Ladies and gentlemen, good day, and welcome to the Ashiana Housing Limited Q3 FY 2023 earnings conference call. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, and there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone telephone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Vinay Sarda from Ernst & Young. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thanks, Melissa. Welcome, everyone, and thanks for joining this Q3 FY23 earnings call for Ashiana Housing Limited. The results and the investor presentation have been mailed to you, and it is also available on the stock exchange. In case you have not received the same, please write to us, and we'll be happy to send it over to you. To take us through the results for this quarter and answer your questions, we have today with us Mr. Varun Gupta, Whole Time Director, and Mr. Vikas Gupta, CFO. We'll be starting the call with a brief overview of the company's performance of this quarter, and then we'll follow it up with Q&A session.
I would like to remind you that everything said on this call that reflects any outlook for the future, which may be constituted as a forward-looking statement, must be viewed in conjunction with uncertainties and risks that they face. These uncertainties and risks are included, but not limited to what we have mentioned in the prospectus filed with SEBI and subsequent annual reports, which you will find on our website. With that said, I'll now hand over the call to Mr. Vikas Gupta. Over to you, sir.
Good afternoon, everyone. Hope all of you and your families are keeping healthy. I welcome you to discuss the performance of the third quarter of FY 2023 of Ashiana Housing. Thank you for joining us today. Ashiana Amara, a kid-centric project in Gurugram, was fully sold on launch. We also launched Ashiana Advik, a senior living project in Bhiwadi. Apart from these new projects, we also launched phase three of Ashiana Anmol in Gurugram, and last phase of Ashiana Umang in Jaipur. Both of these are kid-centric projects. The last phase of Ashiana Dwarka, Jodhpur, were also launched in Q3 FY 2023. We achieved an area booked of 9.03 lakh sq ft for the quarter gone by. Value of area booked went up to INR 485.29 crores in Q3 FY 2023 vis-à-vis INR 240.19 crores in Q2 FY 2023.
Average realization price improved to INR 5,373 per sq ft in Q3 FY23 vis-à-vis INR 4,904 per sq ft in Q2 FY23. This improvement was driven both by increasing prices and projects, and change in mix towards higher price projects. The total sale value reached to INR 877.62 crores for the period April to December 2022. Deliveries commenced in Daksh, with 2.99 lakh sq ft delivered in phase one. A total of 3.6 lakh sq ft was delivered in the third quarter. This was against a delivery of 2.07 lakh sq ft in second quarter, and 2.11 lakh sq ft in the first quarter of the financial year 2022-23.
Area constructed was 3.42 lakh sq ft in Q3 FY 2023 versus 4.38 lakh sq ft in Q2 FY 2023. Total revenue increased to INR 135.31 crores in Q3 FY 2023 from INR 91.72 crores in Q2 FY 2023. PBT improved to +INR 9.29 crores in the quarter gone by, versus -INR 1.31 crores in Q2 FY 2023. Pre-tax operating cash flows was positive at INR 35.6 crores in Q3 FY 2023, versus -INR 1.05 crores in Q2 FY 2023. On this note, I would like to conclude my remarks. We will now be happy to discuss any questions or suggestions that you may have.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may enter star and one on their touchtone telephone. If your questions have been answered and you wish to withdraw yourself from the queue, you may enter star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. To ask a question, you may enter star and one. We have the first question from the line of Ankit Shah from White Equity. Please go ahead.
Hi, thank you for taking my question. I have one question on construction please. So, can you share the trajectory for construction over the next 2-6 quarters? And also, if you can share the hurdles that you know are coming on the way of picking up construction. Thank you.
Hi, Ankit. I'll just... You were a little soft, so I will just state the question again. You want to understand what- how the construction outlook looks over the next 4, 5 quarters, and what are the hurdles in picking up construction? Construction outlook, I think we are in that 20-25 lakh sq ft zone annually, from next year onwards. We haven't set our annual targets for next year as of yet, but, the trajectory that we have, I think we are in that 20-25 lakh sq ft target. This year-... in terms of construction volumes, particularly the third quarter was a little smaller than we expected. We had particularly 3 hurdles that have come in this year.
