Iguatemi S.A. (BVMF:IGTI11)
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Apr 28, 2026, 1:55 PM GMT-3
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Earnings Call: Q3 2022

Nov 8, 2022

Speaker 1

Good morning, everyone, and thank you for holding. At this point, we would like to welcome you to the results conference call from Iguatemia S. A. For the Q3 'twenty two. Today, we have with us Ms.

Christina Bet, company CEO and Mr. Italo Caliendo, the VP for Finance and IR Officer. This event is being recorded, and all participants will be in listen only mode during the company's presentation. In doing this, we will go on to the question and answer session, at which time further instructions will be given. This event is also being broadcast live and may be accessed through Iguatemi's Investor Relations website at www.ri.iguatemi.com.br, where the slide presentation is also available for download.

Participants may view the slides at their convenience. As a reminder, the forward looking statements made herein are based on beliefs and assumptions of Iguatemi's management and on information currently available to the company. They involve risks, uncertainties and assumptions as they relate to future events and they will depend on circumstances which may or may not occur. Investors and analysts should understand that overall economic conditions, industry conditions and other operating factors could also impact the future results of Iguatemi and cause results to differ materially from those expressed in such forward looking statements. We will now turn the floor over to Ms.

Christina Betts, who will begin today's presentation. You may proceed, ma'am. A good day to all of you. Once again, here we are with the results of Iguana Mi and we show the progress that we had made. We had accelerated growth throughout the year and we continue to observe this trend in the Q4 2022.

In our results, you will see our sales resiliency. Our malls continue to perform above what was expected and have remained stable throughout the year. We had a growth of 131% in total sales, growth of 21% compared to the Q3 2019. We have also had a correction above the inflation and we have withdrawn discounts and this has leveraged our rental indicators with a growth of almost 62% visavis2019 with a real gain of 4 percentage points above that period. For more than 12 months, we have been observing this positive indicator, What is also positive in our results and that will be mentioned by Guido is our delinquency levels that have been kept very low.

This means we have recovered the delinquency we had in other periods. And this is a positive reflection of the health of our store owners, of the sales of our store owners that are doing very well in terms of sales. And we are able not only to collect the leases, but we are also, heading to resolving the outstanding rentals that we had in the court suits and we're returning to normalcy. We're going to remark on the results throughout the presentation. I would like to refer to our follow on.

This was the first one of the sectors since 2019, amounting to BRL720 1,000,000, 4.5 times greater than the subscription base. Now this will aid our inorganic growth, our capital structure. And of course, besides making the most of the market moment, we're also going to be remarking on our debt makeup, what it is that we can do to improve our capital structure makeup. During this period, we also had the acquisition of JK Rotimi, our partner, Deercraft, is under the process of acquiring 36 percent of TierraCraft. With this, we will be able to reach 100% of the shares.

We have already concluded the contract that will be approved by the antitrust agency, on the 18th. And this entire process should have its closure at the end of November. During this period, we had the inauguration of our corporate tower Sky Galeria. We can already see the building from a distance. It is an icon of the corporate real estate market in Campinas.

And if not the best, it is simply one of the best of these corporate towers created in Campinas and the delivery of the project and because of its quality renews our commitment that we have made oftentimes a commitment with quality that we want to have in its surroundings. Now to move away a bit from this topic and to speak about digital transformation, we continue on with our digital strategy. The idea, of course, is to connect the online and offline market and to have a very good connection with our audience at large. The first highlight of the digital part is the launch of the Ecoatemy Connections that encompasses our entire network. This is something unheard of in the market for those who are purchasing during the year.

You can register your purchase and exchange this for some very premium products. For example, the crystals from NACMAN or Mandarin and Tuck TAC. This of course has been a success. In the Q1, we increased the number of sales threefold compared to the same period 2021. And our malls in the countryside have also adhered to this allowing for a significant growth.

We're quite enthusiastic with this. It will extend up to December and will become part of our events calendar in the coming years. What I would also like to refer to is that we are back full force in terms of events. We had multiple events happening at all of our shopping malls throughout the year end. But since June July, we have the beginning of the June festivities and a great deal happening.

The highlight is the Iguana de Me talks fashion and event that we have already held. We hold it at JK shopping mall, where we bring together people that are very important in the fashion world. They speak about trends and about all of these issues. And we had 100 percent of appearance of the audience. This is the first physical event after the pandemic and everybody is very keen to return to these face to face events with this renewal now.

Iguatemi 3 65 5 continues to evolve. We have the greatest sales volume in its historical series since 2019, a growth of practically 100% when we compare the Q3 of 2022 to that of 2021, besides having relevant traffic with an increase of more than 30%. So everything is in line with our mission and our values and our vision and our ESG agenda. We have spoken broadly about ESG. We not only have replaced, but have begun with new committees.

Yesterday was the the first meeting of our digital committee, which is not full time, but we have made a commitment of setting 1 up since we worked on our company management. Now all of these committees are already operational with their respective members who are independent. And this allows us to comply with our commitment made during the company restructuring. What is also important in our journey, we mentioned that this was a year of mapping. We have concluded our materiality matrix at Iguatemiasa.

