Ladies and gentlemen, good day and welcome to Caplin Point Laboratories Q4 FY 2026 earnings conference call hosted by 360 ONE Capital Market Private Limited. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode. There will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need any assistance during this conference, please signal for an operator by pressing star and then zero on your touch-tone telephone. Please note that this conference call is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Ms. Julie Mehta from 360 ONE Capital Market Private Limited. Thank you and over to you, ma'am.
Thank you, Sara. Good afternoon, everyone. On behalf of 360 ONE Capital, we would like to welcome you all to the 4Q FY 2026 conference call of Caplin Point Laboratories Limited. Today, we have with us senior management of the company represented by Mr. C.C. Paarthipan, Chairman, Mr. Vivek Partheeban, Vice Chairman, Mr. Ashok Partheeban, Vice Chairman, Dr. Sridhar Ganesan, Managing Director, and Mr. D. Muralidharan, CFO. I would now like to hand the conference over to Caplin Point management for the opening remarks. Over to you, sir.
Thank you, Julie. Thank you everyone for joining and welcome to our Q4 and FY 2026 results and earnings call. Please note that a copy of all our disclosures are available on the investor section of our website as well as on the stock exchanges. Also do note that anything said on this call which reflects our outlook for the future or which could be construed as a forward-looking statement must be reviewed in conjunction with the risks that the company faces. The conference call is being recorded. The transcript along with the audio will be made available on the company's website as well as the exchanges. Please do note that audio conference call is copyright material of Caplin Point and cannot be copied, rebroadcasted, or attributed in press or media without specific written consent of the company.
I would like to now hand over the floor to Chairman for his opening remarks.
Thank you. Good evening, welcome to our investors call. Let me first list out the differentiation that we have created in the last five years. Revenue doubles from INR 1,085 crore - INR 2,300 crore in 2025-2026. Liquid assets tripled, INR 928 crore- INR 2,726 crore. Free cash reserves tripled, INR 470 crore- INR 1,470 crore. EBITDA, PBT and PAT increased by 2.5 x. Investment in CapEx stands at INR 900 crore in the last five years. The gross contribution improved due to operational efficiency. Currently, we are building new factories for injectables. All the machines for the new factories are imported mostly from Germany and Italy. In the next two to three years, we'll have 17 injectable lines for U.S. and other regulated markets of the world. Our factories will be digitalized.
Every machine that enters the factory will have video master to make the qualifications easier and also for operational efficiency. Our video SOP, for which we filed the patent, has some unique features. It is visual before verbal. We do not depend on one QA or one QC or one production or one engineer. The knowledge will be stored in the video library. Our visual SOP ecosystem is both kinetic and non-kinetic. The kinetic side involves cameras, screen, voice-over, online monitoring and dashboards. Non-kinetic side, visual intelligence, behavioral discipline, institutional learning and memory, compliance consciousness, operator confidence and quality mindset. For example, China rise is a kinetic and a non-kinetic story. The present world affects the following: APIs, solvents, freight and lead time to destination, currency swings, energy unpredictability.
However, our model of keeping the goods next to the customer in the last 20 years has produced this compounding effect. Hence, we always keep the goods in our subsidiary warehouses for a minimum of six months' stock in the form of stock in the warehouse, stock in transit and work in progress. This anti-fragile model has really helped us for the best fundamentals, even in ROW markets of lifetime in the last five years. Now that we have substantial ANDAs, we mention to that we also buy for our business. In the next three years, we'll have maximum products registered in the highly regulated markets such as U.S.A., Mexico, South Africa, Brazil, Chile and Colombia. Further, we increased the number of women employees on our shop floor, which ensured the discipline.
The discipline that resulted due to women empowerment also guaranteed the integrity and quality, which are very, very essential for regulatory inspection. The financial freedom for the rural women made them comfortable at their home and also in our shop floors. We always arrange to pick them up from their houses for all the shifts, which ensures their safety too. During volatile period, the cash becomes a strategic oxygen. Our cash flow helps us to build new factories. We are also buying, as I told you before, more and more ANDAs for the U.S. market. We have been trying to buy a distribution company either in Chile, Mexico or Brazil. We are sure that we'll be able to reach the maximum products in this region. At that rate, we'll help our distribution company interest if we buy.
That will actually take us to the nook and corner of the private markets of these countries. This one is not the mainstay for big companies, hence the focus of our business will be more on private market in addition to the tender businesses. We'll also focus more on R&D for hormone injection and inhaler areas which are unique in the regulated markets. We're also on the lookout for a meaningful acquisition of a facility as we have enough cash resource in our system. Let me also convey that I read actually in BS, Business Standard 1,000 of March 2026. They mentioned that we, Caplin, stand at 673 among the 1,000 listed companies of India, which comprises of all segments in addition to pharmaceuticals. They also mentioned that we stand at 42nd position among the pharmaceutical companies.
