Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to SRF conference call hosted by Emkay Global Financial Services. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Meet Vora from Emkay Global Financial Services. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you. Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us today. We at Emkay Global Financial Services Limited are pleased to host SRF Limited's Q3 and nine-month FY 2025 results conference call. We have with us today Mr. Rahul Jain, President and CFO of SRF Limited. I would now like to invite Ms. Nitika Dhawan, Head of Corporate Communications at SRF, to initiate proceedings for the call. Thank you. Over to you, Nitika.
Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for joining us on SRF Limited's Q3 and nine-month financial year 2025 results conference call. We will begin this call with brief opening remarks from our President and CFO, Mr. Rahul Jain, following which we will open the forum for an interactive question-and-answer session. Before we begin this call, I would like to point out that some statements made in this call may be forward-looking, and a disclaimer to this effect has been included in the earnings presentation shared with you earlier. I would now like to invite Mr. Jain to make his opening remarks. Thank you.
Thank you, Nikita. Good afternoon, everyone. I would like to extend a warm welcome to all of you, and thank you for joining us today for SRF's Q3 and nine-month FY 2025 earnings conference call. I trust that you have had the opportunity to go through our results and the presentation shared with you earlier. I will begin the call by briefly taking you through the key financial and operational highlights for the period under review, following which we will open the forum for a Q&A session. We have delivered a healthy performance this quarter, supported by a strong Q on Q uptake, primarily driven by strong contribution from our chemicals business. The packaging films business also demonstrated stable performance. For Q3 FY 2025, the company reported gross operating revenue of INR 3,491 crore, reflecting a 14% year-on-year growth.
EBIT was at INR 529 crore, yielding a margin of 15%, while PAT stood at INR 271 crore, up 7% YoY. Overall, we have seen a decent recovery this quarter. Building on the momentum, we expect to finish the year on a reasonably strong footing with a positive outlook for the next fiscal. Coming to our segmental performance, our chemicals business reported revenues of INR 1,496 crore during the quarter, registering a 7% YoY growth and a 10% growth over Q2 FY 2025. Also, when compared to Q2 FY 2025, EBIT margins were up 600+ basis points and around 100+ basis points when compared with the corresponding period last year. The specialty chemicals segment delivered a strong performance this quarter, with a healthy increase in revenues and margins.
While the broader industry continues to witness some overhang of inventory buildup among agrochemical customers, our performance was strong, driven by positive traction in recently launched products and a gradual pickup in demand for some key agro intermediates, which were deferred earlier. Our cost-competitive pricing strategies and robust export market performance further supported revenue growth. With sustained momentum in demand from agrochemical customers, we expect Q4 performance to improve even further. We have received registrations for some of our future active ingredients and are hopeful of ramping up sales for some of these products during FY 2026 as customer demand picks up. In our fluoro-chemicals business, domestic demand for refrigerants, particularly for room air conditioners, continued to be strong, taking our domestic ref gas sales to their highest-ever levels.
While export realizations for some refrigerant gases were soft, we expect performance to improve in Q4, supported by stronger volumes and better realizations. The chloromethane segment delivered stable results during the quarter. We continue to focus on ramping up sales of PTFE in both free-flow and fine-cut grades, and expect positive traction from the same from FY 2026 onwards. The packaging films business delivered a steady performance this quarter, with revenue growing 27% YoY to INR 1,385 crore. Despite some demand-supply imbalance in BOPET, margins improved slightly, supported by strong sales of value-added products in both BOPET as well as BOPP segments. In India, BOPET demand and prices have remained stable, whereas BOPP witnessed demand growth. Meanwhile, in the aluminum foil segment, export sampling has started, gaining momentum from the U.S. and European markets. However, there was pressure on margins in the domestic market due to lower-cost imports from China.
Our technical textiles business delivered a stable performance, with revenues increasing 11% YoY to INR 510 crore. The segment benefited from steady demand and highest-ever capacity utilization for polyester industrial yarn and better traction for polyester tire cord fabric, though lower demand and margins in belting fabrics impacted overall performance. To mitigate this, we are focusing on expanding our web sales. The ongoing belting fabric and dipping machine projects remain the key drivers of future growth and are on track. In our other segment, the coated fabric business experienced slower demand in the domestic market, though we continue to maintain a dominant position in this space. The laminated fabrics segment performed in line with expectations. Looking ahead, the demand is expected to remain stable in the next quarter, and the integration of a new hot lamination machine is expected to drive margin improvements.