It includes our following steps and this should be concluded at the beginning of 2023. We have also carried out an inventory of greenhouse gases. So we're making significant strides and affirming our commitments going forward. We participated in the Brazil Summit in Columbia University in New York and we're also part of the Global Pact of which we are a signatory. We have gotten here to the last quarter of the year.

We're already in the month of November. We only have 2 months until the end of the year. We're highly confident with the end of the year. We have Black Friday in the horizon. We have also had excellent results throughout the year 2022 and we continue to be deeply committed with our projects and we continue to work on the evolution of our portfolio, delivering enhancements that what they permanently and of course, keeping in mind our shareholders and stakeholders.

Now with this, I would like to go on to the presentation. We go to Page 3 that refers to the operation status. As I mentioned, this refers to our sales. The 3rd quarter was quite strong. We had a conversation in the Q2 about the evolution of sales.

You will see we had a good recovery in the Q3. We ended July August with increases over 2019 September, 131% and in October, 129% above 2019%. Now to speak about the high end line, it's at the 3rd quarter, total sales reached DKK4.0 billion in the Q3 2022 as I said in the opening 22.8% versus the Q2 2021 28.1% above and over the Q3 2019. Same store sales growing 28.1%, same area sales. Same store rents increased 61.4%, 1.4 percentage points over the IDPM and same area rents were up 46.5%.

Gross revenue reached BRL 309.9 million, 22% over the Q3 2021 47.9% for the Q3 2019. Net revenue benefited by the reduction of discounts, obtaining BRL 254,300,000, up by 19 0.5 percent over the Q3 of 2021 38.2 percent over the Q3 of 2019. Adjusted consolidated EBITDA with an increase of 10.6% over the Q3 2019 with a 65.2 percent EBITDA margin. If we exclude the straight line effect, EBITDA came to BRL182 1,000,000 by 40 3.5 percent versus the 3rd quarter 2021 at 21.5 percent over the Q3 2019. Adjusted net income reached BRL 56,500,000, up by BRL166.9 million over Q3 2021.

And adjusted this, this means we are excluding the straight line of debt and for commerce and we had non recurring expenses with Cortezdomas, which were also adjusted. FFO adjusted reaching BRL97.7 million 60 percent over the Q3 2021, 5.4 percent, down over the Q3 2019. On the next page, we speak about the leverage because of the follow on. We closed at 1.83 times net debt over EBITDA. The company issued a secondary public offering of DKK720 1,000,000.

We have already referred to the acquisition of JK Mall. The closure is expected by the end of November. What we have not mentioned is the reorganization of indirect investment in intra commerce. We were working on offshore fund called Navigator Class C. We redeemed these shares and we received our infracomber shares and we have concentrated them in an exclusive vehicle domiciled in Brazil.

We will be reporting this going forward. We've already spoken about Iguatemi Collection, Sky Galleria and Iguatemi Talux Fashion. It's simply to show you some of the images of Sky Galeria, the tower we're on Page 8. It has been opened. We have 60% of the GLA marketed.

And until December, we will have 3 floors opening and they will be delivered unit by unit. We have an average contracted rent of BRL 81.50 per square meter, an excellent figure. Average grace period of 4 months. We have already referred to the total DLA. We have the lead gold seal for this tower and everything that this represents, of course, the electric car charging points, water efficiency, a generator for 100% of common and private areas, helping us in the certification.

And one day we should come together and visit Sky Galleria. With this, I would like to give the floor to Guido Olivera. A good morning to everybody. We now go on to Slide number 10 to speak about main operational indicators. When we compare the Q3 2022 to that of 2021 2019, In terms of total GLA, we had very little alterations in 2019, we sold Iguatemica Chias and Florianopolis.

This was offset in 2020 with the acquisition of Esplanada and a stake that we bought in Iguatemi, Porto Alegre. We have 16 shopping malls and an assessment of our valuation of 6.8 total sales already mentioned by Chris, but I would like to highlight our portfolio. Same store sales increased visavis to 19, 28%, very strong sales in the Q3. And when we look at our same store rents in the Q3, 61.8 percent compared to 2019, a growth of 2 percent above the IGPM for the period showing the strength and resiliency of our portfolio and the withdrawal of discounts that of course have aided and abetted our portfolio. Same store rents with an increase of 35.7 percent, compared with IGP and IPCM of 9%, almost 20% of real growth visavis2021, a very strong growth When we look at same store rents, same area rents, we're in line.

Once again, we complied with that catch up in same store rents and same area rents vis a vis 2021. It is important to highlight that even though we have transferred rents and our sales, our occupancy cost increased 12.2%. Our nominal costs continue to be in line and we're working very strongly in not transferring inflation is something we had not done in the last 5 years. So we have a very healthy situation of our store owners. The inflation rate continues to grow 92.2% on average.

And we reinforce our forecast of having a 95% occupation until the end of the year on December 31. For the 2nd consecutive quarter, we have a net delinquency rate that is already lower than 2 19. We had already mentioned this in the Q2. And the net delinquency rate in the opening and closing is lower than that of 2019 along with our delinquency rate as a whole and the increase in rental tariffs, we believe it will continue to be negative. This thanks to the work of our collection area that has been focusing on this.