When I looked into the details, I have found that 16 companies above us had lower profits than us. The statistics is based on the top line, not on bottom line or cash flow. Finally, when our revenue doubled and the liquid cash and liquid assets triple, we never had the extraordinary fundamentals that we are creating now. We only have one CP-I factory with three old lines and two new lines. Now that we are going for a massive infrastructure expansion, as I told you that we would have 17 lines of injectable in the next two to three years. We would also have automation, digitalization, and visual SOPs. More ANDAs and more registrations, the regular market of regulated markets of LATAM entering in countries like Brazil and South Africa also will increase the prospects of our business.
The variety of injectables in the form of liquid injections, ophthalmic, PFS, bags, BFS, fill finish, lyo, onco injectable, hormone injectable will be there in the next two to three years' time, and will also take us to the next orbit, which is for sure. Finally, as you all know well, business in the formative years is the puddle of unknown unknown. When you develop the freedom for your business over a period of time, and you establish the KPIs through video SOPs, then it's simply going above and beyond. That is the deliberate growth. Thank you. Thank you very much.
Thank you, Chairman. Now I request Ashok to give us a few comments.
Thank you all, and welcome to our investor call. I'll be talking about our Latin American facts and a few points about how we've been growing in Latin America. I would like to start with Chile, which is our newest market. We have 135 products to the tune of $10 million for the next 18 months to be supplied. We have also received 135 registrations in Chile so far. We have submitted around 40 more products. Our private market is the most important in all the countries where we are. As Chairman mentioned, we have two candidates that we are looking to offer to buy that are two solid distribution companies that reach nook and corners of the country in Chile.
We have these two candidates because they actually have their own sales teams. They have their own logistic team also. We are currently doing bio-studies for more than 40 different products that are of very good margins and have very few players in Chile. I would like to move on to Central America, where we've been present since 2002. A peculiar thing about Central America and what happened during COVID was that a lot of independent pharmacies started growing a lot. During COVID, what they basically did was they just started opening pharmacies wherever they could find the space because a lot of people were going out of jobs and they put their savings into the businesses. We made sure that all these individual pharmacies survived.
If we did a recent inquiry into it, we found out that the shelf space for Caplin products are 41% in these individual pharmacies. While we were talking about this with the board, we want to start a liquid manufacturing facility. The reason for this is once we register all these liquids, our shelf space in these independent pharmacies will go from 41% to 57%. We are also getting into brand marketing in Dominican Republic, Guatemala and Nicaragua. We chose the central nervous system line where we already have bio availability done for more than 12 products, and we will be starting with that in September of this year. Going forward to Mexico, our biggest bet and our biggest market in Latin America so far. We've received 25 registrations so far.
We participated in eight different products for a two-year tender, which we won all of them. We also participated in a oncology tender with a partner of us from China who gave us four different products, and we won those products too. We plan to do a sale of around $4 million in the coming two quarters in Mexico. As you all know, we already purchased the land in Mexico to build our first factory in Mexico also because we get a 16% advantage over price when you participate in the tenders in Mexico. We will be having liquid ovules, suppositories, and a blister packing facility for tablets and capsules. This is the update from my side, and I would like to pass it on to Vivek. Thank you.
Thanks, Ashok. I'll just take a few minutes to very quickly brief everyone on our progress in the U.S., which is continuing to be one of the most important pillars of our growth and long-term strategy. As many of you would have seen from the results, FY 2026 has been a very strong and meaningful year with progress on almost all parameters. You know, this is from a few years ago, we were a cash burn, EBITDA negative company, and today we completed around 470% growth with EBITDA that sort of mirrors or comes very close to the parent company's numbers, which have been benchmarked amongst companies of our size. We're very happy and proud to report that. On the product front, this has been a standout year for us.
We've received approvals for 10 ANDAs in the last four quarters. We've also acquired another 15 ANDAs with five in Caplin One main, taking our total tally as on date to 60 ANDAs as of this morning. Importantly, this expansion is not just in numbers, it's also in depth because we cover, you know, the entire gamut of sterile products. You know, we have products which is in vials, in prefilled syringes, in IV bags, in three-piece dropper bottles for ophthalmics. We are now getting into cartridges. We're also getting into blow-fill-seal. Not only are we showing good progress with the products that we have been doing, we are getting into sort of uncharted territory for Caplin Point as we get into some of these complex technologies.
In addition to U.S., we will start seeing some meaningful revenue out of non-U.S. markets in the coming few years as well, because we've already filed 54 products globally in non-U.S. markets such as Canada, Europe, Australia, South Africa, et cetera, and we'll start to see some progress there. From a capacity standpoint, as Chairman said, we are building phase III. It's at a very advanced stage, and we're also expanding capacities internally in phase I and II with expansion of our IV bag line to three times the capacity. It's a very niche area where we have multiple products already approved.
As we get into the slightly more complex platforms, this opens up new opportunities for us when we put up our retail arm of the company shortly. This, I think, would be a good time to touch upon Caplin's own label in the U.S. A lot of people are very skeptical about Caplin launching our own label because our B2B business was doing so well. People were a little bit skeptical saying that this might, you know, distract our partners and this might probably, you know, show some degrowth. Very happy to say that in our first full year of operations, we've nearly touched INR 100 crore in revenue.