Additionally, the geopolitical environment remains uncertain, and overall interest rates, both locally and globally, probably with the exception of the E.U., may settle higher than earlier expectations. Overall reductions in interest rates over the past six to nine months should flow through to the P&L during FY 2026. The current quarter also witnessed a significant strengthening of the U.S. dollar against major currency pairs, which negatively affected the results to the tune of about INR 34 crore. However, a weaker rupee is generally favorable for the company over the long term, both as a net exporter and import priority pricing for some of our key domestic products. In line with our commitment to consistent shareholder returns, the Board of Directors has approved a second interim dividend of 36%, amounting to INR 3.6 per share. This follows the earlier declaration of the first interim dividend at the same rate.
I am glad to share that SRF has been honored with several prestigious awards, including the Gold Award for our annual report 2023-2024 at the LACP Global Communications Competition, a bronze medal in sustainability from EcoVadis, a globally recognized consortium for sustainability rating, and the internationally recognized Gold Stevie Award for our diversity, equity, and inclusion campaign In Her Shoes. Additionally, our packaging films business in Indore has been recognized as one of the top 25 industries for waste minimization and management at the CII awards. SRF strives to be a responsible corporate citizen. SRF Foundation works at the grassroots to empower communities. As part of our Anganwadi development program, we organize door-to-door visits and community meetings in Bhopal to strengthen programs and retain students at these centers. We also held a two-day training for Anganwadi workers, focusing on hands-on activities, workbooks, and proper use of materials.
In Rajasthan, we inaugurated a new Anganwadi center in Khajuraho in December, attended by children, villagers, Anganwadi workers, supervisors from Gram Vikas Samiti, and SRF Foundation team. To conclude, SRF's multi-business structure has enabled us to navigate a challenging operating environment over the past two years with resilience. Despite headwinds across verticals, we have remained focused on strengthening our core foundation, built on world-class infrastructure, a highly skilled workforce, and cutting-edge R&D capabilities. These strengths reinforce our leadership position and equip us to capitalize on emerging opportunities as market conditions improve. As we move forward, our focus remains on driving innovation, operational excellence, and sustainable growth, creating long-term value for all our stakeholders. On that note, I conclude my remarks and would be glad to discuss any questions, comments, or suggestions that you may have.
I would now like to ask the moderator to open the line for the Q&A session. Thank you very much.
Thank you. We will now begin the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touch-tone telephone. If you wish to withdraw from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. In order to ensure that the management is able to address questions from all participants in the conference, please limit your questions to one or two per participant. Should you have a follow-up question, we would request you to rejoin the queue. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question comes from the line of Sumant Kumar from Motilal Oswal. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi, Rahul Jain. So in our PPT, we mentioned our focus on maximizing HFC production for quota requirement between 2024-2026. So can you talk about how much R32 capacity expansion we can do under quota system?
Sumant, again, I think the R32 position with respect to probably about 25,000-28,000 tons that we have is fairly well set. Again, as of now, there are no plans on the ground to expand HFC 32 or R32 capacity. Whenever there is a need, we will be able to do that depending upon what situation the market presents. As of now, I don't think there are any plans to increase HFC 32 capacity.
But how much we can expand under quota? What are the limits we have?
Sumant, I don't think we have done that calculation as of now in terms of what quota can we get. Again, quota is a combination of production as well as consumption. Right? So to that extent, depending upon what the situation pans out, we will be able to do our expansion or, let's say, modify some of our existing plants to be able to do 32. But again, 32 may not just be the only HFC that we are doing. We are doing multiple other HFC and blends as well. So it really will depend on the situation at that point in time, Sumant.
So on an overall basis, how much quota do we have? Do we have a calculation for that?
Again, to be very frank about it, there is no quota setup that has been created as of now. These three calendar years, 2024, 2025, 2026, have to pan out, post which we will know what the quota position the government sets up.
Okay. Okay. Thank you, Rahul Jain.
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Arjun from Kotak Mahindra Asset Management. Please go ahead.
Thank you for taking the question, and congratulations on a good set of numbers. Sir, the first question is on the AIs. So we have talked of a better fourth quarter versus the third quarter. And in addition, we have talked in the presentation of we are on track for the new AIs. So in terms of the milestones that we would have had internally, are we on track with the same in terms of samples sent, etc.? And if you could talk about what kind of we have said the fourth quarter should be better than the third quarter, are we also indicating fourth quarter should be better than the fourth quarter of the previous year, which was actually a very good quarter for us too?
