Please note that this conference is being recorded. Before we begin, I would like to remind participants that this conference call may contain forward-looking statements about the company, which are based on beliefs, opinions, and expectations of the company as on date of this call. These statements are not the guarantee of future performance and involve risks and uncertainties that are difficult to predict. With this, I now hand the conference over to Mr. Nikhil Kumar, Managing Director of TD Power Systems Limited. Thank you and over to you, sir.
Thank you. Good morning, everybody. Thank you once again for joining us on today's earnings call. I trust all of you would have received our results and investor presentation. Let me start now with the financial performance for the quarter ended 30th June 2025. Standalone first. Our total income for Q1 on a standalone basis was INR 3.63 billion versus INR 2.66 billion over the same period previous year, an increase of 36%. EBITDA for the quarter is 18.7%, including other income, excluding exceptional and treasury income, versus 17.17% over the same period previous year. Profit after tax and comprehensive income for the quarter was INR 471 million versus profit of INR 312 million over the same quarter last year, an increase of 51%.
Order book for the manufacturing segment is INR 14.68 billion, out of which INR 10.8 billion is our generator and motor business, INR 3.84 billion railways, spares and aftermarket business INR 0.11 billion, and INR 0.29 billion is the Turkey business. Order inflow statistics. Order inflow during the quarter is INR 3.92 billion, an increase of 32% on a quarter-on-quarter basis. Order inflow from exports and deemed exports is INR 2.57 billion compared to INR 2.14 billion previous year. 66% of our quarterly order inflow is from exports. 34% is domestic. Consolidated. Our total income on a consolidated basis for Q1 is INR 3.76 billion versus INR 2.77 billion, an increase of 36%. Profit after tax and comprehensive income for the quarter is INR 500 million versus INR 35.6 million, an increase of 40%. We continue to maintain a strong cash position of INR 2.3 billion. Order book, market situation, and guidance. Let me now go through this.
The market conditions are fairly similar to the commentary given during the last earnings call. Of course, geopolitical situations have changed quite dramatically over the past one week. I will be happy to discuss with you everything in the level of detail possible, to the extent possible, given the information available at this point in time. Let me now go through each segment and market in some level of detail. India steam turbine market. India and steam turbine market export. The market continues to grow at the rate we predicted, with no surprises, both on the upside or the downside. The market is steady with around 10%-12% growth taking place in the captive power plant business, biomass, and waste heat recovery. We have received a good number of orders for larger size four-pole machines in Q1. There is a strong pipeline of similar orders in Q2.
These orders are mainly domestic. In the export market, the pipeline is also strong. Overall, we expect the steam turbine business for our domestic plus export to grow around 10%-12%. We are getting steam turbine orders from all over the world. Demand is strong and steady. Now coming to the international markets, gas turbine and gas engine. At first, I would like to talk about the tariffs and the impact of tariffs on our business. I have been saying all along for quite a while that TDPS will have to move its production to Turkey in the event that the tariffs from India to the U.S. become uncomfortably high. I think we have reset the situation yesterday after the announcement of the additional 25% tariffs.
We will have to move part of our production to Turkey to avoid or to do a value addition over there to have the Made in Turkey nameplate, which will then attract 15% duty, which is what Turkey has. Last earnings call, I had mentioned that around 15%-20% of our sales will be to the U.S. This should be further divided into two parts. Around 3/4 of that, around 75% of this goes to European OEMs, who in turn package the generator along with their engine or the gas turbine and do a lot of further value addition on the generator, like adding protection panels, control systems. These will then be re-exported as a turbine generator set or an engine gas engine set to the U.S. market.
These will then attract 15% duty, which is a duty which the European Union has now negotiated with the U.S. The remaining 25% of the exports will have to be diverted to Turkey. That is about 4%-5% of our overall business. We have already been discussing with our customers over a period of time about this possibility that in the event that we have high tariffs, we will have to move to this situation, so they are well aware of our plan B. That we have a situation where plan B might become the reality, we will still wait and see what happens till the end of August, whether this situation will actually continue, or whether India will be able to come to a compromise deal with the U.S., we do not know.
At the moment, we are going full steam ahead with plan B. Our customers are fully aware of that. Some negotiations, a lot of extra work is necessary for us to make this a reality. No choice. To protect our markets and our business, we will have to do what is required. Now, coming to the market itself, the demand of forecast from the U.S. and Europe are extremely high for both gas engine and gas turbine generators. We are expecting a big uptick of orders currently. Even if the forecasts are 180% correct, we expect to exceed the guidance made for this year and next year. Currently, we have given a guidance of INR 15 billion consol for this year and INR 18 billion consol for next year.