We were about $11 million+ in revenue with our own label, and we've done this with no degrowth whatsoever in the B2B business as well. We had launched 30 products under our own label in the last year, and another 15 products is going to be launched in the coming year. We have weekly ordering from the four largest wholesalers in the U.S. and pretty much most of the large IDNs that do business in injectables are our customers right now as we move from strength to strength. I would say that in summary, our U.S. business is transitioning from a phase of foundation building to one that is scaling and growing in depth.
You know, with a very strong pipeline, expansion of capacities, entry into complex technologies, et cetera, we are very well positioned for sustained and profitable growth in the years ahead. I would like to request our CFO to throw some light on the numbers before we open up for questions.
Yes. Thank you. Thank you, Vivek. Good afternoon to all who have taken time off to take part in this investor call post FY 2026 results. The results have been highly gratifying, and we are pleased that we have done well across all parameters. The numbers are already there with you for a couple of hours now, and we'll be glad to clarify your queries on the results. Instead of going over the numbers again, we'd like to present a distinctive financial point for your consumption. One, with an exceptional balance sheet, the compounding effect has happened this year. Our net worth expanded by about INR 748 crores.
During the year from INR 3,366.31 crores from INR 2,086 crores in the previous year. This is 26% in one year. That is, this signals strong intrinsic value creation by the company. Massive Forex Translation Reserve uplift is the hidden value that has accrued to us in the form of our net worth as well. Forex assets is at $177 million against liability of $22.2 million. As you all know that we are a 100% export-oriented company and assets out number the liability. This has resulted in an FCTR movement of over INR 141 crores, which has gone directly into the reserve of the company. Third point will be, as already Chairman put it, cash position zero leverage.
We continue to strengthen our balance sheet, INR 1,421 crores in cash and INR 2,728 crores in liquid assets. This strength provides us with significant strategic flexibility as chairman also put it that we are on the lookout for meaningful acquisition. Earnings quality and cash conversion. CFO remained strong at INR 523 crores, representing 80% of the cash conversion of PAT. This shows profits are real cash, not only in books. Profit growth of 20% ahead of revenue growth of 13%. Profitability grew materially ahead of revenue growth, reflecting operating leverage and improving business mix. Next is CapEx. Before CapEx, I would like to inform the investors that our CapEx R&D spend this year has been INR 101 crores.
It's almost 5% of our turnover. This is the first time we have crossed INR 100 crores in R&D spend. CapEx incurred for the last year is INR 238 crores. Just a summary of the ongoing project. Out of the INR 14 crores what we've envisaged, we have capitalized INR 154 crores. CWIP INR 143 crores, primarily representing what is our injection plant in Kakkalur, oncology injection plant, which incidentally has been capitalized in the month of April post our MOH approvals and whatnot. Advances what we expect. We have talked about enhancing on the line capacity. We already have paid an advance of INR 109 crores for various imported equipment.
The balance about INR 500 crores will be incurred in the next 18-24 months from out of our own cash generation. Fixed assets turnover ratio, people were asking it last time. Gladly informed it is about 3.91 x. The inventory held in market and CWIP potential, which we have a potential of realizing about INR 900 crores in terms of sales. Our strategy to keep the inventory closer to the customer and then is paying high dividends. This excludes, of course, inventory in the U.S. facility, in U.S. factory and the warehouse there. To summarize, FY 2026 was not only a growth year, but also a year of strong balance sheet compounding. Net worth increased by INR 748 crores.
Operating cash flow above INR 500 crores. Liquidity pool strengthened to INR 2,720 crores while remaining virtually debt-free. This is all from me for the first instance. We'll be more than glad to take any questions. Over to you, Vivek .
Thanks, Muralidharan . If we can open up the floor for questions now, please.
Sure. Thank you very much, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, we will now begin the question and answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may enter star and one on their touchtone telephones. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may enter star and two. Participants are requested to please use only their handsets while asking a question. We will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Aman Soni from Seven Alpha. Please go ahead. Mr. Soni, your line is unmuted. Please ask your question.
Hello, hello. Am I audible?
Yes, now you are audible. Please go ahead.
Yes.
Yes.
Right. Yeah. Right. Thanks for the opportunity. Good evening and congrats for a good set of numbers. The question is on with growing cash generation, how does management is going to prioritize between the inorganic opportunities and implement the CapEx and the higher shareholder payouts, sir?
As I told you before, the inorganic opportunity, in fact, we are waiting in the wings. It can be in the form of actually buying the ANDAs, which of course we have been doing actually. We are waiting for more and more opportunity on that aspect. As I told you, the distribution company will also open up a bigger opportunity for us for the private market, especially in Latin America. See, going for acquisition for the sake of acquisition, I'm sure you would not actually it would not advise us to go for actually acquisition without without going for a meaningful acquisition. That will be a vanity, you know. That I don't think, you know, it's advisable.