Okay, Arjun, you have asked multiple questions. Let me try and answer each one one by one. With respect to AIs, I think what we have done and in terms of our internal targeting, we are in fairly good shape. Now, it also depends on two things: what registrations and what dossiers we are able to get into, which is in good shape. But the final demand of this will come through only once the customers are looking to expand their production on that side. So to that extent, again, we are very hopeful that FY 2026 should be a good year for some of the AIs that have got registered. My sense is three or four have already got done. Hopefully, some of the sales traction will also start getting witnessed in FY 2026, maybe to a certain extent in Q4 FY 2025 as well.
Further, with respect to the question that you asked in terms of whether Q4 will be a better quarter, we were typically talking about Q3 versus Q4, where I was saying Q4 is going to be a very good quarter. Also, when you look at this historically, for specialty chemicals business, Q4 always has been a good quarter always. So to that extent, I have not looked at and compared it with Q4 numbers, but I'm sure the way we are looking at it today, Q4 is going to be probably even better than the last year, CPLY.
Sure. Thank you for that. Sir, the second question is regarding ref gas. So we have seen a slight uptick in R22 prices also in India. Given that PTFE is a key ingredient R22 to make TFE. Are we seeing an increase in prices for the PTFE market also? And you have talked about, and you said it in the previous quarter also, that probably we would just start from the fourth quarter and from FY 2026, we could see both grades doing well. If you could talk about a little bit in terms of what pricing improvement we could see and what's our current utilizations, or do you expect FY 2026, I mean, for FY 2026, we should be maybe 3,000-4,000 tons or higher?
So again, PTFE is being driven by two or three things today, Arjun. The suspension grade plus some of the free-flow and the fine-cut positions that we are creating. Now, domestically, I think we are doing fairly well, but there is pressure on PTFE also given current pricing, and again, we've not seen very significant increase in domestic prices on PTFE. The way we are looking at it also is that as our sampling for the international market starts to get approved, there will be export traction that we should see building out on PTFE as well. It's at that point in time where we will believe that things have changed for the better, and once exports start to kick in, hopefully, better utilization of PTFE for FY 2026 is what we are targeting today, Arjun.
Sure. Any guidance in volumes, what we possibly can do?
Generally, we don't do that, Arjun. So I would keep it close to my chest and hopefully just say that we will be much better going forward.
Sure. Thank you, and wishing you all the best.
Thank you, Arjun.
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Naushad Chaudhary with Birla Mutual Funds. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi. Thanks for the opportunity and congrats on a good set of numbers. First, on the ref gas business side, sir, if I look at it four or five years back in the domestic market, there were three, four players. Eventually, when things started phasing out, other peers started shifting focus to some other businesses, and we kept adding capacity and now moving to HFO as well. Does that mean eventually, in the next couple of years, we might have a kind of virtual monopoly kind of situation in the ref gas business versus the market share we have today? How do you look at your ref gas business three, four years down the line?
I don't think it is going to be a monopolistic situation, Naushad. I think we've always seen imports on HFCs coming in. That, I think, will probably continue to a certain extent. And I am not really sure with respect to what pans out in, let's say, the next three-to-four years from a market perspective. The only couple of things that I want to talk about is the fact that what we are seeing is AC manufacturing in India going up very significantly. Roughly, let's say, about 15 million ACs. If you aggregate all of these up, the demand for ACs is going up.
Sorry to interrupt you, sir. You're not audible. Mr. Rahul Jain, ladies and gentlemen, please stay connected while we reconnect the management line.
Hello.
Yes, sir. You can go ahead, sir.
Okay. Naushad, I was continuing to reply to your question while the line got disconnected. So what we are seeing is that there will be growth in the AC market that will happen over a period of time, which should overwhelm for, let's say, the overall domestic demand for the HFCs and more specifically 32 as well. So that's the way we look at it. I don't think it's a monopolistic situation. We know there are announcements by other players about 32 expansion. Let's see how that pans out, Naushad.
From an HFO point of view, is there really any tech barrier, or can anybody easily enter by investing some money into this gas?
What we have said in the past, Naushad, is that we are looking at the fourth generation gases. We are a key player. We are doing it through our own technology. I think we will let it be at that rather than comment on what others are doing around it.
Okay. Final one in the Spec Chem cycle recovery. So we have invested so much in our Spec Chem. We have created a gross block. Do you think if cycle recover, your commercials of the pipeline molecule, at least for the initial first year of recovery, should accelerate and should be better than your expectation, then it should normalize? Is that how we should look at it?
And the way we are looking at it is that we are starting to see some recovery in the actual cycle. The customer traction is good. We are also looking at Q4 again, like we have said, better than Q3. I think we've said that probably earlier in the early part of the year as well, that H2 will be better than H1. I think that's the state that is panning out in the way that we thought even in the beginning of the year. I think there is some recovery that has happened. Again, geopolitically and various issues still persist. Let's see what happens. But yeah, fairly confident of what Q3 and what FY 2026 has in store for us.