We go on to Slide 11 to look at our consolidated financial results. Chris has already mentioned this, a record gross revenue of DKK254,000,000, a growth of 19.1 percent visavis2021percent31percentvisavis3rdquarter2019. Our EBITDA reaching BRL165,000,000 with a margin of 65.2 percent, growing 15 percentage points over 21% 22% vis a vis2019. Now the sale of Iguatemicachias was carried out in the Q3 2019. The recurrent growing 3.6%.

When we look at the variation of revenues and expenses, we have an increase because of the increase in the Selic rate when compared with 2019, 2020 2021. The rate has been much higher in these periods, dollars 3.75 and an impact on our financial expenses of $20,000,000 from a court agreement that we had already mentioned in the 2nd quarter with an impact of $20,000,000 in our expenses due to this agreement, which is nonrecurrent. Now Chris has already mentioned the restructuring that we did in our infracommerce investments. They will be accounted after September 30th beginning on October 1st based on the equity method, which means we will no longer have a variation in this line item. The last quarter with this variation had this method and that is why we have a gain of 172,000,000 beginning in October 3.

We have brought all of these investments with an FIP. Centralizing this growth, we redeemed everything from the Fundo Navigator as mentioned by Chris. It is important to show you that our adjusted net profit reaches DKK56 1,000,000 eliminating nonrecurring adjusted funds from operations. We now go on to Slide number 12 on the next page. Here you can observe the figures without straight lining effect and infra commerce effect comparing the Q3 2022 with the Q3 2021 2019, our cash proxy was 68% margin visavishe3rd quarter 2021 of BRL127 1,000,000 and BRL100 1,000,000 visavis 2019.

We would like to highlight our income tax Aliquote and the use of fiscal benefits throughout the year. In the Q3, our Aliquote was 3.6% and the accrued figure for 9 months is approximately 5.8% for cost over profit. We will close the year considering all of this work with the JK operation, which will have its closure until November 30th. We will have 1 month of JK as part of our accounting. And of course, we will work with an average rate below 9% for the entire year.

We go on to Slide 13. We have a recovery of the retail results vis a vis the other quarters. This is the best quarter in the year with a negative margin of minus 20% compared to a margin of minus 52%, a recovery coming from an improvement in revenue with a growth of 10%. And compared to 2021, our net revenue grew 33% now. This, thanks to the increase in the retail stores, the international part and the sales at Iguatemit3 65, an improvement of GMV vis a vis 2021, improvements in headcount making our EBITDA margin go from a negative margin of 52% to 20 0.2%.

We go on to Slide 14 to speak about the SA malls with our margins preserved at €187,000,000 of EBITDA margin when compared to 2019 and 2021. If we look at other operational revenue, we of course, also had expenditures in the incorporation of residential and corporate towers during that period. Now here the revenues come from an improvement in the resale. And in the last quarter, we should account for our towers, which is something that we do recurrently year after year. And after the signature of the contracts, we will be referring to all of this throughout the quarter.

It is important to show you that vis a vis 2021, we had a drop in the discounts, a drop of 34.8% even with a growth of 21% in gross revenue. We go on to Page 15 to look only at the growth of rentals. A gross revenue visavis2019 of 35.6 percent in all revenues. When we look only at the rentals, 43.2% because we transferred inflation. Now parking growing 18% and although the flow continues to be somewhat lower than 2019, we have a growth in revenues because of an increase in the parking rates and because of the collection into shopping malls where for Burley we did not charge for parking.

Iguatemijio Preto and another with an increase of 35.6%. We go on to Slide 16 to look at our rental revenue, a growth of 43.2 percent visavis2019 in terms of 2021, a growth of 16.7%. The minimum rental with a growth of 44.6 percent overage, growing 38%, very strong sales in the international part with a significant overage. When we compare this to 2021, there is a drop in overage once again because of the reduction in the discounts. We decreased the discounts considerably in 2021, 2022 and transferred this revenue.

And of course, there is a percentage decrease. What you should observe is the significant growth in our temporary rentals And we're referring to Leaflet and all of the activations. In this case, as we have been mentioning, we have the best event venues in most of the cities where we operate. Of course, Sao Paulo stands out in this and we no longer have any room in our events venue until the end of the year because of this strong growth. And during the Q4, the growth will be 34 percent in these revenues.

We go on to Slide 17 to look at the cost of our malls. When compared to 2021 2019, very healthy costs, a growth of only 2 percent. Of course, we do have variations in some line items in the Q3 of 2022 to an increase in personnel and a decrease in 3rd party services. This is a change that we carried out in our commercial area. We were working with an outsourced commercial area.

We have brought everything in house and the commercial team now is our own team. And that is why we have the variation in these line items. The cost as you can observe is extremely sound when compared to the inflation, a drop in the other costs, the parking, for example, a drop of 23% in our costs. And when we compare this to 2019, what draws attention is the increase in the cost of parking because we have begun to charge for parking in Now we have gone back to operating at full steam with our malls. We have no lack of capacity compared to 2019.