One hurdle was, the ban in NCR for construction, that this happens every year, but it happens particularly in the third quarter. Also, second, what has happened to us is that spread in NCR because of increasing work in Gurugram and Bhiwadi has become a larger part of our portfolio. So the impact of the construction ban in third quarter feels a little bit more to us. The second issue that came in, in terms of, construction this year, has been that our launches, have gotten a little delayed than what we had planned. So that led to delay in construction in the volumes that we expected. In sales, it's easier to catch up. You know, in Amara, we could sell on day one, when we got the response that we did. But we can't build on day one.
We need to take the time, so the delay is costlier. And the third, you know, some challenges on construction, manpower and supply chain remain. But I think those challenges are the smallest of the challenges that I, I've said. So next year, I'm a lot more hopeful that construction volumes will be better, because, you know, projects are launched this year, and we are planning to launch five projects this year, which we have launched three, two are getting launched in Q4, so we will have enough room to do construction next year.
That's helpful. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Himanshu Upadhyay from o3 Capital. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hi, congratulations on, on good set of numbers. I had, one or two questions, okay? First was, on the project launches, okay, especially in Gurgaon, and where we are seeing successes, okay? And next phases are, to be launched. Are you replanning those projects? So in terms of, larger size of next phase of those projects or anything you are, reevaluating or reworking, or how are you thinking on that? Because if the momentum is strong, why not a slightly higher, larger phase of, the launches, okay. So this was one thing.
Okay. Himanshu, I think we made a mistake like this of launching the very high side phases earlier, when the market momentum was high, and then we got saddled with unsold build, built inventory, which took a bit. So we just want to be careful around that. To us, like a 4 lakh sq ft, nearly 4 lakh sq ft phase size is quite large itself. And as we see momentum, one is always free to launch another phase instead of increasing the size of the phase. So we have, as we sold phase 1 out, faster than we expected in Amara. Phase 2 launch, we have received RERA for phase 2, and we should launch Amara phase 2 also, pretty soon. And then take that up as we go along.
I think, that's, that's the thought process that we have right now.
On the launch, what are the prior top launches or priorities in next 12-15 months now? Can you give some idea on that?
We have two, we have two launches in Q4, which are fresh projects. Phases. So Ashiana Amara phase two, I will not talk about, you know, phase launches are a separate thing. From project perspective, we are launching Ashiana Ekansh in Jaipur and Ashiana Prakriti in Jamshedpur. These are two big launches in this quarter. And in the next financial year, we have five launches planned. Two in Jaipur, which is the land in Bhankrota and the land in Murlipura. In Jagatpura. We have also planned launches of senior living in Chennai. There are two projects, one at Mahindra World City and other at Nemili. And Ashiana Amodh in Pune, which is also a senior living project that we plan to launch.
And that's the main new five project launches that we are planning. Phase launches will be over in Amara.
Okay. And one thing, in terms of deliveries, okay, is there? We had certain phases where we said it may take more time, okay, or one or two quarters. Are we running on time? And is there any probability that we can do faster? Or, how, what's the progress on that side? Because-
So it's, so we have put expected customer handover dates in our sheet, okay? So, and the thing is, you know, a slippage of a quarter could happen because we get, by seeing something that is planned in March, if it goes to April, there is a quarter slippage in this, technically, but it's really a slippage of maybe 15, 20, 30 days. We are generally on track, but this, like, you know, something might go from one quarter to the other a little bit when it's closing. But generally, schedule of construction seems on track to what is, what we have reported.
On business development, lastly, then thank you, yeah. Just business development, what are we doing right now?
...On business development, you know, our focus is to get more work in Gurgaon and Jaipur, and to look at senior living projects elsewhere in the country, wherever we can expand to. Senior living is something we want to take to more locations. So that's just sort of the way we are looking at how to go about doing this in terms of BD. That said, as I said, right now land markets are a little have been frothy for a bit. I think good news is that on the land front, some signs of corrections are there. One clear sign is that the plotting market in Gurgaon has slowed down considerably. Prices have flattened and plateaued.
Volumes have started reducing. The oversupply is a situation on the plot size that I see coming, which I think should help land markets cool off a little bit. So that's where we are at in our perspective, in the way forward.