Sure, sir. All the best. I'll come back in the queue. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Jason Soans with IDBI Capital. Please go ahead.
So yeah, sir, thanks for taking my question. So just wanted to understand from a ref gas pricing trajectory point of view, of course, even in the middle of the quarter, there was some news regarding a reasonable and a very, very big price increase in terms of a U.S. distributor. So just wanted to know your take on how do I mean, of course, I'm not going to do specifics, and probably that was more of a one-off kind of thing. But just in terms of a pricing trajectory, if you could give us some color on how the ref gas pricing is looking domestically as well as in the export markets.
Yeah. I can't comment on each, but the way I would look at it is that we have seen some price increasing happening, increase happening both in the domestic and to a certain extent, that's also been a rebound for the international markets and to a certain extent, local China prices also to that extent. Now, when we think about it, and again, I think we've talked about it in the past also, we've seen historically low prices of HFCs coming through probably for the past 18-24 months. Now, this cycle had to recover at some point in time. The way we are looking at it is pricing is going to be stronger. It is going to be a positive.
But again, when we think about it historically also, when there is a long tail in terms of low pricing, we also see an uptick in pricing, which is very strong. Hopefully, that can continue and give us better realizations on ref gases, especially on 32 as well. Again, we've also commented that some of the other HFCs, we've seen lower export prices in the last quarter. Hopefully, some of that negative can also turn into some positive.
Sure. Thanks for that, sir. And just in terms of ballpark, sir, how much would be exports and how much would be domestic in terms of ref gas?
As of what are we talking, nine months, Q3?
On a full year basis, nine months on a full year basis, roughly nine months, how would that be?
Exports would probably be. Give me just one sec. I'll come back with the number.
Okay. Okay. Sure, sir.
Just one sec.
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
About 40%-42% is export in terms of tonnages.
40%-42% in terms of tonnages is exports, right?
As far as HFCs is all I'm talking.
Yeah. Okay. So that's exports, 40%-42%, and 58% is domestic. Okay. Got it. Got it. Okay, sir. And I also just wanted to also get your view on, I mean, margins have recovered very, very smartly at 24.3%. I'm talking on a consolidated level. So from the sub-20% levels, and you have, of course, alluded to a good recovery going ahead. So just wanted to know, sir, what are we doing differently? Of course, I understand that environment has not changed considerably. Still, things are quite difficult in terms of the business as such. So just wanted to know from your point of view, could this be looked at as a sustainable turnaround from your, and what are we doing things differently in a tough environment?
So to be frank about it, I think we had also said this in the past that when we look at FY 2024 margins versus FY 2025 overall margins, and again, we've said this multiple times, we don't look at margins on a quarter-on-quarter basis. It's best to look at it more on an aggregated basis because there will be seasonality, volatility, customer demand, various factors playing out. Now, when you think about margin just Q1, Q2, when you are looking at Q2 versus Q3, yes, there has been a smart recovery that has happened. I think we had also alluded to the fact that this is likely to happen. Given existing products also have started to show some better traction, we believe margin profile can improve from here when you look at it on a Q3 versus Q4 basis.
But again, going back to it from an aggregated year-on-year basis, again, I think 2% plus minus from a FY 2024 versus FY 2025 perspective should still be the target when we think about it overall. When you think about margins in Q4, FY 2024, we were probably at about 13% overall. I don't remember the number, but yeah, that may have been the case. Now, purely from that perspective, we will see some positives for Q4 in FY 2025 as well.
The chemicals business in Q4, just wanted to tell you. So can we look at a better margin there?
We have to look at purely from that perspective. Go back to FY 2023, probably in 30%+ ranges.
That's right. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Sure, sir. Thanks. That's all from my side. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Sanjesh Jain from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good afternoon, sir. Thanks for taking my question.
Sorry to interrupt, sir. You're not audible, Mr. Sanjesh.
Am I good now?
Yes, sir. Please go ahead.
Okay. Okay. Thank you. Good afternoon, Rahul Jain. A couple of questions.
Yeah. My delusion.
First, on the specialty chemical, I got that Q4 is going to be very strong. What is the sense are we getting? It is a restocking demand, which they are seeing, or there is an underlying recovery in the agrochemical demand, or it is that we have sitting on a lot of approval, and that is driving. So what exactly is playing out so strong for specialty chemical for us and in general for industry?