As I told you, what is important today, especially in the VUCA world, we are going for the completion of facilities, and we'll be completing most of the facilities, you know, that are injectable, which you are aware, you know, there are hardly three or four companies who would have 16 or 17 lines of injectable actually in India. When we complete all these injectables, all these injectables we are aiming to go for U.S. and other major markets. That means that's a great opportunity which will open up in the form of not only the, not only for our own products to be sold in U.S., but also in the form of CMO. Second one is we are concentrating more on R&D for complex products. This is one of the things which is very important, as you know well.
The third one, we are increasing the registration in many of the larger geographies. These are few things which are very important. If you need any other questions, please tell me. I would be able to answer to your question also.
Got it. Got it, sir. Secondly, on the receivables part, receivables have grown materially ahead of the revenue or revenue growth. Is this timing-related thing or any other reasons for that, sir?
I could not hear properly. Vivek, are you able to-
Yeah. Yeah, request CFO to take this, please.
Yes. As we have mentioned in the press release also, while the effect results which I talked about, improving my network, this also increases my receivables. If the out of 136 days what we reported, 11 days is attributable to this FCTAR which has gone into receivables, it's not going to remain permanent. But for this my receivables would have been 125 days. We have been forming 150. As rightly said, timing also is one of the factors that have gone. Last quarter we have won a big tender in El Salvador, and a lot of supplies have gone into that which are in the process of being received in the market. The receivables will be collected by end of Q2.
This is a big tender and most of the supplies have gone during February, March, and then we are in the process of receipt there. This is one of the factors that also contributed to the increase in receivables.
I would like to add one more. The currency in El Salvador is U.S. dollar. When I was working in this Latin American market, I used to see Colombians giving lot of credit in Ecuador, where the currency is dollar. The currency of Colombia used to get weakened, and they allow deliberate actually. Deliberately, they used to do credit more so that, you know, their earning is also more because of the depreciation of their own currency. Here, of course, we don't want to do it that way.
Even if the delay that happens, you know, from El Salvador is going to contribute to actually in the form of increased profit for our company. As you know well, the dollar actually is getting strengthened and our rupee is getting weaker. In no way this is going to affect our bottom line also.
Understood. Understood, sir. Just last question on the outlook for FY 2027, in the terms of the top line and specifically, on the kind of margins. These are very exceptional margins we are doing. How much structural are these margins are going at, sir?
We will continue to do well. As I told you in course of my speech, the best is yet to come. Maybe the best will come after two to three years. If you look at actually the past, in the last five years, I don't want to repeat again actually what all tripled, what all doubled and all you have seen. The next three to five years is going to be the best period for Caplin Point. Of course, we will do well actually, but it's difficult to tell anything on a quarter-on-quarter basis or on a yearly basis. Whatever we say, everything actually is happening in the form of building the factories or whatever it is. You don't see many companies of our size building so many factories without a debt.
After having invested in the CapEx, still we have enough cash flow that will also help us to go for inorganic growth, as you have mentioned. We are waiting for actually that kind of opportunity. It will happen. When it happens, you know, whatever you expect in the form of the growth can come even in actually six months or one year also if you go for inorganic actually opportunity. Again, we don't want to simply grab anything and everything. Rather, we would prefer to wait and actually go for something which is meaningful. Is it okay, please?
Yes, got my answer, sir. Thank you. Thank you very much, sir. Thank you very much. All the best to the team.
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you so much.
Thank you. Participants with questions may enter star followed by one on your handsets. The next question is from the line of Ahmed Madha from Unifi Capital. Please go ahead.
Thanks for the opportunity. I have few questions. Firstly, the revenue growth in the LATAM Africa business, I mean ex-U.S., has been pretty strong. Last few quarters we added close to high single-digit, mid-single-digit growth, and this quarter is relatively exceptional. Can you give some sense what has led to high growth in the specific geographies?
Sometimes markets fluctuate, and whether it is B2B or B2C, generic business is based on supply and demand. You know, we have an advantage of keeping the goods actually in the warehouse. If the profitability is not there in our sales, we will not sell. Selling for the sake of selling doesn't make any difference to the company. Sometimes we wait and actually do it. Sometimes, of course, we bundle it and sell also. At that point of time, there is a possibility that profit may come in single digit also. Overall, if you look at it, as you rightly said, the overall profitability for the year 2025, 2026, I think it's is fairly good. Am I right?
My question was from the front of revenue growth. If I look at the revenue growth of non-U.S. piece of the company, that revenue growth percentage was in single digits for last few quarters, and we have spoken on the call that it will take couple of years for us to jump up, and you have been doing a lot of initiatives on Chile, Mexico, and other markets. The question was that this growth was higher in this quarter. Is there any specific factor which is leading?
No, no.
Yeah.