Yeah. Thank you so much, sir.
Thank you, Himanshu.
Thank you. Participants, if you have a question, you may enter star and one. We have the next question from the line of Rohit, from ICICI PMS. Please go ahead.
Yeah, hello. Good evening. So, my question was, so one was on these five launches that you have talked about, which you see, in the next couple of quarters in terms of square footage, what would be?
In terms of the future, next year projects that we are going to launch?
Yeah. So, these 5 launches that you just spoke about, these are going to be FY 2024 or the next, this quarter and next quarter, sorry, this one.
In Q4, we are launching two projects.
Okay.
These two projects put together are about 14 lakh sq ft. We are not launching the entire project because we launch phases. I would say the phase launches of these would be put together about seven odd lakh sq ft. Half the project should get launched in these two projects. Next year, all the projects put together that we have five is about 45 odd lakh sq ft, 45 lakh sq ft of total in projects, of which phase ones of all those projects put together would be about nine, ten lakh sq ft, like about 20%, maybe 25%. With new phases, new phases of existing projects, we plan to launch around another 3 million sq ft, a total of 3 million sq ft in FY 2024, so 30 lakh.
So, maybe around, you know, about 10-15 lakh sq ft will get launched in new projects, and about 10-15 lakh sq ft will get launched in existing new phases of existing projects.
Right. So just to summarize, you're saying that this quarter you'll see about 7 lakhs of launches, which will have another 7 lakhs of further phases. And overall, in FY 2024, you're looking at around 10-15 lakhs of new launches and a similar number for existing phases getting launched. Correct?
Correct. In this quarter also, we will have an existing phase of another 2-3 lakh sq ft also coming. Yeah.
Okay. So you'll launch close to about 1 million in this quarter, in Q4, correct?
Yeah, and about INR 3 million next year.
Understood. So, so I just wanted to understand, in terms of... So I mean, from a from. So this year you were given a pre-sales number of about INR 1,000 crore-INR 1,100 crore, which seems now fairly good on hopes. So I mean, how are you thinking next year? We are also looking at, you said 3 million sq ft kind of launches. And then obviously, the bigger question then is that, how are you sort of trying to backfill the the launches and the phases that you will launch in terms of our inventory, in terms of our overall land overall land inventory? So if you can just maybe share some perspective there.
So right now, you know, we have about a crore and 15 lakh sq ft to sell as of 31 December, right? With some future projects in terms of land available for future development not counting those which are in Bhiwadi, in Murlipura, in Kolkata, because I don't have clarity on that, clarity on those projects, when we'll get launched or what will happen on those. Outside of that, we still have a crore and about 50 lakh sq ft to sell. So we have enough to sell for a bit. It's not that we don't have anything going for another three, four. We have enough for around three, four years as the case may be. We will need to add more inventory to manage that for future.
That said, according to us, right now, land markets are a little frothy, and we will continue to keep quoting in the market, but not be very, very aggressive on pricing. I think that's the only thing that we are looking at from a strategic perspective, and in my opinion, the land markets are showing signs of correction and plateauing and flattening out. And hopefully, over the next, maybe 12 months, we'll be able to conclude some transactions.
Got it. And FY 2024 now, what are you thinking in terms of pre-sales? Anything, will you be able to maintain or grow?
We don't have a pre-sale number target for this for the next year. We'll get to know that over the next month. But, you know, pre-sales will might be a little volatile as we go along. With-
Right.
It's not necessarily going to be consistently one trajectory, depending on how launches are planned. But right now, FY 2024 to me looks good.
Right. Right. Sure. I'll come back with you. Thank you.
Okay. Thank you.
Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Priyank Singhvi from 5Y Investment Partners . Please go ahead. Mr. Sanghvi, if your line is muted, please unmute and speak.
Okay. Can you hear me now?
Yes, yes, please go ahead.
Yeah, thanks. So, Varun and Nishant, good numbers. Since we provide rental and retail services to the project in our existing projects to the residents, do we track the rental yields at the major locations of our projects?