Looking at the way that the orders are flowing in and the forecasts given by our OEMs, we will exceed these guidances. Order booking in Q2 continues to be very strong, and we will end the quarter with extremely good order booking numbers. During the next earnings call, we will provide a detailed upgrade on the guidance for FY 2026, which is this financial year, and give a tentative guidance for FY 2027. By that time, we expect all tariff-related questions to be answered, and we also expect to know where exactly we stand and where the market stands with respect to tariffs. Hydro, we have achieved excellent order inflow in this segment, and next year will be one of the highest in the history of the company in Hydro. We have also received a big refurbishment job in the last quarter. We are also bidding for further refurbishment projects in India.
Even if we are successful in one or two, the order values and margins are very attractive, very large, and that will significantly give a big uptick to our domestic order inflow as well as our overall order booking numbers. We are very optimistic about this particular segment. There are a number of jobs in the market, and TDPS is well-placed to maybe get one or two large jobs. Our motor business is growing at the rate that we mentioned earlier. This year, we will be still on track to achieve the targets, what we have mentioned, which will be something like INR 1.5 billion. Next year, we are going to do INR 2+ billion in the motor business.
There are a number of orders in the pipeline, mainly for synchronous motors, induction motors for export, and in particular, there are a large number of orders in the synchronous motor segment, which will be finalized very shortly. Railways, we have orders now for the U.S. market, for the European market, and the Russian market. We will be supplying to all these three markets next year. Of course, the Alstom order for India still continues. Next year, we will be supplying to all the four markets, and we will see a significant uptick in our railway business in the next financial year. General guidance, as mentioned earlier, I still stick to INR 1,500 crore for this financial year with a certain upside potential, which will be confirmed in the next quarter, and margins will be maintained at the current levels, ±0.5%.
This brings me to the end of my initial remarks. I will be now happy to address questions that you may have. Thank you.
Thank you very much. We will now begin with the question -and -answer session. Anyone who wishes to ask a question may press star and one on their touchtone phone. If you wish to remove yourself from the question queue, you may press star and two. Participants are requested to use handsets while asking a question. Ladies and gentlemen, we will wait for a moment while the question queue assembles. The first question is from the line of Mohit Kumar from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good morning, sir, thanks for the opportunity. First, congratulations on a very good quarter order inflow and profitability. My question-
Thank you.
My first question is, given, of course, the 25% tariff that was imposed in July is going up to 50%, my question is, do you see the risk of delay of postponement on the existing orders? How to mitigate?
As I said, there are two segments. One is that the 75% of our exports to the U.S. is actually routed through the OEMs, which will move to Europe, and then there'll be value addition done over there, and then from there, it'll get re-exported. The second part is the 25%, which is direct exports. Which for all the pending orders also, we will start now trying to convert as much as possible to redirecting that through our Turkish operation. Our customers are committed towards still continuing with the order inflow from us because it's not easy for them or for us right now to backtrack from the commitments which have already been made. Most of these orders are already signed with the end users, and our name is there on those contracts.
We have to find a way to ensure that The cost that we deliver finally to the end users is within the range of what we discussed earlier, which we had all expected to have a 25% tariff range. We have to make sure that even if we deliver through a third country, because we manufacture in the third country, then the overall additional costs are not going to exceed that 25%, which is what we are planning to achieve. Our turbine customers are fully aware of these calculations and fully aware of this, because we've been talking about this for quite a while, ever since the first round of tariffs took place, say about two or three weeks ago, when the first 25% hit. I expected the worst, and we told our customers, let's expect the worst. If things get better, it's great.
Now the worst case situation has happened and people are fully aware, and people are fully aligned with our plans. Yes, to answer your question, in a very, very long way, we don't expect any order delays or cancellations.
Understood, sir. My second question is, how much time-
Because people are fully aware of what we are doing.
My second question is, how much time it will take to wrap up the Turkey production?
No, we are already producing in Turkey. It's not that the plant is idle. We have production in Q2 and Q3, both put together will be doing something like EUR 5 million in, EUR 4 million - EUR 5 million in Turkey in Q2 and Q3. The plant is running right now. Now we have to beef up a little bit on the manpower, and we'll be doing mainly assembly and testing operations over there, so it's not a lot of manufacturing. We'll be able to meet the requirements. As I said, it's only something like 4%-5% of our overall sales, which is going to go through Turkey. That kind of capacity is already available for the U.S. market.