One of the reasons I can even highlight. See, today we don't have a depth of orders. The facilities we have is running actually at the optimum capacity. If you look at actually our business, you will see at least 40%- 50% of it is in the form of actually outsourcing for the LATAM market. We don't want to especially, you know, when we go for outsourcing, it's not easy to get a good facility where you can do the outsourcing very successfully. That's also one of the reasons for us to actually limit the top line. At the end of the day, what is important, whether it is a Latin American growth or, you know, U.S. growth, overall only you'll have to look at it. Am I right or something?
The Latin American growth will start for good or will start flourishing actually after we complete the registrations, mainly in markets like Mexico. That, you know, as Ashok told, the business of Chile will start from this year, and it will start actually increasing in many folds over a period of time.
Yeah, I think.
Chairman, I just want to supplement one point.
Yeah.
I just like to supplement one point. The increase what you are referring to, the growth from INR 452 crores- INR 460 crores this quarter, especially just now you were answering the previous question on the LATAM. It has a bearing on this aspect. We did supply a lot of material close about INR 50 crores-INR 55 crores during the quarter to El Salvador. The tender is valued at about $15 million, and most of the parts have gone from India. That is the reason, this growth in Latin America has showing a better than normal growth in the offices.
Yeah.
We grew this even though U.S. has grown about 20%. Mix is slightly distorted, but this is the reason.
Yes, yes. Tender business, of course, we had to rush and then export everything. Probably that's the reason you are telling. Okay. Okay. I didn't get it.
Okay.
That's it.
Okay. Yeah. Fair, fair. Not at all. On the U.S. side, this year, I mean, we have done exceptionally well in terms of growing the business and having our own label. From here on with whatever ANDAs we have acquired and organic approvals we have got about 10 of them. If we try to assume the growth rate of 20%, 25%, that sort of run rate in U.S. shall continue till we reach larger numbers.
Yeah. We're very confident that current numbers can be sustained. We are confident that it can grow from here even further. The most important thing as what Chairman was saying, is we are not seeing a dearth of orders. We have an order book that's full for another six months almost. You know, in fact to an extent where some of these lower margin, very high volume products, we're not even taking them on board, you know. I think we are certainly on track to see a very strong next year for CSL. Very strong next few years for CSL with all the capacity coming through.
When it comes to our own label, the target we've set for ourselves is to double what we did last year. I'm fairly confident that we should be in a position to achieve that.
Would you like to sort of give a range for number? What sort of growth we can achieve at least for the next year?
Of course, since we don't, we.
You are able to give guidance, but I just saying this is Yeah. Yeah.
Okay. When it comes to what current growth was, I think it was close to 30%. I think, we can see another 25%-30% next year on the overall Caplin Steriles business. When it comes to our own label, we did close to INR 100 crore. The idea is to touch or go very close to INR 200 crore for the coming year.
Sure. That helps. last question from my side. In terms of, you've spoken about acquisition, considering an acquisition even last quarter and similar this quarter. and you spoke about obviously buying ANDAs and, that sort of profile. Considering the amount of, cash balance we have, what profile of acquisition you'll consider apart from buying ANDAs, which I'm assuming won't be a large ticket size. If you can give some sense of the profile of, a company we are looking for.
Yeah. When it comes to acquisitions, there are many things. Actually, of course, being our, being a listed company, all of our reserves, surplus, everything is in public domain and for everyone to see. You won't be surprised when I tell you that almost on a weekly basis we receive a few opportunities, right? There are some opportunities that come in the U.S., there are some that come in Latin America. One or two, in fact, come from the domestic market as well, you know.
The ones that we will be targeting is similar to what Chairman was saying, is good distribution entities, especially in countries where we are very early, or we are very new, or in countries like the U.S., where it makes meaningful sense in terms of the knowledge that we gather. When it comes to ANDAs, I'm looking at it personally, we'll be very opportunistic in terms of what we can acquire because we need to sort of strike the right balance between making sure that we launch all our approvals on time and at the same time not run into any sort of dirt in the pipeline.
Typically for most companies, including ours, the R&D outstrips the capacity, right? In the injectable, an area of high criticality in terms of compliance and manufacturing, scaling up is not as easy as it is in the oral solids. Taking that into account, we'll be very opportunistic in terms of adding some ANDA in place of doing exhibit batches for new products and stuff like that. That's what we've done the last year. We are actively working on another one right now. Hopefully, that should get over the line in the coming weeks.
Sure. Thank you so much, and all the best.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. Participants with questions may enter star and one on your handset. The next question is from the line of [Chirag] from MS Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi. Good afternoon. Thank you for the opportunity and congratulations, Vivek, Chairman, for a strong set of numbers. I just wanted to first ask a question on the Central American, Latin American operations, and we have the chance to hear from Ashok, Vice Chairman also. If you can just elaborate a little bit on the operations in that region. A couple of annual reports ago, we heard that you have almost 14,000 daily touchpoints. How much has that grown to. We also believe that there's a split between, you know, smaller wholesalers and distributors of around 60%, direct pharmacies, 20%. Could you just overall give us a view of the operations in the Central American market, if that's possible?
Ashok
Yeah.
Sure.
Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, we Every time we open a new country, obviously the number of points that we touch actually increases. We opened Chile this year in a, in a very big way and, obviously, there are four big chain pharmacies in Chile and, on top of that, 30% of the pharmacies are independent. We obviously do not reach all the independent pharmacies right now through our own sales team, but we reach them through a distributor that we sell to. I cannot give you an exact number on how many points we have grown by.
What we are doing is, as I said, our shelf space in these individual pharmacies where we, that we sell to in Latin America is about 41%. What we are trying to do is strengthen our shelf space, to get to 50%-55%, where we are completely indispensable to these pharmacies. Does that answer your question?
Yes, that was helpful. Ashok, if you can also sort of give us a little bit of an understanding on what proportion of our customers would be still distributors or middlemen, what proportion would come from pharmacies, institutions, or smaller wholesalers?
Okay. In the whole of Central America, the business that we do, about 18%-20% is institutional, which is government. The rest is completely private market. What we do have to do in Central America, in these countries, is you have to have two co-distributors at least, so that they reach to those pharmacies that cannot sell in the ticket, everyday ticket sale, which is, let's say, we only do around about 300 products. A pharmacy that does, let's say, a sale of $150 per day cannot buy all the 300 products. They, they have to buy through our co-distributors. You know, each of these countries, we have two or three strong co-distributors.
They sell around about 10%-12% of our sale, and the rest of it all is us going directly to the pharmacies.
Understood. Just to clarify, you said 10%-12% through those distributors?
Yeah. 10%-12% of our sale is through the co-distributors.
Understood.
20% is through the government, and the rest is all directly to our, to the pharmacies. When I say the rest, it also includes the chain pharmacies also.
Understood. Very helpful. Thank you. The second question is just doubling down on a previous participant's question on the receivable days. I understand Ashok mentioned that, you know, a part of that is just FX change between the time the sale was booked and I guess, the closing of the books. That still brings us down to 125 days, which is at least 25 days higher than what we have seen in the past. Is this how we think the new normal would be? Is it a strategic call or how do we understand that?
Yeah. [Chirag], in the past as well, we've been, we've been giving the messaging out that we are comfortable with somewhere around the 100-120 days range. Now, we are still within that range pretty much, you know. As CFO and Chairman was saying before, we entered into a tender, in one of our Central American markets, very highly profitable, tender by the way, where we needed to make sure that the supplies were done within 60 days anyway. It was a fairly large tender as well. Those numbers sort of moved it up by five, six days. Typically, I think we are happy to be anywhere between the 100, 110, 120 days, and that's a sweet spot for us.
The larger picture that I want everybody to really see is we've been consistently able to invest hundreds of crores into our own CapEx, our own distributions. Despite all of that, we are still increasing our reserves and surplus by a considerable number every year. You can imagine that even if we do see another five days or 10 days increase in the future, we're going to be okay with it because when that money comes in, more often than not, it comes in at a higher exchange rate compared to what it was previously, right? The cash flow, I would say that we are benchmarked amongst peers. We are probably better than most other companies in the same segment. We're not worried about that.
Anywhere between, like I said, 100- 130 days even is probably still okay for us going forward. Yeah. Understood. Thank you.
Just to add to what Vivek said, our riskier writing off debts has been virtually negligible and our cost is zero. We have not had any bad debts in the past which we could not recover. There is only a delay but not writing off. Most of these, the receivables now attributing to higher number is from government. For sure if you want the receipt, we will take few weeks here and there.
Understood, yeah. Thank you so much for the opportunity. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Richa from Equitymaster. Please go ahead.
Thank you for the opportunity. I hope I'm audible.
Yes.
Yes, ma'am.
Yes.
Yeah. My question was, you know, my question was on, you know, what's happening around the world, the Middle East tension. I know that's not your core market, but, you know, being closer to the customer helps to overcome the short-term disruptions. How do you think, if at all, this could impact the business or margins or prices or maybe because of economic slowdown in the end, geography, if it could have any impact on your business and any vulnerabilities that you may want to highlight?
I would like to actually give an answer on this. In fact, if you look at our past business, we in fact increased the business. Our profitability and everything actually went up only during COVID time, after COVID and during COVID. What is happening today, as our prime minister said, is something closer to COVID. We all have to actually follow the frugal ways and we started addressing is very, very correct. As a businessman, we should not allow the crisis to go waste. How we are managing it, as I told you before, for the next six months, we don't have to produce any products that we have to sell in the market in Latin America. The same way, even in our U.S. market, the goods are already available there in the U.S. warehouse.
In addition to this six months, we also bought raw materials. Yes, there are some increase in the prices, it's not going to impact us. The reason being, when the prices go up, if you have already agreed actually to a price to a customer in the form of a B2B business or an LC, of course what happens is, you know, you'll have to honor it, honor the commitment, that's how you lose money. In our case, we are selling actually through our own actually subsidiaries, through our own warehouses. That's not going to create any major impact to our business. On the contrary, this will open up the opportunity. The reason being, A, these smaller geographies where we are today in Latin America, the big players are only into brand marketing. I'm talking about multinational.