I think it's a combination of all of these factors. I think to a certain extent, restocking is happening. I think to a certain extent, balance sheets of some of the customers, they are probably also looking at getting this from a Q3 versus Q4 perspective because their financial year typically ends in December. And therefore, some of their future requirements, they are looking to price out or take delivery for from Q1 onwards. So there is restocking. There is some underlying recovery that is happening. So multiple factors playing out, Sanjesh. And again, customer traction seems pretty decent going forward as well.
In the Q4, when you see a significant portion of incremental demand is coming from the new products or even the existing products?
It's a combination of both. Some of our existing products have seen a bit of a rundown when we look at the nine-month period. And to that extent, some of the existing products are seeing some good traction, but yes, certainly new products are providing a positive.
One last question here. In your opening remark, you said that you also had a better margin for specialty chemical in this quarter. Was it more operating leverage, or is that the cost has come down, and that is benefiting us? What is driving margin improvement for specialty chemicals?
I think, again, a combination of both. To a certain extent, pricing has improved. To a certain extent, I would say operating leverage because newer plants are starting to kick in. That's giving the positive. And I would also say that volumes have also picked up. So all of those three are adding to the margin. So when you say volumes have picked up, it also adds to the operating leverage. When you say that new products have started to kick in, therefore, again, operating leverage is a positive, and to a certain extent, pricing as well. I think combination of all of these factors, but I would really say volumes and to a certain extent, new products are creating the positive.
Got it. One last question. You looked a little cautious on the U.S. HFC demand. Why do you seem cautious given that industry-wide there appears to be some sort of shortage?
I have not talked about U.S. HFC demand. Again, thematically, U.S. has gone through now another large cut on the HFC side. And therefore, thematically, there will be lower demand from the U.S. Yes, to a certain extent, what we have seen also is availability of the product, and therefore, some positive development on that side is clearly visible. But I have never said that we are negative on U.S. demand. I have always said that pricing going forward seems to be in good shape.
Got it. No, in your presentation, there was a statement. Sorry, not in your opening remark. My bad. But got the point. But Q4.
I think that's a thematic, Sanjesh, that thematically, because U.S. will have to cut their GWP positioning because of the protocol, there will be a lower demand. There could also be a situation where because of, let's say, lesser use of 125, then 32 goes up. So that's the mechanics operating between the HFCs overall.
Got it. Got it. Structurally, next year, we should have more refrigerant gas exports than the domestic, or because of the quota regime, you want to maximize the domestic quota than the export one? How you want to place yourself for the longer?
I'm talking about FY 2026.
I'm talking about CY 2025. Correct.
Okay. Again, I think it's been a stated position that we want to increase our domestic positions given quota positioning playing out. But we are also therefore happy to export because we have fairly large capacity on this side. Hopefully, both can work out well. I think mix between 40% to 50% on HFCs still is a good mix to have in terms of domestic versus export.
No, that's fair enough. That's pretty much clear. Thanks. Thanks, Rahul Jain, for answering all those questions and best of luck for the coming quarter.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question comes from the line of Madhav Marda from Fidelity. Please go ahead.
Hi, good afternoon. Thank you so much for your time once again. I just wanted to check on the ref gas pricing. So obviously, there has been this recent increase in price coming out of China for exports of HFCs. Just wanted to understand how does that pricing contracts work in India and in the key export markets like Middle East and U.S.? Are these quarterly contracts or monthly contracts? So basically, the impact of the increase, over what duration of time does it start showing into our P&L?
Again, for U.S. market, there will be some contracts that will act, right? Again, the way domestic market operates is largely spot, but OEMs would be different. So the trade versus, let's say, the OEM market would operate differently. OEMs typically have a monthly, maybe in some situations, a quarterly position. But largely, I would say some of the price benefits that we have seen should start to percolate down in Q4 as well.
Yeah. That's what my question was. Given some of this price increase has been more recent, is there some price tag benefit which will show through more in Q4 versus Q3 in our key markets? Is that the right way to think?
Keep telling you each pricing of each gas for each quarter. Very difficult to do that nowadays. Thematically, pricing is higher. That's what we will see.
Okay. Got it. Got it. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ankur Periwal with Axis Capital. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, sir. Thanks for the opportunity and congratulations on a good set of numbers. First question on the specialty chemical side. Again, from a demand recovery perspective, you did highlight that there is a general uptake, volumetric uptake from the existing portfolio as well. But what's your thoughts on pricing front, at least for the existing portfolio, wherein there was some bit of pressure earlier, and we had highlighted that we will be trimming our cost as well to negate that negativity? So where are we, and any guidance?