As I said, hopefully highly likely that we don't have to do all these things by the end of the month, but in the worst case, if we have to expand the operations over there, we will.
Understood, sir. Thank you. All the best, sir. Thank you.
Yeah, thank you.
Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Amit Anwani from PL Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi, sir. Thanks for taking my question. Sir, question on the very strong commentary for exports and you have delivered good orders in export market also this quarter as well. Just wanted to understand a couple of things. Which key markets will drive the exports? Is it the same markets who are getting better response or the demand, the scenario has changed and what has led to the demand scenario changing or is it the tariff which is kind of favorable to us versus other competition. Some sense on why the export market is growing for us. Is it product competitiveness or the market itself? If you could give some highlights and the key markets also.
Markets have been the same. We have been working to develop these markets, Europe and U.S., for I would say a decade. This is not something that switches overnight. We have been working on developing these markets and penetrating these markets for a long period of time. As I've been saying for many quarters right now, the environment or the macro situation for power generation in both the U.S. market and the European market in general is very favorable for us. One is because of the move towards renewables, then the move towards grid stabilization in the European market, also data center market and AI is starting to pick up in the European market too. U.S. is driven mainly by data center and AI, which is a big boom, which is going to continue for some more time.
There is an overall shortage of power equipment in the world. As a part of this overall landscape, TDPS is very much a large participant in this market and we have a big capacity which is coming on stream. Our customers are fully aware of it. Are banking on this capacity to meet the demand. We have to find a way to deliver the machines to them at a reasonable cost, and we have the flexibility of operating and manufacturing in another country. We will make sure that we protect our markets and deliver the numbers that we have committed.
Sure, sir. Second question on the domestic market where we have given a marginal growth guidance for FY 2026. Barring that, if we get a large order from hydro refurbishment, this would be kind of lumpy order. Having said that, except that, what are the underlying reasons for marginal growth for domestic and is the market is kind of tepid in India or are particular sectors not growing, particular sectors growing? If you could give some sense why we are factoring the marginal growth for domestic market.
No, I think I have been saying this for, again, I've been saying this for a few quarters. This is not something new I have been saying. I have been saying that the domestic market on the captive steam turbine side is growing steadily. I don't see that as I said, if we have 10%-12% growth, steady growth year-on-year, it's much better way for the market to grow with steady growth on a long-term basis, rather than having a boom cycle of 25%-30% growth for one or two years and then crashing to zero after that. I'm happy with this, that it's growing steadily. We can depend on this growth. It's a steady growth, and it's a broad-based growth. I would say this is a very positive situation from the domestic market.
We can expect a steady growth taking place this year and next year, and I'm happy with it. Whether it satisfies the overall demand of growth for the company as a whole, it does not. That's why we have multiple products, multiple geographies, and you can see that we have a very broad-based line of products, which overall delivers a much higher growth for the company in the region of 20%+. That's been our strategy also for, I would say we have been talking about this for years right now, and now we're delivering on that strategy.
Right. Lastly, on the data center we have been supplying to U.S. directly to data centers, and we have been highlighting a strong growth there. Any sense on Indian market, have we worked on the data center side or is there any pipeline for data center, especially in the domestic market?
Data center market in India is also quite, it's there. It's quite a big market at the moment. The data center market is. You have to look at it from different segments. There's a data center market where you have storage of data. That's what the Indian market is right now, where you have. It's a big business. It's a huge business, actually. Those are limited to smaller size, backup power where you have 10 MW or 5 MW, maybe larger ones will be 15 MW. Which is mainly met through diesel engines, which are supplied by Cummins or Caterpillar, those kind of machines. TDPS is not in this market. The U.S. market. If India gets into putting in large AI server farms and things like that, then the power demand will go to 50 MW-60 MW, even 100 MW per server farm.
That's when our business will then kick in for the Indian market. It's going to happen. At some point of time, India also is going to make investments in AI, having these servers located in our country. At that point of time, of course, the demand will go up. Those kind of 50 MW- 60 MW or 100 MW cannot be met by diesel engines. People will have to go for larger size gas engines or gas turbines. That's where we will then come in. At the moment, the hottest market is the U.S. market, I would say, followed by Europe and India is right now still in the talking stage.
Sure, sir. Thank you. Thank you so much for answering.
Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Ganesh ram from Unifi Capital. Please go ahead.
Thank you. Are you able to hear me clearly?