We don't track rental yields, Priyank, exactly, but we do track rental values. So I wouldn't know the percentage. You'll have to do the math, but we do track rental values.
So, can you? What do you mean by rental value? You mean the absolute number at which-
How much, how much, rent will you pay per month to rent a flat?
Okay. So can you share those numbers, the current numbers for, say, Gurgaon, Jaipur, Chennai, and Bhiwadi?
Yes. Can you write to us separately to Radhika and to Investor Relations? We'll get that information across to you. We collate it from the different teams we have across.
Yeah, I'll do that. So when I write for the information, then, can you give the necessary information that I can calculate the rental yield as well?
We'll, we'll see what we can organize. But rental yields are typically in the, you know, 3% ±0.5% to 1%, you know. So like 2%-4% is the rental yield ranges across the bit. We'll try and share more information with you.
Yeah, I understand the rental yields don't vary much, but then, even between, say, 2%-4%, I think so the number, the, it doesn't sound big difference, but I think so it can, on a practical basis, that would, that can tilt a person from buying versus renting, at 4% along with appreciation, people may move from-
We'll share that information with you as much as we can.
Thank you so much.
We'll share.
Have a great quarter and next year.
Thank you, Priyank.
Thank you. We have the next question from the line of Kavit Joshi from Newberry Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi. Congrats on the good set of numbers. Area book has increased, and the realizations have also increased. Just two questions: Major of the realization increase, whether it is contributed by Gurugram, and whether we have able to increase the realization in Bhiwadi also?
Good. So a large contribution is coming from Gurugram this quarter, because, A, Gurugram has played a very large role in the area booking in the first place, and also in value of area booked overall. So that's had a very, very large contribution this quarter overall. So, you know, more than half the total square footage sold in the quarter came in from Gurugram, so that made a difference. Second, in Bhiwadi, we've been able to increase prices, not significantly in the premium home segment, but still, some upward movement. However, the project, Ashiana Advik, in senior living that was newly launched, has been launched at a higher price than Ashiana Nirmay.
Okay.
We are seeing about a 7-8% bump up there.
Great. On the land parcels that you are looking, you, you'll be looking, the preference would be again, to Gurgaon and, Jaipur then?
Yes, the land parcels we are looking at are for Gurgaon and Jaipur, and we are exploring other big cities for senior living as well. So those are the two places where we are concentrating.
Okay. And finally, on the Pune, the response, any progress over there in Pune? Because we are so—I think the portion is very little, I understand, but this quarter, but how is the response, any progress over there if you can?
Pune, we are fairly satisfied with the launch of Ashiana Malhar that had happened, selling a lakh and 20,000 sq ft till now. We had launched in the second quarter. I'm fairly happy with how Ashiana Malhar has done. Obviously, the second quarter was very heavy because of the launch. But if we keep this pace, I think we are on track in Pune. I think the bigger game in Pune is also going to be senior living for us. Ashiana Amodh is, like, in the final lap to get launched. We have plan sanctions, we have environmental clearances. We are about, we will, we are in the process of RERA.
So, I think that will also have a much bigger trend on for us in terms of Pune.
Okay, understand. Congratulations once again, and thank you.
Thank you so much.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, you may enter star and one. We have the next question from the line of Ankur Kumar from Alpha Capital. Please go ahead.
Hello, sir. Congrats for good set of numbers, and thank you for taking my questions. Sir, my question was on the revenue recognition. So we recognize, if I know correctly, when we give the project to the final consumer, which is the buyer. So in terms of this quarter, we see there is a good jump in revenue. So what are the key projects that we have handed over to the customers in this quarter?
Yeah, Vikas here, the key project on which deliveries happened in this quarter was Ashiana Daksh.
Ashiana Daksh.
Yeah. So bulk of the revenue was clogged due to Ashiana Daksh. It's a project in Jaipur.
But this was supposed to be handed over to customers in the Q1 of FY 2024, as per, as per the presentations.
Yeah, but we were in a position to complete it timely, issue our intimation of position and deliver, so we did that.
Okay. Sure, sir. And now, if I look at the ongoing project pipeline, we have two projects in Jamshedpur, which we are supposed to hand it over in this quarter, so Seher and Aditya. So they are on time?
