Ladies and gentlemen, good day, welcome to the Alicon Castalloy Limited Q4 FY 23 Earnings Conference Call. As a reminder, all participant lines will be in the listen-only mode, there will be an opportunity for you to ask questions after the presentation concludes. Should you need assistance during the conference call, please signal an operator by pressing star then zero on your touchtone phone. Please note that this conference is being recorded. I now hand the conference over to Mr. Mayank Vaswani from CDR India. Thank you, over to you.
Thank you, Tanvi. Good day, everyone, and thank you for joining us on Alicon Castalloy Limited's Q4 and FY23 Earnings Conference Call. We have with us on the call today Mr. Vimal Gupta, Group CFO; Mr. Veerababu, Group COO; Mr. Shyam Agarwal, Chief Marketing Officer at Alicon Castalloy; Mr. Andreas Heim, Managing Director of Illichmann Castalloy; and Mr. Rajiv G upta, Head of Domestic Business of Alicon Castalloy Limited. Mr. Vimal Gupta will cover the financial performance for the quarter, following which Mr. Shyam Agarwal will walk us through the operating highlights. In order to share the developments in both the global and domestic markets, Mr. Andreas Heim and Mr. R Gupta will provide insights on these areas. Following the comments from the team, our Group COO, Mr. Veerababu, will give us a brief summary of the quarter gone by and cover the strategic imperatives.
Thereafter, we shall open the call for the Q&A session. Before we begin, I would like to point out that some of the statements made in today's call may be forward-looking in nature, and a disclaimer to this effect has been included in the earnings documents that have been shared with all of you earlier. I would now like to hand over the call to Mr. Vimal Gupta for his opening remarks. Over to you, sir.
Good afternoon to all our investors. Thank you for taking the time out to join our earnings call. I trust that all of you have had a chance to review our earnings documents, which were shared on 16th May. As we have indicated earlier, 2018-2019 was the best year in the last few years for the global auto industry. Our assessment is that the domestic industry has reached a performance level of approximately 84% in the financial year 2023 of the level set in 2018-2019. While the international auto industry is at about 88% level in calendar year 2022 of the base achieved.
At Alicon, our revenue performance in the financial year 2023 is around 130% of the benchmark that we had set in 2018-2019, clearly showcasing a different trajectory of performance when compared to global and domestic auto industry. This has been driven by the addition of new parts as well as the new customers. Our growth and transformation strategy over the last 5 years has been validated as we have reported our highest ever annual revenue of INR 1,405 crore in FY 2023, even in the backdrop of significant volatility over this period. The ambitious business transformation involves a strategic focus on multiple avenue for growth, which we have categorized into five pillars.
These pillars are continue to scale strategic products in the ICE business, addressing the opportunities from carbon neutral technology, including battery electric vehicles, hybrid electric vehicles, fuel cell and hydrogen cell technologies. Opportunities from structural parts or technology-agnostic parts which remain consistent no matter which fuel technology is used to power the vehicle. Non-auto business encompassing opportunities from sectors such as defense, energy, telecom, to name a few, where our competencies can be leveraged. Enhanced customer wallet shared through value add and combining products to offer our customers a one-stop solution. The progress we have experiencing can be attributed to the execution of our growth strategy. We have dedicated substantial resources to reshape our business model, becoming a more flexible and diversified organization that capitalizes on our key strengths.
Our international team have been actively engaging with customers, fostering deeper discussions to leverage our expertise in design, research and development and value engineering. Our proven track record validates the effectiveness of our processes and our reliability as a supplier. This is supported by the continuous increase in our order book and the acquisition of new and renowned clients. Moving on to the highlights of our financial performance for the fiscal year ending 31st March 2023. Alicon's best ever annual revenues of INR 1,405 crores in FY 2023 were higher by 30% year-on-year basis, significantly surpassing the industry growth. The revenue growth was driven by enhanced volumes compared to the previous year and start of production in certain new products. This positive trend was further supported by the improved contribution from our international subsidiary, Illichmann.
We also posted higher ever EBITDA of INR 157 crore, higher by 36% year-on-year basis. The EBITDA margin for FY 2023 stood at 11.2% against 10.7% in FY 2022, an increase of 46 basis points. New parts added with higher value addition have contributed to structurally improved EBITDA margin. Profit after tax of INR 51 crore is higher by 113% year-on-year basis. I am pleased to share that our board of directors have approved a interim dividend of 50% equating to INR 2.5 per share. This year we have witnessed an improvement in ROCE to 12.7% for the financial 2023 from 9.1% in FY 2022. Our long-term rating by credit rating agency CRISIL has improved a notch from A stable to A positive. I will now run through the financial performance for the fourth quarter.
Total income of INR 321 crore was flat on year-on-year basis compared to quarter four of FY 2022. This was lower by 12% on a quarter-on-quarter basis from INR 361 crore in quarter three. In quarter four FY 2023, our plant in India and Europe operated at a utilization level of around 65%. In the quarter, we witnessed a decline in two-wheeler volumes as OEMs reduced production schedules in order to transition products in line with on-board diagnostics, that is OBD norms. This one-time regulatory implementation had an impact on our performance during this quarter. The volatility witnessed in last two to three years drove customers to increase the inventory as they moved away from just-in-time strategy.