Yes, sir. I can.
Yes, Ganesh. Hello, how are you?
Doing well, Nikhil. Congratulations on the results. I must say, you keep your introductory remarks concise and to the point, which is very helpful. I would just like to follow up on some of this. Right. The tariff situation is volatile and quite frankly, a bit frustrating to watch because it keeps changing every now and then. I am asking this question from a customer point of view. Are you seeing any fatigue from their end, and are they saying, "Okay, let's wait and watch what happens." Are you seeing any scaling back in demand? Compared to other geographies where the tariffs also keep changing, are we still maintaining that arbitrage versus the other geographies?
I feel that, I was recently in the U.S. I spent there the whole of last week. My feeling is that the customers are prepared to pay between, let's say, 15%-25% more for power generation products. I think they already baked those into the numbers. I think the threshold is something like 25%-30% additional cost on tariffs. European products are basically-- For power generation equipment, very little is manufactured in the U.S. Most of it is manufactured in Europe and to a smaller extent, manufactured in Japan. We are I would say an outlier supplying generators from India. We are probably the only non-European or non-Japanese company which is supplying to the U.S. market in a big way. You already have 15% on European imports to the U.S. I think that customers have reconciled themselves to that number.
These investments are going to go on regardless because the power plant as a percentage, the overall investment rate in an AI server farm is something like 3%-4%. Even if it's up by 25%, it's going to be something like 1%-1.5% overall increase in cost, which is not significant from a point of view of someone like a large tech company putting up these kind of investments, someone like Microsoft or Meta or Google or whatever it is. We don't see any let up of demand. We have to make sure that from TDPS point of view, we have to make sure that we are in that range where our products, when delivered to the customers, don't cross that threshold of pain.
That's why I'm saying again and again that for a direct export to the U.S., if this 50% tariff continues beyond August, we will have to manufacture our generators in another country to avail of the lower tariffs from that third country. For us, we have an existing plant in Turkey, the fastest way for us to do this is to go to our existing plant in Turkey. That's what probably we will do as a first step, if this thing continues to get dragged on for a longer time, we may look at another more efficient option in some other place. All those things are right now very fluid, at the moment, what we can respond to immediately is that we have always been talking about, in this event, we will go to Turkey.
That's what we have on hand right now, this situation has now come to the point where we have to take that call, provided by end of August, we don't see any change in the current situation.
Understood. That's very helpful. In Turkey, this geography tends to be a bit difficult to navigate for businesses. Last I saw was on some other call, there were about 500 companies going bankrupt every month or so. What's going to be the challenges in scaling this up? I know you have staff there, you're already manufacturing some of it, are there any other operational risks? Because this is a geography we once considered exiting. What would be the financial impact on us because we have to read out production to Turkey now compared to just shipping out directly from India?
We have been there for seven years already in Turkey, and we have good experience in managing and operating our plant in that region. If we are doing dollar or euro-based sales, the situation is quite stable, but the moment we start doing Turkish lira kind of business, it becomes, from a currency point of view, unstable. I don't expect any problems in manufacturing the smaller number of machines which are now required, which are direct sales to the U.S. As I said, the threshold is that we have to make sure that the additional cost to our customers doesn't cross that threshold of pain what I earlier mentioned.
It is going to cost something more to move the products to Turkey and to ship them there, ship the components over there, do the further manufacturing over there, reassemble them there, again, ship it from there to the U.S. It's going to cost something more. Based on the calculations what we have done, we can manage the cost to be within that threshold of pain so that our customers are not going to get turned off by those numbers.
No, that makes a lot of sense, especially from the currency point of view. If I could just ask for one clarification. I'm sure you mentioned this before, but just to remind us or clarify. Status quo, what is our cost advantage versus Europe and Japan? With the tariffs and rerouting through Turkey, what will be the situation? If you could just give us a sense.
Let's say our product is INR 100. European or other products will be something like INR 125 or something like that, 25% more on a base before tariffs, then you have a 15% tariff on European products, it goes to something like INR 150. Our INR 100 should be somewhere in the region of INR 125 or INR 130 at the maximum. We still maintain an arbitrage of around INR 20, let's say.
Got it.
It comes down, and definitely as an absolute number, the gap gets reduced to some extent, but not to an extent where it jeopardizes our cost advantage. There is still a significant gap, although the gap comes down.
Got it. You're saying after rerouting, you will still be at INR 125-INR 130, which is although the gap is smaller, the gap exists and the customers will take it.