Second, small companies who want to enter in the form of actually stock and sale. They all actually sell it to some importer. They will be very worried if they supply to the importer, they may or not, they may or may not pay. The reason being most of the transactions today happens in credit. Nobody actually pays cash for a generic. If you have your own warehouse, if you have people, like, you know, we have more than 700 people working in the whole of actually Latin America. It helps us to collect the money. We are there for the last 20-22 years. Coming to currency crisis also, Guatemala is very stable. There is nothing in the form of no fluctuation in the currency.
Coming to Nicaragua and Honduras, maybe slight fluctuation in the form of 3%-4%. The rest of the markets in like El Salvador and then Panama, Ecuador, the currency is dollar, so it's not going to create any issue. Costa Rican currency also is stable. Chile also for the last four, five years the currency is stable. Is there anything else you want me to answer?
Yeah. Thank you. Thank you so much and all the best.
Thank you, madam. Thank you very much.
Sure.
Thank you. Participants, if you have any questions at this time, please enter star and one . The next question is from the line of Prince from Family Office. Please go ahead.
Thank you for taking my question. I have just one question. Going forward, can the company maintain around double digit revenue growth rate and the PAT margin between 25%-29% consistently during 2025, 2027, 2028 and 2029?
Vivek?
Yeah. As explained previously, we remain very confident that the business will continue to do well. We need to be patient for the next 12- 18 months at least because there is a period of stabilization in pharmaceutical. Always what happens is there is a I'm getting an echo from someone's line.
Prince, is your line on handset or the speaker mode? Could you please switch to the handset?
Yeah.
Yes. Thank you.
With all things when it comes to pharmaceuticals, especially the regulated market, things take a lot more time because your product development to approval itself takes around two years plus. As we enter into the larger markets of Latin America and the U.S. itself, things are going to take a little bit longer. Once it starts, you know, fructifying, I think it'll be a very sticky business. 18 months and beyond, we feel that these numbers are going to get back to what they were before. I'm talking about Latin America. What we are seeing today in terms of the bottom line is, please take into account that we have certain segments of our facilities that are not breaking even.
Yes, if you're talking about our API unit, and if you're talking about Amaris Clinical, which is basically completely backward integration. Despite all these drag on our bottom line, we are still looking at 27%-28% PAT and 38%-39% EBITDA, which, in my opinion, at least from whatever I've seen in our size segment, nobody else has these numbers. With all these drags, if we can continue to maintain these numbers, you can imagine that, you know, 18-24 months beyond, these are going to be definitely maintained at the same level or potentially even inch up a little bit. I hope we've answered that.
Thank you, for the presentation. All the best.
Thank you.
Thank you. Thank you very much.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Ahmed Madha from Unifi Capital. Please go ahead.
Thanks for the opportunity, again. Just one question on forex gains. Can you quantify what was the gain on foreign exchange booked in Q4 as well as full financial year, if CFO sir can help?
The unrealized gain will be to the order of.
One second. One second.
The year as a whole, we have gone ahead about INR 20 crores-INR 21 crores of realized gain over the year. The remaining about INR 40 crores-INR 60 crores will be unrealized gain, which is reflecting in the P&L.
Out of INR 160 crore other income, what number will be roughly, forex gains for the full year, if you can, give just one number?
We can even write that to you, Ahmed, so that we don't take everybody's time on this, please.
Yeah. No problem. No problem. Just another question considering your answer on the volatility part. Considering the volatility in RM costs in general, obviously a lot of forex volatility, and assuming we are net beneficiary of the INR depreciation. Overall, considering everything, are we able to manage the current supply chain, raw material volatility, or has there been any issues? Considering we have a fair amount of dependency on China, how would you judge the current situation? If you can give some remarks on that, please.
Yeah.
Go ahead, sir.
Yeah. Our business in the form of outsourcing is much lesser compared to actually what we used to do in China and all. There was a time it was more of a natural hedging. Now that of course, I think it's in the region of 25%- 30%. Coming to the volatility, see, the global economy is drowning in debt rather than water. That of course, you know, that will happen. Coming to us, what is happening to big companies need not happen actually the same way to a company where the fundamentals are unique or the business model is unique. If you try and do something which is unique, then of course you will not allow this crisis to go waste. That's what I called before our ship. Prices are going up, no doubt.
There is definitely going to go up also. When it happens, it is the model that makes actually, you know, you to make money or lose money. The moment we understand that the price of a material which we bought is higher, we also actually define the price at which we have to sell the product in the market. That's why we do not face any major issues, to be honest with you.
Yeah. Just to quantify, obviously, you know, with regards to input materials like glass and plastics and all of those things, we keep getting, you know, increases from suppliers. Of course, we fight all of them back and then try to rationalize it to the lowest amount possible. Just to give you an idea, the highest impact product for us that we have, we've been doing, especially for the U.S., is less than 1.5% - 2%. The COGS I'm talking about that's gone up by, you know. We haven't yet seen any major negative impact in the form of input materials going up significantly.