With the normalization of global supply chain, customers have moved back towards leaner inventory levels, this readjustment towards lower inventory levels has resulted in one-time softness in volume this quarter. We also noticed that issues with semiconductors are yet to be completely resolved. While availability has improved significantly since this challenge first emerged a couple of years ago, there are still constraints in sourcing of semiconductors by global and domestic OEMs. Our gross margin has improved, this was supported by a decrease in prices of major raw materials and a more favorable product mix. We believe that input prices have passed their peak and are likely to decline moving forward. Despite some delays, we have observed a pass-through effect of previous input prices increases and a better product mix leading to improved results.
This has positively influenced our gross margins for the quarter, which was 51.6% in quater four FY 2023 compared to 50.4% in quarter four FY 2022, higher by 118 basis points. In quarter three FY 2023, gross margin was 49.3%. The quarter-on-quarter improvement in gross margin is 230 basis points or over 2%. The improvement in gross margin did not flow through the EBITDA margins due to increase in power and fuel costs, as well as other overheads, which have increased in line with the inflationary trends. Due to the initial sub-stabilization requirement of new products, we have incurred certain costs upfront for new products in this quarter. As the product throughput is stabilized and volumes are enhanced, the unit contribution from these new products will improve in the coming quarters.
There was also a settlement of one old claim from the customer, which resulted in one-time expense in the quarter four. As a result, EBITDA was at INR 33 crores in quarter four FY 2023, with the EBITDA margin of 10.3% as compared to INR 39 crores with a margin of 12.1% in quarter four of FY 2022. On the CapEx front, we have deployed INR 16 crores during the quarter and have deployed a total of INR 82 crores during FY 2023. Our value addition to net block has significantly increased from 130% in FY 2021 to 160% in FY 2023. In FY 2024, we anticipate CapEx deployment of around INR 90 crores.
Coming to the outlook, following our highest ever revenue of INR 1,405 crore in FY 2023, we are poised to take the business to a newer heights and aspiring to deliver a revenue of over INR 2,000 crores by FY 2025-2026. That is over a period of three years. Our confidence stems from the new orders which we have received and the discussions with the customers on new technologies and solutions. Notwithstanding the EBITDA margin performance in this quarter, we are confident for an improved margin outlook. Despite the 7C framework of challenges identified by us, including the post-COVID impact, the chip shortage issue, cost of new product and development, the conflict between Russia and Ukraine, global cost-based inflation, supply chain challenges, as well as the challenge from the recessionary environment, we have improved EBITDA margin for the full year.
The increase in EBITDA level in FY 2023 over 2022 demonstrate the positive impact of enhanced value addition and a richer product mix. As previously mentioned, our target over the next three to four years is to raise the EBITDA margin to 14% through a combination of growth initiatives and cost efficiency measures. In summary, we are focused on sustaining the momentum and endeavor to improve the financial and operational performance in the coming financial year. Our primary focus remains on enhancing margins, return ratios, and optimizing our working capital cycle. We are confident of delivering healthy revenue growth with a strong profitability growth in the upcoming fiscal year. On that note, I would now like to hand over to Mr. Shyam Agarwal, who will talk about operating highlights for the business.
Thank you, Mr. Vimal. Greetings to all of you. During the quarter, domestic auto industry witnessed moderate growth of 0.6% on year-over-year basis due to the OBD issues as well as the constrained chip availability. Within this, the bright spots were passenger vehicles, which grew 13%, and commercial vehicle, which grew 7% on year-over-year basis. The improved growth in PV was driven by increase in high-end segment, greater tourism activity, as well as new launches. In the case of commercial vehicles and heavy vehicles, factors such as increased infrastructure spend, mining activities and logistics growth helped to drive volumes.
In FY 2022-2023, Alicon has booked new orders aggregating INR 1,700 crore. With this, our total order booking has reached to INR 7,800 crore, which is executable over a period of seven years from 2020-2023 up to 2028-2029. In last quarter, we have received further new orders from some of our global customers like Jaguar and Land Rover and Danfoss pertaining to products in the carbon neutral business. The commencement of supply for these orders, along with the start of production across our aggregated orders booking, will contribute to increase in revenue momentum. All of you would recall that we had announced one of our largest order wins for JLR eAxle housing in August 2022.
I am pleased to share that innovative solutions provided by Alicon in coordination with our European arm in close association with JLR R&D team, has enabled project to progress on schedule with the start of production planned in the next year. From the strategy perspective, we are progressing well on our key pillars. Our value addition mix in key pillars did well in the fourth quarter as the share of carbon neutral business stood at 9%, structural products stood at 8% and non-auto business stood at 8%. We were able to deliver balanced growth with improvement in all segments despite a volatile market environment. Another focus area for our value creation approach is to increase the value addition mix from our products for four-wheeler and CV segments.
In FY 2023, we were able to reduce dependence on two-wheelers from 41% to 38% and increasing the share of four-wheeler business from 49% - 53%. In carbon neutral technology, our focus is on passenger vehicles, commercial vehicles and export opportunities as we see a greater scope for value addition in these areas. We see good traction with the motor housing products for Tata Motors as they are dominating the passenger EV market in India. We are also seeing encouraging numbers in commercial vehicle segment as the parts we have developed for Dana are facing promising demand with continued government support to develop cleaner public transport options. We also supply parts for three-wheeler products to Dana, which is again showing favorable demand trends.
The export business is doing well as we are focused on increasing wallet share on the back of development of parts for customers such as Danfoss, Eaton and Scania. We are in discussion on new projects and nominations in coming quarters. Our major customer, JLR, in structural part business witnessed fluctuation in production due to availability of chips, but with their initiative to diversify supplies, we expect improved volumes from them in the current fiscal year. My colleague, Andreas, will walk you through the further developments in the structural parts, while Rajiv will cover development in the ICE and the non-auto business. On that note, I would now like to hand it over to Mr. Andreas Heim to throw light on the global business.