The INR 125 of the European has to be INR 150 because they have the 15% duty. That INR 20 gap is still there. Those are the rough numbers, of course, plus, minus. In general, this arbitrage still remains.
That makes perfect sense. Last question, I'll give chance to others after that, is the increase in employee cost this quarter, I assume is coming with the new sheds being commissioned. Are we on track with that?
We are on track with that. There are some small delays, we will start commissioning the third plant progressively from Q2, it will go on in Q3. There are some small delays.
Okay, understood. Thank you. Thank you, Nikhil. Good luck.
Thank you.
Thank you. A request to all participants. Please restrict your questions to two questions per participant. Our next question is from the line of C.A. Garvit Goyal from Nvest Analytics Advisory LLP. Please go ahead.
Hi. Congratulations for the recent numbers. Most of my questions are answered. Just one clarification. We are going to scale up our production in Turkey, that we spoke about. Do you think, looking at the recent things happen between India and Turkey during the war season, do you believe, is it going to be a permanent solution for TD Power in longer term?
No, as I said, I just mentioned a little bit earlier that for the moment, this is our fastest way to do this, and that's what we're going to do. We have the plant running, and it's a 100% subsidiary of TDPS. This is the fastest way for us to do, we'll do it. We need to breathe little bit right now. We need to have something and start breathing. Once we have the flow of products going in through our Turkish operation and the situation stabilizes, of course, we are going to look at a more efficient solution and look at whether a more efficient or more stable solution somewhere else. We will look at it, we'll examine it, and then we will take a call. Right now, I'm keeping that option open. I'm not committing myself that I'm going to go somewhere else.
Like you are just saying, one has to evaluate the risks, and we have to take a call and do what's best.
Got it. Thank you very much for your time and all the best for the future.
In general, I don't think that political differences between two governments really trickles down to business. I don't think that happens. At least it's not happening between India and Turkey.
Got it. Thank you, sir. Thank you very much.
Thank you. The next question is from the line of Jainam Jain from ICICI Securities. Please go ahead.
Thank you for the opportunity. Congratulations on the great set of numbers. Sir, my question is on the pricing side for motors and generators. Sir, what is the average realization of motors and generators we have? Maybe some broad range.
I can't give that number. Every motor is different, every generator is different. Sorry, I can't really give that number to you.
Okay, sir. Thank you. Okay.
Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Vinit Thakur from Plus91 AMC . Please go ahead.
Good afternoon, sir. Thank you for the opportunity and congratulations on the amazing results. I had just one quick question regarding promoter holding decline has been [inaudible]. Why it was mentioned in the last-
Sorry to interrupt, sir, your voice is breaking a lot.
Hello.
Hello?
Am I audible?
No, sir, your voice is still breaking. I request you to rejoin the queue.
Is it better now?
Could you speak something long sentence?
Yeah, I saw basic [inaudible] clarification.
No, sir. Your voice is still breaking.
I will rejoin.
I request you to rejoin the queue. Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Himanshu from BugleRock Asia . Please go ahead.
Hi, Nikhil. Good set of numbers.
Thank you very much.
I had some confusion on the statement what you gave about U.S. business. If I look at our annual report of this year, INR 145 crore of sales was through U.S. subsidiary and INR 216 crore is through German subsidiary. You are saying that out of this INR 216 crore, three-fourth goes to U.S. when we repackage, and that is what we like to build in or bring it back to Turkey for manufacturing. Is that the way or how should we understand it?
No, it is far more complicated than that, Himanshu. I cannot give you an explanation on the way that the European sales and U.S. sales takes place in relation to whatever I have been talking to you. It cannot be tied up one to one like that. Because there are so many other products that are sold through our U.S. subsidiary, so many other products sold through our European subsidiary. We do hydro, we do steam turbine, we do other products, we do geothermal. We do so many products through our other subsidiaries. It is not possible to say that only data center business has been done, and therefore you can do a one-to-one explanation in just a few sentences. I cannot answer this question to you in a very simplified way. I am sorry.
Would it be right to say that INR 150 type crore of sale is to U.S. and a portion of that goes through Europe?
I said to you that about 15%-20% of our overall sales is to the U.S. market. If we are going to do INR 1,500 crore, 20% of that will be INR 300 crore.
Sir, merely what the question comes that three-fourth, can the Turkey subsidiary scale up so quickly in next one year?
The capacity of our Turkish unit is, we have done in the past INR 120 crore of sales in one year, complete manufacturing in the Turkish unit. Here we're not doing complete manufacturing, we're going to be doing a partial manufacturing. Yes, it can take.