And you can see that all of the costs are fully under control. We go to the expenses on Page 18, all below the inflation variation and this is compared with the Q3 of 2021 2019. This is due to the long term incentives with a variation on share based compensation. The 3 tranches for the long term, which presently has been stabilized beginning in 2022. In 2019, we had a $1,620,000,000 which was 1 tranche in the first quarter, dollars 2,100,000 and now BRL 3,000,000, which accounts for the 3 tranches.

When we look at the other line items, nothing worthy to mention. Only the personnel line item where we have a number of employees very similar to that of 2019. We had a drop in the payroll, of course, because of the impacts of the pandemic. We have worked on this throughout 202021 and now all the shopping malls are operating at full steam. But once again, the costs are fully under control.

We go on to Slide 19 to look at our debt profile. As Chris mentioned, we did carry out a very successful follow on with 4.5 times the subscription base. We were able to capture DKK720 1,000,000. This was the first time that this was done since 2019. Now the cash of BRL 1,070,000,000 has been applied with a drop of 30% and it means that our net debt EBITDA ratio has dropped to 1.83 times.

The resources will be used for the acquisition of JK shopping mall that will have its closure at the end of November. Our amortization program, proceeding calmly. The cost of debt increases. If we look at Slide number 20 to EUR 14.5 billion, our cost is 106% of CDI at an average length or duration of the debt of 3 years. We have been working on liability management and along with the management of JK after the follow on, we're going to assess the liability management and work jointly with the JK shopping mall, enabling us to capture a debt to prepay the debt that has a higher cost.

With this, I would like to end the presentation and I would like to thank you for your attention at this point. We will now go on to the question and answer session only for investors and analysts. Our first question is from Gustavo Cambayova from BTG Pactual. You may proceed, Gustavo. A good day to all of you.

We have two questions at our end. Well, first of all, the increase in your capital structure, which is the scenario for growth now that you have reinforced your cash position? You have announced the JK M and A, but are you thinking of accelerating the greenfield M and As? Or are there other opportunities with this recovery of sales and recovery of your portfolio? Will there be room to carry out new projects?

My second question refers to the operational part. You have shown us that it continues to be very strong in October, which is your outlook for the year because of the inflation and interest rate that will be somewhat lower, the IGPM going forward? Will you be able to still have a real growth in rentals even though you did have this catch up period since 2019. If your outlook for the coming year is of real growth in the rental part. Thank you very much.

Hello. Is everything okay? Well, to respond to your first question about capital allocation. Our outlook is still not to consider greenfield projects. We do have better opportunities in other strategies.

You spoke at length of M and As. And if we look at our portfolio, we have significant opportunities of capturing better efficiency in our portfolio. And of course, this will also demand capital in our portfolio. I think we have things that will come before greenfield expansions, for example. So we're still not very enthusiastic with greenfield projects.

This does not mean we will never build a new shopping mall again. But in the short term, this is not part of our radar. We do have more accretive opportunities for the company than focusing on greenfields. In terms of the outlook for 2023, we're quite confident. We spoke in previous calls of the age of consumption behavior, especially for consumers between the medium and higher brackets.

There's a significant stickiness for us. We see that people have learned to carry out their purchases more locally. It's more comfortable. It's easier. The services tend to be better.

You can pay for them in 10 installments on your credit card. Now this helps us visavis the international sales. And there is a drop in inflation of interest rate and this should of course be a stimulus 30% visavis 2022 will be difficult, but we will have real growth. We're quite enthusiastic with the year 2023. And to complement what Chris said, if we look at the close and everything that we have delivered this year and the, actions carried out with JK Mall and all of the allocations and everything that is underway.

We believe that in 2023, we will have real growth above and beyond inflation. We will continue to deliver quarter on quarter a real growth based on ITPM and the broader consumer price index. Well, thank you. Thank you very much, Chris and Guido. Have a good day.

Our next question is from Victor Tapia. You may proceed, sir. Hey, good morning, everybody. A point that I would like to discuss with you regarding occupancy. You have reaffirmed that your guidance is to reach 95% at the end of the year in December.

I would like to gain an understanding of what is happening with that figure and which have been the negotiations, the commercial conditions, prices per square meter and the grace period as well. The second point I would like to discuss regarding your court agreement, which was the annexation of the contract between the broader Consumer Price Index and IGPM, which was the agreement that you were able to reach, if you could refer to this in greater detail. Please. Yes, I will begin with the occupancy rate. We're quite confident in the recovery of our occupancy rate.

We've been carrying out considerable work since we moved away from the pandemic, even before the pandemic. And we have had a drop, which we're now recovering. Presently, we have an occupancy that is better when we entered into the pandemic and we have to continue to close these vacant areas. It's very important for us to properly fill in our space. You have heard that sometimes to close a vacancy is simple, but to do it successfully tends to be more difficult.