Yeah. That's it. Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Pavan Kumar from RT Capital. Please go ahead.
Sir, can you comment on the CapEx that is expected in FY 2027 and 2028, and what would that be spent on?
When it comes to CapEx, the residual CapEx that we have is the phase III of our injectable plant. We call it internally as COL 2. Also, two other ones, which is, we are considering a much larger capacity oral solids and derma facility in Pondicherry next to what we call our CP-I plant, our existing plant. Thirdly, we also will be completing our oncology API plant. In addition to this, we are drawing up plans for our building in Mexico. That should happen sometime by Q3 or Q4. I mean, it will start by Q3 or Q4. When it comes to exact numbers, CFO, any numbers you can shed some light on?
Yeah. As I mentioned during my opening remarks, out of the envisaged CapEx plan of close to INR 1,000 crores, INR 510 crores remain to be spent. The rest have been spent. They are made in the form of CWIP. The capitalized section is INR 150 crores and INR 143 crores are from CWIP, and we have paid advances to the extent of INR 109 crores for various lines that are being imported. This leaves about INR 500 crores, give or take some this year. This INR 510 crores will be spent over the next 18-24 months. This is the plan as of now. As we expected, this does not contemplate the inorganic growth. It does not contemplate Mexico.
It does not contemplate the Chile warehouses and the quality control lab, which we are planning right now. These are all not even on control. It's at the drawing table right now. Once we get some clarity, probably we'll update in the next quarter. The INR 510 crores for sure will be the amount that is already identified and will be spent in the next 18-24 months.
Okay, sir. Fine. Thanks.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Julie Mehta from 360 ONE Capital. Please go ahead, ma'am.
Thank you for the opportunity. Firstly, congratulations on a great set of numbers to the entire team at Caplin.
Thank you.
My question basically, it caters to the U.S. business. The U.S. business has now picked up decent scale and size. If we want to understand the growth breakup, how much of that would be organic and how much would you still have to account for through the new launches, be it the ones coming in or the pipeline or the ANDAs that we are yet to acquire? If you could also, you know, share the EBITDA margin for CSL for FY 2025 and FY 2026.
Okay. On the breakup in revenue, I would say that more than 90% of the revenue has come from the older products that were already in the market. The 10 ANDAs that were approved over the period of the last 12 months, we've launched a couple of them, but the majority of it, especially the larger ones, are in the process of getting launched in the next few weeks. In addition to that, I would also suggest that 10, 15 ANDAs that we acquired from outside, we are in the process of launching them, which will only happen this year. You can assume that, like I said, around 90% of all the growth that you've seen is from products that were already launched in the market.
This is actually a good statistic as well because, when most other companies, I think are somewhere in the region of, you know, their average earnings per ANDA, I believe, if I'm not wrong, is somewhere around INR 800,000- INR 1 million. Whereas ours is almost twice that number, more than 50% higher itself. Of all the products that we have approvals for, we were just discussing about it yesterday, literally just one product is the one that we've technically taken off the market because there were no sales. Every other product continues to show good sales, and we continue to receive repeat orders. When it comes to the EBITDA margin for CSL, request Sathya to answer this, please.
Sure. Thanks, Julie . Thanks for your question.
The EBITDA of the CSL for financial year 2025-2026 is INR 142 crores, which is 30%, compared to INR 102 crores last year, which is 27.9%.
Okay. Sir, for the 4Q, if you could break out specific numbers for 4Q?
Sorry, can you please summarize for 4Q?
Okay.
For the 4th quarter, you're asking the EBITDA?
Yes, sir.
Yeah, it is, 33%.
Okay. No, thank you. The last question is I may be asking then. Currently you are almost on a last leg of CapEx now. Do we have any plans for CapEx going forward in the next 24 months, or will that largely be maintenance and nothing that major? Just want to confirm.
As we just discussed, we have taken on close to INR 1,100 crore of CapEx, of which 50% is done, other 50% will be completed in the next 18-24 months. This doesn't take into account the ones that we are going to be planning in Mexico, Chile, et cetera. There is still certain amount of residual CapEx that needs to be completed. In addition to that, I will just give you some statistic. Last year, we were able to add close to INR 400 crore to our surplus. Right? That is over and above what was spent in terms of CapEx.
If you were to do some numbers over the last 18, over the next 18- 24 months, you can assume that despite the CapEx we will be putting up, the likelihood is that our reserves and surplus will continue to rise even further.
Okay. Sounds very helpful. Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, that was the last question. I now hand the floor over to the management for closing comments.
Yeah. Thank you to 360 ONE Capital Market and Rohit and Julie for conducting. Thanks to everybody that took time out to attend our call, and we hope to stay in touch with you in the future as well. Thank you.
Thank you very much.
Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you.
Thank you. On behalf of 360 ONE Capital Market Private Limited, that concludes this conference call. Thank you all for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines. Thank you.