One last question, bookkeeping. What was the trade receivable at the end of the quarter, if Varalakshmi can give that number?
Varalakshmi, please.
Yes. It is INR 425 crore.
Okay.
It's the whole quarter's sales number, nearly is in that.
Okay.
Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Aditya Trivedi from Nepean Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi. Given TD Power's entry into long-duration energy storage, and this is as I've seen on the investor presentation through the commissioning of a generator for Energy Dome in Italy, what is the potential market size for CO2 battery storage plants globally? What growth outlook do you foresee for similar projects for TD?
I don't have an answer for that in terms of what is the growth potential in terms of numbers. One of our major customers in India has also tied up with this company, and they're also going a big way into the CO2 market with the same company. The Italian company is also licensing this technology to other companies all over the world. I don't know, it could enter into hundreds of megawatts after some time. It's very hard for us to say today with just the pilot plants being commissioned, how quickly this technology is going to be absorbed and rolled out across the world. Normally, these things take a little bit of time, but it's really a very exciting technology, and it takes CO2 from the air, from the atmosphere, so it's very environmentally friendly.
I can expect this to be a very large business in the future. As I said, one of our major Indian customers is also getting into this in a big way, and we're working with them very closely on this, I think that they will do very well in this segment.
Okay. Thank you so much. That's it from my end.
Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Amit Agicha from HG Hawa. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Thank you for the opportunity. Sir, what is the current size of the order book and how much of it is executable in FY 2026?
Vinay, you're on this call. Can you answer this? I think that we have INR 1,400 crore order book.
Yeah, we have executable order for this year, INR 1,450 crore. As Nikhil said, there is upward revenue possible, we have given an indication of INR 1,500 crore, book and bill looks to be only INR 50 crore. Already we are in a very comfortable situation for INR 1,500 crore.
The second question was, out of the INR 40 crore-INR 45 crore CapEx plan for FY 2026, how much is growth versus maintenance versus automation?
Varalakshmi, you can take this question, please.
See, replacement is around INR 20 crore, which is equal to the depreciation amount, and the other is for the growth.
Thank you for the reply, and all the best for the future.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Our next question is from the line of Akshay J. from Xponent Tribe. Please go ahead.
Hi, thank you for the opportunity. Sir, in the earlier questions, you spoke about the fact that when data centers become larger, the diesel gen set backups are not useful, and one needs to sort of put gas engines or gas turbines. Two questions here. One is that, why is it that diesel gen sets are not sort of usable? Is it that they cannot give high power requirements? Three, are gas engines and gas turbines interchangeable, or are they part of the same product that we would use?
Diesel engines, the largest diesel engines go up to maybe, I think 2 MW- 3 MW. The large manufacturers, whose names I mentioned a little bit earlier, 2 MW- 2.5 MW. If you have 100 MW requirement, you can't have 50 engines running in parallel. It's very complicated. No one invests like that. You would prefer to have three or four machines of 25 MW size or 20 MW size. That's how power plants are built. Nobody puts 50 engines or 100 engines running in parallel to meet a requirement of 100 MW. Gas engines go up to 10 MW-12 MW. Depending on the overall size, you have flexibility of which type of engine to use. In general diesel is not preferred. It's not possible to burn diesel to meet environmental requirements in the Western countries. You have to use gas.
Gas is the only solution for this kind of power generation in the Western countries.
Sure. When you were speaking about that in terms of an India CapEx build-out, our expectation is that when we have much larger data centers sort of running in India, that they would run on gas as backup and not on diesel. That's a fair assumption to have, right?
India is at talking stage right now. I think let's see how it evolves. I don't know. India needs to first figure out how it's going to get power for its basic infrastructure. Then we can talk about power for AI. For India, it's just a conversation that we can have. It's not grounded in reality right now. I think I'm not.
Certainly.
It's not on my radar screen right now.
Certainly. The second is the center that we are developing in the U.K. for larger size products that you spoke about in the last call and in the annual report. Can you help us understand, maybe in a little bit more detail, what kind of products that we are not making right now that we will end up sort of developing there? What is the opportunity we are seeing there, and when does it sort of start fructifying in terms of orders?
We are developing our own range of products for larger machines, say 50 MW - 150 MW, our own design. We need the design talent required to develop these products. That talent we have located in the U.K., and these U.K. nationals would like to work out of the U.K., and that's the reason why we have selected these people and created an infrastructure for them to work for us out of the U.K. The products I've already mentioned, this business above 50 MW is a very large business worldwide. Far, we have worked with another licensed partner to a large company, which has a lot of restrictions, and now we have come to the end of that contract and developing our own products in which we can address a much, much larger market.