Thank you, Shyam, and a warm welcome to all of you. I will briefly cover developments on our international-
Sorry to interrupt you, sir. Your voice is not clearly audible.
Can you get my voice properly, sir?
I will reconnect your line.
Yeah, perfect.
This is the operator. We have the line for Andreas Heim reconnected. Sir, you may proceed now.
Yeah, thanks and sorry for the inconvenience. Thank you, Shyam, and a warm welcome to all of you. I will briefly cover the developments on our international business. We are steadily emerging from the challenging situation witnessed in the calendar year 2022. Businesses in Europe are steadily adapting on the challenging circumstances and with some moderation in input prices, including gas, customers are now starting to operate plants at higher utilization levels. This has led to firmer indications for products being supplied by us, with revenues from our European facility growing 20% on a year-on-year basis. One of our key customers, JLR, has requested an increase in volumes for key part supplies. While semiconductor availability remains a bit of a challenge, we see better availability for high-end cars, which has reflected an improvement demand momentum from JLR for Samsung battery housing.
Bosch, which is a tier one supplier, has also done well and added new customers for their offerings. One of their end customers has a requirement of two housings per vehicle, resulting in firmer demands. In Europe, as the winter subsists, we see resumed demand for two-wheelers. This cyclicality in volumes during the spring season has led to improved demand for structural parts from two-wheeler customers like KTM, Husqvarna, and BMW. We anticipate this to continue to the summer months. Further, with the easing energy costs, there is some relief for households from the sharp inflationary pressures, which can lead to better customer demand. Aluminum prices have also softened on the reduced cost baskets should help our customers in reducing prices of the final products.
Apart from the increased activity from customers, which we have anticipated and indicated last quarter, we also achieved increase our customer interactions and are seeking to work with customers on products as well as on various solutions for adjustment products, as several of our customers across OEMs and tier one are working aggressively on new technology developments. The global business contributed 20%-21% of the total revenue during the quarter, and 22% for the fiscal year respectively. Apart from the improved customer sentiment which we are seeing, we are also moving ahead with initiatives to reduce costs. We have received approval for the investment in solar panel, which will help us to reduce energy costs and remain more competitive. On this note, I would like now to hand over to Mr. Rajiv Gupta, who will cover the development in the domestic business for the quarter.
Thank you, Andreas. Good day, everyone. The Indian automotive sector experienced volume growth of 13% in FY 2023 on a year-on-year basis. However, this growth was largely front-ended, and in the latter half of the year. There was some softness in growth, especially in case of two-wheelers, as it was affected by the regulations related to on-board diagnostics tester, OBD. Fortunately, there was better traction of 25% year-on-year in passenger vehicles and 29% year-on-year in commercial vehicles due to reasons mentioned by my colleagues. For Alicon, the sale growth from passenger vehicle increased 52% year-on-year and commercial increased 59% year-on-year. The contribution from our domestics business stood at 78% during the year. Going forward, in the auto ICE business, we are seeking to increase the portfolio of the critical parts.
In case of Toyota, we anticipate volumes to increase towards the end of the current financial year, with a strong market response with new launches of Hyryder and Innova HyCross. We are further in discussion with the market leader, Maruti Suzuki, on addition of further cylinder head businesses. Progress on these fronts will enable us to deliver on our strategy to enhance the passenger vehicle parts in our revenue mix. In the non-auto business, we have further supplied towards our order of the prestigious telecom project under Atmanirbhar Bharat. During the quarter, we were awarded a tenders from the Ministry of Defence for supply of wheels for the battle tanks and cylinder heads for the heavy-duty defense track, for which we will commence dispatch in the coming quarters. On this note, I would like to now to request our Group CEO, Mr.
Veerababu, to share his perspective on the performance for the year.
Thank you, Rajiv. Good day, everyone. Our FY 2023 performance represents a consolidation from the disruption of the last two to three years. We have stabilized our operations, we look to build on the momentum. One of the key achievements in FY 2023 has been the significant level of order booking, which will feed our growth in the upcoming years. As shared by Vimal-ji, our performance in FY 2022, 2023 is about 130% of the level of financial year 2018, 2019, which was the previous high for the global and domestic industry. We will build on this further within the balanced growth in the business across our five pillars. Our confidence is built upon deepening of our client engagement by delivering on six research and development, design excellence and value engineering.
We have demonstrated to our customers of our deep value that we can provide them as a supplier of ritual. Another important element that we are focused on the deepest footprint on technology. We work around automotive certain process of our operation, automate certain process of our operations. We have been highly proactive by working on advanced technologies, especially for the thermal cooling solution for EV segment. Another area of focus is to provide innovation, innovative solutions to our customers in the area of complex parts pertaining to the cooling solutions for motor and e-axle over traditional methods. We have also made progress in the developing a 3D printing solution for sand mold, enabling our customers the ability to quickly convert design into prototypes, thereby compressing the product development lead time.
We are also exploring friction stir welding, which is highly recommended application in the area of EV for strong and high quality joints. This focus on the technology-based solution has helped us differentiate ourself across the global landscape. We are also actively working towards increasing our sustainability footprint and have commissioned our captive solar plant in India, while installation of solar panels at our facility in Europe will be completed this year. These initiatives will meaningful transform our energy mix. On this note, I would now request to moderate to open the forum for any questions or suggestions that you may have. Thank you.