And we're taking our time because we're fighting to have a store owner that will make sense for the shopping mall at the correct conditions. And you can see the repercussion now in the figures of the company in same area rents where we had a strong recovery. This because we were able to work with this type of recovery and sales as well. It's a non sense to put in a store owner in the shopping mall if they won't give trust to this, their own sales and the sales of others in the shopping mall, they're not only working with a sales point, they have to help the entire ecosystem to sell more. We have carried out good negotiations.

The strong recovery of sales this year was extremely important, enabling us to have greater strength in our negotiation. There's a great deal of demand for our space. So we're in a very good moment. In 2020, of course, we were offering benefits, grace periods because we were in a poor moment. But we do have very specific points.

Most of the store owners are now adhering to the table that we have in the company and life continues on normally for 2023. We will begin at a different level vis a vis 2022. We will have a higher occupancy rate with a lesser scarcity. And of course, we can perhaps become more aggressive going forward. Thank you.

Now to speak about our court agreement, Vitor. It has nothing to do with this. This is a very ancient contingency, perhaps one of the oldest ones we had. We included this as a subsequent event and this arises from a contract of a participation in the shopping in Guatimimrio, a shopping that was sold out in 2012, I believe. We had a clause of participation with a lot that dates back to 1996 or 1994, he apologizes, before the real plan, before Guido ever joined the company.

I joined in 1996 and there was a buyback clause for the developers at that point. And there was a discussion because of the IGPM index For those who remember during the real plan, we had IGPM 1, IGPM 2 and they had purchased the full IGPM and All of this of course, made us to stop paying. This became judicialized. It was taken to court. And at the end of last year, they validated the application of the ITPM, the correct ITPM.

And that is when we were able to make an agreement. We offered them a compensation based on what they had received and added DKK20 1,000,000. This is what we have in our contingency. Thank you. Now simply a very quick follow-up on that.

On the first question, I understand that you're quite confident. We're already in the Q4. We're in mid November, which means we will get to the end of December with a 95% occupancy rate without grace periods and without further discounts at least. This is my reading. If you could confirm this, The follow-up on the second question of what happened in the pandemic and your contracts.

If you expect to have higher liabilities because of this, no. Quite the contrary, everybody that went to court ended up losing. I don't know if you have followed up on this. During the pandemic, the judiciary was highly paternalistic and decided to freeze everything. And Minister Bancozo from the Supreme Court last week or this week, I believe stated that all of the chambers and courts, of course, the taxation courts in Brazil had to speed up their suits.

There was an accumulation because they were not being judged and everything is proceeding at a much faster pace. So those who went to court because of that famous IGP M ended up losing because this is contractual. They would win in the first instance, but end up losing in the second instance. Very good. Thank you.

Our next question is from Bruno Mendoza from Bradesco BBI. You may proceed, sir. Good morning, everybody. Thank you for the presentation. We have 2 questions at our end.

The first about parking. We have seen that the parking has increased significantly 44% year on year, but there's still a gap when you think back in 2019. Do you think that there's room to continue to grow at a faster pace to close this gap or through the readjustment of prices? This is my first question. The second question refers to retail and Iguatemi 365.

The revenues have been growing strongly. The expectation is to reach a breakeven point in 2023 or do you have a project in the pipeline that could consume these funds? And which is the CapEx that you're projecting going forward? Thank you very much. Good morning, Bruno.

Is everything okay to speak about parking? Well, it works differently in parking. We see that sales are very strong and the flow of vehicles continues to be lower than in 2019. If we look at some of the malls that are part of our flagship, we're above 2.19. But in the portfolio as a whole, we're 5% below 2.19 percent.

And of course the malls are still suffering at present, especially those that are more geared to the corporate audiences. We have a growth in the revenues, the parking revenues when compared to 2021 have had significant growth because course, we have had a better flow. We still had idle capacity in 2021 because of the effects of the pandemic. Now the growth we have now is due to 2 factors, increase in the parking rates, of course that have incorporated inflation as a whole and also because of the parking we're charging in 2 different shopping malls in the countryside. Now, we continue on with a greater flexibility in the country.

Everybody has been vaccinated. And of course, we do think there is room to transfer the inflation to our parking rates. We have mentioned this in other calls and in meetings with you. We speak about the work we're doing here and we will of course revise our parking tables. We should have some novelties coming forward and this should enable us to increase our revenues.

Now to speak about retail in Iguatema 3.65, in fact, we did have a very good quarter, an increase of the GMV and 365 an increase in the sales of retail stores. Well, what we observe in our store owner portfolio and the work, especially based on 365, being carried out with greater efficiency for 2023, we will become ever more efficient, but we still will not reach a breakeven point in Iguatemi 365. I spoke to some of you, Iguatemi 365 has to make that technical pit stop. We know very clearly what we want to do. We have a good strategy.

The problem is that technology does not keep up with what we want to deliver. So we have to migrate platforms. We're reaching the conclusion of this process. And after Black Friday and Christmas, we will begin with this work that should be concluded before Mother's Day, most certainly or hopefully before Carnival. And with this, of course, we will have several changes in the process.

Our stakes are greater here, but we still will not reach a breakeven point. Now CapEx is extremely low because Iguatemi 365 practically does not have CapEx. We're referring more specifically to OpEx. This will go through our P and L. And there's very little to do in retail.