This is something for our growth, which we're looking at 2028 onwards, we're building the foundation right now. We have to build in the design capability, manufacturing capability, then go out in the market in a big way with our own products. All these things take time, we are looking at this to be a big area of our business 2028 onwards.
Sure. If you look at your history and how you've kind of went from being a domestic focused company to a much larger global business, it took us a while to build credibility and be able to sell to different markets, right? I mean, if I can take a few steps back and look at a ten-year kind of a picture, right? For the newer larger products, would the journey be as long? You're saying 2028, which seems very short compared to, at least what it may have taken in the past. Is this something that we think because of the credibility we've generated so far, that the speed to market for larger product will be say, three years the first time?
Yeah. Of course. We're not an unknown entity in the market right now as we were 10 years ago. We are a known entity, and therefore it will take less time.
Sure. Certainly. Okay. That's helpful. Thank you.
Thank you. A request to all participants. Please restrict your questions to two questions per participant. Our next question is from the line of [Soham Dhingra] from PhillipCapital. Please go ahead.
Hello, sir. My question was with respect to the recent talks that the government, that there have been rumors about private sector participation in the nuclear sector in India. What kind of tailwinds do you see specifically for the company in case this actually happens and private sector is allowed to participate in the nuclear sector?
Yeah, we will certainly see a lot of increase in motor business.
Sorry, sir. Lot of?
We'll see a lot of increase in the motor business.
Okay. On the generator side?
No, those will be way beyond our size still, we're not going to be participating on the generator side. We're not going to be making 300 MW- 400 MW machines. That's not going to be our target, even for the smaller nuclear power plant, which will be in the private sector. There will be a lot required in each and every plant, and that's what we're targeting.
Okay. Thank you so much, sir.
Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Karthik from Suyash Advisors. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Hi, good afternoon. I just wanted to clarify the example you gave earlier of the cost differential between India and European manufacturers. You said INR 100 going to say INR 125 - INR 130. I'm assuming that the INR 100 already embeds the 10% tariff being imposed by the U.S. Can you split the remaining 30% into, say, 15% of incremental duty and 15%? How that would be paid? What I'm trying to really understand is how different would be the cost structure for doing stuff in Turkey versus India.
Yeah. These are ballpark numbers. INR 100 cost goes to INR 115, and INR 115 will then have a duty on top of that, so it goes to INR 130. Somewhere around INR 130. That's approximately where it's going to be.
No. What I wanted to understand is the cost of doing things, how is it different in Turkey versus India? Like to like, would Turkey be more expensive?
Earlier cost of INR 100 from India would become INR 115 ex-Turkey.
Yeah.
Approximately.
How much of that would be straight? I know you answered it, but.
I'm sorry, I can't give you all the numbers.
Fair enough. Thanks.
Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Naman Parmar from Niveshaay Investments. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Good afternoon, sir. Thank you so much for the opportunity. Firstly, I wanted to understand with the current two facility, how much revenue potential can you do, and the third plant will be commissioning by?
The third plant will be progressively commissioned, as I said, in Q2 or Q3. Initially, we will have an additional capacity to take us to around INR 2,000 crore, We are already working on optimization and better manufacturing, lean manufacturing, and other things like that. We easily see a potential to take this to INR 2,300 crore-INR 2,400 crore. We will not be making further investment, large investment, at least for the next two years, and we want to utilize our assets in a much better way.
Okay. Understood. Secondly, on the order book side, can you just give the breakup how much is from the generator and the motors?
Yeah, I don't have that number with me, we can give it to you offline.
Okay. Yeah. Thank you. Lastly, on the labor sourcing side, as you mentioned earlier that the major manufacturing is not happening in Turkey. Don't you think the sourcing of the labor is a very key challenge there in the Turkey region? How you will manage that risk, sir?
We need some five or 10 people. It's not a big deal. It's not we don't need 500 people.
Okay.
We need maybe 10 people.
Okay. Lastly, on the tariff side, Current situation, what is perceived in the U.S.? Like you are getting a major order, All the impact of the tariff has been borne by the customer only, right? You are not bearing any impact on the tariff. As you mentioned that the other competitors in the Europe and Japanese are mostly costly above around INR 20, if your product costs around INR 100.