So Ashiana Seher is on schedule. We have received occupancy certificate in Ashiana Seher. Ashiana Aditya, we have applied for occupancy certificate. If occupancy certificate comes soon, then we will be on track for this quarter. Otherwise, it might slip, you know, a month in, like, it might slip into April as well. But as of now, I think it's on track for March. But these things can go... You know, it's not as easy to predict the deliveries as we would like to. Although every quarter we do revisit and if we see any kind of indication that there might be a change, we do make the changes in the information that we share in the-
Okay.
Just, one more correction on Ashiana Daksh. If you're looking at the presentation, Ashiana Daksh, phase 2 and 3 are in the presentation for Q1 FY 2024. Ashiana Daksh, phase 1 has been delivered, and therefore, it's not in the ongoing project summary at all, and it's in the completed project summary, it will be there.
Sure. Sure, sir. And sir, what is your thoughts on the margins? What kind of margin should we expect on all these projects?
So, 2, 3 things. One is on the, what I would say are, gross profit margins. Gross profit margins, typically, we have underwritten 30%, okay? However, in the older projects, average gross profits are a little lower, maybe 27-28% is what we are getting. Our selling costs right now would be across the board. So in Aditya and Seher and Daksh, the selling costs are lower. We are averaging about 4% selling costs, and selling costs vary between 2-7, 2-8%, depending on the projects. Some outliers might be there from that range also, but, that's typically what we are experiencing. So. But I would say on average, about selling costs, about 4, 4 and a half quarter percent is what we are looking at.
General administrative costs are more fixed in nature, so, you know, they are on a fixed quantum. So that's the kind of margins we are looking at right now. My view and expectations are that we are in a margin expansion zone, and gross profit margins should have started improving and will, I think, continue to improve, and we should break that 30% barrier on a blended average basis.
Sure, sir. Thank you and all the best.
Not now, but, you know, in maybe two, three years from now, when we deliver some of the projects which have been launched in this year.
Sure, sir. Thank you and all the best.
Thank you.
Thank you. Participants, if you have a question, you may enter star and one. We have the next question from the line of Harsh Beria, a professional investor. Please go ahead.
Hi. Congratulations for the very good performance this quarter. I have a question on the Ashiana Prakriti project in Jamshedpur. It seems that our share of revenues has increased from 73.6% to 76.6%. I think in the last presentation, it was mentioned that 73.6, and in this one it's mentioned as 76.6. Is there something to call out there?
No, sir, I will, we'll have that corrected as there is a typo on this from our end. We'll get that data corrected. The first one was correct. 73.6 was correct. It's not exactly a typo, the structure is a little complicated, so sometimes we give a blended rate. There are some aspects of that we can recover some. We have some recoveries in the revenue share. So as in when the expected revenues go a little thing, it varies a little bit. We'll have this corrected. This was an error at our end, for this. Thank you.
Okay, thanks for that clarification. If I look at deliveries pipeline for FY 2024, a number of our Jaipur projects should get delivered, such as Daksh, Amantran, and Umang. What are the kind of gross profit margins at which these projects were underwritten?
Daksh, Seher, and Aditya, correct?
But I think in the slides you've also mentioned that some phases of Amantran and Umang would also get delivered in-
Amantran and Umang.
Okay.
So, again, these would have a blended average of about 27%. They vary between 25%-29%, I would say. Aditya is a little lower actually, what we are expecting. So this will vary a little bit, and future phases of most of these projects will have a better GP, because prices in the later phases have been higher. So in Ashiana Amantran phase three, our gross profit margin would be higher than Ashiana Amantran phase one. Similarly, Ashiana Umang phase six would be better than Ashiana Umang phase five, because we've been able to check better prices in future projects. So it's. So the even the gross profit margin will vary across phases a little bit.
Okay. So on a reported basis, I think our EBITDA margins would still... Or our reported ROE would still be in single digits in FY 2024. Is that understanding correct? Just on a reported basis.
We've been missed out on some deliveries, and therefore, our ROEs in a reported basis would still be high single digits, is what I would expect, where they are at right now. A little bit of depending what deliveries we get in, yeah.