Thank you very much. We will now begin the question-and-answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touch-tone telephone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Yash Dalal from Sushil Financial Services. Please go ahead.
Yes. firstly, thank you to the management for this detailed breakdown of the quarter and year gone by. just a few questions. your vision was of INR 2,000 crore revenue and a EBITDA margin of 14%-15%. Are we on track to achieve the same? when could we see this happen?
Yash. For INR 2,000 crores, we are targeting by 2025-2026. Next three years to achieve that level. Definitely, as we were explaining in our previous concourse also about the improvement in the margins, we are expecting to reach around 14% in that year of 2025-2026.
To add on, basically to achieve the sale of INR 2,000 crore, we are quite confident because if you see the portfolio for 2025, 2026, we have noticed around 84% business we have already secured. That is from the regular and the new parts what we have added. For achieving that, we don't think there's any worry. Further, we are trying how we can materialize.
Only balance is now 15%, 16% is the balance, so that we are seeing a lot of new inquiries. RFQs are there under a lot of new businesses under negotiation with the customers. We are fully confident that we will be able to deliver these numbers.
Second one here is we are planning to increase as per a strategy where we get good margins. One is to reduce our dependency on two-wheelers and enhance our contribution with passenger and commercial. Second is to increase our portfolio in the carbon neutral, structural and also to some extent the non-auto parts where we have higher margins. Third is to increase our portfolio in the global market, where we can offer solutions and we can leverage over a competitive or basically a high good margin prices.
Okay, thank you. For this INR 2,000 crore revenue numbers, what would be like the revenue mix for your two-wheelers, four-wheelers, your new technologies like your EV hydrogen export and non-auto?
In this, if I talk in terms of our segment buckets, two-wheelers would be around 31%. Passenger would be around 40. Passenger would be around 36%-40%. Commercial would be around 20%-25%. Non-auto, yes, it would be around 6%-8%, something of that sort. Yes, little chunk we have kept with three-wheelers also because we see a good momentum picking up, especially three-wheelers in the EV space. The good thing is, Alicon is also have entered in this space and is now materializing through developments what we did with Ana. Coming to the different portfolio mix which we categorized, that is our five strategic segments.
At this moment, the visibility we see, we've already confirmed with our planning roughly around 20%-24% with carbon neutral parts. ICE would play around 60%-65%. Non-auto, I've already explained. Structural also is our area where we are aiming, and that is where we have added a parts with the Jaguar in the passenger vehicle. These solutions are really appreciated now with other players also in this space. Yes, we are doing quite good in the two-wheeler high-end bikes. The good thing is, yes, we have this edge with our European-based
With past developments through KTM, BMW, Ducati, which we have added last year. Now even in India, we are noticing the trend of high-end bikes are coming up. That's the reason we are noticing yeah, the OEMs like REML, Classic Legends, that's Mahindra and also Honda, they are coming up with a swing arm structural portfolio. This also will further enhance our portfolio. Yes, we are planning to keep this portion from 5%-7% because this is a area where I'm going to mitigate or any risk because be a two-wheeler, I mean, be a hybrid, be a IC or be a electric, this part will remain common. This also is a area where I aim to increase my portfolio.
Important is that if you have heard that with the change in the sales mix, how it is moving. Earlier used to be, Alicon used to be having more than 50% contribution coming from the two-wheeler industry. Now it's, this year we have gone down from 53% that was in last year, 2021, 2022. That has gone down to 46% in the last year of 2022, 2023. Now as per our planning, by 2025, 2026 it will be in the range of 30%-32%.
Okay.
The contribution from other sides like passenger and commercial, that is increasing that bucket.
Yeah, thanks, Hemanth for your explanation. Basically, we are aiming to increase our sales content per vehicle, I mean, per machine. I think if you see a two-wheeler component ranges from, say, one kg to, say, three or four, depending upon the cc of the vehicle. We have more opportunity when we explore a passenger vehicle or even a more opportunity when we explore a commercial. That is what we are aiming to increase the sales per machine.
Okay. Thank you. Just a couple of more questions. Could you throw some light on the revenue loss caused in Q4 due to these new OBD-RD norms? What will be the impact of this in the next few quarters this year?
Yes, we noticed the impact this time we noticed the OEMs very cautious. They didn't wanted to repeat the issues, what they faced when there was a transition from a BS4 to BS6. That's the reason we noticed this very early in quarter four when they started. They have reduced their numbers. Our impact was roughly around INR 13 crores-INR 35 crores with this hit. This is one time what we know very well. This is just a one time hit. Now, on from April, we have noted, in fact from the last two weeks of the March, we noted the volumes have picked up and now we are, the OEMs are planning to build this inventory and further pick it up the market.
Okay. Okay. Also, what is the volume growth in FY 2023 and the impact on realization due to the fall in commodity prices?
The revenue growth which we have noticed, which we have mentioned in the script also, we noted it was around 30%. We noted the commodity prices also have fallen down. With that, we noted there was a hit of roughly around INR 50 crore-INR 55 crore. This would be roughly around 4%-5%.
Okay. Also, could you provide like a guidance on the growth expectation for FY 2024 volumes and revenue going forward?
That I think in the last meeting also we have been approximately now at this moment we are expecting to grow by 15% the top line.
Okay. Okay. Thank you so much.
Thank you.
Thank you.