The expectation is not to add any new brand the coming year for retail. In truth, we're thinking of expanding what we have in Brazil. Thiago, we have the 2nd store of Birken stock in JK, a super great seller in our portfolio. So all of this should take place, but the CapEx will be extremely low. Once again, our efficiency will have to improve, but will not enable us to reach breakeven in 2023.

Thank you. Thank you very much. Our next question is from Andre Manzini from Citibank. You may proceed. Good morning, Chris and Guido.

Thank you for the call. First about the M and A with JK Moll much better than we had ever imagined with an asset of that type. I still believe that sellers are looking at that cap and see if they can use this to obtain a higher value in the next deal? Or does each seller have a different idea of the cap rate? And well, if this is the mindset with those people that you speak about M and A, this is my first question.

The second question, you had a positive aliquote during this period. What has caused this positive aliquote? Why has it been so positive for you in the release? Perhaps this is due to your increase in expectation of fiscal benefits going forward or the company makeup. And by paying your taxes, if you will have a full aliquot for 2022, if this is what is happening.

And how much taxes do you pay every quarter? Thank you. Good morning, Mazzini. I'm going to begin answering your question. In the M and A.

And I joke that the parties have to have a good match. And this only happens when one wants to sell, the other wants to buy and the conditions are there. It seems to be very obvious. But we do create an image, a spreadsheet, but we have to have a match with the other party. And for some time already, and the market is somewhat at a standstill in terms of M and As, the expectations of the seller and the buyer are different.

There was no way to bridge the difference that existed. We were able to close this deal and carry out the acquisition of the 36% of JK. You mentioned it was very positive, but it makes sense. It makes sense for both parties. We had a very long a transparent discussion with Keyur Craft.

I think the better word is transparent and it made sense for both parties. I truly believe we will have further conversations on M and A and the prices will become more realistic than they were in the past. Because what is correct is that the 2 years of the pandemic have shown players that perhaps are not as specialized as we are that this is not such an easy business that this requires caution. Well, shopping mall is not a fixed bond. You have to have security, cleaning, logistics.

You have to open and close a shopping mall. It's not something that you just leave on the back burner. So the network strength is also very important and was during the pandemic. We were able to negotiate condominium contracts. We were able to hold back on our logistic, concede something when it was necessary, work with discounts, something we would never have done previously.

So this also shows us that to be part of a group to have a portfolio that is strong does make a difference. It makes a difference in the results at present and it makes a difference in what you would like to do going forward. We're going to hold more conversations. We already are having more conversations compared to 2 or 3 years ago before the pandemic. And to have been able to close a deal of a trophy asset like JK shopping mall.

It's fantastic. JK Mall is one of the 5 top malls in Brazil. It's also a new mall with a great deal of growth going forward. Well, we'll the entire year we have been working on this. Iguate Mi was incorporated by the ancient Jere Satti company.

And in this incorporation, of course, we did make adjustments when we look at Jerezatti Constructions. We brought the cash to Iguatemi. And we created a company, Calas, based on companies that, of course, could make use of this fiscal loss. This is what we did initially. And we do have a blend of companies with presumed profit companies that were having accrued losses and we were able to make the most of these losses, taking in their cash.

And when you show that you have a result in these companies, we begin to activate the companies and the losses begin to activate the cost. That is why we had an improvement in the Q3. The Aleko nowadays that we showed you on Slide 12 of 13.6 or 3.6, I'm sorry, Already takes into account what we did during the year, removing the effects of infra commerce. When it came in, we had a loss in our profit in the align item capital instruments. All of this was deferred and then it reduces our taxes.

It reduces the losses based on the variation of revenues and expenses. Now with the acquisition of JK Shopping as this will become part of Iguana S. A. That has losses because of the incorporation of the shares that JDS Sate already had. We're going to begin to make the most of these losses and we're going to use their revenues work with activation dollars 40,000,000 $50,000,000 approximately.

And throughout the Q3, we have transferred part of the share of JK to this company, Guatemi S. A. So JK Impregnimientos was taken out and we had another increase of 20% now that it is part of the company Guatemi S. A. And along with this operation with the real estate operations, we will be able to activate all of these losses, reach a better efficiency and we will once again operate with an Aliquote in 2023 and Aliquote of 20% similar to what we were of 20% similar to what we were operating in the last few years.

And this because we have been able to consolidate this new structure that began in Have a good day, Chris and Guido. Our next question is from Sanjay Orenghi from Santander. Fani O'Renge from Santander Bank. You may proceed, ma'am. Thank you for taking the question.

Most of my questions have been answered. If you could give us more color in terms of your liability management going forward? And the second question, a simpler question. I would like to gain a better vision of the shop owner demands, not your expectation for occupants until the end of the year. There has been a change in the demands of shop owners who are entering the mall at present.

Thank you. Hello, Fani. Let's begin with the liability management. When we received JK development, it was above the average cost of Iguatemia. It was a holding with the entry of the resources of the follow on.