Okay. And my last question is, it seems now we have enough pipeline that we have built over the last few years, and we are set for pre-sales of INR 1,000 crores-INR 1,200 crores. Do we see? And this is also the number which we reached in the past. Do we see a scope for expansion of this by 20%-35% each year, given that we have enough pipeline and we also have much more brand equity in markets such as Gurgaon now?
Two things. The best we have done before is INR 671 crore. Okay, so we haven't hit the, we never reached the INR 1,000 crore threshold.
Sorry about that. I meant the volumes. I meant the volumes. We had reached about 2.3 million in the past.
A little bit of change in the company in the first quarter pricing has also happened because you've gone into markets which are higher priced, right? And that has also happened in those things. So two, three things. One, more than also just increasing, we are also... What I would say, our business is cyclical. So what is it that we can do to increase the base, base revenues that we would have, if that's the way to put it? It's something that's what we are also considering and seeing what to do around that. And, I think one of the strategies that will play out is we will look to expand senior living. So as we do senior living more and more, I think overall base case, numbers should increase.
And hopefully, that will start playing out. And as you said, 25, those things will be important. We are also looking to dig deeper into Gurugram. We've started seeing success there after a lot of work. We also believe that Jaipur also, we can do more work than what we are doing today. So both opportunities for growth there remain. And we are looking for higher numbers. That said, as I've said, land prices were worrying me and still worry me. That said, and my sense is started coming that land prices have started plateauing, have started stabilizing, and it might be an opportune time to start looking at transactions again. And if that happens, we can scale that up further.
That's, that's the way we are looking at things. Overall, I'm excited about the business right now, really.
Just follow up on this is, what is the current proportion of our business coming from senior living, and how do you envisage this maybe two, three years out?
It, on a yearly basis, it varies anywhere between 10%-20%. It is the number that we are. We had, we had a little higher number this year. The percentage of senior living team is become lower because we, you know, launched, yeah, we launched other projects, and the base became larger. So Vikas, he is here suggesting to me on senior living, instead of tracking percentages, what we want to track is what kind of an absolute base case scenario in senior living are we able to hit. Just, just as an example, if suppose we plot 15 lakh, and out of that, we did 3 lakh sq ft of senior living, the percentage looks like a good, healthy 20%.
But then, if suppose the overall base goes up to, say, INR 20-25 lakh, that same INR 3 lakh looks like a smaller percentage... So it's the absolute number that we should ideally target, that how do we go from INR 3 lakh to INR 5 lakh or INR 6 lakh or even more than that? So right now, I think this year we will do about INR 150 crores in value of area booked in senior living this year is what my expectations are. I think we have a 3-4-year view to get this north of INR 300-400 crores is where at least we would like it to get to, if not more. And with higher overall margins as compared to what we would experience in non-senior living.
Get a little higher profit margin and better returns on our capital.
And so, just to simplify this, if we are doing INR 150 crore, I would imagine we would at least be doing profit margins of 50% on our senior living. So going ahead, the idea is to kind of try to get this profit pool, like, expand this profit pool and make that the base?
Correct. Yes, yes. It's to expand this profit pool and make it a bigger part of the pie. Yes, absolutely.
And that would hopefully reduce the cyclicality in our numbers.
Can you say that again, please?
This would hopefully reduce the cyclicality in the reported numbers going forward.
Absolutely, though, we would like to reduce more than the cyclicality in the reported numbers, cyclicality in the operations. Reported numbers are some cyclicality driven by accounting norms. That's not as the bigger worry. The bigger, you know, the bigger thing is the cyclicality in the real estate cycle itself, and protect ourselves from it.
Yeah. I appreciate that point. Also, is my understanding correct, that we would at least be doing the 15% profit margins in senior living housing?
Yes. So we don't do after-tax profit margins on project-by-project scenario or segmented. We look at it only at the gross profit level. Again, and these margins vary project to project, but what we are aiming for is senior living gross profit margins to be about, you know, 3-5 percentage points higher than general.
Is the selling cost also lower in the senior citizen projects?
No. Senior Living selling costs are similar, but higher at the launch of a new location, new project, and then trends downwards as and when we build a brand in the location.