The next question is from the line of Raghunandhan from Nuvama Wealth. Please go ahead.
Thank you, sir, for the opportunity. Congratulations on a strong FY 2023. First question was on the demand side. So there are two factors which are likely to positively support the growth for FY 2024. First one, you have a strong pending order book. Can you indicate roughly how much new orders can contribute to FY 2024 revenues? Secondly, one of the segments which I'm hoping that should contribute to the growth is exports. Because semiconductor supply seem to be gradually improving and companies globally like Volkswagen, Audi, they are talking about growth up to 15% in CY 2023. Even JLR has guided for 24% volume growth in FY 2024. If you can throw some light on both these factors, new orders and exports outlook.
Yes. First is on new order booking. If you see, this year we are planning to book roughly around INR 700 crore from the new parts what we have added. This will basically contributed from the passenger vehicle and commercial vehicle segments. Major chunk will be from the passenger and commercial vehicle and also from the structural parts and the EV parts what we have added. Talking about the global OEMs, how they're going to support, yes, the new business of what we have added, especially from Jaguar. One is the order win which we have declared in August 2022 in last year. This we are working very closely to materialize the same.
Further is, last quarter we added one more part with Jaguar. This we have explored one more opportunity. Ideally, we were focusing on a motor housing, battery housing, inverter housings, and a e-axle what we added. These were what we have added, what we were targeting. We noticed especially for the high-end cars, there are some structural parts also as opportunity which we can materialize, which calls for process what we are into. This is a good business what we added in last quarter with a heavy weight of roughly around 13 kg part, and also with a good volumes of roughly around 80,000 a year. This is also is with our strategy which we're aiming. Jaguar is one which with whom we are planning to increase our portfolio.
Second is Daimler in Europe, USA, and also we now have started Japan. Good thing, also we noted in last quarter we entered to even the China of Daimler with this portfolio. Apart from this, there are other players in Europe which is now, I mean, with whom the products are in development right now. One is Scania. This is again on electrification. We have developed seven parts up till now, which will go in the SOP in this year. We have got MAN Trucks. These are into big parts which talks about capability and criticality, what Alicon is able to deliver. These are big flywheel housings weighing from 10 kg -30 kg. With this even we have a possibility to touch base other European, U.S. and Indian customers.
We're also talking big with, if we come down to U.S., it's Danfoss. We have developed one part that was in two years ago. Now, with a successful development, we earned the trust what we able to deliver. We're in discussion of a big orders. One order, yes, in last quarter, which you have noted in our script, which we have booked. Further, we have strong discussions of materializing other portfolio in EV space with Danfoss. With this we see we have got a good opportunity to materialize the developments what we added particularly from the global businesses. Apart from, yes, domestic, which already there, which you have noticed with examples like Toyota, which is now picking up. TACO motor housings for Tata. PSA also is picking up.
We are working on and so on.
Raghu, if we conclude all this. What we are talking about for the numbers of the next year, this means currently year of 2023, 2024. This 15% is the work we worked out based on the earlier schedules shared by the customers, especially the global customers, where we are more focused. Now hopefully, because just now they are in the process of revising their schedules. Whatever you are saying that, they are now revising on the upward side, all their schedules like, either we talk about Volkswagen or JLR. Hopefully maybe in the next con call or very shortly we will be able to revise our numbers also based on their revised numbers we received in the coming month.
Hello.
Raghu, do you have any further questions?
Thank you. Thank you, sir, for the comprehensive answer. In other words, assuming underlying industry grows anywhere between 5%-10%, and with the new orders coming in and revision of schedules happening, can we expect a upside risk to our current expectations?
We hope so.
Uh-
Until we get some informations in writing or some, confirmed news from the customers. It is for us also difficult to revise the numbers.
Sir, just wanted to check with you, just clarifying what you said. Two-wheeler FY 2023, the share was 46%. Is that correct?
Yes.
Can you also share how much was it for TV, CV?
Yeah, that, it was correct, 46% the two-wheeler and 2021-2022 it was 53% on the sales side. I'm talking about the sales.
Correct. Can you share for the other segment also, sir? TV, PV.
Yes. Yes. Definitely. Rajiv, can you please share?
Yes. For the TV, it was 35% last year, what we ended up, and the previous year it was around 28%. Even commercial, in the commercial also we got an increase of roughly around 5% and touching around 21%-22%. Commerce, carbon neutral also we noted an increase. It was roughly around 7%. More we have added with the value addition portion. Ideally we are more.
More observing towards the value addition, what we are able to generate from these segments. On value addition, even the contribution was on a higher side. If you see non-auto, it was around 7%, and technology agnostic was around 7%.
Here clearly you can understand that how the sales mix is changing from the year-on-year basis. That is as per our strategy that we have planned earlier.
Absolutely, sir. In terms of the investment in FY 2023, that was mainly relating to the captive solar plant, right? Some INR 27 crore kind of investment.
Not, for that. Just the total project value was because it is, on a partnership basis. Our investment was INR 5 crore for the equity there.
Okay.
Other investment is for our maintenance CapEx. New projects of PSA, there we have made a huge investment and the machining side as well as. Because now new customers are adding up, like Toyota or Maruti Suzuki or some other new customers are coming up to. Their testing requirements, their quality requirements are very high. We have to invest on that side.
Got it, sir. Just a last question before I fall back to the queue. Q4 you said that there is a one-time expense which was relating to, you know, one was with reference to a customer where a claim settlement was done. So what, how much was the one-time impact in Q4?