Again, Ankur, I think we've commented on that also in our presentation to a certain extent. We will be able to mitigate some of the price negatives coming out of China. But it won't be 100%. There is a price reduction in some of the key products that have happened. We will continue to fight for our share of those products. We will continue to cut our costs around it. There will be tech interventions around it. All of that we are doing. Some of that benefit we will start to see probably in Q4. Also, there is work going on in terms of cost of certain other products, which should pan out over a longer period of time. I can tell you that there is still some pricing pressure that is going on.
Although we are starting to see some positive traction on that side, where pricing is starting to inch up a bit, but there is still price pressure on this.
Okay. Fair enough. And for the new AIs that we have been working with the global innovators, most of them have already been cracked at the R&D approval stage, etc., is done. Are we seeing pricing pressure over there as well, or it is largely for the older portfolio that is seeing pressure?
Again, like I said during the initial remarks, we are seeing some of the registrations that we had taken for coming through. Those have come through. Now, as we will start to see traction building on some of those AIs, we will start to see more volumes. Again, because these are so new, I can't even say that there is pricing pressure here. Pricing pressure will be witnessed, let's say, for some of the products we were selling at $35, which has come down to $25, $28. That's the pricing pressure that you end up seeing. As these pan out, we will see some positive on that side. Now, whether there is pricing pressure, I really can't comment on that, Ankur.
Okay. Fair enough. Fair enough. Secondly, on the PTFE side, we have been sort of trying to get the product approvals there, both in the domestic and international market. Any timelines or anything further that you can share over there in terms of ramp-up and over what timeframe?
I think this sampling is out. There are positive tractions that we've seen from some of our global customers. Hopefully, that will pan out positively more towards FY 2026 than, let's say, Q4 FY 2025.
Sure. And this will be both commodity as well as the specialty grade?
As of now, we are only talking about three grades, Ankur. The suspension, which is pure commodity type of grade, plus the free-flow and the fine-cut. So free-flow and fine-cut are, let's say, more specialized, which is already gone out for sampling and in the process of getting customer approvals on it.
Sure. Great. Last question on the CapEx guidance, if you can share some thoughts.
Again, for FY 2025, I think, generally speaking, we should be in the range of about INR 1,500 crore overall cash spent. For FY 2026, current projects and, let's say, certain future projects, we should probably be again in the range of INR 1,500 crore -INR 2,000 crore. Hopefully, next year onwards, there can be some kick-in on the investment cycle, and therefore, some more traction developing on that side.
Great, sir. Thanks a lot for your answers. All the best. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Archit Joshi from Nuvama Institutional Equities. Please go ahead.
Thank you for the opportunity, sir. And congrats on a good set of numbers. I've got a couple of short ones. First, on packaging films, the aluminum foil capacity, where would we be in terms of utilization and the likely ramp-up ahead of us?
So, roughly speaking, about 55% for Q3 purchase. But again, the way it is, let's say the learning cycle on this has been longer than what we expected. And therefore, I can also tell you that the product is now also out into Europe and U.S. for approval. Again, like I had, it's probably a similar story to PTFE as well, where we believe traction develops on these products in FY 2026. You are all aware that there has been a duty ADD from an India market that is probably being proposed on this side. Hopefully, when that gets notified, probably the Indian market will start to show some positive trends in pricing as well.
Sure, sir. Thanks for that.
So, second one, like we were mentioning before, about the pricing pressure and our existing specialty chem portfolio, and I think DFB has been one of the key losers there. Has anything changed on that account with respect to volumes? Of course, pricing will be a function of different market forces, but at least volume shaping up well.
So again, like I said, I think thematically, what we are starting to see is some inbound pricing, right? And when I had also answered Ankur's question, some of the tech intervention and some of the interventions that we have done are also starting to show some positive signs that we are looking on that side. Volumetrically, I think we are slightly higher, if not flattish, but price remains pretty much stable. Hopefully, some of that pricing pressure that is there gets toned down to a certain extent when we think about Q4 and going forward in FY 2026 as well.
Sure, sir. The volumes will be higher going ahead. That's what I was trying to get to.
Three. And then Q3 versus Q2, sir?
Sure. Sure, sir. Got a point. So thanks and all the best.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Abhijit Akella from Kotak Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good afternoon. Thank you so much. Just two questions from my side. One on specialty chemicals. So just with regard to given that we are already at the end of January, is there any sort of?
No, no. You are too quick for me to understand what you are saying.
Yeah. Sorry. I'll go slower. On specialty chemicals for fiscal 2025, given that we are just two months away from the close of the financial year, is there any update you might be able to help us with in terms of the expected growth for this full financial year?