Yeah. I have already given the numbers on all of this. Please excuse me, I don't want to repeat it the third time.
Okay. Yeah. Okay. Thank you so much.
Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Balasubramanian from Arihant Capital Markets Limited. Please go ahead.
Good afternoon, sir. Sir, that U.K. design center is majorly focused on develop larger generators like 40 MW-100 MW. What is the CapEx for this initiative, and what is the expected timeline for commissioning this 100 MW generator? Is there any requirement JV with OEM for this initiative?
We have already made the manufacturing investments a long time ago, and we don't have to make major investments to do this.
When we can expect a commercialization, sir?
We have just started the design center. We will update you on the progress in the upcoming quarters.
Okay, sir. Thank you.
We just started the design and just started the, no, it will take time. We will get back to you.
Thank you. Our next follow-up question is from the line of Ganesh ram from Unifi Capital. Please go ahead.
Thank you. Just some bookkeeping questions. If you could just clarify the situation on working capital, such as receivables, payables, and inventory. On other income, what's the extent of forwards we've booked and how should we see this pan out? What's the sensitivity to forex here?
Varalakshmi, can you take this question?
Yeah. Working capital, actually, it is running around 120 days, this is what it will be because the revenues are also towards the end of the quarter. There is very high billing and all, it comes into the picture. 120 days is what you can estimate. The forward booking of euros we have done for this year, we are quite well-placed on those numbers.
I'm just trying to get a sense of where this other income number is going to land up if there's anything that we should know from the forex point of view, because it was quite elevated last year. That's the reason.
It will have to be taken on a quarter-on-quarter basis, depending on the movement of euros because the quarter and what we have booked. It will have to be reviewed on a quarter-on-quarter basis. Difficult to make any commitment for the full year right now.
Okay. Currently, how many people do we have employed in Turkey who are manufacturing staff?
Currently we have-
About five to six.
Okay. 10 more people from here. Understood. Okay, thank you.
L et's not make a big deal about this.
Understood.
You know.
Understood.
I'm talking about it, really.
Understood. Okay, thank you.
Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Kiran from Table Tree Capital. Please go ahead.
Hi, thanks for the question. Sir, some tough times. I hope we all come out of this together. My question is more on the promoter selling that happened. In terms of further selling. Because we have been, promoter shareholding is lower as it is, there has been further selling that has happened over the past three months back or two months back. In terms of any assurances that there's not going to be any more promoter selling or there's nothing of that sort? If you could just give some clarity on that'd be great.
There is nothing of that sort planned at least for the next two to three years. At this point of time, I can say that we're not at all looking at that for the next 24 months at least.
Okay. Sure. Okay, thank you.
Thank you. Our next question is from the line of Amit Anwani from PL Capital. Please go ahead.
Yeah. Just one follow-up, sir, on the aftermarket and spares. If you could give some sense for aftermarket and spares business growth from here for us, will it be at company rate? Second, is there any possibility of market expansion? Are we doing aftermarkets? There also, are we seeing the opportunity in export market? Some color on the aftermarket and spares business for next two years, sir.
Vinay, can you answer, please?
Yeah. Aftermarket business, as we told in the last quarter also, we are focusing more on that. As a result of that, we have got a very big order in the last quarter for the refurbishment job, mainly in the hydro. This aftermarket business is mainly coming from the hydro market. Also, we are looking for aftermarket business outside India, and we also participated in one big exhibition in the U.S. last to last week. Yeah, it is going to grow. There are good number of orders we are participating in the tenders, and if they get converted into orders, those are big numbers. Are going to be big numbers.
Yes. What is the current contribution, and will it grow faster than the products business?
It will not grow faster than the product business. New product is the main growing business for us. Because in generators, our own generator fleets are quite young, and we are not targeting our own fleet of generators. We are targeting all our competitors' machines as well. One is the replacement business and the other one is the refurbishment business.
We said that our aftermarket business will be something like 6%-7% of sales, and we stick to that.
Sure, sir. Thank you so much, and all the best to you.
Thank you.
Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, as there are no further questions, I now hand the conference over to Mr. Nikhil Kumar, Managing Director of TD Power Systems Limited for closing comments. Thank you, and over to you, sir.
Thank you, everybody, for joining our call. If you have any further questions, please feel free to get in touch with us. We look forward to interacting with you or seeing you personally at some upcoming investor conference in August and September. Thank you.
Thank you. On behalf of TD Power Systems Limited, that concludes this conference. Thank you for joining us, and you may now disconnect your lines.