We already carried out some payments through a direct operation with the bank above CDI +2, which already gave us a gain. Now with the acquisition of JK at present, we will conclude this at the end of November. We still have some obligations, but everything should end at the most until November 25th. And with this, we will work with the company movements. We're going to generate a real estate credit.

This real estate credit has already been concluded with a bank at a lower rate. So this is a 20 year real estate operation and an operation based on CPI that we're negotiating at present. And with these resources, we're going to have to wait for the year to go back because that company that we acquired from JK, we'll have to change the name and the presumed profit method. All of this will be done at the beginning of next year. And this will enable us to work and look at the debts that we have, debts of 2021 where everything was of a higher cost because of the pandemic of CDI plus CAD1.20 million which means that we will have a gain in liability of 4 percentage points If we think about the present day or current CDI.

Well, we're speaking about the store owners. Well, the good news is that we do have a demand of all sorts of types of store owners. And this is important because each shopping mall has its needs. And to have only one type of store owner wanting to join a shopping mall. This is difficult.

It's difficult to work with a mix, but it also means that everybody's food doing very well. And even some categories, they have different models, but they're doing well. If we look at the new bookstore in Iguatemizau Paulo, that is a success. People say that bookstores have had a drop. It's not the case.

And it has become a very important point in our shopping mall and it's doing very well. So we should have a discussion on the future, not only in terms of categories, but also in terms of the model for store attention, the size of the stores. We spoke a great deal about fast food, for example, in previous quarters. And we have to think of that dynamic. Needs are there, but we have to adjust to the new reality of what this need implies in terms of services, we have observed a readjustment, a new adaptation in terms of the mix and the assortment of new brands as well.

We see new brands coming up. We test them through our pop ups. The 365 was an excellent vehicle to be able to do this, but we also have to do this in brick and mortar stores. And this weekend, for example, I was in Iguatemiz Sao Paulo speaking to one of the new shop owners who is part of a pop up. And there was a great deal of enthusiasm.

She had never imagined that her brand, the jeans brand would have such exposure. It's a brand that is nearly beginning. And this has given the brand new visibility and will enable her to do important things. And all of these brands have to be very successful We will have more options more store owners and a greater number of novelties And I think in fashion, we haven't had too many novelties. We have many new things arriving, which is excellent for us, in line with the question made by Vitor in terms of occupancy.

All of this contribute so that we can have more options when it comes to closing our vacancies. But doing this in a very exciting way, everybody likes to look at new stores, new brands, something that is different. And all of this is of the utmost importance for us. We have seen enormous interest in international brands. We have already remarked on this, the brands that are already with us.

And I took that in the last 6 or 12 months, we have all of the main brands in the shopping mall that are with us at international level. And they all have the same demand, more marketing, more visibility, more space to increase the number of SKUs in the store, which was a great problem to have. We'll not only have new brands, but also the expansion of these brands, new categories, several luxury brands opening up different categories as part of their brand in ready to wear and accessories. They're going to work with high jewelry, ready to wear other categories under the same brand umbrella. This increases the scope of things that you can buy under the same brand umbrella.

This is a very rich movement for us when it comes to store owners in international brands, Mexican brands, this will be important in coming years. Well, thank you. And Gucci and JK apparently will have a very relevant expansion. Well, Gucci is not really expanding. They're in a temporary store and they're putting together the stores they had.

They had store for mails and accessories and they were separate. This was not the ideal format. They're going to put everything together. They're going to put the ready to wear part as part of the store. All of this should contribute positively.

And are there digital alternatives or do these have to be brick and mortar stores? Some are not digital native stores. They have a very small presence and they're opening up stores. We also have these digital natives, Bishai and other stores in the past. But other brands are coming up with more specific stores that are also opening brick and mortar stores.

There's a new brand called Luv, a Brazilian brand that works with a beautiful design of women's wear with natural fabrics. The proposal is really wonderful and they're opening up in Alfavil and very soon in Jardins. So well, thank you, Chris. Thank you very much. Our next question is from Pedro Rana from Credit Suisse.

You may proceed, Pedro. Good morning, Chris and Guido. Thank you for the presentation and for taking my question. I do have some doubts. When we think of a scenario of sales stabilization, what is going to happen with the growth of rentals, leases?

You have a very healthy occupancy rate. But on the other hand, we observe in the market inflation of 14% being reported. Now with that growth of 28% or 30% of sales visavis2019, perhaps the company would be willing to pay for a greatest cost of occupancy increase to be able to increase the rentals? And which would be the limit? Which would represent a red flag for you?

Pedro, to respond to your question, this is an average occupancy rate, average of our portfolio. You have to look at this mall per mall. JK, for example, our occupancy cost is below 10%, which means we have an enormous space of increasing the occupancy rate at JK in Iguatemiz Sao Paulo. We say 14% as a company. We still have a great deal of room to increase the occupancy rate.

So in our portfolio, we're focusing on this. The coming year, we will be holding all of these negotiations, looking at our DNA. We do this every year, but every year we do have a transfer of inflation because of the investments we have to carry out in the condos that were held back in past years. And we are going to have to transfer these costs. So there will be an increase in the cost of these condos.