Give me just one minute. Let me talk about it. Give me one second, Abhijit, to answer your question.
Sure.
So again, when we think about specialty chemicals year as a whole, nine month to nine months, I think we've seen some increase in sales. So that's a positive. Again, given our guidance for FY 2025, we think there should be a positive trend on that side as well. But the 20% number is certainly out of the picture given the kind of environment that we will be in during FY 2025. Hopefully, we can get back on our growth track in FY 2026, Abhijit.
Understood. Thank you. That's very helpful. And the other one I just had was on the R32 capacity. Where do we stand in terms of capacity utilization for that? I know we wanted to maximize output in CY 2024 through 2026. So sort of how are we progressing in terms of the utilization?
Let's say about 75% in terms of overall capacity utilization. Month- on- month, we would have hit that peak. Hopefully, in Q4, we should see, again, what we had suffered with was AHF, right, availability. I think that problem is now pretty much sorted out. Hopefully, you will see you will listen to an announcement on AHF probably in the next few months, which should give us the ability to produce more. My sense is we will probably be in the 65%-70% overall nine months utilization range. But when we think about, let's say, the overall year as a whole, hopefully, better than that is what we can target.
Understood. Thank you so much, sir. That's very helpful. All the best.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Bhaskar Chakraborty with Jefferies. Please go ahead.
Thank you very much. Hi, Rahul Jain. Just wanted to check with you on these seven new AIs that we have been working on. How many of these are patented, vis-à-vis generic? And has any of these started contributing to our revenues in 4Q or 3Q FY 2024?
I think, Bhaskar, to a previous question, I had given that answer, that we have got some registrations that are now completed in our favor. As customer traction builds in, we will start to see revenue positions on that also building. I think most of them are patented. A couple of them may be also generic, but I'll have to check that and come back to you.
Okay. Thank you. And just one other question, which is that across your portfolio, currently, what kind of increase do you have seen at your refrigerant gas portfolio export realizations compared to the last quarter?
For ref gases?
Yes.
So, again, like I said, I think from an export perspective, R32 gas pricing on 32 has been better, while we have also seen softer prices for other HFCs, which hopefully should recover in Q4 as well.
So at a portfolio level, would you be positive, or would you be flat?
Not positive from a portfolio level. These are all different products, Bhaskar.
Okay. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rohit Nagraj from B&K Securities . Please go ahead, sir.
Yeah. Thanks for the opportunity and congratulations on a good set of numbers. First question is on, again, delving into refrigerant gases. For the first nine months, given that the quotas have kicked in from January for the U.S. market, what is the kind of overall growth that we have seen in terms of volumes for overall portfolio of?
In the U.S. market?
Overall. And then U.S. obviously will be lower, I guess.
Again, when we think about export, I think overall export volume growth has been roughly in the range of about 7%-8%, all assets put together, HFCs.
Okay. And domestic, so I mean, combined together, domestic and exports for the first nine months?
Domestic has been definitely pretty significant. I think it's about 60% overall.
Okay. Fair enough. Second question, again, on the AIs front. So we have done the registrations. From the customer perspective, have they also done with the registrations, and where are they in the process of commercializing or marketing their products? Just broader sense on whatever you have.
Mostly, the customer has already done their registration. We will get included in the dossier, and once that happens, we will see the positive traction on it when they start to see demand and start to buy the product.
Fair enough. That's all from my side. Thanks and all the best.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Krishan Parwani with JM Financial. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, Rahul Jain. Congrats on a good set of numbers. Just a couple of them. So firstly, when you mentioned large contribution from AIs expected in FY 2026, so just wanted to understand.
It's not that large, I said. We will start to see some positive on that side. Don't misinterpret, Krishan.
Okay. Okay. Fair enough. I mean, point taken. So just what percentage of incremental spec chem sales do you expect from AIs in FY 2026?
Again, I can't comment on what percentage. I can only tell you that there will be positive traction. The existing one big AI that we are doing is P32. It's slightly been smaller when we think about overall volumes of P32, which will start to kick in probably from Q4. That's the position that the customer is at. Again, some of these, probably two to three, we will start to see some traction in Q1, Q2 as well. Hopefully, by Q4, some of these would have ramped up, and some of these would have started as well.
Got it. Got it. And on the Ref gas capacity utilization, did you mention 65%-70% in nine months?
Roughly around 32 is what I talked about.
Okay, and so overall, what is the capacity utilization, let's say, 65,000 tons what we have versus the utilization in nine months FY 2025?
Again, I'll have to delve into that detail. Probably in the range of about 75% overall.