That is around INR 3 crore. That comes to around 1% of the sales. There was one issue going on for last three to four years. One-time settlement. Still not concluded, but we have made a provision for that. That's all.
Got it. Ideally this should not continue in the coming quarter.
Yes, yes. This is a one time settlement.
Got it, sir. Thank you so much. I'll fall back in the queue.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rahisha from Crown Capital. Please go ahead.
Hello, sir. Good afternoon. My question is on the global business. You said you are looking to increase the portfolio, correct? Currently it is at 22%. First I want to ask, is this global business, is it in general a better business compared to domestic, let's say for margins and profitability?
Because if you see now, one is domestic business has become more of commodity. There are a lot of other players also, right? Nowadays, with so much of competition domestic market, the buyers are very price sensitive. They are like the players who are able to give a lower rate, they will immediately shift to that suppliers. That we have noted, unlike previously where we noted the OEMs were looking for a long-term partnership. Also as we are moving ahead with new technologies, with new spend on R&D, we have also noted, let's not be more with this space, particularly a segment like two-wheeler and so on. That's the reason now we are shifting to more complex and critical and bigger and bolder parts. That also we see a big opportunity when we touch global.
If you see the commercial and passenger in global, it's a huge number compared to India also. That's the reason we are trying to add more with the global businesses. With that we are now increasing our travels also for our global customers to bring this to increase our rapport and thereafter to convert this into opportunity. We know very well this is a time where be a OEM, be a tier one, we are aggressively working on new developments, be a EV or be any advanced technology when we talk about IT. We know a supplier who is regular or very close in discussions can definitely grab this opportunity, rather than who is just trying to have a exploring opportunities, let's say, long from the customer end.
Just to conclude your question. One is that first, in India, the Alicon presence is on the higher side. What we can conclude that key may be the business in India at saturation for the market may be based on the when industry grows. On that basis we can see the grow or some new parts are coming up, but or maybe some more opportunities in the EV segment. On the global side, the market is huge and our presence was very small. We have everywhere we have the opportunity. The mark, based on this, we see the big opportunity on the revenue side as well as definitely the margins are better when we made a comparison with the domestic market.
How much, what can this number be of the split from 22%? How much can you, so how much you're targeting the split of revenue between global and domestic? It's currently at 22% of total revenues on a yearly basis.
Yeah.
How much you think you can scale up?
We are aiming to increase it to around 40%-42% by 2025, 2026.
By 2025, 2026. Okay. This FY 2024 top line, you said 15% growth. What about the EBITDA margins then? Currently at 11%. What is your feeling about that?
At least minimum 1% growth we can see in this coming months, coming years.
Okay. Okay. All right, sir. No problem. That's it for now. Thank you and all the best.
Okay. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Aditya Chheda from InCred Asset Management. Please go ahead.
Hi, thanks. This is Aditya from InCred. Sir, what is the right way to look at this order book of INR 7,800 crore? I'm assuming most of the execution is in FY 2025, 2026. If you can explain how the order book would translate into revenues and how is this divided into the recurring order book or new orders, et cetera. The other question on the margin expansion is that with this structural change in the business slash revenue mix for you, is it the right inference that most of the margin expansion would be from the gross margins?
Third question is on the capacity utilization with us being close to INR 2,000 crore, and most of the current CapEx being in maintenance and machining, is it right inference that we would be operating close to 80% capacity utilization? If yes, how are we thinking about adding more production or manufacturing capacity going ahead? Thanks.
Okay. First now on the order booking, yes, with a great success till now on new orders, we see there's a possibility to book around 7,800 sales over seven years. This, if you talk about contribution, roughly around 33% would be from the EV parts where we were aiming, so that's a good sign. This again, with the recent parts what we added, especially the big orders from JLR, around 6%-7% would be as from structural. If we see this in terms of the segment buckets, around 50%-54% will be from passenger vehicles. That is which you have noted like the Toyota, the new launches, what they have done, Hyryder and HyCross, as the acceptance is far, far better than anticipated.
Even Toyota is now asking us to increase the capacities at the end of this financial. That's a good sign which we want to materialize. PSA, if you have noticed, they have launched this vehicle, a good one with good competitive price. This also we are trying to materialize, and this will even be for domestic as well as the global business. Followed by Jaguar. The business is what we have discussed. A good chunk will be there and exported to UK. Yes, as commercial, if you talk about Daimler, till now, roughly around 20+ cars what we have developed with them. One, few being very complex and complicated, this will help us now to leverage this opportunity. This is roughly around 18%-22% of our total order book, what we have done on this area.
Also would be, if you see this, what we have booked, roughly around 50% is from the global business. That is also a factor for which will help us to increase our portfolio. What was your next question?
With this structural change in the business mix, is it right to infer that most of the margin expansion which we are alluding to, that is from 11% to 14%, would be from gross margins?
Yes. Well, we can see that at the end it will be come from the gross margins.
Got it. Third was on the capacity utilization where we are close to 60%.
Capacity utilization, we can't calculate theoretically like this, the way you are calculating, because, you know, some individual parts depends on the size, criticality. We need some different type of machines, maybe for the bigger size of the casting machine or some different process requirements from the customer. On that basis, we have to invest and somewhere we have to do the automations. As we are explaining that now all, every 100% business is coming, we are getting the machined parts, so we have to invest for the CNC machines also. On that basis, utilization of 80%, definitely.