Now as we have been mentioning here, among all of the evils, our sales are very strong. Now same area, rents are way above inflation. Our rents are tables have not included inflation and we always seek to maintain them at positive levels. There is going to be a slight that we can increase the cost of rentals, but each shopping mall is at a different stage. If we look at the average, of course, we will see there will be a growth in occupancy rate, which will be very healthy.

Occupancy rate has increased and the delinquency levels are very low for the company as a whole. Well, thank you. Thank you very much. Our next question is from Daniel Gasparetti from Itau BBA. You may proceed, Daniel.

A good day to all of you. Thank you for the call. I would like to understand better if in the follow on, you felt that your partners at the shopping mall were more open to discussions on M and A. Are people willing to sit down and converse about this because they have more money or it is nothing moving forward. Whenever there is room in the short term horizon, perhaps you will be able to carry out these new transactions.

I wouldn't say well, I thought it was funny that we have more money in cash and everybody comes knocking at our door. I think the lack of money is generalized. What I do observe is as we mentioned here in another question, the fact that we carried out the first transaction after the restructuring with JK at a reasonable price sets the tone. But we are of course pushing forward in terms of conversations. We have several other conversations underway.

If they're going to happen in a 6 months horizon, I don't know. But once again, we do see a very good path when it comes to a market consolidation with minority shares or in 3rd party shopping malls. There's a great opportunity to make this a relevant growth market in coming years. And we're seeking that portfolio efficiency investing in the square meters that we have. We want to grow with quality.

And in terms of cash generation with JK, we're going to have a significant relevant growth in terms of our cash generation. This will give us the ability to carry out more deals. So we're quite confident that other things will appear, but it's very difficult to say at present. I understand. Thank you, Chris.

Well, passively, of course, this doesn't increase, but actively, are you calling upon your partners for these conversations? Are you adopting this new stand? Well, Casa Barelli, we have had parallel conversations. We don't speak with each partner separately. We have parallel conversations underway, others appear.

And the difference here is that we don't have to knock on their doors. They're coming. They're approaching us naturally. We do provoke some, one or another will come. But they these opportunities arise in a more subtle way perhaps.

And they tend to develop at a faster pace. But the more objective answer is we have more relevant conversations at present compared to 2 years ago, many more conversations. Our next question is from Goodman Sachs, Giulio I have two quick questions. First, I would like to speak about same store sales, same store rent. I was looking at your report, and it says the growth, visavisu2019 is 60%, 65%.

When you think about same area rent and when you think about new leases, are the new contracts observing the same type of growth? If your new contracts will reach 60% visavis the growth in 2019? Another question, same store sales on the part of services. In the 3rd quarter, it was 14% compared to 2019, but flat in the Q2. Should we believe that you will continue to grow at those levels?

Will services grow expressively? Because this is the part that grew most if we compare quarter on quarter vis a vis other categories. Thank you. Georgie, how are you? Good morning.

Now if we think about your question, same store rent. If we look at the growth and we refer to only 60% of our rental base comparing to 2019 with the Q3 2022. This growth comes from adding a minimum rent. There were more discounts And the growth of revenue is approximately 65% based on the accrued IGPN. Now the same store rental still has a catch up because of what happened in 2020 2021.

We have been scaling up and there is a difference because of this scale up and also because of the occupancy rate of that period compared to the current period. If we look at the Q3 2022 and the Q3 2021, there no longer is this difference. If you compare it with 2019 quarter on quarter, this will end in the coming quarters because of the entry of this scale up that increases our revenue. Now when we speak about same store sales and the services, services visavis2019, we have grown 14%. And in our accounts, we have included entertainment.

Now if we compare this with 2021 and the figure was very strong, we can share it with you compared to 2019 and 2021, Entertainment still does not perform well, especially Cinema. This quarter, Cinemas did not do well. But if we think of services in terms of food services, our food courts, hair salons, all of these have had a very good performance. Our next question is from Marcelo Motta from JPMorgan. You may proceed, Marcelo.

A good day. Well, my questions are a follow-up of what Guido said in the presentation. He said that in the Q4, there could be the sale of land. Is this something relevant that you're considering so that we can monitor it? Thank you very much.

Yes, Malta. As I mentioned, every year we make DKK 20 1,000,000 this year will not be different. We're well underway. We're speaking about 2 plots of land. 1 is residential behind the Esplanade Mall from a developer in Sao Paulo.

We will be announcing this, this month and another inhibitor from a local developer for a commercial enterprise with modular construction. We can have offices of 1,000 square meters, something very similar to what we did in Sky Galleria. Now this is a very well known region in Jiberel and we will be announcing this in the Q4. Well, thank you. Thank you very much.

Thank you, ladies and gentlemen. As we have no further questions, we will return the floor to Ms. Christina Betts for her final remarks. You may proceed, Ms. Betts.

Well, thank you all for attending our call. We're always at your entire disposal to speak to everybody. Our IR team is also at your disposal and let's head towards the end of 2022. We're quite enthusiastic with November December. Hope to see you at our next meeting.

Have a good day. With this, we end the results conference call for Iguatemi Shopping Centers. Thank you for

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