Do you expect to achieve a peak utilization in FY 2026, or would you be leaving some room for FY 2027?
Again, the intent would be to achieve full utilization. But again, it would depend on current pricing, markets, various other elements around it.
Got it. And just the last bit. I think I missed out on the chemicals EBIT margin guidance for FY 2026. Did you give it, or did I miss it?
I never give guidance.
Okay. So are you going to give, or no?
Actually, I'll ask you to. Not happening, Krishan. Good try, but.
No, no. Fair enough. Fair enough. No, no. I genuinely missed out. But thank you. Thank you for patiently answering my question.
Thank you.
Thank you.
The next question comes from the line of Surya Patra with PhillipCapital. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Thanks for the opportunity, sir. And good set of numbers. Congratulations for the good set of numbers. First question is on the specialty chemical side. See, in the last almost six, seven quarters, we have capitalized a specialty chemical project worth around INR 2,000-odd crore. And generally, we have been seeing that our new projects are backed by customers, contract, and all that. So if there is a visibility now coming better in terms of the demand and all, so what is the kind of utilization that one can target in, let's say, FY 2026?
Again, the way we've looked at it is that, yes, the capitalizations have happened. I think the fact is that we believe for FY 2026, there will be better capacity utilization that should come through. There is the AI block that we have also put in, which should give us traction on the AI side. Overall, I would say that it's a chemical business, Surya. It does not ramp up like it's not a turn of a switch where you can ramp it up. It will probably take between 12-18 months for it to fully ramp up.
Okay. So that means if the trend reverses really, then we will by 2027 see the full benefit of these expanded capacities. That understanding would be right, sir.
More or less, I would say.
Okay. And.
We would target it to be faster, but yeah, more or less, that should be a good target.
Okay. Regarding the refrigerant gas, sir, so there are contradicting trends. While in the export market, it looks like the pricing is kind of moderating or have been moderating so far. And on the domestic side, we have seen price rise. And also, we are anticipating there is a kind of significant optimal utilization of the assets to qualify for whatever the quota that is likely. And there is a kind of Chinese supply that is anywhere that has been continuously there. So given all this, so how should one think? Because this quarter or following quarter could be because of the seasonality. We can see a better pricing situation for ref gas. But generally, for FY 2026 as a whole, how should one think if we can give some sense, sir?
Again, I think, Surya, you are answering the question yourself. Be very frank about it. Again, the fact is that we have seen some pricing positive on the HFCs. I think that's a trend that can continue given where product positions are, given where availability of the product in the market is. Some uptick in price can continue going forward is what we certainly believe, Surya. But what will the price be, really, nobody knows.
Okay. Just last one point here, sir. You mentioned that for the nine-month period, the export share of refrigerant gas in terms of volume is 42-odd%. For this quarter, could you?
We have seen all together.
Similar, sir? Sorry, I missed it.
Not that much. Yes.
Okay. Sure. Thank you, sir. Wish you all the best.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Niril from Awriga. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Thanks for giving me the opportunity.
Sir, may I ask you to use your handset, sir? You're not clearly audible, sir.
Hello. Am I audible now?
Yes, sir. Please go ahead.
Okay. So my question is with respect to the BOPP price . So in the presentation, you have mentioned that.
I'm not able to hear you. Your question is with respect to?
BOPP price .
OpEx spend or CapEx spend?
BOPP. Think BOPP prices, packaging film segment. So over there, in the presentation, you had mentioned that the Chinese guys are impacting your Thailand operations. So if you can give an outlook of what are the prices prevailing in Thailand, for example, in India, the BOPP prices are roughly 40 kg-42 kg. So what would that be prevailing in Thailand?
I would typically say maybe 5%-10% lower. That's probably the range. Again, I have not looked at it from that perspective. Maybe you want to send that question out, and if possible, and within permissible limits, we'll try and answer it.
Okay. Thanks a lot, sir. And just to add one more question, that is, are you observing any new BOPET or BOPP lines coming on board in the next couple of years globally?
Again, you are talking SRF perspective, or you are talking market perspective?
Market perspective.
There are multiple lines that are scheduled, but given the current scenario, I think some of those might get delayed as well.
Okay. Understood, sir. Thanks a lot. That's from my end.
Thank you.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question for the question-and-answer session. I now hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.
Thank you, everyone. I hope we have been able to answer all your questions. I wish that each one of you remains safe and healthy. If you have any further questions, we would be happy to be of assistance. We hope to have your valuable support on a continued basis as we move ahead. On behalf of the management, I once again thank you for taking the time to join us on this call. Bye-bye.
Thank you. On behalf of Emkay Global Financial Services, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.