We are expecting because, overall utilization when we are even at peak, that cannot go beyond 80%-85%, because 15%-20% we have to keep for the business fluctuations. We can expect that utilization may be around 75%. That we can assume.
Got it. Sir, on the execution of this order book, what is the right way to think about it? Whether most of it will be executed in FY 2025, 2026, or how should we think about revenues flowing from this order book on the execution side?
The important is that what Rajiv has explained, that out of INR 2,000 crore, 85% business is already we are having the orders. Okay. Only now 15% that we can convert into around INR 300 crore. Lot of new businesses are under discussion with various OEMs, especially on the global side. I think there should not be any issue to deliver INR 2,000 crore by 2025-2026. Definitely like earlier this Raghunandhan, he was talking about the additional maybe some surpass our the projections. They may also happen, but we can't say at this moment on the schedules and how the market behaves in the future.
That, if you see, that's the reason we don't want to be dependent on a single customer. That's the reason we are with several customers with diversified portfolio among different segments, different region. When we talk about exports also we are there with U.S., we are there with Europe. U.K., we added a major chunk. Now we are exploring further to increase in Japan and few opportunities which we explored in last quarter with China.
One important more point I would like to add, Apurva, about, we are more focused on the where we are having the higher margin side. Because, you know, when we are talking about INR 2,000 crore, and it is easy for us to even deliver more, maybe we can talk about maybe INR 2,200 crore also. We are focused on the, parts, what kind of parts we are doing. Just for your information, the one year, last one year, the number of parts we have reduced from.
Parts.
I think by 150 parts. From 490- 315. Approximately under 75 number of parts we have reduced from our basket. Yeah.
We're just trying to materialize and capitalize our resources on efficient way where even we can please our customers and we can increase our portfolio with focused customers and getting upward margins thereafter with the service what we provide. That is what again which we are aiming to support our customer the best way. If we are going to touch upon various alternatives, definitely we won't be able to support equally to all our customers. That's the reason we have come up with these strategies, and we have noted this has worked quite well in this year, and we are very sure to materialize even a more benefit coming, in coming years.
Sorry, Aditya, I think I was wrongly pronouncing your name.
nue grew by 15% year-over-year, reaching $1.2 billion. This growth was primarily driven by strong sales in the North American market, which saw a 20% increase. The European market also contributed positively with a 10% rise in revenue. However, the Asian market experienced a slight decline of 5% due to increased competition. Gross profit margin improved by 2 percentage points, from 30% to 32%, mainly due to efficient cost management and a favorable product mix. Operating expenses remained stable at 20% of revenue. As a result, the operating profit increased by 25% to $144 million, and the operating profit margin expanded to 12%. Net income for the quarter was $90 million, up from $75 million in the same period last year, representing a 20% increase. Earnings per share (EPS) also rose to $0.75 from $0.62. The company generated $110 million in cash flow from operations, which was used to fund capital expenditures of $40 million and return $30 million to shareholders through dividends and share repurchases. Looking ahead, the company expects revenue growth of 12%-15% for the full fiscal year, with an operating profit margin of 11%-13%. They plan to invest $150 million in capital expenditures to support new product development and capacity expansion. The management remains optimistic about achieving their long-term strategic goals, focusing on innovation and marke
For this year, like, base, as per our budgeted cash flow planning, hopefully we'll be able to reduce our, the debts by end of the year. On the other side, when we are talking about the increase in the working capital, one is one party that there is in-growth in the top line by 30%. That has also impact. As well as there are some issues like when we are talking about the, some, inventory corrections by the customer. We build up the inventory, you could see that some increase in the inventory as a fund. That will be utilized in the coming months. As well as, like some CapEx capital, debtors are there.
Because lot of new products we have developed and the investing was done for their toolings. That maybe they have started making the payment. Hopefully next six to eight months we will be able to realize that amount also. That is approximately around I think INR 40-45 crore from the customers. We are expecting by end of the year, by means March 2024, we should be able to improve drastically on the debit or working capital cycle as well as the debt side.
That's it from my end. Congratulations on this growth year.
Thank you.
Thank you, Aditya.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Dixit Doshi from Whitestone Financial Advisors. Please go ahead.
Yeah, thanks for the opportunity. First couple of question is regarding the revenue target. What we are having, let's say 15% growth and 1 percentage increase in the margin. If I see our last three quarters performance, the revenue is going down, let's say INR 377 crore in September, then INR 360 crore and INR 320 crore. Some of that may be also because of the reduction in the aluminum prices. When you are factoring in 15% growth from the FY23 revenue, you... I mean, are you factoring in, let's say, the aluminum prices go down further or this or this kind of growth you are anticipating due to the visibility of the order book? How do we read this?
For this, that is a good question. First of all, we have already factored this commodity prices. Nothing, we are not banking on that, on the higher commodity prices. Like Rajiv has explained the new order book. In this year there is a further increase in the delivery side of the what new orders we have secured in the last two to three years. They are, those are the main growth drivers for us.
Okay. Okay.
Now-
You are confident of growth because last three quarters we have been seeing the revenue coming down.
Yes. Even we have touched base what the researchers are talking when a growth of the market for global as well as the Indian automotive. What we have understood is almost all the regions globally are talking about an increase. The good sign for us is Europe, as the energy costs have come down and also the Russia-Ukraine War is about to come down the east. We are hoping a good opportunity from our European location. This will support our exports to Europe and also a good opportunity to materialize for our plant in Illichmann. That is one. Yes, one second is on the new paths, what we added. The new paths and the new business also what we added will go in SOP and this will materialize sales thereafter.
