higher. Any reason the turnover is, I mean, more or less the same turnover, but the tax increase is high. Any reason?
The tax part is, it depends on the country mix of the profitability and the taxable incomes and other things. What I can say is that the effective tax rate for the year will be around 27%-28%, but quarter-over-quarter it may move based on the country mix.
Thank you.
Okay. Thank you.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, you may press star and one to ask a question. The next question is from the line of Shivaji Mehta, an individual investor. Please go ahead.
Hi. Thank you for the opportunity once again. Just had one question regarding the revenue growth. Are there any areas that we are working on that could really provide us a step jump, you know, in terms of the growth? Like, say for example, earlier, you know, as you had mentioned also in your opening remarks, you know, the pharma segment, your work, also hand sanitizers, you know, when the pandemic struck, you know, we had also worked a lot out there. Are there any step jumps which could really, you know, give us, you know, some sort of an impetus when it comes to revenue growth?
I'm not sure I can say step jump. Okay? I'll tell you that first of all, Building our business development pipeline, right, has been significant, and we believe that the pipeline is very rich, and that's going to give us significant volume. The volume there will be much more in beauty and cosmetics and pharmaceutical, right? In line with our strategy. Okay, that is about ongoing growth. I can tell you that we believe that the future growth rates will be better than the past, at least based on the richness of the business development pipeline we have. The other sectors that we are looking at is, obviously conversion of aluminum tubes, and I've already spoken about that earlier, and that's another vector. The third thing is, looking at markets like Brazil, right?
Brazil will come in and, you know, will hopefully be material to our total revenue performance. Okay. Finally, we are still on the hunt for M&A opportunities that can create a further step change, particularly in geographies where we believe there's an opportunity. All right. I would say these are the vectors that we are looking at, in terms of making sure that the future growth trajectory of this business is much better than the past.
All right. Thank you. That's all from my side.
Thank you. As there are no further questions from the participants, I now hand the conference over to Mr. Pratik Tholiya for closing comments.
From Systematix Institutional Equities, I would like to thank all the participants and the management for this candid discussion. I'd like to request the management if they would like to make any closing comments.
No, I'd just like to thank everybody for being engaged and supportive of our business as we traverse these choppy times. All I want to say is that, you know, I think there is light at the end of the tunnel. When these dark clouds pass, I think this business is going to be stronger than ever.
Thank you so much, sir.
Thank you very much.