Just so it follows a normal cycle, as across the projects. Okay, thanks for the clarification. That's it from my side.
Thank you.
Thank you. Participants, if you have a question, you may enter star and one. We have the next question from the line of Jimit Shah from Investore. Please go ahead.
Sir, can you give any guidance on deliveries for Q4 and for FY 2024? And, what about profitability? When can we achieve consistent profitability?
Hi, Jimit. So on terms of delivery, guidances are provided in the seventeenth slide of the deck.
Right.
that we have uploaded. Okay?
It says in which year we expect to hand over to the customer. That's the date, you know, that's the quarter for delivery you can expect, that will take.
So if I'm right, we will deliver 6 million sq ft or 6 lakh sq ft in Q4?
In Q4, that's... I would expect that, yes, we should have about 6 lakhs per foot. 6, 6.5 lakh sq ft is what we'll deliver.
1,000,000-1,200,000 sq ft in Q1?
So, I don't have the Q1 or 10 to 10. I don't see those numbers as 10 to 10, 12 lakh sq ft. If I total up this sheet, it's more like 6.5. And the Q4 number-
6.5 in Q4.
6.5 in Q4 you are expecting.
Even Q1, no, Q1 of FY 2024, if you look at, there are three deliveries planned in Q1 of FY 2024.
Yeah. Right, right, right.
Again, these deliveries can go one quarter here or there, a little bit, as I'm saying. You know, Ashiana Daksh phase two, it's slated for Q1, but there is a potential of delivering it in Q4 also of FY 2023 itself. Ashiana Aditya, which is slated for Q4 of FY 2023, it could go to Q1 of FY 2024. We deliver on getting occupancy certificates from the government, which can, you know, sometimes can get delayed more than we expect, okay? And sometimes come in faster than we expect. So I would just say that, keep that in mind.
Right, right. Okay, sir, thank you. So when can we expect consistent profitability?
Consistent profitability from a reported perspective, I think is a difficult thing because our deliveries can get bunched up. What we have had, though, over the last actually 2-3 years now, consistently a positive, good operating cash flows. From a metric to see whether the operations are positive, that's what we look at. If you have seen FY 2021, FY 21, 22—had both had great cash flows. 2022, 2023, we were a little slow because one blip in a quarter, where we front-loaded some cash flows for construction before launches and for advertising. But if you see that, that's the consistent number that we would like to track from an operational perspective. Reported profits can vary a little by here or there.
Okay, sir. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. Participants, if you have a question, you may enter star and one. We have the next question from the line of Harsh Beria, a professional investor. Please go ahead.
Hi, thanks for this follow-up. I think in the last call or the call before that, you were discussing about some capital return policies, such as buybacks and maybe dividends. Has there been more discussions about it by the board?
So on the buybacks and dividends and capital return thought processes, we have had a few discussions, at least at the executive board member levels, not at, if not at, the full board level. There have been discussions. We are discussing and deliberating and trying to wrap our heads around it. I think it will... It's a process that we are understanding it, whether we should do it or not.
Okay. And one question that I have is about the number of units that we have sold. So we have the current numbers in terms of pre-book volumes and pre-sales value. How many units have you sold so far this year?
I, it would be hard to say, but I would say 1,200 something. I think we're averaging about INR 70 lakh, 70 lakhs, a unit as a ticket size, somewhere around that. I wouldn't have the number right now, but you can, again, if you write to investor relations, we will send that data out to you.
Perfect. Thanks for that clarification, and that's it from my side.
Thank you, Harsh.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, to ask a question, you may enter star and one. As there are no further questions, I would like to hand the conference back to the management for closing comments. Please go ahead.
We would like to thank all of you for being on this call and being so patient with all the questions and answers. If we were unable to take any questions, please feel free to write to us directly or reach out to us directly. With that, we would like to conclude the call. A lot of the material we have spoken about is posted on our website, and you can also email your queries for any further clarification. Thank you once again for taking the time to join us on the call. Thank you.
Thank you, members of the management. Ladies and gentlemen, on behalf of Ashiana Housing Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your line. Thank you.