Okay. Now, second question is, regarding this order book, what we give. Let's say this order book, from a client must be some rough estimates of, you know, let's say in FY 26, they must be having some rough estimate that this much will be their volume. It does impact sometimes due to the recession or any slowdown in the economy. What kind of max, you know, deviation from the order that client give one can expect?
If you see for this, I mean, last year, we anticipated roughly around to book around INR 500 crores from the new order wins. We just checked the hit. We have closed roughly around INR 440-450 crores. This was roughly around 85%-90%. You know, I mean, it all depends upon how volatile the market is. Few hit, yes, which we noted because of the OBD, because some of the launches were affected with the new regulations from the government. For some instance, we see even the SOPs, what initially the volumes were targeted, some. In some area we noted it was shifting by a quarter and so on.
Yes, the good thing is we are able to achieve at least hit 85%-90%. Going forward, we anticipate this will be more than 90% or hit rate to achieve that.
Secondly, on the customer projection versus reality, so we also see which all customer gave us what schedule in the past and how much is the actual pickup by those customers. Whenever we make our business plan, we factor those numbers and then only we make our business plan. We generally go more realistic when we make our business plan.
Okay. Just last one question. You mentioned that, we are seeing the three-wheeler EV also picking up. In three-wheeler EV, is it the ICE guys are aggressive or do you see even the new players are also coming just like the two-wheeler?
It is both the cases. If you see the current ICE player who has also developed the EV vehicle, so that are doing good and also new players are coming. It's a mix. Still our thinking is whatever were the earlier ICE player, they will do good in the EV place.
Okay. Okay, that's it from my side. Thanks.
Thank you.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Rohit Ohri from Progressive Shares. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Two or three questions. The first one being related to the EBITDA margins. If we see that over the last nine, 10 years, we've been at an average of 10.5% EBITDA margins or so. What are these factors that give us this confidence that going forward, we will try to reach around 14% or maybe that kind of range of EBITDA margin in the next two to three years or so?
In this, as I explained, that major impact is coming from the change in the sales mix. Because you know that two is always a, it is very difficult to negotiate or to work with the two-wheeler because the commodity prices are going up. Now we are shifting the main shift of the business from two-wheeler to the passenger as well as the commercial vehicles. That is one. Space, and on the other side we are moving towards the global business. Where we are negotiating the good prices from the customers when we made a comparison from the existing customers in India. There is a major opportunity to improve our margins. As well as the second is that the growth trend. Definitely the economy of scale is that benefit we should get.
Okay. Okay, my next question is, that, if you consider the customer order book anticipation versus the real world and priority as to what we work with our capacity, what exactly is the conversion ratio, assuming that, if the order book is INR 100, then, what sort of conversions can we do over, like, a year's time?
Not understood. Business conversion, converting into the sales you're talking about?
Yeah, converting into sales revenue, yes.
Oh, this what you are talking about, the order book, it depends what we are giving based on the schedules, yearly schedules they have given. We have already secured the orders from them. Customer has already given the purchase orders, only the lead time depends on the part and when there is a launch of the vehicle. It may be 1 year or maybe some customers like JLR, they generally go for the 2 years lead time.
Okay. you just try to.
There is an increase in the volumes year-on-year. In that fashion, our all our new order book, what we are discussing or we are declaring in this console, we get this based on the schedules what we receive from the customers.
Okay. Is it fair to assume that, going forward, you can grow at around 18%-20% kind of casual growth over the next five years or so?
Hope so, with your blessing.
No, no. I mean, like, of course. Do we have the capacity? Because, last I believe that, we spoke about this greenfield.
As I explained the capacity, we cannot directly correlate with the order book and the capacity, existing capacity. Depends on the requirement of, the capacity means the kind of machines, depends on the requirement of the product.
Got it.
We are maybe 50%, 60% of the common things, so we can utilize like the melting or casting, but some different requirements for individual products. There we have to invest.
That's true. True.
Rohit, also as a part of the operational improvement, we also go for more capacity utilization by increasing the number of cavities, by putting more load on the machine, going for the higher weight parts. Those improvements also we do, so that we can generate more revenues with the same capacity.
I understand the part where, you know, we are reducing certain parts but getting newer parts every year. The thing is that, do you think that going forward you'll be making use of the property which is at Kail? Because the greenfield project which was there in the past, it was delayed, and it was blessing in disguise that it got delayed. Going forward, do you think that you'll be investing into this greenfield CapEx?
Rohit, at this moment, we have not planned this because you know that when we go for the greenfield project.
Mm-hmm.
We have to start with the huge investment as well as on the fixed cost side.
Right.
Around that location, I don't know, maybe need 3 to 4 years. We always more focus on how to increase our output or improve our capacity from the existing facilities.
Right.
That's even for the INR 2,000 crore, what we are talking for 2025, 2026, our plan is to deliver from the existing facilities.
Got it. We're still setting the assets which we have right now.
Yes.
Okay, sir. That helps. That helps a lot. Thank you, sir. Thanks a lot.
Thank you.
Thank you very much.
This was the last question for today. I would now like to hand the conference over to the management for closing comments.
Thank you. I hope we have been able to answer all your questions satisfactorily. Should you need any further clarifications or would like to know more about the company, please feel free to contact our team or CDR India. Thank you once again for taking the time to join us on this call, and we look forward to interacting next quarter. Thank you very much.
Thank you very much. On behalf of Alicon Castalloy Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.